Are women socially conditioned to be complainers?

truethat · 9th May 2011, 08:40 PM

I've started threads like this before. I'm constantly frustrated dealing with women who get very emotional about situations that are sort of over and done with.

I'm not sure how to explain it. Here's an example. My 10 year old son accidentally broke my brand new lap top. He left it on the bed under the covers and the motor burned out. I know he didn't mean it. I know he learned a lesson about being careful but I really didn't get mad because it's over and done with, he didn't mean it and what is flipping out going to solve? That said I'm a very strict parent normally so it's not like I let the kids rule the roost.

In this case my attitude to myself was, "it's over, see if you can fix it and if you can't it's a loss"

I've noticed however that several female friends of mine want to play out say "childhood trauma" or "family trauma" they can't get over something like "My father didn't walk me down the aisle and my wedding was ruined." They'll sit and converse and pat each other on the back, each one cooing supportive phrases. In my mind I'm thinking, "Chick it's over, it happened 10 years ago GET OVER IT" but what I say is the same old cooing as the rest or just keeping silent.

I'm struck by a sort of female cultural hegemony where maybe all of us are sitting there thinking the same thing but no one wants to say anything.

Any thoughts?

John Jones · 9th May 2011, 08:50 PM

You sure complain a lot.

Gawdzilla · 9th May 2011, 09:19 PM

You should post that over at the Oprah Winfrey forum. Show them bitches.

Jekyll's Guest · 9th May 2011, 10:16 PM

A Terminator exists only to kill. You could bury one in cement except for one hand, and due to its 120 year power cell, a century after being entombed it would try to crush the life from you if you brushed past it.

When it comes to holding a grudge, Terminators have nothing on a woman.

Kopji · 9th May 2011, 10:23 PM

Posting a lot of these are you?

Jekyll's Guest · 9th May 2011, 10:30 PM

I'm actually very talky for a guy, developed language centers and all that; but sometimes I say to my wife "Babe I love you, but you need to find another woman to talk to. I want to fix the problem, and you want to lament about it."

On average men simply don't need to go over something again and again to get closure. I am no longer on fire, I have closure. I backed over the guy with the knife and he died, I have closure.

Cavemonster · 9th May 2011, 10:36 PM

This is the kind of question that's incredibly susceptible to confirmation bias.

I do feel there's a distinct difference in the way that women and men I know process negative emotions. But I can't clearly label it, and it's not universal. I highly doubt women complain more, but I wouldn't be surprised if they complained in different ways and about different things. It's very hard to tease out real observations from my own, and I suggest yours too, unconscious biases and expectations.

I'd love to see a study on the subject though. I'm sure they exist, but I'm not sure what terms to search for.

Hokulele · 9th May 2011, 10:45 PM

Originally Posted by truethat

I'm constantly frustrated dealing with women who get very emotional about situations that are sort of over and done with.

You are complaining about women who complain?

Jekyll's Guest · 9th May 2011, 10:48 PM

Originally Posted by Cavemonster

I highly doubt women complain more

May I ask why?

JudeBrando · 9th May 2011, 10:53 PM

Almost every time, and I say almost because there must have been a few exceptions, almost every time I walk by a couple of women and only catch a few seconds of their conversation, one is complaining to the other and usually about a man.

jiggeryqua · 9th May 2011, 11:07 PM

Originally Posted by JudeBrando

Almost every time, and I say almost because there must have been a few exceptions, almost every time I walk by a couple of women and only catch a few seconds of their conversation, one is complaining to the other and usually about a man.

There's that confirmation bias at work. Actually at least half the time they're talking about shoes.

Puppycow · 9th May 2011, 11:32 PM

Originally Posted by truethat

Any thoughts?

I sympathize.

Sounds like my wife.

This is what John Gray wrote about in Men are from Mars, Women are from Venus. Men (or other women) are just supposed to patiently listen and agree. The complaints are usually something for which there is no solution, so trying to say something constructive or racking your brains for a solution is pointless.

I can't tell you how many times I've wanted to just say "Unless there's something I can do about it, I don't want to hear it."

Cavemonster · 10th May 2011, 12:33 AM

Originally Posted by Jekyll's Guest

May I ask why?

Just like the OP, a general sense of my personal experience. As an example, threads on this forum. I don't know the gender of everyone here, but there's at least one new "complaint" thread every day, and I'd say the gender of the poster doesn't tend to be female more than their share of forum traffic.

I used to frequent the forum management threads, where the complainers were almost exclusively posters I knew to have identified themselves as male.

I can say the same thing for workplaces I've been in, groups of friends, all very unscientific and based on memory, so I'm very open to being wrong.

rofl · 10th May 2011, 02:45 AM

Truethat, if you were not cooing along with them and patting them on the back once in a while they would probably misintepret your coping skills as callousness or coldness. I don't think that your friend know that they can learn the coping skills and strategies that will help them overcome the way they deal with childhood and family traumas. They are not processing negative emotions in a way that helps them overcomes their suffering , they are processing them in a way that means they recieve the comfort, nurturing and strength to cope with and endure their suffering.

You are right about them being caught in a cycle that does not include them getting over it. Ironically, you can go too far the other direction too. You cope so well with everthing that even car accidents are just water off a duck's back. The goal is to cope really well with stuff without losing your social sensitivity or emotinal intelligence.

Soapy Sam · 10th May 2011, 03:09 AM

Possibly- just possibly- women have more to complain about?

welshdean · 10th May 2011, 03:18 AM

Originally Posted by Cavemonster

... I highly doubt women complain more,

Ha, not married then pal.

My missus is hoping for a place on Team GB in London 2012 in the nagging and moaning. My guess is she'll get a podium finish.

My little moan, why can't women leave the seat up when they've finished in the toilet?

ETA: I think it's more genetic than social conditioning. They have no 'rationality' gene, no 'keeping the argument on the same subject we started on' gene and no 'TV programme filter' gene. They do have the 'buying shoes' gene, the 'keep a grudge for years' gene and of course the 'dish-washing' gene.

Cavemonster · 10th May 2011, 03:38 AM

Let's get scientific a little bit
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16901879
Study of 261 nursing homes. Males more likely to lodge a complaint in general, but men and women complain about different things.

This study seems to fall along the lines of the stereotypes
http://www.sciencedirect.com/science...f&searchtype=a

Women feel more dissatisfaction than men, and have more emotionally based coping styles.

Cavemonster · 10th May 2011, 03:47 AM

Originally Posted by welshdean

Ha, not married then pal.

My missus is hoping for a place on Team GB in London 2012 in the nagging and moaning. My guess is she'll get a podium finish.

My little moan, why can't women leave the seat up when they've finished in the toilet?

ETA: I think it's more genetic than social conditioning. They have no 'rationality' gene, no 'keeping the argument on the same subject we started on' gene and no 'TV programme filter' gene. They do have the 'buying shoes' gene, the 'keep a grudge for years' gene and of course the 'dish-washing' gene.

Maybe that's just your wife

My mom is a huge complainer, and my dad never raised a peep. If you look at just the two of them, it would confirm your stereotype. But skip to the next generation, my two brothers and their wives- One brother and his wife both complain about everything, the other one and his wife never ever complain, no matter what.

May I ask how old you and the missus are? In my experience, the older generations tend to live within the gender roles they were brought up with to some extent.

welshdean · 10th May 2011, 04:14 AM

Originally Posted by Cavemonster

Maybe that's just your wife

My mom is a huge complainer, and my dad never raised a peep. If you look at just the two of them, it would confirm your stereotype. But skip to the next generation, my two brothers and their wives- One brother and his wife both complain about everything, the other one and his wife never ever complain, no matter what.

May I ask how old you and the missus are? In my experience, the older generations tend to live within the gender roles they were brought up with to some extent.

I'm 42 and if Mrs Welshdean saw my post above, not likely to see 43. BTW my asinine jokes were to pander to the folks that hold the stereotype as Truth^tm.

Monketey Ghost · 10th May 2011, 04:18 AM

Originally Posted by truethat

I've started threads like this before. I'm constantly frustrated dealing with women who get very emotional about situations that are sort of over and done with.

I'm not sure how to explain it. Here's an example. My 10 year old son accidentally broke my brand new lap top. He left it on the bed under the covers and the motor burned out. I know he didn't mean it. I know he learned a lesson about being careful but I really didn't get mad because it's over and done with, he didn't mean it and what is flipping out going to solve? That said I'm a very strict parent normally so it's not like I let the kids rule the roost.

In this case my attitude to myself was, "it's over, see if you can fix it and if you can't it's a loss"

I've noticed however that several female friends of mine want to play out say "childhood trauma" or "family trauma" they can't get over something like "My father didn't walk me down the aisle and my wedding was ruined." They'll sit and converse and pat each other on the back, each one cooing supportive phrases. In my mind I'm thinking, "Chick it's over, it happened 10 years ago GET OVER IT" but what I say is the same old cooing as the rest or just keeping silent.

I'm struck by a sort of female cultural hegemony where maybe all of us are sitting there thinking the same thing but no one wants to say anything.

Any thoughts?

Lessons I've learned from my wife:

It doesn't have to make sense

Sometimes women talk just to talk, they don't want you to say anything

They need to be emotionally demonstrative, even if the emotion/demonstration is misleading to what the actual problem/emotion might be

...and it may be days before you get to the bottom of it because you don't know how to elicit useful information from impossible-to-formulate questions.

By the way, my wife insisted on my new avatar after we fought recently.

Cayvmann · 10th May 2011, 04:27 AM

I assure you, I know many men (my brothers) who keep going over old crap, ad nauseum, and never "get over it". I will concede that it's culturally more expected of women, as I call them "old ladies" when they get into the pity parties.

How we see these things is probably a bit of confirmation bias, and cultural expectations.

aggle-rithm · 10th May 2011, 04:44 AM

Originally Posted by Cayvmann

I assure you, I know many men (my brothers) who keep going over old crap, ad nauseum, and never "get over it".

I think men have more of an urge to find closure by going out and killing the thing that is causing them grief. After a few beers, of course.

Stupid society won't let us, though.

Dancing David · 10th May 2011, 04:55 AM

Originally Posted by truethat

I've started threads like this before. I'm constantly frustrated dealing with women who get very emotional about situations that are sort of over and done with.

I'm not sure how to explain it. Here's an example. My 10 year old son accidentally broke my brand new lap top. He left it on the bed under the covers and the motor burned out. I know he didn't mean it. I know he learned a lesson about being careful but I really didn't get mad because it's over and done with, he didn't mean it and what is flipping out going to solve? That said I'm a very strict parent normally so it's not like I let the kids rule the roost.

In this case my attitude to myself was, "it's over, see if you can fix it and if you can't it's a loss"

I've noticed however that several female friends of mine want to play out say "childhood trauma" or "family trauma" they can't get over something like "My father didn't walk me down the aisle and my wedding was ruined." They'll sit and converse and pat each other on the back, each one cooing supportive phrases. In my mind I'm thinking, "Chick it's over, it happened 10 years ago GET OVER IT" but what I say is the same old cooing as the rest or just keeping silent.

I'm struck by a sort of female cultural hegemony where maybe all of us are sitting there thinking the same thing but no one wants to say anything.

Any thoughts?

Um that is not what I consider to be trauma, but if it represents a pattern of emotional suffering it could be trauma. It took me five years of group therapy and a lot of work to resolve my family issues.

Yes some people complain, but I sure here enough men piss and moan about various things that they can't change either.

Now there are healthy ways to learn to cope with emotional trauma and unhealthy ways.

My childhood trauma involved emotional abuse, humiliation, sexual assault and sexual boundary crossing. (Not all by the same person, some had cross over.) It took a lot of effort to change teh patterns that it established, especially since my secong major girl friend was an alcoholic borderline personality.

Quad4_72 · 10th May 2011, 05:45 AM

In my MANY experiences with women, I have found that it is not necessarily them complaining more, it is how they react to problems. I have found that when a problem arises, instead of utilizing the critical thinking process, some women will go straight to emotion and bypass logic. Sometimes, they would rather cry about a problem as opposed to seeking out a rational solution. Of course, this does not apply to all women.

Flo · 10th May 2011, 05:54 AM

Originally Posted by Quad4_72

In my MANY experiences with women, I have found that it is not necessarily them complaining more, it is how they react to problems. I have found that when a problem arises, instead of utilizing the critical thinking process, some women will go straight to emotion and bypass logic. Sometimes, they would rather ~~cry~~ rage about a problem as opposed to seeking out a rational solution. Of course, this does not apply to all women.

TragicMonkey · 10th May 2011, 05:55 AM

I would say that many women complain as a kind of social bonding. One woman complains, the other women sympathize, everyone shares stories, and they wind up a tighter group because of their mutual suffering because of whatever thing they're complaining about. What doesn't work is when they're having this kind of complaining session and someone butts in with suggestions on how to fix it (or worst of all, "what you should have done is this" because what the hell use is that? It's already too late and you just called her stupid as well) because that's not what's being looked for.

The downside of this sort of thing is that it can cause a downward morale spiral. I had a close friend at my work who had a truly horrible time here, and hearing all her complaints made me unhappy with this place also. Then she got a job elsewhere, and now this place doesn't seem as bad as I was thinking it was. I like my friend, and I liked working with her, but constantly airing the negatives made it seem worse than it is.

Quad4_72 · 10th May 2011, 06:45 AM

Originally Posted by Flo

Sometimes. In those situations as you have identified, instead of crying for the emotional response, a male would go into a rage about it instead of thinking rationally. Good point.

sgtbaker · 10th May 2011, 06:50 AM

Originally Posted by truethat

I've started threads like this before. I'm constantly frustrated dealing with women who get very emotional about situations that are sort of over and done with.

It's obviously not over and done with, to them, because it's still bothering them. Is there a rating system for traumatic events; a specific time alloted for which a person is expected to get over issues?

Quote:

I'm not sure how to explain it. Here's an example. My 10 year old son accidentally broke my brand new lap top. He left it on the bed under the covers and the motor burned out. I know he didn't mean it. I know he learned a lesson about being careful but I really didn't get mad because it's over and done with, he didn't mean it and what is flipping out going to solve? That said I'm a very strict parent normally so it's not like I let the kids rule the roost.

There is a whole range of ways to deal with a child not respecting another person's property between forgetting about it and traumatizing the child. When my son broke my daughter's laptop, I saw it as an opportunity to teach him a valuable lesson on how to care for other people's property. He didn't have the $100's laying around to replace it, so he did yardwork to cover half the cost to replace it.

Quote:

I've noticed however that several female friends of mine want to play out say "childhood trauma" or "family trauma" they can't get over something like "My father didn't walk me down the aisle and my wedding was ruined." They'll sit and converse and pat each other on the back, each one cooing supportive phrases. In my mind I'm thinking, "Chick it's over, it happened 10 years ago GET OVER IT" but what I say is the same old cooing as the rest or just keeping silent.

Breaking a material object hardly compares to feeling betrayed by a parent. It may have been ten years ago but what ever is bothering her about it, hasn't been resolved.

Quote:

I'm struck by a sort of female cultural hegemony where maybe all of us are sitting there thinking the same thing but no one wants to say anything.

Any thoughts?

My thoughts are, we are not socially conditioned, we are genetically conditioned. Women have 4x more connective tissue between the right (visual/intuitive side) and left side of the brain (mathematical/logical) which gives us a superior ability to put words to thoughts. Men have a larger [I forget the word] cortex on the left side of the brain and it is believed to be where problem solving skills come from, where as women have a larger [same word] cortex on the right side of the brain, which is where self perception is believed to be controlled.

Those traits play a huge role in the male and female differences in handling situation. Simply put, don't give man a problem unless you want a solution. Most importantly, don't give a man a problem unless there is a solution for it.

There's also some interesting facts about general and mental health rates among men and women. Women are said to live longer because we are more likely to visit a doctor about a problem. This is just my guess but because of our keen sense of self awareness, we identify problems faster. Women also have a higher rate of depression but I wonder if that also plays a role in our ability to vocalize problems. A man is less likely to see a doctor for depression. Women are more likely to attempt suicide but men have a higher rate of suicide completion and that's likely because of the methods chosen. Women are more likely to swallow pills or drowning which tends to offer time to change their minds, where-as men are more likely to use a gun or hang themselves which some in the medical field associate with the desire for finality of the method.

*I would like to note that this is from an obsession I had with suicide after a friend killed himself, 5 years ago. The information may be dated.

DavidJames · 10th May 2011, 06:50 AM

Most of the forums I frequent have a huge majority of male posters. Invariably, threads like this crop up from time to time. Invariably all the guys agree about all the negative aspects of the other gender, eg whining/complaining, gossiping, "cat fighting". Invariably when finished the guys will exhibit most of the same behaviors they just whined about.

JAStewart · 10th May 2011, 06:57 AM

Maybe there's something deeper here. Maybe us men are just complete nihilists and we don't think it's worth getting flustered about anything. I guess that I find some of my female friends' moaning a bit trivial... can't wear the same dress/shoes on a night out, eh, whatever. I think that it's not something necessarily socially conditioned at a young age but as they get older it does seem infectious. My experience with girls and problems (my own or others) is that they take a more sympathetic view, and someone being sympathetic is better than being told to "man up" (sometimes). So maybe wimmins are just smarter and know to complain cause people listen.

Men are far more scary when they're pissed off cause they might actually punch you in the pus.

Flo · 10th May 2011, 07:10 AM

I'm currently acting as an interposition force between the North Brotheristan and the South- and East-Sisteristan following the death of the Main Motheristan.

South-Sisteristan has been viciously fighting against the two other factions, airing grievances* based on real and mostly imaginary** childhood trauma, and engaging in illegal actions despite the sollicitor's advice, then complaining about having been treated in an ignoble way by the two others. East-Sisteristan is dealing with most of the paperwork and formalities, trying to preserve everybody's interests, and telling everybody that the past is the past, while Brotheristan is totally unable to deal logically with the situation, oscillating between regurgitating childhood trauma (real and reinvented/imagined), going into occasionnal rages against East-Sisteristan level-headed approach, and alternatively finding excuses and complaining bitterly about South-Sisteristan's ugly behavior.

This has led me to conclude that both genders are equally able to fall for false reasonning, irrationnal behavior, and that I should put the three of them together in a sealed and padded room for half an hour then go in and sweep the debris before I go completely bonker !

* actually barefaced lies of the vilest order
** I've been very close to the family for more than 40 years and think I've got a good grasp of the truth of the matter ...

Jekyll's Guest · 10th May 2011, 07:36 AM

Originally Posted by JAStewart

Men are far more scary when they're pissed off cause they might actually punch you in the pus.

Yeah you have plenty of man-apes that will stomp on your head for breathing their personal air, but then women tend to make up for their lack of size and testosterone by going in to screaming fits where they use potentially deadly weapons with no restraint.

Lithrael · 10th May 2011, 08:09 AM

A huge huge part of this is social reinforcement. Any woman who liked bugs instead of shoes as a kid will do this a LOT less because they didn't grow up chatting with mall girls. Also, socially, it's just an easy and approved subject for women who don't know each other well - don't have anything to talk about? Well, you can analyze people you both know or you can complain about stuff.

As far as the crying about a problem thing, some women use that as a release valve for stress - it's not that they want to cry about it instead of solve it, it's that they want to get a little catharsis going on first. Tackling the actual problem happens afterward.

Number Six · 10th May 2011, 09:08 AM

I think the women complaining to each other is genetic. Women have more of a need to verbalize than men (in general...of course there are exceptions). I think TragicMonkey's post at 8:55 got it exactly right. Their complaining is a form of sharing problems and bonding in the process. It's a form of mutual emotional support. Women have more ways of getting emotional support than men and I wouldn't be surprised if it was one of the reasons they live longer.

The problem can come when women don't realize that some men don't use that communication style. Some men don't complain unless something is really bothering them and then they say it just succinctly and it's done. But if the woman is thinking in terms of complaints typically coming in torrents then one quick complaint from a man can seem like nothing and it can be treated as meaningless. After all, short complaints like that usually are meaningless in their discussions with their women friends. Listening to someone complain on and on about things that seem trivial and then finally getting a chance to share one back that is important to you and having it be treated as meaningless is the worst.

Taarkin · 10th May 2011, 09:19 AM

When a man airs his grievances, he's being a confident, assertive fella who doesn't take guff from anyone.
When a woman does it, she's a shrill harpy.

Psi Baba · 10th May 2011, 10:38 AM

I'm reminded of a Zen koan I heard a while back. Two Buddhist monks are traveling on foot and come upon a stream that they have to cross. Nearby is a woman who is standing near the edge and is clearly terrified to cross the stream. So the older monk picks up the woman and carries her across the stream. The monks continue their journey and about a mile or so later, the younger monk says, "You picked up that woman back there and you know it is forbidden to touch a woman." The older monk replied, "That's true, but I put her down back there--you're still carrying her."

PGH · 10th May 2011, 10:44 AM

Originally Posted by Jekyll's Guest

Yeah you have plenty of man-apes that will stomp on your head for breathing their personal air, but then women tend to make up for their lack of size and testosterone by going in to screaming fits where they use potentially deadly weapons with no restraint.

Or put another way by the brilliant Louis C.K.:

"A man might punch you in the face or break your arm. But a woman will <crap> in your heart!"

Men do simple damage that is evaluated in dollars. Women do psychological damage that can only be measured in years of therapy.

Love you ladies!

Jekyll's Guest · 10th May 2011, 11:22 AM

Originally Posted by Taarkin

When a man airs his grievances, he's being a confident, assertive fella who doesn't take guff from anyone.
When a woman does it, she's a shrill harpy.

Then surely the answer is for women to stop airing grievances in a shrill, harpy-like manner. They should just do it in a confident, assertive manner, like a man.

See what I did there? Saw a problem and fixed it. You would probably have just went on and on about it then bought new shoes.

sgtbaker · 10th May 2011, 12:09 PM

Originally Posted by welshdean

Ha, not married then pal.

ETA: I think it's more genetic than social conditioning. They have no 'rationality' gene, no 'keeping the argument on the same subject we started on' gene and no 'TV programme filter' gene. They do have the 'buying shoes' gene, the 'keep a grudge for years' gene and of course the 'dish-washing' gene.

You are married so I figure I am probably pointing out the obvious here, but it's been my experience that rarely is the fight ever really about what started the fight. From the huge sampling of women that I confide in, and who confine in me (all 2 of them), I've realized that

1) we tolerate a lot, for the sake of keeping the peace, until we finally blow up and it all comes out.

2) The grudge only comes back up when it's somehow relavant to the situation.

Nursefoxfire · 10th May 2011, 12:30 PM

Originally Posted by TragicMonkey

I would say that many women complain as a kind of social bonding. One woman complains, the other women sympathize, everyone shares stories, and they wind up a tighter group because of their mutual suffering because of whatever thing they're complaining about. What doesn't work is when they're having this kind of complaining session and someone butts in with suggestions on how to fix it (or worst of all, "what you should have done is this" because what the hell use is that? It's already too late and you just called her stupid as well) because that's not what's being looked for.

The downside of this sort of thing is that it can cause a downward morale spiral. I had a close friend at my work who had a truly horrible time here, and hearing all her complaints made me unhappy with this place also. Then she got a job elsewhere, and now this place doesn't seem as bad as I was thinking it was. I like my friend, and I liked working with her, but constantly airing the negatives made it seem worse than it is.

Holy hell, i agree with TragicMonkey!

(usually I just laugh at you

)

9th May 2011, 08:40 PM	#1
truethat Philosopher Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 8,628	Are women socially conditioned to be complainers? I've started threads like this before. I'm constantly frustrated dealing with women who get very emotional about situations that are sort of over and done with. I'm not sure how to explain it. Here's an example. My 10 year old son accidentally broke my brand new lap top. He left it on the bed under the covers and the motor burned out. I know he didn't mean it. I know he learned a lesson about being careful but I really didn't get mad because it's over and done with, he didn't mean it and what is flipping out going to solve? That said I'm a very strict parent normally so it's not like I let the kids rule the roost. In this case my attitude to myself was, "it's over, see if you can fix it and if you can't it's a loss" I've noticed however that several female friends of mine want to play out say "childhood trauma" or "family trauma" they can't get over something like "My father didn't walk me down the aisle and my wedding was ruined." They'll sit and converse and pat each other on the back, each one cooing supportive phrases. In my mind I'm thinking, "Chick it's over, it happened 10 years ago GET OVER IT" but what I say is the same old cooing as the rest or just keeping silent. I'm struck by a sort of female cultural hegemony where maybe all of us are sitting there thinking the same thing but no one wants to say anything. Any thoughts?
truethat Philosopher Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 8,628	__________________ “Do not argue with an idiot they drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.” ― Mark Twain Last edited by truethat; 9th May 2011 at 08:42 PM.

9th May 2011, 08:50 PM	#2
John Jones Illuminator Join Date: Apr 2009 Posts: 3,721	You sure complain a lot.
John Jones Illuminator Join Date: Apr 2009 Posts: 3,721

9th May 2011, 09:19 PM	#3
Gawdzilla 121.92-meter mutant fire-breathing lizard-thingy Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Northern St. Louis County, Missouri. Posts: 13,539	You should post that over at the Oprah Winfrey forum. Show them bitches.
	__________________ World War II Diplomatic and Political Resources Hyperwar, WWII Military History Kido Butai did not transmit. 木戸舞台は、無線メッセージを送信しませんでした

9th May 2011, 10:36 PM	#7
Cavemonster Illuminator Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 3,916	This is the kind of question that's incredibly susceptible to confirmation bias. I do feel there's a distinct difference in the way that women and men I know process negative emotions. But I can't clearly label it, and it's not universal. I highly doubt women complain more, but I wouldn't be surprised if they complained in different ways and about different things. It's very hard to tease out real observations from my own, and I suggest yours too, unconscious biases and expectations. I'd love to see a study on the subject though. I'm sure they exist, but I'm not sure what terms to search for.
Cavemonster Illuminator Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 3,916	__________________ The weakness of all Utopias is this, ... They first assume that no man will want more than his share, and then are very ingenious in explaining whether his share will be delivered by motorcar or balloon. -G.K. CHESTERTON Last edited by Cavemonster; 9th May 2011 at 10:38 PM.

9th May 2011, 10:45 PM	#8
Hokulele Official Nemesis Join Date: Feb 2007 Location: Trying to decide whether to set defenses against an army, or against mole rats. Posts: 27,275	Originally Posted by truethat I'm constantly frustrated dealing with women who get very emotional about situations that are sort of over and done with. You are complaining about women who complain?
	__________________ Yvette: "Blasty! Blasty! Blasty!" Some person: "Why did you shoot that?" Yvette: "Blasty! Blasty! Blasty!" - Tragic Monkey

9th May 2011, 10:16 PM	#4
Jekyll's Guest Graduate Poster Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 1,948	A Terminator exists only to kill. You could bury one in cement except for one hand, and due to its 120 year power cell, a century after being entombed it would try to crush the life from you if you brushed past it. When it comes to holding a grudge, Terminators have nothing on a woman.

9th May 2011, 10:23 PM	#5
Kopji Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: Mogollon Rim Posts: 7,697	Posting a lot of these are you?

9th May 2011, 10:30 PM	#6
Jekyll's Guest Graduate Poster Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 1,948	I'm actually very talky for a guy, developed language centers and all that; but sometimes I say to my wife "Babe I love you, but you need to find another woman to talk to. I want to fix the problem, and you want to lament about it." On average men simply don't need to go over something again and again to get closure. I am no longer on fire, I have closure. I backed over the guy with the knife and he died, I have closure.

9th May 2011, 10:48 PM	#9
Jekyll's Guest Graduate Poster Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 1,948	Originally Posted by Cavemonster I highly doubt women complain more May I ask why?

9th May 2011, 10:53 PM	#10
JudeBrando Banned Join Date: Jan 2011 Posts: 1,701	Almost every time, and I say almost because there must have been a few exceptions, almost every time I walk by a couple of women and only catch a few seconds of their conversation, one is complaining to the other and usually about a man.
JudeBrando Banned Join Date: Jan 2011 Posts: 1,701

9th May 2011, 11:07 PM	#11
jiggeryqua Master Poster Join Date: Dec 2009 Posts: 2,927	Originally Posted by JudeBrando Almost every time, and I say almost because there must have been a few exceptions, almost every time I walk by a couple of women and only catch a few seconds of their conversation, one is complaining to the other and usually about a man. There's that confirmation bias at work. Actually at least half the time they're talking about shoes.

9th May 2011, 11:32 PM	#12
Puppycow Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Japan Posts: 15,789	Originally Posted by truethat Any thoughts? I sympathize. Sounds like my wife. This is what John Gray wrote about in Men are from Mars, Women are from Venus. Men (or other women) are just supposed to patiently listen and agree. The complaints are usually something for which there is no solution, so trying to say something constructive or racking your brains for a solution is pointless. I can't tell you how many times I've wanted to just say "Unless there's something I can do about it, I don't want to hear it."
	__________________ “Some men are born mediocre, some men achieve mediocrity, and some men have mediocrity thrust upon them. With Major Major it had been all three.” ― Joseph Heller, Catch-22

10th May 2011, 12:33 AM	#13
Cavemonster Illuminator Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 3,916	Originally Posted by Jekyll's Guest May I ask why? Just like the OP, a general sense of my personal experience. As an example, threads on this forum. I don't know the gender of everyone here, but there's at least one new "complaint" thread every day, and I'd say the gender of the poster doesn't tend to be female more than their share of forum traffic. I used to frequent the forum management threads, where the complainers were almost exclusively posters I knew to have identified themselves as male. I can say the same thing for workplaces I've been in, groups of friends, all very unscientific and based on memory, so I'm very open to being wrong.
Cavemonster Illuminator Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 3,916	__________________ The weakness of all Utopias is this, ... They first assume that no man will want more than his share, and then are very ingenious in explaining whether his share will be delivered by motorcar or balloon. -G.K. CHESTERTON

10th May 2011, 02:45 AM	#14
rofl Student Join Date: Apr 2011 Location: earth Posts: 43	Truethat, if you were not cooing along with them and patting them on the back once in a while they would probably misintepret your coping skills as callousness or coldness. I don't think that your friend know that they can learn the coping skills and strategies that will help them overcome the way they deal with childhood and family traumas. They are not processing negative emotions in a way that helps them overcomes their suffering , they are processing them in a way that means they recieve the comfort, nurturing and strength to cope with and endure their suffering. You are right about them being caught in a cycle that does not include them getting over it. Ironically, you can go too far the other direction too. You cope so well with everthing that even car accidents are just water off a duck's back. The goal is to cope really well with stuff without losing your social sensitivity or emotinal intelligence.

10th May 2011, 03:09 AM	#15
Soapy Sam NLH Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 25,885	Possibly- just possibly- women have more to complain about?
Soapy Sam NLH Join Date: Oct 2002 Posts: 25,885

10th May 2011, 03:18 AM	#16
welshdean 2012 6Nations Grand Slam -------CHAMPIONS------- Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Spitting in Andrew Wakefields eye Posts: 1,398	Originally Posted by Cavemonster ... I highly doubt women complain more, Ha, not married then pal. My missus is hoping for a place on Team GB in London 2012 in the nagging and moaning. My guess is she'll get a podium finish. My little moan, why can't women leave the seat up when they've finished in the toilet? ETA: I think it's more genetic than social conditioning. They have no 'rationality' gene, no 'keeping the argument on the same subject we started on' gene and no 'TV programme filter' gene. They do have the 'buying shoes' gene, the 'keep a grudge for years' gene and of course the 'dish-washing' gene.
	__________________ Poe's Law!!! im christian if we came from apes how come were not hairy and have a big mouth and did we end up looking like we do know and besides there isnt any serious proof of apes they showd a video saying an ape was wondering around in the forest that thing looked exactly like a costume that i had saw at a store know one ever cought an ape (spelling/punctuation by original author) Last edited by welshdean; 10th May 2011 at 03:24 AM. Reason: add last paragraph

10th May 2011, 03:38 AM	#17
Cavemonster Illuminator Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 3,916	Let's get scientific a little bit http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/16901879 Study of 261 nursing homes. Males more likely to lodge a complaint in general, but men and women complain about different things. This study seems to fall along the lines of the stereotypes http://www.sciencedirect.com/science...f&searchtype=a Women feel more dissatisfaction than men, and have more emotionally based coping styles.
Cavemonster Illuminator Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 3,916	__________________ The weakness of all Utopias is this, ... They first assume that no man will want more than his share, and then are very ingenious in explaining whether his share will be delivered by motorcar or balloon. -G.K. CHESTERTON

10th May 2011, 03:47 AM	#18
Cavemonster Illuminator Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 3,916	Originally Posted by welshdean Ha, not married then pal. My missus is hoping for a place on Team GB in London 2012 in the nagging and moaning. My guess is she'll get a podium finish. My little moan, why can't women leave the seat up when they've finished in the toilet? ETA: I think it's more genetic than social conditioning. They have no 'rationality' gene, no 'keeping the argument on the same subject we started on' gene and no 'TV programme filter' gene. They do have the 'buying shoes' gene, the 'keep a grudge for years' gene and of course the 'dish-washing' gene. Maybe that's just your wife My mom is a huge complainer, and my dad never raised a peep. If you look at just the two of them, it would confirm your stereotype. But skip to the next generation, my two brothers and their wives- One brother and his wife both complain about everything, the other one and his wife never ever complain, no matter what. May I ask how old you and the missus are? In my experience, the older generations tend to live within the gender roles they were brought up with to some extent.
Cavemonster Illuminator Join Date: Sep 2008 Posts: 3,916	__________________ The weakness of all Utopias is this, ... They first assume that no man will want more than his share, and then are very ingenious in explaining whether his share will be delivered by motorcar or balloon. -G.K. CHESTERTON

10th May 2011, 04:14 AM	#19
welshdean 2012 6Nations Grand Slam -------CHAMPIONS------- Join Date: Jul 2002 Location: Spitting in Andrew Wakefields eye Posts: 1,398	Originally Posted by Cavemonster Maybe that's just your wife My mom is a huge complainer, and my dad never raised a peep. If you look at just the two of them, it would confirm your stereotype. But skip to the next generation, my two brothers and their wives- One brother and his wife both complain about everything, the other one and his wife never ever complain, no matter what. May I ask how old you and the missus are? In my experience, the older generations tend to live within the gender roles they were brought up with to some extent. I'm 42 and if Mrs Welshdean saw my post above, not likely to see 43. BTW my asinine jokes were to pander to the folks that hold the stereotype as Truth^tm.
	__________________ Poe's Law!!! im christian if we came from apes how come were not hairy and have a big mouth and did we end up looking like we do know and besides there isnt any serious proof of apes they showd a video saying an ape was wondering around in the forest that thing looked exactly like a costume that i had saw at a store know one ever cought an ape (spelling/punctuation by original author)

10th May 2011, 04:18 AM	#20
Monketey Ghost Body of Work Join Date: May 2003 Location: I'm on your screen! Posts: 14,807	Originally Posted by truethat I've started threads like this before. I'm constantly frustrated dealing with women who get very emotional about situations that are sort of over and done with. I'm not sure how to explain it. Here's an example. My 10 year old son accidentally broke my brand new lap top. He left it on the bed under the covers and the motor burned out. I know he didn't mean it. I know he learned a lesson about being careful but I really didn't get mad because it's over and done with, he didn't mean it and what is flipping out going to solve? That said I'm a very strict parent normally so it's not like I let the kids rule the roost. In this case my attitude to myself was, "it's over, see if you can fix it and if you can't it's a loss" I've noticed however that several female friends of mine want to play out say "childhood trauma" or "family trauma" they can't get over something like "My father didn't walk me down the aisle and my wedding was ruined." They'll sit and converse and pat each other on the back, each one cooing supportive phrases. In my mind I'm thinking, "Chick it's over, it happened 10 years ago GET OVER IT" but what I say is the same old cooing as the rest or just keeping silent. I'm struck by a sort of female cultural hegemony where maybe all of us are sitting there thinking the same thing but no one wants to say anything. Any thoughts? Lessons I've learned from my wife: It doesn't have to make sense Sometimes women talk just to talk, they don't want you to say anything They need to be emotionally demonstrative, even if the emotion/demonstration is misleading to what the actual problem/emotion might be ...and it may be days before you get to the bottom of it because you don't know how to elicit useful information from impossible-to-formulate questions. By the way, my wife insisted on my new avatar after we fought recently.
	__________________ _{The membership of this forum is henceforth to refer to me as potato-headed Bobby} _{SSKCAS, member in long standing} Last edited by Monketey Ghost; 10th May 2011 at 04:19 AM.

10th May 2011, 04:27 AM	#21
Cayvmann Muse Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 578	I assure you, I know many men (my brothers) who keep going over old crap, ad nauseum, and never "get over it". I will concede that it's culturally more expected of women, as I call them "old ladies" when they get into the pity parties. How we see these things is probably a bit of confirmation bias, and cultural expectations.
Cayvmann Muse Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 578

10th May 2011, 04:44 AM	#22
aggle-rithm Ardent Formulist Join Date: Jun 2005 Location: Austin, TX Posts: 14,156	Originally Posted by Cayvmann I assure you, I know many men (my brothers) who keep going over old crap, ad nauseum, and never "get over it". I think men have more of an urge to find closure by going out and killing the thing that is causing them grief. After a few beers, of course. Stupid society won't let us, though.
	__________________ To understand recursion, you must first understand recursion. Woo's razor: Never attribute to stupidity that which can be adequately explained by aliens.

10th May 2011, 04:55 AM	#23
Dancing David Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Central Illinois Posts: 34,738	Originally Posted by truethat I've started threads like this before. I'm constantly frustrated dealing with women who get very emotional about situations that are sort of over and done with. I'm not sure how to explain it. Here's an example. My 10 year old son accidentally broke my brand new lap top. He left it on the bed under the covers and the motor burned out. I know he didn't mean it. I know he learned a lesson about being careful but I really didn't get mad because it's over and done with, he didn't mean it and what is flipping out going to solve? That said I'm a very strict parent normally so it's not like I let the kids rule the roost. In this case my attitude to myself was, "it's over, see if you can fix it and if you can't it's a loss" I've noticed however that several female friends of mine want to play out say "childhood trauma" or "family trauma" they can't get over something like "My father didn't walk me down the aisle and my wedding was ruined." They'll sit and converse and pat each other on the back, each one cooing supportive phrases. In my mind I'm thinking, "Chick it's over, it happened 10 years ago GET OVER IT" but what I say is the same old cooing as the rest or just keeping silent. I'm struck by a sort of female cultural hegemony where maybe all of us are sitting there thinking the same thing but no one wants to say anything. Any thoughts? Um that is not what I consider to be trauma, but if it represents a pattern of emotional suffering it could be trauma. It took me five years of group therapy and a lot of work to resolve my family issues. Yes some people complain, but I sure here enough men piss and moan about various things that they can't change either. Now there are healthy ways to learn to cope with emotional trauma and unhealthy ways. My childhood trauma involved emotional abuse, humiliation, sexual assault and sexual boundary crossing. (Not all by the same person, some had cross over.) It took a lot of effort to change teh patterns that it established, especially since my secong major girl friend was an alcoholic borderline personality.
	__________________ Hell, dynamiting fish in a barrel is more challenging. - Ladewig I suspect you are a sandwich, metaphorically speaking. -Donn And a shot rang out. Now Space is doing time... -Ben Burch You built the toilet - don't complain when people crap in it. _Kid Eager

10th May 2011, 05:45 AM	#24
Quad4_72 AI-EE-YAH! Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: USA Posts: 5,830	In my MANY experiences with women, I have found that it is not necessarily them complaining more, it is how they react to problems. I have found that when a problem arises, instead of utilizing the critical thinking process, some women will go straight to emotion and bypass logic. Sometimes, they would rather cry about a problem as opposed to seeking out a rational solution. Of course, this does not apply to all women.
	__________________ Looks like the one on top has a magazine, thus needs less reloading. Also, the muzzle shroud makes it less likely for a spree killer to burn his hands. The pistol grip makes it more comfortable for the spree killer to shoot. thaiboxerken

10th May 2011, 05:54 AM	#25
Flo Master Poster Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Massongy, France Posts: 2,813	Originally Posted by Quad4_72 In my MANY experiences with women, I have found that it is not necessarily them complaining more, it is how they react to problems. I have found that when a problem arises, instead of utilizing the critical thinking process, some women will go straight to emotion and bypass logic. Sometimes, they would rather ~~cry~~ rage about a problem as opposed to seeking out a rational solution. Of course, this does not apply to all women.
	__________________ "Let me explain the order of things for you. There's the aristocracy, the upper class, middle class, working class, dumb animals, waiters, creeping things, head lice, people who eat packet soup, and then you." (Chef)

10th May 2011, 05:55 AM	#26
TragicMonkey Poisoned Waffles Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: Monkey Posts: 30,112	I would say that many women complain as a kind of social bonding. One woman complains, the other women sympathize, everyone shares stories, and they wind up a tighter group because of their mutual suffering because of whatever thing they're complaining about. What doesn't work is when they're having this kind of complaining session and someone butts in with suggestions on how to fix it (or worst of all, "what you should have done is this" because what the hell use is that? It's already too late and you just called her stupid as well) because that's not what's being looked for. The downside of this sort of thing is that it can cause a downward morale spiral. I had a close friend at my work who had a truly horrible time here, and hearing all her complaints made me unhappy with this place also. Then she got a job elsewhere, and now this place doesn't seem as bad as I was thinking it was. I like my friend, and I liked working with her, but constantly airing the negatives made it seem worse than it is.
	__________________ One cannot expect wisdom to flow from a pumpkin.

10th May 2011, 06:45 AM	#27
Quad4_72 AI-EE-YAH! Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: USA Posts: 5,830	Originally Posted by Flo Sometimes. In those situations as you have identified, instead of crying for the emotional response, a male would go into a rage about it instead of thinking rationally. Good point.
	__________________ Looks like the one on top has a magazine, thus needs less reloading. Also, the muzzle shroud makes it less likely for a spree killer to burn his hands. The pistol grip makes it more comfortable for the spree killer to shoot. thaiboxerken

10th May 2011, 06:50 AM	#28
sgtbaker Philosopher Join Date: Jan 2010 Posts: 5,551	Originally Posted by truethat I've started threads like this before. I'm constantly frustrated dealing with women who get very emotional about situations that are sort of over and done with. It's obviously not over and done with, to them, because it's still bothering them. Is there a rating system for traumatic events; a specific time alloted for which a person is expected to get over issues? Quote: I'm not sure how to explain it. Here's an example. My 10 year old son accidentally broke my brand new lap top. He left it on the bed under the covers and the motor burned out. I know he didn't mean it. I know he learned a lesson about being careful but I really didn't get mad because it's over and done with, he didn't mean it and what is flipping out going to solve? That said I'm a very strict parent normally so it's not like I let the kids rule the roost. There is a whole range of ways to deal with a child not respecting another person's property between forgetting about it and traumatizing the child. When my son broke my daughter's laptop, I saw it as an opportunity to teach him a valuable lesson on how to care for other people's property. He didn't have the $100's laying around to replace it, so he did yardwork to cover half the cost to replace it. Quote: I've noticed however that several female friends of mine want to play out say "childhood trauma" or "family trauma" they can't get over something like "My father didn't walk me down the aisle and my wedding was ruined." They'll sit and converse and pat each other on the back, each one cooing supportive phrases. In my mind I'm thinking, "Chick it's over, it happened 10 years ago GET OVER IT" but what I say is the same old cooing as the rest or just keeping silent. Breaking a material object hardly compares to feeling betrayed by a parent. It may have been ten years ago but what ever is bothering her about it, hasn't been resolved. Quote: I'm struck by a sort of female cultural hegemony where maybe all of us are sitting there thinking the same thing but no one wants to say anything. Any thoughts? My thoughts are, we are not socially conditioned, we are genetically conditioned. Women have 4x more connective tissue between the right (visual/intuitive side) and left side of the brain (mathematical/logical) which gives us a superior ability to put words to thoughts. Men have a larger [I forget the word] cortex on the left side of the brain and it is believed to be where problem solving skills come from, where as women have a larger [same word] cortex on the right side of the brain, which is where self perception is believed to be controlled. Those traits play a huge role in the male and female differences in handling situation. Simply put, don't give man a problem unless you want a solution. Most importantly, don't give a man a problem unless there is a solution for it. There's also some interesting facts about general and mental health rates among men and women. Women are said to live longer because we are more likely to visit a doctor about a problem. This is just my guess but because of our keen sense of self awareness, we identify problems faster. Women also have a higher rate of depression but I wonder if that also plays a role in our ability to vocalize problems. A man is less likely to see a doctor for depression. Women are more likely to attempt suicide but men have a higher rate of suicide completion and that's likely because of the methods chosen. Women are more likely to swallow pills or drowning which tends to offer time to change their minds, where-as men are more likely to use a gun or hang themselves which some in the medical field associate with the desire for finality of the method. *I would like to note that this is from an obsession I had with suicide after a friend killed himself, 5 years ago. The information may be dated.
sgtbaker Philosopher Join Date: Jan 2010 Posts: 5,551

10th May 2011, 06:50 AM	#29
DavidJames Philosopher Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Front Range, CO Posts: 7,088	Most of the forums I frequent have a huge majority of male posters. Invariably, threads like this crop up from time to time. Invariably all the guys agree about all the negative aspects of the other gender, eg whining/complaining, gossiping, "cat fighting". Invariably when finished the guys will exhibit most of the same behaviors they just whined about.
	__________________ I will no longer respond to those who choose to have tools of murder as their avatars. Everyone is a skeptic except, of course, for the stuff that they believe Beaver Hateman: Is your argument that human life loses value proportionate to the number of humans available? Malcolm Kirkpatrick: That's part of the argument. Value is determined by supply and demand.

10th May 2011, 06:57 AM	#30
JAStewart Graduate Poster Tagger Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: Shetland Islands Posts: 1,523	Maybe there's something deeper here. Maybe us men are just complete nihilists and we don't think it's worth getting flustered about anything. I guess that I find some of my female friends' moaning a bit trivial... can't wear the same dress/shoes on a night out, eh, whatever. I think that it's not something necessarily socially conditioned at a young age but as they get older it does seem infectious. My experience with girls and problems (my own or others) is that they take a more sympathetic view, and someone being sympathetic is better than being told to "man up" (sometimes). So maybe wimmins are just smarter and know to complain cause people listen. Men are far more scary when they're pissed off cause they might actually punch you in the pus.
	__________________ Ignorance and google is a horrible combination. - BigAl Argumentum ad YouTubeum - sts60

10th May 2011, 07:10 AM	#31
Flo Master Poster Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Massongy, France Posts: 2,813	I'm currently acting as an interposition force between the North Brotheristan and the South- and East-Sisteristan following the death of the Main Motheristan. South-Sisteristan has been viciously fighting against the two other factions, airing grievances* based on real and mostly imaginary** childhood trauma, and engaging in illegal actions despite the sollicitor's advice, then complaining about having been treated in an ignoble way by the two others. East-Sisteristan is dealing with most of the paperwork and formalities, trying to preserve everybody's interests, and telling everybody that the past is the past, while Brotheristan is totally unable to deal logically with the situation, oscillating between regurgitating childhood trauma (real and reinvented/imagined), going into occasionnal rages against East-Sisteristan level-headed approach, and alternatively finding excuses and complaining bitterly about South-Sisteristan's ugly behavior. This has led me to conclude that both genders are equally able to fall for false reasonning, irrationnal behavior, and that I should put the three of them together in a sealed and padded room for half an hour then go in and sweep the debris before I go completely bonker ! * actually barefaced lies of the vilest order ** I've been very close to the family for more than 40 years and think I've got a good grasp of the truth of the matter ...
	__________________ "Let me explain the order of things for you. There's the aristocracy, the upper class, middle class, working class, dumb animals, waiters, creeping things, head lice, people who eat packet soup, and then you." (Chef)

10th May 2011, 07:36 AM	#32
Jekyll's Guest Graduate Poster Join Date: May 2010 Posts: 1,948	Originally Posted by JAStewart Men are far more scary when they're pissed off cause they might actually punch you in the pus. Yeah you have plenty of man-apes that will stomp on your head for breathing their personal air, but then women tend to make up for their lack of size and testosterone by going in to screaming fits where they use potentially deadly weapons with no restraint.

10th May 2011, 08:09 AM	#33
Lithrael Muse Join Date: Feb 2004 Posts: 775	A huge huge part of this is social reinforcement. Any woman who liked bugs instead of shoes as a kid will do this a LOT less because they didn't grow up chatting with mall girls. Also, socially, it's just an easy and approved subject for women who don't know each other well - don't have anything to talk about? Well, you can analyze people you both know or you can complain about stuff. As far as the crying about a problem thing, some women use that as a release valve for stress - it's not that they want to cry about it instead of solve it, it's that they want to get a little catharsis going on first. Tackling the actual problem happens afterward.
Lithrael Muse Join Date: Feb 2004 Posts: 775

10th May 2011, 09:08 AM	#34
Number Six JREF Kid Join Date: Sep 2001 Posts: 5,017	I think the women complaining to each other is genetic. Women have more of a need to verbalize than men (in general...of course there are exceptions). I think TragicMonkey's post at 8:55 got it exactly right. Their complaining is a form of sharing problems and bonding in the process. It's a form of mutual emotional support. Women have more ways of getting emotional support than men and I wouldn't be surprised if it was one of the reasons they live longer. The problem can come when women don't realize that some men don't use that communication style. Some men don't complain unless something is really bothering them and then they say it just succinctly and it's done. But if the woman is thinking in terms of complaints typically coming in torrents then one quick complaint from a man can seem like nothing and it can be treated as meaningless. After all, short complaints like that usually are meaningless in their discussions with their women friends. Listening to someone complain on and on about things that seem trivial and then finally getting a chance to share one back that is important to you and having it be treated as meaningless is the worst.
Number Six JREF Kid Join Date: Sep 2001 Posts: 5,017

10th May 2011, 09:19 AM	#35
Taarkin Strider Style Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Land of Heat and Clockwork Posts: 1,221	When a man airs his grievances, he's being a confident, assertive fella who doesn't take guff from anyone. When a woman does it, she's a shrill harpy.