Travolta might have seen the light....

dudalb · 27th July 2009, 04:25 PM

I want to make it clear this is just a rumor, but if true the CO$ might have a huge embarassment on it's hands.

From the INternet Movie Base (IMDB) news section:

Quote:

Travolta Turning His Back On Scientology?
27 July 2009 3:01 PM, PDT

John Travolta is reportedly set to abandon Scientology after losing faith in the controversial religion following the death of his teenage son.

The Grease star and his wife Kelly Preston, two of Scientology's most prominent followers, are still struggling to come to terms with 16-year-old Jett's tragic demise after he suffered a seizure during a family holiday in the Bahamas in January.

Jett was rumoured to have battled seizures since childhood, but the youngster was not prescribed any medication to treat the alleged condition as Scientologists are generally opposed to drugs.

The sudden loss is said to have left Travolta with doubts about the religion he's followed for the last 34 years.

Scientology expert, lecturer Rick Ross, tells DailyMail.co.uk, "There have been strong rumours coming out of Scientology that John Travolta is disappointed that the religion was not able to help his son more. It's led him to question his faith

Marduk · 27th July 2009, 04:34 PM

he's not on his own is he, all religions consistently fail to perform miracles

desertgal · 27th July 2009, 04:36 PM

Originally Posted by dudalb

I want to make it clear this is just a rumor, but if true the CO$ might have a huge embarassment on it's hands.

From the INternet Movie Base (IMDB) news section:

It might be true...but there is one little thing:

Quote:

Scientology expert, lecturer Rick Ross, tells DailyMail.co.uk, "There have been strong rumours coming out of Scientology that John Travolta is disappointed that the religion was not able to help his son more. It's led him to question his faith

It's the Daily Mail.

I hope it's true, though.

ravdin · 27th July 2009, 04:37 PM

I won't hold my breath- but a high profile defection like this would make my day!

wicked_ways · 27th July 2009, 04:41 PM

I had no idea Jett suffered from a treatable condition. How incredibly sad!
I didn't pay much attention after the news came out, Travolta has been a favorite actor and/or hunk of mine since 'Welcome Back Kotter'.
Hopefully, they will emerge from their grief and the Church of Scientology quickly.

dudalb · 27th July 2009, 04:47 PM

Originally Posted by ravdin

I won't hold my breath- but a high profile defection like this would make my day!

That is my stand. Very skeptical, but if Travolta does bolt it would be a VERY bad day for the Super Adventure Club.

Audible Click · 27th July 2009, 04:52 PM

How sad to lose a child to a treatable condition. I really do hope that Travolta and his wife are rethinking their commitment to that cult.

dudalb · 27th July 2009, 04:59 PM

Originally Posted by Marduk

he's not on his own is he, all religions consistently fail to perform miracles

Ture, but most churches do not encourage you to give up all medical treatment and rely on miracles.
That is what makes the CO$ so dangerous.

Dunstan · 27th July 2009, 05:04 PM

Given that the Church probably has a very thick file of materials from Travolta's "auditing" sessions that would embarrass him, this would be a very brave thing for him to do.

I'm no fan of the Catholic church, but at least I have to give them credit for treating confessions as confidential, whereas the Scientologists apparently regard them as blackmail material.

desertgal · 27th July 2009, 05:26 PM

Originally Posted by wicked_ways

I had no idea Jett suffered from a treatable condition.

Alleged treatable condition.

I don't doubt that Jett's condition was, in all likelihood, treatable, BUT the Daily Mail is not a reliable source. Fact is, we have no idea what conditions Jett may have suffered from, what treatments his parents used, if they secretly used treatments in defiance of Scientology doctrine, or, even, the detailed circumstances of his death. Without any of that information, we have no way of knowing if his condition(s) was treatable and/or if his death could have been prevented.

That said, though, I sincerely hope the Travoltas break with the CoS. If Scientology doctrine failed Jett, then his parents have paid too high a price already, and they SHOULD question their faith. I certainly would.

No parent should outlive their child. It happens too often, but it is no less tragic when it does, regardless of the circumstances.

desertgal · 27th July 2009, 05:30 PM

Travolta Remains a Scientologist

Quote:

John Travolta’s faith in Scientology remains firm. A July 25 report in Britain's Daily Mail newspaper claiming that Travolta, 55, had grown disenchanted with his longtime religion in the wake of his son Jett's death in January is "totally false," his rep Paul Bloch tells PEOPLE.

dudalb · 27th July 2009, 05:34 PM

SOme people never learn..sadly.

Big Les · 28th July 2009, 02:46 PM

I wouldn't be surprised if he did finally defect at some point. He was (AFAIK) the only Celeb to ever speak out against the church whilst still in it, back in 1983 I think. He's clearly been drinking the Hubbard-Ade the whole time, but he did at least question the church as an organisation.

Makalu G · 28th July 2009, 02:58 PM

I'll bet they "got" to him...

fredcarr · 28th July 2009, 03:13 PM

Quote:

True, but most churches do not encourage you to give up all medical treatment and rely on miracles.

That sure isn't the Church of Scientology. We have very strict policy about sending parishioners to medical doctors for treatment.

BTW lol @ the wild speculation that occurs on such a skeptical site.

AgeGap · 28th July 2009, 03:18 PM

Originally Posted by fredcarr

wild speculation

WTF? From the OP it was made clear that it was just a rumour and dudalb was posting that the rumour was going about. Anyone who fails to see that it either dumb or in need of more auditing. HTH

Epok · 28th July 2009, 03:29 PM

Originally Posted by Dunstan

Given that the Church probably has a very thick file of materials from Travolta's "auditing" sessions that would embarrass him, this would be a very brave thing for him to do.

I'm no fan of the Catholic church, but at least I have to give them credit for treating confessions as confidential, whereas the Scientologists apparently regard them as blackmail material.

It wouldn't really matter what they tried to say about him to give him bad press. Noone is really gonna believe it, at least I sure wouldn't. But this whole fiasco has got to be hard on Travolta, I mean, he just lost his kid. Thats gotta be rough on any parent. And even if he does stick with Scientology I would feel bad about making fun of him over something like this.

Gord_in_Toronto · 28th July 2009, 03:39 PM

Originally Posted by fredcarr

That sure isn't the Church of Scientology. We have very strict policy about sending parishioners to medical doctors for treatment.

Take it up with LRon:

Quote:

HCOPL 26 July 1965 "Release Declaration Restrictions, Healing Amendments

.
.

Originally Posted by fredcarr

BTW lol @ the wild speculation that occurs on such a skeptical site.

I though $camology was supposed to make you brain work better?

Cleon · 28th July 2009, 03:40 PM

Originally Posted by Epok

It wouldn't really matter what they tried to say about him to give him bad press. Noone is really gonna believe it, at least I sure wouldn't. But this whole fiasco has got to be hard on Travolta, I mean, he just lost his kid. Thats gotta be rough on any parent. And even if he does stick with Scientology I would feel bad about making fun of him over something like this.

He lost his kid, he's obviously rather depressed, and there's a whole bunch of people on the Internet who are pestering him to leave the Church.

Honestly, the entire hoopla around Travolta seems kinda ghoulish. This isn't our proudest moment, I don't think.

fredcarr · 28th July 2009, 03:42 PM

Here are a couple comments on a thread that started with the statement that this is just a rumor:

Quote:

It might be true...but there is one little thing:

It's the Daily Mail.

I hope it's true, though.

I won't hold my breath- but a high profile defection like this would make my day!

I had no idea Jett suffered from a treatable condition. How incredibly sad!
I didn't pay much attention after the news came out, Travolta has been a favorite actor and/or hunk of mine since 'Welcome Back Kotter'.
Hopefully, they will emerge from their grief and the Church of Scientology quickly.

How sad to lose a child to a treatable condition. I really do hope that Travolta and his wife are rethinking their commitment to that cult.

Ture, but most churches do not encourage you to give up all medical treatment and rely on miracles.
That is what makes the CO$ so dangerous.

Given that the Church probably has a very thick file of materials from Travolta's "auditing" sessions that would embarrass him, this would be a very brave thing for him to do.

I'm no fan of the Catholic church, but at least I have to give them credit for treating confessions as confidential, whereas the Scientologists apparently regard them as blackmail material.

I'll bet they "got" to him..

fredcarr · 28th July 2009, 03:44 PM

Quote:

He lost his kid, he's obviously rather depressed, and there's a whole bunch of people on the Internet who are pestering him to leave the Church.

Somehow I doubt that there are a bunch of people on the net pestering John to leave his church. There are certainly a bunch of people hoping he does though

Big Les · 28th July 2009, 03:51 PM

I seriously doubt he, or many other celebrity, pays any attention to the court of internet opinion.

YoPopa · 28th July 2009, 03:58 PM

Originally Posted by dudalb

Ture, but most churches do not encourage you to give up all medical treatment and rely on miracles.
That is what makes the CO$ so dangerous.

IMHO, it is the Fair Game policy which makes CO$ dangerous. Withholding Psychiatric medication harms only Scientologists. "Fair Game" allows them to harm anyone who is getting in the way.

fredcarr · 28th July 2009, 04:43 PM

More wild speculations...

http://www.randi.org/site/index.php/...ientology.html

lol!

desertgal · 28th July 2009, 05:24 PM

Originally Posted by fredcarr

Here are a couple comments on a thread that started with the statement that this is just a rumor:

Quote:

It might be true...but there is one little thing:

It's the Daily Mail.

I hope it's true, though.

I also pointed out that the Daily Mail is not a reliable source. I pointed out that the Daily Mail article refers to an alleged treatable condition, not a confirmed one. I pointed out that we have no idea what conditions Jett may have suffered from, what treatments his parents used, if they secretly used treatments in defiance of Scientology doctrine, or, even, the detailed circumstances of his death. Without any of that information, we have no way of knowing if his condition(s) was treatable and/or if his death could have been prevented. I specifically said that If Scientology doctrine failed Jett, then his parents have paid too high a price already, and they SHOULD question their faith. I certainly would. I pointed out that no parent should outlive their child-it happens too often, but it is no less tragic when it does, regardless of the circumstances. I also took the time to verify whether the rumor about Travolta leaving the CoS was true or not, and posted the correction by his agent.

Don't cherry pick my quotes to imply that I indulged in baseless speculation. I didn't.

Wowbagger · 28th July 2009, 06:16 PM

I remain skeptical that Travolta will leave Scientology. Even if he was disillusioned by it, at one point, his mind will "recover". He'll find some justification for sticking with it. He might be too far invested, and the church might be too far threatening, for him to turn back, now. Cognitive dissonance is like that, I'm afraid.

Parts of me hope that I am wrong. But, not the realistic ones.

wicked_ways · 28th July 2009, 09:30 PM

Originally Posted by desertgal

I also pointed out that the Daily Mail is not a reliable source. I pointed out that the Daily Mail article refers to an alleged treatable condition, not a confirmed one. I pointed out that we have no idea what conditions Jett may have suffered from, what treatments his parents used, if they secretly used treatments in defiance of Scientology doctrine, or, even, the detailed circumstances of his death. Without any of that information, we have no way of knowing if his condition(s) was treatable and/or if his death could have been prevented. I specifically said that If Scientology doctrine failed Jett, then his parents have paid too high a price already, and they SHOULD question their faith. I certainly would. I pointed out that no parent should outlive their child-it happens too often, but it is no less tragic when it does, regardless of the circumstances. I also took the time to verify whether the rumor about Travolta leaving the CoS was true or not, and posted the correction by his agent.

Don't cherry pick my quotes to imply that I indulged in baseless speculation. I didn't.

desertgal,
You were quick to correct me on the "alleged" treatable condition and quite right about it.

I am deeply sorry John and Kelly have lost a son, I cannot imagine that pain.

My opinion of Scientology remains the same, but maybe I should not have combined this terrible tragedy with my sour opinion about Scientology.

desertgal · 28th July 2009, 10:34 PM

Originally Posted by wicked_ways

desertgal,
You were quick to correct me on the "alleged" treatable condition and quite right about it.

I am deeply sorry John and Kelly have lost a son, I cannot imagine that pain.

My opinion of Scientology remains the same, but maybe I should not have combined this terrible tragedy with my sour opinion about Scientology.

Well, I believe we share the same opinions about Scientology.

fredcarr · 28th July 2009, 10:37 PM

"Don't cherry pick my quotes to imply that I indulged in baseless speculation. I didn't."

I'm not implying. I'm directly stating. And you did and are speculating wildly and without basis.

Klaymore · 28th July 2009, 10:49 PM

Originally Posted by fredcarr

That sure isn't the Church of Scientology. We have very strict policy about sending parishioners to medical doctors for treatment.

I love how this guy takes it for granted that it's appropriate for a church to "send" their parishioners for medical treatment. If they don't obey, do they have to undertake re-education?

Apology · 28th July 2009, 11:02 PM

Originally Posted by fredcarr

That sure isn't the Church of Scientology. We have very strict policy about sending parishioners to medical doctors for treatment.

BTW lol @ the wild speculation that occurs on such a skeptical site.

And another strict policy that doesn't allow them to take the medications the doctor prescribes. Tory Christman wasn't allowed to take her epilepsy medications, ergo it isn't much of a stretch to assume that the Travoltas were told by their Scientology advisors that Jett Travolta shouldn't take his epilepsy medication either, and now he's dead.

Looks like the auditing and vitamins failed again, this time with fatal results.

Bill Thompson · 28th July 2009, 11:14 PM

A friend of comedian Kathy Griffin told her after she was in the church to do research for a tv pilot that Travolta and Cruise are in the church and are afraid of leaving because auditors have gay confessions in their file cabinets (or file closets?).

Akhenaten · 29th July 2009, 01:03 AM

Originally Posted by desertgal

Well, I believe we share the same opinions about Scientology.

Kewl.

desertgal · 29th July 2009, 04:10 AM

Originally Posted by fredcarr

"Don't cherry pick my quotes to imply that I indulged in baseless speculation. I didn't."

I'm not implying. I'm directly stating. And you did and are speculating wildly and without basis.

Where?

Originally Posted by fredcarr

More wild speculations...

http://www.randi.org/site/index.php/...ientology.html

lol!

You keep asserting that, but you consistently fail to prove otherwise. Smoke and mirrors. If the speculation is baseless, prove it.

Originally Posted by fredcarr

That sure isn't the Church of Scientology. We have very strict policy about sending parishioners to medical doctors for treatment.

Really? You only go to the doctor if your church tells you to?

Cainkane1 · 29th July 2009, 04:49 AM

John Travolta is disappointed that the religion was not able to help his son more. It's led him to question his faith. This religion like any other religion that forbids its members to use medicine causes people to die. If his son needed medicine to keep his seizures in check then he should have had the damn medicine. Travolta should leave this idiotic religion and he should never have been a member in the first place.

Sean84 · 29th July 2009, 04:55 AM

Originally Posted by Bill Thompson

A friend of comedian Kathy Griffin told her after she was in the church to do research for a tv pilot that Travolta and Cruise are in the church and are afraid of leaving because auditors have gay confessions in their file cabinets (or file closets?).

Like an already public picture of Travolta kissing another man on the mouth on the steps of a jet? The cult has a lot more black mail material than simple sexual indiscretions.

That is how they maintain their existence: brainwash, extort.... I should shut up....

Ladewig · 29th July 2009, 06:11 AM

Originally Posted by fredcarr

That sure isn't the Church of Scientology. We have very strict policy about sending parishioners to medical doctors for treatment.

Even for illnesses such as depression, schizophrenia, and bipolar disorder?

desertgal · 29th July 2009, 06:47 AM

Originally Posted by Cainkane1

John Travolta is disappointed that the religion was not able to help his son more. It's led him to question his faith.

How do you know? Not saying that it isn't true, but you are stating it as fact.

wicked_ways · 29th July 2009, 06:08 PM

Originally Posted by Akhenaten

Kewl.

YAY! grouphug! it is the kewlest!

wicked_ways · 29th July 2009, 06:10 PM

Originally Posted by Ladewig

Even for illnesses such as depression, schizophrenia, and bipolar disorder?

yes, fredcarr, what about these serious illnesses?
or is this a glib quetion?

27th July 2009, 04:25 PM	#1
dudalb Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 14,448	Travolta might have seen the light.... I want to make it clear this is just a rumor, but if true the CO$ might have a huge embarassment on it's hands. From the INternet Movie Base (IMDB) news section: Quote: Travolta Turning His Back On Scientology? 27 July 2009 3:01 PM, PDT John Travolta is reportedly set to abandon Scientology after losing faith in the controversial religion following the death of his teenage son. The Grease star and his wife Kelly Preston, two of Scientology's most prominent followers, are still struggling to come to terms with 16-year-old Jett's tragic demise after he suffered a seizure during a family holiday in the Bahamas in January. Jett was rumoured to have battled seizures since childhood, but the youngster was not prescribed any medication to treat the alleged condition as Scientologists are generally opposed to drugs. The sudden loss is said to have left Travolta with doubts about the religion he's followed for the last 34 years. Scientology expert, lecturer Rick Ross, tells DailyMail.co.uk, "There have been strong rumours coming out of Scientology that John Travolta is disappointed that the religion was not able to help his son more. It's led him to question his faith

27th July 2009, 04:34 PM	#2
Marduk Dragon Killer Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Newbury, Berkshire Posts: 3,073	he's not on his own is he, all religions consistently fail to perform miracles
	__________________ Senno Ecto Gama ĝae haš dug zae ama kibid "Stupid humans" (Wollery) "Kill all humans" (Bender) "for while heaven may be closed I am always open, even on Christmas." (Lucifer)

27th July 2009, 04:36 PM	#3
desertgal Graduate Poster Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Dallas, Texas Posts: 1,835	Originally Posted by dudalb I want to make it clear this is just a rumor, but if true the CO$ might have a huge embarassment on it's hands. From the INternet Movie Base (IMDB) news section: It might be true...but there is one little thing: Quote: Scientology expert, lecturer Rick Ross, tells DailyMail.co.uk, "There have been strong rumours coming out of Scientology that John Travolta is disappointed that the religion was not able to help his son more. It's led him to question his faith It's the Daily Mail. I hope it's true, though.
	__________________ "However, no amount of common sense changes the fact that this does remain a real, true, and very important part of my life." - VisionFromFeeling www.StopVisionFromFeeling.com Diana, Princess of Wales

27th July 2009, 04:37 PM	#4
ravdin Graduate Poster Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: The People's Republic of Berkeley, CA Posts: 1,652	I won't hold my breath- but a high profile defection like this would make my day!
	__________________ No man's life, liberty, or property is safe while Congress is in session. -Mark Twain

27th July 2009, 04:41 PM	#5
wicked_ways Thinker Join Date: May 2009 Posts: 200	I had no idea Jett suffered from a treatable condition. How incredibly sad! I didn't pay much attention after the news came out, Travolta has been a favorite actor and/or hunk of mine since 'Welcome Back Kotter'. Hopefully, they will emerge from their grief and the Church of Scientology quickly.
wicked_ways Thinker Join Date: May 2009 Posts: 200

27th July 2009, 04:47 PM	#6
dudalb Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 14,448	Originally Posted by ravdin I won't hold my breath- but a high profile defection like this would make my day! That is my stand. Very skeptical, but if Travolta does bolt it would be a VERY bad day for the Super Adventure Club.

27th July 2009, 04:52 PM	#7
Audible Click The gap in the plot Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: BFE Posts: 2,037	How sad to lose a child to a treatable condition. I really do hope that Travolta and his wife are rethinking their commitment to that cult.
	__________________ A great many people think they are thinking when they are merely rearranging their prejudices.-William James. www.StopVisionFromFeeling.com

27th July 2009, 04:59 PM	#8
dudalb Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 14,448	Originally Posted by Marduk he's not on his own is he, all religions consistently fail to perform miracles Ture, but most churches do not encourage you to give up all medical treatment and rely on miracles. That is what makes the CO$ so dangerous.

27th July 2009, 05:04 PM	#9
Dunstan Master Poster Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Sunnyvale Trailer Park Posts: 2,502	Given that the Church probably has a very thick file of materials from Travolta's "auditing" sessions that would embarrass him, this would be a very brave thing for him to do. I'm no fan of the Catholic church, but at least I have to give them credit for treating confessions as confidential, whereas the Scientologists apparently regard them as blackmail material.

27th July 2009, 05:26 PM	#10
desertgal Graduate Poster Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Dallas, Texas Posts: 1,835	Originally Posted by wicked_ways I had no idea Jett suffered from a treatable condition. Alleged treatable condition. I don't doubt that Jett's condition was, in all likelihood, treatable, BUT the Daily Mail is not a reliable source. Fact is, we have no idea what conditions Jett may have suffered from, what treatments his parents used, if they secretly used treatments in defiance of Scientology doctrine, or, even, the detailed circumstances of his death. Without any of that information, we have no way of knowing if his condition(s) was treatable and/or if his death could have been prevented. That said, though, I sincerely hope the Travoltas break with the CoS. If Scientology doctrine failed Jett, then his parents have paid too high a price already, and they SHOULD question their faith. I certainly would. No parent should outlive their child. It happens too often, but it is no less tragic when it does, regardless of the circumstances.
	__________________ "However, no amount of common sense changes the fact that this does remain a real, true, and very important part of my life." - VisionFromFeeling www.StopVisionFromFeeling.com Diana, Princess of Wales

27th July 2009, 05:30 PM	#11
desertgal Graduate Poster Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Dallas, Texas Posts: 1,835	Travolta Remains a Scientologist Quote: John Travolta’s faith in Scientology remains firm. A July 25 report in Britain's Daily Mail newspaper claiming that Travolta, 55, had grown disenchanted with his longtime religion in the wake of his son Jett's death in January is "totally false," his rep Paul Bloch tells PEOPLE.
	__________________ "However, no amount of common sense changes the fact that this does remain a real, true, and very important part of my life." - VisionFromFeeling www.StopVisionFromFeeling.com Diana, Princess of Wales

27th July 2009, 05:34 PM	#12
dudalb Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 14,448	SOme people never learn..sadly.

28th July 2009, 02:46 PM	#13
Big Les Not so much a medium as a large Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: United Kingdom Posts: 4,661	I wouldn't be surprised if he did finally defect at some point. He was (AFAIK) the only Celeb to ever speak out against the church whilst still in it, back in 1983 I think. He's clearly been drinking the Hubbard-Ade the whole time, but he did at least question the church as an organisation.
	__________________ "One of the fundamental freedoms is to write what you like, including nonsense: another, which I am exercising, is to denounce it." -Robert Raikes bshistorian.wordpress.com

28th July 2009, 02:58 PM	#14
Makalu G New Blood Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Chicagoland Posts: 14	I'll bet they "got" to him...

28th July 2009, 03:13 PM	#15
fredcarr Muse Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Utah Posts: 554	Quote: True, but most churches do not encourage you to give up all medical treatment and rely on miracles. That sure isn't the Church of Scientology. We have very strict policy about sending parishioners to medical doctors for treatment. BTW lol @ the wild speculation that occurs on such a skeptical site.

28th July 2009, 03:18 PM	#16
AgeGap Graduate Poster Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 1,803	Originally Posted by fredcarr wild speculation WTF? From the OP it was made clear that it was just a rumour and dudalb was posting that the rumour was going about. Anyone who fails to see that it either dumb or in need of more auditing. HTH
AgeGap Graduate Poster Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 1,803	__________________ Cool Uri Geller site by Steve Knight

28th July 2009, 03:29 PM	#17
Epok Thinker Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Birmingham, Al Posts: 184	Originally Posted by Dunstan Given that the Church probably has a very thick file of materials from Travolta's "auditing" sessions that would embarrass him, this would be a very brave thing for him to do. I'm no fan of the Catholic church, but at least I have to give them credit for treating confessions as confidential, whereas the Scientologists apparently regard them as blackmail material. It wouldn't really matter what they tried to say about him to give him bad press. Noone is really gonna believe it, at least I sure wouldn't. But this whole fiasco has got to be hard on Travolta, I mean, he just lost his kid. Thats gotta be rough on any parent. And even if he does stick with Scientology I would feel bad about making fun of him over something like this.

28th July 2009, 03:39 PM	#18
Gord_in_Toronto Philosopher Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 8,168	Originally Posted by fredcarr That sure isn't the Church of Scientology. We have very strict policy about sending parishioners to medical doctors for treatment. Take it up with LRon: Quote: HCOPL 26 July 1965 "Release Declaration Restrictions, Healing Amendments . . Originally Posted by fredcarr BTW lol @ the wild speculation that occurs on such a skeptical site. I though $camology was supposed to make you brain work better?
	__________________ "Reality is what's left when you cease to believe." Philip K. Dick Now completely free.

28th July 2009, 03:40 PM	#19
Cleon King of the Pod People Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Atlanta, GA Posts: 14,361	Originally Posted by Epok It wouldn't really matter what they tried to say about him to give him bad press. Noone is really gonna believe it, at least I sure wouldn't. But this whole fiasco has got to be hard on Travolta, I mean, he just lost his kid. Thats gotta be rough on any parent. And even if he does stick with Scientology I would feel bad about making fun of him over something like this. He lost his kid, he's obviously rather depressed, and there's a whole bunch of people on the Internet who are pestering him to leave the Church. Honestly, the entire hoopla around Travolta seems kinda ghoulish. This isn't our proudest moment, I don't think.
	__________________ "Intolerance does not flourish without ignorance to feed it." - kittynh "A jerk who is right is still a jerk." - Ducky My blog

28th July 2009, 03:42 PM	#20
fredcarr Muse Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Utah Posts: 554	Here are a couple comments on a thread that started with the statement that this is just a rumor: Quote: It might be true...but there is one little thing: It's the Daily Mail. I hope it's true, though. I won't hold my breath- but a high profile defection like this would make my day! I had no idea Jett suffered from a treatable condition. How incredibly sad! I didn't pay much attention after the news came out, Travolta has been a favorite actor and/or hunk of mine since 'Welcome Back Kotter'. Hopefully, they will emerge from their grief and the Church of Scientology quickly. How sad to lose a child to a treatable condition. I really do hope that Travolta and his wife are rethinking their commitment to that cult. Ture, but most churches do not encourage you to give up all medical treatment and rely on miracles. That is what makes the CO$ so dangerous. Given that the Church probably has a very thick file of materials from Travolta's "auditing" sessions that would embarrass him, this would be a very brave thing for him to do. I'm no fan of the Catholic church, but at least I have to give them credit for treating confessions as confidential, whereas the Scientologists apparently regard them as blackmail material. I'll bet they "got" to him..

28th July 2009, 03:44 PM	#21
fredcarr Muse Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Utah Posts: 554	Quote: He lost his kid, he's obviously rather depressed, and there's a whole bunch of people on the Internet who are pestering him to leave the Church. Somehow I doubt that there are a bunch of people on the net pestering John to leave his church. There are certainly a bunch of people hoping he does though

28th July 2009, 03:51 PM	#22
Big Les Not so much a medium as a large Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: United Kingdom Posts: 4,661	I seriously doubt he, or many other celebrity, pays any attention to the court of internet opinion.
	__________________ "One of the fundamental freedoms is to write what you like, including nonsense: another, which I am exercising, is to denounce it." -Robert Raikes bshistorian.wordpress.com

28th July 2009, 03:58 PM	#23
YoPopa Graduate Poster Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: State of Yo Posts: 1,187	Originally Posted by dudalb Ture, but most churches do not encourage you to give up all medical treatment and rely on miracles. That is what makes the CO$ so dangerous. IMHO, it is the Fair Game policy which makes CO$ dangerous. Withholding Psychiatric medication harms only Scientologists. "Fair Game" allows them to harm anyone who is getting in the way.

28th July 2009, 04:43 PM	#24
fredcarr Muse Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Utah Posts: 554	More wild speculations... http://www.randi.org/site/index.php/...ientology.html lol!

28th July 2009, 05:24 PM	#25
desertgal Graduate Poster Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Dallas, Texas Posts: 1,835	Originally Posted by fredcarr Here are a couple comments on a thread that started with the statement that this is just a rumor: Quote: It might be true...but there is one little thing: It's the Daily Mail. I hope it's true, though. I also pointed out that the Daily Mail is not a reliable source. I pointed out that the Daily Mail article refers to an alleged treatable condition, not a confirmed one. I pointed out that we have no idea what conditions Jett may have suffered from, what treatments his parents used, if they secretly used treatments in defiance of Scientology doctrine, or, even, the detailed circumstances of his death. Without any of that information, we have no way of knowing if his condition(s) was treatable and/or if his death could have been prevented. I specifically said that If Scientology doctrine failed Jett, then his parents have paid too high a price already, and they SHOULD question their faith. I certainly would. I pointed out that no parent should outlive their child-it happens too often, but it is no less tragic when it does, regardless of the circumstances. I also took the time to verify whether the rumor about Travolta leaving the CoS was true or not, and posted the correction by his agent. Don't cherry pick my quotes to imply that I indulged in baseless speculation. I didn't.
	__________________ "However, no amount of common sense changes the fact that this does remain a real, true, and very important part of my life." - VisionFromFeeling www.StopVisionFromFeeling.com Diana, Princess of Wales Last edited by desertgal; 28th July 2009 at 05:25 PM.

28th July 2009, 06:16 PM	#26
Wowbagger The Infinitely Prolonged Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: Westchester County, NY (when not in space) Posts: 7,725	I remain skeptical that Travolta will leave Scientology. Even if he was disillusioned by it, at one point, his mind will "recover". He'll find some justification for sticking with it. He might be too far invested, and the church might be too far threatening, for him to turn back, now. Cognitive dissonance is like that, I'm afraid. Parts of me hope that I am wrong. But, not the realistic ones.
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28th July 2009, 09:30 PM	#27
wicked_ways Thinker Join Date: May 2009 Posts: 200	desertgal, thanks for setting it straight. Originally Posted by desertgal I also pointed out that the Daily Mail is not a reliable source. I pointed out that the Daily Mail article refers to an alleged treatable condition, not a confirmed one. I pointed out that we have no idea what conditions Jett may have suffered from, what treatments his parents used, if they secretly used treatments in defiance of Scientology doctrine, or, even, the detailed circumstances of his death. Without any of that information, we have no way of knowing if his condition(s) was treatable and/or if his death could have been prevented. I specifically said that If Scientology doctrine failed Jett, then his parents have paid too high a price already, and they SHOULD question their faith. I certainly would. I pointed out that no parent should outlive their child-it happens too often, but it is no less tragic when it does, regardless of the circumstances. I also took the time to verify whether the rumor about Travolta leaving the CoS was true or not, and posted the correction by his agent. Don't cherry pick my quotes to imply that I indulged in baseless speculation. I didn't. desertgal, You were quick to correct me on the "alleged" treatable condition and quite right about it. I am deeply sorry John and Kelly have lost a son, I cannot imagine that pain. My opinion of Scientology remains the same, but maybe I should not have combined this terrible tragedy with my sour opinion about Scientology.
wicked_ways Thinker Join Date: May 2009 Posts: 200

28th July 2009, 10:34 PM	#28
desertgal Graduate Poster Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Dallas, Texas Posts: 1,835	Originally Posted by wicked_ways desertgal, You were quick to correct me on the "alleged" treatable condition and quite right about it. I am deeply sorry John and Kelly have lost a son, I cannot imagine that pain. My opinion of Scientology remains the same, but maybe I should not have combined this terrible tragedy with my sour opinion about Scientology. Well, I believe we share the same opinions about Scientology.
	__________________ "However, no amount of common sense changes the fact that this does remain a real, true, and very important part of my life." - VisionFromFeeling www.StopVisionFromFeeling.com Diana, Princess of Wales

28th July 2009, 10:37 PM	#29
fredcarr Muse Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Utah Posts: 554	"Don't cherry pick my quotes to imply that I indulged in baseless speculation. I didn't." I'm not implying. I'm directly stating. And you did and are speculating wildly and without basis.

28th July 2009, 10:49 PM	#30
Klaymore Critical Thinker Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Tokyo, Japan Posts: 264	Originally Posted by fredcarr That sure isn't the Church of Scientology. We have very strict policy about sending parishioners to medical doctors for treatment. I love how this guy takes it for granted that it's appropriate for a church to "send" their parishioners for medical treatment. If they don't obey, do they have to undertake re-education?
	__________________ The sum of my life's wisdom (year 38): 1) The difference between having a genius IQ and being a genius is the same as the difference between having a machine-gun with a rocket-launcher on it and being a Navy SEAL; 2) Fat women tend to come a lot; 3) [please check back periodically]

28th July 2009, 11:02 PM	#31
Apology Muse Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 917	Originally Posted by fredcarr That sure isn't the Church of Scientology. We have very strict policy about sending parishioners to medical doctors for treatment. BTW lol @ the wild speculation that occurs on such a skeptical site. And another strict policy that doesn't allow them to take the medications the doctor prescribes. Tory Christman wasn't allowed to take her epilepsy medications, ergo it isn't much of a stretch to assume that the Travoltas were told by their Scientology advisors that Jett Travolta shouldn't take his epilepsy medication either, and now he's dead. Looks like the auditing and vitamins failed again, this time with fatal results.
Apology Muse Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 917	__________________ "When I began to talk with him, I could not help thinking that he was not really wise, although he was thought wise by many, and wiser still by himself; and I went and tried to explain to him that he thought himself wise, but was not really wise; and the consequence was that he hated me, and his enmity was shared by several who were present and heard me." Plato, Apology

28th July 2009, 11:14 PM	#32
Bill Thompson Graduate Poster Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Redmond, Washington Posts: 1,435	A friend of comedian Kathy Griffin told her after she was in the church to do research for a tv pilot that Travolta and Cruise are in the church and are afraid of leaving because auditors have gay confessions in their file cabinets (or file closets?).
	__________________ "First comes the snake oil then comes the koolaide" --Wm. M. Thompson

29th July 2009, 01:03 AM	#33
Akhenaten Heretic Pharaoh Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Pi-Broadford Australia Posts: 6,284	Originally Posted by desertgal Well, I believe we share the same opinions about Scientology. Kewl.
	__________________ Life is mostly Froth and Bubble - Adam Lindsay Gordon

29th July 2009, 04:10 AM	#34
desertgal Graduate Poster Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Dallas, Texas Posts: 1,835	Originally Posted by fredcarr "Don't cherry pick my quotes to imply that I indulged in baseless speculation. I didn't." I'm not implying. I'm directly stating. And you did and are speculating wildly and without basis. Where? Originally Posted by fredcarr More wild speculations... http://www.randi.org/site/index.php/...ientology.html lol! You keep asserting that, but you consistently fail to prove otherwise. Smoke and mirrors. If the speculation is baseless, prove it. Originally Posted by fredcarr That sure isn't the Church of Scientology. We have very strict policy about sending parishioners to medical doctors for treatment. Really? You only go to the doctor if your church tells you to?
	__________________ "However, no amount of common sense changes the fact that this does remain a real, true, and very important part of my life." - VisionFromFeeling www.StopVisionFromFeeling.com Diana, Princess of Wales Last edited by desertgal; 29th July 2009 at 04:28 AM.

29th July 2009, 04:49 AM	#35
Cainkane1 Master Poster Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: The great American southeast Posts: 2,566	John Travolta is disappointed that the religion was not able to help his son more. It's led him to question his faith. This religion like any other religion that forbids its members to use medicine causes people to die. If his son needed medicine to keep his seizures in check then he should have had the damn medicine. Travolta should leave this idiotic religion and he should never have been a member in the first place.
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