Need some ghost debunking help in Detroit.

Drewbot · 6th July 2012, 08:28 AM

I have an old high school friend on Facebook, he is posting about how his house is haunted, I posted that there is no evidence of ghosts, and that he had described a classic case of sleep paralysis.

It was to no avail, and he brought in a paranormal research and they found that his house was haunted by two spirits, so now he is saying he is researching the house for deaths that happened.

Anyway, I don't want to be a dick on FB, and post links to all the ghost fakers, I want to provide him a link or a contact for legitimate debunking help, does anyone know of someone in SE Michigan area?

Thanks,

The sleep paralysis 'Ghost encounter'

Quote:

Well....as a lot of you already know, I've had ghost issues at my house in the past. It mainly just liked messing with my electronics and immitating noise and voices. It did mess with me once, where I felt pinned to the bed. Again, I haven't had anything happen in well over a year, but yesturday after I fell asleep for just about an hour, I felt something shaking me as to wake me up, but there was nothing there. I also hear several voices that sounded distant and muffled as though I was hearing them through a vent or something. I always sleep with music playing, and even my music started playing slow & distorted. I was freaked the f--- out! How I fell asleep again after that is beyond me!

The paranormal team post:

Quote:

I just had the wildest evening of my life!! I always thought my house was haunted and I got my proof today! I had a group of ghost hunters come through with equipment this evening and got some wild results! Not 1, but 2 different spirits in this house. I believe they got one to leave, but not sure on the other. We'll see what happens and hopefully activity doesn't get worse!! Thank you S-- K---- for everything you and your team did for me today! If I didn't witness some of the stuff that happened with my own eye's, I wouldn't have believed it!! WOW!!!!

He goes on to post photos of an 'orb', and a dark shadow in the corner of the room, and his 'emf meter'

Then he posts how he is looking for deaths at the house address

Quote:

Im trying to find any history on this house I can find, perticularly any deaths that happened here.

He has bought the EMF meter probably, he is paying for deed records on the house, I think he might be vulnerable to this type of thing.

Can anyone help? i would post a link to a website, or have him call someone.

Marduk · 6th July 2012, 09:56 AM

You need to tell him that you know a spiritual medium who specialises in clearing spirits, then have a friend turn up burn some feathers and annouce the place cured
Bonus points if your fake spiritualist is small, fat, female and talks in a falsetto accent
I can't think of any other way that you'll get through the cognitive dissonance

RhodyDave · 8th July 2012, 06:23 AM

Your friend is probably a 'lost cause' at this point. The emotional and psychological investment he's made by accepting the findings of the charlatans (ghost hunters) may be too great to counteract with reason, science, and logic. At best you can try to prevent him from wasting more money on quackery, but again, this may not be possible.

JoeTheJuggler · 8th July 2012, 09:01 AM

Did your friend pay money to the ghost hunters? (Ask him to be honest--did he not buy an EM meter, audio recorders, etc?)

I would at least inform him that these people are misusing the gadgets. Invite him to try the same gadgets in the same way (usually using them with the gain turned up to the extreme and then making much of slight noise) in a house he agrees is not haunted.

If, for example, they're referring to "cold spots" that are measured in fluctuations of tenths or hundredths of a degree, find out the limit of confidence we can get from the thermometer being used. It was easy to determine with analog meters (you're only confident to the lines, then the digit you have to estimate between the lines is uncertain). On digital meters, usually the last digit is uncertain, but you could certainly market a meter that put in two uncertain digits. It could well be that the "fluctuations" they're talking about are utterly meaningless.

Perhaps more simply is to attack their overall notion of the scientific method. As them if the "ghost" hypothesis is falsifiable. According to one such organization here, when you test ghost hypotheses, you either get a positive result (evidence of a ghost) or uncertainty (reason to continue investigation).

Drewbot · 12th July 2012, 12:52 PM

Thanks for the help.

Drewbot · 16th July 2012, 11:36 AM

Basically, i posted this on his most recent Facebook claim of ghosts being in his house
http://www.assap.ac.uk/newsite/artic...%20photos.html

And sent him a message with this article by Ben Radford.
http://www.csicop.org/si/show/ghost-...nvestigations/

We will see if common sense prevails.

Every time he posts something about his house, that 'Ghost hunter' comments and says stuff like "Oooh I felt a presence in that exact spot, you need to tell that spirit to GET OUT! with force"

DuvalHMFIC · 16th July 2012, 12:16 PM

Why am I slaving away at my job? I really need to become a psychic or a ghost hunter. Much more exciting, and I'm sure the money is probably better. Should I really feel guilty if these people demand such a service?

squealpiggy · 16th July 2012, 01:40 PM

You have but one recourse: You must investigate, you must find this ghost, you must capture it and then pull off the ghost hood, revealing that it was in fact Old Mr Peters who inherited the disused amusement park.

And he would have gotten away with it...

Magic 9-Ball · 16th July 2012, 02:17 PM

Originally Posted by squealpiggy

You have but one recourse: You must investigate, you must find this ghost, you must capture it and then pull off the ghost hood, revealing that it was in fact Old Mr Peters who inherited the disused amusement park.

And he would have gotten away with it...

And that is, of course, after you've rescued and consoled Daphne. Ahh... Daphne!

Have you offered to spend some time in the house and seeing if the "ghostly stuff" happens when you are there? And be ready to possibly explain what might be going on?

Spektator · 16th July 2012, 02:22 PM

1. Ghosts are beyond the limitations of time and space that bind mortals.
2. No one would be caught dead in Detroit.
3. Therefore it is not a ghost.

P.J. Denyer · 17th July 2012, 06:52 AM

Originally Posted by squealpiggy

You have but one recourse: You must investigate, you must find this ghost, you must capture it and then pull off the ghost hood, revealing that it was in fact Old Mr Peters who inherited the disused amusement park.

And he would have gotten away with it...

I would recommend a high energy laser containment system. Just remember to stick a great big 'OFF' switch right next to it.

Drewbot · 25th July 2012, 04:52 AM

Originally Posted by Spektator

1. Ghosts are beyond the limitations of time and space that bind mortals.
2. No one would be caught dead in Detroit.
3. Therefore it is not a ghost.

Detroit is booming folks. It is crazy how much money and people are pouring into the downtown and midtown area.

Lots of breweries and establishments in the area as well.

6th July 2012, 08:28 AM	#1
Drewbot Illuminator Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 3,846	Need some ghost debunking help in Detroit. I have an old high school friend on Facebook, he is posting about how his house is haunted, I posted that there is no evidence of ghosts, and that he had described a classic case of sleep paralysis. It was to no avail, and he brought in a paranormal research and they found that his house was haunted by two spirits, so now he is saying he is researching the house for deaths that happened. Anyway, I don't want to be a dick on FB, and post links to all the ghost fakers, I want to provide him a link or a contact for legitimate debunking help, does anyone know of someone in SE Michigan area? Thanks, The sleep paralysis 'Ghost encounter' Quote: Well....as a lot of you already know, I've had ghost issues at my house in the past. It mainly just liked messing with my electronics and immitating noise and voices. It did mess with me once, where I felt pinned to the bed. Again, I haven't had anything happen in well over a year, but yesturday after I fell asleep for just about an hour, I felt something shaking me as to wake me up, but there was nothing there. I also hear several voices that sounded distant and muffled as though I was hearing them through a vent or something. I always sleep with music playing, and even my music started playing slow & distorted. I was freaked the f--- out! How I fell asleep again after that is beyond me! The paranormal team post: Quote: I just had the wildest evening of my life!! I always thought my house was haunted and I got my proof today! I had a group of ghost hunters come through with equipment this evening and got some wild results! Not 1, but 2 different spirits in this house. I believe they got one to leave, but not sure on the other. We'll see what happens and hopefully activity doesn't get worse!! Thank you S-- K---- for everything you and your team did for me today! If I didn't witness some of the stuff that happened with my own eye's, I wouldn't have believed it!! WOW!!!! He goes on to post photos of an 'orb', and a dark shadow in the corner of the room, and his 'emf meter' Then he posts how he is looking for deaths at the house address Quote: Im trying to find any history on this house I can find, perticularly any deaths that happened here. He has bought the EMF meter probably, he is paying for deed records on the house, I think he might be vulnerable to this type of thing. Can anyone help? i would post a link to a website, or have him call someone.
Drewbot Illuminator Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 3,846	__________________ "I dont call that evolution, I call that the survival of the fittest." - Bulletmaker "I thought skeptics would usually point towards a hoax rather than a group being duped." - makaya325 Kit is not a skeptic. He is a former Bigfoot believer that changed his position to that of non believer.- Crowlogic

8th July 2012, 06:23 AM	#3
RhodyDave Critical Thinker Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: Rhode Island, of course! Posts: 338	Your friend is probably a 'lost cause' at this point. The emotional and psychological investment he's made by accepting the findings of the charlatans (ghost hunters) may be too great to counteract with reason, science, and logic. At best you can try to prevent him from wasting more money on quackery, but again, this may not be possible.
	__________________ If it turns out that there is a God, I don't think that he's evil. But the worst that you can say about him is that basically he's an underachiever - Woody Allen

8th July 2012, 09:01 AM	#4
JoeTheJuggler Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: St. Louis Posts: 26,728	Did your friend pay money to the ghost hunters? (Ask him to be honest--did he not buy an EM meter, audio recorders, etc?) I would at least inform him that these people are misusing the gadgets. Invite him to try the same gadgets in the same way (usually using them with the gain turned up to the extreme and then making much of slight noise) in a house he agrees is not haunted. If, for example, they're referring to "cold spots" that are measured in fluctuations of tenths or hundredths of a degree, find out the limit of confidence we can get from the thermometer being used. It was easy to determine with analog meters (you're only confident to the lines, then the digit you have to estimate between the lines is uncertain). On digital meters, usually the last digit is uncertain, but you could certainly market a meter that put in two uncertain digits. It could well be that the "fluctuations" they're talking about are utterly meaningless. Perhaps more simply is to attack their overall notion of the scientific method. As them if the "ghost" hypothesis is falsifiable. According to one such organization here, when you test ghost hypotheses, you either get a positive result (evidence of a ghost) or uncertainty (reason to continue investigation).
	__________________ "That is a very graphic analogy which aids understanding wonderfully while being, strictly speaking, wrong in every possible way." —Ponder Stibbons

12th July 2012, 12:52 PM	#5
Drewbot Illuminator Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 3,846	Thanks for the help.
Drewbot Illuminator Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 3,846	__________________ "I dont call that evolution, I call that the survival of the fittest." - Bulletmaker "I thought skeptics would usually point towards a hoax rather than a group being duped." - makaya325 Kit is not a skeptic. He is a former Bigfoot believer that changed his position to that of non believer.- Crowlogic

16th July 2012, 11:36 AM	#6
Drewbot Illuminator Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 3,846	Basically, i posted this on his most recent Facebook claim of ghosts being in his house http://www.assap.ac.uk/newsite/artic...%20photos.html And sent him a message with this article by Ben Radford. http://www.csicop.org/si/show/ghost-...nvestigations/ We will see if common sense prevails. Every time he posts something about his house, that 'Ghost hunter' comments and says stuff like "Oooh I felt a presence in that exact spot, you need to tell that spirit to GET OUT! with force"
Drewbot Illuminator Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 3,846	__________________ "I dont call that evolution, I call that the survival of the fittest." - Bulletmaker "I thought skeptics would usually point towards a hoax rather than a group being duped." - makaya325 Kit is not a skeptic. He is a former Bigfoot believer that changed his position to that of non believer.- Crowlogic

6th July 2012, 09:56 AM	#2
Marduk Banned Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Newbury, Berkshire Posts: 10,242	You need to tell him that you know a spiritual medium who specialises in clearing spirits, then have a friend turn up burn some feathers and annouce the place cured Bonus points if your fake spiritualist is small, fat, female and talks in a falsetto accent I can't think of any other way that you'll get through the cognitive dissonance

16th July 2012, 12:16 PM	#7
DuvalHMFIC Thinker Join Date: Jun 2012 Location: Jacksonville, FL Posts: 140	Why am I slaving away at my job? I really need to become a psychic or a ghost hunter. Much more exciting, and I'm sure the money is probably better. Should I really feel guilty if these people demand such a service?

16th July 2012, 01:40 PM	#8
squealpiggy Muse Join Date: Jan 2012 Posts: 657	You have but one recourse: You must investigate, you must find this ghost, you must capture it and then pull off the ghost hood, revealing that it was in fact Old Mr Peters who inherited the disused amusement park. And he would have gotten away with it...
squealpiggy Muse Join Date: Jan 2012 Posts: 657

16th July 2012, 02:17 PM	#9
Magic 9-Ball Hey, that's a good name for a band! Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Here, on my way to there. Posts: 1,504	Originally Posted by squealpiggy You have but one recourse: You must investigate, you must find this ghost, you must capture it and then pull off the ghost hood, revealing that it was in fact Old Mr Peters who inherited the disused amusement park. And he would have gotten away with it... And that is, of course, after you've rescued and consoled Daphne. Ahh... Daphne! Have you offered to spend some time in the house and seeing if the "ghostly stuff" happens when you are there? And be ready to possibly explain what might be going on?
	__________________ All right, but apart from the sanitation, medicine, education, wine, public order, irrigation, roads, the fresh water system and public health, what have the Romans ever done for us?

16th July 2012, 02:22 PM	#10
Spektator Dog Who Laughs Join Date: Jun 2002 Posts: 1,319	1. Ghosts are beyond the limitations of time and space that bind mortals. 2. No one would be caught dead in Detroit. 3. Therefore it is not a ghost.
	__________________ Anyone who is telling the truth does not type complete sentences all in capital letters.

17th July 2012, 06:52 AM	#11
P.J. Denyer Graduate Poster Join Date: Aug 2008 Posts: 1,127	Originally Posted by squealpiggy You have but one recourse: You must investigate, you must find this ghost, you must capture it and then pull off the ghost hood, revealing that it was in fact Old Mr Peters who inherited the disused amusement park. And he would have gotten away with it... I would recommend a high energy laser containment system. Just remember to stick a great big 'OFF' switch right next to it.

25th July 2012, 04:52 AM	#12
Drewbot Illuminator Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 3,846	Originally Posted by Spektator 1. Ghosts are beyond the limitations of time and space that bind mortals. 2. No one would be caught dead in Detroit. 3. Therefore it is not a ghost. Detroit is booming folks. It is crazy how much money and people are pouring into the downtown and midtown area. Lots of breweries and establishments in the area as well.
Drewbot Illuminator Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 3,846	__________________ "I dont call that evolution, I call that the survival of the fittest." - Bulletmaker "I thought skeptics would usually point towards a hoax rather than a group being duped." - makaya325 Kit is not a skeptic. He is a former Bigfoot believer that changed his position to that of non believer.- Crowlogic Last edited by Drewbot; 25th July 2012 at 04:54 AM.