[Split Thread] Is there an underground oligarchy ruling the world? - Page 11

DGM · 16th April 2012, 02:27 PM

Originally Posted by SpringHallConvert

What's life worth with no air!?!?

OMG! Call the Fed! Tell them we need air-backed currency, quick!

Better than gold. You're arguments would have been great in the 19th century.

SpringHallConvert · 16th April 2012, 02:30 PM

Originally Posted by The Dark Lord

Still having problems with the concept of the null hypothesis, huh, troll.

Still having problems proving your vision of how the Fed works, huh, troll.

Quote:

You are a liar. In this post, you agreed that our politicians would turn the dollar into some worthless currency. And so you agree that the Federal Reserve is better. Unless you want the dollar to be worthless.

Where did I state that the Federal Reserve is "better"?

Why are you lying and making stuff up here?

Quote:

It doesn't matter what the value is relative to what it was 100 years ago. It matters what it is relative to other currencies.

Why does it only matter in relation to other currencies? You're basically arguing that, since the rest of the world inflates, we should too.

Why? Who says?

Quote:

And guess what, the dollar is the dominant currency in the world. And really, you are a *********** moron if you can't keep your money ahead of inflation anyway.

Right, the paper dollar is the dominant reserve currency in a world full of other paper, basket case currencies. How impressive!

You government truthbots can't say anything original. It's almost like you are parrots!

The Dark Lord · 16th April 2012, 02:30 PM

Originally Posted by OneTime

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ol3mEe8TH7w

At 7:40 in the linked video Alan Greenspan states that the fed is indapendant and thus doesn't answer to congress.

Another way to prove that the fed is private is to check the phone book and see them listed under private as opposed to other government agencies.

It is true that it is independent and doesn't answer to Congress. That is a good thing because Congress can't manipulate monetary policy to suit their short term goals of being reelected. This doesn't mean that monetary policy is set by a cable of evil bankers though.

carlitos · 16th April 2012, 02:31 PM

Al Gore wants us to trade carbon credits. There are atoms of carbon in the air. Think about it, sheeple.

SpringHallConvert · 16th April 2012, 02:32 PM

Originally Posted by The Dark Lord

How does the troll know that the private banks own stock in the regional Federal Reserve banks? Apparently, he is perfectly fine using official sources when he thinks it suits his purposes. But when those same sources explain how monetary policy is actually set, he just ignores it.

Pathetic.

How does the government truther know that some of his sources aren't a mixture of truth and fiction? After all, the best lies always have a little bit of truth in them.

Maybe the government truthbot doesn't know this.

SpringHallConvert · 16th April 2012, 02:33 PM

Originally Posted by The Dark Lord

This doesn't mean that monetary policy is set by a cable of evil bankers though.

Why not? How do you really know? And why can't you prove what you think you know?

DGM · 16th April 2012, 02:34 PM

Originally Posted by SpringHallConvert

How does the government truther know that some of his sources aren't a mixture of truth and fiction? After all, the best lies always have a little bit of truth in them.

Maybe the government truthbot doesn't know this.

What evidence do you have he is not right?

It keeps coming back to this. What do you use for your information?

SpringHallConvert · 16th April 2012, 02:36 PM

Originally Posted by DGM

What evidence do you have he is not right?

What evidence do you have that he is right?

Quote:

It keeps coming back to this. What do you use for your information?

What do you use for yours?

jaydeehess · 16th April 2012, 02:41 PM

Originally Posted by SpringHallConvert

Looks like the government truthers are having a hard time defending their counterfeit debt-money system.

Actually those that are adressing this derail seem to be doing amuch better job of that than you have managed to do about your take on the OP

Mudcat · 16th April 2012, 02:42 PM

Originally Posted by SpringHallConvert

What do you use for yours?

You are being decidedly unhelpful here. We have the information we have and we share it (you may disagree with it, but that's neither here nor there), but you have some information that you aren't sharing. Share it, already. It could be that missing element that could lead to an 'aha!' moment.

DGM · 16th April 2012, 02:43 PM

Originally Posted by SpringHallConvert

What evidence do you have that he is right?

You have been shown it over and over. Why don't you show you're worth doing it again?

Originally Posted by SpringHallConvert

What do you use for yours?

I have an unlimited number of sources. I'm not restricted.

Who are yours? (I answered you)

The Dark Lord · 16th April 2012, 02:44 PM

Originally Posted by SpringHallConvert

Still having problems proving your vision of how the Fed works, huh, troll.

How the Fed works is spelled out in black in white. If you want to prove it actually operates differently, you prove it. But you can't, can you.

Quote:

Where did I state that the Federal Reserve is "better"?

Why are you lying and making stuff up here?

You agree that politicians would turn the dollar into some worthless currency. So you agree, by default, that the current system is better. Unless you want the dollar to be worthless. I am not sure if you are too stupid to understand this or just too dishonest to admit it. It's a toss up.

Quote:

Why does it only matter in relation to other currencies? You're basically arguing that, since the rest of the world inflates, we should too.

Why? Who says?

Take an economics class.

Quote:

Right, the paper dollar is the dominant reserve currency in a world full of other paper, basket case currencies. How impressive!

And so it is by definition not worthless. Like it would be, as you admitted, if we let politicians be in charge of monetary policy.

The Dark Lord · 16th April 2012, 02:49 PM

Originally Posted by SpringHallConvert

How does the government truther know that some of his sources aren't a mixture of truth and fiction? After all, the best lies always have a little bit of truth in them.

Maybe the government truthbot doesn't know this.

Either the source is credible or it is not. If it is not credible, you don't get to choose which parts to believe based on how well you think it serves your whacked out conspiracy theories. At least if you are honest. Of course, you are not though.

Hans · 16th April 2012, 02:51 PM

Well gentleman have you noticed the pattern?

jaydeehess · 16th April 2012, 02:52 PM

Originally Posted by carlitos

This secret oligarchy operates very much like mysticism, religion and other paranormal stuff. It only leaves vague, non-testable evidence of its existence, and that evidence has to be inferred and interpreted by those with special insight and knowledge, not mere mortals. Maybe it's quantum?

I too have mentioned this. Twice now. However SHC has yet to address it.

Seems he does not care to acknowledge that his beliefs are religious in nature. That is to say that he states that an unseen cadre controls the world. They are so all powerful that they ensure no direct evidence of their existance surfaces and thus it can only be inferred and implied by the indirect method of interpretation of events around us.

The Dark Lord · 16th April 2012, 02:52 PM

Originally Posted by SpringHallConvert

Why not? How do you really know? And why can't you prove what you think you know?

It is is established by sane people standards.

Can you prove that the evil Jew bankers are not actually the lizard people? No? Why not?

OneTime · 16th April 2012, 02:53 PM

Originally Posted by The Dark Lord

It is true that it is independent and doesn't answer to Congress. That is a good thing because Congress can't manipulate monetary policy to suit their short term goals of being reelected. This doesn't mean that monetary policy is set by a cable of evil bankers though.

Politicians aren't elected in the way you think, they're selected by the people who hold the purse strings. But at least we're getting somewhere. Do you realize that politicians have minimal if any power/influence when it comes to decision making? You realize that Obama is just a puppet who takes his orders from back room staff and that it's all just a smoke screen to keep the masses at bay?

DGM · 16th April 2012, 02:54 PM

Originally Posted by Hans

Well gentleman have you noticed the pattern?

Yes. I wonder when it actually qualifies as abuse to respond?

The Dark Lord · 16th April 2012, 02:54 PM

Originally Posted by OneTime

Politicians aren't elected in the way you think, they're selected by the people who hold the purse strings. But at least we're getting somewhere. Do you realize that politicians have minimal power/influence when it comes to decision making? You realize that Obama is just a puppet who takes his orders from back room staff and that it's all just a smoke screen to keep the masses at bay?

Prove it.

DGM · 16th April 2012, 02:55 PM

Originally Posted by OneTime

Politicians aren't elected in the way you think, they're selected by the people who hold the purse strings.

Does this mean I don't have to vote anymore?

SpringHallConvert · 16th April 2012, 02:59 PM

Originally Posted by The Dark Lord

How the Fed works is spelled out in black in white.

So was Bernie Madoff's investment system, but it was still just a Ponzi scheme.

There's a difference between how something is said to work and how it actually works.

Quote:

If you want to prove it actually operates differently, you prove it. But you can't, can you.

Doesn't work that way. If you believe the Fed works the way you say it works, prove it. You don't get to be right by default. It's not my job to prove you wrong, it's your job to prove yourself right.

Quote:

You agree that politicians would turn the dollar into some worthless currency. So you agree, by default, that the current system is better.

Straw man. I never said any such thing. You're just making stuff up.

Quote:

Unless you want the dollar to be worthless.

The dollar is already heading in that direction under the Fed, but that doesn't seem to bother you.

Quote:

Take an economics class.

Why, what good did it do you? Those economics classes turned you into a parrot who does nothing but repeat what you heard somewhere else.

There's absolutely no evidence of critical or independent thought on your part.

Quote:

And so it is by definition not worthless. Like it would be, as you admitted, if we let politicians be in charge of monetary policy.

Why should anybody be in charge of monetary policy? Why not just revert to a free banking system and let people use whatever they want as money? Why should it be in the hands of either politicians or banking cartels?

But, but, but...

OneTime · 16th April 2012, 02:59 PM

Originally Posted by DGM

Does this mean I don't have to vote anymore?

Vote if it pleases you. But I wouldn't. Because I know it's a massive farce and the whole system is corrupt and bent from top to bottom. I prefer not to feed into such a system any more than I have to. Peaceful non compliance is the way to go brother.

SpringHallConvert · 16th April 2012, 03:01 PM

Originally Posted by The Dark Lord

It is is established by sane people standards.

How do you know these people are sane? How do you know their standards aren't insane?

Quote:

Can you prove that the evil Jew bankers are not actually the lizard people? No? Why not?

The government truther M.O.: Refer to Jewz or lizard people whenever you are losing the debate.

DGM · 16th April 2012, 03:02 PM

Originally Posted by OneTime

Vote if it pleases you. But I wouldn't. Because I know it's a massive farce and the whole system is corrupt and bent from top to bottom. I prefer not to feed into such a system any more than I have to. Peaceful non compliance is the way to go brother.

What is your evidence of this (if I dare ask)? You don't think voters would notice if the people they vote for are never elected? Or is this a "brainwash" thing where the rubes only vote what they're told?

Come to think of it, the last president I voted for was not elected.

The Dark Lord · 16th April 2012, 03:08 PM

Originally Posted by SpringHallConvert

So was Bernie Madoff's investment system, but it was still just a Ponzi scheme.

There's a difference between how something is said to work and how it actually works.

And he got found out and put in prison. So where has the Fed been found out?

Quote:

Doesn't work that way. If you believe the Fed works the way you say it works, prove it. You don't get to be right by default. It's not my job to prove you wrong, it's your job to prove yourself right.

I can back what I say with evidence. If you want to say that evidence is a lie, you need to prove it. But you can't. Because you have nothing besides paranoid delusions.

Quote:

Straw man. I never said any such thing. You're just making stuff up.

You are a flat out liar. You agreed with realpaladin that letting politicians be in charge of monetary policy would make the dollar worthless. And so, the Fed is by default better.

Quote:

The dollar is already heading in that direction under the Fed, but that doesn't seem to bother you.

Because this is a lie.

Quote:

Why, what good did it do you? Those economics classes turned you into a parrot who does nothing but repeat what you heard somewhere else.

There's absolutely no evidence of critical or independent thought on your part.

So you confirm that you've never taken an economics class. I can understand how being educated might put a crimp your ability to just make **** up and believe whatever sounds good to you.

Quote:

Why should anybody be in charge of monetary policy? Why not just revert to a free banking system and let people use whatever they want as money? Why should it be in the hands of either politicians or banking cartels?

But, but, but...

Find one instance of this working ever.

Hans · 16th April 2012, 03:09 PM

Originally Posted by DGM

Yes. I wonder when it actually qualifies as abuse to respond?

Place him on ignore - I must follow my own resolution and not post in this thread anymore. However watching you guys get led around by the troll - is both sad and amusing

I do apologize for finding it amusing and I do understand the need to confront conspiracy theories but that doesn't mean you let a troll ....troll you

The Dark Lord · 16th April 2012, 03:11 PM

Originally Posted by SpringHallConvert

How do you know these people are sane? How do you know their standards aren't insane?

Because, unlike you, I know how to think. Sane people don't need to be proven beyond any doubt whatsoever. Because crazy people can always shoe in some kind of doubt about anything, no matter what.

Quote:

The government truther M.O.: Refer to Jewz or lizard people whenever you are losing the debate.

So I take it you can't prove that the reptilians aren't actually in charge? Why not?

OneTime · 16th April 2012, 03:12 PM

Originally Posted by DGM

What is your evidence of this (if I dare ask)? You don't think voters would notice if the people they vote for are never elected? Or is this a "brainwash" thing where the rubes only vote what they're told?

Come to think of it, the last president I voted for was not elected.

I have a plethora of evidence that's made me draw these conclusions, including personal correspondence with people who have worked in the political spectrum. I don't have to prove myself every time I say something because my purpose of contributing to this thread is to shed some light on everything and i'd rather not waste my time spoon feeding you the answers. If you really want to know the truth then you must open your mind and seek it while remaining unbias.

The Dark Lord · 16th April 2012, 03:15 PM

Originally Posted by OneTime

I have a plethora of evidence that's made me draw these conclusions, including personal correspondence with people who have worked in the political spectrum. I don't have to prove myself every time I say something because my purpose of contributing to this thread is to shed some light on everything and i'd rather not waste my time spoon feeding you the answers. If you really want to know the truth then you must open your mind and seek it while remaining unbias.

If you don't offer evidence nobody is going to believe you so you are just wasting your time.

SpringHallConvert · 16th April 2012, 03:19 PM

Originally Posted by The Dark Lord

And he got found out and put in prison. So where has the Fed been found out?

That's not the point. The point is, just because something is spelled out in "black and white" doesn't necessarily make it so, as you seem to believe.

Quote:

I can back what I say with evidence.

Where is it then?

Quote:

If you want to say that evidence is a lie, you need to prove it.

Just the same, if you want to say that your evidence is the truth, you need to prove it.

Quote:

But you can't. Because you have nothing besides paranoid delusions.

Neither can you, because you have nothing besides government truther delusions.

Quote:

You are a flat out liar. You agreed with realpaladin that letting politicians be in charge of monetary policy would make the dollar worthless.

Sure, but only if they are corrupt enough. There's no evidence that the politicians would be that corrupt in the absence of the Fed.

Quote:

And so, the Fed is by default better.

No, it's not, since the Fed has been destroying the value of the dollar since 1913. The Fed is doing exactly what corrupt politicians would do - inflate.

Quote:

Because this is a lie.

Prove it.

Quote:

So you confirm that you've never taken an economics class.

Proof?

Quote:

I can understand how being educated might put a crimp your ability to just make **** up and believe whatever sounds good to you.

Who "educated" you? How do you know they weren't just brainwashing you?

Quote:

Find one instance of this working ever.

Don't need to, as that alone isn't evidence that it can't work. There are a lot of things mankind has never done. Mankind has never been to Mars, but that doesn't necessarily mean it's impossible.

SpringHallConvert · 16th April 2012, 03:21 PM

Originally Posted by Hans

Place him on ignore - I must follow my own resolution and not post in this thread anymore. However watching you guys get led around by the troll - is both sad and amusing

I do apologize for finding it amusing and I do understand the need to confront conspiracy theories but that doesn't mean you let a troll ....troll you

The funny thing is, you guys are the actual trolls. All I am doing is using your own lack of logic against you. Just turning all of your arguments around on you.

The reason you find this "trollish" is because you guys are the trolls and I am the mirror through which you see yourselves. You can put me on 'ignore' all you like, but you'll only be hiding from yourself.

SpringHallConvert · 16th April 2012, 03:24 PM

Originally Posted by The Dark Lord

Because, unlike you, I know how to think.

How do you know this?

Quote:

Sane people don't need to be proven beyond any doubt whatsoever.

Again, how do you know they are sane?

Quote:

Because crazy people can always shoe in some kind of doubt about anything, no matter what.

How do you know the people you identify as "crazy" aren't really the sane ones while those you identify as "sane" aren't really the crazy ones?

Quote:

So I take it you can't prove that the reptilians aren't actually in charge? Why not?

It always comes down to reptiles and aliens for government truthers. This is the "life raft" they cling to when their argument sinks.

SpringHallConvert · 16th April 2012, 03:25 PM

Originally Posted by The Dark Lord

If you don't offer evidence nobody is going to believe you so you are just wasting your time.

As are you, since you don't offer evidence yourself.

dafydd · 16th April 2012, 03:25 PM

Originally Posted by OneTime

Politicians aren't elected in the way you think, they're selected by the people who hold the purse strings. But at least we're getting somewhere. Do you realize that politicians have minimal if any power/influence when it comes to decision making? You realize that Obama is just a puppet who takes his orders from back room staff and that it's all just a smoke screen to keep the masses at bay?

More paranoia.

jaydeehess · 16th April 2012, 03:29 PM

Originally Posted by SpringHallConvert

It always comes down to reptiles and aliens for government truthers. This is the "life raft" they cling to when their argument sinks.

Far from being a 'life raft' it is actually a metaphor and analogy by which one tries to illustrate the folly of another's position.

Given that so many tools of logic seem to completely escape you its not unusual that metaphors do as well.

NoahFence · 16th April 2012, 03:30 PM

SHC - I know I should be committed for even thinking you're capable of a rational, honest response, but what the hell:

Is there ANYTHING in the world that you feel is as it is presented?

Anything?

DGM · 16th April 2012, 03:31 PM

Originally Posted by Hans

Place him on ignore - I must follow my own resolution and not post in this thread anymore. However watching you guys get led around by the troll - is both sad and amusing

I do apologize for finding it amusing and I do understand the need to confront conspiracy theories but that doesn't mean you let a troll ....troll you

What makes you think he's doing the leading? You've heard the phrase "give them enough rope and they will hang themselves"? I just happen to have some extra rope.

SpringHallConvert · 16th April 2012, 03:33 PM

Originally Posted by NoahFence

SHC - I know I should be committed for even thinking you're capable of a rational, honest response, but what the hell:

Is there ANYTHING in the world that you feel is as it is presented?

Anything?

I don't know, why?

jaydeehess · 16th April 2012, 03:34 PM

Originally Posted by SpringHallConvert

As are you, since you don't offer evidence yourself.

Humans are very good at recognizing patterns. In your case we notice that when evidence is presented to you that your immediate response is to deny its credibility as if simply doing so negates it.
This is compounded by your steadfast refusal to produce anything in rebuttal to the evidence produced.

Break your pattern? I would not hold my breath waiting to see it.

SpringHallConvert · 16th April 2012, 03:35 PM

Originally Posted by DGM

What makes you think he's doing the leading? You've heard yo the phrase "give them enough rope and they will hang themselves"? I just happen to have some extra rope.

Doesn't seem to be working very well.

16th April 2012, 02:27 PM	#401
DGM #4 Join Date: May 2007 Location: West of Northshore MA Posts: 14,345	Originally Posted by SpringHallConvert What's life worth with no air!?!? OMG! Call the Fed! Tell them we need air-backed currency, quick! Better than gold. You're arguments would have been great in the 19th century.
	__________________ Join the team, Show us what your machine can do (or just contribute to a good cause)Join the JREF Folders ! Team 13232 "Remember that the goal of conspiracy rhetoric is to bog down the discussion, not to make progress toward a solution" Jay Windley Last edited by DGM; 16th April 2012 at 02:29 PM.

16th April 2012, 02:30 PM	#403
The Dark Lord Suspended Join Date: Jan 2012 Posts: 1,860	Originally Posted by OneTime http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ol3mEe8TH7w At 7:40 in the linked video Alan Greenspan states that the fed is indapendant and thus doesn't answer to congress. Another way to prove that the fed is private is to check the phone book and see them listed under private as opposed to other government agencies. It is true that it is independent and doesn't answer to Congress. That is a good thing because Congress can't manipulate monetary policy to suit their short term goals of being reelected. This doesn't mean that monetary policy is set by a cable of evil bankers though.
The Dark Lord Suspended Join Date: Jan 2012 Posts: 1,860

16th April 2012, 02:34 PM	#407
DGM #4 Join Date: May 2007 Location: West of Northshore MA Posts: 14,345	Originally Posted by SpringHallConvert How does the government truther know that some of his sources aren't a mixture of truth and fiction? After all, the best lies always have a little bit of truth in them. Maybe the government truthbot doesn't know this. What evidence do you have he is not right? It keeps coming back to this. What do you use for your information?
	__________________ Join the team, Show us what your machine can do (or just contribute to a good cause)Join the JREF Folders ! Team 13232 "Remember that the goal of conspiracy rhetoric is to bog down the discussion, not to make progress toward a solution" Jay Windley

16th April 2012, 02:42 PM	#410
Mudcat Man of a Thousand Memes Join Date: Apr 2011 Posts: 3,686	Originally Posted by SpringHallConvert What do you use for yours? You are being decidedly unhelpful here. We have the information we have and we share it (you may disagree with it, but that's neither here nor there), but you have some information that you aren't sharing. Share it, already. It could be that missing element that could lead to an 'aha!' moment.
	__________________ The major problem with Ocham's Razor is that while the simplest answer may be the best answer that doesn't make it the only answer or the right one. Kopji: A perfect utopia where everyone follows the rules is more like a hell than a heaven.

16th April 2012, 02:43 PM	#411
DGM #4 Join Date: May 2007 Location: West of Northshore MA Posts: 14,345	Originally Posted by SpringHallConvert What evidence do you have that he is right? You have been shown it over and over. Why don't you show you're worth doing it again? Originally Posted by SpringHallConvert What do you use for yours? I have an unlimited number of sources. I'm not restricted. Who are yours? (I answered you)
	__________________ Join the team, Show us what your machine can do (or just contribute to a good cause)Join the JREF Folders ! Team 13232 "Remember that the goal of conspiracy rhetoric is to bog down the discussion, not to make progress toward a solution" Jay Windley

16th April 2012, 02:30 PM	#402
SpringHallConvert Banned Join Date: Sep 2010 Posts: 1,272	Originally Posted by The Dark Lord Still having problems with the concept of the null hypothesis, huh, troll. Still having problems proving your vision of how the Fed works, huh, troll. Quote: You are a liar. In this post, you agreed that our politicians would turn the dollar into some worthless currency. And so you agree that the Federal Reserve is better. Unless you want the dollar to be worthless. Where did I state that the Federal Reserve is "better"? Why are you lying and making stuff up here? Quote: It doesn't matter what the value is relative to what it was 100 years ago. It matters what it is relative to other currencies. Why does it only matter in relation to other currencies? You're basically arguing that, since the rest of the world inflates, we should too. Why? Who says? Quote: And guess what, the dollar is the dominant currency in the world. And really, you are a *********** moron if you can't keep your money ahead of inflation anyway. Right, the paper dollar is the dominant reserve currency in a world full of other paper, basket case currencies. How impressive! You government truthbots can't say anything original. It's almost like you are parrots!

16th April 2012, 02:31 PM	#404
carlitos "más divertido" Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 11,553	Al Gore wants us to trade carbon credits. There are atoms of carbon in the air. Think about it, sheeple.

16th April 2012, 02:32 PM	#405
SpringHallConvert Banned Join Date: Sep 2010 Posts: 1,272	Originally Posted by The Dark Lord How does the troll know that the private banks own stock in the regional Federal Reserve banks? Apparently, he is perfectly fine using official sources when he thinks it suits his purposes. But when those same sources explain how monetary policy is actually set, he just ignores it. Pathetic. How does the government truther know that some of his sources aren't a mixture of truth and fiction? After all, the best lies always have a little bit of truth in them. Maybe the government truthbot doesn't know this.

16th April 2012, 02:33 PM	#406
SpringHallConvert Banned Join Date: Sep 2010 Posts: 1,272	Originally Posted by The Dark Lord This doesn't mean that monetary policy is set by a cable of evil bankers though. Why not? How do you really know? And why can't you prove what you think you know?

16th April 2012, 02:36 PM	#408
SpringHallConvert Banned Join Date: Sep 2010 Posts: 1,272	Originally Posted by DGM What evidence do you have he is not right? What evidence do you have that he is right? Quote: It keeps coming back to this. What do you use for your information? What do you use for yours?

16th April 2012, 02:41 PM	#409
jaydeehess Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: I beedunk 40 miles from the border Posts: 10,822	Originally Posted by SpringHallConvert Looks like the government truthers are having a hard time defending their counterfeit debt-money system. Actually those that are adressing this derail seem to be doing amuch better job of that than you have managed to do about your take on the OP

16th April 2012, 02:44 PM	#412
The Dark Lord Suspended Join Date: Jan 2012 Posts: 1,860	Originally Posted by SpringHallConvert Still having problems proving your vision of how the Fed works, huh, troll. How the Fed works is spelled out in black in white. If you want to prove it actually operates differently, you prove it. But you can't, can you. Quote: Where did I state that the Federal Reserve is "better"? Why are you lying and making stuff up here? You agree that politicians would turn the dollar into some worthless currency. So you agree, by default, that the current system is better. Unless you want the dollar to be worthless. I am not sure if you are too stupid to understand this or just too dishonest to admit it. It's a toss up. Quote: Why does it only matter in relation to other currencies? You're basically arguing that, since the rest of the world inflates, we should too. Why? Who says? Take an economics class. Quote: Right, the paper dollar is the dominant reserve currency in a world full of other paper, basket case currencies. How impressive! And so it is by definition not worthless. Like it would be, as you admitted, if we let politicians be in charge of monetary policy.
The Dark Lord Suspended Join Date: Jan 2012 Posts: 1,860

16th April 2012, 02:49 PM	#413
The Dark Lord Suspended Join Date: Jan 2012 Posts: 1,860	Originally Posted by SpringHallConvert How does the government truther know that some of his sources aren't a mixture of truth and fiction? After all, the best lies always have a little bit of truth in them. Maybe the government truthbot doesn't know this. Either the source is credible or it is not. If it is not credible, you don't get to choose which parts to believe based on how well you think it serves your whacked out conspiracy theories. At least if you are honest. Of course, you are not though.
The Dark Lord Suspended Join Date: Jan 2012 Posts: 1,860

16th April 2012, 02:51 PM	#414
Hans Master Poster Join Date: May 2007 Location: NW United States Posts: 2,790	Well gentleman have you noticed the pattern?

16th April 2012, 02:52 PM	#415
jaydeehess Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: I beedunk 40 miles from the border Posts: 10,822	Originally Posted by carlitos This secret oligarchy operates very much like mysticism, religion and other paranormal stuff. It only leaves vague, non-testable evidence of its existence, and that evidence has to be inferred and interpreted by those with special insight and knowledge, not mere mortals. Maybe it's quantum? I too have mentioned this. Twice now. However SHC has yet to address it. Seems he does not care to acknowledge that his beliefs are religious in nature. That is to say that he states that an unseen cadre controls the world. They are so all powerful that they ensure no direct evidence of their existance surfaces and thus it can only be inferred and implied by the indirect method of interpretation of events around us.

16th April 2012, 02:52 PM	#416
The Dark Lord Suspended Join Date: Jan 2012 Posts: 1,860	Originally Posted by SpringHallConvert Why not? How do you really know? And why can't you prove what you think you know? It is is established by sane people standards. Can you prove that the evil Jew bankers are not actually the lizard people? No? Why not?
The Dark Lord Suspended Join Date: Jan 2012 Posts: 1,860

16th April 2012, 02:53 PM	#417
OneTime Student Join Date: Apr 2012 Posts: 32	Originally Posted by The Dark Lord It is true that it is independent and doesn't answer to Congress. That is a good thing because Congress can't manipulate monetary policy to suit their short term goals of being reelected. This doesn't mean that monetary policy is set by a cable of evil bankers though. Politicians aren't elected in the way you think, they're selected by the people who hold the purse strings. But at least we're getting somewhere. Do you realize that politicians have minimal if any power/influence when it comes to decision making? You realize that Obama is just a puppet who takes his orders from back room staff and that it's all just a smoke screen to keep the masses at bay?
OneTime Student Join Date: Apr 2012 Posts: 32	Last edited by OneTime; 16th April 2012 at 02:54 PM.

16th April 2012, 02:54 PM	#418
DGM #4 Join Date: May 2007 Location: West of Northshore MA Posts: 14,345	Originally Posted by Hans Well gentleman have you noticed the pattern? Yes. I wonder when it actually qualifies as abuse to respond?
	__________________ Join the team, Show us what your machine can do (or just contribute to a good cause)Join the JREF Folders ! Team 13232 "Remember that the goal of conspiracy rhetoric is to bog down the discussion, not to make progress toward a solution" Jay Windley

16th April 2012, 02:54 PM	#419
The Dark Lord Suspended Join Date: Jan 2012 Posts: 1,860	Originally Posted by OneTime Politicians aren't elected in the way you think, they're selected by the people who hold the purse strings. But at least we're getting somewhere. Do you realize that politicians have minimal power/influence when it comes to decision making? You realize that Obama is just a puppet who takes his orders from back room staff and that it's all just a smoke screen to keep the masses at bay? Prove it.
The Dark Lord Suspended Join Date: Jan 2012 Posts: 1,860

16th April 2012, 02:55 PM	#420
DGM #4 Join Date: May 2007 Location: West of Northshore MA Posts: 14,345	Originally Posted by OneTime Politicians aren't elected in the way you think, they're selected by the people who hold the purse strings. Does this mean I don't have to vote anymore?
	__________________ Join the team, Show us what your machine can do (or just contribute to a good cause)Join the JREF Folders ! Team 13232 "Remember that the goal of conspiracy rhetoric is to bog down the discussion, not to make progress toward a solution" Jay Windley

16th April 2012, 02:59 PM	#421
SpringHallConvert Banned Join Date: Sep 2010 Posts: 1,272	Originally Posted by The Dark Lord How the Fed works is spelled out in black in white. So was Bernie Madoff's investment system, but it was still just a Ponzi scheme. There's a difference between how something is said to work and how it actually works. Quote: If you want to prove it actually operates differently, you prove it. But you can't, can you. Doesn't work that way. If you believe the Fed works the way you say it works, prove it. You don't get to be right by default. It's not my job to prove you wrong, it's your job to prove yourself right. Quote: You agree that politicians would turn the dollar into some worthless currency. So you agree, by default, that the current system is better. Straw man. I never said any such thing. You're just making stuff up. Quote: Unless you want the dollar to be worthless. The dollar is already heading in that direction under the Fed, but that doesn't seem to bother you. Quote: Take an economics class. Why, what good did it do you? Those economics classes turned you into a parrot who does nothing but repeat what you heard somewhere else. There's absolutely no evidence of critical or independent thought on your part. Quote: And so it is by definition not worthless. Like it would be, as you admitted, if we let politicians be in charge of monetary policy. Why should anybody be in charge of monetary policy? Why not just revert to a free banking system and let people use whatever they want as money? Why should it be in the hands of either politicians or banking cartels? But, but, but...

16th April 2012, 02:59 PM	#422
OneTime Student Join Date: Apr 2012 Posts: 32	Originally Posted by DGM Does this mean I don't have to vote anymore? Vote if it pleases you. But I wouldn't. Because I know it's a massive farce and the whole system is corrupt and bent from top to bottom. I prefer not to feed into such a system any more than I have to. Peaceful non compliance is the way to go brother.
OneTime Student Join Date: Apr 2012 Posts: 32

16th April 2012, 03:01 PM	#423
SpringHallConvert Banned Join Date: Sep 2010 Posts: 1,272	Originally Posted by The Dark Lord It is is established by sane people standards. How do you know these people are sane? How do you know their standards aren't insane? Quote: Can you prove that the evil Jew bankers are not actually the lizard people? No? Why not? The government truther M.O.: Refer to Jewz or lizard people whenever you are losing the debate.

16th April 2012, 03:02 PM	#424
DGM #4 Join Date: May 2007 Location: West of Northshore MA Posts: 14,345	Originally Posted by OneTime Vote if it pleases you. But I wouldn't. Because I know it's a massive farce and the whole system is corrupt and bent from top to bottom. I prefer not to feed into such a system any more than I have to. Peaceful non compliance is the way to go brother. What is your evidence of this (if I dare ask)? You don't think voters would notice if the people they vote for are never elected? Or is this a "brainwash" thing where the rubes only vote what they're told? Come to think of it, the last president I voted for was not elected.
	__________________ Join the team, Show us what your machine can do (or just contribute to a good cause)Join the JREF Folders ! Team 13232 "Remember that the goal of conspiracy rhetoric is to bog down the discussion, not to make progress toward a solution" Jay Windley Last edited by DGM; 16th April 2012 at 03:05 PM.

16th April 2012, 03:08 PM	#425
The Dark Lord Suspended Join Date: Jan 2012 Posts: 1,860	Originally Posted by SpringHallConvert So was Bernie Madoff's investment system, but it was still just a Ponzi scheme. There's a difference between how something is said to work and how it actually works. And he got found out and put in prison. So where has the Fed been found out? Quote: Doesn't work that way. If you believe the Fed works the way you say it works, prove it. You don't get to be right by default. It's not my job to prove you wrong, it's your job to prove yourself right. I can back what I say with evidence. If you want to say that evidence is a lie, you need to prove it. But you can't. Because you have nothing besides paranoid delusions. Quote: Straw man. I never said any such thing. You're just making stuff up. You are a flat out liar. You agreed with realpaladin that letting politicians be in charge of monetary policy would make the dollar worthless. And so, the Fed is by default better. Quote: The dollar is already heading in that direction under the Fed, but that doesn't seem to bother you. Because this is a lie. Quote: Why, what good did it do you? Those economics classes turned you into a parrot who does nothing but repeat what you heard somewhere else. There's absolutely no evidence of critical or independent thought on your part. So you confirm that you've never taken an economics class. I can understand how being educated might put a crimp your ability to just make **** up and believe whatever sounds good to you. Quote: Why should anybody be in charge of monetary policy? Why not just revert to a free banking system and let people use whatever they want as money? Why should it be in the hands of either politicians or banking cartels? But, but, but... Find one instance of this working ever.
The Dark Lord Suspended Join Date: Jan 2012 Posts: 1,860

16th April 2012, 03:09 PM	#426
Hans Master Poster Join Date: May 2007 Location: NW United States Posts: 2,790	Originally Posted by DGM Yes. I wonder when it actually qualifies as abuse to respond? Place him on ignore - I must follow my own resolution and not post in this thread anymore. However watching you guys get led around by the troll - is both sad and amusing I do apologize for finding it amusing and I do understand the need to confront conspiracy theories but that doesn't mean you let a troll ....troll you

16th April 2012, 03:11 PM	#427
The Dark Lord Suspended Join Date: Jan 2012 Posts: 1,860	Originally Posted by SpringHallConvert How do you know these people are sane? How do you know their standards aren't insane? Because, unlike you, I know how to think. Sane people don't need to be proven beyond any doubt whatsoever. Because crazy people can always shoe in some kind of doubt about anything, no matter what. Quote: The government truther M.O.: Refer to Jewz or lizard people whenever you are losing the debate. So I take it you can't prove that the reptilians aren't actually in charge? Why not?
The Dark Lord Suspended Join Date: Jan 2012 Posts: 1,860

16th April 2012, 03:12 PM	#428
OneTime Student Join Date: Apr 2012 Posts: 32	Originally Posted by DGM What is your evidence of this (if I dare ask)? You don't think voters would notice if the people they vote for are never elected? Or is this a "brainwash" thing where the rubes only vote what they're told? Come to think of it, the last president I voted for was not elected. I have a plethora of evidence that's made me draw these conclusions, including personal correspondence with people who have worked in the political spectrum. I don't have to prove myself every time I say something because my purpose of contributing to this thread is to shed some light on everything and i'd rather not waste my time spoon feeding you the answers. If you really want to know the truth then you must open your mind and seek it while remaining unbias.
OneTime Student Join Date: Apr 2012 Posts: 32	Last edited by OneTime; 16th April 2012 at 03:13 PM.

16th April 2012, 03:15 PM	#429
The Dark Lord Suspended Join Date: Jan 2012 Posts: 1,860	Originally Posted by OneTime I have a plethora of evidence that's made me draw these conclusions, including personal correspondence with people who have worked in the political spectrum. I don't have to prove myself every time I say something because my purpose of contributing to this thread is to shed some light on everything and i'd rather not waste my time spoon feeding you the answers. If you really want to know the truth then you must open your mind and seek it while remaining unbias. If you don't offer evidence nobody is going to believe you so you are just wasting your time.
The Dark Lord Suspended Join Date: Jan 2012 Posts: 1,860

16th April 2012, 03:19 PM	#430
SpringHallConvert Banned Join Date: Sep 2010 Posts: 1,272	Originally Posted by The Dark Lord And he got found out and put in prison. So where has the Fed been found out? That's not the point. The point is, just because something is spelled out in "black and white" doesn't necessarily make it so, as you seem to believe. Quote: I can back what I say with evidence. Where is it then? Quote: If you want to say that evidence is a lie, you need to prove it. Just the same, if you want to say that your evidence is the truth, you need to prove it. Quote: But you can't. Because you have nothing besides paranoid delusions. Neither can you, because you have nothing besides government truther delusions. Quote: You are a flat out liar. You agreed with realpaladin that letting politicians be in charge of monetary policy would make the dollar worthless. Sure, but only if they are corrupt enough. There's no evidence that the politicians would be that corrupt in the absence of the Fed. Quote: And so, the Fed is by default better. No, it's not, since the Fed has been destroying the value of the dollar since 1913. The Fed is doing exactly what corrupt politicians would do - inflate. Quote: Because this is a lie. Prove it. Quote: So you confirm that you've never taken an economics class. Proof? Quote: I can understand how being educated might put a crimp your ability to just make **** up and believe whatever sounds good to you. Who "educated" you? How do you know they weren't just brainwashing you? Quote: Find one instance of this working ever. Don't need to, as that alone isn't evidence that it can't work. There are a lot of things mankind has never done. Mankind has never been to Mars, but that doesn't necessarily mean it's impossible.

16th April 2012, 03:21 PM	#431
SpringHallConvert Banned Join Date: Sep 2010 Posts: 1,272	Originally Posted by Hans Place him on ignore - I must follow my own resolution and not post in this thread anymore. However watching you guys get led around by the troll - is both sad and amusing I do apologize for finding it amusing and I do understand the need to confront conspiracy theories but that doesn't mean you let a troll ....troll you The funny thing is, you guys are the actual trolls. All I am doing is using your own lack of logic against you. Just turning all of your arguments around on you. The reason you find this "trollish" is because you guys are the trolls and I am the mirror through which you see yourselves. You can put me on 'ignore' all you like, but you'll only be hiding from yourself.

16th April 2012, 03:24 PM	#432
SpringHallConvert Banned Join Date: Sep 2010 Posts: 1,272	Originally Posted by The Dark Lord Because, unlike you, I know how to think. How do you know this? Quote: Sane people don't need to be proven beyond any doubt whatsoever. Again, how do you know they are sane? Quote: Because crazy people can always shoe in some kind of doubt about anything, no matter what. How do you know the people you identify as "crazy" aren't really the sane ones while those you identify as "sane" aren't really the crazy ones? Quote: So I take it you can't prove that the reptilians aren't actually in charge? Why not? It always comes down to reptiles and aliens for government truthers. This is the "life raft" they cling to when their argument sinks.

16th April 2012, 03:25 PM	#433
SpringHallConvert Banned Join Date: Sep 2010 Posts: 1,272	Originally Posted by The Dark Lord If you don't offer evidence nobody is going to believe you so you are just wasting your time. As are you, since you don't offer evidence yourself.

16th April 2012, 03:25 PM	#434
dafydd Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Belgium (Flatland) Posts: 31,478	Originally Posted by OneTime Politicians aren't elected in the way you think, they're selected by the people who hold the purse strings. But at least we're getting somewhere. Do you realize that politicians have minimal if any power/influence when it comes to decision making? You realize that Obama is just a puppet who takes his orders from back room staff and that it's all just a smoke screen to keep the masses at bay? More paranoia.
	__________________ Yesterday upon the stairs I met a man who wasn't there He wasn't there again today I wish that he would go away.

16th April 2012, 03:29 PM	#435
jaydeehess Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: I beedunk 40 miles from the border Posts: 10,822	Originally Posted by SpringHallConvert It always comes down to reptiles and aliens for government truthers. This is the "life raft" they cling to when their argument sinks. Far from being a 'life raft' it is actually a metaphor and analogy by which one tries to illustrate the folly of another's position. Given that so many tools of logic seem to completely escape you its not unusual that metaphors do as well.