Thinking about joining scientology

[dafydd]

Originally Posted by MNBrant

I am afraid of being bored by their interesting cult.

Giving the cult lots of cash would get boring. Stay away from it, please.

[DragonLady]

Originally Posted by MNBrant

bears trolling. I do take medication but am not on disability. Like I said they didnt call. I got weeded out. I am getting ready at age 49 to go back to school for computer technology and accounting. I am not afraid that they would hook me into their interesting cult. I am afraid of being bored by their interesting cult.

Okay; I'm glad to hear that.

[hgc]

Originally Posted by MNBrant

They were going to call at 11am but didn't. I might have failed the test. Perhaps purposefully. The test seems designed to screen out problem peoples. Schizophrenics would be problematic because they get too many hits and make too many connections to be considered entirely credible. I think there is some evidence to support their views on psychiatrists but I don't view them as negatively as they seem to.

The test is designed for one thing only -- to make the mark think that he took some kind of a test that can provide insight into his spiritual needs (their "ruin," in Scn terms).

It's quite possible, if they already know that you're medicated for mental illness, they may give you a pass. Consider yourself lucky.

If they do call, I recommend you ask the rice-and-beans nourished slug on the other end:

- Was Hubbard taking anti-anxiety medications at the time of his death, Vistaril for instance?

- Why was Lisa McPherson kept prisoner in a Scientology hotel for 10 days while she slowly died from dehydration and starvation?

- Did you know who Debbie Cook is? She used to run Flag Land Base for 17 years. What ever came of her?

- Is Hubbard a nuclear physicist, as he claimed? From what universities did he receive his advanced degree(s)?

Seriously though. Don't ask these questions. Just tell them that you were somnambulating when you visited, and now that you've awoken, you will not be taking the cans in hand.

[MNBrant]

Originally Posted by hgc

The test is designed for one thing only -- to make the mark think that he took some kind of a test that can provide insight into his spiritual needs (their "ruin," in Scn terms).

It's quite possible, if they already know that you're medicated for mental illness, they may give you a pass. Consider yourself lucky.

If they do call, I recommend you ask the rice-and-beans nourished slug on the other end:

- Was Hubbard taking anti-anxiety medications at the time of his death, Vistaril for instance?

- Why was Lisa McPherson kept prisoner in a Scientology hotel for 10 days while she slowly died from dehydration and starvation?

- Did you know who Debbie Cook is? She used to run Flag Land Base for 17 years. What ever came of her?

- Is Hubbard a nuclear physicist, as he claimed? From what universities did he receive his advanced degree(s)?

Seriously though. Don't ask these questions. Just tell them that you were somnambulating when you visited, and now that you've awoken, you will not be taking the cans in hand.

I love rice and beans. Ok I got the call around 6pm. The lady didn't know I was from MN. Apparently I applied in MS. I said I lost interest but they turned it around and said while they usually come out to the house to give you the results, she would send it by mail and call and do a 30 min interpretation. Ok, here's what I think she said but can't be sure because I am schizophrenic.
1. Upset that she would have to give me to a different ORG, and/or upset at having to mail the results.
2. noticed and mentioned that I have a cpap machine running.
3. noticed my baby crying and said that I would not be suitable for Sea.Org
4. Said I seemed to be spry for my age
5. Said that I didn't seem to be a spy.
6. Said being schizophrenic is not a problem for joining. (I bet.. that's probably where they get most of their ideas.)
7. seemed kind of nice but I didn't give her a firm no so I really didn't get a hard sell.

[MNBrant]

I will say from reading from the x members posts it seems to be studying lots of tapes and reading reams of stuffs. Not my strong suit. A youtube video of x members doing a toning session looked not unlike my bible study group. A bunch of older folks attending a meeting.

[Pixel42]

Originally Posted by MNBrant

bears trolling.

Are you saying you think my expression of concern for your health is trolling? I hope not, I assure you it is sincere.

Quote:

I do take medication but am not on disability.

My impression from your previous posts is that your health would be affected if you stopped taking your medication. Do you understand that if you joined this church you would almost certainly have to promise to stop doing so?

From the wiki link posted earlier:

Quote:

Following legal actions involving the Church of Scientology's relationship with its members, it has become standard practice within the group for members to sign lengthy legal contracts and waivers before engaging in Scientology services. In 2003, a series of media reports examined the legal contracts required by Scientology, which require that, among other things, Scientology followers deny any and all psychiatric care that their doctors may prescribe to them:

Quote:

I do not believe in or subscribe to psychiatric labels for individuals. It is my strongly held religious belief that all mental problems are spiritual in nature and that there is no such thing as a mentally incompetent person — only those suffering from spiritual upset of one kind or another dramatized by an individual. I reject all psychiatric labels and intend for this Contract to clearly memorialize my desire to be helped exclusively through religious, spiritual means and not through any form of psychiatric treatment, specifically including involuntary commitment based on so-called lack of competence. Under no circumstances, at any time, do I wish to be denied my right to care from members of my religion to the exclusion of psychiatric care or psychiatric directed care, regardless of what any psychiatrist, medical person, designated member of the state or family member may assert supposedly on my behalf.[23]

[MNBrant]

Originally Posted by Pixel42

Are you saying you think my expression of concern for your health is trolling? I hope not, I assure you it is sincere.


My impression from your previous posts is that your health would be affected if you stopped taking your medication. Do you understand that if you joined this church you would almost certainly have to promise to stop doing so?

From the wiki link posted earlier:

Heh, my voices are telling me I am already 0 level and everything will be paid for. With expectations like that do you think I would accept any lesser offer? Actually I can't join sea.org, I have no money, a kid, a wife. I wonder if I would stick with it even if everything would be paid for. like I said I am not one for tapes and lectures.

[Doctor Plop]

I would wait till Radioshack has a sale.

[MNBrant]

Ok, the voices laughed and said, sure we'll pay for everything... And send you the bill. To which I say, when was the last time I ever paid a bill?

[MNBrant]

Also said that if I climbed the bridge I would be the laughingstock of the sky. Ok, that has about as much meaning to me as the devil likes domininos. ;Domino theory? Ok I haven't taken my meds yet and probably need a prn too. My dopamine is running high and the mascarade we call life is slipping away a bit. Oh yeah they called me the biggest bitch they ever met. In greece I guess they used to like to listen to schizophrenics. In modern life this is not so. If I offend don't hesitate to let me know.

[ExMinister]

You don't offend, MNBrant.

But I too am glad you decided against Scientology. Regardless of what you think of the voices, good, bad, or other, it's good to have medications that allow one to function in the masquerade of life when need be.

[Sticky Fingers]

Hey MN. No. You certainly haven't offended me.

And I hope you won't take offense when I say the best course of action right now for
you is to stay on your meds and drop the notion of joining the Scientology ranks.

I am some one who thinks that society in general is over-medicated.......
But I do know some one who has treated schizophrenics,
and going off medication is a common occurence,
and it usually doesn't end up with good results.

Anyway....... I am just curious........

Why would you want to give up a part of your freeedom to join an organization that
would seek a certain level of control over you?

You seem to be a pretty with-it and intelligent guy.
What is the rationale behind this?

[MNBrant]

Well if it led to a good job, probably. I was in the army and while is wasn't a good experience, Some positive things came out of it. I really don't have the skills or patience to work well with a group. I go to bible study and hear things that my friend doesn't hear. I think its actually being said but the emphasis I place on things is different than his.

[MNBrant]

All I have gotten from them so far is an invite to go to a different state to view my results in an email. Are you sure you have current information about this group? You are painting them in a bad light but most of the claims you have made are not current. My voices were right that the orgs are not connected as I havent gotten anything yet from my home state.

[MNBrant]

Hmm, here's the latest email. It seems I am on their list. They end it with there's no cost of obligation of any kind!

Scientology Test Center
Is this email not displaying correctly?
View it in your browser.

Dear Brant,

Several days ago you took the Oxford Capacity Analysis™ personality test online. Your personality test results are waiting for you at the Test Center.

When you arrive, your results will be evaluated by a trained staff member who will cover each of the 10 points of your personality and what these mean for different parts of your life and your future, including:
What is your Stability level?
What is your Happiness level?
What is your Composure level?
What is your Certainty level?
What is your Activity level?
What is your Aggressive level?
What is your Responsibility level?
What is your Correct Estimation level?
What is your Appreciation level?
What is your Communication level?
Remember, there is no cost or obligation of any kind.

What people are saying:

“This test matched my life and what teachers had been saying about me since 4th grade! How amazing!”
-R.S.

“The test was spot-on. It showed that I was very nervous about some new responsibilities that I had just taken on, and it was right—I was nervous! But most amazingly, I actually was taking on new responsibilities! How did the test know that?”
-A.C.

“It was a bit hard for me at first when I took this personality test. It showed a couple of things that I kind of knew were true, but never really wanted to think about. One in particular really stung. I was in denial about it and so when the test showed that I was being overly critical and mean I actually got upset. But regardless, it did end up making me take a good, hard look at myself and I saw that I was actually doing exactly what the test showed! I had just been blind to it! It was the weirdest thing.

“After that, I was able to just stop acting like that. I changed who I was hanging around with. Also, just by being aware that I was acting like that allowed me to stop doing it. The oddest thing about the test was that after I took it, I was able to look back on my life and see that I had been acting like that the whole time, but had never noticed it!”
-N.H.


Find out what the future holds. Sign up for your appointment using our easy online calendar. Click below to schedule:

I guess I have not been waiting all my life to see what my personality is. My psychiatrist had me sign a goals sheet and at least half the recommendations were to try to be less irritable. How does he even know I am irritable? I have only seen him about 5 times. he irritated me with that.

[The Central Scrutinizer]

Originally Posted by MNBrant

What is the cheapest way to get into scientology as I dont have much money to throw around. Not alot of time to volunteer too. Whats the best, and possibly cheapest way to get in?

Jump up and down on a black woman's sofa.

[MNBrant]

Ok I got my stats in the mail. They kind of screwed up some of them big time which is odd because I gave the correct answers.
What is your Stability level? -40 a bit unstable. Accurate
What is your Happiness level? -15 a bit below normal. Accurate
What is your Composure level? -90 nervous correct answer is probably +50 I have lirums to block nervousness so it just sits in the pit of my stomach or chest but doesnt get to my brain.
What is your Certainty level? +50 they list this as desirable. I would say that I am more uncertain than that probably -30
What is your Activity level? +20 somewhat active. true
What is your Aggressive level? +30 about accurate
What is your Responsibility level? -30 irresponsible accurate
What is your Correct Estimation level? -30 critical. yes accurate I am critical of others
What is your Appreciation level? -60 lack of accord. Probably accurate
What is your Communication level? -70 withdrawn. I wouldn't say I was that withdrawn. Probably a -30

There you go I gave them the answer and there were some wrong. Guess they will call me now. Thats the oxford personality test.

[pakeha]

Originally Posted by Pixel42

MNBrant has revealed in other threads that he is a diagnosed schizophrenic who requires medication to remain functional. Please do not encourage him, even in jest, to join a cult that would forbid him to take that essential medication.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scientology_and_psychiatry

All the best, MNBrant.

[hgc]

Originally Posted by MNBrant

Ok I got my stats in the mail. They kind of screwed up some of them big time which is odd because I gave the correct answers.
What is your Stability level? -40 a bit unstable. Accurate
What is your Happiness level? -15 a bit below normal. Accurate
What is your Composure level? -90 nervous correct answer is probably +50 I have lirums to block nervousness so it just sits in the pit of my stomach or chest but doesnt get to my brain.
What is your Certainty level? +50 they list this as desirable. I would say that I am more uncertain than that probably -30
What is your Activity level? +20 somewhat active. true
What is your Aggressive level? +30 about accurate
What is your Responsibility level? -30 irresponsible accurate
What is your Correct Estimation level? -30 critical. yes accurate I am critical of others
What is your Appreciation level? -60 lack of accord. Probably accurate
What is your Communication level? -70 withdrawn. I wouldn't say I was that withdrawn. Probably a -30

There you go I gave them the answer and there were some wrong. Guess they will call me now. Thats the oxford personality test.

Random numbers. You should ask them to show their work.

[devnull]

Originally Posted by MNBrant

Ok, scientology has been in the news lately. I guess they have been doing things worldwide to combat drugs. I am thinking to myself how can I get in on this. What is the cheapest way to get into scientology as I dont have much money to throw around. Not alot of time to volunteer too. Whats the best, and possibly cheapest way to get in? I have self doubts but they are hidden so deep I refuse to acknowledge them. I am wondering if scientology might be the answer? Keep in mind I am poor but have a positive attitude.

Do you often sing or whistle just for fun?

[Stout]

Don't do it dude. seriously, don't

First they'll talk about your positives, yes good they'll say BUT !!! then they'll focus on the negatives and ho boy will they focus on those negatives. They'll tell you they can "fix" those negatives all you need to do is spend money, lots and lots of money.

Everybody fails that test, it's part of the marketing schtick.

[calebprime]

Originally Posted by Stout

Don't do it dude. seriously, don't

First they'll talk about your positives, yes good they'll say BUT !!! then they'll focus on the negatives and ho boy will they focus on those negatives. They'll tell you they can "fix" those negatives all you need to do is spend money, lots and lots of money.

Everybody fails that test, it's part of the marketing schtick.

Don't do it, MNBrant.

These people are very good at extracting money from new recruits -- there's no way to outsmart them at their own game.

At best, you'll have to spend a bunch of time telling them not to bother you. At worst, they'll really give you a hard time.

I know that you are sometimes a little suspicious of people. Don't get on the wrong side of the Scientologists: They can really make your life miserable if you go against them.

Also, if you don't like organizations, this is about the worst gig you could pick. They are very much like multi-level marketing, only worse.

I'm hoping that you're too ornery to get involved with them, too independent.

[Stout]

I took the test in Amsterdam in 1985, I'd been out partying and the test was offered to me by this hot blonde chick, "10 minutes" she said. "just 10 minutes"

I had never ever heard of Scientology

Needless to say once I got upstairs, the hottie disappeared and I was presented a test that took longer than 10 minutes so I just faked the answers. Of course I "failed"

They insisted I buy this series of books and refused to even consider the fact that I was on a bicycle tour as a reason for my not wanting to carry a bunch of expensive books around for months and I finally had to get aggressive to get myself out of there.

Total buzzkill.

Now I hear that when you join up, you're supposed to install special filtering software on your computer. Software that filters out anything critical of Scientology, so bye bye JREF.

You might have to tell them you've been financially ruined with a terminal illness diagnosis to get rid of them now.

[hgc]

Originally Posted by calebprime

Also, if you don't like organizations, this is about the worst gig you could pick. They are very much like multi-level marketing, only worse.

Hubbard picked up his organizational ideas in the US Navy. But this being Hubbard, Scientology turned out more like Hell's navy.

[MNBrant]

No really. They are calling me from a different state. I believe I have gotten two calls, though they could have been bill collectors. I haven't taken it yet. I have been too busy to take them. Your right though, they give you the idea that this could be useful for public speaking and the like.

[MNBrant]

Hmm, No calls today. I googled Scientology news and it was nothing good. Apparently they are trying to sell books from what I hear. They have taken a pretty low key approach with me. I am guessing they got a copy of my credit report or something. I will say that the printout they send me looked like it was printed by an 80's apple printer. I wonder where they get the ink for that. Can you re-ink printer ribbon?

[hgc]

Originally Posted by MNBrant

I will say that the printout they send me looked like it was printed by an 80's apple printer. I wonder where they get the ink for that. Can you re-ink printer ribbon?

80's? That would be an advance. Hubbard left incredibly detailed instructions for how to run a Scientology org, and they follow those instructions to the letter out of fear for their eternal souls. Thus they are operating like it's the 50's.

[FireGarden]

Originally Posted by hgc

80's? That would be an advance. Hubbard left incredibly detailed instructions for how to run a Scientology org, and they follow those instructions to the letter out of fear for their eternal souls. Thus they are operating like it's the 50's.

So they don't have a website?

[hgc]

Originally Posted by FireGarden

So they don't have a website?

Sshhhh.... I don't want MNB to find out about that.

[The Norseman]

Originally Posted by Pixel42

MNBrant has revealed in other threads that he is a diagnosed schizophrenic who requires medication to remain functional. Please do not encourage him, even in jest, to join a cult that would forbid him to take that essential medication.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scientology_and_psychiatry

Yeah, after reading this, I gotta agree.

I take back my encouragement, though I'm still leaning towards this being a total Poe. I dunno. Maybe Dancing David or another JREFfer can give me more accurate details, but I'm rather suspicious that a diagnosed schizophrenic is able to make the kind of subtle and clever jokes that MNBrant makes. Though I could be wrong.

[devnull]

Originally Posted by MNBrant

Can you re-ink printer ribbon?

Yes! I used to do it one my Commodore MPS-803. Works a treat.

ps. Run, dont walk, away from scientology.

[MNBrant]

Yeah, I have been to their website and there was no mention of this anti-drug campaign they were promoting on mainstream news. Typing Scientology news was quite depressing. There are tons of recent complaints about the group that made the news.

I asked my fundamentalist friend about Scientology and he said that every Saturday there was a group of masked individuals who stood around the center and screamed insults at people going into the building. They moved the building to St. Paul. He assumed that they masked people were Christians but, being in masks, who knows?

As far as needing meds to function, I have gone without meds sometimes for months, but the world seems so confusing and bizarre that I prefer not to. I use a technique in which if I see or hear something unusual I do not react to it. The I promptly forget the unusual occurrence seconds later. This has moderate success. Meds have better outcomes, but, now I tend to get physically sick while hallucinating.

[ddt]

Originally Posted by MNBrant

Yeah, I have been to their website and there was no mention of this anti-drug campaign they were promoting on mainstream news. Typing Scientology news was quite depressing. There are tons of recent complaints about the group that made the news.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Citizen...n_Human_Rights

Originally Posted by MNBrant

I asked my fundamentalist friend about Scientology and he said that every Saturday there was a group of masked individuals who stood around the center and screamed insults at people going into the building. They moved the building to St. Paul. He assumed that they masked people were Christians but, being in masks, who knows?

Maybe they were from Anonymous?

Originally Posted by MNBrant

As far as needing meds to function, I have gone without meds sometimes for months, but the world seems so confusing and bizarre that I prefer not to. I use a technique in which if I see or hear something unusual I do not react to it. The I promptly forget the unusual occurrence seconds later. This has moderate success. Meds have better outcomes, but, now I tend to get physically sick while hallucinating.

Nevertheless, stay away from Scientology, they're bad news for you.

[MNBrant]

Originally Posted by ddt

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Citizen...n_Human_Rights


Maybe they were from Anonymous?


Nevertheless, stay away from Scientology, they're bad news for you.

no he was a bus driver who used to see this every saturday till the moved

i am not a big psychiatry booster and somewhat agree with the commissions opinions. i have been experimented on a few time in what i view an unethical manner by a few groups. Drofmindmd on youtube posted a video complaining of the use of schizophrenics as Guinea pigs for a variety of medicines.

[ddt]

Originally Posted by MNBrant

no he was a bus driver who used to see this every saturday till the moved

No, I mean: were those protesters your friend saw every Saturday, people from Anonymous?

[Professor Yaffle]

Originally Posted by The Norseman

but I'm rather suspicious that a diagnosed schizophrenic is able to make the kind of subtle and clever jokes that MNBrant makes. Though I could be wrong.

Why do you think a schizophrenic wouldn't be able to make subtle and clever jokes? I knew someone with schizophrenia when I was at university, and when he was stable he could be one of the wittiest people I knew.

[MNBrant]

Originally Posted by ddt

No, I mean: were those protesters your friend saw every Saturday, people from Anonymous?

they wore masks so Its hard to say. I wouldn't say I am witty. For instance when I say the devil likes domino's; domino theory. The reality is the devil likes to play dominoes period. I wouldn't say that playing dominos with the devil is fun. At first it was. The rest is secret.

[The Norseman]

Originally Posted by Professor Yaffle

Why do you think a schizophrenic wouldn't be able to make subtle and clever jokes? I knew someone with schizophrenia when I was at university, and when he was stable he could be one of the wittiest people I knew.

As I said, I don't know. I have no idea where I got this from. I have no problem admitting I'm wrong. I'm suspicious of his behavior, is all.

I'm not impugning his character; I'm just bringing up a point that -- over time -- I'm finding it harder to believe he's factually mentally ill (according to DSM criteria).

[ddt]

Originally Posted by MNBrant

they wore masks so Its hard to say. I wouldn't say I am witty. For instance when I say the devil likes domino's; domino theory. The reality is the devil likes to play dominoes period. I wouldn't say that playing dominos with the devil is fun. At first it was. The rest is secret.

The masks Anonymous wears are quite distinctive; see the photos in the wiki page I linked to before. You could ask your friend if he recognizes them.

[MNBrant]

Originally Posted by The Norseman

As I said, I don't know. I have no idea where I got this from. I have no problem admitting I'm wrong. I'm suspicious of his behavior, is all.

I'm not impugning his character; I'm just bringing up a point that -- over time -- I'm finding it harder to believe he's factually mentally ill (according to DSM criteria).

Yeah I hide it well. I can, and have, gone to work fully psychotic and nobody noticed the difference.