JREF Homepage Swift Blog Events Calendar $1 Million Paranormal Challenge The Amaz!ng Meeting Useful Links Support Us
James Randi Educational Foundation JREF Forum
Forum Index Register Members List Events Mark Forums Read Help

Go Back   JREF Forum » General Topics » Conspiracy Theories
Click Here To Donate

Notices


Welcome to the JREF Forum, where we discuss skepticism, critical thinking, the paranormal and science in a friendly but lively way. You are currently viewing the forum as a guest, which means you are missing out on discussing matters that are of interest to you. Please consider registering so you can gain full use of the forum features and interact with other Members. Registration is simple, fast and free! Click here to register today.

Reply
Old 16th April 2012, 04:16 AM   #361
The Dark Lord
Suspended
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 1,860
So then it is a good thing that monetary policy is set by the Fed rather than politicians. Glad we got that cleared up.
The Dark Lord is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 16th April 2012, 04:22 AM   #362
realpaladin
Master Poster
 
realpaladin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: I live not very often where my home is.
Posts: 2,339
Originally Posted by SpringHallConvert View Post
Sure, under a corrupt, corporate-controlled government like we currently have, but not under an honest government truly working in the best interests of the people it represents.

In a healthy, growing economy with normal population increases, the supply of money would need to expand in tandem with the expansion of available goods and services. This expansion of the money supply could be spent right into the economy by the government without creating any inflation whatsoever.
Your government has almost zilch to say about how other nations value your currency.

But besides that... now we get to the real core of the thing...

Without the people 'breeding' as you so flatteringly said, this scheme won't work. And I am not mentioning a Malthusian trap for the 'continued growth scheme'.

And then, the next thing that comes up is the longevity (or do you want to discard older people or deny them healthcare after supporting that growth).
At some point the people that can not produce will outnumber the people that can.

And the resources for creating goods is also a fun matter: the US will either have to be cheaper to have fun with exporting goods (i.e. accept a ridiculous inflation) or it will have to trade and play nice with the others to keep up the current level of living.
And they won't play nice if the US is just running the printing mills.

So, again, what you are proposing is nothing but 'a way to ruin, but fast and furious'.
__________________
"All is needed (and it is essential to my definitions) is to understand the actuality beyond the description, for example: Nothing is actually" - Doron Shadmi
"But this means you actually have nothing." - Realpaladin
---
Doron Shadmi's errors (9feb14): http://forums.randi.org/showpost.php...postcount=3584
realpaladin is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 16th April 2012, 04:23 AM   #363
SpringHallConvert
Banned
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 1,272
Originally Posted by The Dark Lord View Post
So then it is a good thing that monetary policy is set by the Fed rather than politicians.
No, not really. You haven't made a convincing argument for having a private banking cartel in control of the nation's monetary policy. When you do, let me know.
SpringHallConvert is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 16th April 2012, 04:29 AM   #364
SpringHallConvert
Banned
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 1,272
Originally Posted by realpaladin View Post
Without the people 'breeding' as you so flatteringly said, this scheme won't work.
False, as economic growth is not necessarily dependent on population growth. In fact, an economy can grow even with a falling population if increases in productivity outpace decreases in population.

Quote:
And then, the next thing that comes up is the longevity (or do you want to discard older people or deny them healthcare after supporting that growth). At some point the people that can not produce will outnumber the people that can.
Why would the number of non-producers outgrow the number of producers? What are you basing this claim on?

Quote:
And the resources for creating goods is also a fun matter: the US will either have to be cheaper to have fun with exporting goods (i.e. accept a ridiculous inflation) or it will have to trade and play nice with the others to keep up the current level of living.
And they won't play nice if the US is just running the printing mills.
I can't figure out what you are trying to say here. "The U.S. will either have to be cheaper to have fun with exporting goods"? What?

Quote:
So, again, what you are proposing is nothing but 'a way to ruin, but fast and furious'.
I'm not convinced you have any idea what you are even trying to say. I know I don't.
SpringHallConvert is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 16th April 2012, 04:35 AM   #365
The Dark Lord
Suspended
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 1,860
Originally Posted by SpringHallConvert View Post
No, not really. You haven't made a convincing argument for having a private banking cartel in control of the nation's monetary policy. When you do, let me know.
First, I don't think that a "private banking cartel" sets the monetary policy. You do. And you have been completely unable to support this.

Second you agreed that the Federal Reserve system is better than having our politicians set monetary policy. Well, unless you think that making the dollar worthless is a better system.
The Dark Lord is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 16th April 2012, 04:35 AM   #366
jargon buster
Banned
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Posts: 4,776
Quote:
I'm not convinced you have any idea what you are even trying to say. I know I don't.
Maybe a stundie?
jargon buster is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 16th April 2012, 04:37 AM   #367
Tomtomkent
Philosopher
 
Tomtomkent's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Kent, United Kingdom
Posts: 6,343
Originally Posted by SpringHallConvert View Post
No, not really. You haven't made a convincing argument for having a private banking cartel in control of the nation's monetary policy. When you do, let me know.
That might be because the case made has nothing to do with your fantasy of a cartel being in control of policy.

If on the other hand you look at the case made, for policy dictating how much has to be borrowed, regardless of source, the answer is yes.

Exactly why he should make a good case for your "cartel" and not forthe actual practice of the Fed is beyond me.
__________________
@tomhodden

This Christmas THERE WILL BE TROUBLE: http://www.amazon.co.uk/A-Little-Tro...-Hodden-ebook/
Tomtomkent is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 16th April 2012, 04:51 AM   #368
Dancing David
Penultimate Amazing
 
Dancing David's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Central Illinois
Posts: 35,738
Originally Posted by Craig4 View Post
How gold's value not abstract?
Well it makes a great sandwich.
__________________
I suspect you are a sandwich, metaphorically speaking. -Donn
And a shot rang out. Now Space is doing time... -Ben Burch
You built the toilet - don't complain when people crap in it. _Kid Eager
Never underestimate the power of the Random Number God. More of evolutionary history is His doing than people think. - Dinwar
Dancing David is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 16th April 2012, 04:53 AM   #369
Dancing David
Penultimate Amazing
 
Dancing David's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Central Illinois
Posts: 35,738
Originally Posted by SpringHallConvert View Post
Total nonsense.
Why is gold any more meaningful than a bank note?

It is not vegetable oil or some other consumable, it only has an arbitrary value assigned by desire.
__________________
I suspect you are a sandwich, metaphorically speaking. -Donn
And a shot rang out. Now Space is doing time... -Ben Burch
You built the toilet - don't complain when people crap in it. _Kid Eager
Never underestimate the power of the Random Number God. More of evolutionary history is His doing than people think. - Dinwar
Dancing David is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 16th April 2012, 04:58 AM   #370
Dancing David
Penultimate Amazing
 
Dancing David's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Central Illinois
Posts: 35,738
Originally Posted by SpringHallConvert View Post
False, the evidence is the current system itself, which is clearly not representing the interests of the American people. Roosevelt's quote just bears this out.
Um, I doubt anyone here has made that claim.
__________________
I suspect you are a sandwich, metaphorically speaking. -Donn
And a shot rang out. Now Space is doing time... -Ben Burch
You built the toilet - don't complain when people crap in it. _Kid Eager
Never underestimate the power of the Random Number God. More of evolutionary history is His doing than people think. - Dinwar
Dancing David is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 16th April 2012, 07:25 AM   #371
Mudcat
Man of a Thousand Memes
 
Mudcat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2011
Posts: 4,827
Originally Posted by SpringHallConvert View Post
Now that's the understatement of the week.



Straw man. I never claimed they were, but they still qualified as "concentration camps" based on the terminology the British used to describe them during the Second Boer War.

Anyway you slice it, Roosevelt put innocent AMERICAN citizens in internment/concentration camps without due process or regard for their human rights. As such, he was a scumbag president.
Missing the point as usual. Concentration camps is a term coined by the British that has a specific definition... that Internment Camps (which has it's own definition) does not share.

To continue the previous analogy, Internment Camps are closer to jay walking than genocide on the moral scale.
__________________
The major problem with Ocham's Razor is that while the simplest answer may be the best answer that doesn't make it the only answer or the right one.


Kopji: A perfect utopia where everyone follows the rules is more like a hell than a heaven.
Mudcat is online now   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 16th April 2012, 09:22 AM   #372
Tomtomkent
Philosopher
 
Tomtomkent's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Kent, United Kingdom
Posts: 6,343
Originally Posted by Mudcat View Post
Missing the point as usual. Concentration camps is a term coined by the British that has a specific definition... that Internment Camps (which has it's own definition) does not share.

To continue the previous analogy, Internment Camps are closer to jay walking than genocide on the moral scale.
The two meanings are close, and are often conflabulated, but are different. Especially in the legal terms of the Geneva conventions (third and fourth I think). The difference is often overlooked, but important, especially when making a claim that the two are identical.

The most pertinent example would be the conditions in the camps where Jewish settlers were held while the state of Israel was being created, and the conditions of the Nazi concentration camps (that did more than anything else to widen the gap between the meanings). Neither are nice, neither should be hoped for, but they are in different shades of immorality.
__________________
@tomhodden

This Christmas THERE WILL BE TROUBLE: http://www.amazon.co.uk/A-Little-Tro...-Hodden-ebook/
Tomtomkent is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 16th April 2012, 09:47 AM   #373
realpaladin
Master Poster
 
realpaladin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: I live not very often where my home is.
Posts: 2,339
Originally Posted by SpringHallConvert

False, as economic growth is not necessarily dependent on population growth. In fact, an economy can grow even with a falling population if increases in productivity outpace decreases in population.

Why would the number of non-producers outgrow the number of producers? What are you basing this claim on?

I can't figure out what you are trying to say here. "The U.S. will either have to be cheaper to have fun with exporting goods"? What?

I'm not convinced you have any idea what you are even trying to say. I know I don't.
Afaik it was you that mentioned population growth for a healthy economy.

The number of non-producers outgrowing the producers is called the 'urn' model in demographics and that is what happens when the population does not produce enough offspring.
I am basing that on generic understanding of demographics and the CIA World factbook.

I guess you understand that the economic growth needs to both compensate for the longevity (non producing people, like pensioners, who have nothing to barter, only accumulated wealth) and for the decrease in producers.

As you seem to be unable to understand the fact that the US is not an economic island, let me rephrase it:

If the US starts printing enough cash to keep it's own economy running, the value of the dollar outside the US decreases.

This makes production of a lot of products too expensive for the US to have them outsourced in, let's say, China.

But to produce a lot of these products within the US, it would need to buy the raw materials from, let's say, China.

But because the dollar then is not solid in value, those prices would become prohibitively high, therefore closing off that avenue.

As for the exporting... if the US wants to compete in exporting enough to make up for the loss in income because of the failing dollar, it needs to export other goods or labour.
Since most labour and other goods are available quite cheap elsewhere, the average US employee needs to accept a lower income, or it will not be possible to compete.

Having spelled all that out, I see funny contradictions in what you claim, as well as a lack of decent research.

But have at it kiddo.
__________________
"All is needed (and it is essential to my definitions) is to understand the actuality beyond the description, for example: Nothing is actually" - Doron Shadmi
"But this means you actually have nothing." - Realpaladin
---
Doron Shadmi's errors (9feb14): http://forums.randi.org/showpost.php...postcount=3584
realpaladin is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 16th April 2012, 10:49 AM   #374
jaydeehess
Penultimate Amazing
 
jaydeehess's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: I beedunk 40 miles from the border
Posts: 13,210
Our hypothesis is that the world is governed as advertised . From that it would follow that there is no entity such as you describe and with no such entity then there cannot be confirming evidence of that nonexistance(for another eg. its similar to proving you are not an ET living in a human body.)

Your position that such an entity does exist would require that evidence of said oligarchy also exists.

You claim that such an all powerful entity would be able to manipulate all information such that proof of its existance will not be found and can only be implied by examining the world around us.
Originally Posted by jaydeehess View Post
Once again you demonstrate your complete inability to grasp the concept of null hypothesis.
................
Really, which position sounds 'religious'
no all powerfull invisible rulers? (our position)
OR
an all powerful invisible pantheon of such rulers? (your position)

Perhaps the top guy is named "Zeus"?
Originally Posted by SpringHallConvert View Post
This is an interesting statement. The informational gatekeepers in the government and media have marketed a concept of how the world works to you and you've totally bought into it. They've effectively sold you a type of reality - the current paradigm under which we live - which you believe is true. You even acknowledge this by characterizing this marketing campaign as a form of advertising.

You're a mind control victim and you don't even know it. Maybe you do subconsciously, which is why you used the word 'advertised' the way you did, but not a conscious level.
Once again you demonstrate your complete inability to grasp the concept of null hypothesis

Shall it be explained yet again? I certainly tire of trying to have you grasp this relatively simple concept of science and logic.


You claim we are mind controlled slaves and that you know-the-truth.
You claim a cadre of powerful people form an oligarchy that rules the world unseen, yet you seem completely incapable of providing any evidence of the state of the world that you believe is 'the truth'.


Instead you claim that the evidence is all around us and can be therefore easily implied as 'the truth'.

That sounds so very familiar. I have been told that the existance of God is also implied by the evidence all around us.

What sets you aparrt from such true believers SHC? What sets your belief apart from the style of the religious? What can you provide in way of evidence that your belief should in fact be shared by those here?

What makes your concept of how the world works compelling to you? What marketing have you bought into? What events, concepts and evidence was used in that marketing? Or did you arrive at this yourself? Was it an epiphany of your own? Something must have convinced you that the world did not function the way it is accepted as functioning by the ast majority, what were they?

I have missed a few pages of this thread, and have little time right now to do so. If you have supplied such evidence then perhaps you'd care to link me to said post, or perhaps someone else can do so for me since you rarely, if ever, actually respond to requests or questions.

Last edited by jaydeehess; 16th April 2012 at 10:55 AM.
jaydeehess is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 16th April 2012, 01:26 PM   #375
SpringHallConvert
Banned
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 1,272
Originally Posted by The Dark Lord View Post
First, I don't think that a "private banking cartel" sets the monetary policy.
Then you need to support this. Where's your evidence?

Quote:
Second you agreed that the Federal Reserve system is better than having our politicians set monetary policy.
False. Link?

Quote:
Well, unless you think that making the dollar worthless is a better system.
That's what the Federal Reserve has been doing ever since 1913 - making the dollar worthless. A 1913 U.S. dollar has lost roughly 95% of its value since then.
SpringHallConvert is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 16th April 2012, 01:29 PM   #376
Tomtomkent
Philosopher
 
Tomtomkent's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Kent, United Kingdom
Posts: 6,343
Originally Posted by SpringHallConvert View Post
Then you need to support this.
No. The null stands there is no cartel. You have to support the assertion there is an organised cartel. The burden of proof is yours.
__________________
@tomhodden

This Christmas THERE WILL BE TROUBLE: http://www.amazon.co.uk/A-Little-Tro...-Hodden-ebook/
Tomtomkent is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 16th April 2012, 01:32 PM   #377
SpringHallConvert
Banned
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 1,272
Originally Posted by Dancing David View Post
Why is gold any more meaningful than a bank note?

It is not vegetable oil or some other consumable, it only has an arbitrary value assigned by desire.
For one thing, gold has a limited supply that doesn't quickly change, which mirrors the economy and the supply of goods and services. It can't be printed up and counterfeited and expanded just by pushing a button on a printing press. Gold represents human labor, as each ounce, on average, requires considerable labor to extract from the ground. Gold is consistent as money, and its use as money goes back thousands of years.

Why is interest bearing debt-money superior?
SpringHallConvert is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 16th April 2012, 01:34 PM   #378
SpringHallConvert
Banned
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 1,272
Originally Posted by Tomtomkent View Post
No. The null stands there is no cartel. You have to support the assertion there is an organised cartel. The burden of proof is yours.
False. Since the Federal Reserve represents a cartel of private banks, with Federal Reserve stock being owned by member private banks, you need to show they are not dictating monetary policy. Prove it.
SpringHallConvert is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 16th April 2012, 01:37 PM   #379
DGM
Skeptic not Atheist
 
DGM's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: West of Northshore MA
Posts: 16,969
Originally Posted by SpringHallConvert View Post
False. Since the Federal Reserve represents a cartel of private banks, with Federal Reserve stock being owned by member private banks, you need to show they are not dictating monetary policy. Prove it.
Prove you don't understand how the Federal Reserve works? You already have.
__________________
Join the team, Show us what your machine can do (or just contribute to a good cause)Join the JREF Folders ! Team 13232

"Remember that the goal of conspiracy rhetoric is to bog down the discussion, not to make progress toward a solution" Jay Windley

Last edited by DGM; 16th April 2012 at 01:40 PM.
DGM is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 16th April 2012, 01:38 PM   #380
Hans
Illuminator
 
Hans's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: NW United States
Posts: 3,516
Originally Posted by Tomtomkent View Post
No. The null stands there is no cartel. You have to support the assertion there is an organised cartel. The burden of proof is yours.
I guess that the troll will not provide information and say you have to prove what you say....so he can hand wave it away

lol
Hans is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 16th April 2012, 01:49 PM   #381
SpringHallConvert
Banned
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 1,272
Looks like the government truthers are having a hard time defending their counterfeit debt-money system.
SpringHallConvert is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 16th April 2012, 01:50 PM   #382
Tomtomkent
Philosopher
 
Tomtomkent's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Kent, United Kingdom
Posts: 6,343
Originally Posted by SpringHallConvert View Post
False. Since the Federal Reserve represents a cartel of private banks, with Federal Reserve stock being owned by member private banks, you need to show they are not dictating monetary policy. Prove it.
Untill you prove the highlighted part there is no reason to assume it is so. How do you not get this? There is a distinction between stock being owned by private banks (if that is how you choose to simplify it) and those banks being an organised cartel. You have not shown there is an organised cartel. Then the assumption is not that they are dictating policy, the null would be: "Cartel X buys stock the same way they buy any other stock for profit". You would have to show there was a link between this stock being bought and the direction of policy to prove your assertion that the cartel influences policy through ownership of stock.

The burden of proof is STILL yours.
__________________
@tomhodden

This Christmas THERE WILL BE TROUBLE: http://www.amazon.co.uk/A-Little-Tro...-Hodden-ebook/
Tomtomkent is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 16th April 2012, 01:51 PM   #383
DGM
Skeptic not Atheist
 
DGM's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: West of Northshore MA
Posts: 16,969
Originally Posted by SpringHallConvert View Post
Looks like the government truthers are having a hard time defending their counterfeit debt-money system.
Maybe to you.
__________________
Join the team, Show us what your machine can do (or just contribute to a good cause)Join the JREF Folders ! Team 13232

"Remember that the goal of conspiracy rhetoric is to bog down the discussion, not to make progress toward a solution" Jay Windley
DGM is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 16th April 2012, 01:51 PM   #384
Tomtomkent
Philosopher
 
Tomtomkent's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2010
Location: Kent, United Kingdom
Posts: 6,343
Originally Posted by SpringHallConvert View Post
Looks like the government truthers are having a hard time defending their counterfeit debt-money system.
No. It looks like you are having a hard time proving your assertions.
__________________
@tomhodden

This Christmas THERE WILL BE TROUBLE: http://www.amazon.co.uk/A-Little-Tro...-Hodden-ebook/
Tomtomkent is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 16th April 2012, 01:54 PM   #385
Hans
Illuminator
 
Hans's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: NW United States
Posts: 3,516
Originally Posted by Tomtomkent View Post
No. It looks like you are having a hard time proving your assertions.
Ah but that isn't his point, his real point is to dismiss anything you say and tell you are [standard troll insult x], etc ad nauseum - haven't you notice this pattern yet?
Hans is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 16th April 2012, 01:58 PM   #386
SpringHallConvert
Banned
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 1,272
Originally Posted by Tomtomkent View Post
The burden of proof is STILL yours.
Nope, it's yours. Prove that the private banks who own the stock of the Federal Reserve aren't dictating monetary policy for the whole country, since this is what you believe.

Prove it.
SpringHallConvert is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 16th April 2012, 02:01 PM   #387
carlitos
"más divertido"
 
carlitos's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 13,310
This secret oligarchy operates very much like mysticism, religion and other paranormal stuff. It only leaves vague, non-testable evidence of its existence, and that evidence has to be inferred and interpreted by those with special insight and knowledge, not mere mortals. Maybe it's quantum?
carlitos is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 16th April 2012, 02:02 PM   #388
DGM
Skeptic not Atheist
 
DGM's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: West of Northshore MA
Posts: 16,969
Originally Posted by SpringHallConvert View Post
Nope, it's yours. Prove that the private banks who own the stock of the Federal Reserve aren't dictating monetary policy for the whole country, since this is what you believe.

Prove it.
Nope. You claim private banks own the stock of the Federal Reserve are dictating monetary policy for the whole country.

Prove it.
__________________
Join the team, Show us what your machine can do (or just contribute to a good cause)Join the JREF Folders ! Team 13232

"Remember that the goal of conspiracy rhetoric is to bog down the discussion, not to make progress toward a solution" Jay Windley
DGM is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 16th April 2012, 02:08 PM   #389
OneTime
Scholar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 64
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ol3mEe8TH7w

At 7:40 in the linked video Alan Greenspan states that the fed is indapendant and thus doesn't answer to congress.

Another way to prove that the fed is private is to check the phone book and see them listed under private as opposed to other government agencies.
OneTime is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 16th April 2012, 02:09 PM   #390
SpringHallConvert
Banned
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 1,272
Originally Posted by DGM View Post
Nope. You claim private banks own the stock of the Federal Reserve are dictating monetary policy for the whole country.

Prove it.
Nope. Don't need to, since you can't prove the Federal Reserve works the way you think it works.

Denied.
SpringHallConvert is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 16th April 2012, 02:10 PM   #391
carlitos
"más divertido"
 
carlitos's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 13,310
Not sure about that phone book method. We had another poster here who "proved" that the US government was secretly a corporation because they had a business telephone number.
carlitos is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 16th April 2012, 02:11 PM   #392
DGM
Skeptic not Atheist
 
DGM's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: West of Northshore MA
Posts: 16,969
Originally Posted by SpringHallConvert View Post
Nope. Don't need to, since you can't prove the Federal Reserve works the way you think it works.

Denied.
Already did. You just chose not to accept using criteria you refuse to disclose. You admit this, right?

Denial denied!
__________________
Join the team, Show us what your machine can do (or just contribute to a good cause)Join the JREF Folders ! Team 13232

"Remember that the goal of conspiracy rhetoric is to bog down the discussion, not to make progress toward a solution" Jay Windley
DGM is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 16th April 2012, 02:14 PM   #393
SpringHallConvert
Banned
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 1,272
Originally Posted by OneTime View Post
At 7:40 in the linked video Alan Greenspan states that the fed is indapendant and thus doesn't answer to congress.
But, but, but... The Federal Reserve chairman position is appointed by the president! At least, that's what we are told! That means the president is really the one who dictates monetary policy. No, wait. Since the people vote for the president, that means it's really the people who dictate monetary policy! Yeah, that's it!

Government truth for the win!

Quote:
Another way to prove that the fed is private is to check the phone book and see them listed under private as opposed to other government agencies.
But, but, but... paper money is better than gold-backed money! I heard it on TV!

Last edited by SpringHallConvert; 16th April 2012 at 02:16 PM.
SpringHallConvert is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 16th April 2012, 02:15 PM   #394
SpringHallConvert
Banned
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 1,272
Originally Posted by carlitos View Post
Not sure about that phone book method. We had another poster here who "proved" that the US government was secretly a corporation because they had a business telephone number.
Maybe the U.S. government is secretly a corporation?

It certainly seems to operate like one.
SpringHallConvert is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 16th April 2012, 02:18 PM   #395
DGM
Skeptic not Atheist
 
DGM's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: West of Northshore MA
Posts: 16,969
Originally Posted by SpringHallConvert View Post

But, but, but... paper money is better than gold-backed money! I heard it on TV!
What's gold worth with no economy? Salt would be worth more.(history tells us this)
__________________
Join the team, Show us what your machine can do (or just contribute to a good cause)Join the JREF Folders ! Team 13232

"Remember that the goal of conspiracy rhetoric is to bog down the discussion, not to make progress toward a solution" Jay Windley
DGM is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 16th April 2012, 02:18 PM   #396
OneTime
Scholar
 
Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 64
Originally Posted by SpringHallConvert View Post
But, but, but... The Federal Reserve chairman position is appointed by the president! At least, that's what we are told! That means the president is really the one who dictates monetary policy. No, wait. Since the people vote for the president, that means it's really the people who dictate monetary policy! Yeah, that's it!

Government truth for the win!



But, but, but... paper money is better than gold-backed money! A heard it on TV!
I'm waiting for someone to say ''but prove it' lol.
OneTime is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 16th April 2012, 02:21 PM   #397
DGM
Skeptic not Atheist
 
DGM's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: West of Northshore MA
Posts: 16,969
Originally Posted by OneTime View Post
I'm waiting for someone to say ''but prove it' lol.
Prove what?

__________________
Join the team, Show us what your machine can do (or just contribute to a good cause)Join the JREF Folders ! Team 13232

"Remember that the goal of conspiracy rhetoric is to bog down the discussion, not to make progress toward a solution" Jay Windley
DGM is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 16th April 2012, 02:22 PM   #398
The Dark Lord
Suspended
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 1,860
Originally Posted by SpringHallConvert View Post
Then you need to support this. Where's your evidence?
Still having problems with the concept of the null hypothesis, huh, troll.

Quote:
False. Link?
You are a liar. In this post, you agreed that our politicians would turn the dollar into some worthless currency. And so you agree that the Federal Reserve is better. Unless you want the dollar to be worthless.

Quote:
That's what the Federal Reserve has been doing ever since 1913 - making the dollar worthless. A 1913 U.S. dollar has lost roughly 95% of its value since then.
It doesn't matter what the value is relative to what it was 100 years ago. It matters what it is relative to other currencies. And guess what, the dollar is the dominant currency in the world. And really, you are a *********** moron if you can't keep your money ahead of inflation anyway.
The Dark Lord is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 16th April 2012, 02:24 PM   #399
SpringHallConvert
Banned
 
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 1,272
Originally Posted by DGM View Post
What's gold worth with no economy? Salt would be worth more.(history tells us this)
What's life worth with no air!?!?

OMG! Call the Fed! Tell them we need air-backed currency, quick!
SpringHallConvert is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Old 16th April 2012, 02:24 PM   #400
The Dark Lord
Suspended
 
Join Date: Jan 2012
Posts: 1,860
How does the troll know that the private banks own stock in the regional Federal Reserve banks? Apparently, he is perfectly fine using official sources when he thinks it suits his purposes. But when those same sources explain how monetary policy is actually set, he just ignores it.

Pathetic.
The Dark Lord is offline   Quote this post in a PM   Nominate this post for this month's language award Copy a direct link to this post Reply With Quote Back to Top
Reply

JREF Forum » General Topics » Conspiracy Theories

Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -7. The time now is 06:53 PM.
Powered by vBulletin. Copyright ©2000 - 2014, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
© 2001-2013, James Randi Educational Foundation. All Rights Reserved.

Disclaimer: Messages posted in the Forum are solely the opinion of their authors.