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AdMan · 18th May 2011, 08:32 PM

Originally Posted by wollclark

I wish I could laugh at that.

I hope you're not still worrying about this. Nothing is going to happen on Saturday. It's just a bunch of religious kooks who are going to be quite disappointed and confused when they wake up Sunday morning in their beds rather than in heaven.

wollclark · 18th May 2011, 09:47 PM

Originally Posted by AdMan

I hope you're not still worrying about this. Nothing is going to happen on Saturday. It's just a bunch of religious kooks who are going to be quite disappointed and confused when they wake up Sunday morning in their beds rather than in heaven.

I wish I had the rationality to accept that, but I don't. I'm not sure what the fear stems from, it could have been an article I read in the Weekly World News when I was younger.

I don't remember believing much from that magazine, despite being a kid, except for an article which said that the sun was to explode in six years. It wasn't the usual badly photo-shopped story you'd see in that publication like "Bigfoot Marries Elvis: Shocking Photos Inside!". It was simply a black and white picture of the sun, and alarming heading text.

I know it's stupid, but I spent months worrying about that and eventually forgot about it; I'm pretty sure it's been six years by now.

Elypsis44 · 18th May 2011, 10:03 PM

Paul Bethke, have a look at post # 115.

Please explain your comments:

"Future events were sealed even from Christ at least the time of the end."

And then:

"And Jesus Christ is God."

Thanks!

epix · 19th May 2011, 01:59 AM

Originally Posted by IMST

The image below is not my bible, but just a page I grabbed at random from the internet. No where in my bible, nor any bible I've ever seen, other than in commentary, does it use the format you describe, e.g. 20:11. It numbers the chapter then the individual verses separately.
http://forums.randi.org/imagehosting...442a840a47.jpg

By "Chapter:Verse" I meant the commonplace editions of the Bible where each book is divided into chapters and each chapter into verses. The customary quoting from the Bible is

text
BookName Chapter:Verse

Example...

No offense, but I don't feel like answering any of your additional questions asked to explain the above.
Epix 6:66

epix · 19th May 2011, 02:18 AM

Originally Posted by edge

LOL

Yep. It's incredible but the atheists genuinly believe that Camping put all his faith into his prediction, and he is ready to experience a wonderful case of divine lifting on Saturday. I bet that the atheists are the only group whose members believe that Camping is dead serious about his prediction. It's a PR ploy, but a strange one, coz the Rapture scenario will not materialize and that should negatively affect the Camping's ministry. So it appears that Camping sees some PR gain in it nevertheless. But which one?

So someone thinks along these lines and gets curious about the reasons...

"Who you gonna call?"

"A-theists!"

Yeah right. LOL.

Bram Kaandorp · 19th May 2011, 03:20 AM

Originally Posted by epix

Yep. It's incredible but the atheists genuinly believe that Camping put all his faith into his prediction, and he is ready to experience a wonderful case of divine lifting on Saturday. I bet that the atheists are the only group whose members believe that Camping is dead serious about his prediction. It's a PR ploy, but a strange one, coz the Rapture scenario will not materialize and that should negatively affect the Camping's ministry. So it appears that Camping sees some PR gain in it nevertheless. But which one?

So someone thinks along these lines and gets curious about the reasons...

"Who you gonna call?"

"A-theists!"

Yeah right. LOL.

Too bad Camping never used the toungue-in-cheek emoticon in his texts, or else we could have figured it out much more easily.

edge · 19th May 2011, 04:47 AM

Originally Posted by Elypsis44

Interesting.

There's more, way more.

Elypsis44 · 19th May 2011, 06:56 AM

Originally Posted by edge

There's more, way more.

Do tell.

Explain how Jesus/God kept information from Himself.

Sideroxylon · 19th May 2011, 07:19 AM

Originally Posted by epix

Yep. It's incredible but the atheists genuinly believe that Camping put all his faith into his prediction, and he is ready to experience a wonderful case of divine lifting on Saturday. I bet that the atheists are the only group whose members believe that Camping is dead serious about his prediction. It's a PR ploy, but a strange one, coz the Rapture scenario will not materialize and that should negatively affect the Camping's ministry. So it appears that Camping sees some PR gain in it nevertheless. But which one?

So someone thinks along these lines and gets curious about the reasons...

"Who you gonna call?"

"A-theists!"

Yeah right. LOL.

Are you invoking Poe's Law?

IMST · 19th May 2011, 07:30 AM

Originally Posted by epix

By "Chapter:Verse" I meant the commonplace editions of the Bible where each book is divided into chapters and each chapter into verses. The customary quoting from the Bible is

text
BookName Chapter:Verse

Example...

No offense, but I don't feel like answering any of your additional questions asked to explain the above.
Epix 6:66

Taking your ball and running home after I called you out on your silly little claim that the format comes from the Bible. Got it.

Ohnoes · 19th May 2011, 07:41 AM

Originally Posted by wollclark

I wish I had the rationality to accept that, but I don't. I'm not sure what the fear stems from, it could have been an article I read in the Weekly World News when I was younger.

haha I did that same thing when i was young and I was plagued with irrational fears for a long time, and I know that hearing people say it will be fine, doesn't mean it will calm your fears. However, these forums are for discussion and not to really meant to alleviate peoples fears, so maybe I can help you out by laying out something that breaks things down a bit.

1. Harold Camping came up with this theory by using Numerology which is considered on the same level as magic by most christian organizations and more important is not scientifically proven..

2. The numbers Camping used are numbers he pulled out of no where from what I can tell. Kinda like making up your own word and throwing it into everyday conversation..Only you know what it means and everyone else just stares at you.

3. He is under the assumption that Jesus died in 33 A.D. but unless he lived during that time, he wouldn't know. No one knows the exact date of Jesus death, some say it took place anywhere from 27 A.D. up to 34 A.D. which could only mean when Camping finds out he is wrong, he will just site Mark 6:14 "King Herod heard about this, for Jesus’ name had become well known. Some were saying, “John the Baptist has been raised from the dead, and that is why miraculous powers are at work in him.” which pretty much makes the assumption that John was executed while Jesus was still alive.

4. Also, The same calender system (Julian Calendar) wasn't used during the time of Jesus crucifixion that is being used today (Gregorian calendar). So unless he accounted for those numbers as well, then I doubt he is in the same ballpark.

5. Then of course let's not forget all those passages claiming we won't know and stuff like that. I seriously doubt this is one of those times when you are suppose to read beyond the beyond and see some sorta secret passage that tells you the truth. Unless of course this is really just the plot for National Treasure 3 or something.

All in all man you don't have anything to worry about this weekend. Just live your life the best you can and don't sweat this sorta stuff because it will drive you insane...

However, Raptors are very real and you should be scared of them!

RobDegraves · 19th May 2011, 08:01 AM

What I would like to know... and I know it's mostly wishful thinking... is if there would be any way to bring these bastards to account for the damage they do to people who believe their crap.

If you can cast your minds back to the start up of the LHC supercollider, the news whipped up stories of doomsday spun by Walter Wagner and thousands of people freaked out. Some girl in India committed suicide in fear of the world ending.

Now... I also know that selling bs is a time honored tradition in religious circles, but I wish there was some way to bring people to justice who claim, as Harold Camping does, that they have definite knowledge of something and thus destroy lives. Certainly people do need to take responsibility for their own beliefs and decisions, but have we not made laws that make it illegal to advertise products with lies? Shouldn't the same apply here?

Or do I have to go beat them up myself?

Ohnoes · 19th May 2011, 08:20 AM

Hey Rob...Did you use to frequent some LHC forums? I feel like I remember that name in the fight to debunk some of the nonsense back a couple of years ago.

kedo1981 · 19th May 2011, 08:45 AM

My predictions aboot the aftermath of the rapture nonsense.
A dozen or more families will have been ruined finically.
A hand full of suicides.
At least one murder/suicide of an entire family (Texas or Fla)
Camping will disappear for a week or so till the ruckus blows over

RobDegraves · 19th May 2011, 08:49 AM

@ Ohnoes

Quote:

Hey Rob...Did you use to frequent some LHC forums? I feel like I remember that name in the fight to debunk some of the nonsense back a couple of years ago.

Yeah... sadly that was me. Fun times.

Ohnoes · 19th May 2011, 08:55 AM

Originally Posted by RobDegraves

@ Ohnoes
Yeah... sadly that was me. Fun times.

HAHA...Yeah I remember now that you were against it at first, but then after a bit of discussion you came around and then helped us fight the good fight, but if I remember that one forum (it's name escapes me now) was overrun with nutbars and I finally just quit.

But I do agree that there has to be a line drawn somewhere because as you pointed out I do remember when that girl killed herself because the fear mongering just became too much.

CynicalSkeptic · 19th May 2011, 09:06 AM

Originally Posted by Ohnoes

1. Harold Camping came up with this theory by using Numerology which is considered on the same level as magic by most christian organizations and more important is not scientifically proven..

He takes a few bible phrases and pieces them together to come up with the date.

Quote:

Thus Holy God is showing us by the words of 2 Peter 3:8 that He wants us to know that exactly 7,000 years after He destroyed the world with water in Noah’s day, He plans to destroy the entire world forever. Because the year 2011 A.D. is exactly 7,000 years after 4990 B.C. when the flood began, the Bible has given us absolute proof that the year 2011 is the end of the world during the Day of Judgment, which will come on the last day of the Day of Judgment.

http://www.familyradio.com/graphical.../judgment.html

Quote:

4. Also, The same calender system (Julian Calendar) wasn't used during the time of Jesus crucifixion that is being used today (Gregorian calendar). So unless he accounted for those numbers as well, then I doubt he is in the same ballpark.

Actually, he is converting:

Quote:

Amazingly, May 21, 2011 is the 17th day of the 2nd month of the Biblical calendar of our day. Remember, the flood waters also began on the 17th day of the 2nd month, in the year 4990 B.C.

http://www.familyradio.com/graphical.../judgment.html

Quote:

5. Then of course let's not forget all those passages claiming we won't know and stuff like that.

He addresses that as well (but I haven't read it).

Hokulele · 19th May 2011, 09:16 AM

Camping's group has been taking out full page ads in USA Today leading up to this (I am on the road this week and the hotel puts that paper in every room). Reading the ad, it sounds like he is leaving himself some wiggle room. According to the ad, the world only starts to end this weekend (earthquakes and stuff). It doesn't finish ending until Oct. 21st, but no year is indicated

Heh.

CynicalSkeptic · 19th May 2011, 09:17 AM

Originally Posted by Hokulele

According to the ad, the world only starts to end this weekend (earthquakes and stuff). It doesn't finish ending until Oct. 21st, but no year is indicated

My understanding is the Rapture is Saturday where 2 million or so faithful will be taken up. Those of us Left Behind (tm) will deal with a crumbling world for the next 6 months until it finally is destroyed.

http://www.familyradio.com/facts/

Quote:

What will take place on May 21?
On May 21, 2011 two events will occur. These events could not be more opposite in nature, the one more wonderful than can be imagined; the other more horrific than can be imagined.
A great earthquake will occur the Bible describes it as "such as was not since men were upon the earth, so mighty an earthquake, and so great." This earthquake will be so powerful it will throw open all graves.The remains of the all the believers who have ever lived will be instantly transformed into glorified spiritual bodies to be forever with God.

On the other hand the bodies of all unsaved people will be thrown out upon the ground to be shamed.
The inhabitants who survive this terrible earthquake will exist in a world of horror and chaos beyond description. Each day people will die until October 21, 2011when God will completely destroy this earth and its surviving inhabitants.

AdMan · 19th May 2011, 09:21 AM

Originally Posted by CynicalSkeptic

My understanding is the Rapture is Saturday where 2 million or so faithful will be taken up. Those of us Left Behind (tm) will deal with a crumbling world for the next 6 months until it finally is destroyed.

http://www.familyradio.com/facts/

Yup, that's Camping's story. It's 200 million who will be raptured, though (from all of human history, so watch out for flying zombies).

RobDegraves · 19th May 2011, 09:23 AM

So... if Camping is still here on the 22nd...

Nursefoxfire · 19th May 2011, 09:46 AM

that big Rapture-ready forum is saying Camping is a False Prophet (tm):

http://rr-bb.com/showthread.php?1580...cy-Day-Camping

Man, those comments are SAD!

Quote:

I find it hard anymore to believe much that I hear other than what I read in the Bible. I enjoy listening to what I 'believe' to be God loving Christians but it is so difficult now to be sure you are not listening to apostasy that it really makes it scary to listen to anyone! I know of a handful that I trust & I'm sure there are many others I could trust, but until I can prove them to be of the Truth, I just won't listen. I am saddened at the inability to trust many people anymore!

Quote:

The Rapture could happen today, and that is my dearest hope.

etc...

I found it humorous that one poster felt the need to "witness" to some of Camping's acolytes as she drove by them, and was tsking at their false prophecy.

CynicalSkeptic · 19th May 2011, 10:12 AM

Originally Posted by AdMan

Yup, that's Camping's story. It's 200 million who will be raptured, though (from all of human history, so watch out for flying zombies).

You're correct about the number, but my read is that is 200 million from those who are currently alive.

Quote:

We learn from the Bible that Holy God plans to rescue about 200 million people (that is about 3% of today’s population). On the first day of the Day of Judgment (May 21, 2011) they will be caught up (raptured) into Heaven because God had great mercy for them. This is why we can be so thankful that God has given us advance notice of Judgment Day. Because God is so merciful, maybe He will have mercy on you.

http://www.familyradio.com/graphical.../judgment.html
I haven't found where this number comes from ("We learn from the bible..."). Book, chapter & verse would be nice.

epix · 19th May 2011, 10:29 AM

Originally Posted by IMST

Taking your ball and running home after I called you out on your silly little claim that the format comes from the Bible. Got it.

Here is a little corollary that involves a critique of Camping's claim:

Quote:

"In Acts 1:7, Jesus said, 'It is not for you to know times or seasons that the Father has fixed by his own authority.' He said in Matthew 24:36, Christ taught similarly: 'But concerning that day and hour no one knows, not even the angels of heaven, nor the Son, but the Father only.'

In order to "reinforce" his decision, God carefully placed his message in the books of Acts and Mathew, so there would be no reference to time at all. Yeah, right.

Now look once: Acts Matthew

I guess the hoopla we are not supposed to decode will take place in the AM hours of the day, ain't that so?

Look twice: If the union of the initials of the name of both books returns time-related letters AM, the Heavenly Joker wouldn't stop here. Look at the chapter and the verse of Acts mentioned and think time: Acts 1:7

Isn't it so that 1 week = 7 days?

Look thrice: If the initials A and M form a time-related unity AM, then the Matthew quote must continue to spit out another time data as units of time.

Matthew 24:36 = ?

Well, if 24 hours = 1 day, then 36 hours = 1 day and a half. And here is the intended puzzle: Does 36 hours = AM,PM,AM or does 36 hours = PM,AM,PM? (The puzzle relies on substituting AM,PM,AM or the other option with Criminal, Jesus, Criminal -- the crucifixion set.)

The point is the Bible readers genuinely don't believe that God is a realistic entity, like members of some ET civilization who are some 500 million years ahead of us in the evolutionary development, for example, otherwise they wouldn't turn him into a basket case judging by the way they interpret the Bible. They just believe that some three-thousand-year-old concept of God is a real deal.

AdMan · 19th May 2011, 10:33 AM

Originally Posted by CynicalSkeptic

You're correct about the number, but my read is that is 200 million from those who are currently alive.

http://www.familyradio.com/graphical.../judgment.html
I haven't found where this number comes from ("We learn from the bible..."). Book, chapter & verse would be nice.

I think there will be floating zombies too...

Quote:

The Elect: 200 Million People

Curiously, God in His wisdom gives us the number of people whom He has elected to become saved.

We can be quite certain that the total accurate number of people that God plans to save is 200 million people. This includes every person who will be raptured on May 21, 2011. On that awesome day, the body of every true believer who has lived and subsequently died will be raised from the dead and caught up to be with Christ. At the same moment, every living true believer will be given his eternal resurrected body and caught up as a whole personality into heaven

http://www.familyradio.com/graphical...y/glory_6.html (near the middle of the page.)

I don't see his explanation for why he's so certain about that number either.

Ohnoes · 19th May 2011, 10:36 AM

Originally Posted by CynicalSkeptic

He takes a few bible phrases and pieces them together to come up with the date. http://www.familyradio.com/graphical.../judgment.html

True, but the magic number wasn't brought on by those phrases so to speak. He had to do some off the wall calculations and pull certain figures..Mainly around that number 7 from what I can tell.

Quote:

Actually, he is converting:
http://www.familyradio.com/graphical.../judgment.html

Fair enough...Even though if I remember correctly, alot of the dates he is using are mentioned no where in the bible itself.

Quote:

He addresses that as well (but I haven't read it).

Don't bother..I read some of it and it seems to be alot of talk backed up with more confusing talk.

I Am The Scum · 19th May 2011, 10:43 AM

Originally Posted by epix

Here is a little corollary that involves a critique of Camping's claim:

In order to "reinforce" his decision, God carefully placed his message in the books of Acts and Mathew, so there would be no reference to time at all. Yeah, right.

Now look once: Acts Matthew

I guess the hoopla we are not supposed to decode will take place in the AM hours of the day, ain't that so?

Look twice: If the union of the initials of the name of both books returns time-related letters AM, the Heavenly Joker wouldn't stop here. Look at the chapter and the verse of Acts mentioned and think time: Acts 1:7

Isn't it so that 1 week = 7 days?

Look thrice: If the initials A and M form a time-related unity AM, then the Matthew quote must continue to spit out another time data as units of time.

Matthew 24:36 = ?

Well, if 24 hours = 1 day, then 36 hours = 1 day and a half. And here is the intended puzzle: Does 36 hours = AM,PM,AM or does 36 hours = PM,AM,PM? (The puzzle relies on substituting AM,PM,AM or the other option with Criminal, Jesus, Criminal -- the crucifixion set.)

The point is the Bible readers genuinely don't believe that God is a realistic entity, like members of some ET civilization who are some 500 million years ahead of us in the evolutionary development, for example, otherwise they wouldn't turn him into a basket case judging by the way they interpret the Bible. They just believe that some three-thousand-year-old concept of God is a real deal.

And then you flip the calculator upside down, and it says BOOBS.

CynicalSkeptic · 19th May 2011, 10:47 AM

Originally Posted by Ohnoes

True, but the magic number wasn't brought on by those phrases so to speak. He had to do some off the wall calculations and pull certain figures..Mainly around that number 7 from what I can tell.

Yeah, something about God giving Noah 7 days warning (Gen 7:10 "And after the seven days the floodwaters came on the earth."), and the passage where a Day is as 1000 years, so the 7 day warning is like a metaphor for a 7000 year warning.

Quote:

Fair enough...Even though if I remember correctly, alot of the dates he is using are mentioned no where in the bible itself.

True, we don't know how he calculated the year of the flood, but his date comes from Gen 7:11
"In the six hundredth year of Noah’s life, on the seventeenth day of the second month"

Ohnoes · 19th May 2011, 11:10 AM

Originally Posted by CynicalSkeptic

Yeah, something about God giving Noah 7 days warning (Gen 7:10 "And after the seven days the floodwaters came on the earth."), and the passage where a Day is as 1000 years, so the 7 day warning is like a metaphor for a 7000 year warning.

HAHA...So they hold us to a 1 day = 1000 years standard, but not Noah and his straight up 7 earth days? Man that sucks..Giving us all this time to prepare only to figure it all out at the last minute!

Quote:

True, we don't know how he calculated the year of the flood, but his date comes from Gen 7:11
"In the six hundredth year of Noah’s life, on the seventeenth day of the second month"

See....That's the problem right there. If Camping was 600 years old we would probably be more inclined to at least hear him out. He just needs to wait a bit longer then try again!

CynicalSkeptic · 19th May 2011, 11:15 AM

Originally Posted by Ohnoes

Giving us all this time to prepare only to figure it all out at the last minute!

Well Camping figured it out at least a year and a half ago.

Quote:

He just needs to wait a bit longer then try again!

I'm reasonably sure he he will.

Jon. · 19th May 2011, 11:24 AM

Originally Posted by CynicalSkeptic

You're correct about the number, but my read is that is 200 million from those who are currently alive.

http://www.familyradio.com/graphical.../judgment.html
I haven't found where this number comes from ("We learn from the bible..."). Book, chapter & verse would be nice.

Seeing as how there probably weren't 200 million people on the earth (let alone in the world known to the bible writers) when the bible was written, I very much doubt that number appears anywhere in the Bible. I believe it comes from Chapter A55 of the Book of Harold Camping.

CynicalSkeptic · 19th May 2011, 11:29 AM

Originally Posted by Ohnoes

True, but the magic number wasn't brought on by those phrases so to speak. He had to do some off the wall calculations and pull certain figures..Mainly around that number 7 from what I can tell.

Ahh.. This article explains it.

The date of the crucifixion is itself somewhat uncertain, but Camping takes it to be April 1 in 33 AD. Come May 21, 2011, Camping says, 722,500 days will have elapsed since that occurrence. And 722,500 is (5 x 10 x 17) x (5 x 10 x 17). Those numbers are important, according to Camping, because 5 symbolizes atonement, 10 represents completeness, and 17 is for heaven.

I missed all that nonsense, and just found the part about 7000 years since Noah's Flood and 7 days and a day is as 1000 years.

slingblade · 19th May 2011, 02:13 PM

Originally Posted by epix

Matthew 24:36

...has nothing to do with time, or with dates. As has already been pointed out to you, those are the notations for chapter and verse. Constantly trying to twist them into a code for time makes no sense at all.

epix · 19th May 2011, 09:45 PM

Originally Posted by slingblade

...has nothing to do with time, or with dates. As has already been pointed out to you, those are the notations for chapter and verse.

Oh, really? LOL.

Quote:

Constantly trying to twist them into a code for time makes no sense at all.

I don't do it "constantly," coz orthodox theists and the atheists that form the anti-religious branch are a very close-minded audience that is guided by their irreversible dogma respectively. Also, they have a great deal of difficulty to associate symbols; they never notice anything, and so it's virtually impossible to break their stereotypes. I wanted to do the Rapture test, but I have enough evidence now to know that the atheists would flunk it. According to the atheists, AM doesn't relate to time nor does 1 and 7. I think we may experience devolution pretty soon and climb back the trees. LOL.

wollclark · 19th May 2011, 10:50 PM

I've only got 41 hours and 10 minutes.

jhunter1163 · 19th May 2011, 11:42 PM

I'm beginning to think that Epix is a Poe. If so, well played, sir.

Bram Kaandorp · 20th May 2011, 02:13 AM

Originally Posted by jhunter1163

I'm beginning to think that Epix is a Poe. If so, well played, sir.

I sure hope so, or else I think I should rethink why I like his responses.

Cheers

epix · 20th May 2011, 02:53 PM

Originally Posted by Bram Kaandorp

I sure hope so, or else I think I should rethink why I like his responses.

Cheers

Finally Rapture showed up on the MSN page that rerouted one of the favorite news topic of this week to MSNBC Cosmic Log.
http://cosmiclog.msnbc.msn.com/rapture/?GT1=43001

Apparently the end of the world sells and Camping knows it.

Quote:

The real question is: Why has there been so much buzz over Saturday's scheduled Rapture?

"Obviously, what could be a bigger news story than the end of the world?" University of York historian Nicholas Guyatt, author of the book "Have a Nice Doomsday," told me. "It's absurd to think the world is going to end on Saturday, but even if there's an infinitesimally small chance that it's true, we should be interested."

The White House was secretly hoping that the most of the Christians would take the prediction seriously and sell everything they have, which would boost the limping economy. A rumor has it that there has been a long telephone conversation between the Fed Reserve Chairman Ben Bernanke and Harold Camping.

Too bad that the atheists never draw such an interest from the media. But that can be remedied: First, get an idea... well, that's the problem. LOL.

Bram Kaandorp · 20th May 2011, 03:53 PM

I almost forgot my reason for NOT wanting the rapture to take place (even if there were no adverse effects):

May 25th is Towel Day. I'd commit an eternal sin to stay here to celebrate...

Wait, maybe I already have, so I may be in the clear.

Cheers

Mister Earl · 20th May 2011, 04:09 PM

So, epix? If this guy talks rapture and knowingly lies about it, it's ok? Bearing false witness is OK if you do it for god points, I guess.

18th May 2011, 08:32 PM	#121
AdMan Philosopher Join Date: Feb 2010 Posts: 7,343	Originally Posted by wollclark I wish I could laugh at that. I hope you're not still worrying about this. Nothing is going to happen on Saturday. It's just a bunch of religious kooks who are going to be quite disappointed and confused when they wake up Sunday morning in their beds rather than in heaven.
AdMan Philosopher Join Date: Feb 2010 Posts: 7,343	__________________ It is far better to grasp the universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring. - Carl Sagan

18th May 2011, 10:03 PM	#123
Elypsis44 Illuminator Join Date: Dec 2010 Posts: 3,902	Paul Bethke, have a look at post # 115. Please explain your comments: "Future events were sealed even from Christ at least the time of the end." And then: "And Jesus Christ is God." Thanks!
Elypsis44 Illuminator Join Date: Dec 2010 Posts: 3,902

19th May 2011, 01:59 AM	#124
epix Illuminator Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Borgia Apartment, Vatican City Posts: 3,002	Originally Posted by IMST The image below is not my bible, but just a page I grabbed at random from the internet. No where in my bible, nor any bible I've ever seen, other than in commentary, does it use the format you describe, e.g. 20:11. It numbers the chapter then the individual verses separately. http://forums.randi.org/imagehosting...442a840a47.jpg By "Chapter:Verse" I meant the commonplace editions of the Bible where each book is divided into chapters and each chapter into verses. The customary quoting from the Bible is text BookName Chapter:Verse Example... No offense, but I don't feel like answering any of your additional questions asked to explain the above. Epix 6:66
	__________________ Grace to you and peace from Him who is and who was and who is to come, and from the seven Spirits who are before His throne, and from Jesus Christ, the faithful witness, the firstborn from the dead, and the ruler over the kings of the earth. Huh? What's your point?

19th May 2011, 02:18 AM	#125
epix Illuminator Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Borgia Apartment, Vatican City Posts: 3,002	Originally Posted by edge LOL Yep. It's incredible but the atheists genuinly believe that Camping put all his faith into his prediction, and he is ready to experience a wonderful case of divine lifting on Saturday. I bet that the atheists are the only group whose members believe that Camping is dead serious about his prediction. It's a PR ploy, but a strange one, coz the Rapture scenario will not materialize and that should negatively affect the Camping's ministry. So it appears that Camping sees some PR gain in it nevertheless. But which one? So someone thinks along these lines and gets curious about the reasons... "Who you gonna call?" "A-theists!" Yeah right. LOL.
	__________________ Grace to you and peace from Him who is and who was and who is to come, and from the seven Spirits who are before His throne, and from Jesus Christ, the faithful witness, the firstborn from the dead, and the ruler over the kings of the earth. Huh? What's your point?

19th May 2011, 03:20 AM	#126
Bram Kaandorp Master Poster Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: Netherlands Posts: 2,264	Originally Posted by epix Yep. It's incredible but the atheists genuinly believe that Camping put all his faith into his prediction, and he is ready to experience a wonderful case of divine lifting on Saturday. I bet that the atheists are the only group whose members believe that Camping is dead serious about his prediction. It's a PR ploy, but a strange one, coz the Rapture scenario will not materialize and that should negatively affect the Camping's ministry. So it appears that Camping sees some PR gain in it nevertheless. But which one? So someone thinks along these lines and gets curious about the reasons... "Who you gonna call?" "A-theists!" Yeah right. LOL. Too bad Camping never used the toungue-in-cheek emoticon in his texts, or else we could have figured it out much more easily.
	__________________ If autism is a "living death", does that make me a zombie? If so, that'd be great. Just don't get your brain in my general vicinity.

18th May 2011, 09:47 PM	#122
wollclark Critical Thinker Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Fort Payne, Alabama Posts: 286	Originally Posted by AdMan I hope you're not still worrying about this. Nothing is going to happen on Saturday. It's just a bunch of religious kooks who are going to be quite disappointed and confused when they wake up Sunday morning in their beds rather than in heaven. I wish I had the rationality to accept that, but I don't. I'm not sure what the fear stems from, it could have been an article I read in the Weekly World News when I was younger. I don't remember believing much from that magazine, despite being a kid, except for an article which said that the sun was to explode in six years. It wasn't the usual badly photo-shopped story you'd see in that publication like "Bigfoot Marries Elvis: Shocking Photos Inside!". It was simply a black and white picture of the sun, and alarming heading text. I know it's stupid, but I spent months worrying about that and eventually forgot about it; I'm pretty sure it's been six years by now.

19th May 2011, 04:47 AM	#127
edge Philosopher Join Date: Feb 2004 Location: Where my two best friends are, in here now. Posts: 5,300	Originally Posted by Elypsis44 Interesting. There's more, way more.
	__________________ My two best friends in here! Upper left. Laus Deo

19th May 2011, 06:56 AM	#128
Elypsis44 Illuminator Join Date: Dec 2010 Posts: 3,902	Originally Posted by edge There's more, way more. Do tell. Explain how Jesus/God kept information from Himself.
Elypsis44 Illuminator Join Date: Dec 2010 Posts: 3,902	Last edited by Elypsis44; 19th May 2011 at 06:58 AM.

19th May 2011, 07:19 AM	#129
Sideroxylon Gavagai! Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Turkey Posts: 10,838	Originally Posted by epix Yep. It's incredible but the atheists genuinly believe that Camping put all his faith into his prediction, and he is ready to experience a wonderful case of divine lifting on Saturday. I bet that the atheists are the only group whose members believe that Camping is dead serious about his prediction. It's a PR ploy, but a strange one, coz the Rapture scenario will not materialize and that should negatively affect the Camping's ministry. So it appears that Camping sees some PR gain in it nevertheless. But which one? So someone thinks along these lines and gets curious about the reasons... "Who you gonna call?" "A-theists!" Yeah right. LOL. Are you invoking Poe's Law?
	__________________ 'The first principle is that you must not fool yourself - and you are the easiest person to fool.' - Richard Feynman

19th May 2011, 07:30 AM	#130
IMST If Charlie Parker Was a Gunslinger, There'd Be a Whole Lot of Dead Copycats Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Seattle Posts: 6,133	Originally Posted by epix By "Chapter:Verse" I meant the commonplace editions of the Bible where each book is divided into chapters and each chapter into verses. The customary quoting from the Bible is text BookName Chapter:Verse Example... No offense, but I don't feel like answering any of your additional questions asked to explain the above. Epix 6:66 Taking your ball and running home after I called you out on your silly little claim that the format comes from the Bible. Got it.
	__________________ Creativity is more than just being different. Anybody can plan weird; that's easy. What's hard is to be as simple as Bach. Making the simple, awesomely simple, that's creativity. - Charles Mingus

19th May 2011, 07:41 AM	#131
Ohnoes Critical Thinker Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 274	Originally Posted by wollclark I wish I had the rationality to accept that, but I don't. I'm not sure what the fear stems from, it could have been an article I read in the Weekly World News when I was younger. haha I did that same thing when i was young and I was plagued with irrational fears for a long time, and I know that hearing people say it will be fine, doesn't mean it will calm your fears. However, these forums are for discussion and not to really meant to alleviate peoples fears, so maybe I can help you out by laying out something that breaks things down a bit. 1. Harold Camping came up with this theory by using Numerology which is considered on the same level as magic by most christian organizations and more important is not scientifically proven.. 2. The numbers Camping used are numbers he pulled out of no where from what I can tell. Kinda like making up your own word and throwing it into everyday conversation..Only you know what it means and everyone else just stares at you. 3. He is under the assumption that Jesus died in 33 A.D. but unless he lived during that time, he wouldn't know. No one knows the exact date of Jesus death, some say it took place anywhere from 27 A.D. up to 34 A.D. which could only mean when Camping finds out he is wrong, he will just site Mark 6:14 "King Herod heard about this, for Jesus’ name had become well known. Some were saying, “John the Baptist has been raised from the dead, and that is why miraculous powers are at work in him.” which pretty much makes the assumption that John was executed while Jesus was still alive. 4. Also, The same calender system (Julian Calendar) wasn't used during the time of Jesus crucifixion that is being used today (Gregorian calendar). So unless he accounted for those numbers as well, then I doubt he is in the same ballpark. 5. Then of course let's not forget all those passages claiming we won't know and stuff like that. I seriously doubt this is one of those times when you are suppose to read beyond the beyond and see some sorta secret passage that tells you the truth. Unless of course this is really just the plot for National Treasure 3 or something. All in all man you don't have anything to worry about this weekend. Just live your life the best you can and don't sweat this sorta stuff because it will drive you insane... However, Raptors are very real and you should be scared of them!
Ohnoes Critical Thinker Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 274

19th May 2011, 08:01 AM	#132
RobDegraves Muse Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 787	What I would like to know... and I know it's mostly wishful thinking... is if there would be any way to bring these bastards to account for the damage they do to people who believe their crap. If you can cast your minds back to the start up of the LHC supercollider, the news whipped up stories of doomsday spun by Walter Wagner and thousands of people freaked out. Some girl in India committed suicide in fear of the world ending. Now... I also know that selling bs is a time honored tradition in religious circles, but I wish there was some way to bring people to justice who claim, as Harold Camping does, that they have definite knowledge of something and thus destroy lives. Certainly people do need to take responsibility for their own beliefs and decisions, but have we not made laws that make it illegal to advertise products with lies? Shouldn't the same apply here? Or do I have to go beat them up myself?
RobDegraves Muse Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 787

19th May 2011, 08:20 AM	#133
Ohnoes Critical Thinker Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 274	Hey Rob...Did you use to frequent some LHC forums? I feel like I remember that name in the fight to debunk some of the nonsense back a couple of years ago.
Ohnoes Critical Thinker Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 274

19th May 2011, 08:45 AM	#134
kedo1981 Master Poster Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: ohio Posts: 2,103	My predictions aboot the aftermath of the rapture nonsense. A dozen or more families will have been ruined finically. A hand full of suicides. At least one murder/suicide of an entire family (Texas or Fla) Camping will disappear for a week or so till the ruckus blows over
	__________________ "Prove all things, hold fast that which is good" (I Thessalonians 5:21) I readily admit I don’t know enough to say for sure that there is no God. But I do know enough so say that anyone who claims to know the mind and will of a being such as God is a liar. I have no problem with Jesus, but his fan club sucks!

19th May 2011, 08:49 AM	#135
RobDegraves Muse Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 787	@ Ohnoes Quote: Hey Rob...Did you use to frequent some LHC forums? I feel like I remember that name in the fight to debunk some of the nonsense back a couple of years ago. Yeah... sadly that was me. Fun times.
RobDegraves Muse Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 787

19th May 2011, 08:55 AM	#136
Ohnoes Critical Thinker Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 274	Originally Posted by RobDegraves @ Ohnoes Yeah... sadly that was me. Fun times. HAHA...Yeah I remember now that you were against it at first, but then after a bit of discussion you came around and then helped us fight the good fight, but if I remember that one forum (it's name escapes me now) was overrun with nutbars and I finally just quit. But I do agree that there has to be a line drawn somewhere because as you pointed out I do remember when that girl killed herself because the fear mongering just became too much.
Ohnoes Critical Thinker Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 274	Last edited by Ohnoes; 19th May 2011 at 09:01 AM.

19th May 2011, 09:06 AM	#137
CynicalSkeptic Graduate Poster Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: state of denial Posts: 1,407	Originally Posted by Ohnoes 1. Harold Camping came up with this theory by using Numerology which is considered on the same level as magic by most christian organizations and more important is not scientifically proven.. He takes a few bible phrases and pieces them together to come up with the date. Quote: Thus Holy God is showing us by the words of 2 Peter 3:8 that He wants us to know that exactly 7,000 years after He destroyed the world with water in Noah’s day, He plans to destroy the entire world forever. Because the year 2011 A.D. is exactly 7,000 years after 4990 B.C. when the flood began, the Bible has given us absolute proof that the year 2011 is the end of the world during the Day of Judgment, which will come on the last day of the Day of Judgment. http://www.familyradio.com/graphical.../judgment.html Quote: 4. Also, The same calender system (Julian Calendar) wasn't used during the time of Jesus crucifixion that is being used today (Gregorian calendar). So unless he accounted for those numbers as well, then I doubt he is in the same ballpark. Actually, he is converting: Quote: Amazingly, May 21, 2011 is the 17th day of the 2nd month of the Biblical calendar of our day. Remember, the flood waters also began on the 17th day of the 2nd month, in the year 4990 B.C. http://www.familyradio.com/graphical.../judgment.html Quote: 5. Then of course let's not forget all those passages claiming we won't know and stuff like that. He addresses that as well (but I haven't read it).

19th May 2011, 09:16 AM	#138
Hokulele Official Nemesis Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Trying to decide whether to set defenses against an army, or against mole rats. Posts: 27,349	Camping's group has been taking out full page ads in USA Today leading up to this (I am on the road this week and the hotel puts that paper in every room). Reading the ad, it sounds like he is leaving himself some wiggle room. According to the ad, the world only starts to end this weekend (earthquakes and stuff). It doesn't finish ending until Oct. 21st, but no year is indicated Heh.

19th May 2011, 09:17 AM	#139
CynicalSkeptic Graduate Poster Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: state of denial Posts: 1,407	Originally Posted by Hokulele According to the ad, the world only starts to end this weekend (earthquakes and stuff). It doesn't finish ending until Oct. 21st, but no year is indicated My understanding is the Rapture is Saturday where 2 million or so faithful will be taken up. Those of us Left Behind (tm) will deal with a crumbling world for the next 6 months until it finally is destroyed. http://www.familyradio.com/facts/ Quote: What will take place on May 21? On May 21, 2011 two events will occur. These events could not be more opposite in nature, the one more wonderful than can be imagined; the other more horrific than can be imagined. A great earthquake will occur the Bible describes it as "such as was not since men were upon the earth, so mighty an earthquake, and so great." This earthquake will be so powerful it will throw open all graves.The remains of the all the believers who have ever lived will be instantly transformed into glorified spiritual bodies to be forever with God. On the other hand the bodies of all unsaved people will be thrown out upon the ground to be shamed. The inhabitants who survive this terrible earthquake will exist in a world of horror and chaos beyond description. Each day people will die until October 21, 2011when God will completely destroy this earth and its surviving inhabitants.
	Last edited by CynicalSkeptic; 19th May 2011 at 09:19 AM.

19th May 2011, 09:21 AM	#140
AdMan Philosopher Join Date: Feb 2010 Posts: 7,343	Originally Posted by CynicalSkeptic My understanding is the Rapture is Saturday where 2 million or so faithful will be taken up. Those of us Left Behind (tm) will deal with a crumbling world for the next 6 months until it finally is destroyed. http://www.familyradio.com/facts/ Yup, that's Camping's story. It's 200 million who will be raptured, though (from all of human history, so watch out for flying zombies).
AdMan Philosopher Join Date: Feb 2010 Posts: 7,343	__________________ It is far better to grasp the universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring. - Carl Sagan

19th May 2011, 09:23 AM	#141
RobDegraves Muse Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 787	So... if Camping is still here on the 22nd...
RobDegraves Muse Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 787

19th May 2011, 09:46 AM	#142
Nursefoxfire Graduate Poster Join Date: Feb 2008 Posts: 1,197	that big Rapture-ready forum is saying Camping is a False Prophet (tm): http://rr-bb.com/showthread.php?1580...cy-Day-Camping Man, those comments are SAD! Quote: I find it hard anymore to believe much that I hear other than what I read in the Bible. I enjoy listening to what I 'believe' to be God loving Christians but it is so difficult now to be sure you are not listening to apostasy that it really makes it scary to listen to anyone! I know of a handful that I trust & I'm sure there are many others I could trust, but until I can prove them to be of the Truth, I just won't listen. I am saddened at the inability to trust many people anymore! Quote: The Rapture could happen today, and that is my dearest hope. etc... I found it humorous that one poster felt the need to "witness" to some of Camping's acolytes as she drove by them, and was tsking at their false prophecy.

19th May 2011, 10:12 AM	#143
CynicalSkeptic Graduate Poster Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: state of denial Posts: 1,407	Originally Posted by AdMan Yup, that's Camping's story. It's 200 million who will be raptured, though (from all of human history, so watch out for flying zombies). You're correct about the number, but my read is that is 200 million from those who are currently alive. Quote: We learn from the Bible that Holy God plans to rescue about 200 million people (that is about 3% of today’s population). On the first day of the Day of Judgment (May 21, 2011) they will be caught up (raptured) into Heaven because God had great mercy for them. This is why we can be so thankful that God has given us advance notice of Judgment Day. Because God is so merciful, maybe He will have mercy on you. http://www.familyradio.com/graphical.../judgment.html I haven't found where this number comes from ("We learn from the bible..."). Book, chapter & verse would be nice.

19th May 2011, 10:29 AM	#144
epix Illuminator Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Borgia Apartment, Vatican City Posts: 3,002	Originally Posted by IMST Taking your ball and running home after I called you out on your silly little claim that the format comes from the Bible. Got it. Here is a little corollary that involves a critique of Camping's claim: Quote: "In Acts 1:7, Jesus said, 'It is not for you to know times or seasons that the Father has fixed by his own authority.' He said in Matthew 24:36, Christ taught similarly: 'But concerning that day and hour no one knows, not even the angels of heaven, nor the Son, but the Father only.' In order to "reinforce" his decision, God carefully placed his message in the books of Acts and Mathew, so there would be no reference to time at all. Yeah, right. Now look once: Acts Matthew I guess the hoopla we are not supposed to decode will take place in the AM hours of the day, ain't that so? Look twice: If the union of the initials of the name of both books returns time-related letters AM, the Heavenly Joker wouldn't stop here. Look at the chapter and the verse of Acts mentioned and think time: Acts 1:7 Isn't it so that 1 week = 7 days? Look thrice: If the initials A and M form a time-related unity AM, then the Matthew quote must continue to spit out another time data as units of time. Matthew 24:36 = ? Well, if 24 hours = 1 day, then 36 hours = 1 day and a half. And here is the intended puzzle: Does 36 hours = AM,PM,AM or does 36 hours = PM,AM,PM? (The puzzle relies on substituting AM,PM,AM or the other option with Criminal, Jesus, Criminal -- the crucifixion set.) The point is the Bible readers genuinely don't believe that God is a realistic entity, like members of some ET civilization who are some 500 million years ahead of us in the evolutionary development, for example, otherwise they wouldn't turn him into a basket case judging by the way they interpret the Bible. They just believe that some three-thousand-year-old concept of God is a real deal.
	__________________ Grace to you and peace from Him who is and who was and who is to come, and from the seven Spirits who are before His throne, and from Jesus Christ, the faithful witness, the firstborn from the dead, and the ruler over the kings of the earth. Huh? What's your point? Last edited by epix; 19th May 2011 at 10:40 AM.

19th May 2011, 10:33 AM	#145
AdMan Philosopher Join Date: Feb 2010 Posts: 7,343	Originally Posted by CynicalSkeptic You're correct about the number, but my read is that is 200 million from those who are currently alive. http://www.familyradio.com/graphical.../judgment.html I haven't found where this number comes from ("We learn from the bible..."). Book, chapter & verse would be nice. I think there will be floating zombies too... Quote: The Elect: 200 Million People Curiously, God in His wisdom gives us the number of people whom He has elected to become saved. We can be quite certain that the total accurate number of people that God plans to save is 200 million people. This includes every person who will be raptured on May 21, 2011. On that awesome day, the body of every true believer who has lived and subsequently died will be raised from the dead and caught up to be with Christ. At the same moment, every living true believer will be given his eternal resurrected body and caught up as a whole personality into heaven http://www.familyradio.com/graphical...y/glory_6.html (near the middle of the page.) I don't see his explanation for why he's so certain about that number either.
AdMan Philosopher Join Date: Feb 2010 Posts: 7,343	__________________ It is far better to grasp the universe as it really is than to persist in delusion, however satisfying and reassuring. - Carl Sagan Last edited by AdMan; 19th May 2011 at 10:35 AM.

19th May 2011, 10:36 AM	#146
Ohnoes Critical Thinker Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 274	Originally Posted by CynicalSkeptic He takes a few bible phrases and pieces them together to come up with the date. http://www.familyradio.com/graphical.../judgment.html True, but the magic number wasn't brought on by those phrases so to speak. He had to do some off the wall calculations and pull certain figures..Mainly around that number 7 from what I can tell. Quote: Actually, he is converting: http://www.familyradio.com/graphical.../judgment.html Fair enough...Even though if I remember correctly, alot of the dates he is using are mentioned no where in the bible itself. Quote: He addresses that as well (but I haven't read it). Don't bother..I read some of it and it seems to be alot of talk backed up with more confusing talk.
Ohnoes Critical Thinker Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 274	Last edited by Ohnoes; 19th May 2011 at 10:37 AM.

19th May 2011, 10:43 AM	#147
I Am The Scum Graduate Poster Join Date: Mar 2010 Posts: 1,549	Originally Posted by epix Here is a little corollary that involves a critique of Camping's claim: In order to "reinforce" his decision, God carefully placed his message in the books of Acts and Mathew, so there would be no reference to time at all. Yeah, right. Now look once: Acts Matthew I guess the hoopla we are not supposed to decode will take place in the AM hours of the day, ain't that so? Look twice: If the union of the initials of the name of both books returns time-related letters AM, the Heavenly Joker wouldn't stop here. Look at the chapter and the verse of Acts mentioned and think time: Acts 1:7 Isn't it so that 1 week = 7 days? Look thrice: If the initials A and M form a time-related unity AM, then the Matthew quote must continue to spit out another time data as units of time. Matthew 24:36 = ? Well, if 24 hours = 1 day, then 36 hours = 1 day and a half. And here is the intended puzzle: Does 36 hours = AM,PM,AM or does 36 hours = PM,AM,PM? (The puzzle relies on substituting AM,PM,AM or the other option with Criminal, Jesus, Criminal -- the crucifixion set.) The point is the Bible readers genuinely don't believe that God is a realistic entity, like members of some ET civilization who are some 500 million years ahead of us in the evolutionary development, for example, otherwise they wouldn't turn him into a basket case judging by the way they interpret the Bible. They just believe that some three-thousand-year-old concept of God is a real deal. And then you flip the calculator upside down, and it says BOOBS.

19th May 2011, 10:47 AM	#148
CynicalSkeptic Graduate Poster Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: state of denial Posts: 1,407	Originally Posted by Ohnoes True, but the magic number wasn't brought on by those phrases so to speak. He had to do some off the wall calculations and pull certain figures..Mainly around that number 7 from what I can tell. Yeah, something about God giving Noah 7 days warning (Gen 7:10 "And after the seven days the floodwaters came on the earth."), and the passage where a Day is as 1000 years, so the 7 day warning is like a metaphor for a 7000 year warning. Quote: Fair enough...Even though if I remember correctly, alot of the dates he is using are mentioned no where in the bible itself. True, we don't know how he calculated the year of the flood, but his date comes from Gen 7:11 "In the six hundredth year of Noah’s life, on the seventeenth day of the second month"

19th May 2011, 11:10 AM	#149
Ohnoes Critical Thinker Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 274	Originally Posted by CynicalSkeptic Yeah, something about God giving Noah 7 days warning (Gen 7:10 "And after the seven days the floodwaters came on the earth."), and the passage where a Day is as 1000 years, so the 7 day warning is like a metaphor for a 7000 year warning. HAHA...So they hold us to a 1 day = 1000 years standard, but not Noah and his straight up 7 earth days? Man that sucks..Giving us all this time to prepare only to figure it all out at the last minute! Quote: True, we don't know how he calculated the year of the flood, but his date comes from Gen 7:11 "In the six hundredth year of Noah’s life, on the seventeenth day of the second month" See....That's the problem right there. If Camping was 600 years old we would probably be more inclined to at least hear him out. He just needs to wait a bit longer then try again!
Ohnoes Critical Thinker Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: 274

19th May 2011, 11:15 AM	#150
CynicalSkeptic Graduate Poster Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: state of denial Posts: 1,407	Originally Posted by Ohnoes Giving us all this time to prepare only to figure it all out at the last minute! Well Camping figured it out at least a year and a half ago. Quote: He just needs to wait a bit longer then try again! I'm reasonably sure he he will.

19th May 2011, 11:24 AM	#151
Jon. Increasing entropy since 1970 Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: On the Clapham omnibus Posts: 3,509	Originally Posted by CynicalSkeptic You're correct about the number, but my read is that is 200 million from those who are currently alive. http://www.familyradio.com/graphical.../judgment.html I haven't found where this number comes from ("We learn from the bible..."). Book, chapter & verse would be nice. Seeing as how there probably weren't 200 million people on the earth (let alone in the world known to the bible writers) when the bible was written, I very much doubt that number appears anywhere in the Bible. I believe it comes from Chapter A55 of the Book of Harold Camping.
	__________________ In theory, there is no difference between theory and practice. I don't appeal to the masses, and they don't appeal to me. - Graham Parker Calling modern day fundamentalists medieval is giving them about a thousand years of philosophical advancement they do not have. - Jorghnassen

19th May 2011, 11:29 AM	#152
CynicalSkeptic Graduate Poster Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: state of denial Posts: 1,407	Originally Posted by Ohnoes True, but the magic number wasn't brought on by those phrases so to speak. He had to do some off the wall calculations and pull certain figures..Mainly around that number 7 from what I can tell. Ahh.. This article explains it. The date of the crucifixion is itself somewhat uncertain, but Camping takes it to be April 1 in 33 AD. Come May 21, 2011, Camping says, 722,500 days will have elapsed since that occurrence. And 722,500 is (5 x 10 x 17) x (5 x 10 x 17). Those numbers are important, according to Camping, because 5 symbolizes atonement, 10 represents completeness, and 17 is for heaven. I missed all that nonsense, and just found the part about 7000 years since Noah's Flood and 7 days and a day is as 1000 years.

19th May 2011, 02:13 PM	#153
slingblade Guest Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 23,642	Originally Posted by epix Matthew 24:36 ...has nothing to do with time, or with dates. As has already been pointed out to you, those are the notations for chapter and verse. Constantly trying to twist them into a code for time makes no sense at all.
slingblade Guest Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 23,642

19th May 2011, 09:45 PM	#154
epix Illuminator Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Borgia Apartment, Vatican City Posts: 3,002	Originally Posted by slingblade ...has nothing to do with time, or with dates. As has already been pointed out to you, those are the notations for chapter and verse. Oh, really? LOL. Quote: Constantly trying to twist them into a code for time makes no sense at all. I don't do it "constantly," coz orthodox theists and the atheists that form the anti-religious branch are a very close-minded audience that is guided by their irreversible dogma respectively. Also, they have a great deal of difficulty to associate symbols; they never notice anything, and so it's virtually impossible to break their stereotypes. I wanted to do the Rapture test, but I have enough evidence now to know that the atheists would flunk it. According to the atheists, AM doesn't relate to time nor does 1 and 7. I think we may experience devolution pretty soon and climb back the trees. LOL.
	__________________ Grace to you and peace from Him who is and who was and who is to come, and from the seven Spirits who are before His throne, and from Jesus Christ, the faithful witness, the firstborn from the dead, and the ruler over the kings of the earth. Huh? What's your point?

19th May 2011, 10:50 PM	#155
wollclark Critical Thinker Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Fort Payne, Alabama Posts: 286	I've only got 41 hours and 10 minutes.