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Senex · 6th October 2012, 04:16 AM

Originally Posted by Careyp74

Sounds like a really uninformed teacher. Having a topic on nutrition and the importance of vegetables, leading to a screening of VeggieTales.

I hope she doesn't show Caligula when they cover the Roman Empire.

One of the great underrated movies of our time.

Cucumbers have often performed double duty through the ages.

fuelair · 6th October 2012, 10:23 PM

Caligula was certainly a naughty little fellow - but he did pay for it.....

DGM · 7th October 2012, 10:12 AM

Originally Posted by fuelair

Caligula was certainly a naughty little fellow - but he did pay for it.....

We shouldn't talk about these things, someone might get offended.

OCaptain · 7th October 2012, 01:51 PM

Originally Posted by Tenchiken

I just recently found out that my 3rd grade child is being shown Veggietales, unedited, during classtime in a public Missouri school. I am going to discuss with the teacher and other faculty regarding my wishes that my kid is not exposed to religiously-based videos of that type, but I am trying to plan the best way to approach this. From my research, I am expecting that they will separate my child from the class for the duration, and personally I am of the opinion that this is not appropriate.

Does anyone else here have experience with having to ask a public school to not include religious imagery and/or non-historically relevant content? At this young an age, my child is still very easily influenced, and in my specific she is high-function autistic, making this too soon for me to be comfortable with explaining that what she is being shown at school as "educational" is fiction.

I unfortunately do not have the option of complete home-schooling (nor would I want to isolate my child from peers), but would love to hear any suggestions. My knowledge of relevant laws (Missouri) is very limited, and I only am personally aware of laws related to guided prayers. While I personally feel any religious rhetoric presented as "educational" is inappropriate, unfortunately I fear that this particular has not been dealt with in case law.

I am also fearful that, if this is just a single teacher and not a larger accepted curriculum, my child will then be singled out by a potentially angry freshly chastised christian teacher.

Any ideas, comments or warnings would be greatly appreciated!

At some point, you have to ask yourself if, as a parent, your decision to take action against the Veggietales in the classroom is about your child's well-being, or about your comfort level with the program material.

At this age, your child's values have largely been established hopefully by you. The job you've done shouldn't be easily torn down by a 30 minute animated Christian show, right? Part of teaching a child is teaching them to pick their battles. Is this the battle you want your child to go through? As others have said already, if you take legal action, protest, or otherwise make it known at school that your child is "different" in a very basic, cultural way, you don't know what the repercussions will be.

Is that fair to your child?

Silly Green Monkey · 7th October 2012, 11:23 PM

Originally Posted by OCaptain

The job you've done shouldn't be easily torn down by a 30 minute animated Christian show, right?

but OHNOES if a teacher wants to teach them science.

pgwenthold · 8th October 2012, 07:00 AM

Originally Posted by OCaptain

At some point, you have to ask yourself if, as a parent, your decision to take action against the Veggietales in the classroom is about your child's well-being, or about your comfort level with the program material.

How about the fact that the school has no right to advance a religious agenda in class? It violates the constitution.

It's not about anyone's "comfort" level, it is about the school violating the constitution. Why should ANYONE tolerate that?

OCaptain · 8th October 2012, 11:17 AM

Originally Posted by pgwenthold

How about the fact that the school has no right to advance a religious agenda in class? It violates the constitution.

It's not about anyone's "comfort" level, it is about the school violating the constitution. Why should ANYONE tolerate that?

We know now from the OP that they didn't do that.

dropzone · 8th October 2012, 06:31 PM

I didn't mind it that my children were introduced to the Judeo-Christian-Muslim values promoted by Veggie Tales, which are mostly of the "be nice" sort. And that is, at most, what a 3rd grader will get out of them. Kids will eventually have to deal with religion all around them. Knock the chips from your shoulders and let kids watch what are, to them, only cartoons. And cartoons with a far more subtle way of suggesting they be nice than most of the secular cartoons these days that lay it on with a trowel.

Anyway, raising a stink about Veggie Tales can make you look like a petulant idiot, especially if you don't watch some first. Fight the rest of the camel, not its nose.

HotNostril · 9th October 2012, 10:55 PM

Originally Posted by dropzone

I didn't mind it that my children were introduced to the Judeo-Christian-Muslim values promoted by Veggie Tales, which are mostly of the "be nice" sort. And that is, at most, what a 3rd grader will get out of them. Kids will eventually have to deal with religion all around them. Knock the chips from your shoulders and let kids watch what are, to them, only cartoons. And cartoons with a far more subtle way of suggesting they be nice than most of the secular cartoons these days that lay it on with a trowel.

Anyway, raising a stink about Veggie Tales can make you look like a petulant idiot, especially if you don't watch some first. Fight the rest of the camel, not its nose.

Totally agree with you. I'm an atheist that decided to send my child to a private Christian school. His school offered the very best education available, in my area. I've never told him I'm an atheist and right up to about age 8, he identified himself as a Christian. It didn't take him too long after he figured out Santa wasn't real to start asking the tough questions. What was important...he asked me! He would say something isn't sounding right, isn't adding up. I would agree and say it doesn't make any sense to me either. I was never threatened by the thought of my son learning about christianity. I knew logic and reason would eventually win. It's equally important for him to learn about world religions/ history of religions as it is evolution in my opinion.

pgwenthold · 10th October 2012, 07:40 AM

Originally Posted by OCaptain

We know now from the OP that they didn't do that.

But only after checking into it.

And the point is, you don't check into it because anyone is "offended" or "made uncomfortable" by it, but to verify that what is being done is proper.

6th October 2012, 04:16 AM	#81
Senex Illuminator Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: An autobody repair shop in Connecticut Posts: 3,575	Originally Posted by Careyp74 Sounds like a really uninformed teacher. Having a topic on nutrition and the importance of vegetables, leading to a screening of VeggieTales. I hope she doesn't show Caligula when they cover the Roman Empire. One of the great underrated movies of our time. Cucumbers have often performed double duty through the ages.
	__________________ I am the one who knocks! Walter White

6th October 2012, 10:23 PM	#82
fuelair Cythraul Enfys Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 29,307	Caligula was certainly a naughty little fellow - but he did pay for it.....
fuelair Cythraul Enfys Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 29,307	__________________ There is no problem so great that it cannot be fixed by small explosives carefully placed. Wash this space! We fight for the Lady Babylon!!!

7th October 2012, 10:12 AM	#83
DGM #4 Join Date: May 2007 Location: West of Northshore MA Posts: 14,525	Originally Posted by fuelair Caligula was certainly a naughty little fellow - but he did pay for it..... We shouldn't talk about these things, someone might get offended.
	__________________ Join the team, Show us what your machine can do (or just contribute to a good cause)Join the JREF Folders ! Team 13232 "Remember that the goal of conspiracy rhetoric is to bog down the discussion, not to make progress toward a solution" Jay Windley

7th October 2012, 01:51 PM	#84
OCaptain Muse Join Date: Aug 2011 Posts: 917	Originally Posted by Tenchiken I just recently found out that my 3rd grade child is being shown Veggietales, unedited, during classtime in a public Missouri school. I am going to discuss with the teacher and other faculty regarding my wishes that my kid is not exposed to religiously-based videos of that type, but I am trying to plan the best way to approach this. From my research, I am expecting that they will separate my child from the class for the duration, and personally I am of the opinion that this is not appropriate. Does anyone else here have experience with having to ask a public school to not include religious imagery and/or non-historically relevant content? At this young an age, my child is still very easily influenced, and in my specific she is high-function autistic, making this too soon for me to be comfortable with explaining that what she is being shown at school as "educational" is fiction. I unfortunately do not have the option of complete home-schooling (nor would I want to isolate my child from peers), but would love to hear any suggestions. My knowledge of relevant laws (Missouri) is very limited, and I only am personally aware of laws related to guided prayers. While I personally feel any religious rhetoric presented as "educational" is inappropriate, unfortunately I fear that this particular has not been dealt with in case law. I am also fearful that, if this is just a single teacher and not a larger accepted curriculum, my child will then be singled out by a potentially angry freshly chastised christian teacher. Any ideas, comments or warnings would be greatly appreciated! At some point, you have to ask yourself if, as a parent, your decision to take action against the Veggietales in the classroom is about your child's well-being, or about your comfort level with the program material. At this age, your child's values have largely been established hopefully by you. The job you've done shouldn't be easily torn down by a 30 minute animated Christian show, right? Part of teaching a child is teaching them to pick their battles. Is this the battle you want your child to go through? As others have said already, if you take legal action, protest, or otherwise make it known at school that your child is "different" in a very basic, cultural way, you don't know what the repercussions will be. Is that fair to your child?
OCaptain Muse Join Date: Aug 2011 Posts: 917

7th October 2012, 11:23 PM	#85
Silly Green Monkey Cowardly Lurking in the Shadows of Greatness Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Colorado Posts: 3,093	Originally Posted by OCaptain The job you've done shouldn't be easily torn down by a 30 minute animated Christian show, right? but OHNOES if a teacher wants to teach them science.
	__________________ Normal is just a stereotype.

8th October 2012, 07:00 AM	#86
pgwenthold Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Sep 2001 Posts: 12,119	Originally Posted by OCaptain At some point, you have to ask yourself if, as a parent, your decision to take action against the Veggietales in the classroom is about your child's well-being, or about your comfort level with the program material. How about the fact that the school has no right to advance a religious agenda in class? It violates the constitution. It's not about anyone's "comfort" level, it is about the school violating the constitution. Why should ANYONE tolerate that?
	__________________ "Baseball is a philosophy. The primordial ooze that once ruled our world has been captured in perpetual motion. Baseball is the moment. Its ever changing patterns are hypnotizing yet invigorating. Baseball is an art form. Classic and at the same time...progressive. Baseball is pre-historic and post-modern. Baseball is here to stay." (Stolen from the side of a lava lamp box, and modified slightly)

8th October 2012, 11:17 AM	#87
OCaptain Muse Join Date: Aug 2011 Posts: 917	Originally Posted by pgwenthold How about the fact that the school has no right to advance a religious agenda in class? It violates the constitution. It's not about anyone's "comfort" level, it is about the school violating the constitution. Why should ANYONE tolerate that? We know now from the OP that they didn't do that.
OCaptain Muse Join Date: Aug 2011 Posts: 917

8th October 2012, 06:31 PM	#88
dropzone Graduate Poster Join Date: May 2009 Posts: 1,667	I didn't mind it that my children were introduced to the Judeo-Christian-Muslim values promoted by Veggie Tales, which are mostly of the "be nice" sort. And that is, at most, what a 3rd grader will get out of them. Kids will eventually have to deal with religion all around them. Knock the chips from your shoulders and let kids watch what are, to them, only cartoons. And cartoons with a far more subtle way of suggesting they be nice than most of the secular cartoons these days that lay it on with a trowel. Anyway, raising a stink about Veggie Tales can make you look like a petulant idiot, especially if you don't watch some first. Fight the rest of the camel, not its nose.

9th October 2012, 10:55 PM	#89
HotNostril Student Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 42	Originally Posted by dropzone I didn't mind it that my children were introduced to the Judeo-Christian-Muslim values promoted by Veggie Tales, which are mostly of the "be nice" sort. And that is, at most, what a 3rd grader will get out of them. Kids will eventually have to deal with religion all around them. Knock the chips from your shoulders and let kids watch what are, to them, only cartoons. And cartoons with a far more subtle way of suggesting they be nice than most of the secular cartoons these days that lay it on with a trowel. Anyway, raising a stink about Veggie Tales can make you look like a petulant idiot, especially if you don't watch some first. Fight the rest of the camel, not its nose. Totally agree with you. I'm an atheist that decided to send my child to a private Christian school. His school offered the very best education available, in my area. I've never told him I'm an atheist and right up to about age 8, he identified himself as a Christian. It didn't take him too long after he figured out Santa wasn't real to start asking the tough questions. What was important...he asked me! He would say something isn't sounding right, isn't adding up. I would agree and say it doesn't make any sense to me either. I was never threatened by the thought of my son learning about christianity. I knew logic and reason would eventually win. It's equally important for him to learn about world religions/ history of religions as it is evolution in my opinion.
HotNostril Student Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 42

10th October 2012, 07:40 AM	#90
pgwenthold Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Sep 2001 Posts: 12,119	Originally Posted by OCaptain We know now from the OP that they didn't do that. But only after checking into it. And the point is, you don't check into it because anyone is "offended" or "made uncomfortable" by it, but to verify that what is being done is proper.
	__________________ "Baseball is a philosophy. The primordial ooze that once ruled our world has been captured in perpetual motion. Baseball is the moment. Its ever changing patterns are hypnotizing yet invigorating. Baseball is an art form. Classic and at the same time...progressive. Baseball is pre-historic and post-modern. Baseball is here to stay." (Stolen from the side of a lava lamp box, and modified slightly)