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Iamme · 15th September 2003, 07:58 AM

Heard this on the news the other day. Researchers are getting tired of bantering over whether or not there is something to the cursed tomb business. There is this tomb, entered a long time ago, where many people came in and/or died of other premature deaths. It has been dubbed some name, and I forget what they called it, on the news story.

O.k.,...even if science has an explanation for each and every death; does that mean that the tomb is not cursed? Couldn't 'the supernatural' use laws of science, to do it's work? I'll bet this 'news' can be found on some 'cursed tombs' and/or 'Egyptologists' website.

arcticpenguin · 15th September 2003, 08:30 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Iamme
Couldn't 'the supernatural' use laws of science, to do it's work?

Hypothesis 1: Supernatural forces are working their will through the apparent natural behaviour of the physical world.

Hypothesis 2: There is no supernatural, and the physical world works through the "laws of science", many of which have been fully or partially uncovered by man.

Could you a) provide evidence that would support hypothesis 1 over hypothesis 2? b) Explain why we should accept the exceedingly more complex hypothesis 1 without evidence supporting that extra complexity?

Occam prepares for another shave.

SRW · 15th September 2003, 10:08 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Iamme
Heard this on the news the other day. Researchers are getting tired of bantering over whether or not there is something to the cursed tomb business. There is this tomb, entered a long time ago, where many people came in and/or died of other premature deaths. It has been dubbed some name, and I forget what they called it, on the news story.

O.k.,...even if science has an explanation for each and every death; does that mean that the tomb is not cursed? Couldn't 'the supernatural' use laws of science, to do it's work? I'll bet this 'news' can be found on some 'cursed tombs' and/or 'Egyptologists' website.

Just once I would like to see a curse where people enter the tomb and are doomed to live forever. People always die, so the curse of death is fool proof.

arcticpenguin · 15th September 2003, 11:59 AM

From An encyclopedia of claims, frauds and hoaxes of the occult and supernatural by James Randi:

curse of Amen-Ra

Quote:

Though this story has been circulated and re-circulated, re-written and enthusiastically enhanced, it is still just a story. The mummy never existed and the entire tale is a journalistic exercise in bad writing and witless sensationalism, a story that the British Museum is often called upon to deny. The museum even publishes an official denial which is sent to those who inquire. But the story will show up again, count on it.

curse of King Tut

Quote:

An international myth started by the press and carefully nurtured by them ever since.
...
The story arose that many of those who had been connected with the tomb died violently and prematurely. The awkward facts are that the average duration of life for the 22 non-native persons (those who can be traced), who might be said to have had anything to do with the tomb opening or excavation, those who should have suffered the ancient curse, was more than 23 years after the "curse'' was supposed to become effective.
...
This group died at an average age of 73+ years, beating the actuarial tables for persons of that period and social class, by about a year. The Curse of the Pharaoh is a beneficial curse, it would appear.

See Appendix I for more information.

Appendix I, which can be found in the print version of the encyclopedia, details those who entered the tomb, how long after entry they died, cause of death and age at death. Conclusion: no curse.

Abdul Alhazred · 15th September 2003, 12:45 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by arcticpenguin

Hypothesis 1: Supernatural forces are working their will through the apparent natural behaviour of the physical world.

Hypothesis 2: There is no supernatural, and the physical world works through the "laws of science", many of which have been fully or partially uncovered by man.

Could you a) provide evidence that would support hypothesis 1 over hypothesis 2? b) Explain why we should accept the exceedingly more complex hypothesis 1 without evidence supporting that extra complexity?

Occam prepares for another shave.

Of course there might possibly be some mechanism for the tomb to be "cursed" consistent with hypothesis #2.

tracer · 15th September 2003, 02:56 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by SRW
Just once I would like to see a curse where people enter the tomb and are doomed to live forever.

Me too! I'd be visiting that tomb in a heartbeat. Does eternal youth also come with the package?

15th September 2003, 07:58 AM	#1
Iamme Illuminator Join Date: Aug 2003 Location: Western Wisconsin Posts: 4,622	Egyptologists to see if tombs are cursed! Heard this on the news the other day. Researchers are getting tired of bantering over whether or not there is something to the cursed tomb business. There is this tomb, entered a long time ago, where many people came in and/or died of other premature deaths. It has been dubbed some name, and I forget what they called it, on the news story. O.k.,...even if science has an explanation for each and every death; does that mean that the tomb is not cursed? Couldn't 'the supernatural' use laws of science, to do it's work? I'll bet this 'news' can be found on some 'cursed tombs' and/or 'Egyptologists' website.
	__________________ I lost my mind many years ago and it hasn't affected me a bit...a bit..a bit..a bit.

15th September 2003, 08:30 AM	#2
arcticpenguin woo ban clan Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 5,717	Re: Egyptologists to see if tombs are cursed! Quote: Originally posted by Iamme Couldn't 'the supernatural' use laws of science, to do it's work? Hypothesis 1: Supernatural forces are working their will through the apparent natural behaviour of the physical world. Hypothesis 2: There is no supernatural, and the physical world works through the "laws of science", many of which have been fully or partially uncovered by man. Could you a) provide evidence that would support hypothesis 1 over hypothesis 2? b) Explain why we should accept the exceedingly more complex hypothesis 1 without evidence supporting that extra complexity? Occam prepares for another shave.
	__________________ The power of accurate observation is frequently called cynicism by those who don't have it. - George Bernard Shaw

15th September 2003, 10:08 AM	#3
SRW Master Poster Join Date: Jul 2001 Posts: 2,901	Re: Egyptologists to see if tombs are cursed! Quote: Originally posted by Iamme Heard this on the news the other day. Researchers are getting tired of bantering over whether or not there is something to the cursed tomb business. There is this tomb, entered a long time ago, where many people came in and/or died of other premature deaths. It has been dubbed some name, and I forget what they called it, on the news story. O.k.,...even if science has an explanation for each and every death; does that mean that the tomb is not cursed? Couldn't 'the supernatural' use laws of science, to do it's work? I'll bet this 'news' can be found on some 'cursed tombs' and/or 'Egyptologists' website. Just once I would like to see a curse where people enter the tomb and are doomed to live forever. People always die, so the curse of death is fool proof.
SRW Master Poster Join Date: Jul 2001 Posts: 2,901

15th September 2003, 11:59 AM	#4
arcticpenguin woo ban clan Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 5,717	From An encyclopedia of claims, frauds and hoaxes of the occult and supernatural by James Randi: curse of Amen-Ra Quote: Though this story has been circulated and re-circulated, re-written and enthusiastically enhanced, it is still just a story. The mummy never existed and the entire tale is a journalistic exercise in bad writing and witless sensationalism, a story that the British Museum is often called upon to deny. The museum even publishes an official denial which is sent to those who inquire. But the story will show up again, count on it. curse of King Tut Quote: An international myth started by the press and carefully nurtured by them ever since. ... The story arose that many of those who had been connected with the tomb died violently and prematurely. The awkward facts are that the average duration of life for the 22 non-native persons (those who can be traced), who might be said to have had anything to do with the tomb opening or excavation, those who should have suffered the ancient curse, was more than 23 years after the "curse'' was supposed to become effective. ... This group died at an average age of 73+ years, beating the actuarial tables for persons of that period and social class, by about a year. The Curse of the Pharaoh is a beneficial curse, it would appear. See Appendix I for more information. Appendix I, which can be found in the print version of the encyclopedia, details those who entered the tomb, how long after entry they died, cause of death and age at death. Conclusion: no curse.
	__________________ The power of accurate observation is frequently called cynicism by those who don't have it. - George Bernard Shaw

15th September 2003, 12:45 PM	#5
Abdul Alhazred Yes, that one. Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Chicago Posts: 5,508	Re: Re: Egyptologists to see if tombs are cursed! Quote: Originally posted by arcticpenguin Hypothesis 1: Supernatural forces are working their will through the apparent natural behaviour of the physical world. Hypothesis 2: There is no supernatural, and the physical world works through the "laws of science", many of which have been fully or partially uncovered by man. Could you a) provide evidence that would support hypothesis 1 over hypothesis 2? b) Explain why we should accept the exceedingly more complex hypothesis 1 without evidence supporting that extra complexity? Occam prepares for another shave. Of course there might possibly be some mechanism for the tomb to be "cursed" consistent with hypothesis #2.
	__________________ The lack of a rational explanation is not evidence for an irrational explanation.

15th September 2003, 02:56 PM	#6
tracer Graduate Poster Join Date: Jul 2003 Location: Silicon Valley, Calif. Posts: 1,356	Quote: Originally posted by SRW Just once I would like to see a curse where people enter the tomb and are doomed to live forever. Me too! I'd be visiting that tomb in a heartbeat. Does eternal youth also come with the package?
	__________________ The truth, as always, is more complicated than that.