Synesthesia -- Anybody here have it?

Miss_Kitt · 4th August 2008, 05:14 PM

I'm currently writing a (brief) paper on synesthesia--the phenomenon of having one sensory input produce results characteristic of another sense, such as "seeing" colors with sounds or "tasting" colors--and wondered how many in this group have personal experience with same?

The studies I'm looking at give the occurance rate as anything from 1 in 500,000 to 1 in 200 people. I just wanted to take an unofficial, for-my-interest poll.

I discovered in the 90's that this was a named phenomenon, and that it was (then) considered vary rare. Since sounds have had color associations for me for my entire life--and it seems entirely normal to me--I was delighted to gain this insight. I'd learned not to talk about it, because people didn't understand what I meant, but for example brass instruments are blue or purplish in their tones, and strings are more gold-red spectrum.

There are differing degrees of this, for example, there are synesthetes that literally SEE the printed letter "A" as being red, even when it is not; and others who simply see it 'in their head' as red. I don't literally physically see colors in the air, but if I close my eyes or focus on the mental image, it's consistently there.

Anyway, just curious, Miss Kitt

TobiasTheViking · 4th August 2008, 05:28 PM

If i bang my head really hard(like, standing up into an open drawer or something) it has a specific smell. I can only describe it as "smells like a headache", smells almost, but not quite, like metal

Theophage · 4th August 2008, 06:01 PM

I have it, but its not really a big deal. I associate numbers, letters, times, and dates with colors. For example: 1 is white, 2 is yellow, 3 is red, 4 is green, etc. From what I understand, this is the most common form.

Miss_Kitt · 4th August 2008, 06:19 PM

Theophage -- That is supposed to be the most common form, yes. If you don't mind my asking: Do you physically see them as colored, or just associate them in your head? Both forms are known to occur.

Interestingly, some people with this form find mathematics or memorization unusually easy, as one synesthete told her sister who was struggling with multiplication tables, "Just focus on the colors!"

Thanks for replying!

ETA: One of the most interesting things (to me) about synesthesia is that it is completely "no big deal" to those that possess it. I remember having a profound realization while talking with an extremely musically talented friend that she had to keep track of things like fugues without being able to look at them. Wow! That is one amazing mental talent! I sure couldn't do it.

Terry · 4th August 2008, 06:24 PM

Sounds have colors and patterns for me, but it has to be dark for me to notice unless its a very loud sound.

CriticalThanking · 4th August 2008, 08:00 PM

I have a former cow-orker who sees numbers as colors. However, he attributes this to heavy LSD usage, which continues to this day. He does not remember the phenomenon prior to drug usage.

CT

Aquila · 4th August 2008, 08:42 PM

When I play my steel-string guitar, I can "taste" metal. I get a tingling in my mouth, and I have to wash my hands to get rid of the metal taste. Not quite relevant to your question, but I thought you'd like to know.

It's happened for over 30 years.

Ron_Tomkins · 4th August 2008, 09:44 PM

Originally Posted by Miss_Kitt

I'm currently writing a (brief) paper on synesthesia--the phenomenon of having one sensory input produce results characteristic of another sense, such as "seeing" colors with sounds or "tasting" colors--and wondered how many in this group have personal experience with same?

The studies I'm looking at give the occurance rate as anything from 1 in 500,000 to 1 in 200 people. I just wanted to take an unofficial, for-my-interest poll.

I discovered in the 90's that this was a named phenomenon, and that it was (then) considered vary rare. Since sounds have had color associations for me for my entire life--and it seems entirely normal to me--I was delighted to gain this insight. I'd learned not to talk about it, because people didn't understand what I meant, but for example brass instruments are blue or purplish in their tones, and strings are more gold-red spectrum.

There are differing degrees of this, for example, there are synesthetes that literally SEE the printed letter "A" as being red, even when it is not; and others who simply see it 'in their head' as red. I don't literally physically see colors in the air, but if I close my eyes or focus on the mental image, it's consistently there.

Anyway, just curious, Miss Kitt

Did you intentionally write it in blue

Gurdur · 4th August 2008, 09:59 PM

Occasionally. I most certainly do not find mathematics or memorization unusually easy.

Theophage · 4th August 2008, 10:58 PM

Originally Posted by Miss_Kitt

Theophage -- That is supposed to be the most common form, yes. If you don't mind my asking: Do you physically see them as colored, or just associate them in your head? Both forms are known to occur.

Interestingly, some people with this form find mathematics or memorization unusually easy, as one synesthete told her sister who was struggling with multiplication tables, "Just focus on the colors!"

Thanks for replying!

I associate them in my head rather than seeing the colors physically, but when I picture numbers or letters in my head (like in memorizing) then yes, they are that color.

Quote:

ETA: One of the most interesting things (to me) about synesthesia is that it is completely "no big deal" to those that possess it. I remember having a profound realization while talking with an extremely musically talented friend that she had to keep track of things like fugues without being able to look at them. Wow! That is one amazing mental talent! I sure couldn't do it.

I was an adult before I ever heard of anyone else having this phenomena. I figured I was special in some way, and I also thought that those colors were indeed objectively tied to those numbers and letters. When I found out other synesthetes saw/felt different things, it was kind of disappointing.

PingOfPong · 4th August 2008, 11:25 PM

I'm not a synesthete but I'm really good at math.

For example, I can find the following

2 + 34 = 33 + 3

Theophage · 4th August 2008, 11:50 PM

pretty!

1234567890

Gagglegnash · 5th August 2008, 12:11 AM

Hi

When I was young, I distinctly remember words having aroma. "Cup," smelled old and dusty, "sucker," smelled like an old, wet rubber tire, and "rubber," smelled like fish.

All words had some smell, tho those three were the strongest.

In school, I noticed that I could, "feel," a mathematical function. I was in the dummy-arithmetic class because I couldn't add, subtract, multiply or divide until the math teacher had us do the, "Exercises for Experts," thing at the end of the chapter, "This is Algebra."

I knew all the answers, just looking at the problem, because I could, "feel the shape," of the function.

The teacher was stunned for a second, considering my inability to use the basic tools used to derive the answers, and even made sure I wasn't just using the answers in the back of the book. Then he left the room and arranged for me to be transferred immediately into the algebra class.

I still love the feeling of x = y², and computer programs feel like a construction of flexible tinker toys.

PingOfPong · 5th August 2008, 12:19 AM

Theo, for some odd reason your color choices make sense to me. 5 is orange *smacks head*, of course!

whatthebutlersaw · 5th August 2008, 06:17 AM

Smelling other people's feelings like actual smells, and attributing personalities to numbers. Does this qualify?

Delvo · 5th August 2008, 06:37 AM

Originally Posted by Miss_Kitt

Do you physically see them as colored, or just associate them in your head? Both forms are known to occur.

Just mentally associating things is not synesthesia. True synesthesia is sensory. The latter is rare, but any time I see it mentioned online, I see lots of people chiming in with their own examples of the former as if it were the same thing. The very fact that so many people can give examples of the former demonstrates that it isn't at all unusual. Associating one thing with another in an arbitrarily symbolic way is just a part of how human brains think. Getting signals from one of the body's senses misdirected to where signals from another one belong is not.

I think the more interesting thing demonstrated by online conversations about synesthesia is not about the condition itself, but about psychology: that many people seem to WANT to be included in groups that are interesting in some way, such as having rare but harmless conditions. Another example is that if you look at a thread about eye colors, you'll see lots and lots of people claiming to have highly unusual or even impossible colors such as green, gray, or even "violet" instead of just blue or brown like we all know practically everybody's really are; they just have blue or brown eyes and want to make it sound more exotic. (I've seen this in person too, such as a person whose brown eyes I could clearly see for myself right then and there telling me they were green.) Excellent night vision, ultrasonic hearing, and precognition are other popular ones.

Rob Lister · 5th August 2008, 06:53 AM

Originally Posted by Miss_Kitt

I'm currently writing a (brief) paper on synesthesia--the phenomenon of having one sensory input produce results characteristic of another sense, such as "seeing" colors with sounds or "tasting" colors--and wondered how many in this group have personal experience with same?

Three letters...

LSD

'Nuff said.

Rather than provide evidence, I'll rely on at least a few of our forum members to back me up.

Dagny · 5th August 2008, 07:44 AM

I have colored language, and I only “see” the color in my own mind. My mom has this form as well. She named me Bethany because she sees it as a beautiful shade of purple – her favorite color. I, unfortunately, see it as bright yellow.

My mom seems to have it much more mildly than I do. She definitely associates colors with letters but is hard pressed to describe her whole alphabet, and only seems to have a few colored numbers. Aside from my Mom, I have yet to meet anyone else with synesthesia.

I also have “conceptual” synesthesia for time – I see the days of the week as an oval that I’m walking on. Monday through Friday make up one half of the oval and Saturday and Sunday consist of the other half. Since today is Tuesday, Monday is behind me, Wednesday is in front of me and Sunday is to my right. Years, decades and centuries also have a shape for me. Of course, all of this is color coded.

When I’m very tired or intoxicated or both I have color associations with touch, I think. It could also just be that I have an active imagination.

My numbers and letters:

1 = white
2 = yellow
3 = red
4 = dark yellow
5 = black
6 = pale blue
7 = bright green
8 = green
9 = dark red
10 = white

A = red
B = yellow
C = pale blue
D = green
E = blue
F = pale blue
G = dark green
H = orange
I = yellow
J = bright green
K = purple/blue
L = blue
M = red
N = light brown
O = yellow
P = orange
Q = metallic silvery/purple
R = black with reddish tints
S = red
T = green
U = cream
V = black
W = pale blue
X = black
Y = white
Z = light purple/blue

Dagny · 5th August 2008, 08:32 AM

..double post...

Naughtyhippo · 5th August 2008, 08:37 AM

My mother definitely sees colours when she hears sounds, she may see shapes as well - it's been a while since she talked about it.

I strongly doubt I have synesthesia but letters, numbers, fonts all 'feel' better in certain colours and have personality, but go away as soon as a word is formed.* In fact, most inanimate objects have some form of personality in my head - but I'm sure they're meant to. After all, why would anyone talk about 'brooding gothic architecture' unless getting feelings from inanimate objects was common?

*some reason, I find post #11 of this thread very unsettling to look at.

NoisyAstronomer · 5th August 2008, 01:35 PM

I've never experienced that, but I have a friend who does. Letters and numbers have distinct colors in his mind. And words take on the color of the first letter. We had a good time one night finding out what colors our names were associated with.

And no, no LSD. No drugs of any sort with this guy.

buzz lightyear · 5th August 2008, 02:36 PM

Originally Posted by Miss_Kitt

I discovered in the 90's that this was a named phenomenon, and that it was (then) considered vary rare. Since sounds have had color associations for me for my entire life--and it seems entirely normal to me--I was delighted to gain this insight. I'd learned not to talk about it, because people didn't understand what I meant, but for example brass instruments are blue or purplish in their tones, and strings are more gold-red spectrum.

Like you, Miss Kitt, I have had a colour, sound association all my life.
But it also had an emotion element to it, so various sounds-colours produced emotions.
So like most children with 'abnormal' abilities I suppressed it as much as possible.

It wasnt until later life that I started to explore this realm and found, that as Rob Lister has pointed out, LSD is the catalyst par excellence.
I have found the ability to see and produce emotions through sound is a remarkable and beautiful way to explore the inner regions of my psyche.

Miss_Kitt · 5th August 2008, 03:16 PM

Originally Posted by Delvo

Just mentally associating things is not synesthesia. True synesthesia is sensory. The latter is rare, but any time I see it mentioned online, I see lots of people chiming in with their own examples of the former as if it were the same thing. The very fact that so many people can give examples of the former demonstrates that it isn't at all unusual. Associating one thing with another in an arbitrarily symbolic way is just a part of how human brains think. Getting signals from one of the body's senses misdirected to where signals from another one belong is not.

Delvo -- The research that I have been doing indicated that there are people who have a literal, physiological "association" that is involuntary, consistent, and lifelong, and that this is considered synesthesia. The people who can't "switch off" the color processing (or texture, or whatever) have the strongest form, but people with milder presentations are not all "just claiming it" when it isn't happening. They have devised some interesting tests to screen out exactly those kind of wannabes.

At the moment, some researchers believe that all humans start out with their sensory responses "cross-wired", and the connections are pruned down over time, thus removing the additional response. In other words, we have all been synesthetes, but some people's brains retain that function into adulthood, while most don't. Another school of thought is that some brains just have connections between areas that most brains don't. In either case, it appears to be a heritable tendency.

This seems to be a rapidly developing field of research, especially at UCSD and in Spain (forgive me, I've forgotten which university there).

Kotatsu · 5th August 2008, 03:24 PM

My ex-girlfriend had it for sounds. She played the oboe (very nicely, if I may say so), which she loved the colour of, but she couldn't stand the clarinet, as the colour was ghastly. Some kind of stingy red, if I recall correctly.

I had never heard about this until I met her the first time. Then it was revealed to me that two of my best friends also had it --- one seeing colours on all numbers (as others have shown in this thread) and one only seeing letters in colours. So of five people in the room, three had synesthesia, and two had never heard of it before...

Miss_Kitt · 5th August 2008, 03:33 PM

Replying to several: I don't know that psychotropics are or aren't a catalyst for this. Back in the Day, I definitely once watched a ceiling display the sound of a RUSH album for and hour and a half after nobody told me the brownies were "magic" until after I'd eaten TWO...but I have not done any studies, even informally on the subject. (The one nice thing was that lightshow kept my mind off how awful my stomach felt.)

One of the hallmarks of this phenomenon is that it is consistent, that is, if 3 is red for you when you're a kid, it's always red for you. Furthermore, if you're looking at a black-and-white screen with symbols on it and one of them is a "3", fMRI will show the area of the brain that assesses color is firing. Also, people with this kind of synesthesia can pick out differing characters in a random screenful more quickly than other folks if the odd symbols are ones they "see" as a bright color like red or yellow.

Dagny -- What color is "Dagny" for you? Just curious, but I assume since you took it for your screen name, you like it.

Current research suggests the occurance of some form of synesthesia may be as common as one in a thousand, or even--this is the lowest I've seen, and I don't know what their threshhold was--one in 200. It's not often reported without direct questioning, because it is perfectly normal to the person who has it.

What I find interesting is that there have been so many positive responses, though of course this is a self-selecting group. I know based on my own experience, I just didn't mention it because I learned young that it wasn't productive. (In fact, I remember having my first husband tell me, "No, you don't!" when I told him about it.)

Dagny · 6th August 2008, 12:21 AM

Miss Kitt - Dagny is a blackish color with dark red undertones – if that makes any sense. A lot of my colors are sort of difficult to describe in a coherent manner. I do find the color of Dagny far more appealing than yellow which is by far the most offensive of all colors.

buzz lightyear · 6th August 2008, 01:33 AM

Originally Posted by Miss_Kitt

Replying to several: I don't know that psychotropics are or aren't a catalyst for this. Back in the Day, I definitely once watched a ceiling display the sound of a RUSH album for and hour and a half after nobody told me the brownies were "magic" until after I'd eaten TWO...but I have not done any studies, even informally on the subject. (The one nice thing was that lightshow kept my mind off how awful my stomach felt.)

)

Your "cookies" were probably mushroom (psilocybin) laced. An unpredictable, and as you experienced unpleasant venture into psychotropics.
I am pleased that you used the term psychotropics, and not hallucinogens.

My experience with synthetic psychotropics has been to enable me to create acoustic harmonic vortices. This involves chanting, with my eyes closed for a number of hours in a harmonic chamber.
After about an hour of this, the visual cortex receives the sound as images and the various notes become colours that are stacked in a very similar manner to this graph.

After about 3 hours the vortex becomes self sustaining and it is just a matter of watching which colour starts to fade, and sing the note of the corresponding colour to keep the mass spinning.

The sound produced is divine.

4th August 2008, 05:14 PM	#1
Miss_Kitt Zombie Horse of Homeopathy Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Lesser Seattle Posts: 3,625	Synesthesia -- Anybody here have it? I'm currently writing a (brief) paper on synesthesia--the phenomenon of having one sensory input produce results characteristic of another sense, such as "seeing" colors with sounds or "tasting" colors--and wondered how many in this group have personal experience with same? The studies I'm looking at give the occurance rate as anything from 1 in 500,000 to 1 in 200 people. I just wanted to take an unofficial, for-my-interest poll. I discovered in the 90's that this was a named phenomenon, and that it was (then) considered vary rare. Since sounds have had color associations for me for my entire life--and it seems entirely normal to me--I was delighted to gain this insight. I'd learned not to talk about it, because people didn't understand what I meant, but for example brass instruments are blue or purplish in their tones, and strings are more gold-red spectrum. There are differing degrees of this, for example, there are synesthetes that literally SEE the printed letter "A" as being red, even when it is not; and others who simply see it 'in their head' as red. I don't literally physically see colors in the air, but if I close my eyes or focus on the mental image, it's consistently there. Anyway, just curious, Miss Kitt
	__________________ It's much better to live an honest life than a delusional one -- desertgal Magic thinking is a lead personal floatation device. It looks really reassuring, but it will drag you down--whatthebutlersaw

4th August 2008, 05:28 PM	#2
TobiasTheViking Resident Viking Autist Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: With your mother Posts: 6,923	If i bang my head really hard(like, standing up into an open drawer or something) it has a specific smell. I can only describe it as "smells like a headache", smells almost, but not quite, like metal
	__________________ He pricked me with his prick that prick - NobbyNobbs Endearingly Obnoxious - Rebecca Watson

4th August 2008, 06:19 PM	#4
Miss_Kitt Zombie Horse of Homeopathy Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Lesser Seattle Posts: 3,625	Theophage -- That is supposed to be the most common form, yes. If you don't mind my asking: Do you physically see them as colored, or just associate them in your head? Both forms are known to occur. Interestingly, some people with this form find mathematics or memorization unusually easy, as one synesthete told her sister who was struggling with multiplication tables, "Just focus on the colors!" Thanks for replying! ETA: One of the most interesting things (to me) about synesthesia is that it is completely "no big deal" to those that possess it. I remember having a profound realization while talking with an extremely musically talented friend that she had to keep track of things like fugues without being able to look at them. Wow! That is one amazing mental talent! I sure couldn't do it.
	__________________ It's much better to live an honest life than a delusional one -- desertgal Magic thinking is a lead personal floatation device. It looks really reassuring, but it will drag you down--whatthebutlersaw Last edited by Miss_Kitt; 4th August 2008 at 06:21 PM.

4th August 2008, 08:00 PM	#6
CriticalThanking Designated Hitter Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: In the queue to Williamsport Posts: 2,159	I have a former cow-orker who sees numbers as colors. However, he attributes this to heavy LSD usage, which continues to this day. He does not remember the phenomenon prior to drug usage. CT
	__________________ T-Mobile customer service sucks. Happiness should not be a zero sum game. Did I mention T-Mobile customer service sucks?

4th August 2008, 09:59 PM	#9
Gurdur Person Join Date: Jun 2003 Posts: 4,875	Occasionally. I most certainly do not find mathematics or memorization unusually easy.
Gurdur Person Join Date: Jun 2003 Posts: 4,875

4th August 2008, 06:01 PM	#3
Theophage Scholar Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Tucson, AZ Posts: 116	I have it, but its not really a big deal. I associate numbers, letters, times, and dates with colors. For example: 1 is white, 2 is yellow, 3 is red, 4 is green, etc. From what I understand, this is the most common form.

4th August 2008, 06:24 PM	#5
Terry Zeitgeist-impaired Technical Moderator Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: logged in to the server Posts: 6,450	Sounds have colors and patterns for me, but it has to be dark for me to notice unless its a very loud sound.

4th August 2008, 08:42 PM	#7
Aquila Muse Join Date: May 2006 Location: Los Angeles Posts: 631	When I play my steel-string guitar, I can "taste" metal. I get a tingling in my mouth, and I have to wash my hands to get rid of the metal taste. Not quite relevant to your question, but I thought you'd like to know. It's happened for over 30 years.

4th August 2008, 09:44 PM	#8
Ron_Tomkins Satan's Helper Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: NYC Posts: 32,028	Originally Posted by Miss_Kitt I'm currently writing a (brief) paper on synesthesia--the phenomenon of having one sensory input produce results characteristic of another sense, such as "seeing" colors with sounds or "tasting" colors--and wondered how many in this group have personal experience with same? The studies I'm looking at give the occurance rate as anything from 1 in 500,000 to 1 in 200 people. I just wanted to take an unofficial, for-my-interest poll. I discovered in the 90's that this was a named phenomenon, and that it was (then) considered vary rare. Since sounds have had color associations for me for my entire life--and it seems entirely normal to me--I was delighted to gain this insight. I'd learned not to talk about it, because people didn't understand what I meant, but for example brass instruments are blue or purplish in their tones, and strings are more gold-red spectrum. There are differing degrees of this, for example, there are synesthetes that literally SEE the printed letter "A" as being red, even when it is not; and others who simply see it 'in their head' as red. I don't literally physically see colors in the air, but if I close my eyes or focus on the mental image, it's consistently there. Anyway, just curious, Miss Kitt Did you intentionally write it in blue

4th August 2008, 10:58 PM	#10
Theophage Scholar Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Tucson, AZ Posts: 116	Originally Posted by Miss_Kitt Theophage -- That is supposed to be the most common form, yes. If you don't mind my asking: Do you physically see them as colored, or just associate them in your head? Both forms are known to occur. Interestingly, some people with this form find mathematics or memorization unusually easy, as one synesthete told her sister who was struggling with multiplication tables, "Just focus on the colors!" Thanks for replying! I associate them in my head rather than seeing the colors physically, but when I picture numbers or letters in my head (like in memorizing) then yes, they are that color. Quote: ETA: One of the most interesting things (to me) about synesthesia is that it is completely "no big deal" to those that possess it. I remember having a profound realization while talking with an extremely musically talented friend that she had to keep track of things like fugues without being able to look at them. Wow! That is one amazing mental talent! I sure couldn't do it. I was an adult before I ever heard of anyone else having this phenomena. I figured I was special in some way, and I also thought that those colors were indeed objectively tied to those numbers and letters. When I found out other synesthetes saw/felt different things, it was kind of disappointing.

4th August 2008, 11:25 PM	#11
PingOfPong Critical Thinker Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 421	I'm not a synesthete but I'm really good at math. For example, I can find the following 2 + 34 = 33 + 3

4th August 2008, 11:50 PM	#12
Theophage Scholar Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Tucson, AZ Posts: 116	pretty! 1234567890
	Last edited by Theophage; 4th August 2008 at 11:54 PM.

5th August 2008, 12:11 AM	#13
Gagglegnash Graduate Poster Join Date: Jan 2008 Posts: 1,447	Hi When I was young, I distinctly remember words having aroma. "Cup," smelled old and dusty, "sucker," smelled like an old, wet rubber tire, and "rubber," smelled like fish. All words had some smell, tho those three were the strongest. In school, I noticed that I could, "feel," a mathematical function. I was in the dummy-arithmetic class because I couldn't add, subtract, multiply or divide until the math teacher had us do the, "Exercises for Experts," thing at the end of the chapter, "This is Algebra." I knew all the answers, just looking at the problem, because I could, "feel the shape," of the function. The teacher was stunned for a second, considering my inability to use the basic tools used to derive the answers, and even made sure I wasn't just using the answers in the back of the book. Then he left the room and arranged for me to be transferred immediately into the algebra class. I still love the feeling of x = y², and computer programs feel like a construction of flexible tinker toys.
	__________________ But it does me no injury for my neighbor to say there are twenty gods or no God. It neither picks my pocket nor breaks my leg. -----Thomas Jefferson, Notes on Virginia, 1782 Question with boldness even the existence of a god; because if there be one he must approve of the homage of reason more than that of blindfolded fear. -----Thomas Jefferson, Letter to Peter Carr, August 10, 1787

5th August 2008, 12:19 AM	#14
PingOfPong Critical Thinker Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 421	Theo, for some odd reason your color choices make sense to me. 5 is orange smacks head, of course!
	Last edited by PingOfPong; 5th August 2008 at 12:23 AM.

5th August 2008, 06:17 AM	#15
whatthebutlersaw Dessert Arsonist Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: East of the Sun Posts: 4,037	Smelling other people's feelings like actual smells, and attributing personalities to numbers. Does this qualify?

5th August 2008, 06:37 AM	#16
Delvo Illuminator Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Harrisburg, Pennsylvania Posts: 3,885	Originally Posted by Miss_Kitt Do you physically see them as colored, or just associate them in your head? Both forms are known to occur. Just mentally associating things is not synesthesia. True synesthesia is sensory. The latter is rare, but any time I see it mentioned online, I see lots of people chiming in with their own examples of the former as if it were the same thing. The very fact that so many people can give examples of the former demonstrates that it isn't at all unusual. Associating one thing with another in an arbitrarily symbolic way is just a part of how human brains think. Getting signals from one of the body's senses misdirected to where signals from another one belong is not. I think the more interesting thing demonstrated by online conversations about synesthesia is not about the condition itself, but about psychology: that many people seem to WANT to be included in groups that are interesting in some way, such as having rare but harmless conditions. Another example is that if you look at a thread about eye colors, you'll see lots and lots of people claiming to have highly unusual or even impossible colors such as green, gray, or even "violet" instead of just blue or brown like we all know practically everybody's really are; they just have blue or brown eyes and want to make it sound more exotic. (I've seen this in person too, such as a person whose brown eyes I could clearly see for myself right then and there telling me they were green.) Excellent night vision, ultrasonic hearing, and precognition are other popular ones.

5th August 2008, 06:53 AM	#17
Rob Lister Suspended Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: Virginia Beach, VA Posts: 8,523	Originally Posted by Miss_Kitt I'm currently writing a (brief) paper on synesthesia--the phenomenon of having one sensory input produce results characteristic of another sense, such as "seeing" colors with sounds or "tasting" colors--and wondered how many in this group have personal experience with same? Three letters... LSD 'Nuff said. Rather than provide evidence, I'll rely on at least a few of our forum members to back me up.

5th August 2008, 07:44 AM	#18
Dagny Scholar Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Ithaca, NY Posts: 59	I have colored language, and I only “see” the color in my own mind. My mom has this form as well. She named me Bethany because she sees it as a beautiful shade of purple – her favorite color. I, unfortunately, see it as bright yellow. My mom seems to have it much more mildly than I do. She definitely associates colors with letters but is hard pressed to describe her whole alphabet, and only seems to have a few colored numbers. Aside from my Mom, I have yet to meet anyone else with synesthesia. I also have “conceptual” synesthesia for time – I see the days of the week as an oval that I’m walking on. Monday through Friday make up one half of the oval and Saturday and Sunday consist of the other half. Since today is Tuesday, Monday is behind me, Wednesday is in front of me and Sunday is to my right. Years, decades and centuries also have a shape for me. Of course, all of this is color coded. When I’m very tired or intoxicated or both I have color associations with touch, I think. It could also just be that I have an active imagination. My numbers and letters: 1 = white 2 = yellow 3 = red 4 = dark yellow 5 = black 6 = pale blue 7 = bright green 8 = green 9 = dark red 10 = white A = red B = yellow C = pale blue D = green E = blue F = pale blue G = dark green H = orange I = yellow J = bright green K = purple/blue L = blue M = red N = light brown O = yellow P = orange Q = metallic silvery/purple R = black with reddish tints S = red T = green U = cream V = black W = pale blue X = black Y = white Z = light purple/blue
	__________________ "Anticipatory plagiarism occurs when someone steals your original idea and publishes it a hundred years before you were born."--Robert Merton "Hey, when you cure cancer, will you give a shout out to the band?" --Aaron E. "I am against evolution being taught in schools. I am also against widespread literacy and the refrigeration of food." --The Onion

5th August 2008, 08:32 AM	#19
Dagny Scholar Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Ithaca, NY Posts: 59	..double post...
	__________________ "Anticipatory plagiarism occurs when someone steals your original idea and publishes it a hundred years before you were born."--Robert Merton "Hey, when you cure cancer, will you give a shout out to the band?" --Aaron E. "I am against evolution being taught in schools. I am also against widespread literacy and the refrigeration of food." --The Onion Last edited by Dagny; 5th August 2008 at 08:35 AM.

5th August 2008, 08:37 AM	#20
Naughtyhippo I, for one, welcome our kitteh overlords Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: In job application Hell. Posts: 658	My mother definitely sees colours when she hears sounds, she may see shapes as well - it's been a while since she talked about it. I strongly doubt I have synesthesia but letters, numbers, fonts all 'feel' better in certain colours and have personality, but go away as soon as a word is formed.* In fact, most inanimate objects have some form of personality in my head - but I'm sure they're meant to. After all, why would anyone talk about 'brooding gothic architecture' unless getting feelings from inanimate objects was common? *some reason, I find post #11 of this thread very unsettling to look at.
	__________________ RL got me.

5th August 2008, 01:35 PM	#21
NoisyAstronomer Scholar Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Edwardsville, IL Posts: 94	I've never experienced that, but I have a friend who does. Letters and numbers have distinct colors in his mind. And words take on the color of the first letter. We had a good time one night finding out what colors our names were associated with. And no, no LSD. No drugs of any sort with this guy.

5th August 2008, 02:36 PM	#22
buzz lightyear Muse Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 651	Originally Posted by Miss_Kitt I discovered in the 90's that this was a named phenomenon, and that it was (then) considered vary rare. Since sounds have had color associations for me for my entire life--and it seems entirely normal to me--I was delighted to gain this insight. I'd learned not to talk about it, because people didn't understand what I meant, but for example brass instruments are blue or purplish in their tones, and strings are more gold-red spectrum. Like you, Miss Kitt, I have had a colour, sound association all my life. But it also had an emotion element to it, so various sounds-colours produced emotions. So like most children with 'abnormal' abilities I suppressed it as much as possible. It wasnt until later life that I started to explore this realm and found, that as Rob Lister has pointed out, LSD is the catalyst par excellence. I have found the ability to see and produce emotions through sound is a remarkable and beautiful way to explore the inner regions of my psyche.
buzz lightyear Muse Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 651

5th August 2008, 03:16 PM	#23
Miss_Kitt Zombie Horse of Homeopathy Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Lesser Seattle Posts: 3,625	Originally Posted by Delvo Just mentally associating things is not synesthesia. True synesthesia is sensory. The latter is rare, but any time I see it mentioned online, I see lots of people chiming in with their own examples of the former as if it were the same thing. The very fact that so many people can give examples of the former demonstrates that it isn't at all unusual. Associating one thing with another in an arbitrarily symbolic way is just a part of how human brains think. Getting signals from one of the body's senses misdirected to where signals from another one belong is not. Delvo -- The research that I have been doing indicated that there are people who have a literal, physiological "association" that is involuntary, consistent, and lifelong, and that this is considered synesthesia. The people who can't "switch off" the color processing (or texture, or whatever) have the strongest form, but people with milder presentations are not all "just claiming it" when it isn't happening. They have devised some interesting tests to screen out exactly those kind of wannabes. At the moment, some researchers believe that all humans start out with their sensory responses "cross-wired", and the connections are pruned down over time, thus removing the additional response. In other words, we have all been synesthetes, but some people's brains retain that function into adulthood, while most don't. Another school of thought is that some brains just have connections between areas that most brains don't. In either case, it appears to be a heritable tendency. This seems to be a rapidly developing field of research, especially at UCSD and in Spain (forgive me, I've forgotten which university there).
	__________________ It's much better to live an honest life than a delusional one -- desertgal Magic thinking is a lead personal floatation device. It looks really reassuring, but it will drag you down--whatthebutlersaw Last edited by Miss_Kitt; 5th August 2008 at 03:34 PM.

5th August 2008, 03:24 PM	#24
Kotatsu Phthirapterist Join Date: Nov 2005 Location: Good Anvil Posts: 2,154	My ex-girlfriend had it for sounds. She played the oboe (very nicely, if I may say so), which she loved the colour of, but she couldn't stand the clarinet, as the colour was ghastly. Some kind of stingy red, if I recall correctly. I had never heard about this until I met her the first time. Then it was revealed to me that two of my best friends also had it --- one seeing colours on all numbers (as others have shown in this thread) and one only seeing letters in colours. So of five people in the room, three had synesthesia, and two had never heard of it before...
	__________________ "It is not supposed to be funny or annoying or insightful, because it is neither; nor to convey or express any emotion or wit, because it doesn't; nor to be any kind of art, because it isn't; but merely to be repetitive. It is repetition for the sake of repetition; mindless, relentless, remorseless and -- ultimately -- redundant." K. Krishnamurthi, "The Seven Forms of Repetition", 1972.

5th August 2008, 03:33 PM	#25
Miss_Kitt Zombie Horse of Homeopathy Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Lesser Seattle Posts: 3,625	Replying to several: I don't know that psychotropics are or aren't a catalyst for this. Back in the Day, I definitely once watched a ceiling display the sound of a RUSH album for and hour and a half after nobody told me the brownies were "magic" until after I'd eaten TWO...but I have not done any studies, even informally on the subject. (The one nice thing was that lightshow kept my mind off how awful my stomach felt.) One of the hallmarks of this phenomenon is that it is consistent, that is, if 3 is red for you when you're a kid, it's always red for you. Furthermore, if you're looking at a black-and-white screen with symbols on it and one of them is a "3", fMRI will show the area of the brain that assesses color is firing. Also, people with this kind of synesthesia can pick out differing characters in a random screenful more quickly than other folks if the odd symbols are ones they "see" as a bright color like red or yellow. Dagny -- What color is "Dagny" for you? Just curious, but I assume since you took it for your screen name, you like it. Current research suggests the occurance of some form of synesthesia may be as common as one in a thousand, or even--this is the lowest I've seen, and I don't know what their threshhold was--one in 200. It's not often reported without direct questioning, because it is perfectly normal to the person who has it. What I find interesting is that there have been so many positive responses, though of course this is a self-selecting group. I know based on my own experience, I just didn't mention it because I learned young that it wasn't productive. (In fact, I remember having my first husband tell me, "No, you don't!" when I told him about it.)
	__________________ It's much better to live an honest life than a delusional one -- desertgal Magic thinking is a lead personal floatation device. It looks really reassuring, but it will drag you down--whatthebutlersaw

6th August 2008, 12:21 AM	#26
Dagny Scholar Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Ithaca, NY Posts: 59	Miss Kitt - Dagny is a blackish color with dark red undertones – if that makes any sense. A lot of my colors are sort of difficult to describe in a coherent manner. I do find the color of Dagny far more appealing than yellow which is by far the most offensive of all colors.
	__________________ "Anticipatory plagiarism occurs when someone steals your original idea and publishes it a hundred years before you were born."--Robert Merton "Hey, when you cure cancer, will you give a shout out to the band?" --Aaron E. "I am against evolution being taught in schools. I am also against widespread literacy and the refrigeration of food." --The Onion

6th August 2008, 01:33 AM	#27
buzz lightyear Muse Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 651	Originally Posted by Miss_Kitt Replying to several: I don't know that psychotropics are or aren't a catalyst for this. Back in the Day, I definitely once watched a ceiling display the sound of a RUSH album for and hour and a half after nobody told me the brownies were "magic" until after I'd eaten TWO...but I have not done any studies, even informally on the subject. (The one nice thing was that lightshow kept my mind off how awful my stomach felt.) ) Your "cookies" were probably mushroom (psilocybin) laced. An unpredictable, and as you experienced unpleasant venture into psychotropics. I am pleased that you used the term psychotropics, and not hallucinogens. My experience with synthetic psychotropics has been to enable me to create acoustic harmonic vortices. This involves chanting, with my eyes closed for a number of hours in a harmonic chamber. After about an hour of this, the visual cortex receives the sound as images and the various notes become colours that are stacked in a very similar manner to this graph. After about 3 hours the vortex becomes self sustaining and it is just a matter of watching which colour starts to fade, and sing the note of the corresponding colour to keep the mass spinning. The sound produced is divine.
buzz lightyear Muse Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 651	Last edited by buzz lightyear; 6th August 2008 at 03:00 AM. Reason: clarification