Hamas ready to accept Israel's right to exist, ammend charter

Thunder · 21st January 2010, 04:37 AM

http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satelli...cle%2FShowFull

well...this is an interesting turn of events.

not sure what to make of it.

Skeptic · 21st January 2010, 04:42 AM

Must be the same as the PLO "amendment" of its charter: a tactical move to get Israeli withdrawals before re-starting the terrorist war.

Thunder · 21st January 2010, 05:04 AM

Originally Posted by Skeptic

Must be the same as the PLO "amendment" of its charter: a tactical move to get Israeli withdrawals before re-starting the terrorist war.

translation: "Arabs cannot be trusted. But if you say 'Jews cannot be trusted', you are being an anti-Semite."

Tailgater · 21st January 2010, 05:33 AM

They are just taking away another internet talking point. Now, no one can say "it says so in the charter".

Doctor Evil · 21st January 2010, 10:14 AM

It seems that Dweik is already denying the story:

Quote:

Dweik told Ma'an, however, that he offered no such recognition of Israel's "right to exist on Palestinian land," as was reported, and moreover, that he told Abrahams the PLO had made a mistake by nullifying its charter.

"The PLO canceled its charter, and Palestinians achieved nothing," he said. "This is Hamas' stance and the opinion of any Hamas leader regarding the nullification of [its] charter."

Dweik said the talks was held at Abrahams' request, and came within a series of meetings with the PLC's leadership with international officials, delegations and other news outlets. There was nothing unusual about Abrahams' visit, he said.

Another case of a western visitor hearing only what he wanted to hear? That would be my guess. (The Jerusalem Post reporter is a good reporter, but I am not sure whether he got to interview Dweik, or got his story though Abrahams.)

ZARDOZ · 21st January 2010, 11:42 AM

Now let's see if Aziz Dwaik can convince the entire Hamas leadership outside of the West Bank about kissing and making up with Israel. I won't hold my breath since that's like a low-level subordinate of Bin Laden saying "we give up America let's shake."

Ziggurat · 21st January 2010, 11:50 AM

Originally Posted by parky76

translation: "Arabs cannot be trusted.

I think it's rather racist of you to equate Arabs with terrorist organizations.

Skeptic · 21st January 2010, 12:05 PM

Originally Posted by parky76

translation: "Arabs cannot be trusted."

Nope. But Hamas and the PLO, two notorious terrorist organizations whose goal is Israel's destruction, certainly cannot be trusted.

Thunder · 21st January 2010, 12:42 PM

Originally Posted by Ziggurat

I think it's rather racist of you to equate Arabs with terrorist organizations.

it was not a translation of my words.

Thunder · 21st January 2010, 12:43 PM

Originally Posted by Skeptic

Nope. But Hamas and the PLO, two notorious terrorist organizations whose goal is Israel's destruction, certainly cannot be trusted.

I trust Hamas and the PLO just as much as I trust Lieberman and Yisrael B'Teinu.

Ziggurat · 21st January 2010, 12:46 PM

Originally Posted by parky76

it was not a translation of my words.

And yet, it's closer to what you said than your characterization of Skeptic's statement was. Why am I not surprised that the irony was lost on you?

Thunder · 21st January 2010, 12:58 PM

Originally Posted by Ziggurat

And yet, it's closer to what you said than your characterization of Skeptic's statement was. Why am I not surprised that the irony was lost on you?

I completely understand what you were getting at. I however believe that my translation is what Skeptic was trying to say....in much more polite terms.

Ziggurat · 21st January 2010, 01:02 PM

Originally Posted by parky76

I completely understand what you were getting at. I however believe that my translation is what Skeptic was trying to say....in much more polite terms.

But it clearly isn't, as he explicitly refuted your accusation. I'm sorry, parky, but you don't get to invent secret meanings for what other people say.

Thunder · 21st January 2010, 01:04 PM

There is a very common belief among some Israelis and some Zionist Jews, that Arabs simply cannot be trusted. I believe this is reflected in Skeptic's post.

Ziggurat · 21st January 2010, 01:14 PM

Originally Posted by parky76

There is a very common belief among some Israelis and some Zionist Jews, that Arabs simply cannot be trusted. I believe this is reflected in Skeptic's post.

Because you can read his mind? Sorry, parky, your excuses don't wash. There is nothing in the post to indicate anything of the sort. Hell, your own statement in this thread about not trusting either Hamas or the PLO suggests that your own views aren't too far from what he said. So why on earth are you ascribing motives to his post which are not in his post and which he explicitly denied in his subsequent response? This is becoming nothing more than an ad hominem against Skeptic. Whatever you've got against him for past disagreements, whatever differences you may have with him on other topics, you've really got no leg to stand on here, parky. So man up already and admit that your accusation was baseless.

Thunder · 21st January 2010, 01:16 PM

Originally Posted by Ziggurat

So man up already and admit that your accusation was baseless.

I have been reading Skeptic's posts for more than a year and a half. I believe my interpretation was fair and accurate.

Ziggurat · 21st January 2010, 01:25 PM

Originally Posted by parky76

I have been reading Skeptic's posts for more than a year and a half. I believe my interpretation was fair and accurate.

In other words, you're calling him a liar since he specifically denied the interpretation you put forward. And you don't believe what he wrote, based on... what he wrote. Um... yeah. Sorry, still not buying it.

When Skeptic tells me he has one opinion, and you tell me he really has a different one, I'm going to believe Skeptic, not you. Because, really, he knows, you're just guessing. Or more colloquially, you're pulling stuff out of your ***.

NWO Sentryman · 21st January 2010, 02:23 PM

well, it could be like Scientology's "dropping" of fair game. It may not be a de jure policy, but it would become a De Facto policy

Eyeron · 21st January 2010, 02:26 PM

Originally Posted by Ziggurat

In other words, you're calling him a liar since he specifically denied the interpretation you put forward. And you don't believe what he wrote, based on... what he wrote. Um... yeah. Sorry, still not buying it.

When Skeptic tells me he has one opinion, and you tell me he really has a different one, I'm going to believe Skeptic, not you. Because, really, he knows, you're just guessing. Or more colloquially, you're pulling stuff out of your ***.

Thunder · 21st January 2010, 03:09 PM

Originally Posted by Ziggurat

In other words, you're calling him a liar since he specifically denied the interpretation you put forward.

no, I am not calling him a liar.

that is YOU interpretation.

Ziggurat · 21st January 2010, 03:12 PM

Originally Posted by parky76

no, I am not calling him a liar.

that is YOU interpretation.

You are claiming that Skeptic meant something other than what he actually said. I am claiming that you meant what you said. Can you spot the difference? Or will you just flail about some more?

Thunder · 21st January 2010, 03:14 PM

Originally Posted by Ziggurat

You are claiming that Skeptic meant something other than what he actually said. I am claiming that you meant what you said. Can you spot the difference? Or will you just flail about some more?

I am not calling him a flat-out liar. There are degrees to deceit.

portlandatheist · 21st January 2010, 03:20 PM

Originally Posted by parky76

translation: "Arabs cannot be trusted....

Originally Posted by parky76

I trust Hamas and the PLO just as much as I trust Lieberman and Yisrael B'Teinu.

Translation: Jews cannot be trusted

Ziggurat · 21st January 2010, 03:21 PM

Originally Posted by parky76

I am not calling him a flat-out liar. There are degrees to deceit.

That's just sad, parky.

Skeptic · 21st January 2010, 10:45 PM

Originally Posted by Ziggurat

But it clearly isn't, as he explicitly refuted your accusation. I'm sorry, parky, but you don't get to invent secret meanings for what other people say.

Well, actually, he does. He just doesn't get other people to believe those secret meanings.

As the immortal saying in A Fish Called Wanda was, monkeys do read philosophy -- they just don't understand it.

Skeptic · 21st January 2010, 10:50 PM

Originally Posted by NWO Sentryman

well, it could be like Scientology's "dropping" of fair game. It may not be a de jure policy, but it would become a De Facto policy

Possibly, but the "how could you possibly believe" rule applies. I find it hard to take seriously people who throw their co-terrorists our of buildings to their death in vicious clan war in Gaza to really mean it when they say, "look, we'll still say we want to kill you all, but we don't really mean it".

I mean, suppose you just saw a thug in the street slit the throat of another thug, while lobbing hand grenades into your house. Would you believe him if he then knocked on your door and said, "look, I must say I want to break into your house and kill you and your family, but that's just something I say, I don't really mean it"?

bigjelmapro · 21st January 2010, 11:58 PM

This is almost of laughable as Palestinian human rights activists calling out for an independent investigation about the 2006 war in regards to Hamas.

Just another 'rope a dope' (John Bolton made this stick) tactic against Western countries. Same concept used ad nauseam by Iran.

MaGZ · 23rd January 2010, 03:50 PM

Originally Posted by parky76

http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satelli...cle%2FShowFull

well...this is an interesting turn of events.

not sure what to make of it.

I'm really disappointed in Hamas. Oh well, there is always Hezbollah.

Sword_Of_Truth · 23rd January 2010, 05:26 PM

Originally Posted by MaGZ

I'm really disappointed in Hamas. Oh well, there is always Hezbollah.

Note to first time lurkers, this was not sarcasm.

fuelair · 23rd January 2010, 06:22 PM

Originally Posted by parky76

http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satelli...cle%2FShowFull

well...this is an interesting turn of events.

not sure what to make of it.

As for me, I think I'll not hold my breath on this.

Sporanox · 23rd January 2010, 09:26 PM

Originally Posted by Sword_Of_Truth

Note to first time lurkers, this was not sarcasm.

...gah.

r0ast_p0tat0es · 23rd January 2010, 11:55 PM

Quote:

Bethlehem – Ma'an – Palestinian Legislative Council speaker Aziz Dweik on Thursday denied reports by Israeli news outlets that he said on Wednesday Israel has a right to exist.

Link

It certainly looks like someone can't be trusted... I dunno whether it's the Jerusalem Post or Aziz Dweik, but either way... They still want to utterly destroy Israel and everything non-Muslim living in it.

Darth Rotor · 25th January 2010, 05:54 AM

If Hamas decides to recognize Israel, and its right to exist, Hamas or other Pals risk being attacked Osama Bin Laden and his friends. Do they really want to go there?

Originally Posted by Al Qaeda information bit

"The message delivered to you through the plane of the heroic warrior Umar Farouk Abdulmutallab was a confirmation of the previous messages sent by the heroes of the Sept. 11," he said. "America will never dream of security unless we will have it in reality in Palestine," he added.

"God willing, our raids on you will continue as long as your support for the Israelis continues."

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/35042867...ideastn_africa

ZARDOZ · 25th January 2010, 07:13 AM

How many times did Arafat promise to something in english, such as dismantle the Palestinian militias, while promising the exact opposite in arabic? Was it one thousand times or two thousand times? I kinda lost track.

The core of Hamas's ideology is the liberation of Palestine, and no peace with Israel. Somehow I find it beyond comprehension that Hamas has done a complete 180. It just doesn't wash.

Eyeron · 25th January 2010, 09:04 AM

It's just a tactic. Whenever terrorist organizations like these are weakened they will proclaim they want peace and they mean it too. BUT they will only have pace just long enough to regather their strength and then they'll be on the attack again.

In truth the smart thing to do is when they declare peace is to just agree with them and then when they're not expecting it, attack them to wipe them out. Because they are just not truly interested in peace. Sure, it'll look bad to the pacifists and other peace loving people, but they are incapable of understanding that terrorist groups like these are just not interested in true peace or living with their neighbors.

bigjelmapro · 1st February 2010, 12:15 AM

Its called 'Hudna' in Arabic.

However, the PLO has been utilizing this tactic for different reasons than say groups like the ANC and IRA. Extortion has been the PLO's tactic from the beginning even with a number of viable solutions on the table between the two conflicting parties. Similar solutions that groups like the ANC and IRA sought for that eventually ended their respective conflicts.

NWO Sentryman · 1st February 2010, 11:20 AM

Like i said before, it'd be like Scientology's "Dropping" of Fair Game.

21st January 2010, 04:37 AM	#1
Thunder Banned Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Queens Posts: 34,947	Hamas ready to accept Israel's right to exist, ammend charter http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satelli...cle%2FShowFull well...this is an interesting turn of events. not sure what to make of it.

21st January 2010, 05:33 AM	#4
Tailgater Illuminator Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 3,212	They are just taking away another internet talking point. Now, no one can say "it says so in the charter".
Tailgater Illuminator Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 3,212	Last edited by Tailgater; 21st January 2010 at 05:35 AM.

21st January 2010, 10:14 AM	#5
Doctor Evil Graduate Poster Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Back home Posts: 1,966	It seems that Dweik is already denying the story: Quote: Dweik told Ma'an, however, that he offered no such recognition of Israel's "right to exist on Palestinian land," as was reported, and moreover, that he told Abrahams the PLO had made a mistake by nullifying its charter. "The PLO canceled its charter, and Palestinians achieved nothing," he said. "This is Hamas' stance and the opinion of any Hamas leader regarding the nullification of [its] charter." Dweik said the talks was held at Abrahams' request, and came within a series of meetings with the PLC's leadership with international officials, delegations and other news outlets. There was nothing unusual about Abrahams' visit, he said. Another case of a western visitor hearing only what he wanted to hear? That would be my guess. (The Jerusalem Post reporter is a good reporter, but I am not sure whether he got to interview Dweik, or got his story though Abrahams.)
	__________________ "ut biberent, quando esse nollent " (if they will not eat, then they will drink) -- Publius Claudius Pulcher "In this universe, effect follows cause. I've complained about it but ... " -- House

21st January 2010, 11:42 AM	#6
ZARDOZ Scholar Join Date: Jan 2010 Posts: 117	Now let's see if Aziz Dwaik can convince the entire Hamas leadership outside of the West Bank about kissing and making up with Israel. I won't hold my breath since that's like a low-level subordinate of Bin Laden saying "we give up America let's shake."
ZARDOZ Scholar Join Date: Jan 2010 Posts: 117

21st January 2010, 11:50 AM	#7
Ziggurat Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Jun 2003 Posts: 26,199	Originally Posted by parky76 translation: "Arabs cannot be trusted. I think it's rather racist of you to equate Arabs with terrorist organizations.
	__________________ "As long as it is admitted that the law may be diverted from its true purpose -- that it may violate property instead of protecting it -- then everyone will want to participate in making the law, either to protect himself against plunder or to use it for plunder. Political questions will always be prejudicial, dominant, and all-absorbing. There will be fighting at the door of the Legislative Palace, and the struggle within will be no less furious." - Bastiat, The Law

21st January 2010, 04:42 AM	#2
Skeptic Banned Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Behind the chessboard Posts: 18,361	Must be the same as the PLO "amendment" of its charter: a tactical move to get Israeli withdrawals before re-starting the terrorist war.

21st January 2010, 05:04 AM	#3
Thunder Banned Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Queens Posts: 34,947	Originally Posted by Skeptic Must be the same as the PLO "amendment" of its charter: a tactical move to get Israeli withdrawals before re-starting the terrorist war. translation: "Arabs cannot be trusted. But if you say 'Jews cannot be trusted', you are being an anti-Semite."

21st January 2010, 12:05 PM	#8
Skeptic Banned Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Behind the chessboard Posts: 18,361	Originally Posted by parky76 translation: "Arabs cannot be trusted." Nope. But Hamas and the PLO, two notorious terrorist organizations whose goal is Israel's destruction, certainly cannot be trusted.

21st January 2010, 12:42 PM	#9
Thunder Banned Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Queens Posts: 34,947	Originally Posted by Ziggurat I think it's rather racist of you to equate Arabs with terrorist organizations. it was not a translation of my words.

21st January 2010, 12:43 PM	#10
Thunder Banned Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Queens Posts: 34,947	Originally Posted by Skeptic Nope. But Hamas and the PLO, two notorious terrorist organizations whose goal is Israel's destruction, certainly cannot be trusted. I trust Hamas and the PLO just as much as I trust Lieberman and Yisrael B'Teinu.

21st January 2010, 12:46 PM	#11
Ziggurat Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Jun 2003 Posts: 26,199	Originally Posted by parky76 it was not a translation of my words. And yet, it's closer to what you said than your characterization of Skeptic's statement was. Why am I not surprised that the irony was lost on you?
	__________________ "As long as it is admitted that the law may be diverted from its true purpose -- that it may violate property instead of protecting it -- then everyone will want to participate in making the law, either to protect himself against plunder or to use it for plunder. Political questions will always be prejudicial, dominant, and all-absorbing. There will be fighting at the door of the Legislative Palace, and the struggle within will be no less furious." - Bastiat, The Law

21st January 2010, 12:58 PM	#12
Thunder Banned Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Queens Posts: 34,947	Originally Posted by Ziggurat And yet, it's closer to what you said than your characterization of Skeptic's statement was. Why am I not surprised that the irony was lost on you? I completely understand what you were getting at. I however believe that my translation is what Skeptic was trying to say....in much more polite terms.

21st January 2010, 01:02 PM	#13
Ziggurat Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Jun 2003 Posts: 26,199	Originally Posted by parky76 I completely understand what you were getting at. I however believe that my translation is what Skeptic was trying to say....in much more polite terms. But it clearly isn't, as he explicitly refuted your accusation. I'm sorry, parky, but you don't get to invent secret meanings for what other people say.
	__________________ "As long as it is admitted that the law may be diverted from its true purpose -- that it may violate property instead of protecting it -- then everyone will want to participate in making the law, either to protect himself against plunder or to use it for plunder. Political questions will always be prejudicial, dominant, and all-absorbing. There will be fighting at the door of the Legislative Palace, and the struggle within will be no less furious." - Bastiat, The Law

21st January 2010, 01:04 PM	#14
Thunder Banned Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Queens Posts: 34,947	There is a very common belief among some Israelis and some Zionist Jews, that Arabs simply cannot be trusted. I believe this is reflected in Skeptic's post.

21st January 2010, 01:14 PM	#15
Ziggurat Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Jun 2003 Posts: 26,199	Originally Posted by parky76 There is a very common belief among some Israelis and some Zionist Jews, that Arabs simply cannot be trusted. I believe this is reflected in Skeptic's post. Because you can read his mind? Sorry, parky, your excuses don't wash. There is nothing in the post to indicate anything of the sort. Hell, your own statement in this thread about not trusting either Hamas or the PLO suggests that your own views aren't too far from what he said. So why on earth are you ascribing motives to his post which are not in his post and which he explicitly denied in his subsequent response? This is becoming nothing more than an ad hominem against Skeptic. Whatever you've got against him for past disagreements, whatever differences you may have with him on other topics, you've really got no leg to stand on here, parky. So man up already and admit that your accusation was baseless.
	__________________ "As long as it is admitted that the law may be diverted from its true purpose -- that it may violate property instead of protecting it -- then everyone will want to participate in making the law, either to protect himself against plunder or to use it for plunder. Political questions will always be prejudicial, dominant, and all-absorbing. There will be fighting at the door of the Legislative Palace, and the struggle within will be no less furious." - Bastiat, The Law

21st January 2010, 01:16 PM	#16
Thunder Banned Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Queens Posts: 34,947	Originally Posted by Ziggurat So man up already and admit that your accusation was baseless. I have been reading Skeptic's posts for more than a year and a half. I believe my interpretation was fair and accurate.

21st January 2010, 01:25 PM	#17
Ziggurat Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Jun 2003 Posts: 26,199	Originally Posted by parky76 I have been reading Skeptic's posts for more than a year and a half. I believe my interpretation was fair and accurate. In other words, you're calling him a liar since he specifically denied the interpretation you put forward. And you don't believe what he wrote, based on... what he wrote. Um... yeah. Sorry, still not buying it. When Skeptic tells me he has one opinion, and you tell me he really has a different one, I'm going to believe Skeptic, not you. Because, really, he knows, you're just guessing. Or more colloquially, you're pulling stuff out of your ***.
	__________________ "As long as it is admitted that the law may be diverted from its true purpose -- that it may violate property instead of protecting it -- then everyone will want to participate in making the law, either to protect himself against plunder or to use it for plunder. Political questions will always be prejudicial, dominant, and all-absorbing. There will be fighting at the door of the Legislative Palace, and the struggle within will be no less furious." - Bastiat, The Law

21st January 2010, 02:23 PM	#18
NWO Sentryman Proud NWO Gatekeeper Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Quantum Gate to the NWO Posts: 3,774	well, it could be like Scientology's "dropping" of fair game. It may not be a de jure policy, but it would become a De Facto policy
	__________________ If I now say "dominoes", you won't think "pizza". Will you? - FireGarden on the Middle East

21st January 2010, 02:26 PM	#19
Eyeron Guest Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 1,774	Originally Posted by Ziggurat In other words, you're calling him a liar since he specifically denied the interpretation you put forward. And you don't believe what he wrote, based on... what he wrote. Um... yeah. Sorry, still not buying it. When Skeptic tells me he has one opinion, and you tell me he really has a different one, I'm going to believe Skeptic, not you. Because, really, he knows, you're just guessing. Or more colloquially, you're pulling stuff out of your ***.
Eyeron Guest Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 1,774

21st January 2010, 03:09 PM	#20
Thunder Banned Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Queens Posts: 34,947	Originally Posted by Ziggurat In other words, you're calling him a liar since he specifically denied the interpretation you put forward. no, I am not calling him a liar. that is YOU interpretation.

21st January 2010, 03:12 PM	#21
Ziggurat Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Jun 2003 Posts: 26,199	Originally Posted by parky76 no, I am not calling him a liar. that is YOU interpretation. You are claiming that Skeptic meant something other than what he actually said. I am claiming that you meant what you said. Can you spot the difference? Or will you just flail about some more?
	__________________ "As long as it is admitted that the law may be diverted from its true purpose -- that it may violate property instead of protecting it -- then everyone will want to participate in making the law, either to protect himself against plunder or to use it for plunder. Political questions will always be prejudicial, dominant, and all-absorbing. There will be fighting at the door of the Legislative Palace, and the struggle within will be no less furious." - Bastiat, The Law

21st January 2010, 03:14 PM	#22
Thunder Banned Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Queens Posts: 34,947	Originally Posted by Ziggurat You are claiming that Skeptic meant something other than what he actually said. I am claiming that you meant what you said. Can you spot the difference? Or will you just flail about some more? I am not calling him a flat-out liar. There are degrees to deceit.

21st January 2010, 03:20 PM	#23
portlandatheist Master Poster Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 2,111	Originally Posted by parky76 translation: "Arabs cannot be trusted.... Originally Posted by parky76 I trust Hamas and the PLO just as much as I trust Lieberman and Yisrael B'Teinu. Translation: Jews cannot be trusted

21st January 2010, 03:21 PM	#24
Ziggurat Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Jun 2003 Posts: 26,199	Originally Posted by parky76 I am not calling him a flat-out liar. There are degrees to deceit. That's just sad, parky.
	__________________ "As long as it is admitted that the law may be diverted from its true purpose -- that it may violate property instead of protecting it -- then everyone will want to participate in making the law, either to protect himself against plunder or to use it for plunder. Political questions will always be prejudicial, dominant, and all-absorbing. There will be fighting at the door of the Legislative Palace, and the struggle within will be no less furious." - Bastiat, The Law

21st January 2010, 10:45 PM	#25
Skeptic Banned Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Behind the chessboard Posts: 18,361	Originally Posted by Ziggurat But it clearly isn't, as he explicitly refuted your accusation. I'm sorry, parky, but you don't get to invent secret meanings for what other people say. Well, actually, he does. He just doesn't get other people to believe those secret meanings. As the immortal saying in A Fish Called Wanda was, monkeys do read philosophy -- they just don't understand it.

21st January 2010, 10:50 PM	#26
Skeptic Banned Join Date: Jul 2001 Location: Behind the chessboard Posts: 18,361	Originally Posted by NWO Sentryman well, it could be like Scientology's "dropping" of fair game. It may not be a de jure policy, but it would become a De Facto policy Possibly, but the "how could you possibly believe" rule applies. I find it hard to take seriously people who throw their co-terrorists our of buildings to their death in vicious clan war in Gaza to really mean it when they say, "look, we'll still say we want to kill you all, but we don't really mean it". I mean, suppose you just saw a thug in the street slit the throat of another thug, while lobbing hand grenades into your house. Would you believe him if he then knocked on your door and said, "look, I must say I want to break into your house and kill you and your family, but that's just something I say, I don't really mean it"?

21st January 2010, 11:58 PM	#27
bigjelmapro Illuminator Join Date: Jan 2009 Posts: 3,505	This is almost of laughable as Palestinian human rights activists calling out for an independent investigation about the 2006 war in regards to Hamas. Just another 'rope a dope' (John Bolton made this stick) tactic against Western countries. Same concept used ad nauseam by Iran.
bigjelmapro Illuminator Join Date: Jan 2009 Posts: 3,505

23rd January 2010, 03:50 PM	#28
MaGZ Suspended Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 6,319	Originally Posted by parky76 http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satelli...cle%2FShowFull well...this is an interesting turn of events. not sure what to make of it. I'm really disappointed in Hamas. Oh well, there is always Hezbollah.
MaGZ Suspended Join Date: Jan 2007 Posts: 6,319

23rd January 2010, 05:26 PM	#29
Sword_Of_Truth Penultimate Amazing Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 11,497	Originally Posted by MaGZ I'm really disappointed in Hamas. Oh well, there is always Hezbollah. Note to first time lurkers, this was not sarcasm.

23rd January 2010, 06:22 PM	#30
fuelair Cythraul Enfys Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 28,954	Originally Posted by parky76 http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satelli...cle%2FShowFull well...this is an interesting turn of events. not sure what to make of it. As for me, I think I'll not hold my breath on this.
fuelair Cythraul Enfys Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 28,954	__________________ There is no problem so great that it cannot be fixed by small explosives carefully placed. Wash this space! We fight for the Lady Babylon!!!

23rd January 2010, 09:26 PM	#31
Sporanox Muse Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: in the black Posts: 899	Originally Posted by Sword_Of_Truth Note to first time lurkers, this was not sarcasm. ...gah.
	__________________ A joke is a very serious thing. -Winston Churchill

23rd January 2010, 11:55 PM	#32
r0ast_p0tat0es Thinker Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: Johannesburg, South Africa Posts: 190	Quote: Bethlehem – Ma'an – Palestinian Legislative Council speaker Aziz Dweik on Thursday denied reports by Israeli news outlets that he said on Wednesday Israel has a right to exist. Link It certainly looks like someone can't be trusted... I dunno whether it's the Jerusalem Post or Aziz Dweik, but either way... They still want to utterly destroy Israel and everything non-Muslim living in it.

25th January 2010, 05:54 AM	#33
Darth Rotor Salted Sith Cynic Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Rat cheer Posts: 34,264	If Hamas decides to recognize Israel, and its right to exist, Hamas or other Pals risk being attacked Osama Bin Laden and his friends. Do they really want to go there? Originally Posted by Al Qaeda information bit "The message delivered to you through the plane of the heroic warrior Umar Farouk Abdulmutallab was a confirmation of the previous messages sent by the heroes of the Sept. 11," he said. "America will never dream of security unless we will have it in reality in Palestine," he added. "God willing, our raids on you will continue as long as your support for the Israelis continues." http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/35042867...ideastn_africa
	__________________ Helicopters don't so much fly as beat the air into submission. "Jesus wept, but did He laugh?"--F.H. Buckley____"There is one thing that was too great for God to show us when He walked upon our earth ... His mirth." --Chesterton__"If the barbarian in us is excised, so is our humanity."--D'rok__ "I only use my gun whenever kindness fails."-- Robert Earl Keen__"Sturgeon spares none.". -- The Marquis Last edited by Darth Rotor; 25th January 2010 at 05:57 AM.

25th January 2010, 07:13 AM	#34
ZARDOZ Scholar Join Date: Jan 2010 Posts: 117	How many times did Arafat promise to something in english, such as dismantle the Palestinian militias, while promising the exact opposite in arabic? Was it one thousand times or two thousand times? I kinda lost track. The core of Hamas's ideology is the liberation of Palestine, and no peace with Israel. Somehow I find it beyond comprehension that Hamas has done a complete 180. It just doesn't wash.
ZARDOZ Scholar Join Date: Jan 2010 Posts: 117

25th January 2010, 09:04 AM	#35
Eyeron Guest Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 1,774	It's just a tactic. Whenever terrorist organizations like these are weakened they will proclaim they want peace and they mean it too. BUT they will only have pace just long enough to regather their strength and then they'll be on the attack again. In truth the smart thing to do is when they declare peace is to just agree with them and then when they're not expecting it, attack them to wipe them out. Because they are just not truly interested in peace. Sure, it'll look bad to the pacifists and other peace loving people, but they are incapable of understanding that terrorist groups like these are just not interested in true peace or living with their neighbors.
Eyeron Guest Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 1,774