Ex-LAPD Cop goes on vengeful rampage against LAPD - Page 15

Skeptic Ginger · 16th February 2013, 03:34 PM

Originally Posted by Alt+F4

Who are they? Are you saying the LAPD shot into the cabin?

No I'm lumping these guys altogether. The trigger happy cops were not all LAPD, but nether were all the dead cops.

Women delivering newspapers in Torrance shot in manhunt for ex-cop

Quote:

Two women who were shot by Los Angeles police in Torrance early Thursday during a massive manhunt for an ex-LAPD officer were delivering newspapers, sources said.

The women, shot in the 19500 block of Redbeam Avenue, were taken to area hospitals, Torrance police Lt. Devin Chase said. They were not identified. One was shot in the hand and the other in the back, according to Jesse Escochea, who captured video of the victims being treated....

...Sources said the Los Angeles police detectives involved in the Torrance shooting were on protective detail for a police official named in the suspect's supposed manifesto, which was posted on what authorities believe is his Facebook page.

Look at the bullet holes in that SUV. Those women are lucky to be alive and the cops did not give them a chance before shooting.

Quote:

...A second shooting, involving Torrance police officers, occurred about 5:45 a.m. at Flagler Lane and Beryl Street in Torrance. No injuries were reported in that incident....

Chase said that in both instances police came across vehicles they thought were similar to the one Dorner is believed to be driving. Neither vehicle was Dorner's....

...the search intensified after three police officers were shot in Riverside County Thursday and Dorner was identified as a possible suspect....

...A short time later, two Riverside officers were shot at the corner of Magnolia Avenue and Arlington Avenue in Riverside. Riverside police Lt. Guy Toussaint said the officers were sitting at a red light when they were ambushed. One was killed, the other was still in surgery Thursday morning.

Officer who shot at innocent Redondo Beach man's truck believed it was Christopher Dorner's, Torrance chief says

Quote:

The report resulted in a "anxiety within [Torrence police] department," Neu said....

...A motorist reported seeing his Nissan Titan, saying it was driving erratically on the freeway. The motorist provided a partial license plate number of 808, Neu said. The actual license number of Dorner's truck was 8D83987.

The report convinced officers that Dorner was on his way to Torrance to attack the LAPD official. Two officers drove to Flagler Lane and Towers Street to block the road into the neighborhood with their patrol car in case Dorner was on his way, Neu said.

Shortly after 5 a.m., Perdue left his home in Redondo Beach and headed toward Torrance to pick up a friend to go surfing. He drove south on Flagler from Beryl Street and was stopped by the Torrance officers, who got out of their car and told him to turn around.

Perdue made the U-turn and headed north, just as two Torrance officers in another patrol car turned south onto Flagler to join their colleagues in protecting the neighborhood.

As they did, gunfire erupted on Redbeam.

Tell me that doesn't sound trigger happy? I'm sorry, but neither of those shootings were acceptable. In the second one the 'suspects' had just been stopped by other cops only a short time earlier and neither vehicle really fit the description of the suspect's.

It was the San Bernadino Sheriff SWAT Team that burned the cabin.
A San Bernardino County Sheriff SWAT team on a search for Christopher Jordan Dorner on Friday, Feb. 8. Authorities found him four days later holed up in a cabin in the Big Bear Lake resort area.

Quote:

Redlands Policer officers at blockade near the entrance to the San Bernandino National Forest. ...

...Sheriff's Deputy Jeremiah MacKay was killed during that final gunfight and another deputy was wounded.
MacKay, a detective who had been with the department 15 years,

Body of San Bernardino County Sheriff's Deputy Jeremiah MacKay escorted to mortuary

So, sure, LAPD and Torrence PD are not the SBPD, but all area police were on edge and multiple departments directly affected.

Skeptic Ginger · 16th February 2013, 03:36 PM

Originally Posted by Vortigern99

The police had reasonable certainty that no one else was in the cabin because the two cabin-owners (who called in Dorner's location and vehicle -- their own) had vacated, and Dorner had been alone when the police pursued him into the known-to-be-empty cabin.

I'm not defending the police's actions, but facts are facts.

I think it's reasonable the cops were fairly certain no one else was in the cabin. I'm not faulting them for the fire putting potential hostages in danger.

Skeptic Ginger · 16th February 2013, 03:37 PM

Originally Posted by zeggman

...I have read one account that there were three dogs in the cabin, two of which died in the fire, and one which escaped and was hit by a car.

That makes no sense.

I thought the owner of the burned cabin said it was a rental in between guests. Not to mention, what traffic? There weren't exactly cars zipping by on any nearby highways.

Skeptic Ginger · 16th February 2013, 03:43 PM

Big Bear cabin owner watched as vacation home burned during LAPD manhunt

Quote:

Martin bought the Seven Oaks Cabins in 2005 as a getaway for her family and with the intent to rent out the six smaller cabins on the property, which has been featured in movies and television shows.
"It’s hard for me to imagine him in there,” she said. "And I did do that. I imagined, what is he doing? What room is he in?"
Made of solid wood paneling and floors, the cabin was built in 1928. Any photos of the 90-year-old cabin were lost in the fire, Martin said.

No dogs.

zeggman · 16th February 2013, 03:50 PM

Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger

Big Bear cabin owner watched as vacation home burned during LAPD manhuntNo dogs.

I think you're right, there were no dogs. I can't find the original account I read, and assume it has been removed as inaccurate.

RandyN · 16th February 2013, 06:42 PM

This is not complicated. Police shot up two trucks that bear no resemblance and were not even the same make or color of the suspect vehicle. Police train to think and act properly while under pressure and not to overreact by shooting innocent citizens.

If your moral code has zero issues with police making no effort to conclude the chase other than burning the man alive then I have nothing else to add.

But what if next time its a bank robber who holes up? Can we try, convict, and execute him on the spot just cause we are cops who happen to be not all that smart ...we cant think of a better plan...????? Sounds like anarchy to me.

hcmom · 16th February 2013, 06:54 PM

Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger

Look at the bullet holes in that SUV. Those women are lucky to be alive and the cops did not give them a chance before shooting.

This is one of the things that really struck me. They shot the hell out of that truck, those are quite obviously NOT warning shots... and they didn't kill the people they were shooting at. Not only trigger happy, but not terribly good shots, huh?

Skeptic Ginger · 16th February 2013, 07:18 PM

Originally Posted by hcmom

This is one of the things that really struck me. They shot the hell out of that truck, those are quite obviously NOT warning shots... and they didn't kill the people they were shooting at. Not only trigger happy, but not terribly good shots, huh?

If this is true, it's worse than that.

Police fired more than 100 bullets at newspaper delivery women in a case of mistaken identity in the search for fugitive Chistopher Dorner

Sounds like even the woman shot in the back is OK now. The sick cops' boss offered them a new truck. Seems rather pitiful.

zeggman · 16th February 2013, 08:05 PM

Originally Posted by RandyN

This is not complicated. Police shot up two trucks that bear no resemblance and were not even the same make or color of the suspect vehicle. Police train to think and act properly while under pressure and not to overreact by shooting innocent citizens.

If your moral code has zero issues with police making no effort to conclude the chase other than burning the man alive then I have nothing else to add.

I haven't heard anyone say the police were justified in shooting the civilians, but that has nothing to do with burning the cabin. They had identified Dorner as the person in the cabin, and he had killed one cop and wounded another from that location.

They did make an effort to conclude the chase less violently -- they asked him nicely to surrender, then less nicely with tear gas, then less nicely by toppling the walls of the cabin.

I have no problem at all with their decision to set fire to the cabin. The only problem I have is that they're trying to pretend that's not what they did. I dislike people who won't tell the truth. If a citizen lies to the police, it's a prosecutable offense. If the police lie to every citizen who can hear them, it's apparently standard operating procedure.

wasapi · 16th February 2013, 08:12 PM

Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger

If this is true, it's worse than that.

Police fired more than 100 bullets at newspaper delivery women in a case of mistaken identity in the search for fugitive Chistopher Dorner

Sounds like even the woman shot in the back is OK now. The sick cops' boss offered them a new truck. Seems rather pitiful.

Offered them a new a new truck? I wonder if there is a stipulation that says in accepting it, they can't file a legal case in the future!

joesixpack · 17th February 2013, 07:55 AM

Originally Posted by wasapi

Offered them a new a new truck? I wonder if there is a stipulation that says in accepting it, they can't file a legal case in the future!

I'm certain the department lawyers were sure to add that condition if the chief hadn't thought of it himself.

zeggman · 26th March 2013, 06:38 AM

Well, the ******** has started.

The City of Riverside has stated that it will not pay the $100,000 which it pledged to the $1 million+ reward, because the conditions of the reward were not met.

They're using exactly the weasle words that many people suggested they would: The reward is for his "capture and conviction" not his suicide and incineration, or (certainly the most likely scenario when the rewards were offered after two paper delivery women were shot up for having a truck which resembled his) his death in a hail of bullets in lieu of capture.

I have never been more cynical about local government. Good luck getting anyone anywhere to take your promises of a reward seriously in the future.

16th February 2013, 03:34 PM	#561
Skeptic Ginger formerly skeptigirl Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Shifting through paradigms Posts: 40,587	Originally Posted by Alt+F4 Who are they? Are you saying the LAPD shot into the cabin? No I'm lumping these guys altogether. The trigger happy cops were not all LAPD, but nether were all the dead cops. Women delivering newspapers in Torrance shot in manhunt for ex-cop Quote: Two women who were shot by Los Angeles police in Torrance early Thursday during a massive manhunt for an ex-LAPD officer were delivering newspapers, sources said. The women, shot in the 19500 block of Redbeam Avenue, were taken to area hospitals, Torrance police Lt. Devin Chase said. They were not identified. One was shot in the hand and the other in the back, according to Jesse Escochea, who captured video of the victims being treated.... ...Sources said the Los Angeles police detectives involved in the Torrance shooting were on protective detail for a police official named in the suspect's supposed manifesto, which was posted on what authorities believe is his Facebook page. Look at the bullet holes in that SUV. Those women are lucky to be alive and the cops did not give them a chance before shooting. Quote: ...A second shooting, involving Torrance police officers, occurred about 5:45 a.m. at Flagler Lane and Beryl Street in Torrance. No injuries were reported in that incident.... Chase said that in both instances police came across vehicles they thought were similar to the one Dorner is believed to be driving. Neither vehicle was Dorner's.... ...the search intensified after three police officers were shot in Riverside County Thursday and Dorner was identified as a possible suspect.... ...A short time later, two Riverside officers were shot at the corner of Magnolia Avenue and Arlington Avenue in Riverside. Riverside police Lt. Guy Toussaint said the officers were sitting at a red light when they were ambushed. One was killed, the other was still in surgery Thursday morning. Officer who shot at innocent Redondo Beach man's truck believed it was Christopher Dorner's, Torrance chief says Quote: The report resulted in a "anxiety within [Torrence police] department," Neu said.... ...A motorist reported seeing his Nissan Titan, saying it was driving erratically on the freeway. The motorist provided a partial license plate number of 808, Neu said. The actual license number of Dorner's truck was 8D83987. The report convinced officers that Dorner was on his way to Torrance to attack the LAPD official. Two officers drove to Flagler Lane and Towers Street to block the road into the neighborhood with their patrol car in case Dorner was on his way, Neu said. Shortly after 5 a.m., Perdue left his home in Redondo Beach and headed toward Torrance to pick up a friend to go surfing. He drove south on Flagler from Beryl Street and was stopped by the Torrance officers, who got out of their car and told him to turn around. Perdue made the U-turn and headed north, just as two Torrance officers in another patrol car turned south onto Flagler to join their colleagues in protecting the neighborhood. As they did, gunfire erupted on Redbeam. Tell me that doesn't sound trigger happy? I'm sorry, but neither of those shootings were acceptable. In the second one the 'suspects' had just been stopped by other cops only a short time earlier and neither vehicle really fit the description of the suspect's. It was the San Bernadino Sheriff SWAT Team that burned the cabin. A San Bernardino County Sheriff SWAT team on a search for Christopher Jordan Dorner on Friday, Feb. 8. Authorities found him four days later holed up in a cabin in the Big Bear Lake resort area. Quote: Redlands Policer officers at blockade near the entrance to the San Bernandino National Forest. ... ...Sheriff's Deputy Jeremiah MacKay was killed during that final gunfight and another deputy was wounded. MacKay, a detective who had been with the department 15 years, Body of San Bernardino County Sheriff's Deputy Jeremiah MacKay escorted to mortuary So, sure, LAPD and Torrence PD are not the SBPD, but all area police were on edge and multiple departments directly affected.
	__________________ (*Tired of continuing to hear the "Democrat Party" repeatedly I've decided to adopt the name, ~~Pubbie Party, Repubs~~ "Republics" and Republic Party in response.)

16th February 2013, 03:36 PM	#562
Skeptic Ginger formerly skeptigirl Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Shifting through paradigms Posts: 40,587	Originally Posted by Vortigern99 The police had reasonable certainty that no one else was in the cabin because the two cabin-owners (who called in Dorner's location and vehicle -- their own) had vacated, and Dorner had been alone when the police pursued him into the known-to-be-empty cabin. I'm not defending the police's actions, but facts are facts. I think it's reasonable the cops were fairly certain no one else was in the cabin. I'm not faulting them for the fire putting potential hostages in danger.
	__________________ (*Tired of continuing to hear the "Democrat Party" repeatedly I've decided to adopt the name, ~~Pubbie Party, Repubs~~ "Republics" and Republic Party in response.)

16th February 2013, 03:37 PM	#563
Skeptic Ginger formerly skeptigirl Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Shifting through paradigms Posts: 40,587	Originally Posted by zeggman ...I have read one account that there were three dogs in the cabin, two of which died in the fire, and one which escaped and was hit by a car. That makes no sense. I thought the owner of the burned cabin said it was a rental in between guests. Not to mention, what traffic? There weren't exactly cars zipping by on any nearby highways.
	__________________ (Tired of continuing to hear the "Democrat Party" repeatedly I've decided to adopt the name, ~~Pubbie Party, Repubs~~ "Republics" and Republic Party in response.) Last edited by Skeptic Ginger; 16th February 2013 at 03:39 PM.*

16th February 2013, 03:43 PM	#564
Skeptic Ginger formerly skeptigirl Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Shifting through paradigms Posts: 40,587	Big Bear cabin owner watched as vacation home burned during LAPD manhunt Quote: Martin bought the Seven Oaks Cabins in 2005 as a getaway for her family and with the intent to rent out the six smaller cabins on the property, which has been featured in movies and television shows. "It’s hard for me to imagine him in there,” she said. "And I did do that. I imagined, what is he doing? What room is he in?" Made of solid wood paneling and floors, the cabin was built in 1928. Any photos of the 90-year-old cabin were lost in the fire, Martin said. No dogs.
	__________________ (*Tired of continuing to hear the "Democrat Party" repeatedly I've decided to adopt the name, ~~Pubbie Party, Repubs~~ "Republics" and Republic Party in response.)

16th February 2013, 03:50 PM	#565
zeggman Graduate Poster Join Date: Jun 2012 Posts: 1,762	Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger Big Bear cabin owner watched as vacation home burned during LAPD manhuntNo dogs. I think you're right, there were no dogs. I can't find the original account I read, and assume it has been removed as inaccurate.
zeggman Graduate Poster Join Date: Jun 2012 Posts: 1,762

16th February 2013, 06:42 PM	#566
RandyN Muse Join Date: May 2011 Posts: 706	This is not complicated. Police shot up two trucks that bear no resemblance and were not even the same make or color of the suspect vehicle. Police train to think and act properly while under pressure and not to overreact by shooting innocent citizens. If your moral code has zero issues with police making no effort to conclude the chase other than burning the man alive then I have nothing else to add. But what if next time its a bank robber who holes up? Can we try, convict, and execute him on the spot just cause we are cops who happen to be not all that smart ...we cant think of a better plan...????? Sounds like anarchy to me.
RandyN Muse Join Date: May 2011 Posts: 706

16th February 2013, 06:54 PM	#567
hcmom Tagger Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Probably lost. Posts: 10,646	Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger Look at the bullet holes in that SUV. Those women are lucky to be alive and the cops did not give them a chance before shooting. This is one of the things that really struck me. They shot the hell out of that truck, those are quite obviously NOT warning shots... and they didn't kill the people they were shooting at. Not only trigger happy, but not terribly good shots, huh?
	__________________ JeffWagg> hcmom, you can feel that way if you want, but you're quite innocent. Curnir> Hcmom. taking reality into a wholly new direction

16th February 2013, 07:18 PM	#568
Skeptic Ginger formerly skeptigirl Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Shifting through paradigms Posts: 40,587	Originally Posted by hcmom This is one of the things that really struck me. They shot the hell out of that truck, those are quite obviously NOT warning shots... and they didn't kill the people they were shooting at. Not only trigger happy, but not terribly good shots, huh? If this is true, it's worse than that. Police fired more than 100 bullets at newspaper delivery women in a case of mistaken identity in the search for fugitive Chistopher Dorner Sounds like even the woman shot in the back is OK now. The sick cops' boss offered them a new truck. Seems rather pitiful.
	__________________ (*Tired of continuing to hear the "Democrat Party" repeatedly I've decided to adopt the name, ~~Pubbie Party, Repubs~~ "Republics" and Republic Party in response.)

16th February 2013, 08:05 PM	#569
zeggman Graduate Poster Join Date: Jun 2012 Posts: 1,762	Originally Posted by RandyN This is not complicated. Police shot up two trucks that bear no resemblance and were not even the same make or color of the suspect vehicle. Police train to think and act properly while under pressure and not to overreact by shooting innocent citizens. If your moral code has zero issues with police making no effort to conclude the chase other than burning the man alive then I have nothing else to add. I haven't heard anyone say the police were justified in shooting the civilians, but that has nothing to do with burning the cabin. They had identified Dorner as the person in the cabin, and he had killed one cop and wounded another from that location. They did make an effort to conclude the chase less violently -- they asked him nicely to surrender, then less nicely with tear gas, then less nicely by toppling the walls of the cabin. I have no problem at all with their decision to set fire to the cabin. The only problem I have is that they're trying to pretend that's not what they did. I dislike people who won't tell the truth. If a citizen lies to the police, it's a prosecutable offense. If the police lie to every citizen who can hear them, it's apparently standard operating procedure.
zeggman Graduate Poster Join Date: Jun 2012 Posts: 1,762

16th February 2013, 08:12 PM	#570
wasapi Master Poster Join Date: May 2008 Posts: 2,383	Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger If this is true, it's worse than that. Police fired more than 100 bullets at newspaper delivery women in a case of mistaken identity in the search for fugitive Chistopher Dorner Sounds like even the woman shot in the back is OK now. The sick cops' boss offered them a new truck. Seems rather pitiful. Offered them a new a new truck? I wonder if there is a stipulation that says in accepting it, they can't file a legal case in the future!
wasapi Master Poster Join Date: May 2008 Posts: 2,383	__________________ Julia

17th February 2013, 07:55 AM	#571
joesixpack Illuminator Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Edge of the continent, Pacific county, WA Posts: 3,406	Originally Posted by wasapi Offered them a new a new truck? I wonder if there is a stipulation that says in accepting it, they can't file a legal case in the future! I'm certain the department lawyers were sure to add that condition if the chief hadn't thought of it himself.
	__________________ I never got in trouble by bein' ignorant, I always got in trouble 'cause I thought I wasn't.

26th March 2013, 06:38 AM	#572
zeggman Graduate Poster Join Date: Jun 2012 Posts: 1,762	Well, the ******** has started. The City of Riverside has stated that it will not pay the $100,000 which it pledged to the $1 million+ reward, because the conditions of the reward were not met. They're using exactly the weasle words that many people suggested they would: The reward is for his "capture and conviction" not his suicide and incineration, or (certainly the most likely scenario when the rewards were offered after two paper delivery women were shot up for having a truck which resembled his) his death in a hail of bullets in lieu of capture. I have never been more cynical about local government. Good luck getting anyone anywhere to take your promises of a reward seriously in the future.
zeggman Graduate Poster Join Date: Jun 2012 Posts: 1,762