Do the "Dead Sea Scrolls" prove the Bible wasn't altered? - Page 14

RandFan · 26th February 2013, 02:18 PM

Originally Posted by CplFerro

If you already know there's no God, tsig, why ask further questions?

Cpl Ferro

It's because I don't believe in god which is why I want to know why a god would create humans.

CplFerro · 26th February 2013, 02:19 PM

Originally Posted by Pup

I'm assuming you mean seeing what the apostles claimed they saw in the Bible, as if it was really happening and not just legends, because I don't think it actually happened that way.

But let's go with that and assume they were writing about what they witnessed at the time as honestly and accurately as possible.

If it's limited to "seeing," no, because that's how magic tricks work. The audience doesn't get to investigate the way they want; they can only see what the magician wants them to. Interview people after they leave a David Copperfield act, they'll tell you things they saw that were as miraculous as anything the apostles saw.

If you mean, would I believe if I were present at the time and place of the apostles, and given free reign to investigate using modern knowledge and calling in any modern experts or instruments I chose, I'd say it would depend on how things panned out. If events were happening that are unexplainable by our current understanding of natural laws, it doesn't mean every explanation somebody says about them is true. I'd say, let's first find evidence that somebody can actually walk on water, or that dead people are actually coming out of their graves, and then we'll worry about why such things are happening.

More importantly right now, though, it seems odd to me that you're worried about how open my mind is, when you've already stated that yours is sealed shut.

So please answer my question:

Do you feel having a hardened heart or a closed mind is good when you do it but bad when others do it, if they disagree with you?

Because this sounds to me like the usual situation of somebody who is convinced they can never be wrong. I've run into it in lots of fields, and not noticed any correlation between people being sure they're right, and actually being right, except maybe a slightly negative one.

Dear Pup,

An opened heart and mind to God is good when anyone does it.

Cpl Ferro

CplFerro · 26th February 2013, 02:20 PM

Originally Posted by RandFan

It's because I don't believe in god which is why I want to know why a god would create humans.

If you're inventing gods you don't believe in, RandFan, invent an answer.

Cpl Ferro

CplFerro · 26th February 2013, 02:21 PM

Originally Posted by tsig

Nicholas of Cusa was a Christian mystic who lived during the 1400s. The Vision of God is known as a classic of Christian mysticism, putting many believers in touch with the divine.

Many Christians have a desire to experience God, rather than just believe in Him. Nicholas of Cusa provides an excellent guidebook for Christians who sense something deeper to the Christian experience. He was a mystic. He experienced God on a number of levels and taught people to move beyond mere belief and have similar experiences.

Any particular point you'd like to make?

On Cusa, tsig? No, but if you can help me understand his writing better I would appreciate it.

Cpl Ferro

Akri · 26th February 2013, 02:21 PM

Originally Posted by CplFerro

Dear Pup,

An opened heart and mind to God is good when anyone does it.

Cpl Ferro

That doesn't appear to answer Pup's question, which is whether it's good for you to have a hardened heart or closed mind when dealing with views that disagree with your own. I would be interesting in knowing the answer to that question as well.

Dinwar · 26th February 2013, 02:22 PM

Originally Posted by CplFerro

An opened heart and mind to God is good when anyone does it.

As Chesterton put it, the purpose of a mind is akin to that of a mouth: to open it in order to close it on something solid. Give us something solid--ANYTHING solid. At this point you have precisely two lines of reasoning for believing in God: the fact that you believe it, and the fact that you can't explain it.

RandFan · 26th February 2013, 02:23 PM

Originally Posted by CplFerro

If you're inventing gods you don't believe in, RandFan, invent an answer.

Cpl Ferro

You have no answers about the god you believe in?

CplFerro · 26th February 2013, 02:26 PM

Originally Posted by Akri

If they all fail at logic then none of them are beyond logic, they just all fail at logic.

Because "skepticism" doesn't mean "doubting everything to the point of absurdity".

I said theologians who are better than you.

Would you? Is me saying "I agree completely" a more fun discussion?

And I did read it with an open mind. What I didn't do is read it with an uncritical mind.

Like I said, Akri, you've hardened your heart.

Cpl Ferro

tsig · 26th February 2013, 02:27 PM

Originally Posted by CplFerro

If you already know there's no God, tsig, why ask further questions?

Cpl Ferro

Never stop questioning.

Seems as if the questions are starting to pinch so you are dodging.

Why do you think humans are so valuable that god had to die for them?

CplFerro · 26th February 2013, 02:27 PM

Originally Posted by RandFan

You have no answers about the god you believe in?

Dear RandFan,

I've already given enough answers for those who wish to peruse the thread. I don't need to recycle my replies indefinitely for people who won't believe them anyway.

Cpl Ferro

CplFerro · 26th February 2013, 02:29 PM

Originally Posted by tsig

Never stop questioning.

Seems as if the questions are starting to pinch so you are dodging.

Why do you think humans are so valuable that god had to die for them?

Are you saying you don't think human beings are valuable, tsig?

Cpl Ferro

Akri · 26th February 2013, 02:31 PM

Originally Posted by CplFerro

Like I said, Akri, you've hardened your heart.

Cpl Ferro

If you don't want to address my comments then please have the decency to say so. If you think I'm lying about being open to logic and evidence, then have the decency to say so. Repeatedly claiming that I've hardened my heart is insulting and cowardly, not to mention incredibly hypocritical coming from someone who has outright sated that no evidence will change their beliefs. If you want to accuse someone of heart-hardening look in a mirror, and then consult your god's teachings on specks and planks.

CplFerro · 26th February 2013, 03:26 PM

Originally Posted by Akri

If you don't want to address my comments then please have the decency to say so. If you think I'm lying about being open to logic and evidence, then have the decency to say so. Repeatedly claiming that I've hardened my heart is insulting and cowardly, not to mention incredibly hypocritical coming from someone who has outright sated that no evidence will change their beliefs. If you want to accuse someone of heart-hardening look in a mirror, and then consult your god's teachings on specks and planks.

Dear Akri,

I didn't say you weren't open to logic and evidence, but, that, here, logic and evidence aren't the point. If they were the point, they would be everywhere. Something like Cusa is the point, but you're definitely not open to what he has to say, and that's hardly insulting to you or hypocritical of me to say so.

I never said, "hardening the heart is bad" I said, implicitly, hardening the heart to God is bad. So, don't try to beard me with the Gospel.

And, I overlooked your question, I'm sorry.

Quote:

Would you? Is me saying "I agree completely" a more fun discussion?

If you "got" Cusa's "On the Hidden God" I would wonder after what else of his you "got," as his hunt can be difficult to follow. And beyond that, there are others you might also have insight into, which have eluded me except in a circuitous way.

Cpl Ferro

Akri · 26th February 2013, 03:51 PM

Originally Posted by CplFerro

I didn't say you weren't open to logic and evidence

No, but that's certainly what your posts have implied.

Quote:

but, that, here, logic and evidence aren't the point. If they were the point, they would be everywhere.

It doesn't matter if they're the "point" (point of what? Of this conversation? of God's existence?), what matters is that if your claims are true they should hold up to logical scrutiny and be supportable by evidence.

Quote:

Something like Cusa is the point, but you're definitely not open to what he has to say, and that's hardly insulting to you or hypocritical of me to say so.

This conversation might work better if you actually payed attention to what I say. I've already stated that I was open to what he has to say. What I'm not is uncritical. You're complaining that I didn't accept his statements for no reason (and despite having reasons not to accept them).

Quote:

I never said, "hardening the heart is bad" I said, implicitly, hardening the heart to God is bad.

Accusing me of hardening my heart at all is insulting because I've yet to demonstrate any such hardening. I am open to new ideas. I am open to the idea that I could be wrong about God's existence. Hell, I've tried to have a discussion about exactly what it would take to convince me that I'm wrong, but your immediate response was to accuse me of having a hardened heart. I gave Cusa's dialogue far more consideration than it deserves, and you responded by saying I didn't have an open mind.

My heart is not hardened, and my mind is not closed. If you're tempted to say either of those things again kindly save us both time and just don't.

Quote:

If you "got" Cusa's "On the Hidden God" I would wonder after what else of his you "got," as his hunt can be difficult to follow. And beyond that, there are others you might also have insight into, which have eluded me except in a circuitous way.

Fair enough--that could lead to interesting discussion.

That said, I think the reason I didn't "get" Cusa's dialogue is that there was nothing to get. It was, frankly, vapid.

CplFerro · 26th February 2013, 05:06 PM

Originally Posted by Akri

That said, I think the reason I didn't "get" Cusa's dialogue is that there was nothing to get. It was, frankly, vapid.

In which case what is there to talk about, Akri? God is a vapour.

Cpl Ferro

tsig · 26th February 2013, 07:05 PM

Originally Posted by tsig

Never stop questioning.

Seems as if the questions are starting to pinch so you are dodging.

Why do you think humans are so valuable that god had to die for them?

Originally Posted by CplFerro

Are you saying you don't think human beings are valuable, tsig?

Cpl Ferro

No, I'm asking you why you think humans are valuable to god.

If you don't want to answer please just say so your dodging is becoming way too obvious.

Akri · 26th February 2013, 07:22 PM

Originally Posted by CplFerro

In which case what is there to talk about, Akri? God is a vapour.

Cpl Ferro

"Vapid" does not mean "vapor", it means "without substance". And I didn't say God was vapid, I said the dialogue written by Cusa was vapid.

And as far as what there is to talk about, well, I enjoy arguing. Cusa's arguments were low-hanging fruit, but whatever. I don't come to this thread expecting a challenge.

RandFan · 27th February 2013, 05:42 AM

Originally Posted by CplFerro

Dear RandFan,

I've already given enough answers for those who wish to peruse the thread. I don't need to recycle my replies indefinitely for people who won't believe them anyway.

Cpl Ferro

That's a disappointing cop-out. I'll take that as you don't know.

CplFerro · 27th February 2013, 07:53 AM

Dear RandFan, Akri, tsig, et al,

I apologise for being abrasive and evasive.

I also apologise to you, Akri, for judging your heart with relation to God.

Cpl Ferro

CplFerro · 27th February 2013, 07:59 AM

Originally Posted by tsig

No, I'm asking you why you think humans are valuable to god.

Quote:

It's because I don't believe in god which is why I want to know why a god would create humans.

Dear tsig, RandFan,

Your questions are similar so I answer them here.

Lyndon LaRouche discusses humans as "participating in God's work" by recreating the universe, introducing into play, as best I understand it, laws of physics and of the human mind which lie dormant. If I understood it better you'd have a better answer, but there you have it: man is in the image of God and creates new things--technologies, art--to transform and increase his power to exist in the hostile universe.

Cpl Ferro

RandFan · 27th February 2013, 09:19 AM

Originally Posted by CplFerro

Dear tsig, RandFan,

Your questions are similar so I answer them here.

Lyndon LaRouche discusses humans as "participating in God's work" by recreating the universe, introducing into play, as best I understand it, laws of physics and of the human mind which lie dormant. If I understood it better you'd have a better answer, but there you have it: man is in the image of God and creates new things--technologies, art--to transform and increase his power to exist in the hostile universe.

Cpl Ferro

Thank you for the response. I appreciate it. It's problematic given an omniscient god but otherwise I'm fine with the answer.

Akri · 27th February 2013, 09:22 AM

Originally Posted by CplFerro

Dear RandFan, Akri, tsig, et al,

I apologise for being abrasive and evasive.

I also apologise to you, Akri, for judging your heart with relation to God.

Cpl Ferro

Thank you for the apology. I appreciate it.

tsig · 27th February 2013, 10:13 AM

Originally Posted by CplFerro

Dear RandFan, Akri, tsig, et al,

I apologise for being abrasive and evasive.

I also apologise to you, Akri, for judging your heart with relation to God.

Cpl Ferro

Accepted, thanks.

26th February 2013, 02:18 PM	#521
RandFan Mormon Atheist Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Southern California Posts: 53,212	Originally Posted by CplFerro If you already know there's no God, tsig, why ask further questions? Cpl Ferro It's because I don't believe in god which is why I want to know why a god would create humans.
	__________________ Ego, ain't it a bitch? It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion. --Adam Smith

26th February 2013, 02:21 PM	#525
Akri Critical Thinker Join Date: Dec 2012 Posts: 466	Originally Posted by CplFerro Dear Pup, An opened heart and mind to God is good when anyone does it. Cpl Ferro That doesn't appear to answer Pup's question, which is whether it's good for you to have a hardened heart or closed mind when dealing with views that disagree with your own. I would be interesting in knowing the answer to that question as well.
Akri Critical Thinker Join Date: Dec 2012 Posts: 466

26th February 2013, 02:22 PM	#526
Dinwar Philosopher Join Date: Jul 2010 Posts: 8,931	Originally Posted by CplFerro An opened heart and mind to God is good when anyone does it. As Chesterton put it, the purpose of a mind is akin to that of a mouth: to open it in order to close it on something solid. Give us something solid--ANYTHING solid. At this point you have precisely two lines of reasoning for believing in God: the fact that you believe it, and the fact that you can't explain it.
Dinwar Philosopher Join Date: Jul 2010 Posts: 8,931	__________________ GENERATION 8: The first time you see this, copy it into your sig on any forum and add 1 to the generation. Social experiment. Ein krieg ohne feinde.

26th February 2013, 02:23 PM	#527
RandFan Mormon Atheist Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Southern California Posts: 53,212	Originally Posted by CplFerro If you're inventing gods you don't believe in, RandFan, invent an answer. Cpl Ferro You have no answers about the god you believe in?
	__________________ Ego, ain't it a bitch? It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion. --Adam Smith

26th February 2013, 02:31 PM	#532
Akri Critical Thinker Join Date: Dec 2012 Posts: 466	Originally Posted by CplFerro Like I said, Akri, you've hardened your heart. Cpl Ferro If you don't want to address my comments then please have the decency to say so. If you think I'm lying about being open to logic and evidence, then have the decency to say so. Repeatedly claiming that I've hardened my heart is insulting and cowardly, not to mention incredibly hypocritical coming from someone who has outright sated that no evidence will change their beliefs. If you want to accuse someone of heart-hardening look in a mirror, and then consult your god's teachings on specks and planks.
Akri Critical Thinker Join Date: Dec 2012 Posts: 466

26th February 2013, 02:19 PM	#522
CplFerro Graduate Poster Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 1,383	Originally Posted by Pup I'm assuming you mean seeing what the apostles claimed they saw in the Bible, as if it was really happening and not just legends, because I don't think it actually happened that way. But let's go with that and assume they were writing about what they witnessed at the time as honestly and accurately as possible. If it's limited to "seeing," no, because that's how magic tricks work. The audience doesn't get to investigate the way they want; they can only see what the magician wants them to. Interview people after they leave a David Copperfield act, they'll tell you things they saw that were as miraculous as anything the apostles saw. If you mean, would I believe if I were present at the time and place of the apostles, and given free reign to investigate using modern knowledge and calling in any modern experts or instruments I chose, I'd say it would depend on how things panned out. If events were happening that are unexplainable by our current understanding of natural laws, it doesn't mean every explanation somebody says about them is true. I'd say, let's first find evidence that somebody can actually walk on water, or that dead people are actually coming out of their graves, and then we'll worry about why such things are happening. More importantly right now, though, it seems odd to me that you're worried about how open my mind is, when you've already stated that yours is sealed shut. So please answer my question: Do you feel having a hardened heart or a closed mind is good when you do it but bad when others do it, if they disagree with you? Because this sounds to me like the usual situation of somebody who is convinced they can never be wrong. I've run into it in lots of fields, and not noticed any correlation between people being sure they're right, and actually being right, except maybe a slightly negative one. Dear Pup, An opened heart and mind to God is good when anyone does it. Cpl Ferro

26th February 2013, 02:20 PM	#523
CplFerro Graduate Poster Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 1,383	Originally Posted by RandFan It's because I don't believe in god which is why I want to know why a god would create humans. If you're inventing gods you don't believe in, RandFan, invent an answer. Cpl Ferro

26th February 2013, 02:21 PM	#524
CplFerro Graduate Poster Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 1,383	Originally Posted by tsig Nicholas of Cusa was a Christian mystic who lived during the 1400s. The Vision of God is known as a classic of Christian mysticism, putting many believers in touch with the divine. Many Christians have a desire to experience God, rather than just believe in Him. Nicholas of Cusa provides an excellent guidebook for Christians who sense something deeper to the Christian experience. He was a mystic. He experienced God on a number of levels and taught people to move beyond mere belief and have similar experiences. Any particular point you'd like to make? On Cusa, tsig? No, but if you can help me understand his writing better I would appreciate it. Cpl Ferro

26th February 2013, 02:26 PM	#528
CplFerro Graduate Poster Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 1,383	Originally Posted by Akri If they all fail at logic then none of them are beyond logic, they just all fail at logic. Because "skepticism" doesn't mean "doubting everything to the point of absurdity". I said theologians who are better than you. Would you? Is me saying "I agree completely" a more fun discussion? And I did read it with an open mind. What I didn't do is read it with an uncritical mind. Like I said, Akri, you've hardened your heart. Cpl Ferro

26th February 2013, 02:27 PM	#529
tsig a carbon based life-form Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 26,762	Originally Posted by CplFerro If you already know there's no God, tsig, why ask further questions? Cpl Ferro Never stop questioning. Seems as if the questions are starting to pinch so you are dodging. Why do you think humans are so valuable that god had to die for them?

26th February 2013, 02:27 PM	#530
CplFerro Graduate Poster Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 1,383	Originally Posted by RandFan You have no answers about the god you believe in? Dear RandFan, I've already given enough answers for those who wish to peruse the thread. I don't need to recycle my replies indefinitely for people who won't believe them anyway. Cpl Ferro

26th February 2013, 02:29 PM	#531
CplFerro Graduate Poster Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 1,383	Originally Posted by tsig Never stop questioning. Seems as if the questions are starting to pinch so you are dodging. Why do you think humans are so valuable that god had to die for them? Are you saying you don't think human beings are valuable, tsig? Cpl Ferro

26th February 2013, 03:26 PM	#533
CplFerro Graduate Poster Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 1,383	Originally Posted by Akri If you don't want to address my comments then please have the decency to say so. If you think I'm lying about being open to logic and evidence, then have the decency to say so. Repeatedly claiming that I've hardened my heart is insulting and cowardly, not to mention incredibly hypocritical coming from someone who has outright sated that no evidence will change their beliefs. If you want to accuse someone of heart-hardening look in a mirror, and then consult your god's teachings on specks and planks. Dear Akri, I didn't say you weren't open to logic and evidence, but, that, here, logic and evidence aren't the point. If they were the point, they would be everywhere. Something like Cusa is the point, but you're definitely not open to what he has to say, and that's hardly insulting to you or hypocritical of me to say so. I never said, "hardening the heart is bad" I said, implicitly, hardening the heart to God is bad. So, don't try to beard me with the Gospel. And, I overlooked your question, I'm sorry. Quote: Would you? Is me saying "I agree completely" a more fun discussion? If you "got" Cusa's "On the Hidden God" I would wonder after what else of his you "got," as his hunt can be difficult to follow. And beyond that, there are others you might also have insight into, which have eluded me except in a circuitous way. Cpl Ferro

26th February 2013, 03:51 PM	#534
Akri Critical Thinker Join Date: Dec 2012 Posts: 466	Originally Posted by CplFerro I didn't say you weren't open to logic and evidence No, but that's certainly what your posts have implied. Quote: but, that, here, logic and evidence aren't the point. If they were the point, they would be everywhere. It doesn't matter if they're the "point" (point of what? Of this conversation? of God's existence?), what matters is that if your claims are true they should hold up to logical scrutiny and be supportable by evidence. Quote: Something like Cusa is the point, but you're definitely not open to what he has to say, and that's hardly insulting to you or hypocritical of me to say so. This conversation might work better if you actually payed attention to what I say. I've already stated that I was open to what he has to say. What I'm not is uncritical. You're complaining that I didn't accept his statements for no reason (and despite having reasons not to accept them). Quote: I never said, "hardening the heart is bad" I said, implicitly, hardening the heart to God is bad. Accusing me of hardening my heart at all is insulting because I've yet to demonstrate any such hardening. I am open to new ideas. I am open to the idea that I could be wrong about God's existence. Hell, I've tried to have a discussion about exactly what it would take to convince me that I'm wrong, but your immediate response was to accuse me of having a hardened heart. I gave Cusa's dialogue far more consideration than it deserves, and you responded by saying I didn't have an open mind. My heart is not hardened, and my mind is not closed. If you're tempted to say either of those things again kindly save us both time and just don't. Quote: If you "got" Cusa's "On the Hidden God" I would wonder after what else of his you "got," as his hunt can be difficult to follow. And beyond that, there are others you might also have insight into, which have eluded me except in a circuitous way. Fair enough--that could lead to interesting discussion. That said, I think the reason I didn't "get" Cusa's dialogue is that there was nothing to get. It was, frankly, vapid.
Akri Critical Thinker Join Date: Dec 2012 Posts: 466

26th February 2013, 05:06 PM	#535
CplFerro Graduate Poster Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 1,383	Originally Posted by Akri That said, I think the reason I didn't "get" Cusa's dialogue is that there was nothing to get. It was, frankly, vapid. In which case what is there to talk about, Akri? God is a vapour. Cpl Ferro

26th February 2013, 07:05 PM	#536
tsig a carbon based life-form Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 26,762	Originally Posted by tsig Never stop questioning. Seems as if the questions are starting to pinch so you are dodging. Why do you think humans are so valuable that god had to die for them? Originally Posted by CplFerro Are you saying you don't think human beings are valuable, tsig? Cpl Ferro No, I'm asking you why you think humans are valuable to god. If you don't want to answer please just say so your dodging is becoming way too obvious.

26th February 2013, 07:22 PM	#537
Akri Critical Thinker Join Date: Dec 2012 Posts: 466	Originally Posted by CplFerro In which case what is there to talk about, Akri? God is a vapour. Cpl Ferro "Vapid" does not mean "vapor", it means "without substance". And I didn't say God was vapid, I said the dialogue written by Cusa was vapid. And as far as what there is to talk about, well, I enjoy arguing. Cusa's arguments were low-hanging fruit, but whatever. I don't come to this thread expecting a challenge.
Akri Critical Thinker Join Date: Dec 2012 Posts: 466

27th February 2013, 05:42 AM	#538
RandFan Mormon Atheist Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Southern California Posts: 53,212	Originally Posted by CplFerro Dear RandFan, I've already given enough answers for those who wish to peruse the thread. I don't need to recycle my replies indefinitely for people who won't believe them anyway. Cpl Ferro That's a disappointing cop-out. I'll take that as you don't know.
	__________________ Ego, ain't it a bitch? It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion. --Adam Smith

27th February 2013, 07:53 AM	#539
CplFerro Graduate Poster Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 1,383	Dear RandFan, Akri, tsig, et al, I apologise for being abrasive and evasive. I also apologise to you, Akri, for judging your heart with relation to God. Cpl Ferro
	Last edited by CplFerro; 27th February 2013 at 08:08 AM.

27th February 2013, 07:59 AM	#540
CplFerro Graduate Poster Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 1,383	Originally Posted by tsig No, I'm asking you why you think humans are valuable to god. Quote: It's because I don't believe in god which is why I want to know why a god would create humans. Dear tsig, RandFan, Your questions are similar so I answer them here. Lyndon LaRouche discusses humans as "participating in God's work" by recreating the universe, introducing into play, as best I understand it, laws of physics and of the human mind which lie dormant. If I understood it better you'd have a better answer, but there you have it: man is in the image of God and creates new things--technologies, art--to transform and increase his power to exist in the hostile universe. Cpl Ferro

27th February 2013, 09:19 AM	#541
RandFan Mormon Atheist Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Southern California Posts: 53,212	Originally Posted by CplFerro Dear tsig, RandFan, Your questions are similar so I answer them here. Lyndon LaRouche discusses humans as "participating in God's work" by recreating the universe, introducing into play, as best I understand it, laws of physics and of the human mind which lie dormant. If I understood it better you'd have a better answer, but there you have it: man is in the image of God and creates new things--technologies, art--to transform and increase his power to exist in the hostile universe. Cpl Ferro Thank you for the response. I appreciate it. It's problematic given an omniscient god but otherwise I'm fine with the answer.
	__________________ Ego, ain't it a bitch? It is not very unreasonable that the rich should contribute to the public expense, not only in proportion to their revenue, but something more than in that proportion. --Adam Smith

27th February 2013, 09:22 AM	#542
Akri Critical Thinker Join Date: Dec 2012 Posts: 466	Originally Posted by CplFerro Dear RandFan, Akri, tsig, et al, I apologise for being abrasive and evasive. I also apologise to you, Akri, for judging your heart with relation to God. Cpl Ferro Thank you for the apology. I appreciate it.
Akri Critical Thinker Join Date: Dec 2012 Posts: 466

27th February 2013, 10:13 AM	#543
tsig a carbon based life-form Join Date: Nov 2005 Posts: 26,762	Originally Posted by CplFerro Dear RandFan, Akri, tsig, et al, I apologise for being abrasive and evasive. I also apologise to you, Akri, for judging your heart with relation to God. Cpl Ferro Accepted, thanks.