Penn State former defensive coordinator charged with sexual abuse of children

[NoahFence]

Child molesters need the death penalty.

[A Laughing Baby]

Originally Posted by NoahFence

Child molesters need the death penalty.

I'm not a mod, but I did start this thread and I'd really appreciate it if we don't go off into this particular derail.

[A Laughing Baby]

By the way, according to a local Fox affiliate, after the investigation asked for other victims to come forward...they did. We're now up to 20 victims.

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2011/11/08...-case-doubles/

[Checkmite]

Originally Posted by The Shrike

Concur. If McQueary (the GA and current receiver's coach) was close friends with Sandusky (all indications are that those guys at Penn State are more of an extended family than they are merely colleagues at work), he might have had trouble even processing what he had witnessed. He might even have second guessed himself - maybe he was hallucinating. Sounds fantastic to us with distance and hindsight, but unless you were there, you really can't say how you'd react. For all we know, a good Catholic boy like McQueary (and Paterno, for that matter) might have his own dark history of sexual abuse that could have paralyzed him from acting in that moment. Who knows?

I'm trying not to be a PSU apologist: I'm a long-time fan precisely because of the code of honor JoePa has cultivated. I guess that's my disclaimer. Like others, I'm grappling with "why the hell didn't someone just call the police?" Before preparing all the nooses at the gallows, however, I'm trying to wait this out 'til more details emerge and I can pass informed judgment. I'm informed enough to pass judgment on Sandusky. It sounds quite bad for Curley and Schultz. I'd like more information on Spanier, Paterno, and McQueary.

I think you're inventing room for speculation where there is none. Don't take this personally, but the idea that someone who walks in on his friend raping a little boy would turn around and leave without stopping him might do so because "he thinks he might be hallucinating" is pretty ridiculous, to me. If it's true that McQueary was a longtime friend of Sandusky, then if there was any "pausing to think", surely it was to decide whether it was more important to him to rescue the victim or keep his friend out of legal trouble. And frankly that's no less despicable. In the very best case, what we have here is a person seeing a crime in progress and simply refusing to get involved, like all those people who walked by the little girl who was run over multiple times in China without trying to help her. It's just as reprehensible.

No matter how his inaction was motivated, witnessing a child being raped and allowing it to continue, not to mention failing to call the police, is unquestionably worse than being notified of a recent child rape and not calling the police. It's not even a contest.

I'm not claiming anybody who sees it has no excuse not to turn into Rambo Hulk and beat the hell out of the offender; I wouldn't have either. But I would expect anybody in that situation to at least take some kind of action to rescue the child. Run, fine - but grab the kid and run. Not a single person in this case, very definitely starting with McQueary and going on up the chain, showed the slightest deference, regard, or consideration for the victim in the case, or any of the future victims whose molestation was an unavoidably foreseeable result of their actions.

[NoahFence]

Originally Posted by A Laughing Baby

I'm not a mod, but I did start this thread and I'd really appreciate it if we don't go off into this particular derail.

My apologies....

This whole thing is just awful! I guess Sanduski even had a kid that he didn't do this to, but brought him to the school. This so he can tell his wife "go ahead and call soandso" to prove nothing happened.

yikes.

[The Shrike]

Originally Posted by Alt+F4

Unless further information comes about this guy I'm seeing him as someone with no moral center.

That's what I mean. There almost has to be "further information" that we don't yet understand. If that ultimately proves not to be the case then sure, we can string McQueary up too for being a complicit, spineless piece of crap.

[Strawberry]

Can you imagine how that child felt knowing that someone walked in and saw him being raped, and just walked out and did nothing? If he hadn't been too scared to tell anyone before that, he sure as hell would have been afterwards. I don't know how that McQueary guy sleeps at night.

[slingblade]

Neither myself, an adult survivor of childhood sexual abuse, nor my husband can understand leaving that child there and just walking away.

Criticize me all you like for "pretending to know what you'd do." I do know what I'd do. That child would have been leaving with me, regardless. If violence were needed, I'd provide it.

[The Shrike]

Originally Posted by Checkmite

I think you're inventing room for speculation where there is none. . .

Sure, I can't argue against anything you've written about what McQueary should have done given what we think we know about this. A scene as shocking as that, however, can be a source of cognitive dissonance that prevents someone from acting rationally in the moment; second-guessing oneself following the experience could be paralyzing too.

Like I said, I'd prefer to put off the lynching 'til more details emerge.

[Checkmite]

Originally Posted by Strawberry

Can you imagine how that child felt knowing that someone walked in and saw him being raped, and just walked out and did nothing? If he hadn't been too scared to tell anyone before that, he sure as hell would have been afterwards. I don't know how that McQueary guy sleeps at night.

Thank you.

[Strawberry]

Yes, and the same can be said for the caretaker who witnessed another sexual assault in the showers and didn't stop it. Apparently he told his fellow caretakers and they were all worried about losing their jobs if they said anything. FFS - priorities people.

[Kilaak Kommander]

As a university alumnus and now employee, it's been fascinating and a bit overwhelming to watch the pillars collapse. But no one seems surprised.

Paterno has this incredible aura of untouchability. The team has a string of bad seasons? No worries, let's see where the program is in five years. A player has a run-in with the law? Paterno laughs and says "boys will be boys". The team suffers a bad loss? He jokes about going home and beating the wife. One of your good ol' boys rapes a 10-year old? Pass the buck, worry about the next game.

Even in this shameful and horrible case, people are strangely hesitant to target Paterno. Locally, the call is to tar and feather the university president. Yet he was far enough down the chain that it wouldn't surprise me if he only heard a sanitized version of the events.

[Checkmite]

Originally Posted by A Laughing Baby

By the way, according to a local Fox affiliate, after the investigation asked for other victims to come forward...they did. We're now up to 20 victims.

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2011/11/08...-case-doubles/

Well you kind of knew this was coming. To tell from the way the kids in the indictment independently described their own "grooming", Sandusky was practically following a script. A very effective one, evidently.

[ProBonoShill]

Originally Posted by WildCat

I wouldn't be surprised if the game is played, with someone other than Joe Pa as head coach.

I think you're right.

Originally Posted by A Laughing Baby

This is why Paterno is leaving after this season, as announced earlier today. Simply kicking it up the line isn't going to cut it in this case, especially when you SEE NOTHING COMING OF IT FOR YEARS AFTER.

I believe he'll be leaving sooner than that, they cancelled his weekly press conference today and the rumours are flying:

http://www.steelernation.com/forums/...from-PSU/page3

[ProBonoShill]

Originally Posted by ProBonoShill

I think you're right.



I believe he'll be leaving sooner than that, they cancelled his weekly press conference today and the rumours are flying:

http://www.steelernation.com/forums/...from-PSU/page3

Okay maybe not:

http://www.myfoxphilly.com/dpp/sport...te-case-110811

Quote:

Scott Paterno spoke with Fox 29 one hour after Penn State officials cancelled a scheduled press conference with Joe Paterno.

The New York Times reported after the cancelled conference that two sources told it that Penn State officials were negotiating Paterno's exit as football coach, perhaps within days, in the wake of the Jerry Sandusky sex scandal.

Scott Paterno called that report "fiction."

“There are no negotiations between us,” Scott Paterno said. “The New York Times report, you got to get the sources from them. ... The university has not in anyway shape or form indicated or contacted us about any type of retirement agreement, that is all fiction at this point."

“As of now, he’ll be coaching on Saturday and he’s getting ready for practice.”

[Tsukasa Buddha]

How interesting that we are so so ready to declare unthinkable immorality on an individual in a situation (not following through or fist-fighting and instead deferring to authority) that repeated itself so reliably. From a psychological perspective, the behaviours read like classic examples (See: Milgram Experiments, The Lucifer Effect, etc.)

Obviously their actions, and mostly inactions, led to more horrible abuses, but let's not pretend that somehow only incredibly scummy individuals came across this.

[slingblade]

If I were to witness a man anally raping a 10-year-old, I'm not walking away from that.
I'm not leaving that child there. And if--IF--it came down to violence to stop him, then that's what it comes down to.

Make of it what you will, won't hurt me none.

[Checkmite]

Fine; a whole bunch of apathetic individuals came across this.

...nothing seems to have changed. Whether the inaction was the result of people just not particularly caring, or choosing their friend's safety over the rape victims', or being absolutely evil...it makes no difference to the outcome, any more than does the fact that, after all, Sandusky did run a charity for children. They chose to do nothing, and because of that more abuse took place - both directly (in the case of the little boy Sandusky was allowed to finish raping after being walked in on) and indirectly (in the case of other children Sandusky had access to who were abused because nobody reported Sandusky). All their current finger-pointing and buck-passing and shouts of "it wasn't my responsibility" that we're currently witnessing is nothing but a QED of exactly the attitude that facilitated Sandusky's abuses.

[PhantomWolf]

So he's gone from being the defensive coordinator for Penn State to coordinating his defense to avoid the state pen.

[citizenzen]

Originally Posted by Tsukasa Buddha

How interesting that we are so so ready to declare unthinkable immorality on an individual in a situation (not following through or fist-fighting and instead deferring to authority) that repeated itself so reliably. From a psychological perspective, the behaviours read like classic examples (See: Milgram Experiments, The Lucifer Effect, etc.)

Obviously their actions, and mostly inactions, led to more horrible abuses, but let's not pretend that somehow only incredibly scummy individuals came across this.

I appreciate your point.

Another aspect that has struck me is hearing to the reaction to this story. I listen to ESPN radio and the radio host after radio host described this as so heinous ... so outrageous ... so horrible. I hard-pressed to remember the last time I've heard people this outraged.

But outrageous things occur all the time. Why is this incident causing the reaction that I'm seeing?

[varwoche]

Originally Posted by slingblade

If I were to witness a man anally raping a 10-year-old, I'm not walking away from that.
I'm not leaving that child there. And if--IF--it came down to violence to stop him, then that's what it comes down to.

Make of it what you will, won't hurt me none.

I'm with you 100%.

[slingblade]

Originally Posted by varwoche

I'm with you 100%.

Thank you.

[slingblade]

Originally Posted by citizenzen

I appreciate your point.

Another aspect that has struck me is hearing to the reaction to this story. I listen to ESPN radio and the radio host after radio host described this as so heinous ... so outrageous ... so horrible. I hard-pressed to remember the last time I've heard people this outraged.

But outrageous things occur all the time. Why is this incident causing the reaction that I'm seeing?

Wait, you're insinuating that those unnamed, unspecified other "bad outrageous things" don't cause this reaction. If that's so...how are they deemed outrageous if no one's expressing any outrage?

They DO cause this reaction.

It's as if this is the first time you've ever seen people upset.

[MIKILLINI]

Originally Posted by slingblade

If I were to witness a man anally raping a 10-year-old, I'm not walking away from that.
I'm not leaving that child there. And if--IF--it came down to violence to stop him, then that's what it comes down to.

Make of it what you will, won't hurt me none.

Absolutely agree Sling! Had I walked in on this despicable act, I'd have gone right up to Sandusky and punched him in the face.

[Mary_H]

Originally Posted by Tsukasa Buddha

How interesting that we are so so ready to declare unthinkable immorality on an individual in a situation (not following through or fist-fighting and instead deferring to authority) that repeated itself so reliably. From a psychological perspective, the behaviours read like classic examples (See: Milgram Experiments, The Lucifer Effect, etc.)

Obviously their actions, and mostly inactions, led to more horrible abuses, but let's not pretend that somehow only incredibly scummy individuals came across this.

Yeah, this discussion rather quickly skipped over Sandusky and Paterno and their supervisors, and went straight to vilifying the least responsible party (aside from the victim).

[Chungy]

My uncle made me do things to him. I go to mental health counselor at the clinic now, someday I think maybe humans will not harm each other, but not before I die.

[slingblade]

Originally Posted by Mary_H

Yeah, this discussion rather quickly skipped over Sandusky and Paterno and their supervisors, and went straight to vilifying the least responsible party (aside from the victim).

Just as odd how it's stopped being about the issue at all, but rather is now about how we're discussing it. Because that's more important.

Sandusky's a very sick man who should go away for good.

Paterno and the entire body of people who had knowledge of these events should have some prison time in some cases, should have fines in others, or a combination; should expect to face lawsuits, loss of job or position, and other social and economic penalties.

This is a horrible series of events and my outrage knows no bounds.

Does that satisfy the....requirements?

[Checkmite]

Sandusky's been "skipped over" in this discussion because the monstrosity of his actions (assuming the allegations are true) aren't considered by anyone to be a matter that's up for debate.

As for the "least responsible party" (by which I assume you refer to the man who saw the rape in progress and permitted it to continue uninterrupted), there's nothing that Paterno and his superiors can be accused of that said individual is not also guilty of; it's really that simple. There's no reasonable argument for why it would be reprehensible that Paterno (et al) didn't call the police but okay that the first-hand witness did not either.

[EventHorizon]

Originally Posted by PhantomWolf

So he's gone from being the defensive coordinator for Penn State to coordinating his defense to avoid the state pen.

First of all, I'm stealing that line. Second, I was just taking a look at this animal's wikipedia entry and found this:

Quote:

Sandusky is married and has six adopted children.[20] He also took in foster children.[4]

Should I be as disturbed by this as I am? This whole thing is disgusting.

[Mary_H]

Originally Posted by slingblade

Just as odd how it's stopped being about the issue at all, but rather is now about how we're discussing it. Because that's more important.

Sandusky's a very sick man who should go away for good.

Paterno and the entire body of people who had knowledge of these events should have some prison time in some cases, should have fines in others, or a combination; should expect to face lawsuits, loss of job or position, and other social and economic penalties.

This is a horrible series of events and my outrage knows no bounds.

Does that satisfy the....requirements?

The discussion hasn't been about the issue; it's been about what a bad guy the graduate assistant was. According to the indictment, the graduate assistant was "distraught" and "upset" by what he saw. Basically he was a victim of Sandusky, too. The transgressions listed in the indictment began in 1994, and there were many opportunities along the way for other people to stop Sandusky before he raped the boy in the locker room in 2002, including an actual police report in 1998. If responsible people had done their jobs, the GA would not have been put in a position he had no training for.

It's definitely a fascinating phenomenon. The GA, as an employee of the school and part of its culture, somehow "got" that going directly to the police might not work out for the best. Could he believe his eyes? Would he embarrass the boy? Would the police believe him over a professor emeritus (which Sandusky is)? I am sure many questions ran through his head while he was trying to deal with what he had seen, or thought he had seen.

And what about all the other people who "knew," but didn't want to know? Sandusky's wife, the boys' parents, Schultz, Curley, Paterno, the police detectives who interviewed Sandusky in 1998 and got him to promise never to do it again?

So much goes into enabling pedophiles, especially when they are respected members of the community. The victims themselves don't even know what's going on when it is happening to them; they don't even know they have rights. Until recent times, pedophilia has not been, in our culture, a simple question of right vs. wrong or black vs. white. A lot of it has been about protecting the "dignity" of the predator.

[Checkmite]

Originally Posted by Mary_H

And what about all the other people who "knew," but didn't want to know? Sandusky's wife, the boys' parents, Schultz, Curley, Paterno, the police detectives who interviewed Sandusky in 1998 and got him to promise never to do it again?

Every single one of these people can at least make the argument that they never personally saw anything that suggested to them something was wrong. That's something McQueary alone can't argue.

Blame for this, or any situation, isn't a finite "thing", so that one person shoulders a certain percentage of it and that leaves only a certain remaining percentage of blame to distribute amongst however many others there are. The fact that there were others, even many others, doesn't lighten McQueary's load. What kind of "training" is one supposed to get in order to be able to act properly when walking in on a man raping a little boy?

McQueary witnessed a rape and did nothing. If Paterno and his superiors are so guilty of hearing about a rape and doing nothing, McQueary must also be guilty. Your list of proposed "questions that must have been going through his mind" could be applied to anyone - including Paterno and his superiors.

I honestly can't believe how far people are straining credulity to give this guy a pass. According to the indictment he had no question about what he saw - he even distinctly remembers Sandusky and the victim looking directly at him. And you guys are forgiving his inaction because of things like "he might have thought he was hallucinating"? Jesus Christ on a stick, if I walk in on somebody raping a kid, even if it occurs to me that I might be hallucinating it's not going to stop me from trying to intervene simply because I might not be &*$%ing hallucinating.

[Mary_H]

Originally Posted by EventHorizon

First of all, I'm stealing that line. Second, I was just taking a look at this animal's wikipedia entry and found this:



Should I be as disturbed by this as I am? This whole thing is disgusting.

It really makes you wonder not only how widespread it is, but also how widespread it could become. I recently read about the custom of men in the Middle East keeping harems of boys, and how some of the boys interviewed said they couldn't wait to become men so they could get their own harems of boys.

I had a job that required me to visit some charter schools in Oregon, out in the rural areas. Something stood out to me -- all the teachers at the three schools I visited were men. It struck me as odd, so I did an online search of teacher statistics and found that Oregon has a higher number of male teachers than the national average, by a significant amount (this was a few years ago, so I can't remember the exact statistic).

I know there is a well organized international network of pedophiles, with their own websites, etc. I started thinking, what if word got around about places (like Thailand, for example) where child sex was easy to get, or where so many members of the population were pedophile-friendly, that no matter how high you went, you could not get anybody to take any action against them? Now comes Penn State with a pretty good example of how that can work. I don't know who blew the whistle on this one, but if Sandusky were a close friend of the governor or the president, we might never have found out.

[Tsukasa Buddha]

Originally Posted by slingblade

If I were to witness a man anally raping a 10-year-old, I'm not walking away from that.
I'm not leaving that child there. And if--IF--it came down to violence to stop him, then that's what it comes down to.

Make of it what you will, won't hurt me none.

I'm not trying to hurt anyone, but most would claim the same about joining the Nazis and persecuting Jews in WWII Germany. electrocuting people as part of an experiment, etc. Meanwhile we know demonstrably that most of the time this is not the case.

Originally Posted by Checkmite

Fine; a whole bunch of apathetic individuals came across this.

Highly doubtful, and not in relation to any of the psychology topics I mentioned.

Quote:

...nothing seems to have changed. Whether the inaction was the result of people just not particularly caring, or choosing their friend's safety over the rape victims', or being absolutely evil...it makes no difference to the outcome, any more than does the fact that, after all, Sandusky did run a charity for children. They chose to do nothing, and because of that more abuse took place - both directly (in the case of the little boy Sandusky was allowed to finish raping after being walked in on) and indirectly (in the case of other children Sandusky had access to who were abused because nobody reported Sandusky). All their current finger-pointing and buck-passing and shouts of "it wasn't my responsibility" that we're currently witnessing is nothing but a QED of exactly the attitude that facilitated Sandusky's abuses.

Obviously it won't change anything in this case, but understanding why this happened again and again could help lead to policies preventing such lapses. Or it could help us better correct for such perverse influences our own moral thinking. And in the case of blame I think proclaiming guilt on a person affects both individuals, so it is best to be most accurate.

Originally Posted by Mary_H

The discussion hasn't been about the issue; it's been about what a bad guy the graduate assistant was. According to the indictment, the graduate assistant was "distraught" and "upset" by what he saw. Basically he was a victim of Sandusky, too. The transgressions listed in the indictment began in 1994, and there were many opportunities along the way for other people to stop Sandusky before he raped the boy in the locker room 2002, including an actual police report in 1998. If responsible people had done their jobs, the GA would not have been put in a position he had no training for.

It's definitely a fascinating phenomenon. The GA, as an employee of the school and part of its culture, somehow "got" that going directly to the police might not work out for the best. Could he believe his eyes? Would he embarrass the boy? Would the police believe him over a professor emeritus (which Sandusky is)? I am sure many questions ran through his head while he was trying to deal with what he had seen, or thought he had seen.

And what about all the other people who "knew," but didn't want to know? Sandusky's wife, the boys' parents, Schultz, Curley, Paterno, the police detectives who interviewed Sandusky in 1998 and got him to promise never to do it again?

So much goes into enabling pedophiles, especially when they are respected members of the communities. The victims themselves don't even know what's going on when it is happening to them; they don't even know they have rights. Until recent times, pedophilia has not been, in our culture, a simple question of right vs. wrong or black vs. white. A lot of it has been about protecting the "dignity" of the predator.

I agree, except for the beginning bit as being stated too strongly. While many seem content with the "kick the pedo's ***" motto and no one has said they would do the same as these individuals, it is remarkable how many individuals independently "knew".

[fishbait]

This doddering diva of the gridiron was in a position of consummate power and did NOTHING! Innocent , vulnerable children were being hurt, and this vainglorious potentate of the pigskin at Penn State did NOTHING!

He well deserves his fate of going down in history as a moral failure. Joe Paterno cannot win this one with a sleazy Hail Mary PR pass dreamed up by his lawyers and high-priced IMAGE consultants paid for by Penn State.

Appalling.

[Mary_H]

Originally Posted by Checkmite

Every single one of these people can at least make the argument that they never personally saw anything that suggested to them something was wrong. That's something McQueary alone can't argue.

Blame for this, or any situation, isn't a finite "thing", so that one person shoulders a certain percentage of it and that leaves only a certain remaining percentage of blame to distribute amongst however many others there are. The fact that there were others, even many others, doesn't lighten McQueary's load. What kind of "training" is one supposed to get in order to be able to act properly when walking in on a man raping a little boy?

McQueary witnessed a rape and did nothing. If Paterno and his superiors are so guilty of hearing about a rape and doing nothing, McQueary must also be guilty. Your list of proposed "questions that must have been going through his mind" could be applied to anyone - including Paterno and his superiors.

I honestly can't believe how far people are straining credulity to give this guy a pass. According to the indictment he had no question about what he saw - he even distinctly remembers Sandusky and the victim looking directly at him. And you guys are forgiving his inaction because of things like "he might have thought he was hallucinating"? Jesus Christ on a stick, if I walk in on somebody raping a kid, even if it occurs to me that I might be hallucinating it's not going to stop me from trying to intervene simply because I might not be &*$%ing hallucinating.

Well, I disagree, but I'm not going to go on and on about it. According to the indictment, there were other people who saw Sandusky in the showers and on the floor with boys. He also paraded these boys in public year after year, essentially presenting them as his partners at football games, banquets, etc. Now that we know the truth about what Sandusky was up to, we think, "Doh! -- obviously!" But when you're close to the situation, you often don't have the perspective. The GA did react, he just didn't react in the way you hope you would act in the same situation.

Over twenty years ago, a little boy who lived next door to me came to my house to play with my child. The little boy had a red hand print across his cheek, put there by his stepfather, who I had heard yelling at him moments before. I went so far as to pick up the phone to call the police, but overriding my decision was the thought of what was going to happen to that little boy after the police left, so I didn't call.

Yes, I have felt very guilty about it ever since, and I like to think I would do things differently today, now that I am more than twenty years older and it is a different time. I have a feeling that the GA, too, now knows what he "should" have done ten years ago. What purpose does it serve to criticize him about it?

[WildCat]

This story makes me want to vomit:

Quote:

John McQueary knows first hand just how much these allegations involving the sex abuse scandal at Penn State are wearing on his son.

Mike McQueary, the Nittany Lions' wide receivers coach and recruiting coordinator, is the once unnamed graduate assistant who identified former defensive coordinator Jerry Sandusky with a young male at the school's Lasch Football Building in 2002. The grand jury report said the graduate assistant reported the incident, described as sexual assault occurring in a shower, to his boss, Joe Paterno, and from there the investigation continues.

"He's a good kid and a tough kid," John said standing on the front porch of his State College home late Tuesday afternoon. "He did what he was supposed to do, and all of this has been very hard on him. Everything from this and about this (case) has been difficult for him, but he's a strong person and will be OK."

So not calling the police when he witnessed a 10 year old boy being raped was "what he was supposed to do" and we should think of the real victim in all this, Mike McQueary.

What a self-serving pair of clueless idiots.

[ProBonoShill]

Originally Posted by WildCat

This story makes me want to vomit:

So not calling the police when he witnessed a 10 year old boy being raped was "what he was supposed to do" and we should think of the real victim in all this, Mike McQueary.

What a self-serving pair of clueless idiots.

Cowards the pair of them, they were close friends of Sandusky and instead of calling police which the law requires them to do, they decided to "keep it in the football family" and nothing was ever done. Sick.

[Caper]

Originally Posted by WildCat

This story makes me want to vomit:

So not calling the police when he witnessed a 10 year old boy being raped was "what he was supposed to do" and we should think of the real victim in all this, Mike McQueary.

What a self-serving pair of clueless idiots.

This reminds me of those cases where someone needs help.... like the Chinese baby or that the guy who was stabbed in New York . I always find it funny how it always seems like the only 25 or so people on the entire planet that would not have done something are the same ones that just happen to be walking by and not doing anything.

I would have intervened. I was in Florida last winter with my wife and her parents when I witnessed this car just plow into another car and just drive off. We got a green light and my first instinct was to follow the car that was getting away (he was damaged too and I think pretty smashed up on the front end). My first instinct was follow the car get on the cell phone and call the police and give a license plate..... but I wasn't driving.... and when I started yelling to follow that car..... the other 3 just wanted to go the other way.... and we did. I'm determinately not a better person then any of them... not by a long-shot.... but in that moment I was.

Mike McQueary is not a bad person... and in my mind he's not a rare person either. I can't give you a stat about the percentage of people who if faced with that situation would have acted like he did. But I'll tell you this.... it is not a small percentage, not by a long shot..... and I'm not even convinced he would be in the minority. He made the wrong decision and it's not the one I would have made. But I certainly don't hate the man.

[Caper]

Also, I'm sure there will be alot more boys coming forward in time.

This will be a financial disaster for the university.

And you know there will be about 10 or so boys that were never touched back in 98 or when ever that will be coming forward for a big payday.

We had a case like that here in Nova Scotia.... it was a disaster.

Quote:

Shelburne Journal; Tales of Sex, Violence and Greed in a Small Town
By JAMES BROOKE
Published: January 13, 2000
Source: http://www.nytimes.com/2000/01/13/wo...ted=all&src=pm

Five years ago, this seaside fishing village of gabled roofs and colonial alleys served as a movie set for ''The Scarlet Letter.'' But in real life the witch hunt haunting Shelburne revolves not around ''A'' for adulterer, but ''P'' for pedophile.

In 1993 Patrick McDougall, a former employee of Shelburne School for Boys, a provincial reformatory here, was convicted of sexually abusing several boys in the 1960's and 1970's. He died in jail last year.

Edited by Locknar:

<SNIP>, breach of rule 4

Mr. Keating had time to mull over the situation when he worked as a carpenter on the ''Scarlet Letter'' movie set here. Speaking on a recent evening as chairman of a new group, Past Employees for Restorative Justice, he said in a clear voice, ''We want exoneration.''

[SezMe]

This is not going to be limited to Penn State. I'll bet similar incidents at other big sports universities soon come to light.