Ummm... Yeah. (Don't tell Kurious Kathy...)

Roadtoad · 18th May 2006, 05:45 AM

The main article's here.

Quote:

Purity Balls. No, not some sort of newfangled spherical chastity device to be inserted using vacuum tubes and pulleys, but rather fancy creepy dress-up rituals taking place in towns like Colorado Springs and Tucson and Zoloft Jesusville, in which Christian dads rent a bad tux while their daughters, mostly teenagers but many as young as 6 or 7, get all dolled up in gowns from JCPenny and they all drive out to the airport Marriott and prepare to, well, lose their minds.

Good God.

Roboramma · 18th May 2006, 09:43 AM

That's disgusting. What a stupid, sick idea. Why can't young people just be taught the dangers (the real ones) and how to deal responsibly? These idiots need to realise that their daughters will have actual sexual desire (guess what's it's natural, and pretty well everyone experiences it) and whether or not they act on it is almost certainly independant of a pledge they made 10 years ago. Hell, two weeks for that matter.

On the other hand the article seems to be saying that we could solve all the world's problems if we all just had one big orgy. It goes from being very reasonable, to over the top "sexual liberation, yay!".

bjb · 18th May 2006, 10:25 AM

It is interesting that these fathers don't bring their sons along to make the same pledge. Why is chastity the responsibility of teenaged girls, and not boys?

Marquis de Carabas · 18th May 2006, 10:29 AM

Boys don't run the risk of a publicly embarrassing tummy bulge if they get frisky.

Piscivore · 18th May 2006, 10:43 AM

I looked at the site that Toad's link linked to, and now I feel dirty. Finally something offended me.

BlackCat · 18th May 2006, 10:47 AM

Originally Posted by bjb

It is interesting that these fathers don't bring their sons along to make the same pledge. Why is chastity the responsibility of teenaged girls, and not boys?

I've always wondered that. Just another beautiful thing about our society -- double standards.

BlackCat

Arkan_Wolfshade · 18th May 2006, 10:52 AM

My opinions of the idea of chastity until marriage aside for the moment; that article was one of the most vitriolic writings I've read in quite a while.

Now, back to my opinions. I think most of the replies have already touched on my views of the topic in question. The sexist application of the ideas, the forced ignorance, etc

It would be interesting to see how many of the girls that participate in these "Purity Balls" break their promise.

Piscivore · 18th May 2006, 11:02 AM

Originally Posted by Arkan_Wolfshade

My opinions of the idea of chastity until marriage aside for the moment; that article was one of the most vitriolic writings I've read in quite a while.

If so, I say we need more vitriol in the media.

The Central Scrutinizer · 18th May 2006, 11:20 AM

Originally Posted by Arkan_Wolfshade

It would be interesting to see how many of the girls that participate in these "Purity Balls" break their promise.

I would guess north of 90%.

Starthinker · 18th May 2006, 11:50 AM

This may be completely unfair but I just have a gut feeling there's a high rate of molestation in that group.

Piscivore · 18th May 2006, 11:53 AM

Originally Posted by Starthinker

This may be completely unfair but I just have a gut feeling there's a high rate of molestation in that group.

That's my read too. The whole thing oozes incest and pedophillia. It's one thing for a dad to dance with his daughter at a relative's wedding or something. It's just f[rule 8]g sick to make a special event just for it.

Trantor · 18th May 2006, 11:56 AM

Wow, these Fundies are simply amazing. The sad thing is - they vote.

JohnF_73 · 18th May 2006, 12:01 PM

I don't think it's COMPLETELY unfair.
Anyone that repressed is bound to have a few itchy perversions.

I less than three logic · 18th May 2006, 12:05 PM

I’ve seen father daughter dances before that were part of weddings and such, and I never really thought much of it. However, having a father and daughter only ball as a celebration of the daughter’s virginity is a bit disturbing.

Yahzi · 18th May 2006, 12:23 PM

Originally Posted by The Central Scrutinizer

I would guess north of 90%.

You would guess wrong, sir!

From the article:

Quote:

No wonder over half of all teens who take any sort of virginity pledge end up breaking the ridiculous vow within a year (says a new Harvard study), and fully 88 percent end up having sex before marriage anyway.

See, it's actually south of 90%.

The other thing to learn from this is: virginity pledges are a 50-50 chance to get laid! Them is good odds!

Edit: I should have kept reading:

Quote:

What's more, such silly pledges only result in more oral and anal sex among teens who try, vainly, to adhere.

Promiscious and perverse!

Dr Adequate · 18th May 2006, 04:45 PM

Originally Posted by Roboramma

On the other hand the article seems to be saying that we could solve all the world's problems if we all just had one big orgy.

It's gotta be worth a try.

eri · 18th May 2006, 05:22 PM

Quote:

Medical testing is a more reliable gauge of adolescent sexual activity than their own reporting, Rosenbaum said.

Ha! That's great. One of the articles linked from the first said this. I think asking the kids is probably the wrong way to go - I remember filling out surveys like this when I was that age, and we never answered truthfully.

eri · 18th May 2006, 05:23 PM

Quote:

President Bush has requested $206 million in federal funding for abstinence-only programs this year.

Fan-tastic. Is it 2008 yet?

supercorgi · 18th May 2006, 05:35 PM

Wow, this is pretty sick. It harkens back to the middle ages when a girl's only worth was her virginity. Once that was gone, the girl was considered 'ruined' for life. Nice that we're harken back to that earlier time. Forget the girl's accomplishments -- the only thing that matters is if her hyman is intact.

The Mutha · 18th May 2006, 05:42 PM

My daughter's best friend is a wonderful girl. She's 17. Last year, we took her with us to Disney World for a week. Her mother called me right before we left and said "God's mission for me is that (insert daughter's name here) leaves this house a virgin". Well, it was all I could do not to say "too late!" but I figured that wouldn't do the daughter any favors.

Interestingly enough, her two sons (older then the daughter) were allowed to run completely wild and the oldest brought his girlfriend and his baby mama to Thanksgiving dinner last year.

Interesting how the fundies (and boy is this woman one of those!) are so vehement about making sure that their girls go to their marriage beds virgins, but don't appear to spend much time considering how they can help the kids become well-adjusted, productive members of society. And why would this woman be telling me her mission in life? She was not sure that she would allow her daughter to go to Disney World because it's "full of child rapists and murderers".

When I was in college (many moons ago) the fundie girls were the ones who went absolutely freaking wild in college or as soon as they got out of the oppressive atmosphere that was their upbringing. I assume it still holds?

thaiboxerken · 18th May 2006, 05:53 PM

These people are idiots. To the, women are either virgins or sluts.. there is no inbetween.

luchog · 18th May 2006, 06:11 PM

Originally Posted by The Mutha

When I was in college (many moons ago) the fundie girls were the ones who went absolutely freaking wild in college or as soon as they got out of the oppressive atmosphere that was their upbringing. I assume it still holds?

In the various Christian communities, there is a stereotype of "PKs", aka, "Preacher's Kids", as wild, or at least fairly promiscuous. Dusty Springfield's "Son of a Preacher Man" is a good, if tame, example.

My experience was that this stereotype has a very strong grounding in fact.

Polaris · 18th May 2006, 07:03 PM

Originally Posted by Starthinker

This may be completely unfair but I just have a gut feeling there's a high rate of molestation in that group.

When these people are involved, nothing is unfair.

Polaris · 18th May 2006, 07:05 PM

Originally Posted by The Mutha

My daughter's best friend is a wonderful girl. She's 17. Last year, we took her with us to Disney World for a week. Her mother called me right before we left and said "God's mission for me is that (insert daughter's name here) leaves this house a virgin". Well, it was all I could do not to say "too late!" but I figured that wouldn't do the daughter any favors.

Interestingly enough, her two sons (older then the daughter) were allowed to run completely wild and the oldest brought his girlfriend and his baby mama to Thanksgiving dinner last year.

Interesting how the fundies (and boy is this woman one of those!) are so vehement about making sure that their girls go to their marriage beds virgins, but don't appear to spend much time considering how they can help the kids become well-adjusted, productive members of society. And why would this woman be telling me her mission in life? She was not sure that she would allow her daughter to go to Disney World because it's "full of child rapists and murderers".

When I was in college (many moons ago) the fundie girls were the ones who went absolutely freaking wild in college or as soon as they got out of the oppressive atmosphere that was their upbringing. I assume it still holds?

It takes threat of violent torture and death in Islamic societies to keep this from happening. Seems to me that if it wasn't for the rule of law in the US, the Christian fundamentalists would gladly use the same methods to ensure chastity (because, as we all know, recreational sex is MUCH, MUCH worse than murdering your child for it).

Hamradioguy · 18th May 2006, 08:07 PM

Check out a great indie film, "The Education of Shelby Knox" for more along this line...and an encouraging ending.

Polaris · 18th May 2006, 08:15 PM

Originally Posted by Hamradioguy

Check out a great indie film, "The Education of Shelby Knox" for more along this line...and an encouraging ending.

I'll put it on my Netflix queue. Hopefully it will help cure the post-The War Within pessimism.

Roadtoad · 18th May 2006, 10:57 PM

I was headed out the door to work when I posted this thread. Too bad. So many said what I was thinking, (especially Supercorgi.) I mean, seriously, there is something genuinely warped in someone's thinking when a girl's hymen is the only indication she's worth a f***. (Sorry, I had to say it.)

Once you've figured this one out, it's no wonder divorced women are still shunned in Fundamentalist Churches. Stupidity is clearly not only infinite, but eternal.

Zep · 19th May 2006, 04:33 AM

OK, so a higher proportion of these girls are going to stay chaste, but not the boys. They get to run wild and sow their wild oats, presumably.

With whom, pray tell?

Well, obviously it will be those girls of that "community" who don't make or don't keep those vows, or with more educated and responsible girls from outside that community. That is, this process simply drives the boys out. At least, any of them that aren't buck-toothed squinty acne-farms with anancephaly. Like their dads...

Mojo · 19th May 2006, 04:41 AM

Originally Posted by Zep

OK, so a higher proportion of these girls are going to stay chaste, but not the boys. They get to run wild and sow their wild oats, presumably.

With whom, pray tell?

Each other, perhaps.

jj · 19th May 2006, 04:58 AM

Originally Posted by Roadtoad

The main article's here.

Good food!
Good meat!

Quote:

Good God.

Let's eat.

I hardly know what to say, Toad. But then again, you can guess what it would take to get me in a tux and my older offspring into a ball gown.

Hellbound · 19th May 2006, 08:10 AM

Originally Posted by The Mutha

When I was in college (many moons ago) the fundie girls were the ones who went absolutely freaking wild in college or as soon as they got out of the oppressive atmosphere that was their upbringing. I assume it still holds?

Originally Posted by luchog

In the various Christian communities, there is a stereotype of "PKs", aka, "Preacher's Kids", as wild, or at least fairly promiscuous. Dusty Springfield's "Son of a Preacher Man" is a good, if tame, example.

My experience was that this stereotype has a very strong grounding in fact.

Being a former PK myself, I can say there is some truth to this. My parent's weren't fundamentalists (thankfully), but were fairly strict in thier rules and fairly black and white in morality/ethics.

A lot of the "run wild" is because you've been completely sheltered from it. You end up getting outr o fthe house and have had no expereince with, for example, sexual situations, drugs, drinking, or whatever. You don't know what it's like or what it does accurately. You encounter some of these things, and realize there are people who do some of them and thier lives aren't immediately ruined. IN fact many people may drink socially or be rather open in their sexuality and it only seems a source of pleasure and relaxation, nothing bad at all.

So there's a lot of factors at work here. One, your mind gets stuck on these topics because the evils of them are drilled into your head (some of the reasoning follows the lines of 'if these things ruin your life, but people still do them, they must be really, really good'). Second, there's the curiosity factor because you have zero or very little experience. Third, peer pressure of a sort. You're away from Xian peers (and people who would report your behavior to parents), and you most likely find new friends that partkae of some of the "sins".

I'm sure there's more, but that's a bit of my perspective (as a PK run wild).

fuelair · 19th May 2006, 09:45 AM

Originally Posted by Polaris

It takes threat of violent torture and death in Islamic societies to keep this from happening. Seems to me that if it wasn't for the rule of law in the US, the Christian fundamentalists would gladly use the same methods to ensure chastity (because, as we all know, recreational sex is MUCH, MUCH worse than murdering your child for it).

SSAE117,W18,TTDF all< contact scale 4

Starthinker · 19th May 2006, 10:57 AM

Originally Posted by fuelair

SSAE117,W18,TTDF all< contact scale 4

Huh?

Polaris · 19th May 2006, 06:42 PM

Originally Posted by Starthinker

Huh?

Ditto.

Marquis de Carabas · 19th May 2006, 09:40 PM

Originally Posted by Starthinker

Huh?

He either just got the Holy Spirit or he's calling in an air strike.

Meffy · 20th May 2006, 07:22 AM

Weird. "Contact scale" is a term used in sociology and photo printing. The rest appears to be gibberish but might be shorthand choreography for the "stagger, stagger, lurch" scene in the movie "Yellowbeard." I can't get to a conclusion from there.

Polaris · 20th May 2006, 09:34 AM

Still waiting on that explanation, Fuelair.

Btw, is your moniker related in any way to my recent posts in the Loose Change forum?

Polaris · 20th May 2006, 09:34 AM

Still waiting on that explanation, Fuelair.

Btw, is your moniker related in any way to my recent posts in the Loose Change forum?

Starthinker · 20th May 2006, 09:53 AM

I am so glad I wasn't the only one not getting that. I thought it was code for "fathers, pick any daughter but your own and head home."

fuelair · 20th May 2006, 07:20 PM

Sorry re:cryptic - it applies to an earlier posting and no response answered it so... Cannot (will accept will not ) give out further info on it except contact is a specific procedure and the rest is specific to the posting. Again, apologies for any confusion. Should be very rare occurence. No further response on this will be forthcoming.

18th May 2006, 05:45 AM	#1
Roadtoad Bufo Caminus Inedibilis Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Looking for a decent Taco... Posts: 11,857	Ummm... Yeah. (Don't tell Kurious Kathy...) The main article's here. Quote: Purity Balls. No, not some sort of newfangled spherical chastity device to be inserted using vacuum tubes and pulleys, but rather fancy creepy dress-up rituals taking place in towns like Colorado Springs and Tucson and Zoloft Jesusville, in which Christian dads rent a bad tux while their daughters, mostly teenagers but many as young as 6 or 7, get all dolled up in gowns from JCPenny and they all drive out to the airport Marriott and prepare to, well, lose their minds. Good God.
	__________________ "I freed thousands of slaves. I could have freed thousands more, if they had known they were slaves." Harriet Tubman "I would unite with anybody to do right and with nobody to do wrong." Frederick Douglass "Power corrupts. Absolute power... is pretty cool, actually." BPSCG My blog.

18th May 2006, 09:43 AM	#2
Roboramma Illuminator Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Shanghai Posts: 3,087	That's disgusting. What a stupid, sick idea. Why can't young people just be taught the dangers (the real ones) and how to deal responsibly? These idiots need to realise that their daughters will have actual sexual desire (guess what's it's natural, and pretty well everyone experiences it) and whether or not they act on it is almost certainly independant of a pledge they made 10 years ago. Hell, two weeks for that matter. On the other hand the article seems to be saying that we could solve all the world's problems if we all just had one big orgy. It goes from being very reasonable, to over the top "sexual liberation, yay!".
	__________________ "... when people thought the Earth was flat, they were wrong. When people thought the Earth was spherical they were wrong. But if you think that thinking the Earth is spherical is just as wrong as thinking the Earth is flat, then your view is wronger than both of them put together." Isaac Asimov www.reddoor-yoga.com

18th May 2006, 10:25 AM	#3
bjb Graduate Poster Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 1,079	It is interesting that these fathers don't bring their sons along to make the same pledge. Why is chastity the responsibility of teenaged girls, and not boys?
bjb Graduate Poster Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 1,079

18th May 2006, 10:29 AM	#4
Marquis de Carabas Dark Lord of the Pith Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: beneath the vast indifference of heaven Posts: 21,976	Boys don't run the risk of a publicly embarrassing tummy bulge if they get frisky.
	__________________ All your brain chemistry is belong to me. -KateHL

18th May 2006, 10:43 AM	#5
Piscivore Smelling fishy Join Date: May 2004 Location: Yubaba's Bathhouse Posts: 18,191	I looked at the site that Toad's link linked to, and now I feel dirty. Finally something offended me.
	__________________ It's not over till you're underground. Unless of course you bury someone alive. Then it drags on for a couple of minutes. - TM Does it get tiring to be correct about everything? - Francesca R ...untrustworthy obnoxious twerp. - CFLarsen

18th May 2006, 10:47 AM	#6
BlackCat Notorious Path Crosser Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 331	Originally Posted by bjb It is interesting that these fathers don't bring their sons along to make the same pledge. Why is chastity the responsibility of teenaged girls, and not boys? I've always wondered that. Just another beautiful thing about our society -- double standards. BlackCat
	__________________ We are star stuff which has taken its own destiny into its hands. -Carl Sagan I contend that we are both atheists. I just believe in one fewer god than you do. When you understand why you dismiss all the other possible gods, you will understand why I dismiss yours. -Stephen Roberts

18th May 2006, 10:52 AM	#7
Arkan_Wolfshade Philosopher Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Making Mytheon come to life Posts: 7,158	My opinions of the idea of chastity until marriage aside for the moment; that article was one of the most vitriolic writings I've read in quite a while. Now, back to my opinions. I think most of the replies have already touched on my views of the topic in question. The sexist application of the ideas, the forced ignorance, etc It would be interesting to see how many of the girls that participate in these "Purity Balls" break their promise.
	__________________ Amy: You should try homeopathic medicine, Bender. Try some zinc. Bender: I am forty percent zinc. Amy: Then take some echinacea, or St. John's Wort. Professor: Or a big fat placebo. It's all the same crap.

18th May 2006, 11:02 AM	#8
Piscivore Smelling fishy Join Date: May 2004 Location: Yubaba's Bathhouse Posts: 18,191	Originally Posted by Arkan_Wolfshade My opinions of the idea of chastity until marriage aside for the moment; that article was one of the most vitriolic writings I've read in quite a while. If so, I say we need more vitriol in the media.
	__________________ It's not over till you're underground. Unless of course you bury someone alive. Then it drags on for a couple of minutes. - TM Does it get tiring to be correct about everything? - Francesca R ...untrustworthy obnoxious twerp. - CFLarsen

18th May 2006, 11:20 AM	#9
The Central Scrutinizer Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: The White Zone Posts: 20,265	Originally Posted by Arkan_Wolfshade It would be interesting to see how many of the girls that participate in these "Purity Balls" break their promise. I would guess north of 90%.
	__________________ "I got to play with (Michael Goudeau's balls) briefly, and they are primo quality. Heavy, soft, and pliant." - Jeff Wagg "You are always so helpful, rational, and polite." - SaulOhio http://www.stopsylvia.com

18th May 2006, 11:50 AM	#10
Starthinker Illuminator Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Iowa Posts: 3,707	This may be completely unfair but I just have a gut feeling there's a high rate of molestation in that group.
	__________________ Naked People Running on Treadmills \|¦¦\|¦ \|¦\|\|\|\|¦\|\|\|¦\|\|¦¦\|¦\|\|\|\|\|\|\|¦\|¦¦¦¦\|¦¦¦¦\|\|¦\|¦\|¦¦\|¦ \|¦¦\|¦ • Does the blue line only run on Saturday? He who doubts victory has already lost the battle.

18th May 2006, 11:53 AM	#11
Piscivore Smelling fishy Join Date: May 2004 Location: Yubaba's Bathhouse Posts: 18,191	Originally Posted by Starthinker This may be completely unfair but I just have a gut feeling there's a high rate of molestation in that group. That's my read too. The whole thing oozes incest and pedophillia. It's one thing for a dad to dance with his daughter at a relative's wedding or something. It's just f[rule 8]g sick to make a special event just for it.
	__________________ It's not over till you're underground. Unless of course you bury someone alive. Then it drags on for a couple of minutes. - TM Does it get tiring to be correct about everything? - Francesca R ...untrustworthy obnoxious twerp. - CFLarsen

18th May 2006, 11:56 AM	#12
Trantor Critical Thinker Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 419	Wow, these Fundies are simply amazing. The sad thing is - they vote.
Trantor Critical Thinker Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 419

18th May 2006, 12:01 PM	#13
JohnF_73 Thinker Join Date: Sep 2004 Posts: 151	I don't think it's COMPLETELY unfair. Anyone that repressed is bound to have a few itchy perversions.
JohnF_73 Thinker Join Date: Sep 2004 Posts: 151

18th May 2006, 12:05 PM	#14
I less than three logic Graduate Poster Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: St Cloud, MN, USA Posts: 1,461	I’ve seen father daughter dances before that were part of weddings and such, and I never really thought much of it. However, having a father and daughter only ball as a celebration of the daughter’s virginity is a bit disturbing.
	__________________ “There is perhaps no better demonstration of the folly of human conceits than this distant image of our tiny world.” - Carl Sagan “The fact that we live at the bottom of a deep gravity well, on the surface of a gas covered planet going around a nuclear fireball ninety million miles away and think this to be normal is obviously some indication of how skewed our perspective tends to be.” – Douglas Adams

18th May 2006, 12:23 PM	#15
Yahzi Master Poster Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: AZ Posts: 2,672	Originally Posted by The Central Scrutinizer I would guess north of 90%. You would guess wrong, sir! From the article: Quote: No wonder over half of all teens who take any sort of virginity pledge end up breaking the ridiculous vow within a year (says a new Harvard study), and fully 88 percent end up having sex before marriage anyway. See, it's actually south of 90%. The other thing to learn from this is: virginity pledges are a 50-50 chance to get laid! Them is good odds! Edit: I should have kept reading: Quote: What's more, such silly pledges only result in more oral and anal sex among teens who try, vainly, to adhere. Promiscious and perverse!
	__________________ ID lives in a cardboard refrigerator box and throws rocks through the windows of evolution's unfinished mansion. ---Beleth Buy my book! www.WorldOfPrime.com Last edited by Yahzi; 18th May 2006 at 12:28 PM.

18th May 2006, 04:45 PM	#16
Dr Adequate Professor Of The Bleedin' Obvious Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Waiting Long Enough By The River Posts: 17,598	Originally Posted by Roboramma On the other hand the article seems to be saying that we could solve all the world's problems if we all just had one big orgy. It's gotta be worth a try.
	__________________ "It is a mark of insincerity of purpose to spend one's time in looking for the sacred Emperor in low-class teashops."

18th May 2006, 05:22 PM	#17
eri Critical Thinker Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Somewhere nearby, pointing and laughing. Posts: 459	Quote: Medical testing is a more reliable gauge of adolescent sexual activity than their own reporting, Rosenbaum said. Ha! That's great. One of the articles linked from the first said this. I think asking the kids is probably the wrong way to go - I remember filling out surveys like this when I was that age, and we never answered truthfully.
	__________________ I wish I would have a real tragic love affair and get so bummed out that I'd just quit my job and become a bum for a few years, because I was thinking about doing that anyway. -Jack Handy

18th May 2006, 05:23 PM	#18
eri Critical Thinker Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: Somewhere nearby, pointing and laughing. Posts: 459	Quote: President Bush has requested $206 million in federal funding for abstinence-only programs this year. Fan-tastic. Is it 2008 yet?
	__________________ I wish I would have a real tragic love affair and get so bummed out that I'd just quit my job and become a bum for a few years, because I was thinking about doing that anyway. -Jack Handy

18th May 2006, 05:35 PM	#19
supercorgi Dog Everlasting Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: State of Confusion, Massachusetts, USA Posts: 2,474	Wow, this is pretty sick. It harkens back to the middle ages when a girl's only worth was her virginity. Once that was gone, the girl was considered 'ruined' for life. Nice that we're harken back to that earlier time. Forget the girl's accomplishments -- the only thing that matters is if her hyman is intact.
	__________________

18th May 2006, 05:42 PM	#20
The Mutha Muse Join Date: May 2006 Location: Houston Posts: 593	My daughter's best friend is a wonderful girl. She's 17. Last year, we took her with us to Disney World for a week. Her mother called me right before we left and said "God's mission for me is that (insert daughter's name here) leaves this house a virgin". Well, it was all I could do not to say "too late!" but I figured that wouldn't do the daughter any favors. Interestingly enough, her two sons (older then the daughter) were allowed to run completely wild and the oldest brought his girlfriend and his baby mama to Thanksgiving dinner last year. Interesting how the fundies (and boy is this woman one of those!) are so vehement about making sure that their girls go to their marriage beds virgins, but don't appear to spend much time considering how they can help the kids become well-adjusted, productive members of society. And why would this woman be telling me her mission in life? She was not sure that she would allow her daughter to go to Disney World because it's "full of child rapists and murderers". When I was in college (many moons ago) the fundie girls were the ones who went absolutely freaking wild in college or as soon as they got out of the oppressive atmosphere that was their upbringing. I assume it still holds?

18th May 2006, 05:53 PM	#21
thaiboxerken Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Portland, Oregon Posts: 13,273	These people are idiots. To the, women are either virgins or sluts.. there is no inbetween.
	__________________ All national institutions of churches, whether Jewish, Christian or Turkish, appear to me no other than human inventions, set up to terrify and enslave mankind, and monopolize power & profit - Thomas Paine

18th May 2006, 06:11 PM	#22
luchog Neo-Post-Retro-Revivalist Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: The Emerald City Posts: 5,706	Originally Posted by The Mutha When I was in college (many moons ago) the fundie girls were the ones who went absolutely freaking wild in college or as soon as they got out of the oppressive atmosphere that was their upbringing. I assume it still holds? In the various Christian communities, there is a stereotype of "PKs", aka, "Preacher's Kids", as wild, or at least fairly promiscuous. Dusty Springfield's "Son of a Preacher Man" is a good, if tame, example. My experience was that this stereotype has a very strong grounding in fact.
	__________________ "All opinions are not equal. Some are a very great deal more robust, sophisticated and well supported in logic and argument than others." -- Douglas Adams "The absence of evidence might indeed not be evidence of absence, but it's a pretty good start." -- PhantomWolf

18th May 2006, 07:03 PM	#23
Polaris Master Poster Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 2,155	Originally Posted by Starthinker This may be completely unfair but I just have a gut feeling there's a high rate of molestation in that group. When these people are involved, nothing is unfair.
Polaris Master Poster Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 2,155

18th May 2006, 07:05 PM	#24
Polaris Master Poster Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 2,155	Originally Posted by The Mutha My daughter's best friend is a wonderful girl. She's 17. Last year, we took her with us to Disney World for a week. Her mother called me right before we left and said "God's mission for me is that (insert daughter's name here) leaves this house a virgin". Well, it was all I could do not to say "too late!" but I figured that wouldn't do the daughter any favors. Interestingly enough, her two sons (older then the daughter) were allowed to run completely wild and the oldest brought his girlfriend and his baby mama to Thanksgiving dinner last year. Interesting how the fundies (and boy is this woman one of those!) are so vehement about making sure that their girls go to their marriage beds virgins, but don't appear to spend much time considering how they can help the kids become well-adjusted, productive members of society. And why would this woman be telling me her mission in life? She was not sure that she would allow her daughter to go to Disney World because it's "full of child rapists and murderers". When I was in college (many moons ago) the fundie girls were the ones who went absolutely freaking wild in college or as soon as they got out of the oppressive atmosphere that was their upbringing. I assume it still holds? It takes threat of violent torture and death in Islamic societies to keep this from happening. Seems to me that if it wasn't for the rule of law in the US, the Christian fundamentalists would gladly use the same methods to ensure chastity (because, as we all know, recreational sex is MUCH, MUCH worse than murdering your child for it).
Polaris Master Poster Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 2,155

18th May 2006, 08:07 PM	#25
Hamradioguy Pyrrhonist Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: Northern Vermont Posts: 1,982	Check out a great indie film, "The Education of Shelby Knox" for more along this line...and an encouraging ending.

18th May 2006, 08:15 PM	#26
Polaris Master Poster Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 2,155	Originally Posted by Hamradioguy Check out a great indie film, "The Education of Shelby Knox" for more along this line...and an encouraging ending. I'll put it on my Netflix queue. Hopefully it will help cure the post-The War Within pessimism.
Polaris Master Poster Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 2,155

18th May 2006, 10:57 PM	#27
Roadtoad Bufo Caminus Inedibilis Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: Looking for a decent Taco... Posts: 11,857	I was headed out the door to work when I posted this thread. Too bad. So many said what I was thinking, (especially Supercorgi.) I mean, seriously, there is something genuinely warped in someone's thinking when a girl's hymen is the only indication she's worth a f***. (Sorry, I had to say it.) Once you've figured this one out, it's no wonder divorced women are still shunned in Fundamentalist Churches. Stupidity is clearly not only infinite, but eternal.
	__________________ "I freed thousands of slaves. I could have freed thousands more, if they had known they were slaves." Harriet Tubman "I would unite with anybody to do right and with nobody to do wrong." Frederick Douglass "Power corrupts. Absolute power... is pretty cool, actually." BPSCG My blog.

19th May 2006, 04:33 AM	#28
Zep Guest Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 24,230	OK, so a higher proportion of these girls are going to stay chaste, but not the boys. They get to run wild and sow their wild oats, presumably. With whom, pray tell? Well, obviously it will be those girls of that "community" who don't make or don't keep those vows, or with more educated and responsible girls from outside that community. That is, this process simply drives the boys out. At least, any of them that aren't buck-toothed squinty acne-farms with anancephaly. Like their dads...
Zep Guest Join Date: Sep 2002 Posts: 24,230

19th May 2006, 04:41 AM	#29
Mojo Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Jul 2004 Location: Nor Flanden Posts: 14,504	Originally Posted by Zep OK, so a higher proportion of these girls are going to stay chaste, but not the boys. They get to run wild and sow their wild oats, presumably. With whom, pray tell? Each other, perhaps.
	__________________ "You got to use your brain." - McKinley Morganfield Ridicule is not an inappropriate response to the ridiculous.

19th May 2006, 04:58 AM	#30
jj grumpy old skeptic Join Date: Oct 2001 Location: Redmond, Washington Posts: 14,802	Originally Posted by Roadtoad The main article's here. Good food! Good meat! Quote: Good God. Let's eat. I hardly know what to say, Toad. But then again, you can guess what it would take to get me in a tux and my older offspring into a ball gown.
	__________________ Watch the looting. Those "left behind" are a lot less poor than they were on Sunday. They're mostly black, too, from all accounts. - Jocko, 09-01-05 What did you think would happen when there was no police around? NO has a concentration of African Americans, most of the residents there are black. - JayGW 09-02-05 The 'tards. The window lickers. The mouth breathers. Duh.Jocko 04-13-06 The power to quit.

19th May 2006, 08:10 AM	#31
Hellbound ex-Huntsman Join Date: Sep 2002 Location: A Luxury Handbasket Posts: 5,622	Originally Posted by The Mutha When I was in college (many moons ago) the fundie girls were the ones who went absolutely freaking wild in college or as soon as they got out of the oppressive atmosphere that was their upbringing. I assume it still holds? Originally Posted by luchog In the various Christian communities, there is a stereotype of "PKs", aka, "Preacher's Kids", as wild, or at least fairly promiscuous. Dusty Springfield's "Son of a Preacher Man" is a good, if tame, example. My experience was that this stereotype has a very strong grounding in fact. Being a former PK myself, I can say there is some truth to this. My parent's weren't fundamentalists (thankfully), but were fairly strict in thier rules and fairly black and white in morality/ethics. A lot of the "run wild" is because you've been completely sheltered from it. You end up getting outr o fthe house and have had no expereince with, for example, sexual situations, drugs, drinking, or whatever. You don't know what it's like or what it does accurately. You encounter some of these things, and realize there are people who do some of them and thier lives aren't immediately ruined. IN fact many people may drink socially or be rather open in their sexuality and it only seems a source of pleasure and relaxation, nothing bad at all. So there's a lot of factors at work here. One, your mind gets stuck on these topics because the evils of them are drilled into your head (some of the reasoning follows the lines of 'if these things ruin your life, but people still do them, they must be really, really good'). Second, there's the curiosity factor because you have zero or very little experience. Third, peer pressure of a sort. You're away from Xian peers (and people who would report your behavior to parents), and you most likely find new friends that partkae of some of the "sins". I'm sure there's more, but that's a bit of my perspective (as a PK run wild).
	__________________ "The overarching lesson that has emerged from scientific inquiry over the last century is that human experience is often a misleading guide to the true nature of reality."--Brain Greene, The Fabric of the Cosmos

19th May 2006, 09:45 AM	#32
fuelair Cythraul Enfys Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 15,891	Originally Posted by Polaris It takes threat of violent torture and death in Islamic societies to keep this from happening. Seems to me that if it wasn't for the rule of law in the US, the Christian fundamentalists would gladly use the same methods to ensure chastity (because, as we all know, recreational sex is MUCH, MUCH worse than murdering your child for it). SSAE117,W18,TTDF all< contact scale 4
fuelair Cythraul Enfys Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 15,891

19th May 2006, 10:57 AM	#33
Starthinker Illuminator Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Iowa Posts: 3,707	Originally Posted by fuelair SSAE117,W18,TTDF all< contact scale 4 Huh?
	__________________ Naked People Running on Treadmills \|¦¦\|¦ \|¦\|\|\|\|¦\|\|\|¦\|\|¦¦\|¦\|\|\|\|\|\|\|¦\|¦¦¦¦\|¦¦¦¦\|\|¦\|¦\|¦¦\|¦ \|¦¦\|¦ • Does the blue line only run on Saturday? He who doubts victory has already lost the battle.

19th May 2006, 06:42 PM	#34
Polaris Master Poster Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 2,155	Originally Posted by Starthinker Huh? Ditto.
Polaris Master Poster Join Date: Apr 2006 Posts: 2,155

19th May 2006, 09:40 PM	#35
Marquis de Carabas Dark Lord of the Pith Join Date: Dec 2002 Location: beneath the vast indifference of heaven Posts: 21,976	Originally Posted by Starthinker Huh? He either just got the Holy Spirit or he's calling in an air strike.
	__________________ All your brain chemistry is belong to me. -KateHL