The Boy and His Egg

[jer_j]

The Boy and His Egg

When going out to check the mail the other day, I crossed paths with a school-aged child walking down the street in front of my house, carrying an egg. I always tried to be friendly to the little ones, so I stopped to show interest in what was obviously an object of immense pride for him.

“Whoa,” I said. “Cool egg!”

“Thanks!” he beamed.

“Where’d you get it?”

“I just found it in the woods.”

He seemed so happy, I decided not to bother him about the fact that he had basically killed a baby bird.

Instead I knelt down next to him and asked playfully, “Do you know what’s inside it?”

“Nope. But I’m pretty sure it might be a baby robot.”

“A baby robot? Wow, who’s ever heard of such a thing?”

“A bunch of people. Ten of my friends all said they’ve seen baby robots. Tommy drew a picture of one during math class.”

I chuckled and shook my head. “You children have the most active imaginations.”

“It’s not imagination.” The boy started into a defiant tone, and I felt the first pangs of skeptical irritation. “They did see baby robots. And I really think there might be one in here.”

“Well, don’t put too much stock in what a few friends say. It’s probably more likely there’s a baby bird in there.”

“Prove it!”

Breaking the egg was obviously out of the question. So instead I said, “Well, isn’t it more likely to be a bird? I mean, we see birds all the time – ”

“Not all the time. I don’t see one right now.”

“But I mean we see them regularly. They’re a part of our everyday experience, whereas baby robots – ”

“Define everyday experience.”

“Uhh… I don’t want to start splitting hairs with you. Let’s instead just agree that it’s far more likely to be a bird – ”

“You keep saying that, but where’s your proof?”

“I’m not saying I can prove it’s a bird. It might be a lizard, I guess, or a snake. But – ”

“Or a baby robot.”

“Highly unlikely, but – ”

“So where’s your proof that it’s a bird?”

“I can’t prove that it’s a bird, and I’m not trying to. I just mean that if people rarely see baby robots, and there’s so little basis for believing that a baby robot would be inside an egg, then it’s far more likely to be a bird.”

“But WHERE’S YOUR PROOF that it’s a bird?”

“I don’t have proof, and I’m NOT TRYING TO PROVE it’s a bird.” By now my face had turned red and I was forcing myself not to grab the kid by the collar and shake him.

He pulled a piece of paper out of his pocket and unfolded it. It was a picture of a robot.

“See, this is a baby robot standing next to Tommy’s house.”

Even from the childish drawing, I could roughly estimate the size of the baby robot based on perspective and relative size. And I saw a problem. “But that thing’s way too big to fit inside an egg,” I said. “And not only that, but robots couldn’t grow from babies to adults, because they’re made out of metal. Not only is your idea unlikely, it’s totally impossible.”

“Maybe - according to society’s current ideas of science.”

Apparently this brat had gained a vocabulary without the knowledge to complement it.

“But the egg is this size,” I held my fingers an inch a part, “and the robot is this size.” I held out my hands with about two feet between them. “It just doesn’t work!”

“The scientific ideas of today indicate that a large robot will not fit into a small egg. But isn’t it closed-minded to think that will never change when we make new discoveries? That someday we won’t learn strange new things we can’t imagine right now?”

I knew kids could be ignorant. But such elaborate ignorance blew my mind. It was almost impressive – in an utterly wasteful, depressing way.

“No but there are some things that are just so implausible that it doesn’t benefit you to theorize – ”

“That still doesn’t prove it’s a bird!”

I threw up my hands and screamed, then ran down the street to my house.


*****************************


I had resolved never again to speak a word to the little snot-nosed devil. But sitting on the couch, thinking of all the stupid things he said, I got restless. I shifted back and forth, then paced across the living room, all the while telling myself, “Don’t go back out there. Don’t go back out there…”

But then, through the window, I saw the boy parading his “robot egg” up and down the street, and I just needed to…

“DON’T GO OUT THERE!!!” My conscious reasoning screamed to my base impulses. I tried to stay strong.

But then… Then I thought of a brilliant point I could make to him – one so clear and concise that the logic was unavoidable, even to that hellish punk. There was no way he could get around something so obvious!!!

So I ran outside and spelled it all out for him – explained the difference between trying to prove it was a bird and using the possibility of being a bird as an alternate explanation that made the “robot hypothesis” infinitely less likely by comparison – then waited in anticipation.

He looked at me for a minute, cocked his head as if thinking, then said:

“That still doesn’t prove it’s a bird.”

“But I wasn’t TRYING to prove it’s a bird!!!”

“Yes you were.”

“NO!!! I WASN’T!!!”

I was now screaming into the face of this deep, dark logic vacuum, this epic failure of the public school system, this…

“Then why did you say it was a bird.”

“I didn’t! I was just said that was a POSSIBILITY!”

“But if you can’t prove it, then – ”

“AHHHHHHHH!!!!!!” I ran back into my house and slammed the door behind me.

*****************************

I had resolved never again to speak a word to that depraved spawn of outer darkness. But sitting on the couch, thinking of all the stupid things he said, I got restless…







* All people mentioned in this work are fictional. Certain connections to real life people or debates may be made by some, but such interpretation is entirely the responsibility of the reader. Adjectives used to describe the boy are solely those of the narrator, representing HIS feeling about the boy, and are not meant as an insult to any living person.

[Andrew Wiggin]

Originally Posted by jer_j

The Boy and His Egg

When going out to check the mail the other day, I crossed paths with a school-aged child walking down the street in front of my house, carrying an egg. I always tried to be friendly to the little ones, so I stopped to show interest in what was obviously an object of immense pride for him.

“Whoa,” I said. “Cool egg!”

“Thanks!” he beamed.

“Where’d you get it?”

“I just found it in the woods.”

He seemed so happy, I decided not to bother him about the fact that he had basically killed a baby bird.

Instead I knelt down next to him and asked playfully, “Do you know what’s inside it?”

“Nope. But I’m pretty sure it might be a baby robot.”

“A baby robot? Wow, who’s ever heard of such a thing?”

“A bunch of people. Ten of my friends all said they’ve seen baby robots. Tommy drew a picture of one during math class.”

I chuckled and shook my head. “You children have the most active imaginations.”

“It’s not imagination.” The boy started into a defiant tone, and I felt the first pangs of skeptical irritation. “They did see baby robots. And I really think there might be one in here.”

“Well, don’t put too much stock in what a few friends say. It’s probably more likely there’s a baby bird in there.”

“Prove it!”

Breaking the egg was obviously out of the question. So instead I said, “Well, isn’t it more likely to be a bird? I mean, we see birds all the time – ”

“Not all the time. I don’t see one right now.”

“But I mean we see them regularly. They’re a part of our everyday experience, whereas baby robots – ”

“Define everyday experience.”

“Uhh… I don’t want to start splitting hairs with you. Let’s instead just agree that it’s far more likely to be a bird – ”

“You keep saying that, but where’s your proof?”

“I’m not saying I can prove it’s a bird. It might be a lizard, I guess, or a snake. But – ”

“Or a baby robot.”

“Highly unlikely, but – ”

“So where’s your proof that it’s a bird?”

“I can’t prove that it’s a bird, and I’m not trying to. I just mean that if people rarely see baby robots, and there’s so little basis for believing that a baby robot would be inside an egg, then it’s far more likely to be a bird.”

“But WHERE’S YOUR PROOF that it’s a bird?”

“I don’t have proof, and I’m NOT TRYING TO PROVE it’s a bird.” By now my face had turned red and I was forcing myself not to grab the kid by the collar and shake him.

He pulled a piece of paper out of his pocket and unfolded it. It was a picture of a robot.

“See, this is a baby robot standing next to Tommy’s house.”

Even from the childish drawing, I could roughly estimate the size of the baby robot based on perspective and relative size. And I saw a problem. “But that thing’s way too big to fit inside an egg,” I said. “And not only that, but robots couldn’t grow from babies to adults, because they’re made out of metal. Not only is your idea unlikely, it’s totally impossible.”

“Maybe - according to society’s current ideas of science.”

Apparently this brat had gained a vocabulary without the knowledge to complement it.

“But the egg is this size,” I held my fingers an inch a part, “and the robot is this size.” I held out my hands with about two feet between them. “It just doesn’t work!”

“The scientific ideas of today indicate that a large robot will not fit into a small egg. But isn’t it closed-minded to think that will never change when we make new discoveries? That someday we won’t learn strange new things we can’t imagine right now?”

I knew kids could be ignorant. But such elaborate ignorance blew my mind. It was almost impressive – in an utterly wasteful, depressing way.

“No but there are some things that are just so implausible that it doesn’t benefit you to theorize – ”

“That still doesn’t prove it’s a bird!”

I threw up my hands and screamed, then ran down the street to my house.


*****************************


I had resolved never again to speak a word to the little snot-nosed devil. But sitting on the couch, thinking of all the stupid things he said, I got restless. I shifted back and forth, then paced across the living room, all the while telling myself, “Don’t go back out there. Don’t go back out there…”

But then, through the window, I saw the boy parading his “robot egg” up and down the street, and I just needed to…

“DON’T GO OUT THERE!!!” My conscious reasoning screamed to my base impulses. I tried to stay strong.

But then… Then I thought of a brilliant point I could make to him – one so clear and concise that the logic was unavoidable, even to that hellish punk. There was no way he could get around something so obvious!!!

So I ran outside and spelled it all out for him – explained the difference between trying to prove it was a bird and using the possibility of being a bird as an alternate explanation that made the “robot hypothesis” infinitely less likely by comparison – then waited in anticipation.

He looked at me for a minute, cocked his head as if thinking, then said:

“That still doesn’t prove it’s a bird.”

“But I wasn’t TRYING to prove it’s a bird!!!”

“Yes you were.”

“NO!!! I WASN’T!!!”

I was now screaming into the face of this deep, dark logic vacuum, this epic failure of the public school system, this…

“Then why did you say it was a bird.”

“I didn’t! I was just said that was a POSSIBILITY!”

“But if you can’t prove it, then – ”

“AHHHHHHHH!!!!!!” I ran back into my house and slammed the door behind me.

*****************************

I had resolved never again to speak a word to the depraved spawn of outer darkness. But sitting on the couch, thinking of all the stupid things he said, I got restless…







* All people mentioned in this work are fictional. Certain connections to real life people or debates may be made by some, but such interpretation is entirely the responsibility of the reader. Adjectives used to describe the boy are solely those of the narrator, representing HIS feeling about the boy, and are not meant as an insult to any living person.

That's quite the way to put it into perspective. Thanks.

A

[LissaLysikan]

Rofl

[Pure_Argent]

Nominated.

[Brian-M]

Nominated as well.

[sphenisc]

Welcome to the world of Kinder eggs

http://www.flickr.com/photos/balakov/860939368

[Tapio]

Absolutely brilliant. Bravo!

[Stray Cat]

So, I don't get it... was it a bird or a baby robot?




OK - I know the egg was classified as a UFO (unidentified frying object)

[Cayvmann]

This hits very close to home for me. Thanks

[GeeMack]

3. Why would the boy believe that a known and extant creature such as a bird, the proximity of which there is ample and irrefutable evidence near the site under discussion, is an equally plausible explanation for the contents of the egg as a baby robot, for which we have no physical, unambiguous, non-hoaxable evidence whatsoever?

Mental illness? Raw, unadulterated stupidity? Perhaps it's a pretense of believing for the purpose of trolling a web forum [when he grows up]? Maybe the "knower/believer" boy is a compulsive liar and only appears to believe it? The simple naivety of a high school kid? There is at least some compelling evidence [in this tale] to point towards any or a combination of those explanations. Of course there are others.

[Tapio]

Originally Posted by geemack

mental illness? Raw, unadulterated stupidity? Perhaps it's a pretense of believing for the purpose of trolling a web forum [when he grows up]? Maybe the "knower/believer" boy is a compulsive liar and only appears to believe it? The simple naivety of a high school kid? There is at least some compelling evidence [in this tale] to point towards any or a combination of those explanations. Of course there are others.

i-m-a-g-i-n-a-t-i-o-n.

[Aepervius]

The solution is easy : clasp both hand of the child over the ufo egg and show him the yolk, then ask him "does that look like robot part to you?".

[GeeMack]

Originally Posted by Tapio

i-m-a-g-i-n-a-t-i-o-n.

... in juxtaposition with a sane, rational understanding of reality.

[Careyp74]

Originally Posted by Aepervius

The solution is easy : clasp both hand of the child over the ufo egg and show him the yolk, then ask him "does that look like robot part to you?".

let me play devil's advocate here: It doesn't look like bird parts either!

[Aepervius]

Originally Posted by Careyp74

let me play devil's advocate here: It doesn't look like bird parts either!

No but you have the statisfaction of leaving the kid with a stupefied face and hand dunked in yolk :P.

[Careyp74]

I am bored today, don't mind me

Originally Posted by jer_j

Instead I knelt down next to him and asked playfully, “Do you know what’s inside it?”

“Nope. But I’m pretty sure it might be a baby robot.”

He admitted that he didn't know what was in the egg. you, on the other hand,

Originally Posted by jer_j

It’s probably more likely there’s a baby bird in there.”

Ok, well, that is a fine assumption, but if someone wants you to back up your assumption.....

Originally Posted by jer_j

“Prove it!”

I don't think it is very effective to argue it with your premise

Originally Posted by jer_j

“Well, isn’t it more likely to be a bird? I mean, we see birds all the time – ”

So, it is more likely to be a bird because it is more likely to be a bird?
And we see a lot of robots nowadays......

Originally Posted by jer_j

“Not all the time. I don’t see one right now.”

“But I mean we see them regularly. They’re a part of our everyday experience, whereas baby robots – ”

“Define everyday experience.”

“Uhh… I don’t want to start splitting hairs with you. Let’s instead just agree that it’s far more likely to be a bird – ”

Wow, still trying to get him to accept your premise without proof, and dodging the argument by saying you don't want to get into it. You should have walked away right there, you were defeated.

Originally Posted by jer_j

“You keep saying that, but where’s your proof?”

“I’m not saying I can prove it’s a bird. It might be a lizard, I guess, or a snake. But – ”

You just created a strawman here. He is asking proof on your premise, never saying that he wants proof that it IS ACTUALLY A BIRD! And then offers his alternate theory again. After all, it could even be Schroedinger's cat in that egg.

Originally Posted by jer_j

“Or a baby robot.”

Right, sorry kid.

Originally Posted by jer_j

“So where’s your proof that it’s a bird?”

Great, now the kid is confused with the argument. Why do these things always happen when someone starts creating strawmen?

Originally Posted by jer_j

“I can’t prove that it’s a bird, and I’m not trying to. I just mean that if people rarely see baby robots, and there’s so little basis for believing that a baby robot would be inside an egg, then it’s far more likely to be a bird.”

Oh, now that the whole topic is derailed you offer an intelligent basis for your premise? Too late, if this was a thread on JREF, it would be in the AAH bucket by now

[Careyp74]

Originally Posted by Aepervius

No but you have the statisfaction of leaving the kid with a stupefied face and hand dunked in yolk :P.

You're evil.

[Stray Cat]

And we shouldn't overlook the possibility that it's a baby robot BIRD either.

[Careyp74]

Originally Posted by Stray Cat

And we shouldn't overlook the possibility that it's a baby robot BIRD either.

http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/g...ird-webcam.jpg

man, if only the kid thought of that!

[jer_j]

Originally Posted by Aepervius

The solution is easy : clasp both hand of the child over the ufo egg and show him the yolk, then ask him "does that look like robot part to you?".

That would seem conclusive to us. But I've learned it would only scratch the surface of the rationalization process.

"Current science teaches us that if you break an egg with a baby robot inside, you should see a baby robot and not egg yoke. But isn't it a little closed-minded to assume..."

"Have you seen a baby robot in an egg? No? So how do you know what a baby robot in an egg would look like if you've never seen it before? It's outside your realm of comprehension."


Ugggh... That's as far as I can go. I'm becoming ill.

[jer_j]

Originally Posted by Careyp74

Oh, now that the whole topic is derailed you offer an intelligent basis for your premise? Too late, if this was a thread on JREF, it would be in the AAH bucket by now

He tried with all his might to establish that premise from the start, but the snot-nosed devil beautiful child kept interrupting him and asking him to prove it was a bird. He tried and failed, tried and failed. At the end he only returned, like a dog to its vomit, because thought he had come up with a fail-proof method of spelling it out - but no luck.

Surely some of you here have gone through something similar enough that you can relate?

[Blackwell]

Originally Posted by Aepervius

The solution is easy : clasp both hand of the child over the ufo egg and show him the yolk, then ask him "does that look like robot part to you?".

Of course not. The baby robot is made of nano-bots, which, when hatched, would have assembled themselves into a baby robot form. But you had to go and squash them before they could assemble, and in this non-organized state, they just happen to resemble an uncooked egg. Prove me wrong!

[StevenCalder]

Enjoyed this immensely, Thanks Jer_j.

[Aepervius]

Originally Posted by Blackwell

Of course not. The baby robot is made of nano-bots, which, when hatched, would have assembled themselves into a baby robot form. But you had to go and squash them before they could assemble, and in this non-organized state, they just happen to resemble an uncooked egg. Prove me wrong!

See my previous post after the one you quoted, the goal was not to convince the kid, and as somebody said, it was quite evil .

[thull]

Great story

Two things came to mind while reading the story on what might work as 'proof' without breaking the egg.

Candling, could work to see the shadow of what's inside (depending on thickness of the egg). This will likely just be seen as something is inside of the egg, such as a baby robot.
Magnet, as most kids know robots have some metal parts. This will likely be seen as this robot is not made out of metal or is made of some non-magnetic metal.

Great, now I'll be avoiding omelets till i can figure out whether or not I'll end up as part of the robot insurrection of 2018.

[Audible Click]

Great post jer-j!

[jer_j]

Thanks everybody, for the feedback/complements. It was fun to write.

[sonofgloin]

I can't wait for "The Cad vs The Kid" round two......next time take some help, give me a call and we will sort out this little Pipsqueak Plato.

[ExMinister]

Funny story.

I'm surprised this kid didn't respond to you pointing out that robots don't grow the way humans or living creatures do.

I think I might have asked, when he showed me the picture of the robot at Tommy's house, if he had actually personally seen the robot standing there. That might have led to a lively discussion about what kind of evidence he had that any of these robots actually existed, beyond his friends claiming they did.

Good luck!

[SezMe]

Get back at him by taking a potato out to him and claim it is also a robot egg and force him to disprove it. Revenge - the sweetest emotion.

[apathoid]

Originally Posted by jer_j

The Boy and His Egg

...


* All people mentioned in this work are fictional. Certain connections to real life people or debates may be made by some, but such interpretation is entirely the responsibility of the reader. Adjectives used to describe the boy are solely those of the narrator, representing HIS feeling about the boy, and are not meant as an insult to any living person.

This has an all too familiar ring to it. Nominated.

BTW, you still never proved it was a bird...

[ExMinister]

Ahh, I missed the fictional part in the fine print.

Good story.

[Moochie]

If at all possible, I would have suggested we allow the egg to hatch naturally so that we could both learn something.


M.

[RoboTimbo]

Originally Posted by jer_j

The Boy and His Egg

Did the boy claim to be a scientist?

[jer_j]

Originally Posted by RoboTimbo

Did the boy claim to be a scientist?

Yes... But when pressed for details he said it didn't matter. He laughed condescendingly at the idea anyone would wonder about his credentials, and insisted that the narrator drop the whole thing and judge the the baby robot hypothesis on its own (cough, cough) merits.

He then reiterated the fact that the burden of proof was on the narrator for claiming the egg contained a bird, denied half the claims he'd made earlier, and blamed the narrator for bringing the whole thing up.

The narrator ran back into his house and locked the door, wondering whether the child even cared about whether or not the egg contained a robot. Even a coherent but illogical discussion would have been nice - but instead the boy had lowered himself to making and retracting/denying the existence of various random claims so quickly that it became clear he was purposefully wasting the narrator's time.

Does that answer your question?

[RoboTimbo]

Originally Posted by jer_j

Yes... But when pressed for details he said it didn't matter. He laughed condescendingly at the idea anyone would wonder about his credentials, and insisted that the narrator drop the whole thing and judge the the baby robot hypothesis on its own (cough, cough) merits.

He then reiterated the fact that the burden of proof was on the narrator for claiming the egg contained a bird, denied half the claims he'd made earlier, and blamed the narrator for bringing the whole thing up.

The narrator ran back into his house and locked the door, wondering whether the child even cared about whether or not the egg contained a robot. Even a coherent but illogical discussion would have been nice - but instead the boy had lowered himself to making and retracting/denying the existence of various random claims so quickly that it became clear he was purposefully wasting the narrator's time.

Does that answer your question?

Yes, but I'm sure I'll have another one in the future.

[jer_j]

Originally Posted by Moochie

If at all possible, I would have suggested we allow the egg to hatch naturally so that we could both learn something.

Good point. In the same way, I suggest that we wait for aliens to land on the White House lawn. That too would be a very educational experience.

Of course one of the limits of this story's analogy is that an egg is bound to hatch (unless a child takes it out of its nest), whereas there's no set timeline for the UFO question to be settled.

[jer_j]

Originally Posted by RoboTimbo

Yes, but I'm sure I'll have another one in the future.

No doubt. This has been an endless fount of questions, the least of which has been the actual topic at hand. Which is why I can only suggest that you all run - don't walk - at the sight of children bearing robot eggs.

[Stray Cat]

Originally Posted by SezMe

Get back at him by taking a potato out to him and claim it is also a robot egg and force him to disprove it. Revenge - the sweetest emotion.

Would that make it a sweet potato?

[apathoid]

It seems the boy still thinks that the baby robot is a more plausible theory. Why? Because a local ordinance forbids exotic birds as pets.