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Fishstick · 28th January 2011, 04:52 AM

Prepare to be enraged: http://motherjones.com/politics/2009...ji-spin-bottle

Crocoshark · 28th January 2011, 01:40 PM

Originally Posted by Sunray Breaker

But I am surprized that you don't consider a thread like this to be as important as, say, bigfoot...Or maybe you do, I don't know.

But the lack of activity in this thread versus the large amount of activity in the Ghost, ESP, NDE and UFO threads should be appalling to anyone whose concerned about this sort of thing.

From what I've seen, the UFO, etc. threads consist of general agreement that nothing extraordinary is happening with one or a few guys holding out and debating that they had a paranormal experience. I mean, there's a thread on "fairies" that's 9 pages long at this point, despite every single person minus one agreeing that it's just a case of pareidolia.

It seems woooooo, is the gluuueee, that keeps a thread gooiiiiiing. The life blooood is a flooood of pseudoscience blooowiiiiing.

People don't come to JREF issues like this, they come to talk skeptically about UFOs and religion. This thread wouldn't last long on a movie board either.

So I offer here, for this thread, the life blood of all JREF threads, which will keep this thread alive for more people to see the issue at hand

1. Science has not proven chemicals can create consciousness, therefore the existence of the soul is to be assumed.

2. Atheist fundies may not be *insert example of religious fundementalism here* YET but the seeds have been planted and with time they will grow . . .

3. Anti-scientology criticism seems to mostly be ad hominems, poisoning the well, strawmen, appeal to incredulity, and very little actual addressing the "woo" claims of scientology.

4. Submarines have detected with radar objects that appeared intelligent and accelerated to 200mph, which is impossible for known craft underwater. How do you explain that?

5. The twin towers collapsed in on themselves, one floor landing neatly on the other, in such neat succession that it's to improbable to not be a controlled demolition.

Do I believe these things? Does my DAD believe these things? You won't find out in this thread because I'm gonna give them the best defense I got.

Furcifer · 28th January 2011, 09:04 PM

Originally Posted by Sunray Breaker

This movie definititely has me concerned. The stuff about millions of people being displaced by damming and all those kids getting sick from having to drink bad water, really got to me.

I'll read up on this issue some more, but its good to hear what the folks here think.

Perhaps they would feel better if Al Gore brought some Fiji water and spoke to them about Global Warming?

You want to talk about a truly "green" move? Ban bottled water. Everything but 5 gallon recyclable containers. Or effectively do so by imposing a ridiculous environmental tax and licensing through the UN.

Sunray Breaker · 4th February 2011, 12:14 PM

Quote:

Perhaps they would feel better if Al Gore brought some Fiji water and spoke to them about Global Warming?

You want to talk about a truly "green" move? Ban bottled water. Everything but 5 gallon recyclable containers. Or effectively do so by imposing a ridiculous environmental tax and licensing through the UN.

Thats one of the things this film brings up. How NOT green the bottled water industry is and how terrible that very industry is at usurping local water supplies

technoextreme · 4th February 2011, 12:23 PM

Ehhh.... Its pretty much wooish in some regards. If I'm not mistaken one of the major problems involving water worldwide isn't the privatization of it but the discovery that a large amount of what most people associate with clean water is undrinkable as proven by marsplot's stupid statements.

Quote:

It talks about several places around the world where millions of people were displaced and became impoverished because they suddenly lost access to clean water, thus effecting their ability to grow their own food and properly nourish themselves.

Ehhh I would be very very very very careful and double check all the claims because most areas that are associated with the corporate takeovers of water supplies are also famous for having undrinkable water.

Quote:

Mark Thomas's book Belching Out The Devil: Global Adventures with Coca-Cola includes a section on Coca-cola's business practices in relation to water (in India). Might be worth a read.

Heh... Coca-cola. The only company who managed to bottle tap water and make it undrinkable. A company which sells sugar water as a immune system booster and also said that no one would be stupid enough to believe their advertising.

marplots · 4th February 2011, 02:09 PM

Originally Posted by technoextreme

Ehhh.... Its pretty much wooish in some regards. If I'm not mistaken one of the major problems involving water worldwide isn't the privatization of it but the discovery that a large amount of what most people associate with clean water is undrinkable as proven by marsplot's stupid statements.

Are you saying I shouldn't be drinking the water I get from my well? There is iron in it, picked up from subsurface deposits. And I do live near Dow Chemical, which had a recent scandal about old dioxin releases polluting the watershed on the downwind side of the plant (not my side). Thankfully, the studies by the University of Michigan have shown the fears were misplaced and the dioxin levels found present no danger.

I suppose I am blessed by having a natural and renewable source of water here in Michigan and do not have to desalinate like coastal desert countries do.

technoextreme · 4th February 2011, 02:14 PM

Originally Posted by marplots

Are you saying I shouldn't be drinking the water I get from my well?

Actually, the more I think about it..... You probably should be getting it tested if it isn't municipal water. I was originally referencing arsenic levels of water found in large segements of the world. Then I remembered that fouride is naturally occuring also. Then I also remembered that municipalities often remove flouride to make sure that the levels aren't absurdly high. Though I'm sure since you actually have a well that you make sure that its safe.

marplots · 4th February 2011, 10:09 PM

Originally Posted by technoextreme

Actually, the more I think about it..... You probably should be getting it tested if it isn't municipal water. I was originally referencing arsenic levels of water found in large segements of the world. Then I remembered that fouride is naturally occuring also. Then I also remembered that municipalities often remove flouride to make sure that the levels aren't absurdly high. Though I'm sure since you actually have a well that you make sure that its safe.

I guess my worry about having it tested would be if the government took an interest and made me hook up to the municipal supply. Even if I couldn't drink it, I'd still want to use it for toilets and washing and such. I need a way to have it tested objectively (probably not by someone interested in selling me water) but without risk of getting shut down by the Health Department.

Oh, and inexpensively also. I is low budget.

Suggestions?

4th February 2011, 12:14 PM	#44
Sunray Breaker Critical Thinker Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Denver Posts: 498	Quote: Perhaps they would feel better if Al Gore brought some Fiji water and spoke to them about Global Warming? You want to talk about a truly "green" move? Ban bottled water. Everything but 5 gallon recyclable containers. Or effectively do so by imposing a ridiculous environmental tax and licensing through the UN. Thats one of the things this film brings up. How NOT green the bottled water industry is and how terrible that very industry is at usurping local water supplies
	__________________ "There are times, however, and this is one of them, when even being right feels wrong. What do you say, for instance, about a generation that has been taught that rain is poison and sex is death?" - HST If you really believe that death leads to eternal bliss, then why are you wearing a seatbelt? - Doug Stanhope

4th February 2011, 12:23 PM	#45
technoextreme Illuminator Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 3,786	Ehhh.... Its pretty much wooish in some regards. If I'm not mistaken one of the major problems involving water worldwide isn't the privatization of it but the discovery that a large amount of what most people associate with clean water is undrinkable as proven by marsplot's stupid statements. Quote: It talks about several places around the world where millions of people were displaced and became impoverished because they suddenly lost access to clean water, thus effecting their ability to grow their own food and properly nourish themselves. Ehhh I would be very very very very careful and double check all the claims because most areas that are associated with the corporate takeovers of water supplies are also famous for having undrinkable water. Quote: Mark Thomas's book Belching Out The Devil: Global Adventures with Coca-Cola includes a section on Coca-cola's business practices in relation to water (in India). Might be worth a read. Heh... Coca-cola. The only company who managed to bottle tap water and make it undrinkable. A company which sells sugar water as a immune system booster and also said that no one would be stupid enough to believe their advertising.
	__________________ It's amazing how many of these "paranormal" icons seem to merge together. There always seem to be theories about how they link together in some way. I'm sure someone has a very good explanation as to how Bigfoot killed JFK to help cover Roswell.-Mark Mekes This isn't rocket surgery.-Bill Nye Last edited by technoextreme; 4th February 2011 at 12:39 PM.

4th February 2011, 02:09 PM	#46
marplots Philosopher Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 5,643	Originally Posted by technoextreme Ehhh.... Its pretty much wooish in some regards. If I'm not mistaken one of the major problems involving water worldwide isn't the privatization of it but the discovery that a large amount of what most people associate with clean water is undrinkable as proven by marsplot's stupid statements. Are you saying I shouldn't be drinking the water I get from my well? There is iron in it, picked up from subsurface deposits. And I do live near Dow Chemical, which had a recent scandal about old dioxin releases polluting the watershed on the downwind side of the plant (not my side). Thankfully, the studies by the University of Michigan have shown the fears were misplaced and the dioxin levels found present no danger. I suppose I am blessed by having a natural and renewable source of water here in Michigan and do not have to desalinate like coastal desert countries do.
marplots Philosopher Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 5,643

4th February 2011, 02:14 PM	#47
technoextreme Illuminator Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 3,786	Originally Posted by marplots Are you saying I shouldn't be drinking the water I get from my well? Actually, the more I think about it..... You probably should be getting it tested if it isn't municipal water. I was originally referencing arsenic levels of water found in large segements of the world. Then I remembered that fouride is naturally occuring also. Then I also remembered that municipalities often remove flouride to make sure that the levels aren't absurdly high. Though I'm sure since you actually have a well that you make sure that its safe.
	__________________ It's amazing how many of these "paranormal" icons seem to merge together. There always seem to be theories about how they link together in some way. I'm sure someone has a very good explanation as to how Bigfoot killed JFK to help cover Roswell.-Mark Mekes This isn't rocket surgery.-Bill Nye Last edited by technoextreme; 4th February 2011 at 02:33 PM.

4th February 2011, 10:09 PM	#48
marplots Philosopher Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 5,643	Originally Posted by technoextreme Actually, the more I think about it..... You probably should be getting it tested if it isn't municipal water. I was originally referencing arsenic levels of water found in large segements of the world. Then I remembered that fouride is naturally occuring also. Then I also remembered that municipalities often remove flouride to make sure that the levels aren't absurdly high. Though I'm sure since you actually have a well that you make sure that its safe. I guess my worry about having it tested would be if the government took an interest and made me hook up to the municipal supply. Even if I couldn't drink it, I'd still want to use it for toilets and washing and such. I need a way to have it tested objectively (probably not by someone interested in selling me water) but without risk of getting shut down by the Health Department. Oh, and inexpensively also. I is low budget. Suggestions?
marplots Philosopher Join Date: Feb 2006 Posts: 5,643

28th January 2011, 04:52 AM	#41
Fishstick Graduate Poster Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 1,313	Prepare to be enraged: http://motherjones.com/politics/2009...ji-spin-bottle

28th January 2011, 01:40 PM	#42
Crocoshark Critical Thinker Join Date: Dec 2010 Posts: 358	Originally Posted by Sunray Breaker But I am surprized that you don't consider a thread like this to be as important as, say, bigfoot...Or maybe you do, I don't know. But the lack of activity in this thread versus the large amount of activity in the Ghost, ESP, NDE and UFO threads should be appalling to anyone whose concerned about this sort of thing. From what I've seen, the UFO, etc. threads consist of general agreement that nothing extraordinary is happening with one or a few guys holding out and debating that they had a paranormal experience. I mean, there's a thread on "fairies" that's 9 pages long at this point, despite every single person minus one agreeing that it's just a case of pareidolia. It seems woooooo, is the gluuueee, that keeps a thread gooiiiiiing. The life blooood is a flooood of pseudoscience blooowiiiiing. People don't come to JREF issues like this, they come to talk skeptically about UFOs and religion. This thread wouldn't last long on a movie board either. So I offer here, for this thread, the life blood of all JREF threads, which will keep this thread alive for more people to see the issue at hand 1. Science has not proven chemicals can create consciousness, therefore the existence of the soul is to be assumed. 2. Atheist fundies may not be insert example of religious fundementalism here YET but the seeds have been planted and with time they will grow . . . 3. Anti-scientology criticism seems to mostly be ad hominems, poisoning the well, strawmen, appeal to incredulity, and very little actual addressing the "woo" claims of scientology. 4. Submarines have detected with radar objects that appeared intelligent and accelerated to 200mph, which is impossible for known craft underwater. How do you explain that? 5. The twin towers collapsed in on themselves, one floor landing neatly on the other, in such neat succession that it's to improbable to not be a controlled demolition. Do I believe these things? Does my DAD believe these things? You won't find out in this thread because I'm gonna give them the best defense I got.

28th January 2011, 09:04 PM	#43
Furcifer miscreant Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: hohm Posts: 13,379	Originally Posted by Sunray Breaker This movie definititely has me concerned. The stuff about millions of people being displaced by damming and all those kids getting sick from having to drink bad water, really got to me. I'll read up on this issue some more, but its good to hear what the folks here think. Perhaps they would feel better if Al Gore brought some Fiji water and spoke to them about Global Warming? You want to talk about a truly "green" move? Ban bottled water. Everything but 5 gallon recyclable containers. Or effectively do so by imposing a ridiculous environmental tax and licensing through the UN.