Bunch of claims over at letsroll, have they been debunked? - Page 4

Clayton Moore · 4th January 2012, 11:39 AM

Originally Posted by Disbelief

You mean the 85 that have been released becaused of an FOIA request from Federal Watch? The ones that you can view online?

I must have missed that. All of the 85 videos are available? Link(s) please.

000063 · 4th January 2012, 11:40 AM

Originally Posted by Clayton Moore

You never disappoint.

Over 70 videos from cameras nearby the Pentagon were confiscated by the Feds. It's common knowledge.

So making a claim, not providing a source, and saying it's "common knowledge", which implies the person you're disagreeing with it either poorly informed, or lying.

Standard Clayton.

Clayton Moore · 4th January 2012, 11:42 AM

Originally Posted by 000063

So making a claim, not providing a source, and saying it's "common knowledge", which implies the person you're disagreeing with it either poorly informed, or lying.

Kudos. You nailed it.

twinstead · 4th January 2012, 11:51 AM

Originally Posted by Clayton Moore

Kudos. You nailed it.

Poor debate etiquette and technique is not something to be proud of Clayton. It's hard to convince people you're right when you argue like a 6 year old.

beachnut · 4th January 2012, 11:58 AM

Originally Posted by Clayton Moore

You never disappoint.

Over 70 videos from cameras nearby the Pentagon were confiscated by the Feds. It's common knowledge.

You are off topic. All the video has been released. You missed it, like you missed the topic of the thread. What you don't know is posted freely, without hesitation, without effort.

Originally Posted by Clayton Moore

I must have missed that. All of the 85 videos are available? Link(s) please.

Off topic and indicative of your research skills.

Originally Posted by Clayton Moore

Kudos. You nailed it.

Off topic.

Do you have any clue what the topic is?

I don't blame you, reading the first post and figuring out the topic takes some research skills, and you have demonstrated in most posts you don't do research or reality when it comes to 911 issues. You don't know how to do rational research. The topic is...

http://letsrollforums.com/hollywood-...ke-t23532.html

You complain about people breaking rules and now you are off topic and need to report yourself for being off topic.

http://letsrollforums.com/hollywood-...ke-t23532.html
The thread topic is not about video which you can't find.

carlitos · 4th January 2012, 11:59 AM

Originally Posted by Clayton Moore

I must have missed that. All of the 85 videos are available? Link(s) please.

There weren't really 85 videos at the Pentagon.

Lots are here.

Discussion here.

Best summary here.

Clayton Moore · 4th January 2012, 12:51 PM

Originally Posted by jonthompson

Please source me if so. It's another world over there. They claim to prove the jumpers that day were fake. They claim there was something attached to the building to make fake smoke, now I did look at the pic, it was a popular pic, that one where there's a person falling and one hanging out of a window, they say the people were put there to distract from the odd formation on the building, and to be honest it is odd, these things are protruding from the building and they're all evenly across it and identical. As a youngster I always thought it was damage to the building but I dont think it can be.

There's so many claims there, can someone tell me their story or show me where to look for answers to their most notorious claims?

That's the OP.

Please stop the baiting.

leftysergeant · 4th January 2012, 03:00 PM

Originally Posted by Clayton Moore

I must have missed that. All of the 85 videos are available? Link(s) please.

please present proof that more than ten of them were actually Pentagon-related and not private property.

If they were not government property, the government cannot release them under any circumstances if they contain no evidence used in a criminal trial. You twoofers are not entritled to look at the survielance tapes from the entrance of a hotel if the camera was not pointed toward a location that would give a clear view of the aircraft. The only private tape released DID show a part of an aircraft of the right size and speed headed for the Pentagon. Stop whining.

BasqueArch · 4th January 2012, 04:21 PM

Originally Posted by Clayton Moore

I must have missed that. All of the 85 videos are available? Link(s) please.

The CIA asked us not to show them to you.
Sorry.

Clayton Moore · 4th January 2012, 06:14 PM

Originally Posted by leftysergeant

please present proof that more than ten of them were actually Pentagon-related and not private property.

If they were not government property, the government cannot release them under any circumstances if they contain no evidence used in a criminal trial. You twoofers are not entritled to look at the survielance tapes from the entrance of a hotel if the camera was not pointed toward a location that would give a clear view of the aircraft. The only private tape released DID show a part of an aircraft of the right size and speed headed for the Pentagon. Stop whining.

Stop bsing.

triforcharity · 4th January 2012, 07:57 PM

Um, which part are you claiming is BS?

sheeplesnshills · 4th January 2012, 07:57 PM

Originally Posted by Clayton Moore

Stop bsing.

another Clayton classic!

Clayton Moore · 4th January 2012, 08:33 PM

Originally Posted by triforcharity

Um, which part are you claiming is BS?

Originally Posted by leftysergeant View Post

Quote:

please present proof that more than ten of them were actually Pentagon-related and not private property.

If they were not government property, the government cannot release them under any circumstances if they contain no evidence used in a criminal trial. You twoofers are not entritled to look at the survielance tapes from the entrance of a hotel if the camera was not pointed toward a location that would give a clear view of the aircraft. The only private tape released DID show a part of an aircraft of the right size and speed headed for the Pentagon.

the government cannot release them under any circumstances

The only private tape released

please present proof that more than ten of them were actually Pentagon-related and not private property.

They were confiscated.
They were confiscated.

Released? You must mean returned.

If they were returned the owners would sell them for hundreds of thousands of dollars.

triforcharity · 4th January 2012, 09:04 PM

Why would the owners sells them (tapes that showed nothing) for hundreds of thousands of dollars?

Clayton Moore · 4th January 2012, 09:16 PM

Originally Posted by triforcharity

Why would the owners sells them (tapes that showed nothing) for hundreds of thousands of dollars?

A better question would be

Why haven't the videos been returned to their owners?

Kid Eager · 4th January 2012, 09:37 PM

Originally Posted by Clayton Moore

A better question would be

Why haven't the videos been returned to their owners?

Are you claiming that the videos haven't been returned to their owners?

Cl1mh4224rd · 4th January 2012, 09:38 PM

Originally Posted by Clayton Moore

Why haven't the videos been returned to their owners?

You're putting the cart before the horse. Whose to say that they haven't?

I'm not sure that's something that would warrant a public announcement. I've read a number of articles over the years about the FBI confiscating servers and various other computer hardware from individuals or companies, but very rarely have I seen a follow-up article stating that those items had been returned.

Clayton Moore · 4th January 2012, 09:52 PM

Originally Posted by Kid Eager

Are you claiming that the videos haven't been returned to their owners?

Yup.
Can't fool you.

Clayton Moore · 4th January 2012, 09:54 PM

Originally Posted by Cl1mh4224rd

You're putting the cart before the horse. Whose to say that they haven't?

I'm not sure that's something that would warrant a public announcement. I've read a number of articles over the years about the FBI confiscating servers and various other computer hardware from individuals or companies, but very rarely have I seen a follow-up article stating that those items had been returned.

Good grief. It was associated with 9/11.

Redtail · 4th January 2012, 10:20 PM

Originally Posted by Clayton Moore

Good grief. It was associated with 9/11.

And how many truth seekers have contacted the cameras' owners to see if they had gotten the tapes back?

Ivan Kminek · 4th January 2012, 10:41 PM

Ergh... I have read a part of "relevant" threads on Letsrollforums.com and I am wordless.

Instead, I would like to cite "our" truther Miragememories, who wrote there:

"Miragememories
Reader

Join Date: 4 Jan 2008
Posts: 3
Threads: 0
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post

"Re: 9/11 Jumpers Video's - Observations & Critical Thinking
________________________________________
How sick.

To suggest that on 9/11, those poor people trapped in the Towers above the impact zones, were not forced by the desperateness of their situation, to leap to their deaths.

How unfeeling.

Incredible.

Makes me truly sick to my stomach.

MM"

Thanks, MM.

Clayton Moore · 4th January 2012, 11:20 PM

Originally Posted by Redtail

And how many truth seekers have contacted the cameras' owners to see if they had gotten the tapes back?

Gee. I thought that was the MSMs job.

Kid Eager · 5th January 2012, 12:10 AM

Originally Posted by Clayton Moore

Yup.
Can't fool you.

Excellent - we're making progress. Why are you making that assertion?

TSR · 5th January 2012, 12:38 AM

Originally Posted by Clayton Moore

Gee. I thought that was the MSMs job.

.
The MSMs job is to sell ads. "Videos returned, show nothing" is of interest to no one but twoofer idiots who will then claim "forgery!" anyway.
.

Clayton Moore · 5th January 2012, 12:45 AM

Originally Posted by TSR

.
The MSMs job is to sell ads. "Videos returned, show nothing" is of interest to no one but twoofer idiots who will then claim "forgery!" anyway.
.

You're saying the NIST worshiping morons believe TV news shows are figments of my imagination?

Oystein · 5th January 2012, 01:09 AM

Originally Posted by Clayton Moore

You're saying the NIST worshiping morons believe TV news shows are figments of my imagination?

Can you us point to any particular such person? I think in order for this to not be a figment of your imagination you'd have to present us with at least one actual NIST worshiping moron who actually believes the particular TV news piece that you are refering to!

Clayton Moore · 5th January 2012, 01:17 AM

Originally Posted by Oystein

Can you us point to any particular such person? I think in order for this to not be a figment of your imagination you'd have to present us with at least one actual NIST worshiping moron who actually believes the particular TV news piece that you are refering to!

No. Reread my post.

TSR · 5th January 2012, 01:46 AM

Originally Posted by Clayton Moore

You're saying the NIST worshiping morons believe TV news shows are figments of my imagination?

.
No, I'm saying only morons believe that NIST is worshipped, unless you can produce something objective to support it.

You never will, since by your own admission you do not supply sources.

And so it amuzes me to simply point and laugh at your inane ramblings.
.

Oystein · 5th January 2012, 02:03 AM

Originally Posted by Clayton Moore

No. Reread my post.

Which post? You wrote several. But, without any actual persons that actually fit your description "NIST worshiping morons believe TV news shows", the answer to your question "...are figments of my imagination?" seems to a firm yes, they are figments of your imagination.

leftysergeant · 5th January 2012, 02:24 AM

The people from whom any tape with a worthwhile image was taken would already be demanding that the tapes be returned.

They haven't. The tapes that you seek do not exist. They would have been very valuable at the Mousaui trial.

BTW, some people may be totalling the tapes from the Pentagon area with the tapes from the airports from which the planes werre hijacked.

Oystein · 5th January 2012, 02:27 AM

lefty, quite frankly: you are speculating. That ain't worth much.

Myriad · 5th January 2012, 06:59 AM

Since there is no reason to believe that every recording security camera in the area was pointed at the Pentagon wall, there certainly must be some recordings that do not show that area at all.

Let's consider a hypothetical example of such a recording. It's a recording from a security camera outside an emergency exit opening onto a service alley from an apartment building. The exit is locked from the outside and alarmed, so it's not used by anyone under normal circumstances. The recording shows no movement anywhere in the camera's field of view for its entire length, except for a tiny and gradual shift in the shadow positions as the earth turns. A small portion of the Pentagon a mile or so away would have been visible out the end of the alley from where the camera was mounted, if the camera had been pointed that way, but it wasn't because it was pointed at the emergency exit door instead.

However, the authorities confirm that the recording does cover the exact time the plane crashed into the Pentagon a mile or so away.

The recording -- the original VHS tape itself -- is posted for sale on Ebay. How much would you bid for it?

Respectfully,
Myriad

Oystein · 5th January 2012, 07:07 AM

Originally Posted by Myriad

...
The recording -- the original VHS tape itself -- is posted for sale on Ebay. How much would you bid for it?

Respectfully,
Myriad

Uh-oh - asking truthers to put their money where their mouth is - not a good idea if you want constructive replies!

(I have dared truthers several times to bet money on specific proposals; none ever bit. It is interesting now to see Shure and, apparently, some of his buddies, pledge money to support Chris Mohr's effort to have red-gray WTC dust chips competently investigated. Shure is a CIT / P4T supporter, a group that Richard Gage recently disavowed. No doubt they put their money now on a debunker project only to get even with rival truthers!)

pgimeno · 5th January 2012, 08:43 AM

Originally Posted by carlitos

There weren't really 85 videos at the Pentagon.

Lots are here.

Discussion here.

Best summary here.

Bump for Clayton Moore (and the rest).

That should have settled it. I fail to understand why it hasn't.

The videos that the FBI confiscated did not represent the Pentagon at the time of the crash. The few that were are already on YouTube (the two Pentagon security cameras, CITGO, DoubleTree and the one in the DEA HQ that wasn't filming there but turned that way right after the crash).

carlitos · 5th January 2012, 08:48 AM

Originally Posted by pgimeno

Bump for Clayton Moore (and the rest).

That should have settled it. I fail to understand why it hasn't.

The videos that the FBI confiscated did not represent the Pentagon at the time of the crash. The few that were are already on YouTube (the two Pentagon security cameras, CITGO, DoubleTree and the one in the DEA HQ that wasn't filming there but turned that way right after the crash).

Clayton isn't interested in facts or truth, which is why he ignored that, preferring sniping and vague innuendo.

But, you're right. A response like mine above is all these trolls ever deserve, if that.

MikeW · 5th January 2012, 09:25 AM

Originally Posted by pgimeno

Bump for Clayton Moore (and the rest).

That should have settled it. I fail to understand why it hasn't.

The videos that the FBI confiscated did not represent the Pentagon at the time of the crash. The few that were are already on YouTube (the two Pentagon security cameras, CITGO, DoubleTree and the one in the DEA HQ that wasn't filming there but turned that way right after the crash).

And the person who's actually watched all the videos - a truther - complained that some were in poor quality, but concluded:

Quote:

i've been working on this project for so many years, and if there was anything on those videos that may have possibly shed further light on the event, i would have fought for the higher quality. it was all basically random stuff and shaky camera work revealing nothing. that may be hard to accept (my personal judgement) but you're going to have to trust me or hate me.

if you're new the the movement and a bit confused about what to believe, read every word here: http://www.oilempire.us/911.html. stick to the sites recommended there. stay away from no-plane theories and groups and sites that suggest anything other than a 757 impacted the pentagon.
http://penttbom.com/

(my bolding)

Dash80 · 5th January 2012, 09:40 AM

Originally Posted by Ivan Kminek

Ergh... I have read a part of "relevant" threads on Letsrollforums.com and I am wordless.

Instead, I would like to cite "our" truther Miragememories, who wrote there:

"Miragememories
Reader

Join Date: 4 Jan 2008
Posts: 3
Threads: 0
Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post

"Re: 9/11 Jumpers Video's - Observations & Critical Thinking
________________________________________
How sick.

To suggest that on 9/11, those poor people trapped in the Towers above the impact zones, were not forced by the desperateness of their situation, to leap to their deaths.

How unfeeling.

Incredible.

Makes me truly sick to my stomach.

MM"

Thanks, MM.

Atleast some truthers actually have morals. Makes MM look perfectly sane compared to the LetsTroll nutters.

Cl1mh4224rd · 5th January 2012, 10:55 AM

[Erk. Reading fail.]

George152 · 5th January 2012, 11:22 AM

Originally Posted by Clayton Moore

A better question would be

Why haven't the videos been returned to their owners?

I have compassion for the dead horse that you're beating

NoahFence · 5th January 2012, 01:10 PM

Quote:

If they were returned the owners would sell them for hundreds of thousands of dollars.

Thanks a lot, junior.

I just spit my coffee out. What an absurd statement!!!!

The manager of the local Holiday Inn would sell a video of a camera looking at their entrance based soley on the fact that it was taken on 9/11?

Here I was lamenting the death of the stundies now that most of your bretheren have quit! I guess I spoke too soon.

4th January 2012, 11:39 AM	#121
Clayton Moore Philosopher Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 6,196	Originally Posted by Disbelief You mean the 85 that have been released becaused of an FOIA request from Federal Watch? The ones that you can view online? I must have missed that. All of the 85 videos are available? Link(s) please.
	__________________ Shitat Matzliach is why the Holohoax works. The same neoconservative scum who engineered 9/11 and got the US into two wars want American troops to sacrifice their lives in Syria and Iran. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lhc7M...Mc4eb2TClVRQws http://rememberbuilding7.org/10/#aevideo http://www2.ae911truth.org/actionale...rBuilding7.php

4th January 2012, 11:40 AM	#122
000063 Illuminator Join Date: Apr 2011 Location: Not America. Posts: 4,738	Originally Posted by Clayton Moore You never disappoint. Over 70 videos from cameras nearby the Pentagon were confiscated by the Feds. It's common knowledge. So making a claim, not providing a source, and saying it's "common knowledge", which implies the person you're disagreeing with it either poorly informed, or lying. Standard Clayton.
	__________________ No, I'd like you to answer the question in two, simple, coherent sentences. ... That's how you present credible arguments in written form. -ergo, on me giving him a 2 digit number I can think of two reasons why bedunkers are often so loathe to explain their theories using plain, concise language--words even. - ergo

4th January 2012, 11:42 AM	#123
Clayton Moore Philosopher Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 6,196	Originally Posted by 000063 So making a claim, not providing a source, and saying it's "common knowledge", which implies the person you're disagreeing with it either poorly informed, or lying. Kudos. You nailed it.
	__________________ Shitat Matzliach is why the Holohoax works. The same neoconservative scum who engineered 9/11 and got the US into two wars want American troops to sacrifice their lives in Syria and Iran. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lhc7M...Mc4eb2TClVRQws http://rememberbuilding7.org/10/#aevideo http://www2.ae911truth.org/actionale...rBuilding7.php

4th January 2012, 11:51 AM	#124
twinstead Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Big corner office in NWO Towers Posts: 11,578	Originally Posted by Clayton Moore Kudos. You nailed it. Poor debate etiquette and technique is not something to be proud of Clayton. It's hard to convince people you're right when you argue like a 6 year old.
	__________________ You are not entitled to your opinion. You are entitled to your INFORMED opinion. No one is entitled to be ignorant. -- Harlan Ellison

4th January 2012, 11:59 AM	#126
carlitos "más divertido" Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 11,549	Originally Posted by Clayton Moore I must have missed that. All of the 85 videos are available? Link(s) please. There weren't really 85 videos at the Pentagon. Lots are here. Discussion here. Best summary here.
	Last edited by carlitos; 4th January 2012 at 12:11 PM.

4th January 2012, 11:58 AM	#125
beachnut Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: Dog House Posts: 19,901	Originally Posted by Clayton Moore You never disappoint. Over 70 videos from cameras nearby the Pentagon were confiscated by the Feds. It's common knowledge. You are off topic. All the video has been released. You missed it, like you missed the topic of the thread. What you don't know is posted freely, without hesitation, without effort. Originally Posted by Clayton Moore I must have missed that. All of the 85 videos are available? Link(s) please. Off topic and indicative of your research skills. Originally Posted by Clayton Moore Kudos. You nailed it. Off topic. Do you have any clue what the topic is? I don't blame you, reading the first post and figuring out the topic takes some research skills, and you have demonstrated in most posts you don't do research or reality when it comes to 911 issues. You don't know how to do rational research. The topic is... http://letsrollforums.com/hollywood-...ke-t23532.html You complain about people breaking rules and now you are off topic and need to report yourself for being off topic. http://letsrollforums.com/hollywood-...ke-t23532.html The thread topic is not about video which you can't find.

4th January 2012, 12:51 PM	#127
Clayton Moore Philosopher Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 6,196	Originally Posted by jonthompson Please source me if so. It's another world over there. They claim to prove the jumpers that day were fake. They claim there was something attached to the building to make fake smoke, now I did look at the pic, it was a popular pic, that one where there's a person falling and one hanging out of a window, they say the people were put there to distract from the odd formation on the building, and to be honest it is odd, these things are protruding from the building and they're all evenly across it and identical. As a youngster I always thought it was damage to the building but I dont think it can be. There's so many claims there, can someone tell me their story or show me *where to look for answers* to their most notorious claims? That's the OP. Please stop the baiting.
	__________________ Shitat Matzliach is why the Holohoax works. The same neoconservative scum who engineered 9/11 and got the US into two wars want American troops to sacrifice their lives in Syria and Iran. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lhc7M...Mc4eb2TClVRQws http://rememberbuilding7.org/10/#aevideo http://www2.ae911truth.org/actionale...rBuilding7.php

4th January 2012, 03:00 PM	#128
leftysergeant Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Spanaway WA Posts: 18,613	Originally Posted by Clayton Moore I must have missed that. All of the 85 videos are available? Link(s) please. please present proof that more than ten of them were actually Pentagon-related and not private property. If they were not government property, the government cannot release them under any circumstances if they contain no evidence used in a criminal trial. You twoofers are not entritled to look at the survielance tapes from the entrance of a hotel if the camera was not pointed toward a location that would give a clear view of the aircraft. The only private tape released DID show a part of an aircraft of the right size and speed headed for the Pentagon. Stop whining.
	__________________ No civilization ever collapsed because the poor had too much to eat.

4th January 2012, 04:21 PM	#129
BasqueArch Graduate Poster Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Whispering Glades, Fredonia Posts: 1,376	Originally Posted by Clayton Moore I must have missed that. All of the 85 videos are available? Link(s) please. The CIA asked us not to show them to you. Sorry.
	__________________ "If the true believers keep chanting their prayers when facing the enemy, their faith will save them."-LSSBB "The object of life is not to be on the side of the majority, but to escape finding oneself in the ranks of the insane. " - Marcus Aurelius A Truther is a True Believer convinced by lies. You can lead a truther to facts but you can't reason someone out of a thing they weren't reasoned into.- modified Twain or Swift

4th January 2012, 06:14 PM	#130
Clayton Moore Philosopher Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 6,196	Originally Posted by leftysergeant please present proof that more than ten of them were actually Pentagon-related and not private property. If they were not government property, the government cannot release them under any circumstances if they contain no evidence used in a criminal trial. You twoofers are not entritled to look at the survielance tapes from the entrance of a hotel if the camera was not pointed toward a location that would give a clear view of the aircraft. The only private tape released DID show a part of an aircraft of the right size and speed headed for the Pentagon. Stop whining. Stop bsing.
	__________________ Shitat Matzliach is why the Holohoax works. The same neoconservative scum who engineered 9/11 and got the US into two wars want American troops to sacrifice their lives in Syria and Iran. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lhc7M...Mc4eb2TClVRQws http://rememberbuilding7.org/10/#aevideo http://www2.ae911truth.org/actionale...rBuilding7.php

4th January 2012, 07:57 PM	#131
triforcharity Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: The South! Posts: 12,236	Um, which part are you claiming is BS?
	__________________ "The horse has been led to the water, the horse is in fact standing up to its knees in the water, but the horse is telling you in a loud voice that there's no water to be had....he's still so very thirsty!" ~alienentity

4th January 2012, 07:57 PM	#132
sheeplesnshills Illuminator Join Date: Mar 2010 Posts: 3,706	Originally Posted by Clayton Moore Stop bsing. another Clayton classic!

4th January 2012, 08:33 PM	#133
Clayton Moore Philosopher Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 6,196	Originally Posted by triforcharity Um, which part are you claiming is BS? Originally Posted by leftysergeant View Post Quote: please present proof that more than ten of them were actually Pentagon-related and not private property. If they were not government property, the government cannot release them under any circumstances if they contain no evidence used in a criminal trial. You twoofers are not entritled to look at the survielance tapes from the entrance of a hotel if the camera was not pointed toward a location that would give a clear view of the aircraft. The only private tape released DID show a part of an aircraft of the right size and speed headed for the Pentagon. the government cannot release them under any circumstances The only private tape released please present proof that more than ten of them were actually Pentagon-related and not private property. They were confiscated. They were confiscated. Released? You must mean returned. If they were returned the owners would sell them for hundreds of thousands of dollars.
	__________________ Shitat Matzliach is why the Holohoax works. The same neoconservative scum who engineered 9/11 and got the US into two wars want American troops to sacrifice their lives in Syria and Iran. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lhc7M...Mc4eb2TClVRQws http://rememberbuilding7.org/10/#aevideo http://www2.ae911truth.org/actionale...rBuilding7.php

4th January 2012, 09:04 PM	#134
triforcharity Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: The South! Posts: 12,236	Why would the owners sells them (tapes that showed nothing) for hundreds of thousands of dollars?
	__________________ "The horse has been led to the water, the horse is in fact standing up to its knees in the water, but the horse is telling you in a loud voice that there's no water to be had....he's still so very thirsty!" ~alienentity

4th January 2012, 09:16 PM	#135
Clayton Moore Philosopher Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 6,196	Originally Posted by triforcharity Why would the owners sells them (tapes that showed nothing) for hundreds of thousands of dollars? A better question would be Why haven't the videos been returned to their owners?
	__________________ Shitat Matzliach is why the Holohoax works. The same neoconservative scum who engineered 9/11 and got the US into two wars want American troops to sacrifice their lives in Syria and Iran. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lhc7M...Mc4eb2TClVRQws http://rememberbuilding7.org/10/#aevideo http://www2.ae911truth.org/actionale...rBuilding7.php

4th January 2012, 09:37 PM	#136
Kid Eager Illuminator Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Australia Posts: 3,511	Originally Posted by Clayton Moore A better question would be Why haven't the videos been returned to their owners? Are you claiming that the videos haven't been returned to their owners?
	__________________ What do Narwhals, Magnets and Apollo 13 have in common? Think about it....

4th January 2012, 09:38 PM	#137
Cl1mh4224rd Philosopher Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Pennsylvania, USA Posts: 6,618	Originally Posted by Clayton Moore Why haven't the videos been returned to their owners? You're putting the cart before the horse. Whose to say that they haven't? I'm not sure that's something that would warrant a public announcement. I've read a number of articles over the years about the FBI confiscating servers and various other computer hardware from individuals or companies, but very rarely have I seen a follow-up article stating that those items had been returned.
	Last edited by Cl1mh4224rd; 4th January 2012 at 09:44 PM.

4th January 2012, 09:52 PM	#138
Clayton Moore Philosopher Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 6,196	Originally Posted by Kid Eager Are you claiming that the videos haven't been returned to their owners? Yup. Can't fool you.
	__________________ Shitat Matzliach is why the Holohoax works. The same neoconservative scum who engineered 9/11 and got the US into two wars want American troops to sacrifice their lives in Syria and Iran. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lhc7M...Mc4eb2TClVRQws http://rememberbuilding7.org/10/#aevideo http://www2.ae911truth.org/actionale...rBuilding7.php

4th January 2012, 09:54 PM	#139
Clayton Moore Philosopher Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 6,196	Originally Posted by Cl1mh4224rd You're putting the cart before the horse. Whose to say that they haven't? I'm not sure that's something that would warrant a public announcement. I've read a number of articles over the years about the FBI confiscating servers and various other computer hardware from individuals or companies, but very rarely have I seen a follow-up article stating that those items had been returned. Good grief. It was associated with 9/11.
	__________________ Shitat Matzliach is why the Holohoax works. The same neoconservative scum who engineered 9/11 and got the US into two wars want American troops to sacrifice their lives in Syria and Iran. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lhc7M...Mc4eb2TClVRQws http://rememberbuilding7.org/10/#aevideo http://www2.ae911truth.org/actionale...rBuilding7.php

4th January 2012, 10:20 PM	#140
Redtail Philosopher Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 9,304	Originally Posted by Clayton Moore Good grief. It was associated with 9/11. And how many truth seekers have contacted the cameras' owners to see if they had gotten the tapes back?
Redtail Philosopher Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 9,304	__________________ AVENGERS!!!.. Turn off the dark!

4th January 2012, 10:41 PM	#141
Ivan Kminek Muse Join Date: Jun 2011 Location: Czech Republic Posts: 821	Ergh... I have read a part of "relevant" threads on Letsrollforums.com and I am wordless. Instead, I would like to cite "our" truther Miragememories, who wrote there: "Miragememories Reader Join Date: 4 Jan 2008 Posts: 3 Threads: 0 Thanked 1 Time in 1 Post "Re: 9/11 Jumpers Video's - Observations & Critical Thinking ________________________________________ How sick. To suggest that on 9/11, those poor people trapped in the Towers above the impact zones, were not forced by the desperateness of their situation, to leap to their deaths. How unfeeling. Incredible. Makes me truly sick to my stomach. MM" Thanks, MM.
	Last edited by Ivan Kminek; 4th January 2012 at 10:43 PM.

4th January 2012, 11:20 PM	#142
Clayton Moore Philosopher Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 6,196	Originally Posted by Redtail And how many truth seekers have contacted the cameras' owners to see if they had gotten the tapes back? Gee. I thought that was the MSMs job.
	__________________ Shitat Matzliach is why the Holohoax works. The same neoconservative scum who engineered 9/11 and got the US into two wars want American troops to sacrifice their lives in Syria and Iran. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lhc7M...Mc4eb2TClVRQws http://rememberbuilding7.org/10/#aevideo http://www2.ae911truth.org/actionale...rBuilding7.php

5th January 2012, 12:10 AM	#143
Kid Eager Illuminator Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: Australia Posts: 3,511	Originally Posted by Clayton Moore Yup. Can't fool you. Excellent - we're making progress. Why are you making that assertion?
	__________________ What do Narwhals, Magnets and Apollo 13 have in common? Think about it....

5th January 2012, 12:38 AM	#144
TSR Do you know what this notorious criminal did? Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 4,788	Originally Posted by Clayton Moore Gee. I thought that was the MSMs job. . The MSMs job is to sell ads. "Videos returned, show nothing" is of interest to no one but twoofer idiots who will then claim "forgery!" anyway. .
	__________________ My apologies once again for not being allowed to use the obvious shorthand term for a person who knowingly posts untruths. Apparently someone finds that term uncivil, demonstrated and deserved as it is. . "My family is not my weakness, Max. It's my strength." Vince Faraday aka The Cape

5th January 2012, 12:45 AM	#145
Clayton Moore Philosopher Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 6,196	Originally Posted by TSR . The MSMs job is to sell ads. "Videos returned, show nothing" is of interest to no one but twoofer idiots who will then claim "forgery!" anyway. . You're saying the NIST worshiping morons believe TV news shows are figments of my imagination?
	__________________ Shitat Matzliach is why the Holohoax works. The same neoconservative scum who engineered 9/11 and got the US into two wars want American troops to sacrifice their lives in Syria and Iran. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lhc7M...Mc4eb2TClVRQws http://rememberbuilding7.org/10/#aevideo http://www2.ae911truth.org/actionale...rBuilding7.php

5th January 2012, 01:09 AM	#146
Oystein Philosopher Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Germany Posts: 9,809	Originally Posted by Clayton Moore You're saying the NIST worshiping morons believe TV news shows are figments of my imagination? Can you us point to any particular such person? I think in order for this to not be a figment of your imagination you'd have to present us with at least one actual NIST worshiping moron who actually believes the particular TV news piece that you are refering to!

5th January 2012, 01:17 AM	#147
Clayton Moore Philosopher Join Date: Apr 2008 Posts: 6,196	Originally Posted by Oystein Can you us point to any particular such person? I think in order for this to not be a figment of your imagination you'd have to present us with at least one actual NIST worshiping moron who actually believes the particular TV news piece that you are refering to! No. Reread my post.
	__________________ Shitat Matzliach is why the Holohoax works. The same neoconservative scum who engineered 9/11 and got the US into two wars want American troops to sacrifice their lives in Syria and Iran. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lhc7M...Mc4eb2TClVRQws http://rememberbuilding7.org/10/#aevideo http://www2.ae911truth.org/actionale...rBuilding7.php

5th January 2012, 01:46 AM	#148
TSR Do you know what this notorious criminal did? Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 4,788	Originally Posted by Clayton Moore You're saying the NIST worshiping morons believe TV news shows are figments of my imagination? . No, I'm saying only morons believe that NIST is worshipped, unless you can produce something objective to support it. You never will, since by your own admission you do not supply sources. And so it amuzes me to simply point and laugh at your inane ramblings. .
	__________________ My apologies once again for not being allowed to use the obvious shorthand term for a person who knowingly posts untruths. Apparently someone finds that term uncivil, demonstrated and deserved as it is. . "My family is not my weakness, Max. It's my strength." Vince Faraday aka The Cape Last edited by TSR; 5th January 2012 at 03:43 AM.

5th January 2012, 02:03 AM	#149
Oystein Philosopher Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Germany Posts: 9,809	Originally Posted by Clayton Moore No. Reread my post. Which post? You wrote several. But, without any actual persons that actually fit your description "NIST worshiping morons believe TV news shows", the answer to your question "...are figments of my imagination?" seems to a firm yes, they are figments of your imagination.

5th January 2012, 02:24 AM	#150
leftysergeant Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Spanaway WA Posts: 18,613	The people from whom any tape with a worthwhile image was taken would already be demanding that the tapes be returned. They haven't. The tapes that you seek do not exist. They would have been very valuable at the Mousaui trial. BTW, some people may be totalling the tapes from the Pentagon area with the tapes from the airports from which the planes werre hijacked.
	__________________ No civilization ever collapsed because the poor had too much to eat.

5th January 2012, 02:27 AM	#151
Oystein Philosopher Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Germany Posts: 9,809	lefty, quite frankly: you are speculating. That ain't worth much.

5th January 2012, 06:59 AM	#152
Myriad Hyperthetical Moderator Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 8,205	Since there is no reason to believe that every recording security camera in the area was pointed at the Pentagon wall, there certainly must be some recordings that do not show that area at all. Let's consider a hypothetical example of such a recording. It's a recording from a security camera outside an emergency exit opening onto a service alley from an apartment building. The exit is locked from the outside and alarmed, so it's not used by anyone under normal circumstances. The recording shows no movement anywhere in the camera's field of view for its entire length, except for a tiny and gradual shift in the shadow positions as the earth turns. A small portion of the Pentagon a mile or so away would have been visible out the end of the alley from where the camera was mounted, if the camera had been pointed that way, but it wasn't because it was pointed at the emergency exit door instead. However, the authorities confirm that the recording does cover the exact time the plane crashed into the Pentagon a mile or so away. The recording -- the original VHS tape itself -- is posted for sale on Ebay. How much would you bid for it? Respectfully, Myriad
	__________________ The cosmos is a vast Loom, with time the warp and space the weft. We are all fruit of the Loom, unaware.

5th January 2012, 07:07 AM	#153
Oystein Philosopher Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Germany Posts: 9,809	Originally Posted by Myriad ... The recording -- the original VHS tape itself -- is posted for sale on Ebay. How much would you bid for it? Respectfully, Myriad Uh-oh - asking truthers to put their money where their mouth is - not a good idea if you want constructive replies! (I have dared truthers several times to bet money on specific proposals; none ever bit. It is interesting now to see Shure and, apparently, some of his buddies, pledge money to support Chris Mohr's effort to have red-gray WTC dust chips competently investigated. Shure is a CIT / P4T supporter, a group that Richard Gage recently disavowed. No doubt they put their money now on a debunker project only to get even with rival truthers!)

5th January 2012, 08:43 AM	#154
pgimeno Graduate Poster Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Spain Posts: 1,302	Originally Posted by carlitos There weren't really 85 videos at the Pentagon. Lots are here. Discussion here. Best summary here. Bump for Clayton Moore (and the rest). That should have settled it. I fail to understand why it hasn't. The videos that the FBI confiscated did not represent the Pentagon at the time of the crash. The few that were are already on YouTube (the two Pentagon security cameras, CITGO, DoubleTree and the one in the DEA HQ that wasn't filming there but turned that way right after the crash).
	__________________ Ask questions. Demand answers. But be prepared to accept the answers, or don't ask questions in the first place.

5th January 2012, 08:48 AM	#155
carlitos "más divertido" Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 11,549	Originally Posted by pgimeno Bump for Clayton Moore (and the rest). That should have settled it. I fail to understand why it hasn't. The videos that the FBI confiscated did not represent the Pentagon at the time of the crash. The few that were are already on YouTube (the two Pentagon security cameras, CITGO, DoubleTree and the one in the DEA HQ that wasn't filming there but turned that way right after the crash). Clayton isn't interested in facts or truth, which is why he ignored that, preferring sniping and vague innuendo. But, you're right. A response like mine above is all these trolls ever deserve, if that.