What's The Point?

[Johnny Pneumatic]

This question goes out to the skeptical religious people on here, or those who think they can give an answer.

What's the point of religion? Faith has been shown many times in this forum to be horrible at getting to the truth; so religion can't be about seeking truth unless one is ultra stupid. So what's left? Fun. Is because it's fun is why you do religion? If so, can't you find something even more fun? What's fun about it? Does one actually have to believe in God and the other stuff to have fun with the religion? Can't one sing, dance ect. in a church(or whatever) without being religious at all?

[Ladewig]

Quote:

Originally posted by SkepticJ
This question goes out to the skeptical religious people on here, or those who think they can give an answer.

What's the point of religion? Faith has been shown many times in this forum to be horrible at getting to the truth; so religion can't be about seeking truth unless one is ultra stupid. So what's left? Fun. Is because it's fun is why you do religion? If so, can't you find something even more fun? What's fun about it? Does one actually have to believe in God and the other stuff to have fun with the religion? Can't one sing, dance ect. in a church(or whatever) without being religious at all?

It is comforting for some people.

Other reasons can be found in this thread.

[Humphreys]

I don't really have an issue with people who believe in things like an afterlife, or a supreme being, because these are possibilities. Sure, they don't seem likely, and there is nowhere near enough evidence to justify belief, but they are very comforting beliefs, and since no one has proved these ideas false, I can understand people who accept them as true on Faith alone.

However, the actual religions such as Christianity, are clearly false. Blindingly obviously so.

It's this kind of ridiculous denial of reality that these religious folks adopt that I just cannot understand. I think this is called blind faith.

[Ryokan]

Quote:

Originally posted by SkepticJ
Does one actually have to believe in God and the other stuff to have fun with the religion?

As a Buddhist I must answer 'no' to that

[Ducky]

What's the point of religion?


twofold:

1) control by those in charge of the religion.
2) comforting ideas like life after death that make people not realize how little time on earth they actually have. see reason #1.


That's how I see it.

[jimmygun]

"Religion is what keeps the poor from murdering the rich!"

Napoleon

[juryjone]

Quote:

Originally posted by SkepticJ
ThDoes one actually have to believe in God and the other stuff to have fun with the religion? Can't one sing, dance ect. in a church(or whatever) without being religious at all?

Have done it for many years, although not now. Might do it in the future. If someone asks me to sing, it's hard to turn them down.

For the average joe (not those controlling the religion) I think it comes down to a few things:

1) Comfort - as fowlsound says, belief in life after death is comforting to some. My wife would be one of those, Doesn't want to examine her beliefs too strongly for fear she'd have to give up that "security blanket". Also, there can be conmfort in ritual - since things change so rapidly in our modern world, it can ne comforting to have an hour or two every week where the same things happen, year after year.

2) Recognition. Worth proven. If I'm doing something good, it would be nice to know that someone, sometime, is going to recognize that. God supposedly will do that, since there's no guarantee that it will be recognized here on earth. Everybody who is being honest will grant that they would like such recognition. Religion "guarantees" it.

3) Social aspects. There are a lot of jobs that people have that do not allow for a lot of social interaction. School was a sort of forced interaction, and that is gone once you leave school. Church is something you are "required" to do every week, where you will be seeing the same people. It might be the only method of gaining friends that some people have.

I can't begrudge people their beliefs or social structures, as long as they don't try to proselytize. And as much as it seems like "lack of belief' is being assailed on all sides, the majority of believers really just want to be left to their "security blankets".

[Tormac]

It seems to me that religion has multiple uses, and none of them need the religion to be an accurate description of reality to be of value.

On an individual level it can be a source of comfort and support when dealing with the cruel realities of a fundamentally uncaring universe.

On a cultural level it is an official construct that can codify cultural norms, and bring a larger identify to the group, beyond just the obvious ones of race, and family, clan, and or nation/tribe. Just as it unifies a group of people, it also tends to isolate, or make that group culturally more distinct from others. This may make one culture less likely to be assimilated by another.

Of course it also serves as a rally for the troops. When the Gods are on your side, you car be sure to win. And even if you don’t win, most religions provide the notion of a holy martyr to a culture, helping to ensure that there are some individuals that will dare to be heroic, even if, on an individual level, it is a suicidal thing to do. It is also easier for individuals to justify killing, rape, theft, etc, if the victims are sub-human (i.e. infidels, etc.).

I’m sure I’ve left many other fine reasons why religions are successful. Of course, as you noted SkepticJ, the search for the truth is not in any of them. But it does seem to be a useful cultural construct.

[Dogdoctor]

There are probably several benefits to religion. The main advantage I see that religion gives is adverse situations. Religion allows people to keep a positive attitude when things are bad. This keeps them from giving up prior to the absolute end. I saw a documentary last night about surviving cold water or weather. They say that survivors all had a reason to give while their faith was not the only reason it was a reason. Anyway it makes sense that if it helps to give you a positive attitude and you are not manifesting this by waiting for god to save you, you will be more likely to survive. I don't know if you have seen any religious people go through rough situations but many seem to handle it well because "they know god will help them".

[Anders W. Bonde]

...conversely, they don't need to do much to improve their lot on Earth - what's the point when "It is God's will" that we suffer? IOW - it works both ways.

[crocodile deathroll]

I can just now picture all those bible thumping fundies who are just thanking the good Lord for answering their prayers and sparing them a direct hit from Hurricane Katrina in New Orleans.

I am sure these poor victims who were in way of the new track of the "Good Lord" made the hurricane take to avoid his loyal bible thumping fundies, would be happy for them.

[Robin]

Quote:

Originally posted by crocodile deathroll
I can just now picture all those bible thumping fundies who are just thanking the good Lord for answering their prayers and sparing them a direct hit from Hurricane Katrina in New Orleans.

I am sure these poor victims who were in way of the new track of the "Good Lord" made the hurricane take to avoid his loyal bible thumping fundies, would be happy for them.

To paraphrase Richard Dawkins, New Orleans will be thanking God for sparing their town, Biloxi will be thanking God that it was not worse. Either way God wins.

[RandFan]

Many social benefits. I was Mormon and I enjoyed many aspects of the church. As a child I enjoyed the organized sports scouting, and youth activities. As an adult I didn't care that much for the activities though some were enjoyable. I did very much like the friendship, associations and help during difficult times. I can't stress the last one too much. The Church has been there many times for me. Of course one could argue that 10% invested over a life time can offer a lot of help. But it is more than just that.

Now that I don't go to church I don't have the associations that I once did and I seem to lack the social skills to acquire new friends outside of church. So for those like me lacking in the social graces and those who might not be self sufficient or independent the church can be a great resource.

To tell you the truth I also miss spirituality. It might be all hokum but it can be some pretty damn good hokum. Spiritually I was very sensitive. I enjoyed very strong experiences and emotions. My endorphins and serotonin flow quite freely when I'm in religious services. I liked it very much.

Yes, it all comes at a cost and a lot of it is pure and utter BS. That is why I don't go.

Hope that helps.

[crocodile deathroll]

Quote:

Originally posted by Robin
To paraphrase Richard Dawkins, New Orleans will be thanking God for sparing their town, Biloxi will be thanking God that it was not worse. Either way God wins.

It appears worst of it was yet to come for residents of New Orleans as the levees have just been breached by a major storm surge. So any fundie zealot who had ever been gloating that after their city been spared the eye of the storm this is true testimony to the hand of their god answering their prayers had better now start building an ark.

[bignickel]

http://www.kpnt.com/

They began to seriously suck after a few years; now it's Top 20. ("alternative" Top 20, but alternative to what I'd like to know)

[jjramsey]

Quote:

Originally posted by SkepticJ
What's the point of religion? Faith has been shown many times in this forum to be horrible at getting to the truth; so religion can't be about seeking truth unless one is ultra stupid.

SkepticJ, have you stopped beating your wife?

Aside from the loaded question, there are also some ambiguities in the statement, "Faith has been shown many times in this forum to be horrible at getting to the truth." If by "faith," you mean a belief beyond what the evidence warrants, then the statement "Faith is horrible at getting to the truth" is trivially true, regardless of whether it has be demonstrated in this forum or not. If you are using "faith" as a synonym for "religion," that is another story, and a very long story at that. Also, what you mean by "getting to the truth" and "seeking truth"? Are you talking about truths about the natural world, which indeed are better handled by science? Are you talking about philosophical truth? Truths about human nature? Until you clarify that, the statement "religion can't be about seeking truth unless one is ultra stupid" presents itself as a vague generalization used as a rhetorical bludgeon.