Redesigning the human body

ArmillarySphere · 3rd November 2010, 08:24 AM

Something I've been thinking about for a while is genetic technology, and how we might use it. Basically, once we've figured out how our genome fits together and what genes go where, what's the next step beyond curing genetic diseases? How might we use genetics to improve our own species, bypassing the hunt-and-peck of evolution?

Deetee posted this link recently, which ends in a list of possible improvements. His list is directed to God, who obviously has an easier time figuring out how to do these things than we would have. Being bound by physics and biology, we might have a more difficult time doing some of these.

Originally Posted by Deetee

Give us a tail. It would be fun to wag, and we already have the muscle from version 1.0 which can do this – Extensor coccygis.
Similarly, It would be nice to have moveable ears, like lesser mammals do (and we have the auricularis muscle already).
Put our retinas in front of the optic nerve fibres in the eye, and get rid of our blind spots.
Make some of those genes function properly, please. Like LGGLO for synthesising vitamin C. Its there, in our bodies. Make it work!
Don’t make vital nerves like the ones controlling the larynx go on complicated detours around the body.
And give us a break from auto-immune diseases (I mean, what is the point?)
And Hayfever.
And make the metatarsals less fracture-prone.
Especially in Englishmen.

So, imagine that you're giving a team of geneticists, a good lab, a couple of billions to spend and a friendly parliament that won't outlaw your experiment. What would you like to do? Immunities? Super-strength? Catgirls?

Personally, I think some things are fairly obvious, like rerouting meandering nerves, fixing our eyes and repairing obviously broken genes. I expect those will mostly be of limited impact, though.

My list, obviously not exhaustive, but it's a start.

Vertically-slit pupils, like those of felines (and snakes, for that matter). Beside weirding out your granny, it might improve our low-light vision. However, I'm not sure if it will impact negatively on our vision otherwise. Is there any research?
Tetrachromacy, pushing our colour vision outwards. Birds generally see into the ultraviolet, but a better improvement might be downwards into the infrared. This conveys a survival edge since you could actually see hot surfaces glowing. I wonder what the impact on art will be?
Conscious control over some bodily functions. The female reproductive cycle rather springs to mind - why not let women ovulate when they choose to, and forego the whole mess when they're not interested in procreating? (Unfortunately, this would probably mean people being less careful about protection, so STDs might rise as a result. Oh well.)
Prevent bone loss in the elderly or microgravity situations. A spacefaring species should not have to deal with such troubles.
Similarly, there's no reason for muscles to atrophy as long as sufficient nutrition is provided.

C_Felix · 3rd November 2010, 08:27 AM

One boob on the back of a woman, ya know, for when you hug them.

Cuddles · 3rd November 2010, 08:59 AM

Originally Posted by ArmillarySphere

[*]Vertically-slit pupils, like those of felines (and snakes, for that matter). Beside weirding out your granny, it might improve our low-light vision. However, I'm not sure if it will impact negatively on our vision otherwise. Is there any research?

http://jeb.biologists.org/cgi/content/abstract/209/1/18
http://jeb.biologists.org/cgi/content/full/209/1/i
It doesn't seem to be to do with low light vision, but an additional adaptation to eliminate the problems caused by having multifocal lenses, which can provide sharper focus for colour images but can be interfered with by a round pupil. I can't find any mention of negative effects, so I assume it's just that it's not any use if you have the wrong kind of lens to start with.

Quote:

[*]Tetrachromacy, pushing our colour vision outwards. Birds generally see into the ultraviolet, but a better improvement might be downwards into the infrared. This conveys a survival edge since you could actually see hot surfaces glowing. I wonder what the impact on art will be?

Unfortunately, infra-red vision probably wouldn't be all that useful. The problem is that in order to not be swamped by ambient noise, the detector needs to be cooler than the object it's trying to view. That means that you would only ever be able to see things significantly hotter than the human body, rather than being able to have movie-style heat vision. There's a reason quite a few species can see into the ultraviolet, but only a few cold-blooded ones use infrared.

Quote:

[*]Prevent bone loss in the elderly or microgravity situations. A spacefaring species should not have to deal with such troubles.[*]Similarly, there's no reason for muscles to atrophy as long as sufficient nutrition is provided.

Well, there is a good reason for both of these - eliminating things you're not using saves energy and resources. Certainly a nice one to get rid of now though. While we're at it, why not get rid of old age as well? It's bad enough having muscles stop working just because you're not using them, no reason to have the body start falling apart when you actually are still trying to use it.

My additions:

Chlorophyll;
More interesting hair and skin colours;
Tentacles.

StuBob · 3rd November 2010, 09:28 AM

I love the idea of antlers.

But from a practical point of view, how about doing something better with the prostate?

SumDood · 3rd November 2010, 09:29 AM

- Increased brain capacity for the ability to focus on more than one thing at a time.
- Extra eyes on the sides and back of the head (maybe top?) for 360 degree field of vision. (we would need the added brain capacity for this to be any use)
- Have all joints able to rotate 360 degrees, rather than just one direction.

We couldn't get too drastic with the redesign if the new version is to function in our society with door knobs, jars to open, steering wheels and the like. But if EVERYTHING was going to be redesigned, we could rethink the two legs, two arms plan.

Soapy Sam · 3rd November 2010, 09:53 AM

Opposable pinkies, so you can tie shoelaces and drink tea at the same time.

LarianLeQuella · 3rd November 2010, 10:06 AM

Originally Posted by Cuddles

My additions:

Tentacles.

I didn't realize you wanted to break into Japanese porn...

Fnord · 3rd November 2010, 10:08 AM

Hermaphroditic, with separate organs for insemination and waste disposal. Also, place the reproductive organs far enough away from the waste disposal organs so as to not associate reproductive acts with anything "dirty".

dogjones · 3rd November 2010, 10:09 AM

How about giving us an immortal soul. That would be nice.

I Ratant · 3rd November 2010, 10:17 AM

Originally Posted by StuBob

I love the idea of antlers.

But from a practical point of view, how about doing something better with the prostate?

.
Frequent exercise will keep the prostate in working condition.
I'm told mine is a "young man's prostate"....

coalesce · 3rd November 2010, 10:31 AM

Originally Posted by Fnord

Hermaphroditic, with separate organs for insemination and waste disposal. Also, place the reproductive organs far enough away from the waste disposal organs so as to not associate reproductive acts with anything "dirty".

Well, clearly you've never been to Athens...

Michael

Lukraak_Sisser · 3rd November 2010, 11:02 AM

Make us all about 50% percent smaller
Add enzymes that allow metabolism of cellulose and lignin
Remove those ancient cravings for fat and sugar
Allow neurons to regenerate if needed
Strengthening the vertebrae to be really efficient in standing up
Design a way to quickly detect cancers and internal injury, probably by adding nerve cells inside the body.
Work out a way to allow limb regeneration (if lizards can do it)
Re-design the neuronic pathways so that ethanol and random plant products no longer influence them. And while we're at it, allow consious reprogramming in case errors occur.

Dinwar · 3rd November 2010, 11:38 AM

Quote:

Remove those ancient cravings for fat and sugar

I wouldn't say remove it--it is a useful tool in survival. How about "Adjust our sense of taste to fit a more modern diet"? The main problem is that in the past fat and sugar were limiting resources, and those who found them tasty ate more of them. Now they're not limiting, so the trait is no longer necessary; making a ballanced modern diet taste good would have the same effect in terms of survival, I'd think.

Quote:

Re-design the neuronic pathways so that ethanol and random plant products no longer influence them. And while we're at it, allow consious reprogramming in case errors occur.

I don't like this one. While I don't often get drunk (last time I did so was in 2008) I do appreciate the affects of controled randomness on cognition. For example, I doubt the Beer Can Experiment would have been as successfull to a fully sober geophysicst. In fact, I'd go so far as to say that if you remove the ability of ethanol to affect the brain you'd loose geology as a whole--we are the first alcohol-based organisms, after all.

My picks:

--The ability to more efficiently convert materials into necessary chemicals. For example, fixing that whole Vitamine C thing....
--Greater range of scale in our vision. For example, the ability to "zoom in" and see things at 10X or 20X or so magnification
--Resistance to ultraviolet light. If we can make Vitamine D some other way UV would no longer be an issue.
--Better anti-cancer systems.
--Neural/computer interface. I want to plug into a USB port and be able to upload/download things.
--Optical overlays. I'd LOVE a semi-transparant map that overlays my visual field, kinda like what Diablo and Diablo II do. This would also be useful for grocery lists, lists of errands, and the like. This one we don't even need to adjust the human body for--I already wear glasses, just put an LCD screen calibrated for being that close to my eye and hook it up to a computer on my belt that has a rechargeable battery. If I were better at the whole technology thing I'd already have this one.

casebro · 3rd November 2010, 11:58 AM

I met a petite blonde gal once whose visible body was covered with fine blonde hairs. I dunno the gene involved, but more of it wouldn't hurt.

Otherwise, anti-cancer genes.

And a basic tune-up system to eliminate the expression of genes with negative impacts. - if we could do that without us all becoming identical clones.

rjh01 · 3rd November 2010, 01:28 PM

How about a better communication system?

ArmillarySphere · 3rd November 2010, 03:37 PM

Originally Posted by Dinwar

I wouldn't say remove it--it is a useful tool in survival. How about "Adjust our sense of taste to fit a more modern diet"? The main problem is that in the past fat and sugar were limiting resources, and those who found them tasty ate more of them. Now they're not limiting, so the trait is no longer necessary; making a ballanced modern diet taste good would have the same effect in terms of survival, I'd think.

Speak for yourself - I love vegetables, but taste is very much a matter of taste. I doubt you could call this a generic improvement, since there may be situations where you need to store fat for future needs. Perhaps what's needed is simply a limiting mechanism, so that the number of fat cells don't exceed sane limits. Alternatively, make the fat cells react to some hormone which would then become a natural dieting drug. A very successful therapy against excessive weight today seems to be surgically reducing the size of the stomach, so maybe a natural size limit to its expansion could be built in. The stomach will expand or contract depending on the size of your meals, and this also affects your feeling of satiation.

Originally Posted by Dinwar

--Better anti-cancer systems.

Indeed, that would be beneficial. The question is how, since cancer is a failure in copying the "instruction set" correctly. Any extra mechanism for triggering apoptosis is risk-prone, and may be disabled by the very same mutation that caused the cancer.

As far as I understand it, current research seems to link ageing with cancer protection: All cells come with a "mitosis counter" which is increased (decreased?) every time a cell divides. Once it reaches the limit, the cell can no longer divide. The problem is that in cancer cells, this limiting mechanism may be disabled due to copying errors in the DNA.

Originally Posted by Dinwar

--Neural/computer interface. I want to plug into a USB port and be able to upload/download things.
--Optical overlays.

These two I think are best left to artificial implants, not genetics. The problem with linking computers to the brain using a genetic modification is that computers change too quickly to make a permanent installation feasible. Besides, I think expressing the USB standard in DNA might be a tad tricky.

I think the wildest yet was adding chloroplasts to our skin. That would certainly be a way to go *really* vegan - become a plant yourself!

Dinwar · 3rd November 2010, 03:54 PM

Quote:

I think the wildest yet was adding chloroplasts to our skin. That would certainly be a way to go *really* vegan - become a plant yourself!
Today 01:28 PM

I'd add some duck DNA to it...

Quote:

Speak for yourself - I love vegetables, but taste is very much a matter of taste.

Oh, I do too--my dad used to complain that carrots didn't last a week, but a bag of candy would last all year! But a lot of this is physiological as well--the reason sugar tastes sweet is because the people who didn't like sugar (I assume it didn't taste sweet) didn't eat enough and starved. Same with fats. It's kinda hard to imagine today, but for a LONG time food was a major issue with humans, and that's certainly left a mark on our species.

Quote:

Perhaps what's needed is simply a limiting mechanism, so that the number of fat cells don't exceed sane limits. Alternatively, make the fat cells react to some hormone which would then become a natural dieting drug.

Hm....How about a way to identify which nutrients we need? For example, have a system that warns "Idiot, you need more calcium today". Cravings might work (there's already a mechanism we can exploit), we'd just have to have anti-cravings as well (as in, once you get what you need, plus perhaps a little more just in case, you no longer want that food/drink).

Quote:

These two I think are best left to artificial implants, not genetics. The problem with linking computers to the brain using a genetic modification is that computers change too quickly to make a permanent installation feasible. Besides, I think expressing the USB standard in DNA might be a tad tricky.

Agreed. I guess once I get my computer/LCD display thingy, the line between "me" and "machine" will already begin to blur--where you store your memories has never historically been a major issue.

Weak Kitten · 3rd November 2010, 04:03 PM

Make the aging process less painful. Or just get rid of it entirely. I don't mind everyone just dropping dead at the age of 100 or something but the long slow slide to that point can be terrible.

blutoski · 3rd November 2010, 04:10 PM

As I thought about this, I came to the conclusion that there is no single design I would recommend...

A best outcome would be seven billion custom jobbies, each optimized to the role a person wants to pursue.

People who love to fly would go for wings and a light skeleton, swimmers like myself would choose to breathe underwater.

Perhaps the bravest of use would choose to be intensely ruggedized and shot into space to colonize other planets.

GlennB · 3rd November 2010, 04:18 PM

Teeth that don't have nerves inside them. That's all.

portlandatheist · 3rd November 2010, 04:27 PM

A more appropriate pain system. Pain serves a very useful purpose but can go very haywire, especially lower back pain.
Higher nerve density in the eye for better resolution, this may require a larger brain as well.
A USB port

Soapy Sam · 3rd November 2010, 04:35 PM

USB3 ports.

dogjones · 3rd November 2010, 06:25 PM

Originally Posted by Dinwar

I doubt the Beer Can Experiment would have been as successfull

I love that you misspelled successful in the same sentence as a Beer Can Experiment - huzzah!

Delvo · 3rd November 2010, 07:57 PM

Originally Posted by ArmillarySphere

[*]Prevent bone loss in the elderly or microgravity situations. A spacefaring species should not have to deal with such troubles.

One way to fix that would also fix a few other things: just don't make the bones out of a type of salt in the first place. Using some kind of protein or other polymer instead would mean they wouldn't be so quick to start dissolving away, because they'd contain no particular resources that other body cells use (calcium ions). We'd still need to store calcium somewhere, but just scattered little beads/pebbles of it should be enough. And given how greedy our soft tissues are about taking calcium away from the bones, it's apparently a rather valuable nutrient, which we wouldn't need nearly as much of if we didn't make bones out of it. On top of that, a structure made of a tough polymer can be more impact-resistant, and it did structurally fail, it would tend do so by denting or bending, or at least breaking relatively cleanly, instead of by cracking or shattering, so surrounding soft tissues wouldn't be subjected to jagged splinters. That reduced severity of a bone-damaging injury, plus the fact that our cells can break down, alter, move, and build up organic compounds more quickly and efficiently than they can do so with minerals, would make healing/repair of such injuries faster, less painful, and more thorough.

Carbon fiber would be even more interesting structurally, but might be impossible for organisms to produce; the way we do it now for industrial uses involves rather high temperatures and pressures.

Originally Posted by ArmillarySphere

Similarly, there's no reason for muscles to atrophy as long as sufficient nutrition is provided.

Not having them shrink to the level of use would also mean they couldn't be built up by use either.

Originally Posted by Cuddles

Chlorophyll

It's only useful if what you ingest (other than water and carbon dioxide) is raw ions and radicals.

I prefer sticking to eating complex compounds.

Originally Posted by Cuddles

More interesting hair and skin colours

That's probably going to be done. Even if nobody invents any new colors, people will buy the genes for the established natural but not-so-common ones, so they'll become more common.

Avatar49 · 3rd November 2010, 08:06 PM

Originally Posted by casebro

I met a petite blonde gal once whose visible body was covered with fine blonde hairs. I dunno the gene involved, but more of it wouldn't hurt.

And a basic tune-up system to eliminate the expression of genes with negative impacts. - if we could do that without us all becoming identical clones.

I had a girlfriend like that once and the hair was translucent and you are right if we find that gene it would be good to reproduce it.

tyr_13 · 3rd November 2010, 08:14 PM

-enhanced digestive and metabolic systems
-electric generating organs (and adjusted pain thresholds needed to use them)
-bio-luminescent pigment tolerance (I'd love to have a glowing tattoo.)
-carbon-fiber esque cored cranial hair
-better foot design (Laying that additional joint down doesn't do much.)
-More brain power in specific areas

jaydeehess · 3rd November 2010, 08:25 PM

- Organ regeneration. As it stands now the liver is the only internal organ that can regenerate.
Kidneys that could take a beating and then regenerate would be a bonus as would a pancreas that could do the same.

- A more efficient waste disposal system. Perhaps a small pouch to one side of the navel that holds a dry powdery waste product.

jaydeehess · 3rd November 2010, 08:27 PM

Originally Posted by tyr_13

-electric generating organs (and adjusted pain thresholds needed to use them)

Live in northern Canada and wear wool sweaters in the winter.
(goes a long way towards that bio-luminesnce as well)

rjh01 · 4th November 2010, 03:25 AM

Originally Posted by GlennB

Teeth that don't have nerves inside them. That's all.

Have teeth that are replaced after 10 - 20 years or so.

quarky · 4th November 2010, 06:44 AM

I fancy something like a Siamese octuplet; a single, central head with 32 appendages, arranged spherically. This human would roll along the shores of warm oceans, grabbing shellfish along the way. The arms and legs would fold inward, like a hoberman sphere, when needing to retain more heat.

Cuddles · 4th November 2010, 06:55 AM

Originally Posted by LarianLeQuella

I didn't realize you wanted to break into Japanese porn...

Well, that could be an added advantage, but seriously, tentacles are awesome. Opposable thumbs are supposedly one of the great features that makes us such good tool users. But just imagine if we had tentacles instead of fingers. No need for opposable thumbs at all, since every finger would be able to oppose itself. The only real down side I can see is that clumsy people would keep tying themselves in knots.

Originally Posted by Delvo

It's only useful if what you ingest (other than water and carbon dioxide) is raw ions and radicals.

I work at a particle accelerator, so no problems here.

Quote:

That's probably going to be done. Even if nobody invents any new colors, people will buy the genes for the established natural but not-so-common ones, so they'll become more common.

Yeat, but the established natural ones are boring. Where's my UV-reactive pink and green hair, dammit? While we're at it, lets do something about baldness as well, since I may not be able to pull off the silly hair thing quite so well these days.

quarky · 4th November 2010, 09:24 AM

Originally Posted by Cuddles

Well, that could be an added advantage, but seriously, tentacles are awesome. Opposable thumbs are supposedly one of the great features that makes us such good tool users. But just imagine if we had tentacles instead of fingers. No need for opposable thumbs at all, since every finger would be able to oppose itself. The only real down side I can see is that clumsy people would keep tying themselves in knots.

I work at a particle accelerator, so no problems here.

Yeat, but the established natural ones are boring. Where's my UV-reactive pink and green hair, dammit? While we're at it, lets do something about baldness as well, since I may not be able to pull off the silly hair thing quite so well these days.

Don't you also work at a particle decelerator?

TraneWreck · 4th November 2010, 09:57 AM

I'll take a prehensile tail, some gorilla arms, better ears, and a ~~giant~~, gianter member.

quarky · 4th November 2010, 10:02 AM

A prehensile gianter member.

quarky · 4th November 2010, 10:14 AM

I like to swim, so for that purpose, I'd like massive blubber/and/or awesome fur, and some tubular nostril extensions that came up to the top of my head.

Though my desires are fraught with proclivity to the beach, I 'd like to go on record:

I heartily endorse non-beach engineering, too.

I'd like to see some human breeds that were designed for deserts; frozen tundra; caves, etc.

We really need to branch out. Look what the wolf was able to do, in a short 20,ooo years or so:

Miniature Yorkshire terriors/chihuahuas.

And to whomever mentioned getting smaller...

I heartily endorse that. If we weighed 50 lbs, average, so many problems would be solved.

Thermodynamically, of course, more group hugs are implied, unless global warming is true, in which case, less hugging.

TraneWreck · 4th November 2010, 10:24 AM

Originally Posted by quarky

A prehensile gianter member.

My only concern is that the little fella would be about 2 genes away from sentience at that point, which isn't so bad, except I'd feel guilty about cramming it down my pants. It might have Constitutional rights.

I just don't think society is ready yet. But we can keep fighting the good fight.

quarky · 4th November 2010, 10:29 AM

We could postpone its rights with drugs.

Or would that be wrongity?

Paul2 · 4th November 2010, 12:30 PM

How about

brains that can't think stupid things.

Dinwar · 4th November 2010, 12:37 PM

Quote:

brains that can't think stupid things.

No good--you'd have to have some human judge what's stupid and what isn't, and while we can all think of people we wouldn't mind being given that power I'm not sure we could come up with any one person or group of people that could definitively determine what's stupid and what's not. I mean, imagine of Sarah Palin was given the authority to do so...

catsmate1 · 4th November 2010, 01:51 PM

Originally Posted by StuBob

But from a practical point of view, how about doing something better with the prostate?

A good start.

Originally Posted by Lukraak_Sisser

Add enzymes that allow metabolism of cellulose and lignin
Remove those ancient cravings for fat and sugar
Allow neurons to regenerate if needed

All good.

Originally Posted by Lukraak_Sisser

Strengthening the vertebrae to be really efficient in standing up

We spend a lot of time sitting down, not what we evolved for and suffer back pain as a result. I'd like a full spinal redesign.

Originally Posted by Lukraak_Sisser

Design a way to quickly detect cancers and internal injury, probably by adding nerve cells inside the body.

Better data checking/correction during the cell duplication process.

Originally Posted by Lukraak_Sisser

Work out a way to allow limb regeneration (if lizards can do it)

And teeth.

Originally Posted by portlandatheist

A more appropriate pain system. Pain serves a very useful purpose but can go very haywire, especially lower back pain.

The ability to switch off pain signals when we've realised something's wrong or needs attention.

Originally Posted by portlandatheist

A USB port

Nah, wireless USB.

Originally Posted by Delvo

Carbon fiber would be even more interesting structurally, but might be impossible for organisms to produce; the way we do it now for industrial uses involves rather high temperatures and pressures.

To paraphrase a geneticist of my acquaintance, give me a hundred years, the best minds and unlimited resources and I'll do it. Perhaps some sort of symbiotic bacteria?

Personally I'd like four arms each with three main bones and better joints for added flexibility.

3rd November 2010, 08:24 AM	#1
ArmillarySphere Muse Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: London Posts: 713	Redesigning the human body Something I've been thinking about for a while is genetic technology, and how we might use it. Basically, once we've figured out how our genome fits together and what genes go where, what's the next step beyond curing genetic diseases? How might we use genetics to improve our own species, bypassing the hunt-and-peck of evolution? Deetee posted this link recently, which ends in a list of possible improvements. His list is directed to God, who obviously has an easier time figuring out how to do these things than we would have. Being bound by physics and biology, we might have a more difficult time doing some of these. Originally Posted by Deetee Give us a tail. It would be fun to wag, and we already have the muscle from version 1.0 which can do this – Extensor coccygis. Similarly, It would be nice to have moveable ears, like lesser mammals do (and we have the auricularis muscle already). Put our retinas in front of the optic nerve fibres in the eye, and get rid of our blind spots. Make some of those genes function properly, please. Like LGGLO for synthesising vitamin C. Its there, in our bodies. Make it work! Don’t make vital nerves like the ones controlling the larynx go on complicated detours around the body. And give us a break from auto-immune diseases (I mean, what is the point?) And Hayfever. And make the metatarsals less fracture-prone. Especially in Englishmen. So, imagine that you're giving a team of geneticists, a good lab, a couple of billions to spend and a friendly parliament that won't outlaw your experiment. What would you like to do? Immunities? Super-strength? Catgirls? Personally, I think some things are fairly obvious, like rerouting meandering nerves, fixing our eyes and repairing obviously broken genes. I expect those will mostly be of limited impact, though. My list, obviously not exhaustive, but it's a start. Vertically-slit pupils, like those of felines (and snakes, for that matter). Beside weirding out your granny, it might improve our low-light vision. However, I'm not sure if it will impact negatively on our vision otherwise. Is there any research? Tetrachromacy, pushing our colour vision outwards. Birds generally see into the ultraviolet, but a better improvement might be downwards into the infrared. This conveys a survival edge since you could actually see hot surfaces glowing. I wonder what the impact on art will be? Conscious control over some bodily functions. The female reproductive cycle rather springs to mind - why not let women ovulate when they choose to, and forego the whole mess when they're not interested in procreating? (Unfortunately, this would probably mean people being less careful about protection, so STDs might rise as a result. Oh well.) Prevent bone loss in the elderly or microgravity situations. A spacefaring species should not have to deal with such troubles. Similarly, there's no reason for muscles to atrophy as long as sufficient nutrition is provided.

3rd November 2010, 08:59 AM	#3
Cuddles Decoy Moderator Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: A magical land full of pink fluffy sheeps and bunnies Posts: 16,586	Originally Posted by ArmillarySphere []Vertically-slit pupils, like those of felines (and snakes, for that matter). Beside weirding out your granny, it might improve our low-light vision. However, I'm not sure if it will impact negatively on our vision otherwise. Is there any research? http://jeb.biologists.org/cgi/content/abstract/209/1/18 http://jeb.biologists.org/cgi/content/full/209/1/i It doesn't seem to be to do with low light vision, but an additional adaptation to eliminate the problems caused by having multifocal lenses, which can provide sharper focus for colour images but can be interfered with by a round pupil. I can't find any mention of negative effects, so I assume it's just that it's not any use if you have the wrong kind of lens to start with. Quote: []Tetrachromacy, pushing our colour vision outwards. Birds generally see into the ultraviolet, but a better improvement might be downwards into the infrared. This conveys a survival edge since you could actually see hot surfaces glowing. I wonder what the impact on art will be? Unfortunately, infra-red vision probably wouldn't be all that useful. The problem is that in order to not be swamped by ambient noise, the detector needs to be cooler than the object it's trying to view. That means that you would only ever be able to see things significantly hotter than the human body, rather than being able to have movie-style heat vision. There's a reason quite a few species can see into the ultraviolet, but only a few cold-blooded ones use infrared. Quote: []Prevent bone loss in the elderly or microgravity situations. A spacefaring species should not have to deal with such troubles.[]Similarly, there's no reason for muscles to atrophy as long as sufficient nutrition is provided. Well, there is a good reason for both of these - eliminating things you're not using saves energy and resources. Certainly a nice one to get rid of now though. While we're at it, why not get rid of old age as well? It's bad enough having muscles stop working just because you're not using them, no reason to have the body start falling apart when you actually are still trying to use it. My additions: Chlorophyll; More interesting hair and skin colours; Tentacles.
	__________________ I am not a little teapot.

3rd November 2010, 09:28 AM	#4
StuBob Scholar Join Date: Mar 2002 Posts: 85	I love the idea of antlers. But from a practical point of view, how about doing something better with the prostate?
StuBob Scholar Join Date: Mar 2002 Posts: 85

3rd November 2010, 09:53 AM	#6
Soapy Sam NLH Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 25,885	Opposable pinkies, so you can tie shoelaces and drink tea at the same time.
Soapy Sam NLH Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 25,885

3rd November 2010, 10:06 AM	#7
LarianLeQuella Elf Wino Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: 3rd Rock from the Sun Posts: 1,995	Originally Posted by Cuddles My additions: Tentacles. I didn't realize you wanted to break into Japanese porn...
	__________________ My crappy blog that no one should be forced to read. Ever... But I like traffic and comments, so have at it if you please. Larian LeQuella Armyn ab Treanid

3rd November 2010, 08:27 AM	#2
C_Felix Graduate Poster Join Date: Jul 2009 Location: Right outside Raleigh, NC Posts: 1,041	One boob on the back of a woman, ya know, for when you hug them.

3rd November 2010, 09:29 AM	#5
SumDood Muse Join Date: May 2008 Location: Alabama Posts: 707	- Increased brain capacity for the ability to focus on more than one thing at a time. - Extra eyes on the sides and back of the head (maybe top?) for 360 degree field of vision. (we would need the added brain capacity for this to be any use) - Have all joints able to rotate 360 degrees, rather than just one direction. We couldn't get too drastic with the redesign if the new version is to function in our society with door knobs, jars to open, steering wheels and the like. But if EVERYTHING was going to be redesigned, we could rethink the two legs, two arms plan.

3rd November 2010, 10:08 AM	#8
Fnord Metasyntactic Variable Join Date: Oct 2006 Posts: 6,633	Hermaphroditic, with separate organs for insemination and waste disposal. Also, place the reproductive organs far enough away from the waste disposal organs so as to not associate reproductive acts with anything "dirty".
	__________________ Belief is the subjective acceptance of a (valid or invalid) concept, opinion, or theory; Faith is the unreasoned belief in improvable things; *and Knowledge* is the reasoned belief in provable things. Belief itself proves nothing.**

3rd November 2010, 10:09 AM	#9
dogjones Graduate Poster Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Bermuda Posts: 1,281	How about giving us an immortal soul. That would be nice.
	__________________ It's great being ideologically flexible.

3rd November 2010, 10:17 AM	#10
I Ratant Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 15,305	Originally Posted by StuBob I love the idea of antlers. But from a practical point of view, how about doing something better with the prostate? . Frequent exercise will keep the prostate in working condition. I'm told mine is a "young man's prostate"....

3rd November 2010, 10:31 AM	#11
coalesce Illuminator Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Queens, NY Posts: 3,350	Originally Posted by Fnord Hermaphroditic, with separate organs for insemination and waste disposal. Also, place the reproductive organs far enough away from the waste disposal organs so as to not associate reproductive acts with anything "dirty". Well, clearly you've never been to Athens... Michael
	__________________ "I want the kids in bed by nine, the dog fed, the yard watered and the gate locked. And get a note to the milkman NO MORE CHEESE!"

3rd November 2010, 11:02 AM	#12
Lukraak_Sisser Graduate Poster Join Date: Aug 2009 Posts: 1,619	Make us all about 50% percent smaller Add enzymes that allow metabolism of cellulose and lignin Remove those ancient cravings for fat and sugar Allow neurons to regenerate if needed Strengthening the vertebrae to be really efficient in standing up Design a way to quickly detect cancers and internal injury, probably by adding nerve cells inside the body. Work out a way to allow limb regeneration (if lizards can do it) Re-design the neuronic pathways so that ethanol and random plant products no longer influence them. And while we're at it, allow consious reprogramming in case errors occur.

3rd November 2010, 11:38 AM	#13
Dinwar Philosopher Join Date: Jul 2010 Posts: 8,945	Quote: Remove those ancient cravings for fat and sugar I wouldn't say remove it--it is a useful tool in survival. How about "Adjust our sense of taste to fit a more modern diet"? The main problem is that in the past fat and sugar were limiting resources, and those who found them tasty ate more of them. Now they're not limiting, so the trait is no longer necessary; making a ballanced modern diet taste good would have the same effect in terms of survival, I'd think. Quote: Re-design the neuronic pathways so that ethanol and random plant products no longer influence them. And while we're at it, allow consious reprogramming in case errors occur. I don't like this one. While I don't often get drunk (last time I did so was in 2008) I do appreciate the affects of controled randomness on cognition. For example, I doubt the Beer Can Experiment would have been as successfull to a fully sober geophysicst. In fact, I'd go so far as to say that if you remove the ability of ethanol to affect the brain you'd loose geology as a whole--we are the first alcohol-based organisms, after all. My picks: --The ability to more efficiently convert materials into necessary chemicals. For example, fixing that whole Vitamine C thing.... --Greater range of scale in our vision. For example, the ability to "zoom in" and see things at 10X or 20X or so magnification --Resistance to ultraviolet light. If we can make Vitamine D some other way UV would no longer be an issue. --Better anti-cancer systems. --Neural/computer interface. I want to plug into a USB port and be able to upload/download things. --Optical overlays. I'd LOVE a semi-transparant map that overlays my visual field, kinda like what Diablo and Diablo II do. This would also be useful for grocery lists, lists of errands, and the like. This one we don't even need to adjust the human body for--I already wear glasses, just put an LCD screen calibrated for being that close to my eye and hook it up to a computer on my belt that has a rechargeable battery. If I were better at the whole technology thing I'd already have this one.
Dinwar Philosopher Join Date: Jul 2010 Posts: 8,945	__________________ GENERATION 8: The first time you see this, copy it into your sig on any forum and add 1 to the generation. Social experiment. Ein krieg ohne feinde.

3rd November 2010, 11:58 AM	#14
casebro Philosopher Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 6,794	I met a petite blonde gal once whose visible body was covered with fine blonde hairs. I dunno the gene involved, but more of it wouldn't hurt. Otherwise, anti-cancer genes. And a basic tune-up system to eliminate the expression of genes with negative impacts. - if we could do that without us all becoming identical clones.
casebro Philosopher Join Date: Jun 2005 Posts: 6,794	__________________ Please pardon me for having ideas, not facts. Some have called me cynical, but I don't believe them. It's not how many breaths you take. It's how many times you have been breathless that counts.

3rd November 2010, 01:28 PM	#15
rjh01 Gentleman of leisure Tagger Join Date: May 2005 Location: Planet Earth Posts: 17,187	How about a better communication system?

3rd November 2010, 03:37 PM	#16
ArmillarySphere Muse Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: London Posts: 713	Originally Posted by Dinwar I wouldn't say remove it--it is a useful tool in survival. How about "Adjust our sense of taste to fit a more modern diet"? The main problem is that in the past fat and sugar were limiting resources, and those who found them tasty ate more of them. Now they're not limiting, so the trait is no longer necessary; making a ballanced modern diet taste good would have the same effect in terms of survival, I'd think. Speak for yourself - I love vegetables, but taste is very much a matter of taste. I doubt you could call this a generic improvement, since there may be situations where you need to store fat for future needs. Perhaps what's needed is simply a limiting mechanism, so that the number of fat cells don't exceed sane limits. Alternatively, make the fat cells react to some hormone which would then become a natural dieting drug. A very successful therapy against excessive weight today seems to be surgically reducing the size of the stomach, so maybe a natural size limit to its expansion could be built in. The stomach will expand or contract depending on the size of your meals, and this also affects your feeling of satiation. Originally Posted by Dinwar --Better anti-cancer systems. Indeed, that would be beneficial. The question is how, since cancer is a failure in copying the "instruction set" correctly. Any extra mechanism for triggering apoptosis is risk-prone, and may be disabled by the very same mutation that caused the cancer. As far as I understand it, current research seems to link ageing with cancer protection: All cells come with a "mitosis counter" which is increased (decreased?) every time a cell divides. Once it reaches the limit, the cell can no longer divide. The problem is that in cancer cells, this limiting mechanism may be disabled due to copying errors in the DNA. Originally Posted by Dinwar --Neural/computer interface. I want to plug into a USB port and be able to upload/download things. --Optical overlays. These two I think are best left to artificial implants, not genetics. The problem with linking computers to the brain using a genetic modification is that computers change too quickly to make a permanent installation feasible. Besides, I think expressing the USB standard in DNA might be a tad tricky. I think the wildest yet was adding chloroplasts to our skin. That would certainly be a way to go really vegan - become a plant yourself!

3rd November 2010, 03:54 PM	#17
Dinwar Philosopher Join Date: Jul 2010 Posts: 8,945	Quote: I think the wildest yet was adding chloroplasts to our skin. That would certainly be a way to go really vegan - become a plant yourself! Today 01:28 PM I'd add some duck DNA to it... Quote: Speak for yourself - I love vegetables, but taste is very much a matter of taste. Oh, I do too--my dad used to complain that carrots didn't last a week, but a bag of candy would last all year! But a lot of this is physiological as well--the reason sugar tastes sweet is because the people who didn't like sugar (I assume it didn't taste sweet) didn't eat enough and starved. Same with fats. It's kinda hard to imagine today, but for a LONG time food was a major issue with humans, and that's certainly left a mark on our species. Quote: Perhaps what's needed is simply a limiting mechanism, so that the number of fat cells don't exceed sane limits. Alternatively, make the fat cells react to some hormone which would then become a natural dieting drug. Hm....How about a way to identify which nutrients we need? For example, have a system that warns "Idiot, you need more calcium today". Cravings might work (there's already a mechanism we can exploit), we'd just have to have anti-cravings as well (as in, once you get what you need, plus perhaps a little more just in case, you no longer want that food/drink). Quote: These two I think are best left to artificial implants, not genetics. The problem with linking computers to the brain using a genetic modification is that computers change too quickly to make a permanent installation feasible. Besides, I think expressing the USB standard in DNA might be a tad tricky. Agreed. I guess once I get my computer/LCD display thingy, the line between "me" and "machine" will already begin to blur--where you store your memories has never historically been a major issue.
Dinwar Philosopher Join Date: Jul 2010 Posts: 8,945	__________________ GENERATION 8: The first time you see this, copy it into your sig on any forum and add 1 to the generation. Social experiment. Ein krieg ohne feinde.

3rd November 2010, 04:03 PM	#18
Weak Kitten Graduate Poster Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: Lost and lonely...will you be my friend? Posts: 1,726	Make the aging process less painful. Or just get rid of it entirely. I don't mind everyone just dropping dead at the age of 100 or something but the long slow slide to that point can be terrible.

3rd November 2010, 04:10 PM	#19
blutoski Philosopher Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Vancouver BC Canada Posts: 5,983	As I thought about this, I came to the conclusion that there is no single design I would recommend... A best outcome would be seven billion custom jobbies, each optimized to the role a person wants to pursue. People who love to fly would go for wings and a light skeleton, swimmers like myself would choose to breathe underwater. Perhaps the bravest of use would choose to be intensely ruggedized and shot into space to colonize other planets.
	__________________ "Sometimes it's better to light a flamethrower than curse the darkness." - Terry Pratchett

3rd November 2010, 04:18 PM	#20
GlennB Jellied eel and offal fancier Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Arcadia Posts: 8,951	Teeth that don't have nerves inside them. That's all.

3rd November 2010, 04:27 PM	#21
portlandatheist Master Poster Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 2,111	A more appropriate pain system. Pain serves a very useful purpose but can go very haywire, especially lower back pain. Higher nerve density in the eye for better resolution, this may require a larger brain as well. A USB port

3rd November 2010, 04:35 PM	#22
Soapy Sam NLH Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 25,885	USB3 ports.
Soapy Sam NLH Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 25,885

3rd November 2010, 06:25 PM	#23
dogjones Graduate Poster Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Bermuda Posts: 1,281	Originally Posted by Dinwar I doubt the Beer Can Experiment would have been as successfull I love that you misspelled successful in the same sentence as a Beer Can Experiment - huzzah!
	__________________ It's great being ideologically flexible.

3rd November 2010, 07:57 PM	#24
Delvo Illuminator Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Harrisburg, Pennsylvania Posts: 3,884	Originally Posted by ArmillarySphere []Prevent bone loss in the elderly or microgravity situations. A spacefaring species should not have to deal with such troubles. One way to fix that would also fix a few other things: just don't make the bones out of a type of salt* in the first place. Using some kind of protein or other polymer instead would mean they wouldn't be so quick to start dissolving away, because they'd contain no particular resources that other body cells use (calcium ions). We'd still need to store calcium somewhere, but just scattered little beads/pebbles of it should be enough. And given how greedy our soft tissues are about taking calcium away from the bones, it's apparently a rather valuable nutrient, which we wouldn't need nearly as much of if we didn't make bones out of it. On top of that, a structure made of a tough polymer can be more impact-resistant, and it did structurally fail, it would tend do so by denting or bending, or at least breaking relatively cleanly, instead of by cracking or shattering, so surrounding soft tissues wouldn't be subjected to jagged splinters. That reduced severity of a bone-damaging injury, plus the fact that our cells can break down, alter, move, and build up organic compounds more quickly and efficiently than they can do so with minerals, would make healing/repair of such injuries faster, less painful, and more thorough. Carbon fiber would be even more interesting structurally, but might be impossible for organisms to produce; the way we do it now for industrial uses involves rather high temperatures and pressures. Originally Posted by ArmillarySphere Similarly, there's no reason for muscles to atrophy as long as sufficient nutrition is provided. Not having them shrink to the level of use would also mean they couldn't be built up by use either. Originally Posted by Cuddles Chlorophyll It's only useful if what you ingest (other than water and carbon dioxide) is raw ions and radicals. I prefer sticking to eating complex compounds. Originally Posted by Cuddles More interesting hair and skin colours That's probably going to be done. Even if nobody invents any new colors, people will buy the genes for the established natural but not-so-common ones, so they'll become more common.
	Last edited by Delvo; 3rd November 2010 at 07:59 PM.

3rd November 2010, 08:06 PM	#25
Avatar49 Scholar Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 63	Originally Posted by casebro I met a petite blonde gal once whose visible body was covered with fine blonde hairs. I dunno the gene involved, but more of it wouldn't hurt. And a basic tune-up system to eliminate the expression of genes with negative impacts. - if we could do that without us all becoming identical clones. I had a girlfriend like that once and the hair was translucent and you are right if we find that gene it would be good to reproduce it.
Avatar49 Scholar Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 63

3rd November 2010, 08:14 PM	#26
tyr_13 Philosopher Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Falconer, NY Posts: 9,662	-enhanced digestive and metabolic systems -electric generating organs (and adjusted pain thresholds needed to use them) -bio-luminescent pigment tolerance (I'd love to have a glowing tattoo.) -carbon-fiber esque cored cranial hair -better foot design (Laying that additional joint down doesn't do much.) -More brain power in specific areas
	__________________ Circled nothing is still nothing. "Nothing will stop the U.S. from being a world leader, not even a handful of adults who want their kids to take science lessons from a book that mentions unicorns six times." -UNLoVedRebel Mumpsimus: a stubborn person who insists on making an error in spite of being shown that it is wrong

3rd November 2010, 08:25 PM	#27
jaydeehess Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: I beedunk 40 miles from the border Posts: 10,810	- Organ regeneration. As it stands now the liver is the only internal organ that can regenerate. Kidneys that could take a beating and then regenerate would be a bonus as would a pancreas that could do the same. - A more efficient waste disposal system. Perhaps a small pouch to one side of the navel that holds a dry powdery waste product.

3rd November 2010, 08:27 PM	#28
jaydeehess Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: I beedunk 40 miles from the border Posts: 10,810	Originally Posted by tyr_13 -electric generating organs (and adjusted pain thresholds needed to use them) Live in northern Canada and wear wool sweaters in the winter. (goes a long way towards that bio-luminesnce as well)

4th November 2010, 03:25 AM	#29
rjh01 Gentleman of leisure Tagger Join Date: May 2005 Location: Planet Earth Posts: 17,187	Originally Posted by GlennB Teeth that don't have nerves inside them. That's all. Have teeth that are replaced after 10 - 20 years or so.

4th November 2010, 06:44 AM	#30
quarky Banned Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 20,454	I fancy something like a Siamese octuplet; a single, central head with 32 appendages, arranged spherically. This human would roll along the shores of warm oceans, grabbing shellfish along the way. The arms and legs would fold inward, like a hoberman sphere, when needing to retain more heat.
quarky Banned Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 20,454

4th November 2010, 06:55 AM	#31
Cuddles Decoy Moderator Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: A magical land full of pink fluffy sheeps and bunnies Posts: 16,586	Originally Posted by LarianLeQuella I didn't realize you wanted to break into Japanese porn... Well, that could be an added advantage, but seriously, tentacles are awesome. Opposable thumbs are supposedly one of the great features that makes us such good tool users. But just imagine if we had tentacles instead of fingers. No need for opposable thumbs at all, since every finger would be able to oppose itself. The only real down side I can see is that clumsy people would keep tying themselves in knots. Originally Posted by Delvo It's only useful if what you ingest (other than water and carbon dioxide) is raw ions and radicals. I work at a particle accelerator, so no problems here. Quote: That's probably going to be done. Even if nobody invents any new colors, people will buy the genes for the established natural but not-so-common ones, so they'll become more common. Yeat, but the established natural ones are boring. Where's my UV-reactive pink and green hair, dammit? While we're at it, lets do something about baldness as well, since I may not be able to pull off the silly hair thing quite so well these days.
	__________________ I am not a little teapot.

4th November 2010, 09:24 AM	#32
quarky Banned Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 20,454	Originally Posted by Cuddles Well, that could be an added advantage, but seriously, tentacles are awesome. Opposable thumbs are supposedly one of the great features that makes us such good tool users. But just imagine if we had tentacles instead of fingers. No need for opposable thumbs at all, since every finger would be able to oppose itself. The only real down side I can see is that clumsy people would keep tying themselves in knots. I work at a particle accelerator, so no problems here. Yeat, but the established natural ones are boring. Where's my UV-reactive pink and green hair, dammit? While we're at it, lets do something about baldness as well, since I may not be able to pull off the silly hair thing quite so well these days. Don't you also work at a particle decelerator?
quarky Banned Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 20,454

4th November 2010, 09:57 AM	#33
TraneWreck Philosopher Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Chicago Posts: 6,414	I'll take a prehensile tail, some gorilla arms, better ears, and a ~~giant~~, gianter member.

4th November 2010, 10:02 AM	#34
quarky Banned Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 20,454	A prehensile gianter member.
quarky Banned Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 20,454

4th November 2010, 10:14 AM	#35
quarky Banned Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 20,454	I like to swim, so for that purpose, I'd like massive blubber/and/or awesome fur, and some tubular nostril extensions that came up to the top of my head. Though my desires are fraught with proclivity to the beach, I 'd like to go on record: I heartily endorse non-beach engineering, too. I'd like to see some human breeds that were designed for deserts; frozen tundra; caves, etc. We really need to branch out. Look what the wolf was able to do, in a short 20,ooo years or so: Miniature Yorkshire terriors/chihuahuas. And to whomever mentioned getting smaller... I heartily endorse that. If we weighed 50 lbs, average, so many problems would be solved. Thermodynamically, of course, more group hugs are implied, unless global warming is true, in which case, less hugging.
quarky Banned Join Date: Oct 2007 Posts: 20,454