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Old 4th December 2012, 06:16 PM   #401
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making unsupported claims against a dead man is pretty low on the totem pole of "anti skepticism" (somewhere above Holocaust deniers and Truthers, but somewhere below AGW deniers and Bigfooters)
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Old 4th December 2012, 06:18 PM   #402
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Originally Posted by justintime View Post
There are plans to build the next generation of rockets that will push us past our own galaxy. NASA does not have that capability yet. Sort of if they won`t come to us we just have to go to them.
Can we see those plans for the trans-galactic rocket?
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Old 4th December 2012, 07:00 PM   #403
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Originally Posted by abaddon View Post
Can we see those plans for the trans-galactic rocket?
Yes I'd like to see them too, particularly as the Galactic escape velocity at the Solar System's radial position is about 1000 km/s, and the fastest we have ever accelerated a rocket to is 16.26 km/s (New Horizons mission to Pluto launched January 2006). By my math, that makes it over 60 times too slow.

justintime's "next generation of rockets" will have to be light-years (literally) ahead of what we have now. Even a spacecraft travelling at 90% of C will take something like 40,000 years just to reach the edge
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Old 4th December 2012, 07:14 PM   #404
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Originally Posted by justintime View Post
I think looking at the dates Roswell 1947 and around 1951 Carl Sagan at 17 talking about flying saucers and aliens makes me feel he made that connection. He developed an early obsession and tried to fulfill it by searching for them for the rest of his life.
~~~
Something seemed wonky with this speculation to me, because I was under the impression that 'The Roswell Incident' did not become known outside Roswell until the late 50s/early 60s.

I was wrong. It was the late 70s, when Stanton Friedman dug up Jesse Marcell in 1978.

So Sagan and the Green Bank Conference(SETI) had no connexion to Roswell.
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Old 4th December 2012, 07:18 PM   #405
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Originally Posted by justintime View Post
There are plans to build the next generation of rockets that will push us past our own galaxy. NASA does not have that capability yet. Sort of if they won`t come to us we just have to go to them.
I feel sorry for you, that you think this is something you could get away with saying. You have gone from pathetic to bathetic--you have three, and only three, reasonable options:
1. Provide a reliable source for these magical intergalactic rockets. Book, chapter, verse, or it didn't happen.
2. Throw yourself on the mercy of the forum, and admit that your braggadocio and hubris led your ego to write a check reality can't cash. Admit it was a fabrication out of thin air, or remarkable carelessness, and hope that the forum is in a forgiving mood.
3. Try to pretend we did not understand what you meant. Blame your claim on our lack of comprehension. Pretend we just don't get it. Try to lie your way out of it, and change the subject...and live with the fact that you have exposed your true colors for all to see.

Ooops--there is one more option. You could just go away.

I'm curious to see upon which one you will settle.
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Old 4th December 2012, 07:24 PM   #406
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How many laughing dogs are there in a light year?
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Old 4th December 2012, 07:37 PM   #407
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Originally Posted by Kid Eager View Post
How many laughing dogs are there in a light year?
Depends on how they lie.
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Old 4th December 2012, 07:39 PM   #408
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Originally Posted by Noztradamus View Post
Something seemed wonky with this speculation to me, because I was under the impression that 'The Roswell Incident' did not become known outside Roswell until the late 50s/early 60s.

I was wrong. It was the late 70s, when Stanton Friedman dug up Jesse Marcell in 1978.

So Sagan and the Green Bank Conference(SETI) had no connexion to Roswell.
Which simple proves his early obsession with flying saucers and aliens were even less founded because Roswell was what gave an impetus to UFOs. Maybe he got his impressions from early Mayan readings about UFOs and aliens which makes him even less credible than his public records.
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Old 4th December 2012, 07:48 PM   #409
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Originally Posted by justintime View Post
Which simple proves his early obsession with flying saucers and aliens were even less founded because Roswell was what gave an impetus to UFOs. Maybe he got his impressions from early Mayan readings about UFOs and aliens which makes him even less credible than his public records.
Okay, come clean. This is some kind of class assignment right? See what kind of outrageous illogical, non-sensical drivel you can post until everyone figures out that there's no way you could be serious? After all, there's no way anyone could possibly be as obtuse as your postings make you out to be. Not a bad attempt, but really, did you think anyone was going to take you seriously, ragging on Sagan with such ludicrous accusations. You should have made it at least plausible.
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Old 4th December 2012, 07:49 PM   #410
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Originally Posted by justintime View Post
Which simple proves his early obsession with flying saucers and aliens were even less founded because Roswell was what gave an impetus to UFOs. Maybe he got his impressions from early Mayan readings about UFOs and aliens which makes him even less credible than his public records.
Ever hear of, I dunno, War of the Worlds? The original radio broadcast? In 1938? Orson Welles? From the H.G. Wells novel?

Impetus to UFOs?

WTF are you talking about?
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Old 4th December 2012, 08:01 PM   #411
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Originally Posted by Kid Eager View Post
How many laughing dogs are there in a light year?
X10999999999
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Old 4th December 2012, 08:03 PM   #412
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Originally Posted by rwguinn View Post
X10999999999
You forgot to divide by 7 for dog years.
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Old 4th December 2012, 08:04 PM   #413
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Originally Posted by Spindrift View Post
Okay, come clean. This is some kind of class assignment right? See what kind of outrageous illogical, non-sensical drivel you can post until everyone figures out that there's no way you could be serious? After all, there's no way anyone could possibly be as obtuse as your postings make you out to be. Not a bad attempt, but really, did you think anyone was going to take you seriously, ragging on Sagan with such ludicrous accusations. You should have made it at least plausible.

Yep. Everyone has figured out by now that this is just gratuitous trolling. All that's left is batting his silly comments around like a cat toy. Oh, and I think there's a betting pool going for how long it goes before the ban.
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Old 4th December 2012, 08:10 PM   #414
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Originally Posted by justintime View Post
Maybe he got his impressions from early Mayan readings about UFOs and aliens which makes him even less credible than his public records.

So you are ignorant about the Mayans too. What's next?
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Old 4th December 2012, 08:17 PM   #415
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Originally Posted by Spindrift View Post
You forgot to divide by 7 for dog years.
Crap!
yes, we both know that a light-year is a distance, not a time
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Old 4th December 2012, 08:23 PM   #416
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Originally Posted by Resume View Post
Ever hear of, I dunno, War of the Worlds? The original radio broadcast? In 1938? Orson Welles? From the H.G. Wells novel?

Impetus to UFOs?

WTF are you talking about?
"1938?" What about 1898? Naturally though H.G. Wells believed or must have had some 'obsession' with UFO's and invading aliens, vengeful submariners, invisible men, changing animals to be almost human, time travel, and a world war dominated by air power, since he evidently wrote fictional stories about them.
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Old 4th December 2012, 08:24 PM   #417
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Originally Posted by justintime View Post
Maybe he got his impressions from early Mayan readings about UFOs and aliens which makes him even less credible than his public records.

Maybe he was an alien. Maybe that's Jesus on your toast. Maybe cats and dogs should get married. Maybe I'm petting a unicorn and you are under a bridge, demanding people pay a toll.
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Old 4th December 2012, 08:33 PM   #418
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Originally Posted by justintime View Post
Which simple proves his early obsession with flying saucers and aliens were even less founded because Roswell was what gave an impetus to UFOs. Maybe he got his impressions from early Mayan readings about UFOs and aliens which makes him even less credible than his public records.
Where's your source for those magical intergalactic rockets, Rocket-Boy? Changing the subject will not make the gaffe go away...
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Old 4th December 2012, 09:15 PM   #419
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Originally Posted by Slowvehicle View Post
Where's your source for those magical intergalactic rockets, Rocket-Boy? Changing the subject will not make the gaffe go away...
Future Space Travel
http://science.howstuffworks.com/solar-sail4.htm
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Old 4th December 2012, 09:19 PM   #420
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Originally Posted by justintime View Post
Carl Sagan was challenged about the two way communication even if it was possible would take hundreds of years to get the messages across. The entire project was a scam.
1. First the ETI had to be contacted.
2. We would never know if they responded to our signal because it would take way longer than a lifetime.
3. It would take another lifetime for the ETI to receive out reply.
You cannot get more irrational that this.

When I earlier said that, among other things, you did not understand the meaning of 'hypocrisy', and that 'fiction' was also a thing you did not understand, I should have added 'irrational' because you don't know what that means either. Oh, and 'scam'.
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Old 4th December 2012, 09:28 PM   #421
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Originally Posted by justintime View Post

A speculative article on possible future means of propulsion for spacecraft. Did you even understand it?

How long do you think it will take such a craft to reach another galaxy, justintime, as you believe the "next generation" of rockets will?
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Old 4th December 2012, 09:29 PM   #422
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Originally Posted by Slowvehicle View Post
I feel sorry for you, that you think this is something you could get away with saying. You have gone from pathetic to bathetic--you have three, and only three, reasonable options:
1. Provide a reliable source for these magical intergalactic rockets. Book, chapter, verse, or it didn't happen.
2. Throw yourself on the mercy of the forum, and admit that your braggadocio and hubris led your ego to write a check reality can't cash. Admit it was a fabrication out of thin air, or remarkable carelessness, and hope that the forum is in a forgiving mood.
3. Try to pretend we did not understand what you meant. Blame your claim on our lack of comprehension. Pretend we just don't get it. Try to lie your way out of it, and change the subject...and live with the fact that you have exposed your true colors for all to see.

Ooops--there is one more option. You could just go away.

I'm curious to see upon which one you will settle.
If you can read properly. It says NASA does not have that capability yet. Duh!
Quote:
There are plans to build the next generation of rockets that will push us past our own galaxy. NASA does not have that capability yet. Sort of if they won`t come to us we just have to go to them.
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Old 4th December 2012, 09:31 PM   #423
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Originally Posted by AdMan View Post
A speculative article on possible future means of propulsion for spacecraft. Did you even understand it?

How long do you think it will take such a craft to reach another galaxy, justintime, as you believe the "next generation" of rockets will?
I said there are plans to make the next generation rockets. But NASA does not have that capability yet. How much simpler can I get.

Quote:
There are plans to build the next generation of rockets that will push us past our own galaxy. NASA does not have that capability yet. Sort of if they won`t come to us we just have to go to them.
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Old 4th December 2012, 09:33 PM   #424
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Originally Posted by justintime View Post
If you can read properly. It says NASA does not have that capability yet. Duh!

Do you now admit that this part is ignorant nonsense?

Originally Posted by justintime View Post
There are plans to build the next generation of rockets that will push us past our own galaxy.
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Old 4th December 2012, 09:38 PM   #425
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Originally Posted by AdMan View Post
A speculative article on possible future means of propulsion for spacecraft. Did you even understand it?

How long do you think it will take such a craft to reach another galaxy, justintime, as you believe the "next generation" of rockets will?
The Sagittarius Dwarf Elliptical Galaxy is only some 70,000 light years from us. So as long as this next generation can travel at a large percentage of the speed of light, it's only an incredibly long trip. Of course, the Sagittarius Dwarf Elliptical Galaxy is kind of rinky dink, so if you want to go to a cool galaxy like M31 you'll have to hang in there for almost three million years. Better bring something to read.
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Old 4th December 2012, 09:45 PM   #426
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Originally Posted by justintime View Post
<snip>

As per usual, your cite does not support your claims.

You said:
Originally Posted by justintime View Post
There are plans to build the next generation of rockets that will push us past our own galaxy. NASA does not have that capability yet. Sort of if they won`t come to us we just have to go to them.
And compounded the silliness with:
Originally Posted by justintime View Post
You forget. The long range rockets combined with launching pad based on distant planets will enable us to get beyond our Milky Way.
The link you provided,
Originally Posted by justintime View Post
...is a speculative, sensationalist article about "solar sails". Not "rockets". Certainly not "intergalactic rockets" with "launching pad (sic) based on distant planets".

Did you even read the article? The "solar sail" concept has been around a long time. At its most effective, a solar-sail-powered craft might reach up to "5 times the speed of a conventional rocket"(notice that "solar sail craft are not"rockets")...and that only within a solar system. In interstellar space, the solar sail would not develop any significant power. I know maths can be confusing, but that means a solar-sail-powered craft would still only reach about 1/12 of galactic escape velocity.

So, do you have the plans for the intergalactic rockets you claimed, or was this just another...((what's a polite word?) "exaggeration" of reality, with no basis in fact?
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Old 4th December 2012, 09:45 PM   #427
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Originally Posted by AdMan View Post
Do you now admit that this part is ignorant nonsense?
Have to scale back the intergalactic travel to interstellar travel.

NASA's 100-Year Starship Project Sets Sights on Interstellar Travel
http://www.space.com/11200-nasa-100-...ar-travel.html
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Old 4th December 2012, 09:46 PM   #428
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I hear Mitch McConnell has plans to build his own Death Star. He just doesn't have that capability yet.
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Old 4th December 2012, 09:48 PM   #429
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Originally Posted by Slowvehicle View Post
Rocket-Boy:

As per usual, your cite does not support your claims.

You said:

And compounded the silliness with:


The link you provided,


...is a speculative, sensationalist article about "solar sails". Not "rockets". Certainly not "intergalactic rockets" with "launching pad (sic) based on distant planets".

Did you even read the article? The "solar sail" concept has been around a long time. At its most effective, a solar-sail-powered craft might reach up to "5 times the speed of a conventional rocket (notice that "solar sail craft are not"rockets")...and that only within a solar system. In interstellar space, the solar sail would not develop any significant power. I know maths can be confusing, but that means a solar-sail-powered craft would still only reach about 1/12 of galactic escape velocity.

So, do you have the plans for the intergalactic rockets you claimed, or was this just another...((what's a polite word?) "exaggeration" of reality, with no basis in fact?
I am a bit ahead of NASA. Hey what can I say.
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Old 4th December 2012, 09:50 PM   #430
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Originally Posted by justintime View Post
I am a bit ahead of NASA. Hey what can I say.

No, you simply don't know what you are talking about. And the fact that you think you can criticize Carl Sagan, who definitely did know what he was talking about, is laughable.

You have no credibility.
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Old 4th December 2012, 09:56 PM   #431
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Originally Posted by justintime View Post
I am a bit ahead of NASA. Hey what can I say.
You can say, "I got caught in a lie--there are no plans for 'intergalactic rockets', I just hoped that no one on a forum full of space-happy science fiction fans would know that".

Instead of pretending that you are "ahead of NASA".

...not that you need to admit the obvious, Rocket-Boy.
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Old 4th December 2012, 10:01 PM   #432
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ahead of NASA eh?

design me a spacecraft capable of traveling to Venus and back (with applicable flight path trajectories and burn times)

I'll give you a few days (and no high detail blueprints required, just a rough sketch with applicable notes)

should be a piece of cake for an engineering genius such as yourself eh?



ETA: 3 man crew, no lander, just an orbiter is required thanx!
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Old 4th December 2012, 10:03 PM   #433
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Originally Posted by Slowvehicle View Post
You can say, "I got caught in a lie--there are no plans for 'intergalactic rockets', I just hoped that no one on a forum full of space-happy science fiction fans would know that".

Instead of pretending that you are "ahead of NASA".

...not that you need to admit the obvious, Rocket-Boy.
With all the Carl Sagan material I have been researching. I might have caught his bug. I should be consider a cosmic visionary. Intergalactic travel. If they won't come to us, we will go to them. My new slogan.
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Old 4th December 2012, 10:12 PM   #434
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Originally Posted by justintime View Post
With all the Carl Sagan material I have been researching. I might have caught his bug. I should be consider a cosmic visionary. Intergalactic travel. If they won't come to us, we will go to them. My new slogan.
So this is your new tack? Caper, and jape, and play the jackanape, hoping to be winsome enough to distract from your fundamental dishonesty?

How's that working out for you?
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Old 4th December 2012, 10:13 PM   #435
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Originally Posted by justintime View Post
Which simple proves his early obsession with flying saucers and aliens were even less founded because Roswell was what gave an impetus to UFOs. Maybe he got his impressions from early Mayan readings about UFOs and aliens which makes him even less credible than his public records.
What a load of crap....does it make you feel "important" to lie about someone who can't "fight back" because they are dead?

You should be ashamed of yourself.

Last edited by R.A.F.; 4th December 2012 at 10:14 PM.
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Old 4th December 2012, 10:15 PM   #436
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Two questions, justintime, which you may understandably prefer not to answer: a) how old are you; and b) is English your first language (I'm guessing not)?
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Old 4th December 2012, 10:25 PM   #437
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Originally Posted by Foster Zygote View Post
The Sagittarius Dwarf Elliptical Galaxy is only some 70,000 light years from us. So as long as this next generation can travel at a large percentage of the speed of light, it's only an incredibly long trip. Of course, the Sagittarius Dwarf Elliptical Galaxy is kind of rinky dink, so if you want to go to a cool galaxy like M31 you'll have to hang in there for almost three million years. Better bring something to read.
No one said it was going to be easy.
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Old 4th December 2012, 10:26 PM   #438
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Originally Posted by justintime View Post
It is well documented his obsession with flying sauces and aliens in his biographies. But it does not mention where he got his information from. I am guessing it was from Roswell or Mayan literature. What is there to be ashamed of. I am sure he wants us to continue talking about his legacy....ETI, aliens and flying saucers.

You have shown you are ignorant on these subjects. Perhaps you should move on.
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Old 4th December 2012, 10:28 PM   #439
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Originally Posted by AdMan View Post
No, you simply don't know what you are talking about. And the fact that you think you can criticize Carl Sagan, who definitely did know what he was talking about, is laughable.

You have no credibility.
I don't know how you can even make a comparison. Carl Sagan was talking about radio signal contact. I am talking about intergalactic travel. We are visions apart.
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Old 4th December 2012, 10:28 PM   #440
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Originally Posted by justintime View Post
It is well documented his obsession with flying sauces and aliens in his biographies.
If you are trying to say that Sagan believed in alien flying saucers visiting Earth right now, then I have no "difficulity" calling you a bald faced LIAR.


Do yourself a "favor" and stop being stupid.
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