Can I get a passport without a SSN?

boyntonstu · 29th October 2009, 08:12 AM

Can I get a passport without a SSN?

http://forum.freestateproject.org/in...?topic=15140.0

Yes! I have a passport and did not provide a ss#. If you read the application, on the back of the last page it states that. the IRS will fine you $500 for failure to disclose the number. The clerk claimed that I need to fill it out. I ended up speaking to a supervisor who pointed to the penalty clause. My response was "no problem, the IRS can fine me $500. I can afford it. Please tell them to send me a bill and in the meantime, process my application. Six weeks later I received my passport. I will say that a friend went with me and turned in their app at the same time. They did disclose and got the goods in two weeks so be prepared for a delay.

There is no law which requires you to have one so there can be no law which requires you to disclose what you're not required to have. No word from the IRS 5 years and one passport renewal later (I did not include a ss# on the renewal app either).

“If you read the application, on the back of the last page it states that. the IRS will fine you $500 for failure to disclose the number.”

Indeed, for tax purposes only; not for passports!

Cleon · 29th October 2009, 08:17 AM

Believe it or not, anonymous people on web forums aren't necessarily 100% accurate.

From http://travel.state.gov/passport/get...irst_830.html:

Quote:

STEP 1: Complete and Submit Form DS-11: Application For A U.S. Passport

Complete Form DS-11: Application for a U.S. Passport. To submit Form DS-11, you:

Must apply in person at an Acceptance Facility or Passport Agency

Must include the additional documentation required by Form DS-11 (See Steps 2-5)

Must not sign the application until instructed to do so by the Acceptance Agent

Must provide your SSN in accordance with 26 U.S.C. 6039E

Notice last line. The code referenced specifically requires the TIN (aka Social Security Number).

boyntonstu · 29th October 2009, 08:22 AM

Originally Posted by Cleon

Believe it or not, anonymous people on web forums aren't necessarily 100% accurate.

From http://travel.state.gov/passport/get...irst_830.html:

Notice last line. The code referenced specifically requires the TIN (aka Social Security Number).

Please show us the connection between the IRS Code and a passport.

drkitten · 29th October 2009, 08:30 AM

Originally Posted by boyntonstu

Please show us the connection between the IRS Code and a passport.

The connection is that the State Department passport regulations cross-reference title 26 (the Internal Revenue Code). Which is not the same as the "IRS code"; there's no mention of the IRS in that particular section at all.

And if you actually read the relevant law, you do not need to provide a TIN. You only need to provide it if you have it. If for some reason you've managed to avoid getting a TIN, you can still get a passport without penalty. (The free state nutcase happened to be right on this one.) But if you have one, they will simply attach your TIN to the passport file anyway and charge you $500 for the extra work they've got to do.

What's the point of making your passport $500 more expensive than it needs to be?

Cleon · 29th October 2009, 08:31 AM

Originally Posted by boyntonstu

Please show us the connection between the IRS Code and a passport.

Excuse me? I just gave you a link to the relevant federal law with the requirement. I have no idea why the requirement is there, but it most assuredly is there.

Cleon · 29th October 2009, 08:33 AM

Originally Posted by drkitten

And if you actually read the relevant law, you do not need to provide a TIN. You only need to provide it if you have it. If for some reason you've managed to avoid getting a TIN, you can still get a passport without penalty. (The free state nutcase happened to be right on this one.) But if you have one, they will simply attach your TIN to the passport file anyway and charge you $500 for the extra work they've got to do.

What's the point of making your passport $500 more expensive than it needs to be?

I did notice the "if you have one" part, but I'm not sure how you'd go about avoiding getting one. They assign it at birth, no?

Fiona · 29th October 2009, 08:34 AM

What is the point of this discussion, please?

drkitten · 29th October 2009, 08:37 AM

Originally Posted by Cleon

I did notice the "if you have one" part, but I'm not sure how you'd go about avoiding getting one. They assign it at birth, no?

No.

Granted, your parents have to be pretty bonkers for you NOT to have a SSN within a year of your birth; in order to claim you as a dependent, you need to have a SSN.

... or you simply need not to be a US citizen and not to have lived in the US.

Cleon · 29th October 2009, 08:41 AM

Originally Posted by drkitten

No.

Granted, your parents have to be pretty bonkers for you NOT to have a SSN within a year of your birth; in order to claim you as a dependent, you need to have a SSN.

Ah, ok. (I have no kids, and obviously I wasn't consulted when my parents got me an SSN. Of course, my parents have never been tax-protesting whackaloons, so it's a non-issue.)

Quote:

... or you simply need not to be a US citizen and not to have lived in the US.

If that's the case, would/could you apply for a US passport in the first place?

GreyICE · 29th October 2009, 09:00 AM

Originally Posted by Cleon

I did notice the "if you have one" part, but I'm not sure how you'd go about avoiding getting one. They assign it at birth, no?

He's a birfer. This is leading up to Kenya.

boyntonstu · 29th October 2009, 09:14 AM

US Passports
Some forms for applying for US Passports (DSP-11 12/87) request a Social Security Number, but don't give enough information in their Privacy Act notice to verify that the Passport office has the authority to request it. There is a reference to "Federal Tax Law" and a misquotation of Section 6039E of the 1986 Internal Revenue Code, claiming that that section requires that you provide your name, mailing address, date of birth, and Social Security Number. The referenced section only requires TIN (SSN), and it only requires that it be sent to the IRS (not to the Passport office). It appears that when you apply for a passport, you can refuse to reveal your SSN to the passport office, and instead mail a notice to the IRS, give only your SSN (other identifying info optional) and notify them that you are applying for a passport. Here is the postscript source for the letter that was used by one contributor. Another reader has converted the letter to Word for the Macintosh. I've now converted it to HTML as well. Other readers have also used this technique successfully.
I had received reports that a new version of the passport application fixed the problems described above. Apparently, these new applications asked for SSN, but stated that failure to provide it wasn't grounds to deny a passport. It warned that the SSN would be used to verify the other information on the form, and processing of the application might be delayed if the number was not provided.
There's another new version (DS-11 03-2005) available now at the State department's web site. It has a different notice that implies (in the same roundabout way) that the SSN is required by the abovementioned laws, and says passports will be refused if the number is not included. People have continued to report that using the letters provided by David Wise result in timely processing.
I applied for a renewal of my passport in July, 2000, and received a new passport in August. I used the 1997 version of the form for Renewal by Mail, which I obtained at the State department's web site, and sent a suitably modified version of Professor Wise's letter. (The letter assumes you are delivering the application to a postal clerk.)

Tax Protesters?

http://cpsr.org/issues/privacy/ssn-government/#passport

The Central Scrutinizer · 29th October 2009, 09:16 AM

I give the government my SSN at every opportunity. I feel it allows them the track me more efficiently.

brodski · 29th October 2009, 09:51 AM

If this is a "tax protest" isn't it the worst one ever, in that it requires you to give the government an extra $500? I bet the IRS hate that.

KingMerv00 · 29th October 2009, 10:41 AM

Stick it to the man. Now the government only got ahold of your birth certificate, address, full name, previous addresses, shoe size....etc etc.

You sure showed them.

drkitten · 29th October 2009, 11:08 AM

Originally Posted by Cleon

If that's the case, would/could you apply for a US passport in the first place?

I do not believe there is a requirement for US citizens, in general, to have SSNs, nor do I think they are required to get them as part of the naturalization process. So if one played one's cards exactly right, one could become a naturalized citizen without an SSN, and then apply for a passport.

Of course, you'd have to forego almost the entire US economy to do it; you couldn't get a job, for example, so you'd need to be stonkin' rich to begin with, and you couldn't invest or even bank your money, so you'd need to put your entire fortune into a great wodge of cash.

I think technically dual nationals are not liable for US taxes on income earned abroad, so you could also be born on US soil (and therefore hold a US passport) while living and working in Ruritania without a SSN. I am not a tax lawyer, though, so don't take that as legal advice.

leftysergeant · 29th October 2009, 12:01 PM

I find it hard now to believe anything you post, dude. You cannot even prove to me that you are a US citizen and entitled to a US passport without a SSN.

Would a Freestater lie on the internet?

Well DUH!

Ladewig · 29th October 2009, 12:18 PM

What is the advantage of not giving a SSN when applying for a passport?

Praktik · 29th October 2009, 12:29 PM

Originally Posted by Ladewig

What is the advantage of not giving a SSN when applying for a passport?

Then you're not giving up a piece of your soul... isn't it obvious??

headscratcher4 · 29th October 2009, 12:34 PM

The fact that he may have got a passport without having to provide a SSN# is all the more reason why I've advocated that SSN# be tatooed across the forehead (along with a bar code, of course) AND that every citizen be required to have a micro chip implanted on their body. That should solve the problem, I should think.

Cleon · 29th October 2009, 12:36 PM

Originally Posted by Ladewig

What is the advantage of not giving a SSN when applying for a passport?

You are, apparently, Sticking it to the Man. And costing yourself $500. And annoying some nameless clerk you've never met.

Eyeron · 29th October 2009, 12:39 PM

That makes you the anti-christ.

dtugg · 29th October 2009, 12:39 PM

Originally Posted by headscratcher4

The fact that he may have got a passport without having to provide a SSN# is all the more reason why I've advocated that SSN# be tatooed across the forehead (along with a bar code, of course) AND that every citizen be required to have a micro chip implanted on their body. That should solve the problem, I should think.

That sounds like an awesome idea. I am going to write Congress and the White House about it immediately.

headscratcher4 · 29th October 2009, 12:41 PM

Originally Posted by Eyeron

That makes you the anti-christ.

No, it merely makes me one of his familiars.

KingMerv00 · 29th October 2009, 01:44 PM

Originally Posted by Ladewig

What is the advantage of not giving a SSN when applying for a passport?

You don't have to carry around that wad of money anymore.

Doubt · 29th October 2009, 02:25 PM

Originally Posted by headscratcher4

The fact that he may have got a passport without having to provide a SSN# is all the more reason why I've advocated that SSN# be tatooed across the forehead (along with a bar code, of course) AND that every citizen be required to have a micro chip implanted on their body. That should solve the problem, I should think.

You forgot that the bar codes all start with 666.

WildCat · 29th October 2009, 02:57 PM

Originally Posted by drkitten

What's the point of making your passport $500 more expensive than it needs to be?

So the government doesn't get the secret number you've been assigned to by, uh, the government.

LostAngeles · 29th October 2009, 03:11 PM

boyontsu, the way you stuck it to The Man has got me bothered and hot. I must now rip open my shirt as it can no longer take the heaving of my bosom and beg for you to just take me, right here, on this subforum. Take me, ravish me with your tax-dodging ways. Press your giving the government an extra $500 bucks up against my soft flesh. Oh boyontsu, I do love the WTF you give me.

Cleon · 29th October 2009, 03:13 PM

Originally Posted by LostAngeles

boyontsu, the way you stuck it to The Man has got me bothered and hot. I must now rip open my shirt as it can no longer take the heaving of my bosom and beg for you to just take me, right here, on this subforum. Take me, ravish me with your tax-dodging ways. Press your giving the government an extra $500 bucks up against my soft flesh. Oh boyontsu, I do love the WTF you give me.

I'll be in my bunk.

Alt+F4 · 29th October 2009, 03:38 PM

Originally Posted by Fiona

What is the point of this discussion, please?

Indeed.

If a person doesn't want to divulge their Social Security number...than don't.

If a person doesn't want to file a federal tax return...than don"t.

Ladewig · 29th October 2009, 03:40 PM

Originally Posted by drkitten

Of course, you'd have to forego almost the entire US economy to do it; you couldn't get a job, for example, so you'd need to be stonkin' rich to begin with, and you couldn't invest or even bank your money, so you'd need to put your entire fortune into a great wodge of cash.
.

Furthermore, many states now require a SSN for drivers' licenses. The legislatures passed the law to crack down on deadbeat dads

dudalb · 29th October 2009, 04:15 PM

Originally Posted by Alt+F4

Indeed.

If a person doesn't want to divulge their Social Security number...than don't.

If a person doesn't want to file a federal tax return...than don"t.

Just be damn sure you have a good lawyer if you do the second.

boyntonstu · 29th October 2009, 05:24 PM

Originally Posted by Alt+F4

Indeed.

If a person doesn't want to divulge their Social Security number...than don't.

If a person doesn't want to file a federal tax return...than don"t.

Exactly!

boyntonstu · 29th October 2009, 05:26 PM

Originally Posted by dudalb

Just be damn sure you have a good lawyer if you do the second.

Is Tom Cryer a good enough attorney?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=psPkblKxdzQ

Fiona · 29th October 2009, 05:28 PM

Is this about not paying tax,then?

fuelair · 29th October 2009, 05:39 PM

Originally Posted by Fiona

Is this about not paying tax,then?

Somehoe it always gets around to not paying tax to the nutters. Love the videos of them being carted of to jail!!!

The Central Scrutinizer · 29th October 2009, 06:26 PM

Originally Posted by LostAngeles

boyontsu, the way you stuck it to The Man has got me bothered and hot. I must now rip open my shirt as it can no longer take the heaving of my bosom and beg for you to just take me, right here, on this subforum. Take me, ravish me with your tax-dodging ways. Press your giving the government an extra $500 bucks up against my soft flesh. Oh boyontsu, I do love the WTF you give me.

I'm the one that gave boyontsu the idea.

Ladewig · 29th October 2009, 08:02 PM

Boyntonstu, what is the advantage of not giving a SSN when applying for a passport?

The Central Scrutinizer · 29th October 2009, 08:04 PM

Originally Posted by Ladewig

Boyntonstu, what is the advantage of not giving a SSN when applying for a passport?

Don't you get it? If you give them your SSN, they'll know who you are.

Fiona · 29th October 2009, 08:13 PM

Er....is that not the point of a passport?

elbe · 29th October 2009, 08:22 PM

No, it's to get you out of this hell hole to where they can't track you anymore... except by the secret spy satellites, but you can avoid them by hiding in caves during the day and only moving at night.

29th October 2009, 08:12 AM	#1
boyntonstu Banned Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Florida Posts: 916	Can I get a passport without a SSN? Can I get a passport without a SSN? http://forum.freestateproject.org/in...?topic=15140.0 Yes! I have a passport and did not provide a ss#. If you read the application, on the back of the last page it states that. the IRS will fine you $500 for failure to disclose the number. The clerk claimed that I need to fill it out. I ended up speaking to a supervisor who pointed to the penalty clause. My response was "no problem, the IRS can fine me $500. I can afford it. Please tell them to send me a bill and in the meantime, process my application. Six weeks later I received my passport. I will say that a friend went with me and turned in their app at the same time. They did disclose and got the goods in two weeks so be prepared for a delay. There is no law which requires you to have one so there can be no law which requires you to disclose what you're not required to have. No word from the IRS 5 years and one passport renewal later (I did not include a ss# on the renewal app either). “If you read the application, on the back of the last page it states that. the IRS will fine you $500 for failure to disclose the number.” Indeed, for tax purposes only; not for passports!

29th October 2009, 08:17 AM	#2
Cleon King of the Pod People Moderator Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Atlanta, GA Posts: 20,531	Believe it or not, anonymous people on web forums aren't necessarily 100% accurate. From http://travel.state.gov/passport/get...irst_830.html: Quote: STEP 1: Complete and Submit Form DS-11: Application For A U.S. Passport Complete Form DS-11: Application for a U.S. Passport. To submit Form DS-11, you: Must apply in person at an Acceptance Facility or Passport Agency Must include the additional documentation required by Form DS-11 (See Steps 2-5) Must not sign the application until instructed to do so by the Acceptance Agent Must provide your SSN in accordance with 26 U.S.C. 6039E Notice last line. The code referenced specifically requires the TIN (aka Social Security Number).
	__________________ "People like me are what stand between us and Auschwitz." - Newt Gingrich

29th October 2009, 08:31 AM	#5
Cleon King of the Pod People Moderator Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Atlanta, GA Posts: 20,531	Originally Posted by boyntonstu Please show us the connection between the IRS Code and a passport. Excuse me? I just gave you a link to the relevant federal law with the requirement. I have no idea why the requirement is there, but it most assuredly is there.
	__________________ "People like me are what stand between us and Auschwitz." - Newt Gingrich

29th October 2009, 08:33 AM	#6
Cleon King of the Pod People Moderator Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Atlanta, GA Posts: 20,531	Originally Posted by drkitten And if you actually read the relevant law, you do not need to provide a TIN. You only need to provide it if you have it. If for some reason you've managed to avoid getting a TIN, you can still get a passport without penalty. (The free state nutcase happened to be right on this one.) But if you have one, they will simply attach your TIN to the passport file anyway and charge you $500 for the extra work they've got to do. What's the point of making your passport $500 more expensive than it needs to be? I did notice the "if you have one" part, but I'm not sure how you'd go about avoiding getting one. They assign it at birth, no?
	__________________ "People like me are what stand between us and Auschwitz." - Newt Gingrich

29th October 2009, 08:34 AM	#7
Fiona Guest Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 8,238	What is the point of this discussion, please?
Fiona Guest Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 8,238

29th October 2009, 08:22 AM	#3
boyntonstu Banned Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Florida Posts: 916	Originally Posted by Cleon Believe it or not, anonymous people on web forums aren't necessarily 100% accurate. From http://travel.state.gov/passport/get...irst_830.html: Notice last line. The code referenced specifically requires the TIN (aka Social Security Number). Please show us the connection between the IRS Code and a passport.

29th October 2009, 08:30 AM	#4
drkitten Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Wits' End Posts: 21,647	Originally Posted by boyntonstu Please show us the connection between the IRS Code and a passport. The connection is that the State Department passport regulations cross-reference title 26 (the Internal Revenue Code). Which is not the same as the "IRS code"; there's no mention of the IRS in that particular section at all. And if you actually read the relevant law, you do not need to provide a TIN. You only need to provide it if you have it. If for some reason you've managed to avoid getting a TIN, you can still get a passport without penalty. (The free state nutcase happened to be right on this one.) But if you have one, they will simply attach your TIN to the passport file anyway and charge you $500 for the extra work they've got to do. What's the point of making your passport $500 more expensive than it needs to be?

29th October 2009, 08:37 AM	#8
drkitten Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Wits' End Posts: 21,647	Originally Posted by Cleon I did notice the "if you have one" part, but I'm not sure how you'd go about avoiding getting one. They assign it at birth, no? No. Granted, your parents have to be pretty bonkers for you NOT to have a SSN within a year of your birth; in order to claim you as a dependent, you need to have a SSN. ... or you simply need not to be a US citizen and not to have lived in the US.

29th October 2009, 08:41 AM	#9
Cleon King of the Pod People Moderator Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Atlanta, GA Posts: 20,531	Originally Posted by drkitten No. Granted, your parents have to be pretty bonkers for you NOT to have a SSN within a year of your birth; in order to claim you as a dependent, you need to have a SSN. Ah, ok. (I have no kids, and obviously I wasn't consulted when my parents got me an SSN. Of course, my parents have never been tax-protesting whackaloons, so it's a non-issue.) Quote: ... or you simply need not to be a US citizen and not to have lived in the US. If that's the case, would/could you apply for a US passport in the first place?
	__________________ "People like me are what stand between us and Auschwitz." - Newt Gingrich

29th October 2009, 09:00 AM	#10
GreyICE Guest Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 7,173	Originally Posted by Cleon I did notice the "if you have one" part, but I'm not sure how you'd go about avoiding getting one. They assign it at birth, no? He's a birfer. This is leading up to Kenya.
GreyICE Guest Join Date: Mar 2008 Posts: 7,173

29th October 2009, 09:14 AM	#11
boyntonstu Banned Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Florida Posts: 916	US Passports Some forms for applying for US Passports (DSP-11 12/87) request a Social Security Number, but don't give enough information in their Privacy Act notice to verify that the Passport office has the authority to request it. There is a reference to "Federal Tax Law" and a misquotation of Section 6039E of the 1986 Internal Revenue Code, claiming that that section requires that you provide your name, mailing address, date of birth, and Social Security Number. The referenced section only requires TIN (SSN), and it only requires that it be sent to the IRS (not to the Passport office). It appears that when you apply for a passport, you can refuse to reveal your SSN to the passport office, and instead mail a notice to the IRS, give only your SSN (other identifying info optional) and notify them that you are applying for a passport. Here is the postscript source for the letter that was used by one contributor. Another reader has converted the letter to Word for the Macintosh. I've now converted it to HTML as well. Other readers have also used this technique successfully. I had received reports that a new version of the passport application fixed the problems described above. Apparently, these new applications asked for SSN, but stated that failure to provide it wasn't grounds to deny a passport. It warned that the SSN would be used to verify the other information on the form, and processing of the application might be delayed if the number was not provided. There's another new version (DS-11 03-2005) available now at the State department's web site. It has a different notice that implies (in the same roundabout way) that the SSN is required by the abovementioned laws, and says passports will be refused if the number is not included. People have continued to report that using the letters provided by David Wise result in timely processing. I applied for a renewal of my passport in July, 2000, and received a new passport in August. I used the 1997 version of the form for Renewal by Mail, which I obtained at the State department's web site, and sent a suitably modified version of Professor Wise's letter. (The letter assumes you are delivering the application to a postal clerk.) Tax Protesters? http://cpsr.org/issues/privacy/ssn-government/#passport

29th October 2009, 09:16 AM	#12
The Central Scrutinizer Penultimate Amazing Pither Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: The White Zone Posts: 42,277	I give the government my SSN at every opportunity. I feel it allows them the track me more efficiently.
	__________________ If I see somebody with a gun on a plane? I'll kill him.

29th October 2009, 09:51 AM	#13
brodski Tea-Time toad Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 15,080	If this is a "tax protest" isn't it the worst one ever, in that it requires you to give the government an extra $500? I bet the IRS hate that.
brodski Tea-Time toad Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 15,080

29th October 2009, 10:41 AM	#14
KingMerv00 Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Philadelphia, PA...USA Posts: 14,482	Stick it to the man. Now the government only got ahold of your birth certificate, address, full name, previous addresses, shoe size....etc etc. You sure showed them.
	__________________ If man came from dust, why is there still dust?

29th October 2009, 11:08 AM	#15
drkitten Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: Wits' End Posts: 21,647	Originally Posted by Cleon If that's the case, would/could you apply for a US passport in the first place? I do not believe there is a requirement for US citizens, in general, to have SSNs, nor do I think they are required to get them as part of the naturalization process. So if one played one's cards exactly right, one could become a naturalized citizen without an SSN, and then apply for a passport. Of course, you'd have to forego almost the entire US economy to do it; you couldn't get a job, for example, so you'd need to be stonkin' rich to begin with, and you couldn't invest or even bank your money, so you'd need to put your entire fortune into a great wodge of cash. I think technically dual nationals are not liable for US taxes on income earned abroad, so you could also be born on US soil (and therefore hold a US passport) while living and working in Ruritania without a SSN. I am not a tax lawyer, though, so don't take that as legal advice.

29th October 2009, 12:01 PM	#16
leftysergeant Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Spanaway WA Posts: 18,613	I find it hard now to believe anything you post, dude. You cannot even prove to me that you are a US citizen and entitled to a US passport without a SSN. Would a Freestater lie on the internet? Well DUH!

29th October 2009, 12:18 PM	#17
Ladewig Hipster alien Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: not measurable Posts: 16,810	What is the advantage of not giving a SSN when applying for a passport?
	__________________ Is the JREF message board training wheels for people who hope to one day troll other message boards? It is not that hard to get us to believe you. We are not the major leagues or even the minor leagues. We are Pee-Wee baseball. If you love striking out 10-year-olds, then you'll love trolling our board.

29th October 2009, 12:29 PM	#18
Praktik Illuminator Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Tee Dot Posts: 4,244	Originally Posted by Ladewig What is the advantage of not giving a SSN when applying for a passport? Then you're not giving up a piece of your soul... isn't it obvious??
	__________________ “ it has become my conviction that things mean pretty much what we want them to mean. We’ll pluck significance from the least consequential happenstance if it suits us and happily ignore the most flagrantly obvious symmetry between separate aspects of our lives if it threatens some cherished prejudice or cosily comforting belief" -Iain Banks

29th October 2009, 12:34 PM	#19
headscratcher4 Philosopher Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: USA Posts: 7,749	The fact that he may have got a passport without having to provide a SSN# is all the more reason why I've advocated that SSN# be tatooed across the forehead (along with a bar code, of course) AND that every citizen be required to have a micro chip implanted on their body. That should solve the problem, I should think.
	__________________ Weaseling out of things is important to learn. It's what separates us from the animals ... except the weasel. -- Homer Simpson

29th October 2009, 12:36 PM	#20
Cleon King of the Pod People Moderator Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Atlanta, GA Posts: 20,531	Originally Posted by Ladewig What is the advantage of not giving a SSN when applying for a passport? You are, apparently, Sticking it to the Man. And costing yourself $500. And annoying some nameless clerk you've never met.
	__________________ "People like me are what stand between us and Auschwitz." - Newt Gingrich

29th October 2009, 12:39 PM	#21
Eyeron Guest Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 1,774	That makes you the anti-christ.
Eyeron Guest Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 1,774

29th October 2009, 12:39 PM	#22
dtugg Banned Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: NWO headquarters Posts: 7,898	Originally Posted by headscratcher4 The fact that he may have got a passport without having to provide a SSN# is all the more reason why I've advocated that SSN# be tatooed across the forehead (along with a bar code, of course) AND that every citizen be required to have a micro chip implanted on their body. That should solve the problem, I should think. That sounds like an awesome idea. I am going to write Congress and the White House about it immediately.

29th October 2009, 12:41 PM	#23
headscratcher4 Philosopher Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: USA Posts: 7,749	Originally Posted by Eyeron That makes you the anti-christ. No, it merely makes me one of his familiars.
	__________________ Weaseling out of things is important to learn. It's what separates us from the animals ... except the weasel. -- Homer Simpson

29th October 2009, 01:44 PM	#24
KingMerv00 Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Philadelphia, PA...USA Posts: 14,482	Originally Posted by Ladewig What is the advantage of not giving a SSN when applying for a passport? You don't have to carry around that wad of money anymore.
	__________________ If man came from dust, why is there still dust?

29th October 2009, 02:25 PM	#25
Doubt Philosopher Join Date: Apr 2002 Posts: 5,447	Originally Posted by headscratcher4 The fact that he may have got a passport without having to provide a SSN# is all the more reason why I've advocated that SSN# be tatooed across the forehead (along with a bar code, of course) AND that every citizen be required to have a micro chip implanted on their body. That should solve the problem, I should think. You forgot that the bar codes all start with 666.
Doubt Philosopher Join Date: Apr 2002 Posts: 5,447	__________________ Doubt world tour locations: Mostly home for now. No international travel scheduled other than the Galapagos trip in March. Disclaimer: Not a high energy scientist!

29th October 2009, 02:57 PM	#26
WildCat NWO Master Conspirator Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Albany Park, Chicago Posts: 49,051	Originally Posted by drkitten What's the point of making your passport $500 more expensive than it needs to be? So the government doesn't get the secret number you've been assigned to by, uh, the government.

29th October 2009, 03:11 PM	#27
LostAngeles Anti-WM Jihadist Join Date: May 2004 Location: Having a cup of tea. Posts: 10,159	boyontsu, the way you stuck it to The Man has got me bothered and hot. I must now rip open my shirt as it can no longer take the heaving of my bosom and beg for you to just take me, right here, on this subforum. Take me, ravish me with your tax-dodging ways. Press your giving the government an extra $500 bucks up against my soft flesh. Oh boyontsu, I do love the WTF you give me.
	__________________ "There is also a likelihood that the settlement will fall between two biomes, potentially hazardous if the player expects a peaceful oceanside meadow, without realizing the ocean is full of amphibious zombie whales." - Dwarf Fortress Wik

29th October 2009, 03:13 PM	#28
Cleon King of the Pod People Moderator Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Atlanta, GA Posts: 20,531	Originally Posted by LostAngeles boyontsu, the way you stuck it to The Man has got me bothered and hot. I must now rip open my shirt as it can no longer take the heaving of my bosom and beg for you to just take me, right here, on this subforum. Take me, ravish me with your tax-dodging ways. Press your giving the government an extra $500 bucks up against my soft flesh. Oh boyontsu, I do love the WTF you give me. I'll be in my bunk.
	__________________ "People like me are what stand between us and Auschwitz." - Newt Gingrich

29th October 2009, 03:38 PM	#29
Alt+F4 diabolical globalist Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Department of Abandoned Places Posts: 9,780	Originally Posted by Fiona What is the point of this discussion, please? Indeed. If a person doesn't want to divulge their Social Security number...than don't. If a person doesn't want to file a federal tax return...than don"t.
	__________________ "My folks touched a lot of kids." - Jerry Sandusky

29th October 2009, 03:40 PM	#30
Ladewig Hipster alien Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: not measurable Posts: 16,810	Originally Posted by drkitten Of course, you'd have to forego almost the entire US economy to do it; you couldn't get a job, for example, so you'd need to be stonkin' rich to begin with, and you couldn't invest or even bank your money, so you'd need to put your entire fortune into a great wodge of cash. . Furthermore, many states now require a SSN for drivers' licenses. The legislatures passed the law to crack down on deadbeat dads
	__________________ Is the JREF message board training wheels for people who hope to one day troll other message boards? It is not that hard to get us to believe you. We are not the major leagues or even the minor leagues. We are Pee-Wee baseball. If you love striking out 10-year-olds, then you'll love trolling our board.

29th October 2009, 04:15 PM	#31
dudalb Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 22,843	Originally Posted by Alt+F4 Indeed. If a person doesn't want to divulge their Social Security number...than don't. If a person doesn't want to file a federal tax return...than don"t. Just be damn sure you have a good lawyer if you do the second.

29th October 2009, 05:24 PM	#32
boyntonstu Banned Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Florida Posts: 916	Originally Posted by Alt+F4 Indeed. If a person doesn't want to divulge their Social Security number...than don't. If a person doesn't want to file a federal tax return...than don"t. Exactly!

29th October 2009, 05:26 PM	#33
boyntonstu Banned Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Florida Posts: 916	Originally Posted by dudalb Just be damn sure you have a good lawyer if you do the second. Is Tom Cryer a good enough attorney? http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=psPkblKxdzQ

29th October 2009, 05:28 PM	#34
Fiona Guest Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 8,238	Is this about not paying tax,then?
Fiona Guest Join Date: Dec 2007 Posts: 8,238

29th October 2009, 05:39 PM	#35
fuelair Cythraul Enfys Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 28,945	Originally Posted by Fiona Is this about not paying tax,then? Somehoe it always gets around to not paying tax to the nutters. Love the videos of them being carted of to jail!!!
fuelair Cythraul Enfys Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 28,945	__________________ There is no problem so great that it cannot be fixed by small explosives carefully placed. Wash this space! We fight for the Lady Babylon!!!