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truethat · 14th January 2013, 04:53 AM

Originally Posted by Belz...

From my experience this is not automatic. This is mere rhetoric on your part.

Your experience is anecdotal and therefor irrelevant.

WildCat · 14th January 2013, 07:23 AM

Originally Posted by arromdee

As a defense. "I actually fired her for unprofessional conduct, so it's not discrimination."

"Defense"? In her lawsuit??? She's the plaintiff.

WildCat · 14th January 2013, 07:31 AM

Originally Posted by fitzgibbon

I find it astonishing that the nominal 'free market' minds here (really libertarians by any reasonable judgement) seem to be looking to return to the halcyon days of the robber barons and such. So far as I can see, they seem emblematic of the axiom about those who forget history

Fitz

Absolute nonsense. Not a single person here argues for monopolies, trusts, and cartels. Nor the repeal of workplace safety laws or other oversight.

If the employee had looked for another job instead of filing a lawsuit she would probably have been working in another office long ago. Now she has a national rep as sue-happy over sour grapes, good luck finding a job with that baggage in this environment.

WildCat · 14th January 2013, 07:36 AM

Originally Posted by Morrigan

Indeed, so what's the problem with protecting employees from bad business owners who do fire employees on whims?

How could an employer stay in business like that? How could he keep his good employees in such an environment? Why would anyone want to work for such an employer? The "problem" is self-correcting without government involvement.

WildCat · 14th January 2013, 07:37 AM

Originally Posted by lionking

Like Knight. Firing someone because he can't control his erections.

It's easy to win arguments when you just make stuff up, eh?

WildCat · 14th January 2013, 07:45 AM

Originally Posted by Blue Mountain

Would that every employer do as well as you claim to be doing. Regulation sets the minimum standard, below which you get the government investigating your business. In the absence of regulation, business tends to engage in a race to the bottom: poverty-level wages, children toiling sixteen hours a day in mines, workers getting fired for being injured on the job; shades of The Jungle. It was the horrible working conditions, primarily incredible lack of physical safety for workers, in the 1700s and 1800s that led to the rise of unions and expansion of government regulation.

Odd, I don't recall anyone in this thread calling for an end to all government regulations.

Got a link? Of course you don't. This is just a weird hybrid of a strawman and an excluded middle fallacy.

Originally Posted by Blue Mountain

Tell that to the workers in Michigan who have just had most of their safety net swept away by the state's Republican government, who have changed the state to at-will employment.

What about the workers in Michigan? Have employers fired everybody since going to at-will employment?

I'd hate to see Detroit go downhill, it and the rest of Michigan were thriving under Dem stewardhip! I bet the GOP turns it into a hellhole...

tsig · 14th January 2013, 08:29 AM

Originally Posted by WildCat

Absolute nonsense. Not a single person here argues for monopolies, trusts, and cartels. Nor the repeal of workplace safety laws or other oversight.

If the employee had looked for another job instead of filing a lawsuit she would probably have been working in another office long ago. Now she has a national rep as sue-happy over sour grapes, good luck finding a job with that baggage in this environment.

Originally Posted by WildCat

It's easy to win arguments when you just make stuff up, eh?

Like the hilited?

WildCat · 14th January 2013, 09:18 AM

Originally Posted by tsig

Like the hilited?

My speculation is made up? How does that work?

tsig · 14th January 2013, 09:37 AM

Originally Posted by WildCat

My speculation is made up? How does that work?

If you didn't make up your speculation then where did it come from?

fitzgibbon · 14th January 2013, 09:52 AM

Originally Posted by tsig

If you didn't make up your speculation then where did it come from?

A presumptive inability of the plaintiff to multitask? Just a wild stab here. Feel free to correct

Fitz

fitzgibbon · 14th January 2013, 09:55 AM

Originally Posted by WildCat

Absolute nonsense. Not a single person here argues for monopolies, trusts, and cartels. Nor the repeal of workplace safety laws or other oversight.

The day is young. Do you think the same will still be true if the GOP continues its march to the right?

Originally Posted by WildCat

If the employee had looked for another job instead of filing a lawsuit she would probably have been working in another office long ago. Now she has a national rep as sue-happy over sour grapes, good luck finding a job with that baggage in this environment.

Your 'blame the victim' stance is duly noted.

WildCat · 14th January 2013, 10:11 AM

Originally Posted by tsig

If you didn't make up your speculation then where did it come from?

Obviously speculation is made up, thus my confusion as to your post.

WildCat · 14th January 2013, 10:14 AM

Originally Posted by fitzgibbon

The day is young. Do you think the same will still be true if the GOP continues its march to the right?

If they go there they'll be all alone, like Libertarians. Libertarians actually do think all regulations should be abolished, they get a whopping 1% or so of the vote. So no, I don't see those laws changing ever.

Originally Posted by fitzgibbon

Your 'blame the victim' stance is duly noted.

What is she a victim of?

tsig · 14th January 2013, 10:54 AM

Originally Posted by WildCat

My speculation is made up? How does that work?

Originally Posted by WildCat

Obviously speculation is made up, thus my confusion as to your post.

One of these posts is not like the other.

First you express scorn about speculation being made up then attempt to portray my post as confusing.

If this is to be the way you choose to post then future dialogue may prove unprofitable for both of us.

WildCat · 14th January 2013, 11:06 AM

Originally Posted by tsig

One of these posts is not like the other.

First you express scorn about speculation being made up then attempt to portray my post as confusing.

If this is to be the way you choose to post then future dialogue may prove unprofitable for both of us.

I really have no idea what you're on about. lionking stated as a fact (not speculation) that the woman was fired because the boss couldn't control his erections, and that is something he just made up. My speculation was clearly speculation (note the word "probably"), not presented as fact and yet you compared it to lionking's post.

All clear now?

Belz... · 14th January 2013, 01:45 PM

Originally Posted by truethat

Your experience is anecdotal and therefor irrelevant.

Tell that to NewtronTrino.

Belz... · 14th January 2013, 01:47 PM

Originally Posted by tsig

If you didn't make up your speculation then where did it come from?

He doesn't try to make up what actually happened, is the distinction.

lionking · 14th January 2013, 01:51 PM

Originally Posted by WildCat

It's easy to win arguments when you just make stuff up, eh?

I hardly made this up:

Quote:

But in the final months of her employment, he complained that her tight clothing was distracting, once telling her that if his pants were bulging that was a sign her clothes were too revealing, according to the opinion.

Read more: http://www.patriotledger.com/news/x4...#ixzz2HzNjGJcB

I made the rational extrapolation that his inability to control himself was the problem, and not Nelson's behaviour.

fitzgibbon · 14th January 2013, 01:57 PM

Originally Posted by WildCat

If they go there they'll be all alone, like Libertarians. Libertarians actually do think all regulations should be abolished, they get a whopping 1% or so of the vote. So no, I don't see those laws changing ever.

No concept of the slippery slope in the windy city?

Originally Posted by WildCat

What is she a victim of?

The wife and a whipped husband that didn't want to be taken to the matrimonial cleaners in an at-will state.

Fitz

NewtonTrino · 14th January 2013, 04:39 PM

Originally Posted by Belz...

Tell that to NewtronTrino.

I would agree. Anecdotes are not evidence. All I'm claiming is that my perspective is different from most here. In no way do I ever make claims to be god or correct in all things. I simply call 'em as I see em in a very raw and aggressive manner. I come here to blow off steam and at least be in an environment with some small level of intelligent argument. For the record the best forums on the internet to participate in are the ones that use real names at all times and generally speaking have closed invite only membership.

fitzgibbon · 14th January 2013, 04:48 PM

Originally Posted by NewtonTrino

For the record the best forums on the internet to participate in are the ones that use real names at all times and generally speaking have closed invite only membership.

which oddly enough tend towards a not-quite-homogeneous-purview-but-preferring-not-too-dissimilar-outlooks (preaching to the converted in more common parlance).

Fitz

NewtonTrino · 14th January 2013, 05:01 PM

Originally Posted by fitzgibbon

which oddly enough tend towards a not-quite-homogeneous-purview-but-preferring-not-too-dissimilar-outlooks (preaching to the converted in more common parlance).

Fitz

Um, no.

Blue Mountain · 14th January 2013, 05:29 PM

Originally Posted by WildCat

Odd, I don't recall anyone in this thread calling for an end to all government regulations.

Strawman. I never said there are people in this thread wanting to end all government regulations. I was responding to NewtonTrino's obvious disdain for regulation and pointing out it's important, and gave a bit of background as to where it came from.

Maybe I read too much into it. When I read NewtonTrino's comment "excessive government regulation," I saw it in the same way that the Enron folks and the Wall Street banks didn't like "excessive" government regulation. California knows all too well how a deregulated electricity market went (they got screwed by Enron, which then spectacularly imploded), and the whole world knows how well loosening the banking regulations worked back in the 1900s and 2000s. A few people got very, very rich, and North America is still digging itself out of the recession they caused.

tsig · 14th January 2013, 07:12 PM

Originally Posted by NewtonTrino

I would agree. Anecdotes are not evidence. All I'm claiming is that my perspective is different from most here. In no way do I ever make claims to be god or correct in all things. I simply call 'em as I see em in a very raw and aggressive manner. I come here to blow off steam and at least be in an environment with some small level of intelligent argument. For the record the best forums on the internet to participate in are the ones that use real names at all times and generally speaking have closed invite only membership.

Yes, the whole forum and all us small level intelligences are here just to provide you with emotional release.

I'm surprised you'd waste your valuable time consorting with such small level intelligences.

NewtonTrino · 14th January 2013, 07:52 PM

Originally Posted by tsig

Yes, the whole forum and all us small level intelligences are here just to provide you with emotional release.

Oh that's right, this is supposed to be a super serious forum. Nobody comes here just for fun, right?

Quote:

I'm surprised you'd waste your valuable time consorting with such small level intelligences.

I'm trying to stop but you keep pulling me back in.

Morrigan · 14th January 2013, 09:57 PM

Originally Posted by WildCat

How could an employer stay in business like that?

By replacing the employee?

Quote:

How could he keep his good employees in such an environment?

Sometimes they don't, and still stay in business, because while keeping good employees is good for business, it's not inherently necessary to the survival of the business.

Quote:

Why would anyone want to work for such an employer?

Because they desperately need a job? Beggars can't be choosers, and all that.

Quote:

The "problem" is self-correcting without government involvement.

Nope.

Belz... · 15th January 2013, 02:55 AM

Originally Posted by NewtonTrino

I would agree. Anecdotes are not evidence.

Actually, they are, but the irony of you saying that is quite sweet.

Quote:

All I'm claiming is that my perspective is different from most here.

BS. You've been quite clear that your perspective is superior to others. Shall I quote you ?

Quote:

In no way do I ever make claims to be god or correct in all things.

Strawman.

Quote:

I simply call 'em as I see em in a very raw and aggressive manner. I come here to blow off steam and at least be in an environment with some small level of intelligent argument.

Part of that would sound like trolling, to a lot of people.

truethat · 15th January 2013, 08:58 AM

Originally Posted by NewtonTrino

I would agree. Anecdotes are not evidence. All I'm claiming is that my perspective is different from most here. In no way do I ever make claims to be god or correct in all things. I simply call 'em as I see em in a very raw and aggressive manner. I come here to blow off steam and at least be in an environment with some small level of intelligent argument. For the record the best forums on the internet to participate in are the ones that use real names at all times and generally speaking have closed invite only membership.

Give me a link to a site like this because I'm seriously ready to bail on here. I used to think this was a fantastic mecca of intellectual discussion, it seems to have evolved into a grind stone of personal agendas.

fitzgibbon · 15th January 2013, 09:06 AM

Ta-ta! You'll be missed

Fitz

truethat · 15th January 2013, 09:09 AM

Originally Posted by fitzgibbon

Ta-ta! You'll be missed

Fitz

I'm sure, and your GOP paranoia comments will be missed by me.

fitzgibbon · 15th January 2013, 09:18 AM

As will your Democrat paranoia ones. But I'm not a Yank so mine are observations of an outsider; I don't have a dog in your fight

Fitz

tsig · 15th January 2013, 09:34 AM

Originally Posted by truethat

Give me a link to a site like this because I'm seriously ready to bail on here. I used to think this was a fantastic mecca of intellectual discussion, it seems to have evolved into a grind stone of personal agendas.

People get back what they bring.

arromdee · 15th January 2013, 11:38 AM

Originally Posted by WildCat

"Defense"? In her lawsuit??? She's the plaintiff.

As a defense by the *defendant*. When she sued for discrimination, the employer should have responded "I didn't discriminate against her; I fired her for improper behavior". If the employer didn't do this, then he doesn't think her behavior was improper.

truethat · 16th January 2013, 07:12 PM

Originally Posted by arromdee

As a defense by the *defendant*. When she sued for discrimination, the employer should have responded "I didn't discriminate against her; I fired her for improper behavior". If the employer didn't do this, then he doesn't think her behavior was improper.

He didn't complain about her behavior, another employee did.

14th January 2013, 04:53 AM	#801
truethat Philosopher Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 9,005	Originally Posted by Belz... From my experience this is not automatic. This is mere rhetoric on your part. Your experience is anecdotal and therefor irrelevant.
truethat Philosopher Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 9,005	__________________ “Now I understand what is so intriguing about Zombie themed movies. When the pile on of stupid begins it's like being trapped in a Zombie movie. Seemingly normal people have suddenly turned into brainless gobs of hostility” ― Dan

14th January 2013, 09:52 AM	#810
fitzgibbon Master Poster Join Date: May 2007 Location: Just west of the centre of the universe Posts: 2,553	Originally Posted by tsig If you didn't make up your speculation then where did it come from? A presumptive inability of the plaintiff to multitask? Just a wild stab here. Feel free to correct Fitz
	__________________ "Television is a circus, a carnival, a traveling troupe of acrobats, storytellers, dancers, singers, jugglers, side-show freaks, lion tamers, and football players. We're in the boredom-killing business! So if you want the truth... Go to God!" Howard Beale, "Network"

14th January 2013, 09:55 AM	#811
fitzgibbon Master Poster Join Date: May 2007 Location: Just west of the centre of the universe Posts: 2,553	Originally Posted by WildCat Absolute nonsense. Not a single person here argues for monopolies, trusts, and cartels. Nor the repeal of workplace safety laws or other oversight. The day is young. Do you think the same will still be true if the GOP continues its march to the right? Originally Posted by WildCat If the employee had looked for another job instead of filing a lawsuit she would probably have been working in another office long ago. Now she has a national rep as sue-happy over sour grapes, good luck finding a job with that baggage in this environment. Your 'blame the victim' stance is duly noted.
	__________________ "Television is a circus, a carnival, a traveling troupe of acrobats, storytellers, dancers, singers, jugglers, side-show freaks, lion tamers, and football players. We're in the boredom-killing business! So if you want the truth... Go to God!" Howard Beale, "Network"

14th January 2013, 01:45 PM	#816
Belz... Fiend God Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: In the details... Posts: 28,974	Originally Posted by truethat Your experience is anecdotal and therefor irrelevant. Tell that to NewtronTrino.
	__________________ The Onmyouza Theatre, An unofficial international fanclub forum dedicated to the Japanese heavy metal band Onmyo-Za. "In the interests of time and space, it is not unreasonable to cite one point at a time. Citing 30 is the equivalent of citing none. Obviously." - Robert Prey

14th January 2013, 01:47 PM	#817
Belz... Fiend God Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: In the details... Posts: 28,974	Originally Posted by tsig If you didn't make up your speculation then where did it come from? He doesn't try to make up what actually happened, is the distinction.
	__________________ The Onmyouza Theatre, An unofficial international fanclub forum dedicated to the Japanese heavy metal band Onmyo-Za. "In the interests of time and space, it is not unreasonable to cite one point at a time. Citing 30 is the equivalent of citing none. Obviously." - Robert Prey

14th January 2013, 07:23 AM	#802
WildCat NWO Master Conspirator Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Albany Park, Chicago Posts: 49,457	Originally Posted by arromdee As a defense. "I actually fired her for unprofessional conduct, so it's not discrimination." "Defense"? In her lawsuit??? She's the plaintiff.

14th January 2013, 07:31 AM	#803
WildCat NWO Master Conspirator Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Albany Park, Chicago Posts: 49,457	Originally Posted by fitzgibbon I find it astonishing that the nominal 'free market' minds here (really libertarians by any reasonable judgement) seem to be looking to return to the halcyon days of the robber barons and such. So far as I can see, they seem emblematic of the axiom about those who forget history Fitz Absolute nonsense. Not a single person here argues for monopolies, trusts, and cartels. Nor the repeal of workplace safety laws or other oversight. If the employee had looked for another job instead of filing a lawsuit she would probably have been working in another office long ago. Now she has a national rep as sue-happy over sour grapes, good luck finding a job with that baggage in this environment.

14th January 2013, 07:36 AM	#804
WildCat NWO Master Conspirator Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Albany Park, Chicago Posts: 49,457	Originally Posted by Morrigan Indeed, so what's the problem with protecting employees from bad business owners who do fire employees on whims? How could an employer stay in business like that? How could he keep his good employees in such an environment? Why would anyone want to work for such an employer? The "problem" is self-correcting without government involvement.

14th January 2013, 07:37 AM	#805
WildCat NWO Master Conspirator Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Albany Park, Chicago Posts: 49,457	Originally Posted by lionking Like Knight. Firing someone because he can't control his erections. It's easy to win arguments when you just make stuff up, eh?

14th January 2013, 07:45 AM	#806
WildCat NWO Master Conspirator Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Albany Park, Chicago Posts: 49,457	Originally Posted by Blue Mountain Would that every employer do as well as you claim to be doing. Regulation sets the minimum standard, below which you get the government investigating your business. In the absence of regulation, business tends to engage in a race to the bottom: poverty-level wages, children toiling sixteen hours a day in mines, workers getting fired for being injured on the job; shades of The Jungle. It was the horrible working conditions, primarily incredible lack of physical safety for workers, in the 1700s and 1800s that led to the rise of unions and expansion of government regulation. Odd, I don't recall anyone in this thread calling for an end to all government regulations. Got a link? Of course you don't. This is just a weird hybrid of a strawman and an excluded middle fallacy. Originally Posted by Blue Mountain Tell that to the workers in Michigan who have just had most of their safety net swept away by the state's Republican government, who have changed the state to at-will employment. What about the workers in Michigan? Have employers fired everybody since going to at-will employment? I'd hate to see Detroit go downhill, it and the rest of Michigan were thriving under Dem stewardhip! I bet the GOP turns it into a hellhole...

14th January 2013, 08:29 AM	#807
tsig a carbon based life-form Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 27,243	Originally Posted by WildCat Absolute nonsense. Not a single person here argues for monopolies, trusts, and cartels. Nor the repeal of workplace safety laws or other oversight. If the employee had looked for another job instead of filing a lawsuit she would probably have been working in another office long ago. Now she has a national rep as sue-happy over sour grapes, good luck finding a job with that baggage in this environment. Originally Posted by WildCat It's easy to win arguments when you just make stuff up, eh? Like the hilited?

14th January 2013, 09:18 AM	#808
WildCat NWO Master Conspirator Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Albany Park, Chicago Posts: 49,457	Originally Posted by tsig Like the hilited? My speculation is made up? How does that work?

14th January 2013, 09:37 AM	#809
tsig a carbon based life-form Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 27,243	Originally Posted by WildCat My speculation is made up? How does that work? If you didn't make up your speculation then where did it come from?

14th January 2013, 10:11 AM	#812
WildCat NWO Master Conspirator Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Albany Park, Chicago Posts: 49,457	Originally Posted by tsig If you didn't make up your speculation then where did it come from? Obviously speculation is made up, thus my confusion as to your post.

14th January 2013, 10:14 AM	#813
WildCat NWO Master Conspirator Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Albany Park, Chicago Posts: 49,457	Originally Posted by fitzgibbon The day is young. Do you think the same will still be true if the GOP continues its march to the right? If they go there they'll be all alone, like Libertarians. Libertarians actually do think all regulations should be abolished, they get a whopping 1% or so of the vote. So no, I don't see those laws changing ever. Originally Posted by fitzgibbon Your 'blame the victim' stance is duly noted. What is she a victim of?

14th January 2013, 10:54 AM	#814
tsig a carbon based life-form Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 27,243	Originally Posted by WildCat My speculation is made up? How does that work? Originally Posted by WildCat Obviously speculation is made up, thus my confusion as to your post. One of these posts is not like the other. First you express scorn about speculation being made up then attempt to portray my post as confusing. If this is to be the way you choose to post then future dialogue may prove unprofitable for both of us.

14th January 2013, 11:06 AM	#815
WildCat NWO Master Conspirator Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Albany Park, Chicago Posts: 49,457	Originally Posted by tsig One of these posts is not like the other. First you express scorn about speculation being made up then attempt to portray my post as confusing. If this is to be the way you choose to post then future dialogue may prove unprofitable for both of us. I really have no idea what you're on about. lionking stated as a fact (not speculation) that the woman was fired because the boss couldn't control his erections, and that is something he just made up. My speculation was clearly speculation (note the word "probably"), not presented as fact and yet you compared it to lionking's post. All clear now?

14th January 2013, 01:51 PM	#818
lionking In the Peanut Gallery Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: Melbourne Posts: 29,983	Originally Posted by WildCat It's easy to win arguments when you just make stuff up, eh? I hardly made this up: Quote: But in the final months of her employment, he complained that her tight clothing was distracting, once telling her that if his pants were bulging that was a sign her clothes were too revealing, according to the opinion. Read more: http://www.patriotledger.com/news/x4...#ixzz2HzNjGJcB I made the rational extrapolation that his inability to control himself was the problem, and not Nelson's behaviour.
	__________________ A fanatic is one who can't change his mind and won't change the subject. Sir Winston Churchill Last edited by lionking; 14th January 2013 at 01:52 PM.

14th January 2013, 01:57 PM	#819
fitzgibbon Master Poster Join Date: May 2007 Location: Just west of the centre of the universe Posts: 2,553	Originally Posted by WildCat If they go there they'll be all alone, like Libertarians. Libertarians actually do think all regulations should be abolished, they get a whopping 1% or so of the vote. So no, I don't see those laws changing ever. No concept of the slippery slope in the windy city? Originally Posted by WildCat What is she a victim of? The wife and a whipped husband that didn't want to be taken to the matrimonial cleaners in an at-will state. Fitz
	__________________ "Television is a circus, a carnival, a traveling troupe of acrobats, storytellers, dancers, singers, jugglers, side-show freaks, lion tamers, and football players. We're in the boredom-killing business! So if you want the truth... Go to God!" Howard Beale, "Network"

14th January 2013, 04:39 PM	#820
NewtonTrino Illuminator Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Bothell, WA Posts: 3,803	Originally Posted by Belz... Tell that to NewtronTrino. I would agree. Anecdotes are not evidence. All I'm claiming is that my perspective is different from most here. In no way do I ever make claims to be god or correct in all things. I simply call 'em as I see em in a very raw and aggressive manner. I come here to blow off steam and at least be in an environment with some small level of intelligent argument. For the record the best forums on the internet to participate in are the ones that use real names at all times and generally speaking have closed invite only membership.

14th January 2013, 04:48 PM	#821
fitzgibbon Master Poster Join Date: May 2007 Location: Just west of the centre of the universe Posts: 2,553	Originally Posted by NewtonTrino For the record the best forums on the internet to participate in are the ones that use real names at all times and generally speaking have closed invite only membership. which oddly enough tend towards a not-quite-homogeneous-purview-but-preferring-not-too-dissimilar-outlooks (preaching to the converted in more common parlance). Fitz
	__________________ "Television is a circus, a carnival, a traveling troupe of acrobats, storytellers, dancers, singers, jugglers, side-show freaks, lion tamers, and football players. We're in the boredom-killing business! So if you want the truth... Go to God!" Howard Beale, "Network"

14th January 2013, 05:01 PM	#822
NewtonTrino Illuminator Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Bothell, WA Posts: 3,803	Originally Posted by fitzgibbon which oddly enough tend towards a not-quite-homogeneous-purview-but-preferring-not-too-dissimilar-outlooks (preaching to the converted in more common parlance). Fitz Um, no.

14th January 2013, 05:29 PM	#823
Blue Mountain Resident Skeptical Hobbit Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Waging war on woo-woo in Winnipeg Posts: 3,657	Originally Posted by WildCat Odd, I don't recall anyone in this thread calling for an end to all government regulations. Strawman. I never said there are people in this thread wanting to end all government regulations. I was responding to NewtonTrino's obvious disdain for regulation and pointing out it's important, and gave a bit of background as to where it came from. Maybe I read too much into it. When I read NewtonTrino's comment "excessive government regulation," I saw it in the same way that the Enron folks and the Wall Street banks didn't like "excessive" government regulation. California knows all too well how a deregulated electricity market went (they got screwed by Enron, which then spectacularly imploded), and the whole world knows how well loosening the banking regulations worked back in the 1900s and 2000s. A few people got very, very rich, and North America is still digging itself out of the recession they caused.
	__________________ The social illusion reigns to-day upon all the heaped-up ruins of the past, and to it belongs the future. The masses have never thirsted after truth. They turn aside from evidence that is not to their taste, preferring to deify error, if error seduce them. Gustav Le Bon, The Crowd, 1895 (from the French) Canadian or living in Canada? PM me if you want an entry on the list of Canadians on the forum. Last edited by Blue Mountain; 14th January 2013 at 05:30 PM.

14th January 2013, 07:12 PM	#824
tsig a carbon based life-form Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 27,243	Originally Posted by NewtonTrino I would agree. Anecdotes are not evidence. All I'm claiming is that my perspective is different from most here. In no way do I ever make claims to be god or correct in all things. I simply call 'em as I see em in a very raw and aggressive manner. I come here to blow off steam and at least be in an environment with some small level of intelligent argument. For the record the best forums on the internet to participate in are the ones that use real names at all times and generally speaking have closed invite only membership. Yes, the whole forum and all us small level intelligences are here just to provide you with emotional release. I'm surprised you'd waste your valuable time consorting with such small level intelligences.
	Last edited by tsig; 14th January 2013 at 07:14 PM.

14th January 2013, 07:52 PM	#825
NewtonTrino Illuminator Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Bothell, WA Posts: 3,803	Originally Posted by tsig Yes, the whole forum and all us small level intelligences are here just to provide you with emotional release. Oh that's right, this is supposed to be a super serious forum. Nobody comes here just for fun, right? Quote: I'm surprised you'd waste your valuable time consorting with such small level intelligences. I'm trying to stop but you keep pulling me back in.

14th January 2013, 09:57 PM	#826
Morrigan Crone of War Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 7,000	Originally Posted by WildCat How could an employer stay in business like that? By replacing the employee? Quote: How could he keep his good employees in such an environment? Sometimes they don't, and still stay in business, because while keeping good employees is good for business, it's not inherently necessary to the survival of the business. Quote: Why would anyone want to work for such an employer? Because they desperately need a job? Beggars can't be choosers, and all that. Quote: The "problem" is self-correcting without government involvement. Nope.
Morrigan Crone of War Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 7,000	__________________ curi0us: "Many kids grow up in environments where if the worse thing they had to deal with was a pervy gym teacher wanting to **** them they would considere themselves to be privileged and living the good life." Last edited by Morrigan; 14th January 2013 at 09:58 PM.

15th January 2013, 02:55 AM	#827
Belz... Fiend God Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: In the details... Posts: 28,974	Originally Posted by NewtonTrino I would agree. Anecdotes are not evidence. Actually, they are, but the irony of you saying that is quite sweet. Quote: All I'm claiming is that my perspective is different from most here. BS. You've been quite clear that your perspective is superior to others. Shall I quote you ? Quote: In no way do I ever make claims to be god or correct in all things. Strawman. Quote: I simply call 'em as I see em in a very raw and aggressive manner. I come here to blow off steam and at least be in an environment with some small level of intelligent argument. Part of that would sound like trolling, to a lot of people.
	__________________ The Onmyouza Theatre, An unofficial international fanclub forum dedicated to the Japanese heavy metal band Onmyo-Za. "In the interests of time and space, it is not unreasonable to cite one point at a time. Citing 30 is the equivalent of citing none. Obviously." - Robert Prey

15th January 2013, 08:58 AM	#828
truethat Philosopher Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 9,005	Originally Posted by NewtonTrino I would agree. Anecdotes are not evidence. All I'm claiming is that my perspective is different from most here. In no way do I ever make claims to be god or correct in all things. I simply call 'em as I see em in a very raw and aggressive manner. I come here to blow off steam and at least be in an environment with some small level of intelligent argument. For the record the best forums on the internet to participate in are the ones that use real names at all times and generally speaking have closed invite only membership. Give me a link to a site like this because I'm seriously ready to bail on here. I used to think this was a fantastic mecca of intellectual discussion, it seems to have evolved into a grind stone of personal agendas.
truethat Philosopher Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 9,005	__________________ “Now I understand what is so intriguing about Zombie themed movies. When the pile on of stupid begins it's like being trapped in a Zombie movie. Seemingly normal people have suddenly turned into brainless gobs of hostility” ― Dan

15th January 2013, 09:06 AM	#829
fitzgibbon Master Poster Join Date: May 2007 Location: Just west of the centre of the universe Posts: 2,553	Ta-ta! You'll be missed Fitz
	__________________ "Television is a circus, a carnival, a traveling troupe of acrobats, storytellers, dancers, singers, jugglers, side-show freaks, lion tamers, and football players. We're in the boredom-killing business! So if you want the truth... Go to God!" Howard Beale, "Network"

15th January 2013, 09:09 AM	#830
truethat Philosopher Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 9,005	Originally Posted by fitzgibbon Ta-ta! You'll be missed Fitz I'm sure, and your GOP paranoia comments will be missed by me.
truethat Philosopher Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 9,005	__________________ “Now I understand what is so intriguing about Zombie themed movies. When the pile on of stupid begins it's like being trapped in a Zombie movie. Seemingly normal people have suddenly turned into brainless gobs of hostility” ― Dan

15th January 2013, 09:18 AM	#831
fitzgibbon Master Poster Join Date: May 2007 Location: Just west of the centre of the universe Posts: 2,553	As will your Democrat paranoia ones. But I'm not a Yank so mine are observations of an outsider; I don't have a dog in your fight Fitz
	__________________ "Television is a circus, a carnival, a traveling troupe of acrobats, storytellers, dancers, singers, jugglers, side-show freaks, lion tamers, and football players. We're in the boredom-killing business! So if you want the truth... Go to God!" Howard Beale, "Network"

15th January 2013, 09:34 AM	#832
tsig a carbon based life-form Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 27,243	Originally Posted by truethat Give me a link to a site like this because I'm seriously ready to bail on here. I used to think this was a fantastic mecca of intellectual discussion, it seems to have evolved into a grind stone of personal agendas. People get back what they bring.

15th January 2013, 11:38 AM	#833
arromdee Scholar Join Date: Dec 2011 Posts: 64	Originally Posted by WildCat "Defense"? In her lawsuit??? She's the plaintiff. As a defense by the defendant. When she sued for discrimination, the employer should have responded "I didn't discriminate against her; I fired her for improper behavior". If the employer didn't do this, then he doesn't think her behavior was improper.
arromdee Scholar Join Date: Dec 2011 Posts: 64

16th January 2013, 07:12 PM	#834
truethat Philosopher Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 9,005	Originally Posted by arromdee As a defense by the defendant. When she sued for discrimination, the employer should have responded "I didn't discriminate against her; I fired her for improper behavior". If the employer didn't do this, then he doesn't think her behavior was improper. He didn't complain about her behavior, another employee did.
truethat Philosopher Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 9,005	__________________ “Now I understand what is so intriguing about Zombie themed movies. When the pile on of stupid begins it's like being trapped in a Zombie movie. Seemingly normal people have suddenly turned into brainless gobs of hostility” ― Dan