North Korean absurdity

[DialecticMaterialist]

I was recently looking into North Korea recently, at it newspapers and factbook entry and I ran into some interesting tid bits.

The first concerns military spending. The average nation spends about 2 percent of its total wealth on its military. The US spends 3.2 percent, Japan spends 1 percent, China spends about 4 percent....

And North Korea is far ahead though as it allocates a whopping 33.9%.

For North Korea: http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/...k/geos/kn.html


For World Average: http://www.cia.gov/cia/publications/...k/geos/xx.html


I have also looked at their news articles, and I must say they are just downright whacky. The National Inquirer does a better job of proving its points. Most news articles are literally a paragraph long. And just to give you some excerpts:

Quote:

DPRK, Dignified Powerful Nation
Pyongyang, November 30 (KCNA) -- The Democratic People's Republic of Korea is an invincible powerful nation with a great national power enough to firmly defend its just idea, system and cause, stresses Rodong Sinmun today in a signed article. The DPRK is an indestructible political power in which the whole party, the entire army and all the people get united in one mind and an ever-victorious military power, the article says, and goes on:
The socio-political foundation of the DPRK government which has been consolidated on the basis of the worker-peasant alliance led by the working class and in reliance on the united front of the popular masses has been immensely strengthened as the singleheartedly united force of the whole party, the entire army and all the people.
As powerfully demonstrated to the world once again by the election of deputies to the 11th term Supreme People's Assembly and the military parade and mass demonstration for celebrating the 55th anniversary of the DPRK, the DPRK is the great political power where the whole party, the entire army and all the people are singledheartedly united with the headquarters of the revolution as its hard core. The singlehearted unity of the party, the army and the people is a true and solid unity and cohesion which can neither be destroyed by nuclear weapons nor be toppled down by any crafty psychological warfare as it is an ideological, willful and moral unity based on the revolutionary faith and comradeship.
The DPRK has a powerful might enough to decisively check and frustrate the imperialists' vicious moves of aggression and war. We are firmly armed with the war method of Juche in the spirit of devotedly defending the leader, the spirit of laying down our life as a human bullet and bomb and the spirit of self-blasting explosion and has ever-victorious revolutionary strong army of Mt. Paektu equipped with modern offensive and defensive means and the powerful independent defense industry.
The imperialist bellicose forces should clearly know that any "preemptive nuclear attack" , "aerial and sea strike" and "precision strike" are impotent before the military power of the DPRK and there is no place on the planet to escape the powerful retaliatory strike of its revolutionary armed forces.

(Bold added)


This imo, is far worst then fox news at its worst.


And this piece on how the US has "messed up" South Korea really made me sick:

Quote:

They have brutally violated many south Korean women and reduced them to sexual slaves, producing hundreds of thousands of foreigners' whores and mixed-bloods.

(Italics added)

Mixed Bloods? So much for Marxist education......

Anyways the article and the news reports are here:

http://www.kcna.co.jp/index-e.htm

Enjoy.

[Jon_in_london]

Arent they also demanding like $43trillion from the US as well?

Its quite scary that such delusional nutjobs may have access to nukes...

Quote:

The amount of damage inflicted by the U.S. imperialists upon the south Korean people runs into astronomical figures. If the victims are considered to be still alive and the income to be earned by them during their lifetime plus its interest and the changed value of U.S. dollar, etc. are estimated by the calculation method according to the international usage, the amount of damage caused to the dead is estimated to be 9,343,020,050,000 U.S. dollars, the amount of damage to the wounded 13,105,728,120,000 U.S. dollars, bringing the total amount of human damage to 22,448,748,170,000 U.S. dollars.

[shuize]

Yes, the whole "workers of the world unite" idea falls a bit flat when filtered through North Korean xenophobia.

I just recently read a Time magazine article (sorry, no links I read it at the library) which detailed the extra brutal treatment North Korean women who are forcibly repatriated from China endure if they are suspected of carrying the baby of a Chinese father.

The article states that the North Korean guards hold the Chinese in particularly low esteem for "betraying the tenets of socialism" and will often induce miscarriages through beatings and hard labor.

[shuize]

Quote:

Originally posted by Jon_in_london
Arent they also demanding like $43trillion from the US as well?

Its quite scary that such delusional nutjobs may have access to nukes...

Do they specify cash or will they take traveller's checks?

I can just imagine trying to sit down with them at the negotiating table.

N. Korea: Before we begin discussing our nuclear weapons program, I see you have an outstanding bill of $43 trillion past due. We'll settle for $42 trillion and call it even.

U.S.: No.

N. Korea: O.K. $41 trillion.

U.S.: No.

N. Korea: $40 trillion.

U.S.: No.

N. Korea: $39 trillion.

U.S.: No.

N. Korea: $38 trillion

U.S.: No. ... (and so on)

[headscratcher4]

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...-2003Dec1.html

Sure, they may be wackey...but they know how to show tourists a good time...

From today's Washington Post...a "Style" piece on tourism in North Korea.




BTW -- an observation, I and many make fun of the prevailing myths that the Kims have propogated to support their Stalinist state...for example, that Kim Jong Il was born in Korea, and that his birth was accompanied by thunderstorms, rainbows and other "natural" phenomena that marks the birth of a great man. I was reading John Krakauers (sp?) book on Mormon fundumentalists...how are the prevailing and rediculous myths propogated by the North Koreans any more or less rediculous than those propogated by Mormans -- and Mormans get to vote in this country! Oh well, this is my first NKorea isn't all that different than Utah rant...I must be evolving.

[EvilYeti]

The NK stuff makes about as much sense as shanek's propaganda. Maybe he should consider moving there?

[hammegk]

The wording and factual content reminds me of the Teddy K. & Hilary C. school of discourse.

[CFLarsen]

Quote:

Originally posted by hammegk
The wording and factual content reminds me of the Teddy K. & Hilary C. school of discourse.

Can you show examples?

[headscratcher4]

Quote:

The wording and factual content reminds me of the Teddy K. & Hilary C. school of discourse.

Yes, because, God knows, the George W. and Donald R. School of discourse is so much more understandable and without bias, spin or orwellian turn of phrase.....

My point is that this is a completely "crap" comparission. What ever problem you or I may have with the rhetoric of Teddy K or Hillary C. (or, George W. for that matter), is that in a free society, statements, spin, assertions, rhetoric may be analysed, discussed, ridiculed, shown to be wrong or faulty, and the speaker...even Teddy K. ... held responsible (well, maybe not Ann Coulter or Rush Limbaugh). This is not true about North Korea. The above quote is the kind of out of control rhetoric that turns political discussion into discussions of who is or who isn't a "traitor" (a'la Ann Coulter) and diminishes all free speech.

Ultimately, this kind of false analogy is just as "stalinist" as what the Kim's practice in North Korea...it is a cheap shot and it is unworthy of you.

[hgc]

Quote:

Originally posted by headscratcher4
...

Ultimately, this kind of false analogy is just as "stalinist" as what the Kim's practice in North Korea...it is a cheap shot and it is unworthy of you.

Your only mistake (in italics).

[DialecticMaterialist]

Apparently Japan needs to be punished says North Korea:

Quote:

Japan Must Be Punished for Its Human Rights Abuses

Pyongyang, December 2 (KCNA) -- All the international human rights organizations should show due interests in the human rights abuses committed by Japan in the past and make all efforts for an early solution to the issue, says Minju Joson today in a signed commentary. Recalling again that the Japanese imperialists drafted at least 8.4 million Koreans to force them to tragic death and slave labor, made 200,000 women sex slavery for the Japanese Imperial Army and massacred over one million Koreans during their military occupation of Korea for 40 odd years, the commentary goes on:
This shows that nearly a half of the Koreans fell victims to the hideous human rights abuses by the Japanese imperialists, measured against the then size of the Korean population.
It was impossible for Japan to cause losses to so many Koreans without an organizational measure based on a state policy. This proves that the brutal human rights violation against the Korean people by the Japanese imperialists was a deliberately organized state-governed crime.
The problem is that Japan is strutting about like a conquering hero scot-free today after committing such monstrous human rights abuses.
Germany and other countries, which inflicted losses to humankind under different historical conditions in the past, are now paying a great attention to compensation and properly resolving the issue. Only Japan, however, is evading its legal and moral responsibility as the assailant and wantonly violating the principles of compensation based on provisions of international conventions and usages.
This illegal and immoral act of Japan has become a main cause of encouragement to the continued practices of human right abuses.
The realities show that for Japan to redress its past crimes of human rights abuses is not merely to comply with the demand for compensation to the victims but the preceding process of guaranteeing justice and putting an end to human rights abuses on the global scale.

http://www.kcna.co.jp/index-e.htm


Apparently they want money. (NO surprise) and blame Japan for modern human rights abuses.

I wonder if it approaches our own 43 trillion and if we can all just put it on tabs and IOU's.....

[DialecticMaterialist]

North Korea wonders what it has to do to get US attention.


Note: I am personally opposed to any military action against North Korea. As I find their million man army somewhat deterring.

[headscratcher4]

Quote:

Originally posted by DialecticMaterialist
North Korea wonders what it has to do to get US attention.


Note: I am personally opposed to any military action against North Korea. As I find their million man army somewhat deterring.

I also oppose going to war with North Korea...but, Kim has something of Stalin's problem when it comes to the million man army. Any use of that force as an invader (of the South) runs into the problem of demonstrating to that army that it has been lied to. The North's propoganda line is that living conditions in the South are horrible, invading troops would quickly see that isn't the case...

Second, in 1948 Russia and China supported Kim Il Sung. Today, such support is less certain. For China, a North Korean invasion of the South would be an economic disaster (for all of Asia). Also, in spite of the North's effort to develop a bomb, China has to be concerened about that development as well...CHina really doesn't want another nuclear power on its Southern Border, not to mention what it, ultimately, might drive Japan to do in the interenst of self defence.

Anyway, I am not sure what the solution to the North Korean problem is, I suspect we should support Southern efforts to open up greater relations with the NOrth...infecting Northerners with the sense that they've been lied to. But, the North's army is really a defensive army today, and is unlikely to really be much of an offensive threat. Indeed, it's nuclear policy is a defensive deterent policy...don't invade us, we've got the bomb and we will level Souel or Tokyo...

[hammegk]

Quote:

Originally posted by CFLarsen


Can you show examples?

It's better to look at the big picture.

Quote:

Originally posted by headscratcher4

My point is that this is a completely "crap" comparission.

Kim Jong II, Hil, & Ted all want to be maximum leader don't you think? And the last thing any of them want is a Free Society, or to discuss their particular views as being potentially wrong.

[headscratcher4]

Quote:

Kim Jong II, Hil, & Ted all want to be maximum leader don't you think?

Your original point remains a feeble, "crap" comparison that demonstrates either remarkable ignorance or insupportable arrogance. In any event, what your statement demonstrates is that it is you who is most like the Kims because you are an absolutist.

BTW, you don't think George W. or Dick C. want ot be "maximum leader"?

[DrChinese]

Quote:

Originally posted by hammegk
Kim Jong II, Hil, & Ted all want to be maximum leader don't you think? And the last thing any of them want is a Free Society, or to discuss their particular views as being potentially wrong.

Absurd comparison. Where do you get this about Hillary and Ted? I guess I better compare Bush to Kim to balance the blatently partisan equation.

[phildonnia]

Quote:

Originally posted by headscratcher4

Indeed, it's nuclear policy is a defensive deterent policy...don't invade us, we've got the bomb and we will level Souel or Tokyo...

Just an observation about the alleged NK nuclear threat;

As you point out, the atomic bomb is primarily a defensive weapon, but its "use" in this way requires that you show it off, make sure it appears in satellite photos, blow up some South Pacific island, etc.

The North Korean hinting, implying and bragging is precisely what would be expected from a nation that didn't (yet) have the bomb.

[hammegk]

Quote:

Originally posted by headscratcher4

Your original point remains a feeble, "crap" comparison that demonstrates either remarkable ignorance or insupportable arrogance.i In any event, what your statement demonstrates is that it is you who is most like the Kims because you are an absolutist.

It is tough when an opponent won't even consider the idea that there is enough of merit in your stance to bother to negotiate. Maximum leader for me, no thanks. I'd rather be a hermit.

Quote:

BTW, you don't think George W. or Dick C. want ot be "maximum leader"?

No. Do you?

FDR maybe, Nixon, who knows. No other president imo. Advisor level; probably lots of people think they could direct our lives from cradle to grave better than we do, and yup Hil is firmly in that camp. I agree Ted is a fat drunk murdering slob, and wouldn't know what to do if he had max leader role.

[headscratcher4]

Quote:

Originally posted by phildonnia


Just an observation about the alleged NK nuclear threat;

As you point out, the atomic bomb is primarily a defensive weapon, but its "use" in this way requires that you show it off, make sure it appears in satellite photos, blow up some South Pacific island, etc.

The North Korean hinting, implying and bragging is precisely what would be expected from a nation that didn't (yet) have the bomb.

I think this too...they have to test the damnd thing for it to be a real deterent and I think the Chinese would go ape if there was ever a test ... not to mention the rest of the world. Besides, your basic point is right too...if you've got it, you want people to know definitively that you've got it...that is why Hiroshima and Nagosaki got nailed....

[hgc]

Quote:

Originally posted by headscratcher4


I think this too...they have to test the damnd thing for it to be a real deterent and I think the Chinese would go ape if there was ever a test ... not to mention the rest of the world. Besides, your basic point is right too...if you've got it, you want people to know definitively that you've got it...that is why Hiroshima and Nagosaki got nailed....

Yes, they wouldn't want to make the mistake of the USSR in the movie "Dr. Strangelove ..." in building an automatically activated deterrent doomsday device, but not telling anyone about it, hence no deterrent ... and then doomsday.

[headscratcher4]

Unless of course CHairman Kim (lovingly known as Comrade Kissov), known for his love of surprises, was planning to announce it at the annual party convention next week....oh my god, we're going to die!

[Zep]

Easy and cheap solution proposed by a very young child (she is just turned 5, actually):

Get lots of postcards of Hawaii, Grand Canyon, Venice, Great Barrier Reef, etc, i.e. all the beautiful tourist places on this planet, and mail them to people in North Korea. Write on the postcards: "Wish you were here." The North Koreans will want to see these places on TV and want to go there. Then they will see happy people with lots of food, not starving and unhappy people like they are. Then they will ask their leaders to change things for themselves.

Out of the mouths of babes...

[phildonnia]

Quote:

Originally posted by Zep
Easy and cheap solution proposed by a very young child (she is just turned 5, actually):

Get lots of postcards of Hawaii, Grand Canyon, Venice, Great Barrier Reef, etc, i.e. all the beautiful tourist places on this planet, and mail them to people in North Korea. Write on the postcards: "Wish you were here." The North Koreans will want to see these places on TV and want to go there. Then they will see happy people with lots of food, not starving and unhappy people like they are. Then they will ask their leaders to change things for themselves.

Out of the mouths of babes...

Gee, I hate to come down so hard on an optimisitic 5 year-old, but I'm 100% certain that one can find postcards in North Korea showing what a wonderful beautiful land of plenty it is.

[DialecticMaterialist]

Just thought Huzington should see this.