Denial Stops Here

[MaterialismSlave]

Hello everyone.

I recently watched Michael Rupperts "Denial Stops Here", and I am looking for debunks on this movie.

I have been searching the debunk part of the forum but they all seem to focus on the extreme conspiracies made up by children, so if you could point me to any site or movie that deals with the real issues I would be grateful.

[~enigma~]

Originally Posted by MaterialismSlave

Hello everyone.

I recently watched Michael Rupperts "Denial Stops Here", and I am looking for debunks on this movie.

I have been searching the debunk part of the forum but they all seem to focus on the extreme conspiracies made up by children, so if you could point me to any site or movie that deals with the real issues I would be grateful.

Ever think you might actually get a real answer if you asked specific questions or better yet search this forum through google, just append site: forums.randi.org. Not for nothing but the search here is not very good. On a side note, Didn't Ruppert get himself lost (run away) in South America? Really dependable source you have.

[Drudgewire]

Originally Posted by ~enigma~

On a side note, Didn't Ruppert get himself lost (run away) in South America? Really dependable source you have.

Quick googling found that he was a buddy of Alex Jones until they got in a catfight:

http://www.prisonplanet.com/articles...esrebuttal.htm

Quote:

Alex is known for not attacking other people. Unlike Ruppert, he has no history of doing so. And yet the sheer venom of Ruppert's article implies that we're psychologically stomping on widows and grieving family members.

Where to even start?

[~enigma~]

Originally Posted by Drudgewire

Quick googling found that he was a buddy of Alex Jones until they got in a catfight:

http://www.prisonplanet.com/articles...esrebuttal.htm




Where to even start?

That's rich. Ruppert calls AJ a racist (which I believe) yet it is Ruppert that is living and probably dining with nazi war criminals down in South America.

[MaterialismSlave]

So there is no specific debunk on Denial Stops Here? Its a shame since its one of the few theories that doesnt include easy to debunk materials or lies. You should look it up if you havent.

What is the best 911 debunk movie in your opinion? Prefer one that ignores missile on pentagon and no planes insane theories.

[~enigma~]

Originally Posted by MaterialismSlave

So there is no specific debunk on Denial Stops Here? Its a shame since its one of the few theories that doesnt include easy to debunk materials or lies.

If you don't ask a specific question you aren't going to get an answer. Is that to difficult for you to understand?

Quote:

You should look it up if you havent.

What makes you think we haven't or that we will bother?

Quote:

What is the best 911 debunk movie in your opinion? Prefer one that ignores missile on pentagon and no planes insane theories.

That is another topic for another thread, you are not making a good first impression.

[beachnut]

Originally Posted by MaterialismSlave

Hello everyone.

I recently watched Michael Rupperts "Denial Stops Here", and I am looking for debunks on this movie.

... point me to any site or movie that deals with the real issues I would be grateful.

No real issues from 911Truth; only fantasy, hearsay and lies. And Mike work is the same.
Give us your favorite 911 thing from his video. Where is the new stuff that is real?


Has Mike been shot at for his new work?

Mike's fantasy; the government brought us 911 due to oil. Mike can sit down he knows as much about 9/11 as the entire 911Truth Movement, ZERO.

... new real smoking gun? ... trying to sell books. Money.

Better title, “Insane ideas from Mike; ultimate paranoia” now on DVD. Did you read and watch his video? He tells lies, spews some fantasy and tries to appeal to those who hate some political extreme. What is there to debunk.

Pure junk on 9/11. Is he trying to be the biggest pusher of idiotic ideas?
A grade school kid can debunk Mike’s work, the worst 9/11 tripe you can find is from Mike. Complete fiction. It hurts to watch him lie and spew his fantasy.

[Brainster]

I watched about 20 minutes of it. It's generally evidence-free. When the question of how many people would have had to know the government did 9-11 and keep it a secret, Ruppert brings up the Manhattan Project. Of course, the Manhattan project is a poor example, since several people working on it revealed information to the Soviets:

Quote:

Over the years, scholars and federal agents have identified a half-dozen individuals who spied on the bomb project for the Soviets, especially at Los Alamos in New Mexico. All were “walk ins,” spies by impulse and sympathetic leaning rather than rigorous training.

By contrast, Dr. Koval was a mole groomed in the Soviet Union by the feared G.R.U., the military intelligence agency. Moreover, he gained wide access to America’s atomic plants, a feat unknown for any other Soviet spy. Nuclear experts say the secrets of bomb manufacturing can be more important than those of design.

I also note that Ruppert claims that the 9-11 attacks were a pretext for the US to steal Iraq's oil. That never ended up happening.

[T.A.M.]

Originally Posted by MaterialismSlave

Hello everyone.

I recently watched Michael Rupperts "Denial Stops Here", and I am looking for debunks on this movie.

I have been searching the debunk part of the forum but they all seem to focus on the extreme conspiracies made up by children, so if you could point me to any site or movie that deals with the real issues I would be grateful.

Are you looking for a debunking of the video because;

(A) you believe what it says, and want to see if anyone has attempted to debunk it.
(B) you think it is a pile of crap, and speculation, and want a link to a good debunking of it?

TAM

[CurtC]

Originally Posted by MaterialismSlave

What is the best 911 debunk movie in your opinion? Prefer one that ignores missile on pentagon and no planes insane theories.

Which insane theories, in particular, would you like it to address? The insane theory that AA11 and UAL175 were remote controlled? The insane theory that UAL93 was shot down? The insane theory that NORAD was prevented from responding in a timely way?

[MaterialismSlave]

Originally Posted by T.A.M.

Are you looking for a debunking of the video because;

(A) you believe what it says, and want to see if anyone has attempted to debunk it.
(B) you think it is a pile of crap, and speculation, and want a link to a good debunking of it?

TAM

I'm researching 911 from both points of view to form a opinion, as I suppose most on this board has done.

I specifically asked for debunks on Denial Stops Here, which ~enigma~had a hard time understanding apparently.

Since no one seems to know of such debunks, and the fact that I have limited time to research, I ask what you experienced debunkers think is the good debunk movies/sites.
I don't have time to go thru them all.

Quote:

I watched about 20 minutes of it. It's generally evidence-free. When the question of how many people would have had to know the government did 9-11 and keep it a secret, Ruppert brings up the Manhattan Project. Of course, the Manhattan project is a poor example, since several people working on it revealed information to the Soviets:

I dont think that spies in a scientific project reporting to another country is the same as people not admitting they where a part of a mass murder.

If you imply that there should be spies among the supposed 911 evildoers, do you really think the country they spy for would go in public media and say "our spies say it was a inside job". To what benefit?

As for stealing Iraq's oil, I doubt any person using that term really mean it like moving in there and claiming it. I think what most people refer to as stealing is stealing done on paper with contracts from new government that is not hostile to USA.

Quote:

Give us your favorite 911 thing from his video. Where is the new stuff that is real?

I haven't decided what is real, wouldn't mind some info that dissect his theories on war for oil.
Also a explanation to how the most paranoid industrial country can set themselves in a position to be more or less fully exposed to attacks thanks to ongoing WARGAMES?
Finally, why do officials say that "its not important to find the men behind 911" in some interviews?

Oh, I would like to see these movies debunked if anyone have time:
Al Qaeda Doesn't Exist (Documentary) - 1
Its made by The Corbett Report

Found on Youtube, Its 3 parts but a short one, 25 minutes in total. It has the proof that the foundation to Al Qaeda was made by USA and further discussion on the subject.
I cant post the link because I have to few posts.

Thanks

[BCR]

Originally Posted by MaterialismSlave

I'm researching 911 from both points of view to form a opinion, as I suppose most on this board has done.

I specifically asked for debunks on Denial Stops Here, which ~enigma~had a hard time understanding apparently.

Since no one seems to know of such debunks, and the fact that I have limited time to research, I ask what you experienced debunkers think is the good debunk movies/sites.
I don't have time to go thru them all.



I dont think that spies in a scientific project reporting to another country is the same as people not admitting they where a part of a mass murder.

If you imply that there should be spies among the supposed 911 evildoers, do you really think the country they spy for would go in public media and say "our spies say it was a inside job". To what benefit?

As for stealing Iraq's oil, I doubt any person using that term really mean it like moving in there and claiming it. I think what most people refer to as stealing is stealing done on paper with contracts from new government that is not hostile to USA.



I haven't decided what is real, wouldn't mind some info that dissect his theories on war for oil.
Also a explanation to how the most paranoid industrial country can set themselves in a position to be more or less fully exposed to attacks thanks to ongoing WARGAMES?
Finally, why do officials say that "its not important to find the men behind 911" in some interviews?

Oh, I would like to see these movies debunked if anyone have time:
Al Qaeda Doesn't Exist (Documentary) - 1
Found on Youtube, Its 3 parts. I cant post the link because I have to few posts. Its made by The Corbett Report

Thanks

Sounds like you are doing an advertisement for the movie. I am not going to watch it just to come up with a debunk (better uses for my time).

[MaterialismSlave]

Originally Posted by 911files

Sounds like you are doing an advertisement for the movie. I am not going to watch it just to come up with a debunk (better uses for my time).

"Oh, I would like to see these movies debunked if anyone have time:"

Your response was unnecessary spam, as is this one but atleast I get closer to the 15 posts required to post links in messages.

[Drudgewire]

Originally Posted by MaterialismSlave

I specifically asked for debunks on Denial Stops Here, which ~enigma~had a hard time understanding apparently.

As you're new here, you aren't fully grasping what the problem is. Without resorting to bashing, in a nutshell we've seen too many of these movies to continue down the tired old minute-by-minute debunking of them. It has become tedious and circular. Not to mention a blanket "here's a new video, tell me what you think" falls dangerously close to spamming under the current rules.

Therefore, what we ask instead is for specifics of claims from the movie which seem new and worthy of examination. If there's really anything that isn't just a new coat of paint over the same claims the rest hash out then not only will it get a fresh discussion, it will also inspire some of us to actually watch the movie in question and go from there.

Protip: putting "specifically" in bold doesn't really qualify as giving specifics.

[MaterialismSlave]

Originally Posted by Drudgewire

As you're new here, you aren't fully grasping what the problem is. Without resorting to bashing, in a nutshell we've seen too many of these movies to continue down the tired old minute-by-minute debunking of them. It has become tedious and circular. Not to mention a blanket "here's a new video, tell me what you think" falls dangerously close to spamming under the current rules.

Therefore, what we ask instead is for specifics of claims from the movie which seem new and worthy of examination. If there's really anything that isn't just a new coat of paint over the same claims the rest hash out then not only will it get a fresh discussion, it will also inspire some of us to actually watch the movie in question and go from there.

Protip: putting "specifically" in bold doesn't really qualify as giving specifics.

I never asked you make a new debunk to Denial Stops Here, I just asked if there was any since I couldn't find anything in my search for it.

As for the movie about Al Qaeda, its a short one 25 minutes in total, has the proof that the foundation to Al Qaeda was made by USA and further discussion on the subject.

Some of above posters seem very defensive, almost aggressive (not aimed at you Drudgewire). I guess you are tired of the debate, but then why are you replying at all?

[~enigma~]

Originally Posted by MaterialismSlave

I specifically asked for debunks on Denial Stops Here, which ~enigma~had a hard time understanding apparently.

No but apparently you have a hard time comprehending what you read. My original response to you said

Quote:

Ever think you might actually get a real answer if you asked specific questions

Based on your response above, you are lying when you say you are researching from both sides. You are firmly entrenched in short bus territory.

[DGM]

Originally Posted by MaterialismSlave

I'm researching 911 from both points of view to form a opinion, as I suppose most on this board has done.

I specifically asked for debunks on Denial Stops Here, which ~enigma~had a hard time understanding apparently.

Since no one seems to know of such debunks, and the fact that I have limited time to research, I ask what you experienced debunkers think is the good debunk movies/sites.
I don't have time to go thru them all.



I dont think that spies in a scientific project reporting to another country is the same as people not admitting they where a part of a mass murder.

If you imply that there should be spies among the supposed 911 evildoers, do you really think the country they spy for would go in public media and say "our spies say it was a inside job". To what benefit?

As for stealing Iraq's oil, I doubt any person using that term really mean it like moving in there and claiming it. I think what most people refer to as stealing is stealing done on paper with contracts from new government that is not hostile to USA.



I haven't decided what is real, wouldn't mind some info that dissect his theories on war for oil.
Also a explanation to how the most paranoid industrial country can set themselves in a position to be more or less fully exposed to attacks thanks to ongoing WARGAMES?
Finally, why do officials say that "its not important to find the men behind 911" in some interviews?

Oh, I would like to see these movies debunked if anyone have time:
Al Qaeda Doesn't Exist (Documentary) - 1
Found on Youtube, Its 3 parts. I cant post the link because I have to few posts. Its made by The Corbett Report

Thanks

Have you read the 9/11 commission report? Either you have not or for some reason you think it's not true.

War games?

Not important to find the man behind?

You sir are pulling our leg or have not even considered looking for facts behind 9/11.

[MaterialismSlave]

Originally Posted by DGM

Have you read the 9/11 commission report? Either you have not or for some reason you think it's not true.

War games?

Not important to find the man behind?

You sir are pulling our leg or have not even considered looking for facts behind 9/11.

No I havent read the commission report, didn't know about it until tonight and its to much info to start now. Will do that and see if I have any unanswered questions.

[~enigma~]

Originally Posted by MaterialismSlave

No I havent read the commission report, didn't know about it until tonight and its to much info to start now. Will do that and see if I have any unanswered questions.

Didn't know about it!?!?! You been living under a rock since 2004?

[dudalb]

I think I see where this is going, and we have all been there before.
Ruppert and his theories are old hat, I think if one uses the search engine on this site you can find plenty about him.
His latest film seems to be just a rehash of his old theories, and, as people here have pointed out, we get tired of refuting the same nonsense time and time again.

[dudalb]

In Fact "Denial Stops Here" seems to be just a collection of film clips of Ruppert from his previous videos.
I though Ruppert had retired from the Truth Movement,although I would not be surprised if he could not resist the temptation to get back in again.

[Drudgewire]

Originally Posted by MaterialismSlave

didn't know about it until tonight

*head asplodes*

[~enigma~]

Originally Posted by dudalb

In Fact "Denial Stops Here" seems to be just a collection of film clips of Ruppert from his previous videos.
I though Ruppert had retired from the Truth Movement,although I would not be surprised if he could not resist the temptation to get back in again.

He ran down to South America like a good little coward after someone broke into and ransacked his office (don't think they stole anything).

[MaterialismSlave]

Originally Posted by ~enigma~

Didn't know about it!?!?! You been living under a rock since 2004?

My mistake, thought he was referring to the 9/11 Commission records released today. I have read the Commission Report. Will read the records when I have time.

Originally Posted by dudalb

I think I see where this is going, and we have all been there before.
Ruppert and his theories are old hat, I think if one uses the search engine on this site you can find plenty about him.
His latest film seems to be just a rehash of his old theories, and, as people here have pointed out, we get tired of refuting the same nonsense time and time again.

So you have refuted his previous movies? Thats all I wanted, I just want to know where to look for it.

[~enigma~]

Originally Posted by MaterialismSlave

My mistake, thought he was referring to the 9/11 Commission records released today. I have read the Commission Report. Will read the records when I have time.

Ah, this I understand because based on your third post I would guess you mistake lots of things.

[MaterialismSlave]

Originally Posted by ~enigma~

Ah, this I understand because based on your third post I would guess you mistake lots of things.

Specifics please.

Based on all your posts you should just leave this thread alone. I bet there is plenty of other post for your useless oneliners.

[Arus808]

Can we get back on the thread? What specific issues or claims made in the film do you need clarifications or a rebuttal too?

[rwguinn]

Originally Posted by T.A.M.

Are you looking for a debunking of the video because;

(A) you believe what it says, and want to see if anyone has attempted to debunk it.
(B) you think it is a pile of crap, and speculation, and want a link to a good debunking of it?

TAM

I object, Mr. Chairman.
Rules of Order state that the motive behind a motion may not be questioned, only the motion itself.

[gnome]

Perhaps this will help. You recently watched "Denial Stops Here" and appear to be interested in the opinion of the skeptics here.

It's been expressed that because of the redundancy in most of the claims that before commenting some specifics might be useful.

It's a simple question: which parts of the movie did you find the most compelling? Which theories do you not consider childish? If you were even to name one or two I bet you'd have some takers.

When you just throw it out there and avoid bringing up any particular topics (of which there are MANY) it makes it look less like you're here to find out anything and more like you're here to generate buzz about the movie. So I hope you'll understand if you're viewed with some degree of suspicion and hostility. Easily cleared up--let us know what were your favorite parts of the film?

[DGM]

As far as the war games go search for NORAD and look for Gumboot's posts (I think he even started a thread). He has dissected this topic and I would consider him the resident expert.

[sleahead]

Originally Posted by MaterialSlave

Also a explanation to how the most paranoid industrial country can set themselves in a position to be more or less fully exposed to attacks thanks to ongoing WARGAMES?

Well, I don't agree that it was thanks to wargames. Does Ruppert still include Tripod II, which wasn't scheduled to commence until September 12th? Anyways, what you're looking for is Gumboot's Norad Paper.

[beachnut]

Originally Posted by MaterialismSlave

No I havent read the commission report, didn't know about it until tonight and its to much info to start now. Will do that and see if I have any unanswered questions.

The stuff you presented is pure junk. There is nothing to debunk because it is all made up. It is BS.

You spoke of proof, it was fantasy. If you think otherwise you may be gullible.

You have discovered the Internet, the vast wasteland of false ideas for the gullible.


Who did it? Ruppert says Cheney and the Secret Service in the PEOC. How dumb do things get, oops, yes, Cheney had software to override the FAA and enable 9/11 to happen. This is pure stupid and BS. How do you debunk pure stupid?

Originally Posted by MaterialismSlave

Specifics please.

Based on all your posts you should just leave this thread alone. I bet there is plenty of other post for your useless oneliners.

You are the one asking for a debunking of a video what is clearly pure BS.

[jaydeehess]

I doubt if there is a specific video or web page devoted to debunking every other specific 911 conspiracy video or web page.

All here have already spent many hours that we will not get back viewing all manner of carp and thus we would like to know what specific issues are raised in the video in question. certainly you could give us a short report of what Rupert is saying.

[DGM]

Originally Posted by MaterialismSlave

Since no one seems to know of such debunks, and the fact that I have limited time to research, I ask what you experienced debunkers think is the good debunk movies/sites.
I don't have time to go thru them all.

I can't help but wonder, what's your rush?

This is exactly what the conspiracy theory pushers want. They don't want you to spend the time necessary to understand the complexities of the subject at hand. Don't fall into their trap and look for the quick answer. Studying the whole event and all it's complexities is the only way you will truly understand how the events of that day transpired. Also expect them to prove their claims as you would any one supporting the "official story". You will find they come up short every time.

[Quad4_72]

I don't do the whole "Watch this movie and debunk it for me" thing. In most of these nutter movies, many many claims are made. You must bring up specific claims if we are going to get anywhere here. Name one thing that you want debunked from that movie. I can guarantee you it has been covered.

[Brainster]

Somebody brought up Ruppert's flight to Venezuela. Back in 2006, Ruppert became a suspect in the burglary of his own offices.

Quote:

But, in June, he accused an ex-employee of burglarizing his office, shortly after that employee accused him of sexual harassment. Around the time that Ashland police pegged him as a potential suspect in the crime, he changed his story and claimed to flee to Venezuela.

"There are facts about the timing of the burglary that may eventually connect to events here in Venezuela," he said in a farewell letter on his Web site. At that time, he said his site would continue without him, making a plea for financial donations.

He didn't last long in Hugo Chavez's paradise; IIRC about two months later he went to Toronto, reportedly to seek medical treatment. He's apparently living in the Los Angeles area currently.

As one who monitors the 9-11 Truthers on a daily basis, I can tell you that this movie got traction or interest. I had never even heard of it before today. It's long on unsupported conclusions and short on evidence.

Ruppert was a giant of the Troofer Movement during the early days, there's no denying that. But time and events have passed him by.

[~enigma~]

Originally Posted by Brainster

Somebody brought up Ruppert's flight to Venezuela. Back in 2006, Ruppert became a suspect in the burglary of his own offices.



He didn't last long in Hugo Chavez's paradise; IIRC about two months later he went to Toronto, reportedly to seek medical treatment. He's apparently living in the Los Angeles area currently.

As one who monitors the 9-11 Truthers on a daily basis, I can tell you that this movie got traction or interest. I had never even heard of it before today. It's long on unsupported conclusions and short on evidence.

Ruppert was a giant of the Troofer Movement during the early days, there's no denying that. But time and events have passed him by.

IOW he's a dismal failure at running away. Another impotent humanoid truther...how surprising

[A W Smith]

Originally Posted by MaterialismSlave

I'm researching 911 from both points of view to form a opinion, as I suppose most on this board has done.

I specifically asked for debunks on Denial Stops Here, which ~enigma~had a hard time understanding apparently.

Since no one seems to know of such debunks, and the fact that I have limited time to research,

you have limited time? What? are ya gonna die soon? have a book report due and too busy playing Warcraft or something?

Quote:

I ask what you experienced debunkers think is the good debunk movies/sites.
I don't have time to go thru them all.

You know how many idiots have come here in the past 7 years asking us to do their work for them because they are too inept or too lazy to RESEARCH for themselves? lemme make this clear. We don't make "movies'. as we have no books or barbecue aprons or DVDs to peddle or fragile ego's to massage. heres what you do. get a legal pad and jot down one by one the points that are made in your little 20 something minute movie and research them one by one. theres a URL in my sig. follow it. if that fails to fill your needs and you need something randi.org specific. Go to google and do an advanced search within this domain. We are not here to re-type the points that have been made in the past seven years over and over and over again each time someone clueless shows up.

[dudalb]

I guess it occured to the OP to type in the name "Ruppert" or the names of the previous Ruppert films into the JREF Search Engine and see what he gets.

[GStan]

Originally Posted by dudalb

I guess it occured to the OP to type in the name "Ruppert" or the names of the previous Ruppert films into the JREF Search Engine and see what he gets.

Yeah. I'm sure he's pouring through old threads as we speak, saying to himself, 'hmmm....most of these JREFers are too dumb to read between the lines, but, man, that LastChild is a genius!"