If God does not exist, can anything be morally wrong? - Page 30

RoboTimbo · 11th July 2012, 09:28 AM

Originally Posted by KlLLUMINATI

IDC I am just waiting for the mod response so I can close this account.

Mods don't close accounts. An Admin may change your status to unregistered or Guest. You don't own this thread so you have no say in it being closed.

Everyone will continue to be able to see your actions.

Scootch · 11th July 2012, 09:46 AM

Originally Posted by Noztradamus

Aren't bears Catholic?

"Does the pope **** in the woods?"

Tricky · 11th July 2012, 10:11 AM

Originally Posted by KlLLUMINATI

IDC I am just waiting for the mod response so I can close this account.

Even if you set your account to unregistered, everything you ever posted will remain.

But you know, it's really easy just to stop posting. Heck, you could even stop logging on. All it takes is free will.

KlLLUMINATI · 11th July 2012, 10:14 AM

Originally Posted by Tricky

Even if you set your account to unregistered, everything you ever posted will remain.

But you know, it's really easy just to stop posting. Heck, you could even stop logging on. All it takes is free will.

So I cant close the actual account? So my e-mail address will not still be here.

tsig · 11th July 2012, 10:48 AM

Originally Posted by Foster Zygote

Imagine a fourteen year old girl living in a small town. Early one morning a hoard of heavily armed men come charging over the top of the hill and take everyone by surprise. She watches as they proceed to hack and stab almost everyone she knows. She sees a fully grown man brings his sword down on the head of her seven year old brother, splitting his skull open. She looks on as her father, uncles and the other men of the town attempt to mount a defense of their families, but are quickly overwhelmed and cut down. She stands, paralyzed with horror, as one of the raiders stabs her pregnant older sister in the belly, running her completely through. She sees her own mother cut down as she tries to flee with her baby brother in her arms. The soldier who slashed her mother's throat open then takes her baby brother by the ankles and swings him at the ground, crushing his skull against a rock. She witnesses the slaughter of her family, friends, everyone she's ever known and loved. She expects to meet the same fate, but when it is all over, she finds herself lifted up and thrown over the shoulder of one of the soldiers. She realizes that he is the one who split her younger brother's head open. Through her shock, she slowly becomes aware that a few of her young friends and cousins are also being carried off by the marauders.

Eventually, they are taken back to the town that the raiders came from. The man who murdered her brother gives her a blanket in the corner of his house and warns her not to attempt to escape. He announces that she will have one month to mourn for the loved ones whom he has slaughtered. One complete cycle of the moon later she is declared his and he takes her into his bed and has sex with her.

Does that really sound like something that is morally correct to you? Do you really think that abducting a young girl after murdering everyone she knew and loved doesn't qualify as rape as long as you give her a month to mourn her loved ones and then declare that she is your wife before you have sex with her?

Maybe the month isn't for her to mourn but to make sure she isn't pregnant.

DC · 11th July 2012, 10:54 AM

Originally Posted by KlLLUMINATI

So I cant close the actual account? So my e-mail address will not still be here.

why would you want to close it? you can change your email in User CP.

but afaik users can't see your email anyway.

Belz... · 11th July 2012, 11:47 AM

Originally Posted by KlLLUMINATI

IDC I am just waiting for the mod response so I can close this account.

Why ? Because you thought it would be so easy to prove your point when you made this thread that you didn't ever consider to understand what people post ?

I think you should reconsider and listen. People here didn't reach their conclusions on a whim, and we're just trying to help.

Or you can just act like a drama queen, but that's your loss.

Daald · 11th July 2012, 12:09 PM

Wow. What a thread. I laughed, I cried and then gouged my eyes out.

No seriously, Kill you have done a great service to us atheists. Next time someone asks us, what is the point in fighting theism and that it does no harm to let them believe what they want, we will have this thread as an example of the great mental harm religion has done to you.

Thank you for that.

Lowpro · 11th July 2012, 12:15 PM

Someday I'm sure this will be answered =\

http://forums.randi.org/showpost.php...postcount=1053

Foster Zygote · 11th July 2012, 12:21 PM

There's just no getting around it. The Bible cannot be seen as a source of objectively correct morality unless one is willing to declare as morally correct many acts that the great majority of people would consider abhorrently evil. If you try to argue that those rules no longer apply and need not be followed any longer, then you have just scuttled the whole idea of objective morality, admitting that even the Bible is subjective and fluid in its ethics. Either the Bible prescribes actions that are evil, or it used to and is rendered subject to internal revision regarding its moral precepts.

Foster Zygote · 11th July 2012, 12:22 PM

Originally Posted by Daald

I... gouged my eyes out.

That's in the Bible, too.

Navigator · 11th July 2012, 02:26 PM

Originally Posted by Foster Zygote

There's just no getting around it. The Bible cannot be seen as a source of objectively correct morality unless one is willing to declare as morally correct many acts that the great majority of people would consider abhorrently evil. If you try to argue that those rules no longer apply and need not be followed any longer, then you have just scuttled the whole idea of objective morality, admitting that even the Bible is subjective and fluid in its ethics. Either the Bible prescribes actions that are evil, or it used to and is rendered subject to internal revision regarding its moral precepts.

It is easy enough to argue for 'the rules no longer apply' due in great part to hindsight. Humans make the rules.

Even if acts that are rejected or accepted by the great majority of people and this is the propelling force from which the unfolding reality gets its impetus, does not make it true or false in terms of where that unfolding leads everyone, minority or majority.

Because evolution is understood to have no 'goal' or 'morals' in no way suggests that human beings should go blindly forth as instruments of evolution - and nor do we.

Therefore we can create our own collective future and indeed are doing this very thing.

So we should at some point be able to clearly see where that future we are creating now, will place us then.

Objective reality may be exactly what we need to create in order to actually survive as a species.

Evolution is the wave - human consciousness is the surfer.

truethat · 11th July 2012, 02:33 PM

Originally Posted by KlLLUMINATI

It sucks we cant find common ground and to be honest these types of thread are never any different its the same thing over and over

We all have common ground. We're on this *********** planet floating around the universe trying to figure it all out.

Don't close your account! We want you here, we want to hear what you have to say about your ideas, your confidence and your frustrations.

Stop being defensive and things will go a lot smoother for you. Don't forget that many of us had strong faith in our younger years. We're not mocking you, we're lashing back at attacks.

Why? Because people are *********** stupid.

dafydd · 11th July 2012, 03:22 PM

Originally Posted by Navigator

species.

Evolution is the wave - human consciousness is the surfer.

Er.....evolution was here long before humans arrived on the scene. Nice new age waffle though, well done.

Paulhoff · 11th July 2012, 05:52 PM

It is all laid out at the end of this video.............

YouTube Video This video is not hosted by the JREF. The JREF can not be held responsible for the suitability or legality of this material. By clicking the link below you agree to view content from an external website.

I AGREE

Paul

MattusMaximus · 11th July 2012, 07:42 PM

Folks, I think the main topic of this thread is over, because Killuminati has already admitted that belief in God or gods isn't necessary to have an ethical society (when I confronted him with the virtue ethics of the ancient Greeks). So I'll be lurking for a bit...

laca · 12th July 2012, 12:05 AM

Originally Posted by Navigator

Objective reality may be exactly what we need to create in order to actually survive as a species.

Navigator · 12th July 2012, 12:11 AM

Originally Posted by dafydd

Er.....evolution was here long before humans arrived on the scene. Nice new age waffle though, well done.

What is the point in consciousness if there is no thing to be conscious of except consciousness?

Why don't you pull finger?

laca · 12th July 2012, 12:34 AM

Originally Posted by Navigator

What is the point in consciousness if there is no thing to be conscious of except consciousness?

Why would there be a point in it?

Halfcentaur · 12th July 2012, 01:25 AM

Originally Posted by Navigator

What is the point in consciousness if there is no thing to be conscious of except consciousness?

Why don't you pull finger?

There are no such things as absolute universal points or truths. Consciousness is conscious of the limited part of the universe it's only capable of being conscious of through direct means and deduction.

dafydd · 12th July 2012, 01:45 AM

Originally Posted by Navigator

What is the point in consciousness if there is no thing to be conscious of except consciousness?

Why don't you pull finger?

Try being serious for a change.

Belz... · 12th July 2012, 03:08 AM

Originally Posted by MattusMaximus

Folks, I think the main topic of this thread is over, because Killuminati has already admitted that belief in God or gods isn't necessary to have an ethical society (when I confronted him with the virtue ethics of the ancient Greeks). So I'll be lurking for a bit...

He's apparently not coming back anyway. Something about us winning and not converting to his religion.

Twiler · 12th July 2012, 12:17 PM

Originally Posted by Navigator

What is the point in consciousness if there is no thing to be conscious of except consciousness?

Why don't you pull finger?

Evolution doesn't have a point; It just is.

truethat · 12th July 2012, 04:37 PM

Originally Posted by Twiler

Evolution doesn't have a point; It just is.

This.

It's strange but understandable the way people will decide there must be some sort of "intelligence" involved when this are too complicated for them to understand.

Complicated and sophisticated are not the same thing at all.

tsig · 12th July 2012, 04:45 PM

Originally Posted by truethat

This.

It's strange but understandable the way people will decide there must be some sort of "intelligence" involved when this are too complicated for them to understand.

Complicated and sophisticated are not the same thing at all.

delete

Paulhoff · 12th July 2012, 05:03 PM

YouTube Video This video is not hosted by the JREF. The JREF can not be held responsible for the suitability or legality of this material. By clicking the link below you agree to view content from an external website.

I AGREE

Paul

Wuglife · 15th July 2012, 12:25 PM

I recommend reading The Elements of Moral Philosophy by James Rachels. I don't agree with everything in it; it's not a perfect book, but it's a great start to examining this question.

Old editions can be had for as little as $4.

cyborg · 15th July 2012, 12:41 PM

Originally Posted by Navigator

Evolution is the wave - human consciousness is the surfer.

I guess this means Keanu Reeves in Point Break is Jesus or something then.

Dave Rogers · 16th July 2012, 01:24 AM

Originally Posted by cyborg

I guess this means Keanu Reeves in Point Break is Jesus or something then.

ITYM Patrick Swayze. Keanu Reeves is clearly the Everyman character of the medieval morality play.

Dave

pakeha · 16th July 2012, 01:40 AM

Originally Posted by KlLLUMINATI

It sucks we cant find common ground and to be honest these types of thread are never any different its the same thing over and over

What do you think could be common ground here?

On the subject of young women taken in war:

Originally Posted by tsig

Maybe the month isn't for her to mourn but to make sure she isn't pregnant.

Excellent point.

Paulhoff · 23rd July 2012, 06:49 AM

Quote:

Jephthah Burns His Daughter

"At that time the Spirit of the LORD came upon Jephthah, and he went throughout the land of Gilead and Manasseh, including Mizpah in Gilead, and led an army against the Ammonites. And Jephthah made a vow to the LORD. He said, "If you give me victory over the Ammonites, I will give to the LORD the first thing coming out of my house to greet me when I return in triumph. I will sacrifice it as a burnt offering."

"So Jephthah led his army against the Ammonites, and the LORD gave him victory. He thoroughly defeated the Ammonites from Aroer to an area near Minnith – twenty towns – and as far away as Abel-keramim. Thus Israel subdued the Ammonites. When Jephthah returned home to Mizpah, his daughter – his only child – ran out to meet him, playing on a tambourine and dancing for joy. When he saw her, he tore his clothes in anguish. "My daughter!" he cried out. "My heart is breaking! What a tragedy that you came out to greet me. For I have made a vow to the LORD and cannot take it back." And she said, "Father, you have made a promise to the LORD. You must do to me what you have promised, for the LORD has given you a great victory over your enemies, the Ammonites. But first let me go up and roam in the hills and weep with my friends for two months, because I will die a virgin." "You may go," Jephthah said. And he let her go away for two months. She and her friends went into the hills and wept because she would never have children. When she returned home, her father kept his vow, and she died a virgin. So it has become a custom in Israel for young Israelite women to go away for four days each year to lament the fate of Jephthah's daughter." (Judges 11:29-40 NLT)

God.............. morals........... oh please.

Paul

truethat · 23rd July 2012, 10:43 AM

And the point is, morally speaking, when you promise to murder someone for God, you keep your word man, you keep your word.

But in all honesty Paulhoff, she became a nun basically. If you read through it you will see it differently.

Nontheless the male domination over a woman having no choice in her life is certainly perpetuated by that Savvy Yhwh.

But to read

http://scottthong.wordpress.com/2008...rifice-to-god/

11th July 2012, 09:46 AM	#1162
Scootch Critical Thinker Join Date: Jul 2008 Posts: 267	Originally Posted by Noztradamus Aren't bears Catholic? "Does the pope **** in the woods?"
Scootch Critical Thinker Join Date: Jul 2008 Posts: 267

11th July 2012, 10:14 AM	#1164
KlLLUMINATI Critical Thinker Join Date: Mar 2012 Posts: 477	Originally Posted by Tricky Even if you set your account to unregistered, everything you ever posted will remain. But you know, it's really easy just to stop posting. Heck, you could even stop logging on. All it takes is free will. So I cant close the actual account? So my e-mail address will not still be here.
	Last edited by KlLLUMINATI; 11th July 2012 at 10:15 AM.

11th July 2012, 10:54 AM	#1166
DC dedicated aphilatelist Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Switzerland Posts: 21,647	Originally Posted by KlLLUMINATI So I cant close the actual account? So my e-mail address will not still be here. why would you want to close it? you can change your email in User CP. but afaik users can't see your email anyway.
	__________________ AGW is a fact, including the A, face it

11th July 2012, 11:47 AM	#1167
Belz... Fiend God Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: In the details... Posts: 28,446	Originally Posted by KlLLUMINATI IDC I am just waiting for the mod response so I can close this account. Why ? Because you thought it would be so easy to prove your point when you made this thread that you didn't ever consider to understand what people post ? I think you should reconsider and listen. People here didn't reach their conclusions on a whim, and we're just trying to help. Or you can just act like a drama queen, but that's your loss.
	__________________ The Onmyouza Theatre, An unofficial international fanclub forum dedicated to the Japanese heavy metal band Onmyo-Za: "In the interests of time and space, it is not unreasonable to cite one point at a time. Citing 30 is the equivalent of citing none. Obviously." - Robert Prey "Physical evidence must be observed and interpreted by witnesses which makes it subjective and subject to mistakes and to fraud." - Robert Prey

11th July 2012, 12:15 PM	#1169
Lowpro Illuminator Join Date: Dec 2010 Location: Birmingham, AL Posts: 4,518	Someday I'm sure this will be answered =\ http://forums.randi.org/showpost.php...postcount=1053
	__________________ "If I actually believed that Jesus was coming to end the world in 2050, I'd be preparing by stocking up on timber and nails" - PZ Myers

11th July 2012, 09:28 AM	#1161
RoboTimbo Hostile Nanobacon Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Prosperity, AZ Posts: 21,833	Originally Posted by KlLLUMINATI IDC I am just waiting for the mod response so I can close this account. Mods don't close accounts. An Admin may change your status to unregistered or Guest. You don't own this thread so you have no say in it being closed. Everyone will continue to be able to see your actions.

11th July 2012, 10:11 AM	#1163
Tricky Briefly immortal Moderator Join Date: Nov 2001 Location: The Group W bench Posts: 42,345	Originally Posted by KlLLUMINATI IDC I am just waiting for the mod response so I can close this account. Even if you set your account to unregistered, everything you ever posted will remain. But you know, it's really easy just to stop posting. Heck, you could even stop logging on. All it takes is free will.

11th July 2012, 10:48 AM	#1165
tsig a carbon based life-form Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 26,671	Originally Posted by Foster Zygote Imagine a fourteen year old girl living in a small town. Early one morning a hoard of heavily armed men come charging over the top of the hill and take everyone by surprise. She watches as they proceed to hack and stab almost everyone she knows. She sees a fully grown man brings his sword down on the head of her seven year old brother, splitting his skull open. She looks on as her father, uncles and the other men of the town attempt to mount a defense of their families, but are quickly overwhelmed and cut down. She stands, paralyzed with horror, as one of the raiders stabs her pregnant older sister in the belly, running her completely through. She sees her own mother cut down as she tries to flee with her baby brother in her arms. The soldier who slashed her mother's throat open then takes her baby brother by the ankles and swings him at the ground, crushing his skull against a rock. She witnesses the slaughter of her family, friends, everyone she's ever known and loved. She expects to meet the same fate, but when it is all over, she finds herself lifted up and thrown over the shoulder of one of the soldiers. She realizes that he is the one who split her younger brother's head open. Through her shock, she slowly becomes aware that a few of her young friends and cousins are also being carried off by the marauders. Eventually, they are taken back to the town that the raiders came from. The man who murdered her brother gives her a blanket in the corner of his house and warns her not to attempt to escape. He announces that she will have one month to mourn for the loved ones whom he has slaughtered. One complete cycle of the moon later she is declared his and he takes her into his bed and has sex with her. Does that really sound like something that is morally correct to you? Do you really think that abducting a young girl after murdering everyone she knew and loved doesn't qualify as rape as long as you give her a month to mourn her loved ones and then declare that she is your wife before you have sex with her? Maybe the month isn't for her to mourn but to make sure she isn't pregnant.

11th July 2012, 12:09 PM	#1168
Daald Critical Thinker Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Queens, NY Posts: 423	Wow. What a thread. I laughed, I cried and then gouged my eyes out. No seriously, Kill you have done a great service to us atheists. Next time someone asks us, what is the point in fighting theism and that it does no harm to let them believe what they want, we will have this thread as an example of the great mental harm religion has done to you. Thank you for that.

11th July 2012, 12:21 PM	#1170
Foster Zygote Dental Floss Tycoon Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Between the pit of man's fears and the summit of his knowledge Posts: 14,386	There's just no getting around it. The Bible cannot be seen as a source of objectively correct morality unless one is willing to declare as morally correct many acts that the great majority of people would consider abhorrently evil. If you try to argue that those rules no longer apply and need not be followed any longer, then you have just scuttled the whole idea of objective morality, admitting that even the Bible is subjective and fluid in its ethics. Either the Bible prescribes actions that are evil, or it used to and is rendered subject to internal revision regarding its moral precepts.
	__________________ It looks just like a Telefunken U47... You'll love it.

11th July 2012, 12:22 PM	#1171
Foster Zygote Dental Floss Tycoon Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Between the pit of man's fears and the summit of his knowledge Posts: 14,386	Originally Posted by Daald I... gouged my eyes out. That's in the Bible, too.
	__________________ It looks just like a Telefunken U47... You'll love it.

11th July 2012, 02:26 PM	#1172
Navigator Graduate Poster Join Date: Apr 2004 Posts: 1,034	Originally Posted by Foster Zygote There's just no getting around it. The Bible cannot be seen as a source of objectively correct morality unless one is willing to declare as morally correct many acts that the great majority of people would consider abhorrently evil. If you try to argue that those rules no longer apply and need not be followed any longer, then you have just scuttled the whole idea of objective morality, admitting that even the Bible is subjective and fluid in its ethics. Either the Bible prescribes actions that are evil, or it used to and is rendered subject to internal revision regarding its moral precepts. It is easy enough to argue for 'the rules no longer apply' due in great part to hindsight. Humans make the rules. Even if acts that are rejected or accepted by the great majority of people and this is the propelling force from which the unfolding reality gets its impetus, does not make it true or false in terms of where that unfolding leads everyone, minority or majority. Because evolution is understood to have no 'goal' or 'morals' in no way suggests that human beings should go blindly forth as instruments of evolution - and nor do we. Therefore we can create our own collective future and indeed are doing this very thing. So we should at some point be able to clearly see where that future we are creating now, will place us then. Objective reality may be exactly what we need to create in order to actually survive as a species. Evolution is the wave - human consciousness is the surfer.
	__________________ "I have walked a mile in your shoes and discovered what your problem is...your feet are too small" ~σκεπτικιστής ακραίες

11th July 2012, 02:33 PM	#1173
truethat Philosopher Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 8,623	Originally Posted by KlLLUMINATI It sucks we cant find common ground and to be honest these types of thread are never any different its the same thing over and over We all have common ground. We're on this ********* planet floating around the universe trying to figure it all out. Don't close your account! We want you here, we want to hear what you have to say about your ideas, your confidence and your frustrations. Stop being defensive and things will go a lot smoother for you. Don't forget that many of us had strong faith in our younger years. We're not mocking you, we're lashing back at attacks. Why? Because people are ********* stupid.
truethat Philosopher Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 8,623	__________________ “Do not argue with an idiot they drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.” ― Mark Twain

11th July 2012, 03:22 PM	#1174
dafydd Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Belgium (Flatland) Posts: 31,444	Originally Posted by Navigator species. Evolution is the wave - human consciousness is the surfer. Er.....evolution was here long before humans arrived on the scene. Nice new age waffle though, well done.
	__________________ Yesterday upon the stairs I met a man who wasn't there He wasn't there again today I wish that he would go away.

11th July 2012, 07:42 PM	#1176
MattusMaximus Intellectual Gladiator Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: In the midst of a vast, beautiful & uncaring universe Posts: 14,175	Folks, I think the main topic of this thread is over, because Killuminati has already admitted that belief in God or gods isn't necessary to have an ethical society (when I confronted him with the virtue ethics of the ancient Greeks). So I'll be lurking for a bit...
	__________________ Visit my blog: The Skeptical Teacher The Times They Are A-Changin' Last edited by MattusMaximus; 11th July 2012 at 07:45 PM.

12th July 2012, 12:05 AM	#1177
laca Illuminator Join Date: May 2009 Posts: 3,161	Originally Posted by Navigator Objective reality may be exactly what we need to create in order to actually survive as a species.
laca Illuminator Join Date: May 2009 Posts: 3,161

12th July 2012, 12:11 AM	#1178
Navigator Graduate Poster Join Date: Apr 2004 Posts: 1,034	Originally Posted by dafydd Er.....evolution was here long before humans arrived on the scene. Nice new age waffle though, well done. What is the point in consciousness if there is no thing to be conscious of except consciousness? Why don't you pull finger?
	__________________ "I have walked a mile in your shoes and discovered what your problem is...your feet are too small" ~σκεπτικιστής ακραίες

12th July 2012, 12:34 AM	#1179
laca Illuminator Join Date: May 2009 Posts: 3,161	Originally Posted by Navigator What is the point in consciousness if there is no thing to be conscious of except consciousness? Why would there be a point in it?
laca Illuminator Join Date: May 2009 Posts: 3,161

12th July 2012, 01:25 AM	#1180
Halfcentaur Philosopher Join Date: Jun 2010 Posts: 5,937	Originally Posted by Navigator What is the point in consciousness if there is no thing to be conscious of except consciousness? Why don't you pull finger? There are no such things as absolute universal points or truths. Consciousness is conscious of the limited part of the universe it's only capable of being conscious of through direct means and deduction.
Halfcentaur Philosopher Join Date: Jun 2010 Posts: 5,937

12th July 2012, 01:45 AM	#1181
dafydd Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Belgium (Flatland) Posts: 31,444	Originally Posted by Navigator What is the point in consciousness if there is no thing to be conscious of except consciousness? Why don't you pull finger? Try being serious for a change.
	__________________ Yesterday upon the stairs I met a man who wasn't there He wasn't there again today I wish that he would go away.

12th July 2012, 03:08 AM	#1182
Belz... Fiend God Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: In the details... Posts: 28,446	Originally Posted by MattusMaximus Folks, I think the main topic of this thread is over, because Killuminati has already admitted that belief in God or gods isn't necessary to have an ethical society (when I confronted him with the virtue ethics of the ancient Greeks). So I'll be lurking for a bit... He's apparently not coming back anyway. Something about us winning and not converting to his religion.
	__________________ The Onmyouza Theatre, An unofficial international fanclub forum dedicated to the Japanese heavy metal band Onmyo-Za: "In the interests of time and space, it is not unreasonable to cite one point at a time. Citing 30 is the equivalent of citing none. Obviously." - Robert Prey "Physical evidence must be observed and interpreted by witnesses which makes it subjective and subject to mistakes and to fraud." - Robert Prey

12th July 2012, 12:17 PM	#1183
Twiler Master Poster Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 2,494	Originally Posted by Navigator What is the point in consciousness if there is no thing to be conscious of except consciousness? Why don't you pull finger? Evolution doesn't have a point; It just is.
Twiler Master Poster Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 2,494

12th July 2012, 04:37 PM	#1184
truethat Philosopher Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 8,623	Originally Posted by Twiler Evolution doesn't have a point; It just is. This. It's strange but understandable the way people will decide there must be some sort of "intelligence" involved when this are too complicated for them to understand. Complicated and sophisticated are not the same thing at all.
truethat Philosopher Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 8,623	__________________ “Do not argue with an idiot they drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.” ― Mark Twain

12th July 2012, 04:45 PM	#1185
tsig a carbon based life-form Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 26,671	Originally Posted by truethat This. It's strange but understandable the way people will decide there must be some sort of "intelligence" involved when this are too complicated for them to understand. Complicated and sophisticated are not the same thing at all. delete
	Last edited by tsig; 12th July 2012 at 04:52 PM.

15th July 2012, 12:25 PM	#1187
Wuglife Critical Thinker Join Date: Jul 2011 Posts: 400	I recommend reading The Elements of Moral Philosophy by James Rachels. I don't agree with everything in it; it's not a perfect book, but it's a great start to examining this question. Old editions can be had for as little as $4.
Wuglife Critical Thinker Join Date: Jul 2011 Posts: 400

15th July 2012, 12:41 PM	#1188
cyborg deus ex machina Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 4,974	Originally Posted by Navigator Evolution is the wave - human consciousness is the surfer. I guess this means Keanu Reeves in Point Break is Jesus or something then.
cyborg deus ex machina Join Date: Aug 2005 Posts: 4,974	__________________ The phrase deus ex machina (literally "god out of a machine") describes an unexpected, artificial, or improbable character, device, or event introduced suddenly in a work of fiction or drama to resolve a situation or untangle a plot...

16th July 2012, 01:24 AM	#1189
Dave Rogers Bandaged ice that stampedes inexpensively through a scribbled morning waving necessary ankles Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: In a world lit only by fire. Posts: 17,894	Originally Posted by cyborg I guess this means Keanu Reeves in Point Break is Jesus or something then. ITYM Patrick Swayze. Keanu Reeves is clearly the Everyman character of the medieval morality play. Dave
	__________________ "We will punish the murderer together. Our punishment will be more generosity, more tolerance and more democracy." - Fabian Stang, Mayor of Oslo SSKCAS, covert member

16th July 2012, 01:40 AM	#1190
pakeha Philosopher Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 7,969	Originally Posted by KlLLUMINATI It sucks we cant find common ground and to be honest these types of thread are never any different its the same thing over and over What do you think could be common ground here? On the subject of young women taken in war: Originally Posted by tsig Maybe the month isn't for her to mourn but to make sure she isn't pregnant. Excellent point.
pakeha Philosopher Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 7,969	__________________ To a conspiracy theorist, having double standards just means that they have twice as many standards. carlitos

23rd July 2012, 06:49 AM	#1191
Paulhoff You can't expect perfection. Join Date: May 2005 Location: South Florida Posts: 12,570	Quote: Jephthah Burns His Daughter "At that time the Spirit of the LORD came upon Jephthah, and he went throughout the land of Gilead and Manasseh, including Mizpah in Gilead, and led an army against the Ammonites. And Jephthah made a vow to the LORD. He said, "If you give me victory over the Ammonites, I will give to the LORD the first thing coming out of my house to greet me when I return in triumph. I will sacrifice it as a burnt offering." "So Jephthah led his army against the Ammonites, and the LORD gave him victory. He thoroughly defeated the Ammonites from Aroer to an area near Minnith – twenty towns – and as far away as Abel-keramim. Thus Israel subdued the Ammonites. When Jephthah returned home to Mizpah, his daughter – his only child – ran out to meet him, playing on a tambourine and dancing for joy. When he saw her, he tore his clothes in anguish. "My daughter!" he cried out. "My heart is breaking! What a tragedy that you came out to greet me. For I have made a vow to the LORD and cannot take it back." And she said, "Father, you have made a promise to the LORD. You must do to me what you have promised, for the LORD has given you a great victory over your enemies, the Ammonites. But first let me go up and roam in the hills and weep with my friends for two months, because I will die a virgin." "You may go," Jephthah said. And he let her go away for two months. She and her friends went into the hills and wept because she would never have children. When she returned home, her father kept his vow, and she died a virgin. So it has become a custom in Israel for young Israelite women to go away for four days each year to lament the fate of Jephthah's daughter." (Judges 11:29-40 NLT) God.............. morals........... oh please. Paul
	__________________ For our money "IN WHICH GOD DO YOU TRUST" Much worse than the Question not asked, is the Answer not Given Don't accept an answer that can't be questioned - God is Surperfluous A society fails when ignorance outweighs knowledge Science doesn’t know everything, but religion doesn’t know anything Life is so horrent and also so beautiful, but without it there is nothing

23rd July 2012, 10:43 AM	#1192
truethat Philosopher Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 8,623	And the point is, morally speaking, when you promise to murder someone for God, you keep your word man, you keep your word. But in all honesty Paulhoff, she became a nun basically. If you read through it you will see it differently. Nontheless the male domination over a woman having no choice in her life is certainly perpetuated by that Savvy Yhwh. But to read http://scottthong.wordpress.com/2008...rifice-to-god/
truethat Philosopher Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 8,623	__________________ “Do not argue with an idiot they drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.” ― Mark Twain Last edited by truethat; 23rd July 2012 at 10:47 AM.