The BFF V The BFRO Forums

[mikeyx]

Originally Posted by captain koolaid

Bigfootery as church? Yeah, maybe. Sort of. Used to think so, but now I'm not so sure. It certainly has that sort of look to it. But, I don't think the belief factor is as significant anymore, overall (if it ever was). Certainly not with the bigwigs and probably not with many, if not most of the followers. I think Footery is more like a floating campfire yarn circle slash tourist trap. They're not so much gullible, as liars. Colourful liars. It's a sort of an exclusive liars club. Complete with status and prestige. Grand poobah of liars... Exective officer of liars... Chief bottle washer of liars... that sort of thing. It's about telling scary stories and selling coffee mugs. Getting more wide eyed "kiddies" to sit enthralled by monster tales. It's fun and also profitable for some. I don't think they're all that stupid. Well, maybe initially. But I suspect that most know that's it's all fantasy and a jolly wheeze, after a while. But, they carry on the charade as the look on the face of the impressionable is kind of addictive. It's a grand and elaborate prank that isn't hampered by the bucks it generates, here and there. It started as a prank and I don't think it's changed all that much. Just expanded operations and diversified.

Liars (IN SOME CASES) is a bit harsh. But my take on that is with some, they've been doing the squatch thing for a certain time and haven't proven. And if they can't prove it, there must surely be a way to make a buck off it.

Not with all, but with many "celebrity" footers its become about the green.

[GT/CS]

For some of them they have nothing else in their lives. Sadly, all their friends are on the BFF, and it is their entire social life, so when they figure out bigfoot is not a real animal they keep 'believing'.

[tsig]

Originally Posted by GT/CS

For some of them they have nothing else in their lives. Sadly, all their friends are on the BFF, and it is their entire social life, so when they figure out bigfoot is not a real animal they keep 'believing'.

As do many who fill the church pews every Sunday.

[Gilbert Syndrome]

Originally Posted by LTC8K6

It's hard to bash what you aren't allowed to participate in?

That would be my guess. Sceptics are sort of allowed on BFF.

Not so much on BFRO.

I've never been a member of either, so I'm only guessing.

Well, that's half true. Skeptics are allowed on the BFF, but they aren't allowed to say much. I myself was banned in one day, but then again, I did hassle them, because that's the kinda thing i'm into.

[Gilbert Syndrome]

Originally Posted by RayG

I just think bigfoot can be discussed without things getting personal.RayG

Things don't really need to get personal for a person to be kicked out of the BFF. I was banned in 24 hours, and never once attacked anyone personally.

It's basically just a play-group for overgrown children, where they can roam free across metaphorical pastures green, hand-in-hand with Sasquatch.

[Gilbert Syndrome]

Originally Posted by Jodie

I guess I was being one of those fake skeptics for begging the question and not discussing science and truth. I'll remember that criteria the next time the authentic skeptics start one upping each other with the kindergarten banter.

Personally, I think I would just walk away if I saw a big hairy ape man and not bother to mention it to anyone knowing what I know now. I'm not overly concerned about the negative, it would be the positive reinforcement from the die hard footers that would put me off.

Well, it depends on whether you actually saw something, considering the fact that Bigfoot doesn't exist, believers are put into 3 groups: the one's who think they saw something, the one's who were hoaxed, and the one's who're talking bollocks for the sake of it.

If I was certain I'd seen something real, then yes, I'd tell someone. Assuming I wasn't intoxicated in any way.

If I were to see Bigfoot, of course I'd tell people, even knowing what I know about the possible "backlash" I'd receive. Who cares?

I don't believe that anyone has ever seen an actual Bigfoot, though.

[Gilbert Syndrome]

Originally Posted by OntarioSquatch

The BFF is like a church for us bleevers. Jk lol

Freudian Slip!

[captain koolaid]

Originally Posted by mikeyx

Liars (IN SOME CASES) is a bit harsh. But my take on that is with some, they've been doing the squatch thing for a certain time and haven't proven. And if they can't prove it, there must surely be a way to make a buck off it.

Not with all, but with many "celebrity" footers its become about the green.

Definitely agree with your point about some being in it mostly, if not entirely for the bucks. But, I dunno about the liars thing being too harsh. I used to cut Footery a fair bit of slack, but, I guess I've gotten cynical. Anyway I suspect, in the most part, it's a fair assessment.

For those who aren't really interested or involved, I can see how one might be deceived by the tales and accept it. But, after you've entered the world of Footery seriously, it becomes all about the prank, the woods and wildmen and telling porkies. People have been doing this sort of thing for a very, very long time. It's a campfire legend. A modern tribal boogeyman. It's a lie told by liars. But, it's a funny lie. A prank. A sort of meme. Some might be doing a good job of convincing themselves of the lie, but that's part of role playing.

Originally Posted by GT/CS

For some of them they have nothing else in their lives. Sadly, all their friends are on the BFF, and it is their entire social life, so when they figure out bigfoot is not a real animal they keep 'believing'.

Can't argue with that. One way or another, I suspect they know it's all just a story.

[RedRatSnake]

Originally Posted by captain koolaid

For those who aren't really interested or involved, I can see how one might be deceived by the tales and accept it. But, after you've entered the world of Footery seriously, it becomes all about the prank, the woods and wildmen and telling porkies. People have been doing this sort of thing for a very, very long time. It's a campfire legend. A modern tribal boogeyman. It's a lie told by liars. But, it's a funny lie. A prank. A sort of meme. Some might be doing a good job of convincing themselves of the lie, but that's part of role playing.

Well with that, I can see some of us are out of a job, No use in trying to explain footers after that post, I'm going to go have a few pops and think of a new hobby now ~

[I am Bigfoot]

Originally Posted by captain koolaid

Can't argue with that. One way or another, I suspect they know it's all just a story.

I think you're really giving them too much credit for being in on it all. I mean christians and hindus really do believe in their crazy stories (at least to some extent).

Looking around BFF you find people that are arguing that the US government is covering up bigfoot because of the profit the govt. stands to make from doing so. And other people eat it up. Other people trying to link bigfoot and Mothman as maybe being the same thing or similar.

I'd find your point more convincing if these people were establishing like fully fleshed out and cogent fictions; short stories about crazy woods monsters. Instead, it's more like a bunch of random ideas and random speculations.

Really, the only thing that puts me kind of in your "they all know" camp is that none of them really fight over details so much. (That I have seen). I don't see any evidence that they are over there trying to piece together all the available information on a living creature and sort out the wheat from the chaff. It's a bunch of wildly different and frequently contradictory "facts" that no one seems to interested in trying to make sense of except when a skeptic speaks up.

[captain koolaid]

Originally Posted by I am Bigfoot

I think you're really giving them too much credit for being in on it all. I mean christians and hindus really do believe in their crazy stories (at least to some extent).

Looking around BFF you find people that are arguing that the US government is covering up bigfoot because of the profit the govt. stands to make from doing so. And other people eat it up. Other people trying to link bigfoot and Mothman as maybe being the same thing or similar.

I'd find your point more convincing if these people were establishing like fully fleshed out and cogent fictions; short stories about crazy woods monsters. Instead, it's more like a bunch of random ideas and random speculations.

Really, the only thing that puts me kind of in your "they all know" camp is that none of them really fight over details so much. (That I have seen). I don't see any evidence that they are over there trying to piece together all the available information on a living creature and sort out the wheat from the chaff. It's a bunch of wildly different and frequently contradictory "facts" that no one seems to interested in trying to make sense of except when a skeptic speaks up.

I didn't specify a definite all. But, maybe pretty much all. Wasn't really considering the deranged in the assessment, anyway. But no matter how wacky some may seem, I think they come to know. The whole govt/NSA/MIB type thing I see as simply more stories to enhance the original story. The trouble with Bigfoot is that it is actually less believeable than other crazy stuff. Chupacabras? Elusive alien hybrid CIA experiment. They probably dissolve, or something... Little grey men? They're aliens. Who knows what they do... Ghosts? Well, they're ghosts... And so on. Chalk it up to magic, or something. But, Bigfoot is this real, undocumented, 8 foot 500 pound behemoth, that is everywhere. He's in your dumpster, your trailer park, your backyard. Yet, Biggie just won't show up when you need him. Biggie is like some deadbeat friend. Ironically, I think that those who adhere to magic Bigfoot, interdimensional, time travelling sasquatch, are possibly not engaged in active deception. Historian wasn't a liar. He was simply crazy.

These Footers (in general) know it's all crap. Bigfoot can't be everywhere the reports and stories say he is and have nothing to show for it. Footers know that the reports are lies. When you rule out 90% as lies and 10% might be lies, they understand it's a big joke based on telling whoppers. They embrace it, or go rogue. I doubt that most with their own stories of encounters think they really saw Bigfoot. I doubt that they even think it might be Bigfoot. They know it was never Bigfoot. It's all role playing and yarn spinning.

If the original prank had stayed this super-rare, elusive wood ape in a tiny area, then maybe I could believe that they're just gullible, or hopeful. But, it's not like that. It got out of control rather quickly and now Bigfoot is in the everglades, opening pork and beans with a screwdriver, eating garlic in Tennessee, in back yards in New York and whatnot. It's a club of hucksters and tall story artists. Some are in it to grift, some for the pranking, some to simply socialise with other fibbers.

Not trying to tell you that this is fact. It's just my opinion. I reckon that they're not, as a whole, a bunch of simple feebs. They're just liars.

[Jodie]

My experience with the footers, and this was how I felt about it while I was there on the BFF, was "Everyone else's stuff is crap except mine". The majority didn't necessarily believe any of it except what they said they personally experienced, and they didn't want to hear any real questioning about their experience, no matter how polite it was, from anyone else.

That's the thing about the BFF and BFRO that is bad, by sharing so much it makes it easier for the lunatic fringe to confabulate something that matches what most say they experience. You can no longer seperate the wheat from the chaff so all of the reports, all the stories, are pretty much useless. That's what I think the footers fail to understand about it all. Now with the "Finding Bigfoot" show on the air I imagine you'll get reports in Hawaii before too long, if it hasn't happened already.

[StankApe]

and an ensuing rationalization of how they got there from the hardcore bleevers

[Jodie]

They were stow aways on cruise ships because they smelled the food. I can hear it now.

[StankApe]

too late!

http://www.bigfootencounters.com/sbs/aikanaka.htm

http://www.bigfootbuzz.net/bigfoot-c...iian-mountain/

http://www.bigfoothawaii.com/aboutus.html

[Jodie]

And I thought I was being facetious, seriously? How do you hide something like that in Hawaii, in a lava tube?

[StankApe]

who knows.... I wonder what the bleevers on the BFF would say if presented with these "sightings"? Would they dare question their own claim of "well the sheer number of sightings mean that SOME of them HAVE to be true"?

Would they laugh and say "obviously people have misidentified a known animal"?

Would they say "wow, Bigfoot in Hawaii too? PROOF!!"

I suspect you would hear all 3

[Jodie]

LOLOL....yeah, you would.

[Resume]

,

Originally Posted by Jodie

And I thought I was being facetious, seriously? How do you hide something like that in Hawaii, in a lava tube?

Originally Posted by StankApe

who knows.... I wonder what the bleevers on the BFF would say if presented with these "sightings"? Would they dare question their own claim of "well the sheer number of sightings mean that SOME of them HAVE to be true"?

Would they laugh and say "obviously people have misidentified a known animal"?

Would they say "wow, Bigfoot in Hawaii too? PROOF!!"

I suspect you would hear all 3

I guess all y'all missed my Hawaiian Footie song.

(Think Puff the Magic Dragon)

Ahem . . .

Biff the Magic Bigfoot, hid by the sea
where he threw pigs into the surf
on a beach near Hanalei.

Big ole chimp boy Bobo, loved that rascal Biff
went searching for him high and low
until he fell off a cliff.

Needs more verses.

[LashL]

Notwithstanding the earlier clean up and closing of this thread due to multiple breaches by multiple participants, some members have continued to breach the Membership Agreement requiring additional splits to Abandon All Hope and resulting in additional infractions being imposed. Please note that any further breaches will be infracted and could also attract further moderation action including suspensions and even banning if necessary. So, remember, be civil, address the argument rather than attacking other members, stick to the subject matter of the thread, do not try to get around the moderated status of other threads by posting off-topic in this thread, and do not import arguments from other theads or other forums. Thank you in advance for your anticipated cooperation.

Posted By:LashL

[Beaver Hateman]

Originally Posted by StankApe

too late!

http://www.bigfootencounters.com/sbs/aikanaka.htm

http://www.bigfootbuzz.net/bigfoot-c...iian-mountain/

http://www.bigfoothawaii.com/aboutus.html

That third one is patently a joke.

[RedRatSnake]

Is this still accurate anymore for the BFRO. "The only scientific research organization exploring the bigfoot/sasquatch mystery"

It seems to me that in the BF world this is no longer true, with the DNA studies and folks on the BFF having some in's, it looks like the BFRO is lagging way behind in the science department.

[Resume]

Originally Posted by Slocie's

Is this still accurate anymore for the BFRO. "The only scientific research organization exploring the bigfoot/sasquatch mystery"

It seems to me that in the BF world this is no longer true, with the DNA studies and folks on the BFF having some in's, it looks like the BFRO is lagging way behind in the science department.

Because of the current Daisy Debacle, I've finally, with more than a bit of trepidation, had a look at these footer forums. I'm not sure how any of them can blow any sort of scientific trumpet.

Beyond that, how can anyone take any of the **** shovelled on those sites seriously. I mean there are long ass threads with participants who actually believe they have a habituation scenario going on in their backyards. Excluding the hoaxing and attention-whoring, that's some serious crazy.

[Jodie]

LOLOL.....well it makes for entertaining reading.Thinkof it as creative writing or fanfic for bigfoot

[GT/CS]

"Entertaining" is the key word.

I think many of those long-ass threads are just storytellers practicing their craft.

[RedRatSnake]

I got that question because I was going through some of the BF forums and I noticed the BFRO uses that line to differ from the rest, yup it's a joke and I am certainly well~aware real science does not park their cars in the same garage as the BFRO would hope, if your into this BF stuff you know the forums are filled with confused and misguided folks, I just think the BFRO is not the only BF organization anymore using some sort of science, the footers wanted science to take a look and it is ~ Be Fearful of what you ask for.

~~~~~~Now Stop Laughing At Me ~~~~~~ lol

[Jodie]

They only want science to investigate as long as science agrees with the conclusions.

[RedRatSnake]

Thoughts:
I think back to around 2005 ish when the BBF1 and possibly the BFRO had some discussion about bringing science into the search, but it was not a hot topic cause you had the old timers (John Green) research still holding strong, (I could be wrong so chime in), I think it has been the new generation of researchers that convinced themselves so heavily BF is real they begged for science to step cause their perception was this creature must exist was so strong they never figured science would be live or die for BF. ( Needing real BF samples aside of course)

Or ~~~The blurry pictures and crappy footprints were getting old and the new generation footers needed to get with the times to keep the dream alive, so they locate a patsy to fake a BF killing story and have some poor down on her luck do anything for a buck scientist (very loose using scientist) get involved and start this DNA drive going while they continue to write future chapters.

[Resume]

Originally Posted by Jodie

LOLOL.....well it makes for entertaining reading.Thinkof it as creative writing or fanfic for bigfoot

Originally Posted by GT/CS

"Entertaining" is the key word.

I think many of those long-ass threads are just storytellers practicing their craft.

Some of these folks need to take a preparatory workshop then, paying close attention to techniques for suspending disbelief.

[rockinkt]

Originally Posted by Jodie

They only want science to investigate as long as science agrees with the conclusions.

Exactly.

[jerrywayne]

Originally Posted by Jodie

They only want science to investigate as long as science agrees with the conclusions.

Duly noted: conclusions come first.

[jhunter1163]

Originally Posted by jerrywayne

Duly noted: conclusions come first.

That's the way it works in Bigfootery. You start with the conclusion that Bigfoot exists. Then, every footprint and hair and piece of poo you find in the woods is Teh Evidences!!!!eleventy!!!1!!!!1!!

[AttorneyTom]

Yes.. and not only that .. It gets marketed and sold to some.. person.. something.

[RedRatSnake]

Ok~ Hey! WTF: This footer stereo typing has to stop, I just started posting over on the BFF again and within 5 replies of a post I made saying I liked Dr Melrums photo with a human face, instead of the chicken face , I got like 30 likes, these people are cool, you guys are wrong ~

[RedRatSnake]

No I am not drinking any cool aid, I'm a beer guy I do have to say that the BFF does have the advantage when it comes to being able to question evidence, sightings and claims, etc, there are more skeptics than I thought on the BFF, as we know you question one BFRO related sighting and poof ~ you are a troll and get thrown under the bridge.

[AttorneyTom]

Does it really matter ? I mean it seems that you folks get zapped in the end by either of these "organizations" sooner or later ? I almost feel bad for you.. but in the end it is BF'ery... so.. not so much.

When you join a cult.. expect them to turn on you when you question their core.

I suppose it is interesting.

Why join the Cult ? I mean really, BF ? Why not something more plausible ? Perhaps saving amphibians that have deformed feet or something ?

It is an outdoor thing and actually exists ? Or maybe an endangered species (that exists) like the California Condor or a snail darter in TN.. or stopping the Asian Carp from entering the Great Lakes System.. or the last remaining native Brook Trout habitat in NE OH.. or.. ___________ fill it in.

Must be nice to have a place to land after all of that ? Pop over and start a discussion about the differences of the Bf'er sites and how they treat their BF folk. Like I said before... Interesting...

[RedRatSnake]

Wow! I did not see that coming.

[AttorneyTom]

Just saying. Must be nice to have a place to land after the pro BF sites "let folks go".

Nothing wrong with it btw... Interesting
No self reflection periods.. time outs. just bounce out of one place and jump into another that is totally the opposite.

My assumption is that most have been banned for some reason or another from the pro BF sites and they just come here because they have no other outlet for their BF issues/compulsions ? Then they complain about the reasons they arent there anymore. I cant say any of the complaints involve not believing in BF. Seems like all of them or most involve people in the organization

Anyway.. This is why I like this site. What other one would alllow a a bunch of folks that were or still are believers in BF to show up and post a topic and establish a "which wacky BF Believer Thread" comparison ?

I would suggest that those that are having trouble cominng to terms about their "mythical beliefs" about BF should perhaps start their own landing zones and websites rather than showing up here ? I mean it would be helpful to talk about the BF cult together in one place ? Not sure why anyone with those issues would want to be here.. I mean . We dont think the thing exists !

Unlike these sites that are listed the people here are quite understanding and tolerant of the cult you are trying to leave.
It is interesting to see . Also entertaining.

[rockinkt]

In the interest of fairness - I would like to point out that Slocie's (who some of us know better as Red Rat Snake) left the BFF as a skeptic.
He has since posted there as a skeptic and roused the ire of many who do not like the fact that people can be drawn to the BFF based on false evidence and groundless premises in the popular media; and then, finding the evidence to be false, falsified, or totally lacking in reality - denounce the whole thing as woo.

AttorneyTom - I think you owe the man an apology. (However, I do think your post is true of others on here).

[Resume]

Originally Posted by AttorneyTom

Just saying. Must be nice to have a place to land after the pro BF sites "let folks go".

Nothing wrong with it btw... Interesting
No self reflection periods.. time outs. just bounce out of one place and jump into another that is totally the opposite.

My assumption is that most have been banned for some reason or another from the pro BF sites and they just come here because they have no other outlet for their BF issues/compulsions ? Then they complain about the reasons they arent there anymore. I cant say any of the complaints involve not believing in BF. Seems like all of them or most involve people in the organization

Anyway.. This is why I like this site. What other one would alllow a a bunch of folks that were or still are believers in BF to show up and post a topic and establish a "which wacky BF Believer Thread" comparison ?

I would suggest that those that are having trouble cominng to terms about their "mythical beliefs" about BF should perhaps start their own landing zones and websites rather than showing up here ? I mean it would be helpful to talk about the BF cult together in one place ? Not sure why anyone with those issues would want to be here.. I mean . We dont think the thing exists !

Unlike these sites that are listed the people here are quite understanding and tolerant of the cult you are trying to leave.
It is interesting to see . Also entertaining.

Ward, I think you're being a bit hard on the Beaver . . .

Having typed that I think your point is well taken; a visit to any of these cult websites is an interesting look at poor thinking and poorer science. The oftener the curious come here though, the more they make progress and I think some even come to the conclusion that there indeed is no monkey to be found.

The others, well, they're entertaining.