Hats - or Sombreros - off to Hubble & Spitzer!

CFLarsen · 6th May 2005, 02:38 AM

"Old" picture of the Sombrero Galaxy:

New picture of the Sombrero Galaxy:

Quote:

This new image of Messier 104, the Sombrero galaxy, combines a recent infrared observation from NASA's Spitzer Space Telescope with a well-known visible light image from NASA's Hubble Space Telescope.
NASA

Is that beautiful or what?

Anders W. Bonde · 6th May 2005, 04:50 AM

Stunning!

Please excuse me for displaying my ignorance: Is it the remains of a supernova? If so, am I correct in assuming that the bulk of the blown away 'heavy' matter is in an essentially planar ring due to the exploding star's initial rotation? (A 'fixed' sphere I would assume to explode in a sperical pattern only, like the (presumably) light matter that may not have been affected by the initial rotation.

Paul C. Anagnostopoulos · 6th May 2005, 05:46 AM

Oh my, that is truly beautiful. Can't be natural. Gotta be some woo-woo explanation for it.

~~ Paul

neutrino_cannon · 6th May 2005, 12:09 PM

Well, in all fairness, that's probably a false-color image. Don't know if that counts as a woo-woo explaination, unless of course it was done by telepathy.

CFLarsen · 6th May 2005, 12:30 PM

Somehow, I can't really see the problems of financing a space telescope, just to get pictures like these, then sell them as posters.

Imagine if these posters would be found next to the posters of the latest boybands. Which posters do you think would spark the most ideas?

Dang, that is an amazing image...

SpaceFluffer · 6th May 2005, 12:41 PM

I prefer the original image...what's better about the false color image exactly?

Quote:

Originally posted by Anders W. Bonde
Please excuse me for displaying my ignorance: Is it the remains of a supernova?

No, it's a galaxy containing billions of stars. It's much like our own Milky Way galaxy, but the Sombrero's structure is different (i.e. many more globular clusters, etc.)

CFLarsen · 6th May 2005, 01:06 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by SpaceFluffer
I prefer the original image...what's better about the false color image exactly?

You assume that the human eye is the best recipient for the best images. It isn't.

T'ai Chi · 6th May 2005, 02:43 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by CFLarsen
You assume that the human eye is the best recipient for the best images. It isn't.

No, he didn't assume that.

He merely asked you what is better about the false color image.

SpaceFluffer · 6th May 2005, 03:16 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by CFLarsen
You assume that the human eye is the best recipient for the best images. It isn't.

Far from it. But since you're presenting an image using visible light, and since that's all my crappy body can image at the moment, my question is why is this visible light image better than the older one?

Believe me, I can fully appreciate the implications of viewing an image in IR, X-rays, or whatever. But last time I checked, artwork is usually created to be visible to humans.

CFLarsen · 6th May 2005, 10:28 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by SpaceFluffer
Far from it. But since you're presenting an image using visible light, and since that's all my crappy body can image at the moment, my question is why is this visible light image better than the older one?

Believe me, I can fully appreciate the implications of viewing an image in IR, X-rays, or whatever. But last time I checked, artwork is usually created to be visible to humans.

Then I don't understand your question at all.

It's early here.

Chupacabras · 6th May 2005, 10:33 PM

THERE goes Planet X *sigh*

T'ai Chi · 7th May 2005, 07:07 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by CFLarsen
Then I don't understand your question at all.

So if you don't understand, you just assume that he is assuming??

Logic must be a scarce commodity over there.

neutrino_cannon · 7th May 2005, 02:26 PM

I can only assume that the new information is best presented in a false color format.

Quote:

Spitzer adds new detail to the galaxy's bright, bulbous core and its thick, outer dust lanes. Infrared light traces the dust and makes the dark, murky ring glow brilliantly. The clumpy dust ring also becomes transparent in infrared. This allows a clear view of the inner disk of stars within the dust ring.

CFLarsen · 7th May 2005, 02:35 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by neutrino_cannon
I can only assume that the new information is best presented in a false color format.

I don't like that term, "false color". It indicates that only the colors humans see are real.

Nah - let's include the whole spectrum, but make it visible to us.

Dang, that is a beautiful image....

neutrino_cannon · 7th May 2005, 02:43 PM

Perhaps you would prefer...

"compressed spectrum"

CFLarsen · 7th May 2005, 02:53 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by neutrino_cannon
Perhaps you would prefer...

"compressed spectrum"

Clever!

neutrino_cannon · 7th May 2005, 03:27 PM

That does of course assume that the spectra in the picture are ordered in the same "direction", frequency wise, that the detected infra red waves were.

I've always wanted to be able to see in UV. That would be a kick, to see all the patterns on flowers that were hitherto the domain of the pollenating insects alone. What mesmerizing patterns might lie, just a few angstroms out of reach, on the modified leaves of lillies, roses, and the other assorted angiosperms that we (rather heartlessly) cut up and present to our girlfriends?

If, in the places between base red and higher violet, there is enough reproductive splendor to induce some fine lady not to dump us for another week, than what regal patterns must lie beyond, that cause bees, hummingbirds and the varried lepidoptera (and anything else that sojourns to the flowers for the appreciation of art and sucrose) to savor their wares before those of another flower?

Ohhhh...

makes me wonder.

The Central Scrutinizer · 7th May 2005, 03:36 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by CFLarsen
Is that beautiful or what?

God is truly great!

Darat · 7th May 2005, 03:37 PM

neutrino_cannon, itâ€™s a bit of a sidetrack but it's still about wonderful natural images so: http://www.naturfotograf.com/UV_flowers_list.html

neutrino_cannon · 7th May 2005, 03:47 PM

Pretty round objects
Be they large or be they small
Let me see all hues!

Anders W. Bonde · 7th May 2005, 04:49 PM

Ooops!

SpaceFluffer - If I'd just payed attention to the word Galaxy - dunno why I was thunkin 'nebula' at the time - must've been sleepy.

[/If only I could keep my mouth shut until I'm done tninking]

CFLarsen · 7th May 2005, 10:28 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Anders W. Bonde
[/If only I could keep my mouth shut until I'm done tninking]

That would mean that your post count would not incr....

....oops.

6th May 2005, 02:38 AM	#1
CFLarsen Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Aug 2001 Posts: 42,804	Hats - or Sombreros - off to Hubble & Spitzer! "Old" picture of the Sombrero Galaxy: New picture of the Sombrero Galaxy: Quote: This new image of Messier 104, the Sombrero galaxy, combines a recent infrared observation from NASA's Spitzer Space Telescope with a well-known visible light image from NASA's Hubble Space Telescope. NASA Is that beautiful or what?
	__________________ SkepticReport.com

6th May 2005, 04:50 AM	#2
Anders W. Bonde Critical Thinker Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: East Jutland, Denmark Posts: 467	Stunning! Please excuse me for displaying my ignorance: Is it the remains of a supernova? If so, am I correct in assuming that the bulk of the blown away 'heavy' matter is in an essentially planar ring due to the exploding star's initial rotation? (A 'fixed' sphere I would assume to explode in a sperical pattern only, like the (presumably) light matter that may not have been affected by the initial rotation.
	__________________ Anders W. Bonde

6th May 2005, 05:46 AM	#3
Paul C. Anagnostopoulos Nap, interrupted. Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: a little toolshed Posts: 18,627	Oh my, that is truly beautiful. Can't be natural. Gotta be some woo-woo explanation for it. ~~ Paul
	__________________ Millions long for immortality who do not know what to do with themselves on a rainy Sunday afternoon. ---Susan Ertz RIP Mr. Skinny

6th May 2005, 12:09 PM	#4
neutrino_cannon Master Poster Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Seventh circle of limbo Posts: 2,575	Well, in all fairness, that's probably a false-color image. Don't know if that counts as a woo-woo explaination, unless of course it was done by telepathy.
	__________________ "Man would have been too happy, if, limiting himself to the visible objects which interested him, he had employed, to perfect his real sciences, his laws, his morals, his education, one half-the efforts he has put into his researches on the Divinity" -Percy Bysshe Shelley, The Necessity of Atheism

6th May 2005, 12:30 PM	#5
CFLarsen Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Aug 2001 Posts: 42,804	Somehow, I can't really see the problems of financing a space telescope, just to get pictures like these, then sell them as posters. Imagine if these posters would be found next to the posters of the latest boybands. Which posters do you think would spark the most ideas? Dang, that is an amazing image...
	__________________ SkepticReport.com

6th May 2005, 12:41 PM	#6
SpaceFluffer Muse Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 595	I prefer the original image...what's better about the false color image exactly? Quote: Originally posted by Anders W. Bonde Please excuse me for displaying my ignorance: Is it the remains of a supernova? No, it's a galaxy containing billions of stars. It's much like our own Milky Way galaxy, but the Sombrero's structure is different (i.e. many more globular clusters, etc.)
SpaceFluffer Muse Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 595

6th May 2005, 01:06 PM	#7
CFLarsen Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Aug 2001 Posts: 42,804	Quote: Originally posted by SpaceFluffer I prefer the original image...what's better about the false color image exactly? You assume that the human eye is the best recipient for the best images. It isn't.
	__________________ SkepticReport.com

6th May 2005, 02:43 PM	#8
T'ai Chi Penultimate Amazing Join Date: May 2003 Posts: 11,235	Quote: Originally posted by CFLarsen You assume that the human eye is the best recipient for the best images. It isn't. No, he didn't assume that. He merely asked you what is better about the false color image.
	__________________ http://www.statisticool.com

6th May 2005, 03:16 PM	#9
SpaceFluffer Muse Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 595	Quote: Originally posted by CFLarsen You assume that the human eye is the best recipient for the best images. It isn't. Far from it. But since you're presenting an image using visible light, and since that's all my crappy body can image at the moment, my question is why is this visible light image better than the older one? Believe me, I can fully appreciate the implications of viewing an image in IR, X-rays, or whatever. But last time I checked, artwork is usually created to be visible to humans.
SpaceFluffer Muse Join Date: May 2004 Posts: 595

6th May 2005, 10:28 PM	#10
CFLarsen Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Aug 2001 Posts: 42,804	Quote: Originally posted by SpaceFluffer Far from it. But since you're presenting an image using visible light, and since that's all my crappy body can image at the moment, my question is why is this visible light image better than the older one? Believe me, I can fully appreciate the implications of viewing an image in IR, X-rays, or whatever. But last time I checked, artwork is usually created to be visible to humans. Then I don't understand your question at all. It's early here.
	__________________ SkepticReport.com

6th May 2005, 10:33 PM	#11
Chupacabras Illuminator Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Fascistoland. Posts: 3,487	THERE goes Planet X sigh
	__________________ "TEAR DOWN THE WALL!!!"

7th May 2005, 07:07 AM	#12
T'ai Chi Penultimate Amazing Join Date: May 2003 Posts: 11,235	Quote: Originally posted by CFLarsen Then I don't understand your question at all. So if you don't understand, you just assume that he is assuming?? Logic must be a scarce commodity over there.
	__________________ http://www.statisticool.com

7th May 2005, 02:26 PM	#13
neutrino_cannon Master Poster Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Seventh circle of limbo Posts: 2,575	I can only assume that the new information is best presented in a false color format. Quote: Spitzer adds new detail to the galaxy's bright, bulbous core and its thick, outer dust lanes. Infrared light traces the dust and makes the dark, murky ring glow brilliantly. The clumpy dust ring also becomes transparent in infrared. This allows a clear view of the inner disk of stars within the dust ring.
	__________________ "Man would have been too happy, if, limiting himself to the visible objects which interested him, he had employed, to perfect his real sciences, his laws, his morals, his education, one half-the efforts he has put into his researches on the Divinity" -Percy Bysshe Shelley, The Necessity of Atheism

7th May 2005, 02:35 PM	#14
CFLarsen Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Aug 2001 Posts: 42,804	Quote: Originally posted by neutrino_cannon I can only assume that the new information is best presented in a false color format. I don't like that term, "false color". It indicates that only the colors humans see are real. Nah - let's include the whole spectrum, but make it visible to us. Dang, that is a beautiful image....
	__________________ SkepticReport.com

7th May 2005, 02:43 PM	#15
neutrino_cannon Master Poster Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Seventh circle of limbo Posts: 2,575	Perhaps you would prefer... "compressed spectrum"
	__________________ "Man would have been too happy, if, limiting himself to the visible objects which interested him, he had employed, to perfect his real sciences, his laws, his morals, his education, one half-the efforts he has put into his researches on the Divinity" -Percy Bysshe Shelley, The Necessity of Atheism

7th May 2005, 02:53 PM	#16
CFLarsen Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Aug 2001 Posts: 42,804	Quote: Originally posted by neutrino_cannon Perhaps you would prefer... "compressed spectrum" Clever!
	__________________ SkepticReport.com

7th May 2005, 03:27 PM	#17
neutrino_cannon Master Poster Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Seventh circle of limbo Posts: 2,575	That does of course assume that the spectra in the picture are ordered in the same "direction", frequency wise, that the detected infra red waves were. I've always wanted to be able to see in UV. That would be a kick, to see all the patterns on flowers that were hitherto the domain of the pollenating insects alone. What mesmerizing patterns might lie, just a few angstroms out of reach, on the modified leaves of lillies, roses, and the other assorted angiosperms that we (rather heartlessly) cut up and present to our girlfriends? If, in the places between base red and higher violet, there is enough reproductive splendor to induce some fine lady not to dump us for another week, than what regal patterns must lie beyond, that cause bees, hummingbirds and the varried lepidoptera (and anything else that sojourns to the flowers for the appreciation of art and sucrose) to savor their wares before those of another flower? Ohhhh... makes me wonder.
	__________________ "Man would have been too happy, if, limiting himself to the visible objects which interested him, he had employed, to perfect his real sciences, his laws, his morals, his education, one half-the efforts he has put into his researches on the Divinity" -Percy Bysshe Shelley, The Necessity of Atheism

7th May 2005, 03:36 PM	#18
The Central Scrutinizer Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: The White Zone Posts: 42,556	Re: Hats - or Sombreros - off to Hubble & Spitzer! Quote: Originally posted by CFLarsen Is that beautiful or what? God is truly great!
	__________________ If I see somebody with a gun on a plane? I'll kill him.

7th May 2005, 03:37 PM	#19
Darat Lackey Administrator / JREF Forum Liaison Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: South East, UK Posts: 64,948	neutrino_cannon, itâ€™s a bit of a sidetrack but it's still about wonderful natural images so: http://www.naturfotograf.com/UV_flowers_list.html
	__________________ If it were all so simple! If only there were evil people somewhere insidiously committing evil deeds, and it were necessary only to separate them from the rest of us and destroy them. But the line dividing good and evil cuts through the heart of every human being. And who is willing to destroy a piece of his own heart? - Aleksandr Solzhenitsyn 1918-2008

7th May 2005, 03:47 PM	#20
neutrino_cannon Master Poster Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: Seventh circle of limbo Posts: 2,575	Pretty round objects Be they large or be they small Let me see all hues!
	__________________ "Man would have been too happy, if, limiting himself to the visible objects which interested him, he had employed, to perfect his real sciences, his laws, his morals, his education, one half-the efforts he has put into his researches on the Divinity" -Percy Bysshe Shelley, The Necessity of Atheism

7th May 2005, 04:49 PM	#21
Anders W. Bonde Critical Thinker Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: East Jutland, Denmark Posts: 467	Ooops! SpaceFluffer - If I'd just payed attention to the word Galaxy - dunno why I was thunkin 'nebula' at the time - must've been sleepy. [/If only I could keep my mouth shut until I'm done tninking]
	__________________ Anders W. Bonde

7th May 2005, 10:28 PM	#22
CFLarsen Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Aug 2001 Posts: 42,804	Quote: Originally posted by Anders W. Bonde [/If only I could keep my mouth shut until I'm done tninking] That would mean that your post count would not incr.... ....oops.
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