Nice Job, Tea Party! You're right up there with Hamas and Al Qaeda now!

[Dorian Gray]

http://news.yahoo.com/s/politico/201...politico/34907

Quote:

Slaughter, a Democrat who chairs the House Rules Committee, said a caller to her office last week vowed to send snipers to “kill the children of the members who voted yes.” Her office reported the call to police, who were dispatched to provide protection for Slaughter’s grandchildren. She has also been in touch with the FBI and U.S. Postal Service inspectors, who intercepted a letter en route to her home in upstate New York.
Stupak, the Michigan Democrat whose last-minute compromise on abortion guaranteed passage of the bill Sunday, said callers have left messages for him saying, “You’re dead; we know where you live; we’ll get you.”

If you don't like the bill, fine. But threatening to kill members of Congress? Anyone who doesn't shrink away from the Teabaggers may as well join Hamas.

[Redtail]

Originally Posted by Dorian Gray

http://news.yahoo.com/s/politico/201...politico/34907


If you don't like the bill, fine. But threatening to kill members of Congress? Anyone who doesn't shrink away from the Teabaggers may as well join Hamas.

No. Tea party tantrums, saber rattling, and vandalism is vastly stupid and in some cases reprehensible, but on the level of Hamas and Al Qaeda? No. Maybe on the level of Kappa Alpha and Lambda Chi.

[Thunder]

Hamas? Naaaa...

Brownshirts in 1929? Yep.

[quixotecoyote]

Originally Posted by Dorian Gray

http://news.yahoo.com/s/politico/201...politico/34907


If you don't like the bill, fine. But threatening to kill members of Congress? Anyone who doesn't shrink away from the Teabaggers may as well join Hamas.

Nah. Hamas and AQ comparisons will only be appropriate after one of the baggers goes and kills someone and gets an outpouring of support.

eta: I know what you're thinking, but I'm pretty sure the IRS plane-bomber doesn't count because he wasn't actually involved with the TP.

[Thunder]

Originally Posted by quixotecoyote

Nah. Hamas and AQ comparisons will only be appropriate after one of the baggers goes and kills someone and gets an outpouring of support.

no. if someone related to the Tea Party torches a Congressman's office in the middle of the night, an analogy to the KKK or Hamas would be fare.

[quixotecoyote]

Originally Posted by parky76

no. if someone related to the Tea Party torches a Congressman's office in the middle of the night, an analogy to the KKK or Hamas would be fare.

I think the outpouring of support is the key thing. If it horrified the movement and they toned down the nutbag rhetoric, that would be one thing. If they cheered it on, then the comparison would be legitimate.

[Thunder]

Originally Posted by quixotecoyote

I think the outpouring of support is the key thing. If it horrified the movement and they toned down the nutbag rhetoric, that would be one thing. If they cheered it on, then the comparison would be legitimate.

i don't know if we have reached that point, where the torching of Pelosi's or Stupak's office, would bring cheers from even 35% of Tea-Baggers and other right-wingers.

but we indeed may have reached such a sad day.

[Redtail]

Originally Posted by quixotecoyote

I think the outpouring of support is the key thing. If it horrified the movement and they toned down the nutbag rhetoric, that would be one thing. If they cheered it on, then the comparison would be legitimate.

Agreed. Once any group gets large enough there are going to be some nuts, but if say a tea party member blows up an office, home, car, puts it on you tube, and calls himself Tea Partycus and we start seeing signs/t-shirts/bumper stickers/etc... with "I'm Tea Partycus!" showing up at rallies and they aren't kicked out then we have a different animal.

[Puppycow]

There have been multiple death threats made against democrats after this vote, as well as acts of vandalism.

After Health Vote, Democrats are Threatened
House Democrats Face Violent Threats After Health Care Vote
Words, and now bricks thrown at lawmakers over health care vote

[Regnad Kcin]

C'mon, these same people were just as virulent and outspoken about the invasion and subsequent war in Iraq, not to mention Mr. Bush's immense tax cuts for the rich.

Oh, wait...

[INRM]

This bothers me on a number of levels, on the nature of the threats and the fact that they were directed against members of Congress, and also the fact that because of a couple of crazies, every critic of government policy will likely be lumped with these people...

[Thunder]

Originally Posted by INRM

This bothers me on a number of levels, on the nature of the threats and the fact that they were directed against members of Congress, and also the fact that because of a couple of crazies, every critic of government policy will likely be lumped with these people...

is that a prediction..or a wish?

[Grizzly Bear]

Anybody stupid enough to think it a bright idea to threaten a guys life because they can't control their temper tantrums deserves to be denounced and ridiculed for the idiocy they spew. And I for one am glad that this was denounced by the talk show hosts I listen to. That has no place in any form of politics.

It's almost amusing though to see how ultra bias works with some people I suppose, especially the pat about aimlessly associating entire groups with a relative minority of ultra nuts.

Originally Posted by parky76

is that a prediction..or a wish?

The OP is already on the spin cycle.

[Dorian Gray]

Now look at this site, which feeds the Teabagging bears!
http://hubpages.com/hub/plainenglishhealthcarereform
The bolds are NOT mine - they were as quoted.

Quote:

snipperooo
Page 16: States that if you have insurance at the time of the bill becoming law and change, you will be required to take a similar plan. If that is not available, you will be required to take the gov option!
• Page 22: Mandates audits of all employers that self-insure!
• Page 29: Admission: your health care will be rationed!
• Page 30: A government committee will decide what treatments and benefits you get (and, unlike an insurer, there will be no appeals process)
• Page 42: The "Health Choices Commissioner" will decide health benefits for you. You will have no choice. None.
• Page 50: All non-US citizens, illegal or not, will be provided with free healthcare services.
• Page 58: Every person will be issued a National ID Healthcard. (Who gets #666?)
• Page 59: The federal government will have direct, real-time access to all individual bank accounts for electronic funds transfer.
• Page 65: Taxpayers will subsidize all union retiree and community organizer health plans (example: SEIU, UAW and ACORN)
• Page 72: All private healthcare plans must conform to government rules to participate in a Healthcare Exchange.
• Page 84: All private healthcare plans must participate in the Healthcare Exchange (i.e., total government control of private plans)
• Page 91: Government mandates linguistic infrastructure for services; translation: illegal aliens
• Page 95: The Government will pay ACORN and Americorps to sign up individuals for Government-run Health Care plan.

sniperruss maximuss

It supposedly "explains" the health care bill. What it really does is line up a random list of scare-tactic talking points with a random set of page numbers. Really stupid or lazy people will read this list and go off half-cocked, but in reality, not only are all these "explanations" biased opinions, but none of the topics appears on the page it claims to be listed on, and there is no mention of a national ID card in the plan.

Check for yourself.

[Sword_Of_Truth]

Originally Posted by Regnad Kcin

C'mon, these same people were just as virulent and outspoken about the invasion and subsequent war in Iraq, not to mention Mr. Bush's immense tax cuts for the rich.

Oh, wait...

A different set of nuts were just as virulent during the Bush years.

They were there, but you probably didn't notice them.

[Redtail]

Originally Posted by Dorian Gray

Now look at this site, which feeds the Teabagging bears!
http://hubpages.com/hub/plainenglishhealthcarereform
The bolds are NOT mine - they were as quoted.

[/b][/b]
It supposedly "explains" the health care bill. What it really does is line up a random list of scare-tactic talking points with a random set of page numbers. Really stupid or lazy people will read this list and go off half-cocked, but in reality, not only are all these "explanations" biased opinions, but none of the topics appears on the page it claims to be listed on, and there is no mention of a national ID card in the plan.

Check for yourself.

Didn't Acorn go bankrupt?

[Dorian Gray]

Originally Posted by Grizzly Bear

Anybody stupid enough to think it a bright idea to threaten a guys life because they can't control their temper tantrums deserves to be denounced and ridiculed for the idiocy they spew. And I for one am glad that this was denounced by the talk show hosts I listen to. That has no place in any form of politics.

It's almost amusing though to see how ultra bias works with some people I suppose.




The OP is already on the spin cycle.

Not true. If people didn't like the bill, even demonstrated, I wouldn't give a crap because that's part of politics. As evidenced by the paucity of threads on this subject started by me.

On the other hand, threatening the lives of Congressmen or Senators, spitting on black members of Congress, and in particular threatening the CHILDREN of those Congressman or Senators, that crosses the lines of sanity and disagreement into criminal activity. It's not spin.

Do you really not get the difference between "you're an idiot for voting this way" and "I'm going to kill you and your family for voting this way"?

[Dorian Gray]

Originally Posted by Redtail

Didn't Acorn go bankrupt?

Um, not the point. Page 95 in its entirety:

Quote:

stand-alone plan that is offered and priced
2 separately from a qualified health benefits
3 plan.
4 Subtitle B—Standards Guaran5
teeing Access to Affordable Cov6
erage
7 SEC. 211. PROHIBITING PREEXISTING CONDITION EXCLU8
SIONS.
9 A qualified health benefits plan may not impose any
10 preexisting condition exclusion (as defined in section
11 2701(b)(1)(A) of the Public Health Service Act) or other12
wise impose any limit or condition on the coverage under
13 the plan with respect to an individual or dependent based
14 on any of the following: health status, medical condition,
15 claims experience, receipt of health care, medical history,
16 genetic information, evidence of insurability, disability, or
17 source of injury (including conditions arising out of acts
18 of domestic violence) or any similar factors.
19 SEC. 212. GUARANTEED ISSUE AND RENEWAL FOR IN20
SURED PLANS AND PROHIBITING RESCIS21
SIONS.
22 The requirements of sections 2711 (other than sub23
sections (e) and (f)) and 2712 (other than paragraphs (3),
24 and (6) of subsection (b) and subsection (e)) of the Public
25 Health Service Act, relating to guaranteed availability and

Yeah, the formatting sucks. The point is that page 95 doesn't come anywhere close to even mentioning ACORN or any other agency, or the government hiring anyone to do anything. But your average lazy moron will just gloss over the list and start repeating it.

[Grizzly Bear]

Originally Posted by Dorian Gray

Do you really not get the difference between "you're an idiot for voting this way" and "I'm going to kill you and your family for voting this way"?

I understand the difference full well, as I've made very clear already. I have no sympathy for those who see it fit to even make these threats. Spinning it to indiscriminately encompass an entire political movement on the actions of a few however isn't exactly my cup of tea.

As for the listing you're now posting, if you got criticisms over that then fine I respect that, but it has nothing to do with the opening statement which directly associates an entire party with a entirely different level of idiocy, based on the actions of a few. Heck, the article you posted just now comes no where near the level of terrorizing congressmen with threats to life or property.

[Thunder]

"you are a moron for making such a stupid vote. i hate you!"

this is crude..but still American.

"you are a Communist pig because of your vote, watch your back..cause you got a bullet with your name on it".

this..is unAmerican.

[MattusMaximus]

For the record, the one guy I know personally (he's a friend) who is a bit into the Tea Party stuff thinks this sort of crap is waaaaaay out of line. He and I had an online conversation about it tonight, and he described the vandalism as "worthy of Mussolini" and "thuggish".

But I agree with others here: how the TP/GOP reacts to this garbage will be very telling. They are, in my view, really dancing on eggshells now.

[Sword_Of_Truth]

Originally Posted by Dorian Gray

http://news.yahoo.com/s/politico/201...politico/34907


If you don't like the bill, fine. But threatening to kill members of Congress? Anyone who doesn't shrink away from the Teabaggers may as well join Hamas.

Is there any evidence that this was from the tea party or on their behalf? Did the people sending these messages identify themselves as Tea Partiers? Di they say "the Tea Party is coming for you"?

Is there any reason we should assume that this is the work of the Tea Party (a movement with no definable hierarchy, structure or actual leader) over say the Jonas Brothers Fan Club?

[Redtail]

Originally Posted by Dorian Gray

Um, not the point. Page 95 in its entirety:


Yeah, the formatting sucks. The point is that page 95 doesn't come anywhere close to even mentioning ACORN or any other agency, or the government hiring anyone to do anything. But your average lazy moron will just gloss over the list and start repeating it.

So ACORN isn't in there plus ACORN is going/has gone bankrupt, yet they're still babbling about it.... Wow...


ETA: Sweet baby howler monkey! They got it from the freeperville.
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/f-chat/2300451/posts

[Drewbot]

The people that make threats, or do other unseemly acts, do not represent the vast majority of TEA party people. The vast majority of them, are simply disgusted with the government spending another Trillion dollars of their money.

Every group seems to have people on the fringe, unfortunately, the kooks are the ones who get the attention from the media.

[ZouPrime]

Originally Posted by Sword_Of_Truth

A different set of nuts were just as virulent during the Bush years.

They were there, but you probably didn't notice them.

Were they supported by elected officials?

I can't remember any democrats shouting "terrorists!" in congress, or hinting that the 9/11 CTers may be on something (as opposed to what happened with the birthers).

No, in fact, from what I can remember, the democrats back then made absolutely everything in their power to distance themselves from the loons on their side. Why aren't republicans doing the same thing? Instead, they are pandering to their lunatic fringe! How is that even remotely equivalent?

Obviously there are loons everywhere, and every causes has its dangerous extremists. But I can't remember democrats officials nor media personalities feeding this extremism like the republicans have been doing in the last year.

[Thunder]

Originally Posted by Sword_Of_Truth

A different set of nuts were just as virulent during the Bush years.

They were there, but you probably didn't notice them.

I don't recall any death threats to Bush, after the 2001 and 2003 tax cuts, and after he invaded Iraq.

I don't recall the House Minority leader accusing Bush of Fascism and calling him a "dead man".

I don't recall the members of the Senate Democrats threatening to not cooperate on ANY legislation with the GOP.

[thaiboxerken]

Originally Posted by quixotecoyote

Nah. Hamas and AQ comparisons will only be appropriate after one of the baggers goes and kills someone and gets an outpouring of support.

eta: I know what you're thinking, but I'm pretty sure the IRS plane-bomber doesn't count because he wasn't actually involved with the TP.

But he did get an outpouring of support from the TP.

[Unabogie]

Originally Posted by Dorian Gray

Um, not the point. Page 95 in its entirety:


Yeah, the formatting sucks. The point is that page 95 doesn't come anywhere close to even mentioning ACORN or any other agency, or the government hiring anyone to do anything. But your average lazy moron will just gloss over the list and start repeating it.

Someone I know sent me that exact list with a "see? no wonder people are bringing guns!" response. There's a huge percentage of this opposition that's based on pure fantasy.

[cienaños]

Originally Posted by parky76

"you are a moron for making such a stupid vote. i hate you!"

this is crude..but still American.

"you are a Communist pig because of your vote, watch your back..cause you got a bullet with your name on it".

this..is unAmerican.

Where is this America you speak of? I want to go to there.

[cienaños]

Originally Posted by Sword_Of_Truth

Is there any evidence that this was from the tea party or on their behalf? Did the people sending these messages identify themselves as Tea Partiers? Di they say "the Tea Party is coming for you"?

Is there any reason we should assume that this is the work of the Tea Party (a movement with no definable hierarchy, structure or actual leader) over say the Jonas Brothers Fan Club?

From what I understand (NPR, Huffpo, Stewart & Colbert), the "Tea Party" is quite fractured and there are some within this very loose "umbrella" with some common sense.

However, the sane ones clearly are not the face of the movement twitchment. It's racism folks. Alive and well. The essence of the racist is ignorance, which leads to hate, which leads to coo-coo for cocoa puffs, which leads to death threats and so on.

Some evidence here.

But mobs do require some guidance. In this case, it's Limbaugh, Bachmann, Beck, FoxNews, just to name a few. What's really striking to me is, that these "guides" are frauds. They suffer a variation of Dorian Gray Syndrome mixed with a heaping dose of arrested mental development. They just want the money, power, and fame. And the knuckledraggers teabaggers either don't know, or do know, and are grateful for the opportunity to express their hatreds and phobias.

If only we could get states like Texas to somehow, I don't know, make changes in school books that - oh wait.

[mortimer]

Originally Posted by parky76

I don't recall any death threats to Bush, after the 2001 and 2003 tax cuts, and after he invaded Iraq.

You don't?

[Thunder]

Originally Posted by mortimer

You don't?

looks like a GOPer in disguise.

[ktesibios]

Originally Posted by Unabogie

Someone I know sent me that exact list with a "see? no wonder people are bringing guns!" response. There's a huge percentage of this opposition that's based on pure fantasy.

The aficionado of paranoid conspiracism will recognize a familiar phenomenon here. It's just like the list of executive orders that supposedly provide for the transformation of the USA into a dictatorship at the whim of the President which continually turn up in the bargain bin at the Alcoa Haberdashery Shoppe as seen here.

Of course, if you actually take the time to look up and read these horrible unAmerican ukases they turn out either to be superseded, cancelled out or else boring plans to divvy up bureaucratic turf that reads like Bill Cosby describing a game of street football.

"The Secretary of Health and Human Services shall go out about 20 yards and break left- behind the yellow Chevy".

But, since the internet is full of people who can't be bothered to check the primary sources or read for comprehension, these lists continue to circulate by copypasta and can be expected to continue circulating until we're all doing our Web surfing via the microchips the government implanted in our brains.

I predict that the specimen posted by Dorian Gray will have a similar fate.

[doobiedoright]

Originally Posted by parky76

I don't recall any death threats to Bush, after the 2001 and 2003 tax cuts, and after he invaded Iraq.

I don't recall the House Minority leader accusing Bush of Fascism and calling him a "dead man".

I don't recall the members of the Senate Democrats threatening to not cooperate on ANY legislation with the GOP.

Really............you must be blind!
http://www.zombietime.com/zomblog/?p=621

How about a death threat from none other than John kerry?
Maher: You could have went to New Hampshire and killed two birds with one stone.

Kerry: Or, I could have gone to 1600 Pennsylvania and killed the real bird with one stone.



How about a noble peace prize winner?
On July 11, 2007, Nobel Peace Prize laureate Betty Williams gave the keynote speech to the International Women’s Peace Conference in Dallas, Texas, and said (to laughter and applause from the audience):

“I mean right now, I could kill George Bush, no problem. No, I don’t mean that. I mean — how could you nonviolently kill somebody? I would love to be able to do that.”

You can hear the audiotape of her threat on Breitbart.TV. Despite the fact that threatening to kill the president is a crime, the Secret Service refused to question her or detain her; according to the Dallas Morning News, “Secret Service spokesman Eric Zahren in Washington declined to comment, but a Dallas agent said Ms. Williams had not been questioned and there were no plans to do so.” However, the people who emailed the conference in anger about her threats — they were the ones investigated:


New York State comptroller, Alan Hevesi said during a June 1, 2006 speech that Senator Charles Schumer “will put a bullet between the president’s eyes if he could get away with it.” Hevesi later apologized for the statement.

News outlets that are focusing on the incendiary rhetoric of conservatives outside President Obama's town hall meeting Tuesday ignored the incendiary rhetoric -- and even violence -- of liberals outside an appearance by former President George W. Bush in 2002.

When Bush visited Portland, Ore., for a fundraiser, protesters stalked his motorcade, assailed his limousine and stoned a car containing his advisers. Chanting "Bush is a terrorist!", the demonstrators bullied passers-by, including gay softball players and a wheelchair-bound grandfather with multiple sclerosis.

One protester even brandished a sign that seemed to advocate Bush's assassination. The man held a large photo of Bush that had been doctored to show a gun barrel pressed against his temple.

"BUSH: WANTED, DEAD OR ALIVE," read the placard, which had an X over the word "ALIVE.
A third sign urged motorists to "HONK IF YOU HATE BUSH." A fourth declared: "CHRISTIAN FASCISM," with a swastika in place of the letter S in each word.
Although reporters from numerous national news organizations were traveling with Bush and witnessed the protest, none reported that protesters were shrieking at Republican donors epithets like "Slut!" "Whore!" and "Fascists!"
Protesters slashed the tires of several state patrol cruisers and leapt onto an occupied police car, slamming the hood and blocking the windshield with placards. A female police officer was knocked to the street by advancing protesters, badly injuring her wrist.

The angry protest grew so violent that the Secret Service was forced to take the highly unusual step of using a backup route for Bush's motorcade because the primary route had been compromised by protesters, one of whom pounded his fist on the president's moving limousine.

All the while, angry demonstrators brandished signs with incendiary rhetoric, such as "9/11 - YOU LET IT HAPPEN, SHRUB," and "BUSH: BASTARD CHILD OF THE SUPREME COURT." One sign read: "IMPEACH THE COURT-APPOINTED JUNTA AND THE FASCIST, EGOMANIACAL, BLOOD-SWILLING BEAST!"

Yet none of these signs were cited in the national media's coverage of the event. By contrast, the press focused extensively on over-the-top signs held by Obama critics at the president's town hall event held Tuesday in New Hampshire.

The lead story in Wednesday's Washington Post, for example, is headlined: "Obama Faces 'Scare Tactics' Head-On."

On Sunday, The New York Times reported that a Democratic congressman discovered that "an opponent of health care reform hanged him in effigy" and was confronted by "200 angry conservatives." The article lamented "increasingly ugly scenes of partisan screaming matches, scuffles, threats and even arrests."

No such coverage was given to the Portland protest of Bush by The New York Times or the Washington Post, which witnessed the protest
http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2009...-bush-protest/

The left in America has tunnel vision they see and hear what they want to see and hear. How many of them remained silent when death threats were directed at Bush? How many were outraged when images of Bush were being hung with blood pouring from his head at so called “Peace Rallies”.

No, they were silent when the same things where happening to Bush. They were giddy and happy when it was Bush! They laughed and sang songs and joked and promoted there hate with graffiti on subways an corner streets. They mocked his religion his family and his intelligence. The ones calling for civility today were silent when the target was a Republican.
http://hiphoprepublican.com/general/...-left-forgets/



And how in the world can you forget the crazy left actually made a movie about killing the POTUS
http://www.usatoday.com/life/movies/...resident_x.htm

[dudalb]

Originally Posted by parky76

looks like a GOPer in disguise.

God, Parky, can't you take off the Partisan Blinders for one minute?

[Shalamar]

Ahh.. Therefore it is all Ok, Violence against elected officials.. Have at it!

They did it! That means we can throw bricks at their houses!

[cienaños]

doobiedoright: politics has always been an elaborate ball with masks and spectacle. What is clear is that, so is every other profession.

Though your point about the crazy lefty fringe acting crazy lefty fringy may be true, it does not provide any useful input that might help the issue. Instead of saying this side does X, and so does that other side, um, what can we do to adjust this circumstance? What you do do, is say, "So? You do it too! Mah!"

Ideas for Solutions, man. They are welcome here.

Peace

[Freddy]

Originally Posted by Regnad Kcin

C'mon, these same people were just as virulent and outspoken about the invasion and subsequent war in Iraq, not to mention Mr. Bush's immense tax cuts for the rich.

Oh, wait...

You're right, they weren't. But others were. And those people are cheering now, just as many Tea Partiers who are angry now were supportive of the Iraq war. What on earth does one have to do with the other? Do you have to be outraged at things that don't outrage you in order to be outraged at things that do? What is the point of your post, other than to expose yourself for a knee-jerk partisan criticizing others for being knee-jerk partisans?

That said, threats and vandalism are completely unjustified. Period. No buts, no qualification.

[doobiedoright]

Originally Posted by cienanos

doobiedoright: politics has always been an elaborate ball with masks and spectacle. What is clear is that, so is every other profession.

Though your point about the crazy lefty fringe acting crazy lefty fringy may be true, it does not provide any useful input that might help the issue. Instead of saying this side does X, and so does that other side, um, what can we do to adjust this circumstance? What you do do, is say, "So? You do it too! Mah!"

Ideas for Solutions, man. They are welcome here.

Peace

I agree with your point!
however the poster in question said he had never seen such things against the past president so I figured I would open his eyes.
All though how one can forget the movie made of killing a sitting president leaves my mind boggled!
Violence is not the answer!
I was just pointing out their are crazies every where!

[cienaños]

Originally Posted by doobiedoright

I agree with your point!
however the poster in question said he had never seen such things against the past president so I figured I would open his eyes.
All though how one can forget the movie made of killing a sitting president leaves my mind boggled!
Violence is not the answer!
I was just pointing out their are crazies every where!

I've only been on this thing for a while. And I can say with confidence, that although there is some wicked smart stuff around here, there is also stuff that is obviously questionable. In other words, the crazies are here too!

Bait questions are sometimes posted to gauge, categorize, and scoff at "newbies." Some call these clowns "vampires." There are also "fake" accounts here. If I were one by the way, I might or might not tell you.

For all I know, you're an agent.

Oh shoot, someone's knocking on my door. If I don't respond in 6 months, email the underlings.