Pack of African painted dogs kill 3 year old at Pittsburgh Zoo.

JoeBentley · 4th November 2012, 11:50 AM

CNN: http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2012/11/04...ild/?hpt=hp_t4

Quote:

A group of African painted dogs killed a boy who fell into their exhibit today at the Pittsburgh Zoo.

Vortigern99 · 4th November 2012, 12:06 PM

He "fell off an observation deck that's about 14 feet above the exhibit," she said, "and was killed by the dogs."

How did he fall off? What kind of railing is there to keep small children from slipping through bars? What exactly occurred here? The article doesn't give enough details.

rjh01 · 4th November 2012, 01:32 PM

The boy probably climbed over the fence. I would like to know what sort of fence they did have that allowed for this accident to happen.

Rat · 4th November 2012, 02:10 PM

At all the zoos that I go to, the parents lift up their children and stand them on the safety rails or fences. Not necessarily saying that's what happened here, but it worries me every time I see it.

Halfcentaur · 4th November 2012, 02:16 PM

This is a terrible thing, but it's a shame things like this cause people to say such moronic crap as they desperately try to blame and claim what they would do in the situation and why the parents deserve to die or be imprisoned. People seem to just hate the idea that accidents can happen.

I truly hope the zoo had an adequately secure enclosure and this is a case of a tenaciously curious and daring boy doing something unusual in a moment without supervision.

My older brother climbed into the grizzly bear closure apparently when he was 4 at the zoo. Luckily the bear just stared at him and didn't feel like sitting up.

JoeBentley · 4th November 2012, 02:24 PM

I have not been to the Pittsburgh Zoo specifically, but I honestly can't remember the last time I went to a major zoo that was setup in such a way that you could really "fall in" to an animal enclosure on "accident."

bookworm · 4th November 2012, 04:11 PM

I've been to the Pittsburgh zoo. I remember this exhibit. There is an observation deck with a net spread underneath but at the time I still thought the ground seemed a little too close for comfort. It seems that the mother was holding him on top of the railing and he fell. I can see how he would have rolled off of the net. This is unimaginably horrible. I really feel that these exhibits should be made with NO POSSIBILITY of someone getting in there.

korenyx · 4th November 2012, 04:17 PM

Originally Posted by JoeBentley

I have not been to the Pittsburgh Zoo specifically, but I honestly can't remember the last time I went to a major zoo that was setup in such a way that you could really "fall in" to an animal enclosure on "accident."

The Sedgwick Country Zoo (www.scz.org) changed the Amur Leopard exhibit after a kid on a school trip almost got his face ripped off. He ducked under the bars on top of the four foot high barrier, climbed the barrier and crossed about 20 feet of ground.
He got too close to the cage; she grabbed his head with her claws and tried to bite him. A male visitor got the kid away from the leopard.

The exhibit has now been changed and the new fence is harder to climb.

After this happened the public schools decided to tell students that wild animals are dangerous! Who knew?

P. S. Everyone I talked to afterwards blamed the kid for ignoring the signs and climbing the barrier.
The leopard was put back on display after her cage was fixed.

bookworm · 4th November 2012, 04:28 PM

Originally Posted by korenyx

The Sedgwick Country Zoo (www.scz.org) changed the Amur Leopard exhibit after a kid on a school trip almost got his face ripped off. He ducked under the bars on top of the four foot high barrier, climbed the barrier and crossed about 20 feet of ground.
He got too close to the cage; she grabbed his head with her claws and tried to bite him. A male visitor got the kid away from the leopard.

The exhibit has now been changed and the new fence is harder to climb.

After this happened the public schools decided to tell students that wild animals are dangerous! Who knew?

P. S. Everyone I talked to afterwards blamed the kid for ignoring the signs and climbing the barrier.
The leopard was put back on display after her cage was fixed.

The thing is that kids do these kinds of things because it's what kids do. There should be no way a kid can get in a dangerous animal's exhibit.

korenyx · 4th November 2012, 04:46 PM

Originally Posted by bookworm

The thing is that kids do these kinds of things because it's what kids do. There should be no way a kid can get in a dangerous animal's exhibit.

No one had done it before so maybe the zoo thought no one could.
I still blame the kid; he could read and he was old enough to know better. I also blame the teacher for not keeping better track of him.

Skeptic Ginger · 4th November 2012, 05:00 PM

While my heart goes out to this mom, how anyone could let a 2 or 3 yr old slip off a railing like that is mind boggling. If you're going to put the kid up there, you only do it with a really firm grip.

And dogs or not, if that were my kid, I'd have jumped in right behind him.

Denver · 4th November 2012, 05:05 PM

Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger

While my heart goes out to this mom, how anyone could let a 2 or 3 yr old slip off a railing like that is mind boggling. If you're going to put the kid up there, you only do it with a really firm grip.

And dogs or not, if that were my kid, I'd have jumped in right behind him.

It's terrible to imagine the horror of a parent having to witness this.

ETA: It's possible the fall killed the kid. I hope that was the case.

smartcooky · 4th November 2012, 05:15 PM

Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger

While my heart goes out to this mom, how anyone could let a 2 or 3 yr old slip off a railing like that is mind boggling. If you're going to put the kid up there, you only do it with a really firm grip.

And dogs or not, if that were my kid, I'd have jumped in right behind him.

Why would you even put the kid up there in the first place? the barriers are there to separate people from danger, not for stupid parents to perch their children on.

How long will it be before someone plunges 500 feet to their death off the Grand Canyon Skywalk?

We can make all the "safety" designs we like for these kinds of things, but we cannot be 100% sure of protecting people from their own (or their parents) stupidity.

WildCat · 4th November 2012, 05:28 PM

There should be criminal charges on the parent who put the kid up there.

African wild dogs are nasty nasty nasty, basically eat their prey to death.

Skeptic Ginger · 4th November 2012, 05:31 PM

Originally Posted by WildCat

There should be criminal charges on the parent who put the kid up there....

Why? Because a fine or a few months in jail must be added to their already horrific pain?

Pulvinar · 4th November 2012, 06:29 PM

When they're done fixing that enclosure they should take a look outside: there are parents walking their kids down sidewalks! Next to speeding cars!! With no barriers!!!

EventHorizon · 4th November 2012, 06:33 PM

Originally Posted by Pulvinar

When they're done fixing that enclosure they should take a look outside: there are parents walking their kids down sidewalks! Next to speeding cars!! With no barriers!!!

That's a good point but going back to the original story, I wanna know what PETA's reaction will be when they find out people are painting dogs!

RedRatSnake · 4th November 2012, 06:35 PM

Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger

While my heart goes out to this mom, how anyone could let a 2 or 3 yr old slip off a railing like that is mind boggling. If you're going to put the kid up there, you only do it with a really firm grip.

And dogs or not, if that were my kid, I'd have jumped in right behind him.

You bet your ass i would have, I don't know the facts of the case but it seems like the logical thing to have done.

TheShadow · 4th November 2012, 07:06 PM

I just want to know why they couldnt have been Australian wild dogs....

Then i could finally say " a dingo ate her baby" and have it be true....

Yes, I'm well aware of my tasteless and dark sense of humor.

I would apologize, but I have little sympathy for stupid people. If you're going to hold your child on top of a railing (which i'd never do), then you'd damn welll better make sure you have a firm grip on him/her.

Hallo Alfie · 4th November 2012, 07:12 PM

Originally Posted by TheShadow

I just want to know why they couldnt have been Australian wild dogs....

Then i could finally say " a dingo ate her baby" and have it be true....

It actually was true that Azaria Chamberlain was teken by a dingo. The coroner cleared her (formerly) earlier this year.
http://tv.ibtimes.com/lindy-chamberl...lled-baby-4755

Originally Posted by TheShadow

I would apologize, but I have little sympathy for stupid people. If you're going to hold your child on top of a railing (which i'd never do), then you'd damn welll better make sure you have a firm grip on him/her.

Exactly, tugs of war with wild dogs over a baby can be messy; one needs a strong grip.

JoeBentley · 4th November 2012, 07:14 PM

If they want to make exhibits more secure they could put dangerous animals in them that would attack people that enter.

Part of the way they make these exhibits secure is to post rules as to what you can and can't do around the exhibits. It's a nice idea to go "Make it impossible to get in them!" but that's not reasonable. You can't expect a zoo to keep people out of an exhibit in they are intent upon breaking the rules put in place to keep them out of the exhibit.

Something happening because someone didn't follow the rules isn't a design flaw in the exhibit.

It's terrible that a perfectly innocent child is the one that paid the price for this, but it's not the zoo's fault from the scenario we're being given. (I off course retain the right to modify this as new information is presented in this story.)

RedRatSnake · 4th November 2012, 07:25 PM

Some new Info.

PITTSBURGH (AP) — A 2-year-old boy visiting the Pittsburgh zoo was killed Sunday when he fell off a railing that his mother had put him on top of to view a pack of African painted dogs, who pounced on the child and mauled him, police said.

It was not clear whether the boy died from the 11-foot fall into the wild dog exhibit area or from the attack, said Barbara Baker, president and CEO of the Pittsburgh Zoo & PPG Aquarium.

"It was very horrific," said Lt. Kevin Kraus of the Pittsburgh police, who added that the dogs attacked "immediately" after the boy's fall.

When the boy fell, other visitors immediately told staff members, who responded along with Pittsburgh police. Zookeepers called off some of the dogs, and seven of them immediately went to a back building. Three more eventually were drawn away from the child, but the last dog was aggressive and police had to shoot the animal, officials say.

http://news.yahoo.com/2-old-boy-kill...234149458.html

WildCat · 4th November 2012, 07:28 PM

Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger

Why? Because a fine or a few months in jail must be added to their already horrific pain?

Would you feel the same if the parent had killed the kid driving drunk? Left a loaded gun in the crib?

mikedenk · 4th November 2012, 07:40 PM

Originally Posted by smartcooky

Why would you even put the kid up there in the first place? the barriers are there to separate people from danger, not for stupid parents to perch their children on.

How long will it be before someone plunges 500 feet to their death off the Grand Canyon Skywalk?

We can make all the "safety" designs we like for these kinds of things, but we cannot be 100% sure of protecting people from their own (or their parents) stupidity.

QFT.

Regardless, the zoo will probably be sued into oblivion.

kerikiwi · 4th November 2012, 09:48 PM

Originally Posted by Hallo Alfie

...The coroner cleared her (formerly) earlier this year.

And latterly? Has she been uncleared?

Hallo Alfie · 4th November 2012, 09:59 PM

Originally Posted by kerikiwi

And latterly? Has she been uncleared?

LOL

whoops

rjh01 · 4th November 2012, 11:46 PM

There is a crocodile enclosure I visited once. You could easily lean over the top of the rail and look down at the crocodile. There was a notice that said if you fell in and the fall did not kill you then the crocodile would!

The trouble with putting a high fence in so that parents cannot put their children on top is that the fence ruins the view for the rest of us.

I think any parent whose child dies from the parent's own stupidity should not be allowed to have any more children.

Caper · 4th November 2012, 11:56 PM

Originally Posted by WildCat

There should be criminal charges on the parent who put the kid up there.

African wild dogs are nasty nasty nasty, basically eat their prey to death.

Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger

Why? Because a fine or a few months in jail must be added to their already horrific pain?

Originally Posted by WildCat

Would you feel the same if the parent had killed the kid driving drunk? Left a loaded gun in the crib?

I wouldn't say that is akin to leaving a gun in the crib. Maybe akin to leaving a gun on a table and having a kid find it and shoot himself. I can't see how society or anyone else is served by punishing this women. If it were me.... I would want to put a bullet in my head. She may never live another happy day in her life....... that's punishment enough.

Caper · 5th November 2012, 12:06 AM

I am also surprised the mother didn't jump in after her son..... I really can't think of many parents that wouldn't have done it.

truethat · 5th November 2012, 12:09 AM

I would imagine I'd have jumped after him as well.

TheShadow · 5th November 2012, 12:18 AM

Originally Posted by EventHorizon

That's a good point but going back to the original story, I wanna know what PETA's reaction will be when they find out people are painting dogs!

Just wanted to thank you for that... got a nice laugh from it.

I needed it tonight....

smartcooky · 5th November 2012, 12:21 AM

Originally Posted by rjh01

The trouble with putting a high fence in so that parents cannot put their children on top is that the fence ruins the view for the rest of us.

rjh01 · 5th November 2012, 12:39 AM

Originally Posted by smartcooky

http://www.richmondglass.co.nz/sites...20v%20good.jpg

Very hard to take decent pictures through glass. Glass gets dirty easily and also reflections light.

smartcooky · 5th November 2012, 01:51 AM

Originally Posted by rjh01

Very hard to take decent pictures through glass. Glass gets dirty easily and also reflections light.

Here's a couple of tips for you.
1. Make sure your flash is turned off - it's this flash mode on your camera

.

2. Rest the front end of the camera lens (carefully) right against the glass.

You will not see a reflection, and any dirt or marks on the glass will be far enough away from the autofocus range of your camera that they will;
(a) not cause the autofocus to to seek or lock onto them, and
(b) be out of focus so that you won't see them.

Unless you are a professional photographer, you will never be able to tell the difference.

Beerina · 5th November 2012, 04:11 AM

Originally Posted by Slocie's

You bet your ass i would have, I don't know the facts of the case but it seems like the logical thing to have done.

Certainly several humans would scare off the dogs.

angrysoba · 5th November 2012, 05:48 AM

Terrible story. Not much to learn from it.

WildCat · 5th November 2012, 05:59 AM

Originally Posted by Caper

I wouldn't say that is akin to leaving a gun in the crib. Maybe akin to leaving a gun on a table and having a kid find it and shoot himself. I can't see how society or anyone else is served by punishing this women. If it were me.... I would want to put a bullet in my head. She may never live another happy day in her life....... that's punishment enough.

So parents who kill their children through their own reckless negligence should never be charged with a crime?

WildCat · 5th November 2012, 06:00 AM

Originally Posted by rjh01

Very hard to take decent pictures through glass. Glass gets dirty easily and also reflections light.

Even worse is people scratch graffitti in it, and after a few years you can hardly see through it.

svenax · 5th November 2012, 06:05 AM

Originally Posted by WildCat

African wild dogs are nasty nasty nasty, basically eat their prey to death.

Would be even worse if they didn't kill their prey, but just kept nibbling at it, no?

fagin · 5th November 2012, 06:06 AM

Originally Posted by Beerina

Certainly several humans would scare off the dogs.

You think? Those things are mean, nasty, vicious, have jaws that crush bone, and hunt in packs.
Think of a pack of pit bulls on steroids.
My kid, maybe, just maybe. Someone else's, no way.

4th November 2012, 11:50 AM	#1
JoeBentley Self Employed Remittance Man Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Norfolk, VA Posts: 1,762	Pack of African painted dogs kill 3 year old at Pittsburgh Zoo. CNN: http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2012/11/04...ild/?hpt=hp_t4 Quote: A group of African painted dogs killed a boy who fell into their exhibit today at the Pittsburgh Zoo.
	__________________ - Opinions require evidence and no before you ask defining something as "Something doesn't require evidence" doesn't count. - In extreme cases continuing to be wrong when you've been repeatedly proven to be wrong is a form of rudeness. - Major in philosophy. That way you can also ask people "why" they would like fries would that.

4th November 2012, 12:06 PM	#2
Vortigern99 Philosopher Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Austin, TX Posts: 5,010	He "fell off an observation deck that's about 14 feet above the exhibit," she said, "and was killed by the dogs." How did he fall off? What kind of railing is there to keep small children from slipping through bars? What exactly occurred here? The article doesn't give enough details.
	__________________ "I'm 'willing to admit' any fact that can be shown to be evidential and certain." -- Vortigern99 / Noah D. Henson "One thing we've learned (and the Internet confirms this) is that humans will screw just about anything." -- Theagenes

4th November 2012, 01:32 PM	#3
rjh01 Gentleman of leisure Tagger Join Date: May 2005 Location: Planet Earth Posts: 17,164	The boy probably climbed over the fence. I would like to know what sort of fence they did have that allowed for this accident to happen.
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4th November 2012, 02:10 PM	#4
Rat Not bored. Never bored. Moderator Join Date: May 2003 Location: Leicester, UK Posts: 7,050	At all the zoos that I go to, the parents lift up their children and stand them on the safety rails or fences. Not necessarily saying that's what happened here, but it worries me every time I see it.
	__________________ "Man muß den Menschen vor allem nach seinen Lastern beurteilen. Tugenden können vorgetäuscht sein. Laster sind echt." - Klaus Kinski UKLS 1988- Sitting on the fence throwing stones at both sides.

4th November 2012, 02:16 PM	#5
Halfcentaur Philosopher Join Date: Jun 2010 Posts: 5,935	This is a terrible thing, but it's a shame things like this cause people to say such moronic crap as they desperately try to blame and claim what they would do in the situation and why the parents deserve to die or be imprisoned. People seem to just hate the idea that accidents can happen. I truly hope the zoo had an adequately secure enclosure and this is a case of a tenaciously curious and daring boy doing something unusual in a moment without supervision. My older brother climbed into the grizzly bear closure apparently when he was 4 at the zoo. Luckily the bear just stared at him and didn't feel like sitting up.
Halfcentaur Philosopher Join Date: Jun 2010 Posts: 5,935

4th November 2012, 02:24 PM	#6
JoeBentley Self Employed Remittance Man Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Norfolk, VA Posts: 1,762	I have not been to the Pittsburgh Zoo specifically, but I honestly can't remember the last time I went to a major zoo that was setup in such a way that you could really "fall in" to an animal enclosure on "accident."
	__________________ - Opinions require evidence and no before you ask defining something as "Something doesn't require evidence" doesn't count. - In extreme cases continuing to be wrong when you've been repeatedly proven to be wrong is a form of rudeness. - Major in philosophy. That way you can also ask people "why" they would like fries would that.

4th November 2012, 04:11 PM	#7
bookworm Muse Join Date: Nov 2011 Posts: 534	I've been to the Pittsburgh zoo. I remember this exhibit. There is an observation deck with a net spread underneath but at the time I still thought the ground seemed a little too close for comfort. It seems that the mother was holding him on top of the railing and he fell. I can see how he would have rolled off of the net. This is unimaginably horrible. I really feel that these exhibits should be made with NO POSSIBILITY of someone getting in there.
bookworm Muse Join Date: Nov 2011 Posts: 534

4th November 2012, 04:17 PM	#8
korenyx Muse Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: 19th Century Kansas Posts: 827	Originally Posted by JoeBentley I have not been to the Pittsburgh Zoo specifically, but I honestly can't remember the last time I went to a major zoo that was setup in such a way that you could really "fall in" to an animal enclosure on "accident." The Sedgwick Country Zoo (www.scz.org) changed the Amur Leopard exhibit after a kid on a school trip almost got his face ripped off. He ducked under the bars on top of the four foot high barrier, climbed the barrier and crossed about 20 feet of ground. He got too close to the cage; she grabbed his head with her claws and tried to bite him. A male visitor got the kid away from the leopard. The exhibit has now been changed and the new fence is harder to climb. After this happened the public schools decided to tell students that wild animals are dangerous! Who knew? P. S. Everyone I talked to afterwards blamed the kid for ignoring the signs and climbing the barrier. The leopard was put back on display after her cage was fixed.

4th November 2012, 04:28 PM	#9
bookworm Muse Join Date: Nov 2011 Posts: 534	Originally Posted by korenyx The Sedgwick Country Zoo (www.scz.org) changed the Amur Leopard exhibit after a kid on a school trip almost got his face ripped off. He ducked under the bars on top of the four foot high barrier, climbed the barrier and crossed about 20 feet of ground. He got too close to the cage; she grabbed his head with her claws and tried to bite him. A male visitor got the kid away from the leopard. The exhibit has now been changed and the new fence is harder to climb. After this happened the public schools decided to tell students that wild animals are dangerous! Who knew? P. S. Everyone I talked to afterwards blamed the kid for ignoring the signs and climbing the barrier. The leopard was put back on display after her cage was fixed. The thing is that kids do these kinds of things because it's what kids do. There should be no way a kid can get in a dangerous animal's exhibit.
bookworm Muse Join Date: Nov 2011 Posts: 534

4th November 2012, 04:46 PM	#10
korenyx Muse Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: 19th Century Kansas Posts: 827	Originally Posted by bookworm The thing is that kids do these kinds of things because it's what kids do. There should be no way a kid can get in a dangerous animal's exhibit. No one had done it before so maybe the zoo thought no one could. I still blame the kid; he could read and he was old enough to know better. I also blame the teacher for not keeping better track of him.
	Last edited by korenyx; 4th November 2012 at 04:49 PM.

4th November 2012, 05:00 PM	#11
Skeptic Ginger formerly skeptigirl Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Shifting through paradigms Posts: 40,503	While my heart goes out to this mom, how anyone could let a 2 or 3 yr old slip off a railing like that is mind boggling. If you're going to put the kid up there, you only do it with a really firm grip. And dogs or not, if that were my kid, I'd have jumped in right behind him.
	__________________ (Tired of continuing to hear the "Democrat Party" repeatedly I've decided to adopt the name, ~~Pubbie Party, Repubs~~ "Republics" and Republic Party in response.) Last edited by Skeptic Ginger; 4th November 2012 at 05:01 PM.*

4th November 2012, 05:05 PM	#12
Denver Philosopher Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Denver, Colorado Posts: 6,595	Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger While my heart goes out to this mom, how anyone could let a 2 or 3 yr old slip off a railing like that is mind boggling. If you're going to put the kid up there, you only do it with a really firm grip. And dogs or not, if that were my kid, I'd have jumped in right behind him. It's terrible to imagine the horror of a parent having to witness this. ETA: It's possible the fall killed the kid. I hope that was the case.
	__________________ Dreams inevitably lead to hideous implosions -- Invader Zim Last edited by Denver; 4th November 2012 at 05:11 PM.

4th November 2012, 05:15 PM	#13
smartcooky Muse Join Date: Oct 2012 Location: Nelson, New Zealand Posts: 882	Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger While my heart goes out to this mom, how anyone could let a 2 or 3 yr old slip off a railing like that is mind boggling. If you're going to put the kid up there, you only do it with a really firm grip. And dogs or not, if that were my kid, I'd have jumped in right behind him. Why would you even put the kid up there in the first place? the barriers are there to separate people from danger, not for stupid parents to perch their children on. How long will it be before someone plunges 500 feet to their death off the Grand Canyon Skywalk? We can make all the "safety" designs we like for these kinds of things, but we cannot be 100% sure of protecting people from their own (or their parents) stupidity.

4th November 2012, 05:28 PM	#14
WildCat NWO Master Conspirator Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Albany Park, Chicago Posts: 48,973	There should be criminal charges on the parent who put the kid up there. African wild dogs are nasty nasty nasty, basically eat their prey to death.

4th November 2012, 05:31 PM	#15
Skeptic Ginger formerly skeptigirl Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Shifting through paradigms Posts: 40,503	Originally Posted by WildCat There should be criminal charges on the parent who put the kid up there.... Why? Because a fine or a few months in jail must be added to their already horrific pain?
	__________________ (Tired of continuing to hear the "Democrat Party" repeatedly I've decided to adopt the name, ~~Pubbie Party, Repubs~~ "Republics" and Republic Party in response.) Last edited by Skeptic Ginger; 4th November 2012 at 06:43 PM.*

4th November 2012, 06:29 PM	#16
Pulvinar Muse Join Date: Aug 2009 Posts: 816	When they're done fixing that enclosure they should take a look outside: there are parents walking their kids down sidewalks! Next to speeding cars!! With no barriers!!!
Pulvinar Muse Join Date: Aug 2009 Posts: 816

4th November 2012, 06:33 PM	#17
EventHorizon Atheist Tergiversator Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: New Jersey Posts: 2,840	Originally Posted by Pulvinar When they're done fixing that enclosure they should take a look outside: there are parents walking their kids down sidewalks! Next to speeding cars!! With no barriers!!! That's a good point but going back to the original story, I wanna know what PETA's reaction will be when they find out people are painting dogs!
	__________________ "One of the hardest parts of being an active skeptic - of anything - is knowing when to cut your losses, and then doing so." -Phil Plait

4th November 2012, 06:35 PM	#18
RedRatSnake Slithering Through life Join Date: May 2008 Location: Southie, Massachusetts. Posts: 1,625	Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger While my heart goes out to this mom, how anyone could let a 2 or 3 yr old slip off a railing like that is mind boggling. If you're going to put the kid up there, you only do it with a really firm grip. And dogs or not, if that were my kid, I'd have jumped in right behind him. You bet your ass i would have, I don't know the facts of the case but it seems like the logical thing to have done.

4th November 2012, 07:06 PM	#19
TheShadow Scholar Join Date: Sep 2012 Location: Just North of Gotham Posts: 76	I just want to know why they couldnt have been Australian wild dogs.... Then i could finally say " a dingo ate her baby" and have it be true.... Yes, I'm well aware of my tasteless and dark sense of humor. I would apologize, but I have little sympathy for stupid people. If you're going to hold your child on top of a railing (which i'd never do), then you'd damn welll better make sure you have a firm grip on him/her.

4th November 2012, 07:12 PM	#20
Hallo Alfie Alexithymically superadjusted Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Melbourne Australia Posts: 9,997	Originally Posted by TheShadow I just want to know why they couldnt have been Australian wild dogs.... Then i could finally say " a dingo ate her baby" and have it be true.... It actually was true that Azaria Chamberlain was teken by a dingo. The coroner cleared her (formerly) earlier this year. http://tv.ibtimes.com/lindy-chamberl...lled-baby-4755 Originally Posted by TheShadow I would apologize, but I have little sympathy for stupid people. If you're going to hold your child on top of a railing (which i'd never do), then you'd damn welll better make sure you have a firm grip on him/her. Exactly, tugs of war with wild dogs over a baby can be messy; one needs a strong grip.
	__________________ Alfie is a real goose. Lionking http://forums.randi.org/member.php?u=14601 'Sex by surprise is a form of "rape" unknown outside of Sweden.' Bit Pattern http://forums.randi.org/showthread.p...91#post8776491 'Show me a young conservative and I'll show you someone with no heart. Show me an old liberal and I'll show you someone with no brains.' Francois Guizot

4th November 2012, 07:14 PM	#21
JoeBentley Self Employed Remittance Man Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Norfolk, VA Posts: 1,762	If they want to make exhibits more secure they could put dangerous animals in them that would attack people that enter. Part of the way they make these exhibits secure is to post rules as to what you can and can't do around the exhibits. It's a nice idea to go "Make it impossible to get in them!" but that's not reasonable. You can't expect a zoo to keep people out of an exhibit in they are intent upon breaking the rules put in place to keep them out of the exhibit. Something happening because someone didn't follow the rules isn't a design flaw in the exhibit. It's terrible that a perfectly innocent child is the one that paid the price for this, but it's not the zoo's fault from the scenario we're being given. (I off course retain the right to modify this as new information is presented in this story.)
	__________________ - Opinions require evidence and no before you ask defining something as "Something doesn't require evidence" doesn't count. - In extreme cases continuing to be wrong when you've been repeatedly proven to be wrong is a form of rudeness. - Major in philosophy. That way you can also ask people "why" they would like fries would that.

4th November 2012, 07:25 PM	#22
RedRatSnake Slithering Through life Join Date: May 2008 Location: Southie, Massachusetts. Posts: 1,625	Some new Info. PITTSBURGH (AP) — A 2-year-old boy visiting the Pittsburgh zoo was killed Sunday when he fell off a railing that his mother had put him on top of to view a pack of African painted dogs, who pounced on the child and mauled him, police said. It was not clear whether the boy died from the 11-foot fall into the wild dog exhibit area or from the attack, said Barbara Baker, president and CEO of the Pittsburgh Zoo & PPG Aquarium. "It was very horrific," said Lt. Kevin Kraus of the Pittsburgh police, who added that the dogs attacked "immediately" after the boy's fall. When the boy fell, other visitors immediately told staff members, who responded along with Pittsburgh police. Zookeepers called off some of the dogs, and seven of them immediately went to a back building. Three more eventually were drawn away from the child, but the last dog was aggressive and police had to shoot the animal, officials say. http://news.yahoo.com/2-old-boy-kill...234149458.html

4th November 2012, 07:28 PM	#23
WildCat NWO Master Conspirator Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Albany Park, Chicago Posts: 48,973	Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger Why? Because a fine or a few months in jail must be added to their already horrific pain? Would you feel the same if the parent had killed the kid driving drunk? Left a loaded gun in the crib?

4th November 2012, 07:40 PM	#24
mikedenk Muse Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Midsouth, USA Posts: 786	Originally Posted by smartcooky Why would you even put the kid up there in the first place? the barriers are there to separate people from danger, not for stupid parents to perch their children on. How long will it be before someone plunges 500 feet to their death off the Grand Canyon Skywalk? We can make all the "safety" designs we like for these kinds of things, but we cannot be 100% sure of protecting people from their own (or their parents) stupidity. QFT. Regardless, the zoo will probably be sued into oblivion.

4th November 2012, 09:48 PM	#25
kerikiwi Philosopher Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Bay of Islands NZ Posts: 5,843	Originally Posted by Hallo Alfie ...The coroner cleared her (formerly) earlier this year. And latterly? Has she been uncleared?

4th November 2012, 09:59 PM	#26
Hallo Alfie Alexithymically superadjusted Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Melbourne Australia Posts: 9,997	Originally Posted by kerikiwi And latterly? Has she been uncleared? LOL whoops
	__________________ Alfie is a real goose. Lionking http://forums.randi.org/member.php?u=14601 'Sex by surprise is a form of "rape" unknown outside of Sweden.' Bit Pattern http://forums.randi.org/showthread.p...91#post8776491 'Show me a young conservative and I'll show you someone with no heart. Show me an old liberal and I'll show you someone with no brains.' Francois Guizot

4th November 2012, 11:46 PM	#27
rjh01 Gentleman of leisure Tagger Join Date: May 2005 Location: Planet Earth Posts: 17,164	There is a crocodile enclosure I visited once. You could easily lean over the top of the rail and look down at the crocodile. There was a notice that said if you fell in and the fall did not kill you then the crocodile would! The trouble with putting a high fence in so that parents cannot put their children on top is that the fence ruins the view for the rest of us. I think any parent whose child dies from the parent's own stupidity should not be allowed to have any more children.
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4th November 2012, 11:56 PM	#28
Caper Master Poster Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 2,945	Originally Posted by WildCat There should be criminal charges on the parent who put the kid up there. African wild dogs are nasty nasty nasty, basically eat their prey to death. Originally Posted by Skeptic Ginger Why? Because a fine or a few months in jail must be added to their already horrific pain? Originally Posted by WildCat Would you feel the same if the parent had killed the kid driving drunk? Left a loaded gun in the crib? I wouldn't say that is akin to leaving a gun in the crib. Maybe akin to leaving a gun on a table and having a kid find it and shoot himself. I can't see how society or anyone else is served by punishing this women. If it were me.... I would want to put a bullet in my head. She may never live another happy day in her life....... that's punishment enough.
Caper Master Poster Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 2,945

5th November 2012, 12:06 AM	#29
Caper Master Poster Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 2,945	I am also surprised the mother didn't jump in after her son..... I really can't think of many parents that wouldn't have done it.
Caper Master Poster Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 2,945

5th November 2012, 12:09 AM	#30
truethat Philosopher Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 8,622	I would imagine I'd have jumped after him as well.
truethat Philosopher Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 8,622	__________________ “Do not argue with an idiot they drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.” ― Mark Twain

5th November 2012, 12:18 AM	#31
TheShadow Scholar Join Date: Sep 2012 Location: Just North of Gotham Posts: 76	Originally Posted by EventHorizon That's a good point but going back to the original story, I wanna know what PETA's reaction will be when they find out people are painting dogs! Just wanted to thank you for that... got a nice laugh from it. I needed it tonight....

5th November 2012, 12:21 AM	#32
smartcooky Muse Join Date: Oct 2012 Location: Nelson, New Zealand Posts: 882	Originally Posted by rjh01 The trouble with putting a high fence in so that parents cannot put their children on top is that the fence ruins the view for the rest of us.

5th November 2012, 12:39 AM	#33
rjh01 Gentleman of leisure Tagger Join Date: May 2005 Location: Planet Earth Posts: 17,164	Originally Posted by smartcooky http://www.richmondglass.co.nz/sites...20v%20good.jpg Very hard to take decent pictures through glass. Glass gets dirty easily and also reflections light.
	__________________ dddffffpppqqqq Want to use your computer for something that will make society better? See this thread for details Folding@home

5th November 2012, 01:51 AM	#34
smartcooky Muse Join Date: Oct 2012 Location: Nelson, New Zealand Posts: 882	Originally Posted by rjh01 Very hard to take decent pictures through glass. Glass gets dirty easily and also reflections light. Here's a couple of tips for you. 1. Make sure your flash is turned off - it's this flash mode on your camera . 2. Rest the front end of the camera lens (carefully) right against the glass. You will not see a reflection, and any dirt or marks on the glass will be far enough away from the autofocus range of your camera that they will; (a) not cause the autofocus to to seek or lock onto them, and (b) be out of focus so that you won't see them. Unless you are a professional photographer, you will never be able to tell the difference.

5th November 2012, 04:11 AM	#35
Beerina Sarcastic Conqueror of Notions Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: A floating island above the clouds Posts: 23,835	Originally Posted by Slocie's You bet your ass i would have, I don't know the facts of the case but it seems like the logical thing to have done. Certainly several humans would scare off the dogs.
	__________________ "Great innovations should not be forced [by way of] slender majorities." - Thomas Jefferson The government should nationalize it! Socialized, single-payer video game development and sales *now!* More, cheaper, better games, right? Right?