Yet another nail in the Apollo Hoax coffin

Obviousman · 5th November 2009, 03:06 AM

Apollo Hoaxers continue their retreat into denial as more evidence (as if there weren't enough already) as to the reality of the Apollo lunar landings is put forward:

Dave Rogers · 5th November 2009, 03:24 AM

Nice. What's the source?

Dave

McHrozni · 5th November 2009, 03:24 AM

Considering how many nails is in that coffin already, the whole thing probably has more nails in it than everything else combined.

We should move to welds on the coffin.

Nicely done, though

McHrozni

Obviousman · 5th November 2009, 03:34 AM

Originally Posted by Dave Rogers

Nice. What's the source?

Dave

Latest release of the LRO images, this time at 50 km altitude.

Edx · 5th November 2009, 04:54 AM

F-a-k-e

Flaherty · 5th November 2009, 04:57 AM

You can also seek the footprints from the landing to the equipment.

There isn't enough room for more nails in the hoax coffin. In fact, the grave has been paved over and a mall built on top of it.

twinstead · 5th November 2009, 05:32 AM

It appears the coffin is made out of nails

plumjam · 5th November 2009, 05:58 AM

Photoshop

Trojan_Jockey · 5th November 2009, 06:28 AM

Problem is, you can't use evidence to destroy a theory that says "all evidence that contradicts this theory is fake".

Klimax · 5th November 2009, 06:41 AM

Originally Posted by McHrozni

Considering how many nails is in that coffin already, the whole thing probably has more nails in it than everything else combined.

We should move to welds on the coffin.

Nicely done, though

McHrozni

You want to weld something has been nailed into nothingness???

Alferd_Packer · 5th November 2009, 08:23 AM

Originally Posted by plumjam

Photoshop

Nailshop

twinstead · 5th November 2009, 08:40 AM

Originally Posted by Alferd_Packer

Nailshop

Ah, so that Vietnamese lady who does my sister's manicures are in on it. I KNEW it!

Random · 5th November 2009, 05:57 PM

You guys actually believe the moon is real? Its only bamboo scaffolding with a canvas cover. They ran out of money during construction so they only finished half of it, that's why its "tidal locked". If we never see the back half, we will never know the truth.

McHrozni · 5th November 2009, 11:03 PM

Originally Posted by Klimax

You want to weld something has been nailed into nothingness???

Why would that be a problem? There should still be some coffin there anyway.

McHrozni

Obviousman · 6th November 2009, 12:49 AM

The coffin is a hologram! You people are sheeple!

BTMO · 6th November 2009, 01:50 AM

I thought the reptoid aliens inhabited the moon, and the only reason we hadn't gone there was because we'd been told not to?

I have real trouble with mutually exclusive conspiracies.

DavidJames · 6th November 2009, 06:54 AM

Originally Posted by Edx

F-a-k-e

No, the photo is real, but it a photo of some place near area 51

twinstead · 6th November 2009, 07:03 AM

I suspect in my children's lifetime at least Apollo 11's site will be a national monument with tours flying in from Earth. What's sad is that there are probably Apollo HBs who STILL will believe it never happened.

fromdownunder · 6th November 2009, 03:06 PM

Originally Posted by twinstead

I suspect in my children's lifetime at least Apollo 11's site will be a national monument with tours flying in from Earth. What's sad is that there are probably Apollo HBs who STILL will believe it never happened.

They will still only be going to the Nevada Desert, or it will be a Hologramic FAKE!!! After all, I have been to Disneyland, and been on Star Tours - I know it's fake.

Norm

shemp · 7th November 2009, 01:02 PM

I see Bigfoot in the photo.

Dcdrac · 9th February 2012, 03:32 AM

wow

http://www.nasa.gov/mission_pages/LR...llo-sites.html

What more evidence is needed?

when the Chiense or Indians get there maybe they could be asked to take pictures for us

SpitfireIX · 9th February 2012, 03:49 AM

Originally Posted by Dcdrac

wow

http://www.nasa.gov/mission_pages/LR...llo-sites.html

What more evidence is needed?

when the Chiense or Indians get there maybe they could be asked to take pictures for us

"NASA faked the images."

"The hardware was planted by unmanned missions."

"These photos are clear evidence of an extraterrestrial civilization on the moon."

Dcdrac · 9th February 2012, 03:59 AM

Originally Posted by SpitfireIX

"NASA faked the images."

"The hardware was planted by unmanned missions."

"These photos are clear evidence of an extraterrestrial civilization on the moon."

oh yes I forgot we never went there did we.......it is beyond mere human abilites.........

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zGNryrsT7OI

Nice one Spitfire....

Redtail · 9th February 2012, 04:00 AM

Originally Posted by Dcdrac

wow

http://www.nasa.gov/mission_pages/LR...llo-sites.html

What more evidence is needed?

when the Chiense or Indians get there maybe they could be asked to take pictures for us

My hope is that the Chinese get there, land near Eagle, and one of them yells, " Hey! The conspiracy theories were right! This thing's made of cardboard!!! Look! You can see the footprints of the guy who set it up!"

Jack by the hedge · 9th February 2012, 07:00 AM

Originally Posted by Klimax

You want to weld something has been nailed into nothingness???

You can't weld wood. It's ready to be welded together when the whole thing is a solid mass of nails.

Myron Proudfoot · 9th February 2012, 07:01 AM

Originally Posted by twinstead

It appears the coffin is made out of nails

that's how it gets thru the Van Halen belt!

Dcdrac · 9th February 2012, 07:54 AM

The Smurfs did it they got to the moon first and with their co conspirators the muppets faked the human moon landings.....for various nefarious, evil, ill defined and thought out purposes linked to the supply of lizards

MG1962 · 9th February 2012, 08:05 AM

Eugen Cernan was interviewed about these photos recently and the imaging team asked him if recalled which way the front tires were pointing when he parked the rover for the last time.

He said, "I think about 40 degrees to the left"

Their response "Yep that's right"

Ya gotta love technology

JayUtah · 9th February 2012, 10:14 AM

Originally Posted by SpitfireIX

"NASA faked the images."

"The hardware was planted by unmanned missions."

"These photos are clear evidence of an extraterrestrial civilization on the moon."

Indeed the Moon-related conspiracy theories are a mass of contradictions and speculations. You may recall the guy in the U.K., Cosmic Dave, who manages to advocate all of them simultaneously: i.e., the Apollo astronauts never went to the Moon -- but while they were there they found evidence of aliens.

In the manner of the ubiquitous goalpost-shifting, it's been fun to watch the conspiracy crowd say, "Why don't we just send a spacecraft to photograph the landing sites?" back when such a thing seemed improbable. Then when we send the requested spacecraft and it sends back the photos, they immediately cry, "Photoshopped!"

Alferd_Packer · 9th February 2012, 11:49 AM

The coffin has shattered from all the nails and this zombie thread has risen from the grave.

twinstead · 9th February 2012, 02:57 PM

Originally Posted by Alferd_Packer

The coffin has shattered from all the nails and this zombie thread has risen from the grave.

I suspect it might want to eat our brains

Corsair 115 · 9th February 2012, 10:32 PM

Originally Posted by twinstead

I suspect it might want to eat our brains

Well, it already has eaten the brains of those who believe in the conspiracy theory that the lunar landings were faked.

Anders Lindman · 10th February 2012, 12:37 AM

Why is the ground around the descend stage so black? And in the closeup the ground is no longer black: http://www.nasa.gov/images/content/5..._ap14_area.jpg

nomuse · 10th February 2012, 12:47 AM

Originally Posted by Anders Lindman

Why is the ground around the descend stage so black? And in the closeup the ground is no longer black: http://www.nasa.gov/images/content/5..._ap14_area.jpg

Wow.

Now I understand conspiracy believers even better.

BaaBaa · 10th February 2012, 02:15 AM

Originally Posted by Anders Lindman

Why is the ground around the descend stage so black? And in the closeup the ground is no longer black: http://www.nasa.gov/images/content/5..._ap14_area.jpg

Jimminy frikkin' crickets....

FatFreddy88 · 10th February 2012, 05:50 AM

Those pictures of the alleged landing sites are fakeable so they aren't proof of anything and they don't make the mountain of hoax evidence go away.
http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/show...64&postcount=1

Apollo was a hoax.

threadworm · 10th February 2012, 06:03 AM

Originally Posted by Anders Lindman

Why is the ground around the descend stage so black? And in the closeup the ground is no longer black: http://www.nasa.gov/images/content/5..._ap14_area.jpg

It's not confusing.

There are two possiblities.

1) They are two different photographs taken under different lighting conditions or, more likely

2) The main photograph has had the contrast levels adjusted to enhance the darkened areas of disturbed ground. That is what the dark patches are - disturbed ground. You can very easily test this by using a photo editor (such as the free GIMP package, or photoshop) to select the enlarged inset and alter the levels in it to make it darker. it takes no time at all to reproduce exactly the effect in main picture.

And no, this does not mean NASA is faking anything.

SpitfireIX · 10th February 2012, 06:34 AM

Originally Posted by FatFreddy88

Those pictures of the alleged landing sites are fakeable so they aren't proof of anything. . .

Do I win the million dollars?

Originally Posted by FatFreddy88

. . . and they don't make the mountain of hoax evidence go away.
http://www.spurstalk.com/forums/show...64&postcount=1

There is no mountain of hoax evidence; merely the ignorant expectations of conspiracists. All the assertions in the linked post have been debunked ad nauseam. So how about presenting some orginal claims, instead of just parroting those of others.

Originally Posted by FatFreddy88

Apollo was a hoax.

No.

Jack by the hedge · 10th February 2012, 06:42 AM

The moon is fake. A fleet of black helicopters carry a huge cardboard cutout picture of a moon across the sky every night.

If you have any lingering questions about this undoubted truth, the answer is 'Photoshop, sheeple'.

Happy to help.

JayUtah · 10th February 2012, 07:23 AM

Originally Posted by Anders Lindman

Why is the ground around the descend stage so black? And in the closeup the ground is no longer black: http://www.nasa.gov/images/content/5..._ap14_area.jpg

It's an artifact of how the different images in different bands are "stacked" and filtered to create a final image approximating visual photography. Space cameras do not operate the same way as ordinary cameras which capture a single image consisting of a broad band of visible wavelengths. Cameras intended for scientific use in space capture images only in a set of narrowly-defined wavelengths. This allows scientists to combine those wavelengths algebraically to make more detailed observations than would otherwise be available.

5th November 2009, 03:06 AM	#1
Obviousman Muse Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: NSW, Australia Posts: 652	Yet another nail in the Apollo Hoax coffin Apollo Hoaxers continue their retreat into denial as more evidence (as if there weren't enough already) as to the reality of the Apollo lunar landings is put forward:
	__________________ Any time it can be proved that one of my studies is wrong, I am more eager than anyone to acknowledge AND CORRECT IT. Jack White Little White Lies.......

5th November 2009, 03:24 AM	#2
Dave Rogers Bandaged ice that stampedes inexpensively through a scribbled morning waving necessary ankles Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: In a world lit only by fire. Posts: 17,894	Nice. What's the source? Dave
	__________________ "We will punish the murderer together. Our punishment will be more generosity, more tolerance and more democracy." - Fabian Stang, Mayor of Oslo SSKCAS, covert member

5th November 2009, 03:24 AM	#3
McHrozni Illuminator Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 3,554	Considering how many nails is in that coffin already, the whole thing probably has more nails in it than everything else combined. We should move to welds on the coffin. Nicely done, though McHrozni
McHrozni Illuminator Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 3,554

5th November 2009, 03:34 AM	#4
Obviousman Muse Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: NSW, Australia Posts: 652	Originally Posted by Dave Rogers Nice. What's the source? Dave Latest release of the LRO images, this time at 50 km altitude.
	__________________ Any time it can be proved that one of my studies is wrong, I am more eager than anyone to acknowledge AND CORRECT IT. Jack White Little White Lies.......

5th November 2009, 04:54 AM	#5
Edx Illuminator Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 4,242	F-a-k-e
Edx Illuminator Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 4,242	__________________ http://www.youtube.com/user/TheSkepticalIdealist Last edited by Edx; 5th November 2009 at 04:55 AM.

5th November 2009, 04:57 AM	#6
Flaherty Critical Thinker Join Date: Aug 2001 Posts: 292	You can also seek the footprints from the landing to the equipment. There isn't enough room for more nails in the hoax coffin. In fact, the grave has been paved over and a mall built on top of it.
Flaherty Critical Thinker Join Date: Aug 2001 Posts: 292	__________________ "After all, who of us in our lives hasn't set fire to some great public building?" -- Graham Chapman

5th November 2009, 05:32 AM	#7
twinstead Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Big corner office in NWO Towers Posts: 11,572	It appears the coffin is made out of nails
	__________________ You are not entitled to your opinion. You are entitled to your INFORMED opinion. No one is entitled to be ignorant. -- Harlan Ellison

5th November 2009, 05:58 AM	#8
plumjam Banned Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Valencia, Spain Posts: 7,837	Photoshop

5th November 2009, 06:28 AM	#9
Trojan_Jockey Critical Thinker Join Date: Jun 2008 Posts: 276	Problem is, you can't use evidence to destroy a theory that says "all evidence that contradicts this theory is fake".

5th November 2009, 06:41 AM	#10
Klimax NWO cyborg (3930K inside) Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Starship Wanderer - DS9 Posts: 7,882	Originally Posted by McHrozni Considering how many nails is in that coffin already, the whole thing probably has more nails in it than everything else combined. We should move to welds on the coffin. Nicely done, though McHrozni You want to weld something has been nailed into nothingness???
	__________________ ModBorg Engine: Ibalgin 400

5th November 2009, 08:23 AM	#11
Alferd_Packer Philosopher Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 7,191	Originally Posted by plumjam Photoshop Nailshop
	__________________ No laws of physics were broken in the writing of this post

5th November 2009, 08:40 AM	#12
twinstead Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Big corner office in NWO Towers Posts: 11,572	Originally Posted by Alferd_Packer Nailshop Ah, so that Vietnamese lady who does my sister's manicures are in on it. I KNEW it!
	__________________ You are not entitled to your opinion. You are entitled to your INFORMED opinion. No one is entitled to be ignorant. -- Harlan Ellison

5th November 2009, 05:57 PM	#13
Random Master Poster Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Massachusetts Posts: 2,458	You guys actually believe the moon is real? Its only bamboo scaffolding with a canvas cover. They ran out of money during construction so they only finished half of it, that's why its "tidal locked". If we never see the back half, we will never know the truth.
	__________________ ...So, the next time you find yourself desperately Googling for some factual example that proves your argument is right, and failing to find even one, stop. See if you can put the brakes on and actually say, out loud, "Wait a second. If the things I'm saying in order to bolster my argument are consistently wrong, then maybe my argument is also wrong." -Cracked

5th November 2009, 11:03 PM	#14
McHrozni Illuminator Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 3,554	Originally Posted by Klimax You want to weld something has been nailed into nothingness??? Why would that be a problem? There should still be some coffin there anyway. McHrozni
McHrozni Illuminator Join Date: Jun 2009 Posts: 3,554

6th November 2009, 12:49 AM	#15
Obviousman Muse Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: NSW, Australia Posts: 652	The coffin is a hologram! You people are sheeple!
	__________________ Any time it can be proved that one of my studies is wrong, I am more eager than anyone to acknowledge AND CORRECT IT. Jack White Little White Lies.......

6th November 2009, 01:50 AM	#16
BTMO Overlord of the Underthings Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Wellington, New Zealand. Posts: 2,343	I thought the reptoid aliens inhabited the moon, and the only reason we hadn't gone there was because we'd been told not to? I have real trouble with mutually exclusive conspiracies.
	__________________ Insert pithy saying here

6th November 2009, 06:54 AM	#17
DavidJames Philosopher Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Front Range, CO Posts: 7,083	Originally Posted by Edx F-a-k-e No, the photo is real, but it a photo of some place near area 51
	__________________ I will no longer respond to those who choose to have tools of murder as their avatars. Everyone is a skeptic except, of course, for the stuff that they believe Beaver Hateman: Is your argument that human life loses value proportionate to the number of humans available? Malcolm Kirkpatrick: That's part of the argument. Value is determined by supply and demand.

6th November 2009, 07:03 AM	#18
twinstead Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Big corner office in NWO Towers Posts: 11,572	I suspect in my children's lifetime at least Apollo 11's site will be a national monument with tours flying in from Earth. What's sad is that there are probably Apollo HBs who STILL will believe it never happened.
	__________________ You are not entitled to your opinion. You are entitled to your INFORMED opinion. No one is entitled to be ignorant. -- Harlan Ellison

6th November 2009, 03:06 PM	#19
fromdownunder Illuminator Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 3,091	Originally Posted by twinstead I suspect in my children's lifetime at least Apollo 11's site will be a national monument with tours flying in from Earth. What's sad is that there are probably Apollo HBs who STILL will believe it never happened. They will still only be going to the Nevada Desert, or it will be a Hologramic FAKE!!! After all, I have been to Disneyland, and been on Star Tours - I know it's fake. Norm

7th November 2009, 01:02 PM	#20
shemp Timothy, Timothy, where on earth did you go? Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: trapped in a cave-in with Joe Posts: 12,884	I see Bigfoot in the photo.
	__________________ Church on Sunday, sleep and nod Tryin' to duck the wrath of God Preacher's fillin' us with fright Tryin' to tell us what he thinks is right He really got to be some kind of nut (I can't use it!) Tryin' to make it real - compared to what?

9th February 2012, 03:32 AM	#21
Dcdrac Illuminator Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 3,665	wow http://www.nasa.gov/mission_pages/LR...llo-sites.html What more evidence is needed? when the Chiense or Indians get there maybe they could be asked to take pictures for us
Dcdrac Illuminator Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 3,665

9th February 2012, 03:49 AM	#22
SpitfireIX Master Poster Join Date: May 2007 Location: Fort Wayne, Indiana, USA Posts: 2,830	Originally Posted by Dcdrac wow http://www.nasa.gov/mission_pages/LR...llo-sites.html What more evidence is needed? when the Chiense or Indians get there maybe they could be asked to take pictures for us "NASA faked the images." "The hardware was planted by unmanned missions." "These photos are clear evidence of an extraterrestrial civilization on the moon."
	__________________ Handy responses to conspiracy theorists' claims: 1) "I am not able rightly to apprehend the kind of confusion of ideas that could provoke such a question." --Charles Babbage 2) "This isn't right. This isn't even wrong." --Wolfgang Pauli 3) "You keep using that word. I do not think it means what you think it means." --Inigo Montoya

9th February 2012, 03:59 AM	#23
Dcdrac Illuminator Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 3,665	Originally Posted by SpitfireIX "NASA faked the images." "The hardware was planted by unmanned missions." "These photos are clear evidence of an extraterrestrial civilization on the moon." oh yes I forgot we never went there did we.......it is beyond mere human abilites......... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zGNryrsT7OI Nice one Spitfire....
Dcdrac Illuminator Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 3,665

9th February 2012, 04:00 AM	#24
Redtail Philosopher Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 9,303	Originally Posted by Dcdrac wow http://www.nasa.gov/mission_pages/LR...llo-sites.html What more evidence is needed? when the Chiense or Indians get there maybe they could be asked to take pictures for us My hope is that the Chinese get there, land near Eagle, and one of them yells, " Hey! The conspiracy theories were right! This thing's made of cardboard!!! Look! You can see the footprints of the guy who set it up!"
Redtail Philosopher Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 9,303	__________________ AVENGERS!!!.. Turn off the dark! Last edited by Redtail; 9th February 2012 at 04:01 AM.

9th February 2012, 07:00 AM	#25
Jack by the hedge Safely Ignored Join Date: Oct 2009 Posts: 5,407	Originally Posted by Klimax You want to weld something has been nailed into nothingness??? You can't weld wood. It's ready to be welded together when the whole thing is a solid mass of nails.

9th February 2012, 07:01 AM	#26
Myron Proudfoot Muse Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Washington DC area. Posts: 959	Originally Posted by twinstead It appears the coffin is made out of nails that's how it gets thru the Van Halen belt!
	__________________ That's odd. That's very odd. Wouldn't you say that's very odd??

9th February 2012, 07:54 AM	#27
Dcdrac Illuminator Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 3,665	The Smurfs did it they got to the moon first and with their co conspirators the muppets faked the human moon landings.....for various nefarious, evil, ill defined and thought out purposes linked to the supply of lizards
Dcdrac Illuminator Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 3,665	Last edited by Dcdrac; 9th February 2012 at 08:10 AM.

9th February 2012, 08:05 AM	#28
MG1962 Guest Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Kansas (Australia) Posts: 14,750	Eugen Cernan was interviewed about these photos recently and the imaging team asked him if recalled which way the front tires were pointing when he parked the rover for the last time. He said, "I think about 40 degrees to the left" Their response "Yep that's right" Ya gotta love technology

9th February 2012, 10:14 AM	#29
JayUtah Illuminator Join Date: Sep 2011 Posts: 4,128	Originally Posted by SpitfireIX "NASA faked the images." "The hardware was planted by unmanned missions." "These photos are clear evidence of an extraterrestrial civilization on the moon." Indeed the Moon-related conspiracy theories are a mass of contradictions and speculations. You may recall the guy in the U.K., Cosmic Dave, who manages to advocate all of them simultaneously: i.e., the Apollo astronauts never went to the Moon -- but while they were there they found evidence of aliens. In the manner of the ubiquitous goalpost-shifting, it's been fun to watch the conspiracy crowd say, "Why don't we just send a spacecraft to photograph the landing sites?" back when such a thing seemed improbable. Then when we send the requested spacecraft and it sends back the photos, they immediately cry, "Photoshopped!"
JayUtah Illuminator Join Date: Sep 2011 Posts: 4,128

9th February 2012, 11:49 AM	#30
Alferd_Packer Philosopher Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 7,191	The coffin has shattered from all the nails and this zombie thread has risen from the grave.
	__________________ No laws of physics were broken in the writing of this post

9th February 2012, 02:57 PM	#31
twinstead Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Big corner office in NWO Towers Posts: 11,572	Originally Posted by Alferd_Packer The coffin has shattered from all the nails and this zombie thread has risen from the grave. I suspect it might want to eat our brains
	__________________ You are not entitled to your opinion. You are entitled to your INFORMED opinion. No one is entitled to be ignorant. -- Harlan Ellison

9th February 2012, 10:32 PM	#32
Corsair 115 Philosopher Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Tranquility Base Posts: 8,556	Originally Posted by twinstead I suspect it might want to eat our brains Well, it already has eaten the brains of those who believe in the conspiracy theory that the lunar landings were faked.
	__________________ "We choose to go to the moon in this decade and do the other things not because they are easy, but because they are hard. Because that goal will serve to organize and measure the best of our abilities and skills, because that challenge is one we are willing to accept, one we are unwilling to postpone, and one which we intend to win."

10th February 2012, 12:37 AM	#33
Anders Lindman Philosopher Join Date: Sep 2010 Posts: 9,289	Why is the ground around the descend stage so black? And in the closeup the ground is no longer black: http://www.nasa.gov/images/content/5..._ap14_area.jpg

10th February 2012, 12:47 AM	#34
nomuse Muse Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: People's Republic of Berkeley Posts: 745	Originally Posted by Anders Lindman Why is the ground around the descend stage so black? And in the closeup the ground is no longer black: http://www.nasa.gov/images/content/5..._ap14_area.jpg Wow. Now I understand conspiracy believers even better.

10th February 2012, 02:15 AM	#35
BaaBaa Semi-literate hench-person Join Date: Feb 2010 Posts: 1,419	Originally Posted by Anders Lindman Why is the ground around the descend stage so black? And in the closeup the ground is no longer black: http://www.nasa.gov/images/content/5..._ap14_area.jpg Jimminy frikkin' crickets....
	__________________ "Damn, i think you are illeterate"