Has your checking account/credit/ATM card ever been used fraudulently?

[michaellee]

With all of the security guarantees found at various websites that sell services or products, you would think that it would be very difficult for some jerk-off criminal to:

Obtain your credit card/ATM check card number
Obtain all of your personal information related to obtaining your checking account
Then sign up for 4 "free" trials at 4 different porno sites using your card and information

These free trials are free for the first day, and if not cancelled by that time, become non-free or recurring, monthly, subscriptions to these sites, at monthly charges around $40 per month. So some dickhead does this to me, using his own e-mail account, doesn't cancel the 4 free trials, and probably doesn't ever use his wonderfully free(my dough) subscription ever again.

Now, I may look like a fool for disclosing this, but believe me, this mistake is easy to make, depending on your bank statement details.

I didn't notice that I was being charged $39.95, $39.95, $39.10, and $36.20 per month until 9 friggin months had passed by. This was due largely to the fact that these charges are processed by an Internet processing company, the same one with which I actually did have valid charges for other internet purchases I made over that same period of time.

So I contact my bank, then this processing company, explain I know nothing about these charges, am accused by the processing company that I am at fault; I must have given my information to someone else as that is the only way this could have happened, etc...

Anyway, to sum it up, the processing company's fraud department quickly gave me credit for the last 4 months of charges, saying thats all they are responsible for, and I am stuck with the other 5 months. So I am out over $700, and not too thrilled with the operational tactics of this processing company.

I then learned that the processing company handles over 23 million transactions per month, the majority of these for charges exactly like the ones I incurred.

My questions are:

How was my card number and personal information so easily breached?
Have any of you experienced anything similar to this?
Are there really that many porno-site addicts in the world?
If your email address used to be lili220.....@yahoo.com, and I happen to cross your path......

[Theodore Kurita]

[quote]Originally posted by michaellee

Quote:

How was my card number and personal information so easily breached?

It doesn't take much.

There are may ways...

Here are just a few:

Keyloggers
Trojans
Spyware
Phony Sites that Collect CC info

etc. etc.

Quote:

Have any of you experienced anything similar to this?

No, but I have studied the mentality of the average carder (Carder = Identity Thief that uses Credit Card info)

What most of them believe is, well...

You are suppose to notice the unusual transactions on your card right...

Then just file a chargeback.

You get your money back, and the CC Company is out a few thousand.

Big whoop, because they make almost a trillion dolars a year off of interest payments for people that are in debt.

Quote:

Are there really that many porno-site addicts in the world?

Yes.

It is not suprising that 60% of sites on the web are Porn sites.

[Mr Manifesto]

I totally will not, under any circumstances, use my credit card on the internet. I always use a postal order. I don't care that it takes longer. Until internet security improves vastly, that's the way it's going to be.

[Jas]

Even that doesn't seem to matter...almost two years ago my bank account was drained (quite a shock to discover this while buying beer at the liquor store), because the bank gave out cheques for my account, to persons unknown. They refuse to take responsibility for it, I haven't gotten the cheques back (even though I've gotten every other cheque back that I wrote), and I was in Greece at the time, not Canada. There were also some American ATM transactions that took place at the same time as well.

[Luke T.]

I don't use my credit card over the internet either. And I always check my credit card account every month to verify the correct charges are on there. Every time I use my credit card, I put the receipt in my wallet and then veryfiy it against my online account every month when I pay my bills and balance my checkbook.

This is common sense stuff, but a lot of people don't do it. A friend of ours had the same thing happen. Months and months of charges to her credit card, and since she never checked her account, it went on for a while.

Her charges weren't for porn, though. They were for toys. So some parent out there was making their kid's every dream come true.

edited to add: She didn't use her credit card on line. So someone got it another way. Maybe an employee at a store where she used it. I don't know.

[michaellee]

Regardless of my stupidity for not finding the charges earlier, my main concern is not so much the money, even though it stings a bit, but the culprit should be found, flogged, shot, hung, and all on public television for all to see.

My bank and the processing company both recommended I pursue criminal charges, at least file a police report, as this makes my claim of fraud seem more truthful in their eyes.

Instead of calling or going in to my local police and getting laughed at, I found an interesting website, one run by the US Government, called The Internet Fraud Complaint Center (IFCC), a partnership between the Federal Bureau of Investigation (FBI) and the National White Collar Crime Center (NW3C).

I filled out a complaint, providing much detail, and this agency is supposed to contact my local law enforcement agency, if they believe the case warrants action. I think the idea behind this government website is a good one, but I will wait to see if any charges or such are filed against the culprit.

I know it is not that difficult to find out who the person is, as the e-mail address used is traceable by IP address through whatever ISP was used. They will not, of course, provide this information to me, thus the need to involve law enforcement.

I will pull the switch on the electric chair without breaking a sweat.

[LTC8K6]

One day as my check card was about to expire, I decided to have the ATM machine print out a mini-statement of the last few charges on my card, so I could see what had gone through just before I had to activate a new card.

Well, my check card showed a couple of charges totaling $350.00 in the last 2 days that I sure as heck didn't make.

I went right in to the bank and said I didn't know anything about the charges, and could they tell me more about them. The charges were for airline tickets from NY to FLA and a charge for a flower delivery in NYC. $250 & $100 dollars respectively. Just in the last couple of days before I got the printout.

I told them that I didn't know anyone in NY and wasn't budging from North Carolina for the forseeable future.

Does anyone else have access to the card? No.
Did you buy the tickets for someone else? No.
Was the card out of your possession? No.
Many more inane questions followed with commensurate temperature rise on my part.

After a while, they agreed that I hadn't made the charges and eventually I got the money back.

I still hate 1-800-FLOWERS because the only reason they gave me back my $100 was because they hadn't been able to deliver the flowers, not because we had proved the charge was fraudulent. They didn't care about the theft at all and would not refund the money until they looked up the record and found that they hadn't actually been able to deliver the flowers. If the woman had been home to get the flowers, I am certain I'd still be out $100.

Spirit Airlines (I'd never heard of them before this) agreed fairly quickly to refund the money. They looked through their records and found the same guy had booked several more flights with several other cards. They cancelled all of them, so hopefully I put a little dent in the jerk's crime spree.

I wish it had been a credit card, since it wouldn't have been my money that was stolen, and I could have just disputed the charges. With a check card, that money is gone from your checking account.

I was very lucky because the jerk got my information only 2 days before the card expired, and that's why I was paying attention to the charges and getting ready to activate a new card. I doubt I'd have noticed so quickly if I wasn't waiting for a new card. I have no idea how he was able to do it.

In the end I never got a new check card because they are attached to your checking account. I told them to cancel that card and the new one and give me a regular Mastercard. I will never use a check card again, since it's my own money that gets lost, rather than the credit card company's money.

For weeks afterwards, I got a call about every charge I made, to verify that it was me.

[Peter Jenkins]

I have used my card on the internet many times at reputable sites, and never had a problem. I was advised to use one particular card for internet transactions (ie a 2nd card which I don't use for much else) and I have always followed that advice.
The one time I did have my card cloned, was with my main card (I think it was probably when I allowed it out of my site for a few seconds at a car rental agency). Luckily, my credit card people picked it up the first time it was used (at a 'known credit card testing location' ??!!) and phoned me the next day. I didn't lose any money over it.
If you have any worries over internet card use then:
1) Use a 2nd (3rd or whatever) card, specifically for internet use.
2) Check your PC regularly for spyware & adware. Have a good, up-to-date Anti-virus and firewall.
3) Dont keep credit card info, passwords, logins, etc, in a reminder file on your PC.
4) If your bank allows you to look at your credit card details on-line, use it. I am now able to check what charges are on both of my cards, 24 hours a day, usually within hours of the card being charged.
Peter

[Samus]

I use my credit card for Internet purchases. In fact, that is pretty much the only place I use it. I have fraud protection, so while it is inconvenient to get a new card, I don't have to pay anything.

I've only had my card used like this once, last fall there was an unauthorized Verizon Wireless charge of about $450 or so. A couple phone calls later, problem solved, and a new card with a new number was on its way to me. I assume Verizon footed the bill to the CC company.

I too reconcile the charges on my card every month. I also don't carry a balance, I only use it for convenience (online purchases and when I have to travel for work), and pay it off in full every month. I realize this puts me in the minority of how people use their cards, but I just don't want the extra debt.

[Graham]

Quote:

Originally posted by Mr Manifesto
I totally will not, under any circumstances, use my credit card on the internet. I always use a postal order. I don't care that it takes longer. Until internet security improves vastly, that's the way it's going to be.

Quote:

Originally posted by Luke T.
I don't use my credit card over the internet either.

Just out of interest, where do you use your credit card?

Do you realise that there is far less security in using your card at the local grocery store or (even more so) at a restaurant?

Do you realise that far more fraud occurs at those type of locations than on the internet?

Seriously, every time you hand your card to a cashier or give your credit card number to the movie theatre clerk over the 'phone, you are doing exactly the same thing as typing it onto a website with no security at all.

You would be far safer and more sensible to do all your credit carding online and never use the card anywhere else.

Graham

[Luke T.]

Quote:

Originally posted by michaellee
...the culprit should be found, flogged, shot, hung, and all on public television for all to see.

...

I will pull the switch on the electric chair without breaking a sweat.

I'd be glad to strap the guy into the chair for ya.

[Graham]

Quote:

Originally posted by Luke T.


I'd be glad to strap the guy into the chair for ya.

As long as virus writers and spammers are strapped in there too, I'm happy.

[toddjh]

Quote:

Originally posted by michaellee
Have any of you experienced anything similar to this?

Funny you should ask. Just this last weekend my debit card number was stolen and used to run up $2000 on eBay. Fortunately, I monitor my checking account religiously and noticed the charges well before they posted, so I was able to talk to the auction payment site the guy used and cancel the illegal payments before they actually got to my bank.

How he got my number I have no idea.

Also, only idiots pay for porn. But I guess only idiots steal credit cards, too.

Jeremy

[Luke T.]

Quote:

Originally posted by toddjh


Funny you should ask. Just this last weekend my debit card number was stolen and used to run up $2000 on eBay. Fortunately, I monitor my checking account religiously and noticed the charges well before they posted, so I was able to talk to the auction payment site the guy used and cancel the illegal payments before they actually got to my bank.

How he got my number I have no idea.

Also, only idiots pay for porn. But I guess only idiots steal credit cards, too.

Jeremy

So the thief had to give an address for the goods to be delivered, didn't he? Are you pursuing that?

[TillEulenspiegel]

So the thief had to give an address for the goods to be delivered, didn't he? Are you pursuing that?

most scammers use dead drops I.E a address of an unoccupied house or one where people are on vacation a P.O. box with false info on the sign up.

There are hundreds of ways to get info from dumpster diving to sorting thru trash bins at ATM's to stealing mail ( outgoing..you pay your bills by check? ).

Visa and MC and AE are all reputable companies so if you have a ATM card make sure it has a CC company assignment. You have a specific amount of time (7-30 days ) to report fraud but these companies are taking a more pro-active approach to suspicious activity. My wife lost her card ( it was under the bed ) and she borrowed mine. I almost never use the card in credit mode but almost always ATM mode. The wife made three purchases in one day -total < $100.00- and visa called ME, saying there was suspicious activity.
So watch your receipts , pay your bills if you have to mail them at a mailbox, keep a protected ATM card separate from your CC and LOOK at your statements.

[Luke T.]

Quote:

Originally posted by TillEulenspiegel
most scammers use dead drops I.E a address of an unoccupied house or one where people are on vacation a P.O. box with false info on the sign up.

I don't know if it is a nationwide policy, but our post office won't deliver mail to our address unless the name on the mail matches the known occupants.

If a scammer uses someone else's credit card, it would have a name on it that doesn't match the mailing address' occupants.

I suppose there are ways around that. General Delivery.

[Mr Manifesto]

Quote:

Originally posted by Graham




Just out of interest, where do you use your credit card?

Do you realise that there is far less security in using your card at the local grocery store or (even more so) at a restaurant?

Do you realise that far more fraud occurs at those type of locations than on the internet?

Seriously, every time you hand your card to a cashier or give your credit card number to the movie theatre clerk over the 'phone, you are doing exactly the same thing as typing it onto a website with no security at all.

You would be far safer and more sensible to do all your credit carding online and never use the card anywhere else.

Graham

:burns credit card:

[Luke T.]

Quote:

Originally posted by Graham




Just out of interest, where do you use your credit card?

I use it strictly for emergencies. More out of a fiscal sense than a security sense. Since I use it so rarely, it would be a simple matter to figure out who compromised it, though.

[TillEulenspiegel]

Not sure about the PO but I know if you use the US PO the way to ensure secure delivery , you must use RRR -return receipt requested.
Most merchandise (identity ) thieves use UPS or Federal express..not only do they deliver the package if no one is there but the thief avoids a mail fraud charge if caught.

Edit :
Was stupid not to mention that the majority of identity theft involve direct purchases at malls and retail stores with faked IDs.

[Calee]

Here's something else to be aware of...

A few years ago, I wento into a Large Consumer Electronics Chain Store to buy a VCR as a Christmas gift. I wanted to use my ATM card, but they were not set up to use the card as such. They COULD however use it as a Visa card, as the fancy logo appeared on the card, and you can use it JUST LIKE A VISA CARD ANYWHERE!!!

WHEE!!! Lucky me!

BUT, when you do this, the clerk needs to scan the card, type in numbers etc.

Two days later, my wife is checking our bank account online, and sees a $500.00 debit from our checking account for a local toy store. Neither one of us had made a purchaes at this store.

It appears that the clerk at the Large Consumer Electronics Chain Store had a buddy at the toy store, went in at 11:00 pm and bought $500.00 in gift certificates. The clerk at the toy store manually keyed in the numbers from our card, and off they went.

The difference between using a debit card as a "credit" card and using an actual credit card is that the transaction is immediate. The money was withdrawn from our checking account. If my wife was not in the habit of constantly checking our banking info online, we would have started bouncing checks, and the sh**bag might have been able to run a few more transactions through. As it was, it took about two weeks to get our money, and even then our bank ate it and went after the toy store. Never found out if they collected.

With a credit card, you can dispute the statement and not have to pay until the dispute is settled.

NEVER use your ATM card as a credit card.

As for paying for porn, you can get anything you want from USENET for free.

Or so I hear....

[epepke]

Quote:

Originally posted by Theodore Kurita
It doesn't take much.

There are may ways...

Here are just a few:

Keyloggers
Trojans
Spyware
Phony Sites that Collect CC info

Still, the easiest and most common way to get credit card info is to rummage through the dumpsers behing car rental companies. I hope pointing this out doesn't break the rules.

[Theodore Kurita]

Quote:

Originally posted by TillEulenspiegel
Not sure about the PO but I know if you use the US PO the way to ensure secure delivery , you must use RRR -return receipt requested.
Most merchandise (identity ) thieves use UPS or Federal express..not only do they deliver the package if no one is there but the thief avoids a mail fraud charge if caught.

Edit :
Was stupid not to mention that the majority of identity theft involve direct purchases at malls and retail stores with faked IDs.

Also, thieves usually don't use PO Boxes.

What most of them do is bring in a Fake ID, and another Fake ID and open up a Mail Boxes Etc. or UPS Store Mailbox.

They do a change of billing on the credit card, making their dropsite (where the illegally bought goods go, ie. Mailboxes Etc. and UPS Store).

On these Change of Billings, they also ad an anonymous cellphone, which can be easily purchased at any retail store.

Once it's set and done, the ID Thief usually gets away with loads of goods to sell on ebay, or for personal use.

While you on the other hand, you are stuck with the fact that you have a large amount of paperwork to fill out.

[toddjh]

Quote:

Originally posted by Luke T.
So the thief had to give an address for the goods to be delivered, didn't he? Are you pursuing that?

The internet site he paid through wouldn't give us that information. We're working with the police on it.

Jeremy

[Luke T.]

Quote:

Originally posted by toddjh


The internet site he paid through wouldn't give us that information. We're working with the police on it.

Jeremy

michaellee and I will be over here by the electric chair if you catch him.

[michaellee]

Just paid my electric bill, and Sparky is ready to fire.

[SRW]

I noticed on day soon after my roommates house guest left that my Check book was missing. This was in the 70's so I drove down to my bank, took all my money out (I had no outstanding checks) and put a hold on the account. The next day I got called down to the bank by the security people. They told me that I had bounced a check for $500.00. After further questioning I found out that not only did the bank cash the stolen check after I had reported it, it was the same teller I had used to close the account.

Needless to say I closed my account and took my business elsewhere.