enron

Well listening to the newly released Enron tapes today rang home CLEARLY why deregulations and "self policing" is a major crock!

I know of course that the standard line for from the republican
apologist will be that this is "just an isolated incident" and I agree with that to the extent that most other corps are either not as stupid or flip about it. But I say that that's where the
dissimilarity ends.

While big govt is DEFINATELY not my idea of a solution.
This scandal along with the obvious and continued farce
of initial privileged offerings that control the US stock market.
These 2 issues have cost the average middle class stock holders
millions if not billions in retirement savings and standard of living, while the big boys get off with a slap on the wrist and get to keep their 5 million dollar mansions and Ferraris as family cars.


C

[Agammamon]

Or comversely, the collapse of Enron is a perfect example of why deregulation does work. Corruption and illegal behavior don't go away just because the business is regulated. Rather it just means the penalties for it are removed, as the government is absolutely loathe to see a large regulated business fail.

If the government had stepped in, as they usually do with large corps (pretty much every American airline has been bailed out at least once), then you and I, people who are also innocent of any wrongdoing, would be footing the bill to keep Enron in business. All this so that those innocent stockholders and employees don't lose their shirts. Perhaps I'm callous, but buying stock and working for a pension are gambles. These people lost, I don't want to pay for it.
And the Enron execs would still keep their Ferraris.

Enron's execs acted illegally and paid the price (admittedly along with a lot of otherwise innocent people), this sends a message to the execs of other companies that if they want to keep raking in the dought, then they need to rein in the greed.

[AtheistArchon]

Quote:

Or comversely, the collapse of Enron is a perfect example of why deregulation does work.

- Wellllll, yes they collapsed, but the damage is already done. The execs are largely free millionaires and the employees are SOL. Yes, reputable execs of other companies will take notice and move to avoid at least the appearance of theft, but the crooked ones have no real example to deter them from crashing the company and walking away with the loot, do they? I could be wrong here... I haven't followed Enron as closely as I should have.

[Rob Lister]

Quote:

Originally posted by AtheistArchon


- Wellllll, yes they collapsed, but the damage is already done.

Does that not assume that they would not have collapsed under tighter requlation? Perhaps you assume they would not have existed?

[AtheistArchon]

Quote:

Does that not assume that they would not have collapsed under tighter requlation? Perhaps you assume they would not have existed?

- I care nothing for the collapse of the company itself. My interests lie in the actual corruption, and whether it gets punished or not.

[Rob Lister]

Quote:

Originally posted by AtheistArchon


- I care nothing for the collapse of the company itself. My interests lie in the actual corruption, and whether it gets punished or not.

Would the likelihood of their 'being punished' be greater than if they had not 'been caught'?

[Tmy]

Quote:

Originally posted by AtheistArchon


- I care nothing for the collapse of the company itself. My interests lie in the actual corruption, and whether it gets punished or not.

The collapse is far more damaging to the country than people escaping punishment.

Those tapes really angried up my blood. Makes you think of the kind of nonsense going on behind the oil biz right now.

[Rob Lister]

Quote:

Originally posted by Tmy


The collapse is far more damaging to the country than people escaping punishment.

Those tapes really angried up my blood. Makes you think of the kind of nonsense going on behind the oil biz right now.

To what connection between Enron and 'the oil biz' are you referring?

[Tmy]

Well the enron tapes revealed the backhanded manipulation of energy prices.

Maybe theres the same manipulation of oil prices right now.

[Rob Lister]

Quote:

Originally posted by Tmy
Well the enron tapes revealed the backhanded manipulation of energy prices.

Maybe theres the same manipulation of oil prices right now.

What leads you to suggest the connection? What is the non-sense?

[AtheistArchon]

Quote:

Would the likelihood of their 'being punished' be greater than if they had not 'been caught'?

- Well no, but this doesn't necessarily have anything to do with the collapse of the business. I am for catching the crooks, but I'd rather the business not have to fold because of the thefts.

- The events we saw with Enron do show the execs being scoundrels (and the lesser employees being wronged), but as far as I'm aware they haven't been "caught". They are free and rich as lords.

- Of course, I'm not certain what the solution actually is, I'm jsut voicing my opinion.

[evil sutko]

It's hard to imagine a worse outcome than Enron for all the stakeholders involved. Deregulation played entirely into their hands, and to some of the more aggressive posters here that's a good thing ?

First, as far as I know none of the execs of Enron are in jail.
BUt I am not even talking about the cfos and ceos.

The tapes have customer service type people talking about how they screwed some old lady by charging here $200 per Kw hours and how she just has to eat dog food for the month or something.

And how the rep told a business owner to simply move because his power/billing issues will never be fixed.

Again, not that I am advocating LARGE govt. for a solution, but clearly the retoric of the Corp. world that "we will police oureselves" is been shot full of holes. The ONLY people hurt by these scandals are innocent.

And what is the intent of govt if not to protect it's citizens from corruption (of course this should include govt corruption as well, but hey that's whole other topic)

C