"Police report massive rise in Scottish gay hate crime"

Tsukasa Buddha · 6th February 2011, 04:07 PM

Quote:

HATE crimes against homosexuals in Scotland have risen almost fivefold in the past five years, shock new statistics have revealed.
The statistics - gathered by a freedom of information request to Scotland's eight police forces - show a disturbing rise in reports of violent attacks, indecent assaults, abuse and vandalism against people targeted just because of their sexual orientation.

Figures show there were 666 incidents of homophobic abuse in 2009-10, almost double the 364 incidents reported in 2007-8, and almost five times the 114 incidents reported in 2004-5.

Linky.

Wow, did they change they way the count these crimes? Or is there some theory as to why this happened?

bikerdruid · 6th February 2011, 04:10 PM

maybe scottish chavs are just becoming more violent.

Halfcentaur · 6th February 2011, 04:20 PM

666,.... this can be no coincidence.

geni · 6th February 2011, 04:25 PM

Originally Posted by Tsukasa Buddha

Linky.

Wow, did they change they way the count these crimes? Or is there some theory as to why this happened?

There were some changes around that time to how some crimes were recorded. There normaly are. However from what I can recall when simular figures came out in england the jump may simply be due to higher reporting rates.

Rolfe · 6th February 2011, 04:29 PM

Originally Posted by bikerdruid

maybe scottish chavs are just becoming more violent.

Scotland doesn't have chavs. We have neds.

Rolfe.

bikerdruid · 6th February 2011, 04:36 PM

Originally Posted by Rolfe

Scotland doesn't have chavs. We have neds.

Rolfe.

are 'neds' as nasty as chavs?

Rolfe · 6th February 2011, 05:34 PM

Oh, worse. Believe me.

Rolfe.

Fnord · 6th February 2011, 05:43 PM

So now they're using homosexuality as an excuse to beat on the Scots?

rjh01 · 6th February 2011, 06:13 PM

Or maybe the number of crimes have not gone up much, but a greater % of victims go to the police.

Scott Haley · 6th February 2011, 08:26 PM

Do Scottish drag queens wear trousers?

bikerdruid · 6th February 2011, 08:44 PM

Originally Posted by Scott Haley

Do Scottish drag queens wear trousers?

Travis · 6th February 2011, 09:21 PM

How is the economy right now in Scotland?

commandlinegamer · 7th February 2011, 01:38 AM

Incidentally, a recent movie release, Neds, by acclaimed actor/director Peter Mullan has seen pitched battles during some screenings of the film.

http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/sc...6908-22903480/

Then again, I always tend to avoid the cinema on Saturday afternoons, as more than once I witnessed interruptions by youngsters running around, and this goes back to the mid-90s at least.

Another film I might recommend as a bit of an insight into Glasgow gang culture is Small Faces by Gillies Mackinnon.

23_Tauri · 7th February 2011, 02:11 AM

deleted post. Oops, sorry, didn't read whole article before posting. My bad.

Darat · 7th February 2011, 02:28 AM

Originally Posted by Tsukasa Buddha

Linky.

Wow, did they change they way the count these crimes? Or is there some theory as to why this happened?

The actual numbers being reported rising doesn't surprise me, institutions like the police forces are not seen quite as much as the enemy by many minority groups as they used to be. As to the numbers of incidents - sadly that also doesn't surprise me. Thinking about it a bit more, it may be that because homosexuals are on the whole better tolerated (and that is unfortunately the word to use) more homosexuals are visible today so there are more homosexuals that can be attacked.

Sword_Of_Truth · 7th February 2011, 02:34 AM

Originally Posted by Darat

The actual numbers being reported rising doesn't surprise me, institutions like the police forces are not seen quite as much as the enemy by many minority groups as they used to be. As to the numbers of incidents - sadly that also doesn't surprise me. Thinking about it a bit more, it may be that because homosexuals are on the whole better tolerated (and that is unfortunately the word to use) more homosexuals are visible today so there are more homosexuals that can be attacked.

The improved relationship between minority communities and law enforcement also beg the question; is the situation truly worsening, or is the increased trust between law enforcement and the affected community leading to better reporting of incidents?

Vladd · 7th February 2011, 02:50 AM

Is it because homosexuals nowadays are less inclined to just take the abuse, and feel more willing to report such attacks?

Matthew Best · 7th February 2011, 02:59 AM

Originally Posted by Rolfe

Scotland doesn't have chavs. We have neds.

Rolfe.

Indeed - there's a new movie called "NEDS" which says that this stands for Non-Educated Delinquents. The poster for the film makes it look terrible in my opinion, but it's actually terrific. It's a bit like Shane Meadows' "This Is England" only set in Scotland.

So, think of it as "This Is Scotland".

ETA - I see the movie has already been mentioned. Despite the fact that you may apparently be battered during a screening, I still recommend it.

uk_dave · 7th February 2011, 03:04 AM

Originally Posted by Matthew Best

Despite the fact that you may apparently be battered during a screening...

And deep fried?

Darat · 7th February 2011, 03:08 AM

Originally Posted by Sword_Of_Truth

The improved relationship between minority communities and law enforcement also beg the question; is the situation truly worsening, or is the increased trust between law enforcement and the affected community leading to better reporting of incidents?

Originally Posted by Vladd

Is it because homosexuals nowadays are less inclined to just take the abuse, and feel more willing to report such attacks?

I suspect that this is one of those things that we can't tease out cause and effect from the statistics.

Certainly back in the 80s (for example) I knew no one who would have gone to the police (voluntarily) if they'd been attacked or abused. Indeed I think we would have looked at someone with incredulity if they had suggested that verbal abuse and harassment or a bit of pushing and shoving was something that could be reported never mind actually should be reported. On the other hand a lot less people were "out" to any degree and especially not in the streets, "no PDA" was something that a lot of homosexuals learnt and abided by so a lot of the abuse would be confided to areas around known gay pubs and the like.

zooterkin · 7th February 2011, 03:40 AM

Originally Posted by Darat

On the other hand a lot less people were "out" to any degree and especially not in the streets, "no PDA" was something that a lot of homosexuals learnt and abided by so a lot of the abuse would be confided to areas around known gay pubs and the like.

I've had a PDA for years, I didn't know it meant I was gay (though I'm pretty sure my daughter did say exactly that once)...

(I guess you really meant "public displays of affection", not "personal digital assistant".

)

Arcade22 · 7th February 2011, 03:56 AM

What constitutes a hate crime in Scotland? If i beat someone up and scream "*********** Faggot!" am i committing a hate crime even though his sexual preferences isn't the reason i beat him up?

Darat · 7th February 2011, 04:32 AM

Originally Posted by Arcade22

What constitutes a hate crime in Scotland? If i beat someone up and scream "*********** Faggot!" am i committing a hate crime even though his sexual preferences isn't the reason i beat him up?

"Hate crime" is a silly way of putting it if you ask me when all it means is that the court has to take into account the motivation for the offence.

Architect · 7th February 2011, 05:36 AM

Originally Posted by Arcade22

What constitutes a hate crime in Scotland? If i beat someone up and scream "*********** Faggot!" am i committing a hate crime even though his sexual preferences isn't the reason i beat him up?

You may get laughed at for using the word "faggot" in the 21st century. It's barely an insult.

zooterkin · 7th February 2011, 06:04 AM

Originally Posted by Architect

You may get laughed at for using the word "faggot" in the 21st century. It's barely an insult.

Especially not in the UK, where I don't think it's ever really been one, unless you find balls of minced offal in gravy offensive.

Darat · 7th February 2011, 06:10 AM

I can assure you it is still a favoured word to scream at people suspected of being homosexual in the UK.

Vladd · 7th February 2011, 06:14 AM

Originally Posted by Darat

"Hate crime" is a silly way of putting it if you ask me when all it means is that the court has to take into account the motivation for the offence.

As in Life on Mars when Sam Tyler describes a murder as a hate crime and Gene Hunt replies "As opposed to one of those I really love you murders?"

zooterkin · 7th February 2011, 06:30 AM

Originally Posted by Darat

I can assure you it is still a favoured word to scream at people suspected of being homosexual in the UK.

Fair enough, I stand corrected. I've never encountered it in real life, but I suspect that says more about me than anything else.

bikerdruid · 7th February 2011, 06:39 AM

Originally Posted by zooterkin

I've had a PDA for years, I didn't know it meant I was gay (though I'm pretty sure my daughter did say exactly that once)...

what's a PDA?

zooterkin · 7th February 2011, 07:08 AM

Originally Posted by bikerdruid

what's a PDA?

See the part of my post that you snipped when you replied.

richardm · 7th February 2011, 08:36 AM

Originally Posted by Darat

I can assure you it is still a favoured word to scream at people suspected of being homosexual in the UK.

"Money for Nothing" was recently banned from playlists in Canada because it features three uses of the word "Faggot". Do you think that's a useful step, given that it is still used unpleasantly, or do you reckon that sort of thing is pointless? It seems pointless to me but then I'm not at the sharp end of the abuse, so I dunno.

Matthew Best · 7th February 2011, 08:46 AM

Originally Posted by richardm

"Money for Nothing" was recently banned from playlists in Canada because it features three uses of the word "Faggot". Do you think that's a useful step, given that it is still used unpleasantly, or do you reckon that sort of thing is pointless?

Anything that takes "Money For Nothing" off playlists anywhere can only be considered a useful step.

Vladd · 7th February 2011, 09:04 AM

Do they still play Oliver's Army by Elvis Costello which uses the N word?

Darat · 7th February 2011, 09:13 AM

Originally Posted by richardm

"Money for Nothing" was recently banned from playlists in Canada because it features three uses of the word "Faggot". Do you think that's a useful step, given that it is still used unpleasantly, or do you reckon that sort of thing is pointless? It seems pointless to me but then I'm not at the sharp end of the abuse, so I dunno.

Yeah I read a thread here about that and I couldn't see the reason for their decision, that was a private organisation wasn't it? As a more general point I don't agree with a blanket ban on any such terms but I don't think there is anything wrong with saying you can't call someone a faggot at work without consequences, which was the case in the UK until very recently.

richardm · 7th February 2011, 09:16 AM

Originally Posted by Darat

Yeah I read a thread here about that and I couldn't see the reason for their decision, that was a private organisation wasn't it? As a more general point I don't agree with a blanket ban on any such terms but I don't think there is anything wrong with saying you can't call someone a faggot at work without consequences, which was the case in the UK until very recently.

Seems fair enough (so does Matthew's comment, really

)

bikerdruid · 7th February 2011, 12:14 PM

Originally Posted by zooterkin

See the part of my post that you snipped when you replied.

you could have answered my question in fewer words, if you had wished to be helpful.
(seriously, some of you throw around acronyms very readily, assuming that everyone knows what the heck you are talking about.)

Big Les · 7th February 2011, 12:18 PM

Originally Posted by Matthew Best

Indeed - there's a new movie called "NEDS" which says that this stands for Non-Educated Delinquents.

I've always doubted that explanation. Too convenient, and assuming it were true, not a little ironic. There are analogous terms other than "chav" based on perceived lower/working class personal names all over the rest of the UK - "Kevs", "Barries" etc. I suspect "Ned" was coined along these lines (being somewhat geographically specific to Scotland and Ireland as a name/nickname), and that "N.E.D." is a false etymology.

zooterkin · 7th February 2011, 12:22 PM

Originally Posted by bikerdruid

you could have answered my question in fewer words, if you had wished to be helpful.
(seriously, some of you throw around acronyms very readily, assuming that everyone knows what the heck you are talking about.)

Well, my post was actually a roundabout way of making the same point, as well as expanding the acronym for others who, like me, didn't recognise it at first. I'd already answered your question, so I didn't see the need to say it again. (And I type fast, so it really wasn't much more work; selecting and deleting text takes longer.)

Thunder · 7th February 2011, 12:35 PM

does this include rape of gay men by straight Scots?

Sword_Of_Truth · 7th February 2011, 04:24 PM

Originally Posted by bikerdruid

you could have answered my question in fewer words, if you had wished to be helpful.

You could have read one more sentence of his post.

6th February 2011, 04:07 PM	#1
Tsukasa Buddha Other (please write in) Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: NeverLand Posts: 9,914	"Police report massive rise in Scottish gay hate crime" Quote: HATE crimes against homosexuals in Scotland have risen almost fivefold in the past five years, shock new statistics have revealed. The statistics - gathered by a freedom of information request to Scotland's eight police forces - show a disturbing rise in reports of violent attacks, indecent assaults, abuse and vandalism against people targeted just because of their sexual orientation. Figures show there were 666 incidents of homophobic abuse in 2009-10, almost double the 364 incidents reported in 2007-8, and almost five times the 114 incidents reported in 2004-5. Linky. Wow, did they change they way the count these crimes? Or is there some theory as to why this happened?
	__________________ As cultural anthropologists have always said "human culture" = "human nature". You might as well put a fish on the moon to test how it "swims naturally" without the "influence of water". -Earthborn

6th February 2011, 04:10 PM	#2
bikerdruid hermit hippy weirdo Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: green island autonomous zone Posts: 7,369	maybe scottish chavs are just becoming more violent.
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6th February 2011, 04:20 PM	#3
Halfcentaur Philosopher Join Date: Jun 2010 Posts: 5,952	666,.... this can be no coincidence.
Halfcentaur Philosopher Join Date: Jun 2010 Posts: 5,952

6th February 2011, 04:29 PM	#5
Rolfe Anti-homeopathy illuminati member Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: NT 150 511 Posts: 34,329	Originally Posted by bikerdruid maybe scottish chavs are just becoming more violent. Scotland doesn't have chavs. We have neds. Rolfe.
	__________________ "The way we vote will depend, ultimately, on whether we are persuaded to hope or to fear." - Aonghas MacNeacail, June 2012.

6th February 2011, 04:36 PM	#6
bikerdruid hermit hippy weirdo Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: green island autonomous zone Posts: 7,369	Originally Posted by Rolfe Scotland doesn't have chavs. We have neds. Rolfe. are 'neds' as nasty as chavs?
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6th February 2011, 04:25 PM	#4
geni Anti-homeopathy illuminati member Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: UK Posts: 26,572	Originally Posted by Tsukasa Buddha Linky. Wow, did they change they way the count these crimes? Or is there some theory as to why this happened? There were some changes around that time to how some crimes were recorded. There normaly are. However from what I can recall when simular figures came out in england the jump may simply be due to higher reporting rates.

6th February 2011, 05:34 PM	#7
Rolfe Anti-homeopathy illuminati member Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: NT 150 511 Posts: 34,329	Oh, worse. Believe me. Rolfe.
	__________________ "The way we vote will depend, ultimately, on whether we are persuaded to hope or to fear." - Aonghas MacNeacail, June 2012.

6th February 2011, 05:43 PM	#8
Fnord Metasyntactic Variable Join Date: Oct 2006 Posts: 6,633	So now they're using homosexuality as an excuse to beat on the Scots?
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6th February 2011, 06:13 PM	#9
rjh01 Gentleman of leisure Tagger Join Date: May 2005 Location: Planet Earth Posts: 17,190	Or maybe the number of crimes have not gone up much, but a greater % of victims go to the police.

6th February 2011, 08:26 PM	#10
Scott Haley Muse Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 562	Do Scottish drag queens wear trousers?
Scott Haley Muse Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 562

6th February 2011, 08:44 PM	#11
bikerdruid hermit hippy weirdo Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: green island autonomous zone Posts: 7,369	Originally Posted by Scott Haley Do Scottish drag queens wear trousers?
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6th February 2011, 09:21 PM	#12
Travis Misanthrope of the Mountains Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Tuolumne City, CA Posts: 17,945	How is the economy right now in Scotland?
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7th February 2011, 01:38 AM	#13
commandlinegamer Philosopher Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Mazes of Menace Posts: 5,903	Incidentally, a recent movie release, Neds, by acclaimed actor/director Peter Mullan has seen pitched battles during some screenings of the film. http://www.dailyrecord.co.uk/news/sc...6908-22903480/ Then again, I always tend to avoid the cinema on Saturday afternoons, as more than once I witnessed interruptions by youngsters running around, and this goes back to the mid-90s at least. Another film I might recommend as a bit of an insight into Glasgow gang culture is Small Faces by Gillies Mackinnon.
	__________________ He bade me take any rug in the house.

7th February 2011, 02:11 AM	#14
23_Tauri Illuminator Join Date: Jan 2010 Location: UK Posts: 4,947	deleted post. Oops, sorry, didn't read whole article before posting. My bad.

7th February 2011, 02:28 AM	#15
Darat Lackey Administrator / JREF Forum Liaison Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: South East, UK Posts: 64,788	Originally Posted by Tsukasa Buddha Linky. Wow, did they change they way the count these crimes? Or is there some theory as to why this happened? The actual numbers being reported rising doesn't surprise me, institutions like the police forces are not seen quite as much as the enemy by many minority groups as they used to be. As to the numbers of incidents - sadly that also doesn't surprise me. Thinking about it a bit more, it may be that because homosexuals are on the whole better tolerated (and that is unfortunately the word to use) more homosexuals are visible today so there are more homosexuals that can be attacked.
	__________________ If it were all so simple! If only there were evil people somewhere insidiously committing evil deeds, and it were necessary only to separate them from the rest of us and destroy them. But the line dividing good and evil cuts through the heart of every human being. And who is willing to destroy a piece of his own heart? - Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn 1918-2008

7th February 2011, 02:34 AM	#16
Sword_Of_Truth Penultimate Amazing Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 11,497	Originally Posted by Darat The actual numbers being reported rising doesn't surprise me, institutions like the police forces are not seen quite as much as the enemy by many minority groups as they used to be. As to the numbers of incidents - sadly that also doesn't surprise me. Thinking about it a bit more, it may be that because homosexuals are on the whole better tolerated (and that is unfortunately the word to use) more homosexuals are visible today so there are more homosexuals that can be attacked. The improved relationship between minority communities and law enforcement also beg the question; is the situation truly worsening, or is the increased trust between law enforcement and the affected community leading to better reporting of incidents?

7th February 2011, 02:50 AM	#17
Vladd Thinker Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 138	Is it because homosexuals nowadays are less inclined to just take the abuse, and feel more willing to report such attacks?
Vladd Thinker Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 138

7th February 2011, 02:59 AM	#18
Matthew Best Illuminator Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Leicester Square, London Posts: 4,147	Originally Posted by Rolfe Scotland doesn't have chavs. We have neds. Rolfe. Indeed - there's a new movie called "NEDS" which says that this stands for Non-Educated Delinquents. The poster for the film makes it look terrible in my opinion, but it's actually terrific. It's a bit like Shane Meadows' "This Is England" only set in Scotland. So, think of it as "This Is Scotland". ETA - I see the movie has already been mentioned. Despite the fact that you may apparently be battered during a screening, I still recommend it.

7th February 2011, 03:04 AM	#19
uk_dave Philosopher Join Date: Oct 2006 Posts: 7,866	Originally Posted by Matthew Best Despite the fact that you may apparently be battered during a screening... And deep fried?
uk_dave Philosopher Join Date: Oct 2006 Posts: 7,866

7th February 2011, 03:08 AM	#20
Darat Lackey Administrator / JREF Forum Liaison Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: South East, UK Posts: 64,788	Originally Posted by Sword_Of_Truth The improved relationship between minority communities and law enforcement also beg the question; is the situation truly worsening, or is the increased trust between law enforcement and the affected community leading to better reporting of incidents? Originally Posted by Vladd Is it because homosexuals nowadays are less inclined to just take the abuse, and feel more willing to report such attacks? I suspect that this is one of those things that we can't tease out cause and effect from the statistics. Certainly back in the 80s (for example) I knew no one who would have gone to the police (voluntarily) if they'd been attacked or abused. Indeed I think we would have looked at someone with incredulity if they had suggested that verbal abuse and harassment or a bit of pushing and shoving was something that could be reported never mind actually should be reported. On the other hand a lot less people were "out" to any degree and especially not in the streets, "no PDA" was something that a lot of homosexuals learnt and abided by so a lot of the abuse would be confided to areas around known gay pubs and the like.
	__________________ If it were all so simple! If only there were evil people somewhere insidiously committing evil deeds, and it were necessary only to separate them from the rest of us and destroy them. But the line dividing good and evil cuts through the heart of every human being. And who is willing to destroy a piece of his own heart? - Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn 1918-2008

7th February 2011, 03:40 AM	#21
zooterkin Nitpicking dilettante Moderator Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Berkshire, mostly Posts: 24,587	Originally Posted by Darat On the other hand a lot less people were "out" to any degree and especially not in the streets, "no PDA" was something that a lot of homosexuals learnt and abided by so a lot of the abuse would be confided to areas around known gay pubs and the like. I've had a PDA for years, I didn't know it meant I was gay (though I'm pretty sure my daughter did say exactly that once)... (I guess you really meant "public displays of affection", not "personal digital assistant". )
	__________________ The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts.Bertrand Russell Zooterkin is correct Darat Nerd! Hokulele Join the JREF Folders ! Team 13232 Last edited by zooterkin; 7th February 2011 at 03:41 AM.

7th February 2011, 03:56 AM	#22
Arcade22 Graduate Poster Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Västerbotten, Sweden Posts: 1,830	What constitutes a hate crime in Scotland? If i beat someone up and scream "*********** Faggot!" am i committing a hate crime even though his sexual preferences isn't the reason i beat him up?
	__________________ The habit of the religious way of thinking has biased our mind so grievously that we are — terrified at ourselves in our nakedness and naturalness; it has degraded us so that we deem ourselves depraved by nature, born devils. Max Stirner

7th February 2011, 04:32 AM	#23
Darat Lackey Administrator / JREF Forum Liaison Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: South East, UK Posts: 64,788	Originally Posted by Arcade22 What constitutes a hate crime in Scotland? If i beat someone up and scream "*********** Faggot!" am i committing a hate crime even though his sexual preferences isn't the reason i beat him up? "Hate crime" is a silly way of putting it if you ask me when all it means is that the court has to take into account the motivation for the offence.
	__________________ If it were all so simple! If only there were evil people somewhere insidiously committing evil deeds, and it were necessary only to separate them from the rest of us and destroy them. But the line dividing good and evil cuts through the heart of every human being. And who is willing to destroy a piece of his own heart? - Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn 1918-2008

7th February 2011, 05:36 AM	#24
Architect Chief Punkah Wallah Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: UK Posts: 8,478	Originally Posted by Arcade22 What constitutes a hate crime in Scotland? If i beat someone up and scream "*********** Faggot!" am i committing a hate crime even though his sexual preferences isn't the reason i beat him up? You may get laughed at for using the word "faggot" in the 21st century. It's barely an insult.
	__________________ When the men elected to make laws are but a small part of a foreign parliament, that is when all healthy national feeling dies. James Keir Hardie (1856 - 1915): Politician, Founder of Scottish Labour Party

7th February 2011, 06:04 AM	#25
zooterkin Nitpicking dilettante Moderator Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Berkshire, mostly Posts: 24,587	Originally Posted by Architect You may get laughed at for using the word "faggot" in the 21st century. It's barely an insult. Especially not in the UK, where I don't think it's ever really been one, unless you find balls of minced offal in gravy offensive.
	__________________ The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts.Bertrand Russell Zooterkin is correct Darat Nerd! Hokulele Join the JREF Folders ! Team 13232

7th February 2011, 06:10 AM	#26
Darat Lackey Administrator / JREF Forum Liaison Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: South East, UK Posts: 64,788	I can assure you it is still a favoured word to scream at people suspected of being homosexual in the UK.
	__________________ If it were all so simple! If only there were evil people somewhere insidiously committing evil deeds, and it were necessary only to separate them from the rest of us and destroy them. But the line dividing good and evil cuts through the heart of every human being. And who is willing to destroy a piece of his own heart? - Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn 1918-2008

7th February 2011, 06:14 AM	#27
Vladd Thinker Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 138	Originally Posted by Darat "Hate crime" is a silly way of putting it if you ask me when all it means is that the court has to take into account the motivation for the offence. As in Life on Mars when Sam Tyler describes a murder as a hate crime and Gene Hunt replies "As opposed to one of those I really love you murders?"
Vladd Thinker Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 138

7th February 2011, 06:30 AM	#28
zooterkin Nitpicking dilettante Moderator Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Berkshire, mostly Posts: 24,587	Originally Posted by Darat I can assure you it is still a favoured word to scream at people suspected of being homosexual in the UK. Fair enough, I stand corrected. I've never encountered it in real life, but I suspect that says more about me than anything else.
	__________________ The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts.Bertrand Russell Zooterkin is correct Darat Nerd! Hokulele Join the JREF Folders ! Team 13232

7th February 2011, 06:39 AM	#29
bikerdruid hermit hippy weirdo Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: green island autonomous zone Posts: 7,369	Originally Posted by zooterkin I've had a PDA for years, I didn't know it meant I was gay (though I'm pretty sure my daughter did say exactly that once)... what's a PDA?
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7th February 2011, 07:08 AM	#30
zooterkin Nitpicking dilettante Moderator Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Berkshire, mostly Posts: 24,587	Originally Posted by bikerdruid what's a PDA? See the part of my post that you snipped when you replied.
	__________________ The whole problem with the world is that fools and fanatics are always so certain of themselves, and wiser people so full of doubts.Bertrand Russell Zooterkin is correct Darat Nerd! Hokulele Join the JREF Folders ! Team 13232

7th February 2011, 08:36 AM	#31
richardm Philosopher Join Date: Aug 2001 Posts: 9,270	Originally Posted by Darat I can assure you it is still a favoured word to scream at people suspected of being homosexual in the UK. "Money for Nothing" was recently banned from playlists in Canada because it features three uses of the word "Faggot". Do you think that's a useful step, given that it is still used unpleasantly, or do you reckon that sort of thing is pointless? It seems pointless to me but then I'm not at the sharp end of the abuse, so I dunno.
richardm Philosopher Join Date: Aug 2001 Posts: 9,270	__________________ Rimmer: Look at her! Magnificent woman! Very prim, very proper, almost austere. Some people took her for cold, thought she was aloof. Not a bit of it. She just despised fools. Quite tragic, really, because otherwise I think we'd have got on famously.

7th February 2011, 08:46 AM	#32
Matthew Best Illuminator Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: Leicester Square, London Posts: 4,147	Originally Posted by richardm "Money for Nothing" was recently banned from playlists in Canada because it features three uses of the word "Faggot". Do you think that's a useful step, given that it is still used unpleasantly, or do you reckon that sort of thing is pointless? Anything that takes "Money For Nothing" off playlists anywhere can only be considered a useful step.

7th February 2011, 09:04 AM	#33
Vladd Thinker Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 138	Do they still play Oliver's Army by Elvis Costello which uses the N word?
Vladd Thinker Join Date: Nov 2010 Posts: 138

7th February 2011, 09:13 AM	#34
Darat Lackey Administrator / JREF Forum Liaison Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: South East, UK Posts: 64,788	Originally Posted by richardm "Money for Nothing" was recently banned from playlists in Canada because it features three uses of the word "Faggot". Do you think that's a useful step, given that it is still used unpleasantly, or do you reckon that sort of thing is pointless? It seems pointless to me but then I'm not at the sharp end of the abuse, so I dunno. Yeah I read a thread here about that and I couldn't see the reason for their decision, that was a private organisation wasn't it? As a more general point I don't agree with a blanket ban on any such terms but I don't think there is anything wrong with saying you can't call someone a faggot at work without consequences, which was the case in the UK until very recently.
	__________________ If it were all so simple! If only there were evil people somewhere insidiously committing evil deeds, and it were necessary only to separate them from the rest of us and destroy them. But the line dividing good and evil cuts through the heart of every human being. And who is willing to destroy a piece of his own heart? - Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn 1918-2008

7th February 2011, 09:16 AM	#35
richardm Philosopher Join Date: Aug 2001 Posts: 9,270	Originally Posted by Darat Yeah I read a thread here about that and I couldn't see the reason for their decision, that was a private organisation wasn't it? As a more general point I don't agree with a blanket ban on any such terms but I don't think there is anything wrong with saying you can't call someone a faggot at work without consequences, which was the case in the UK until very recently. Seems fair enough (so does Matthew's comment, really )
richardm Philosopher Join Date: Aug 2001 Posts: 9,270	__________________ Rimmer: Look at her! Magnificent woman! Very prim, very proper, almost austere. Some people took her for cold, thought she was aloof. Not a bit of it. She just despised fools. Quite tragic, really, because otherwise I think we'd have got on famously.