Help with simple card technique

KingMerv00 · 16th February 2007, 08:12 AM

I won't mention the name of the card technique since the name is a bit of a spoiler. The initials are DL and it is very very common.

I have trouble making it look natural and doing it quickly enough. Any advice?

PM's welcome.

Dinsdale Piranha · 16th February 2007, 08:40 AM

What sources are you using to learn the move?

You can learn some basic technique from Royal Road to Card Magic or Card College vol. 1.

Is there anyone you know who could teach you? Since you're in Philly, I know there are a couple magic shops there. You could probably get someone to teach you a few methods.

You may want to look into this video:

http://www.dennymagic.com/cgi-bin/ha...il&item=001675

Whatever method you choose, just keep working with it. The move you're referring to is not as easy to perfect as it may seem. There are too many magicians out there who still can't perform it properly. Keep practicing.

Even after several years of doing card magic, I still practice this technique regularly. Don't worry about trying to do it too quickly. Concentrate on doing it smoothly and use a little misdirection. Don't look at your hands, look up at your spectator as you do it.

Hope this helps. Feel free to PM me if you have any more questions.

Garrette · 16th February 2007, 09:19 AM

It is hard for me, too. The only way I can do it reliably is by getting a break and having the misdirection down so the audience doesn't see when I initially grasp what I'm turning over.

Brown · 16th February 2007, 09:24 AM

I will chime in only to add that I am not happy with my own consistency of the move. For me, the tough part is the "get ready." I'm not as smooth and consistent as I'd like to be, and I sometimes flash.

Various videos provide hints on the move (e.g. the Ammar and Lorayne videos), including different techniques that work better when you're holding different numbers of cards. When you're holding three cards, you can do a "block pushover" or a "buckle"; when you're holding four, you can do Lorayne's "No get-ready"; and so on.

NeilC · 16th February 2007, 09:29 AM

It's one of the hardest sleights to do completely naturally IMO, partly because you often want attention on the pack for the maximum effect, unlike say a p**m where you would usually prefer strong visual misdirection. However you can have mental misdirection in the structure of the effect and patter.

To do it exactly like a normal person would is very difficult so many people just go for a consistent and believable one that they use when not doing it, if you catch my drift.

I personally do it by getting a b***** under cover of misdirection/patter/effect structure and then using my two fingers to pull and flip it over. It looks a little bit "flourishy" but that is believable in the context of doing magic, I believe. I practice by doing a real one and then a fake one ad nauseum. I've never been caught yet.

Try a few. Pick one and commit to it. Otherwise you end up being able to do 14 types badly.

KingMerv00 · 16th February 2007, 10:27 AM

Originally Posted by Garrette

It is hard for me, too. The only way I can do it reliably is by getting a break and having the misdirection down so the audience doesn't see when I initially grasp what I'm turning over.

At TAM5 a was privy to a Jamy demonstration up close and I have been obsessed with magic tricks since then. 3 and a half weeks. I guess I am an ultra novice but it seems to me that the DL is THE card technique to know. So many tricks depend on it that I feel pressured to get it right right now.

Dinsdale Piranha · 16th February 2007, 11:21 AM

Originally Posted by KingMerv00

I guess I am an ultra novice but it seems to me that the DL is THE card technique to know. So many tricks depend on it that I feel pressured to get it right right now.

Throw in a control and a palm and you have the basics to do a lot of great card tricks.

firecoins · 16th February 2007, 11:31 AM

Originally Posted by KingMerv00

At TAM5 a was privy to a Jamy demonstration up close and I have been obsessed with magic tricks since then. 3 and a half weeks. I guess I am an ultra novice but it seems to me that the DL is THE card technique to know. So many tricks depend on it that I feel pressured to get it right right now.

you have been at it for only 4 weeks? the DL is too har a move. Learn the basics first.

But that won't deter you, a strike DL is the best one. It does not need a get ready as most DLs do. I buckel the deck to the right. My top finger hits the card and the card turnsover on to the deck. Looks natural.

aofl · 16th February 2007, 11:41 AM

Originally Posted by Dinsdale Piranha

Throw in a control and a palm and you have the basics to do a lot of great card tricks.

Add an Elmsley Count and the world of packet tricks opens up to you.

A

aofl · 16th February 2007, 11:46 AM

Originally Posted by firecoins

you have been at it for only 4 weeks? the DL is too har a move. Learn the basics first.

But that won't deter you, a strike DL is the best one. It does not need a get ready as most DLs do. I buckel the deck to the right. My top finger hits the card and the card turnsover on to the deck. Looks natural.

I agree, a strike DL is the best looking, IMHO. I practice it a lot and only rarely have to double dip. However, in the rare times I perform I usually do a Snap DL. 100% absolute guaranteed DL or TL.

A

Azrael 5 · 16th February 2007, 12:04 PM

Don't worry about DL's do a side steal into Tenkai or lateral palm instead!

DL's are easy if you don't think about what you are doing too much.

firecoins · 16th February 2007, 12:27 PM

Originally Posted by aofl

I agree, a strike DL is the best looking, IMHO. I practice it a lot and only rarely have to double dip. However, in the rare times I perform I usually do a Snap DL. 100% absolute guaranteed DL or TL.

A

my hand is too small I think. I end up having to move my hand up to pull that off and than looks horrible for me. Other people do it flawless. The strike works for me.

firecoins · 16th February 2007, 12:28 PM

Originally Posted by Azrael 5

Don't worry about DL's do a side steal into Tenkai or lateral palm instead!

Great, encourage the even harder technique. I love the side steal. I use it now along with a top change. I am thinking dropping the DL completely.

Dinsdale Piranha · 16th February 2007, 12:40 PM

Originally Posted by firecoins

Great, encourage the even harder technique. I love the side steal. I use it now along with a top change. I am thinking dropping the DL completely.

In some instances, a second deal can also be used instead of a DL.

KingMerv00 · 16th February 2007, 12:44 PM

Wow. Umm...Are we still taking about card tricks?

*Looks for the novice exit.*

Dinsdale Piranha · 16th February 2007, 12:51 PM

Originally Posted by KingMerv00

Wow. Umm...Are we still taking about card tricks?

*Looks for the novice exit.*

Don't run away. We strayed off topic a bit. Those are just some advanced moves you can use after you gain some experience.

Meanwhile, practice your DL and also learn a control and a palm and you can do some miracles.

KingMerv00 · 16th February 2007, 12:54 PM

Originally Posted by Dinsdale Piranha

Meanwhile, practice your DL and also learn a control and a palm and you can do some miracles.

I know alot of people blame small hands for not being able to palm cards. I'd hate to break with tradition.

Garrette · 16th February 2007, 01:03 PM

Definitely don't run away. You need the DL, but you don't need it now. Last week I wowed some guys at a luncheon with just a few card tricks and none of them required a DL (none required any sleights at all, in fact).

You want to learn that all these different sleights exist, but you only need three or four. The DL is a must, even if you replace it with something else later. A basic palm is a must, and you can learn different ways to get in to that as you progress. The Elmsley Count was an excellent suggestion; it will get you through many tricks. Just one control is plenty to start.

If you do only those three, you can put on a regular show. In a couple of years you'll know enough to know what else you want to add to it.

Azrael 5 · 16th February 2007, 01:04 PM

Well at least I was joking!

Garrette · 16th February 2007, 01:05 PM

Originally Posted by KingMerv00

At TAM5 a was privy to a Jamy demonstration up close and I have been obsessed with magic tricks since then. 3 and a half weeks. I guess I am an ultra novice but it seems to me that the DL is THE card technique to know. So many tricks depend on it that I feel pressured to get it right right now.

To sort of contradict my previous post:

If I had to give up all my knowledge of card sleights save one, I would save a control and not the DL.

Garrette · 16th February 2007, 01:06 PM

Originally Posted by Azrael 5

Well at least I was joking!

Nobody with that avatar can ever be joking.

Azrael 5 · 16th February 2007, 03:38 PM

Originally Posted by Garrette

Nobody with that avatar can ever be joking.

Blame Darat.Some Dr Who thread....

Peter S. · 21st February 2007, 12:44 PM

Originally Posted by Dinsdale Piranha

...There are too many magicians out there who still can't perform it properly...

David Blain for one! Even worse, Mark Wilson.

rebecca · 21st February 2007, 01:09 PM

Originally Posted by Peter S.

David Blain for one!

He said magicians, not hack performance artists.

Ooh, take that David Blaine.

firecoins · 21st February 2007, 01:21 PM

how many magicians can properly sit in a box above the River Thames and crap in garbage bag?

How many magicians can be properly forzen in a block of ice in Times Square?

Of couse I don't know anyone who want to.

Peter S. · 21st February 2007, 01:30 PM

At the risk of embarrassing myself, here are a couple of the DLs I use most often. Note the big "get ready" on the second one! The third one, the aerial DL, is just silly. I only do it for magicians.

The one thing I like to do when doing the DL is to make the card snap. I think the sound enhances the move to make it more deceptive. Unfortunately, my little web cam mic doesn't capture the sound accurately, so on the video it sounds a bit strange. I discovered something about that sound many years ago when I was working close up in very loud rock and roll bars: Even with music playing so loudly my patter couldn't be heard if I screamed it at the top of my lungs, that snap sound could still be heard clearly.

http://www.petersosna.com/dl.mpg

firecoins · 21st February 2007, 01:52 PM

learn a strike DL

16th February 2007, 08:12 AM	#1
KingMerv00 Philosopher Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Philadelphia, PA...USA Posts: 8,802	Help with simple card technique I won't mention the name of the card technique since the name is a bit of a spoiler. The initials are DL and it is very very common. I have trouble making it look natural and doing it quickly enough. Any advice? PM's welcome.
	__________________ TEEK on Merv: He really is cute. Not in a tickle-me-Elmo way, either. Cicero: [Ann Coulter] doesn't require defending. Her education, college appearances, and book sales speak for themselves

16th February 2007, 08:40 AM	#2
Dinsdale Piranha A cruel man, but fair. Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: In the conversation pit. Posts: 842	What sources are you using to learn the move? You can learn some basic technique from Royal Road to Card Magic or Card College vol. 1. Is there anyone you know who could teach you? Since you're in Philly, I know there are a couple magic shops there. You could probably get someone to teach you a few methods. You may want to look into this video: http://www.dennymagic.com/cgi-bin/ha...il&item=001675 Whatever method you choose, just keep working with it. The move you're referring to is not as easy to perfect as it may seem. There are too many magicians out there who still can't perform it properly. Keep practicing. Even after several years of doing card magic, I still practice this technique regularly. Don't worry about trying to do it too quickly. Concentrate on doing it smoothly and use a little misdirection. Don't look at your hands, look up at your spectator as you do it. Hope this helps. Feel free to PM me if you have any more questions.
	__________________ "Don't hit me with them negative waves this early in the morning." Oddball from Kelly's Heroes. "I almost had a psychic girlfriend, but she left me before we met." Steven Wright

16th February 2007, 09:19 AM	#3
Garrette Philosopher Join Date: Aug 2001 Posts: 7,964	It is hard for me, too. The only way I can do it reliably is by getting a break and having the misdirection down so the audience doesn't see when I initially grasp what I'm turning over.
Garrette Philosopher Join Date: Aug 2001 Posts: 7,964	__________________ My kids still love me.

16th February 2007, 09:24 AM	#4
Brown Philosopher Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Twin Cities, Canada Posts: 9,119	I will chime in only to add that I am not happy with my own consistency of the move. For me, the tough part is the "get ready." I'm not as smooth and consistent as I'd like to be, and I sometimes flash. Various videos provide hints on the move (e.g. the Ammar and Lorayne videos), including different techniques that work better when you're holding different numbers of cards. When you're holding three cards, you can do a "block pushover" or a "buckle"; when you're holding four, you can do Lorayne's "No get-ready"; and so on.
	__________________ Klaatu: I'm impatient with stupidity. My people have learned to live without it. Mr. Harley: I'm afraid my people haven't. I am very sorry. I wish it were otherwise. -- The Day The Earth Stood Still, screenplay by Edmund H. North "Don't you get me wrong. I only want to know." -- Judas in Jesus Christ Superstar, lyrics by Tim Rice

16th February 2007, 10:27 AM	#6
KingMerv00 Philosopher Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Philadelphia, PA...USA Posts: 8,802	Originally Posted by Garrette It is hard for me, too. The only way I can do it reliably is by getting a break and having the misdirection down so the audience doesn't see when I initially grasp what I'm turning over. At TAM5 a was privy to a Jamy demonstration up close and I have been obsessed with magic tricks since then. 3 and a half weeks. I guess I am an ultra novice but it seems to me that the DL is THE card technique to know. So many tricks depend on it that I feel pressured to get it right right now.
	__________________ TEEK on Merv: He really is cute. Not in a tickle-me-Elmo way, either. Cicero: [Ann Coulter] doesn't require defending. Her education, college appearances, and book sales speak for themselves

16th February 2007, 09:29 AM	#5
NeilC Graduate Poster Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: London, UK Posts: 1,085	It's one of the hardest sleights to do completely naturally IMO, partly because you often want attention on the pack for the maximum effect, unlike say a pm where you would usually prefer strong visual misdirection. However you can have mental misdirection in the structure of the effect and patter. To do it exactly like a normal person would is very difficult so many people just go for a consistent and believable one that they use when not doing it, if you catch my drift. I personally do it by getting a b*** under cover of misdirection/patter/effect structure and then using my two fingers to pull and flip it over. It looks a little bit "flourishy" but that is believable in the context of doing magic, I believe. I practice by doing a real one and then a fake one ad nauseum. I've never been caught yet. Try a few. Pick one and commit to it. Otherwise you end up being able to do 14 types badly.

16th February 2007, 11:21 AM	#7
Dinsdale Piranha A cruel man, but fair. Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: In the conversation pit. Posts: 842	Originally Posted by KingMerv00 I guess I am an ultra novice but it seems to me that the DL is THE card technique to know. So many tricks depend on it that I feel pressured to get it right right now. Throw in a control and a palm and you have the basics to do a lot of great card tricks.
	__________________ "Don't hit me with them negative waves this early in the morning." Oddball from Kelly's Heroes. "I almost had a psychic girlfriend, but she left me before we met." Steven Wright

16th February 2007, 11:31 AM	#8
firecoins Illuminator Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Nyack, NY Posts: 3,065	Originally Posted by KingMerv00 At TAM5 a was privy to a Jamy demonstration up close and I have been obsessed with magic tricks since then. 3 and a half weeks. I guess I am an ultra novice but it seems to me that the DL is THE card technique to know. So many tricks depend on it that I feel pressured to get it right right now. you have been at it for only 4 weeks? the DL is too har a move. Learn the basics first. But that won't deter you, a strike DL is the best one. It does not need a get ready as most DLs do. I buckel the deck to the right. My top finger hits the card and the card turnsover on to the deck. Looks natural.
	__________________ NY Paramedic, skeptic, 9/11/01 Reality-ist. I am both right wing nut and left wing lunatic. Deal with it. Last edited by firecoins; 16th February 2007 at 11:35 AM.

16th February 2007, 11:41 AM	#9
aofl Critical Thinker Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 306	Originally Posted by Dinsdale Piranha Throw in a control and a palm and you have the basics to do a lot of great card tricks. Add an Elmsley Count and the world of packet tricks opens up to you. A
aofl Critical Thinker Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 306	__________________ Have you ever considered the cesspool of your minds? The best thing is not to be born. But who is as lucky as that? To whom does it happen??!! An evil mind is my only consolation! - Theodore When you're out of slits, you're out of pier. - Crow

16th February 2007, 11:46 AM	#10
aofl Critical Thinker Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 306	Originally Posted by firecoins you have been at it for only 4 weeks? the DL is too har a move. Learn the basics first. But that won't deter you, a strike DL is the best one. It does not need a get ready as most DLs do. I buckel the deck to the right. My top finger hits the card and the card turnsover on to the deck. Looks natural. I agree, a strike DL is the best looking, IMHO. I practice it a lot and only rarely have to double dip. However, in the rare times I perform I usually do a Snap DL. 100% absolute guaranteed DL or TL. A
aofl Critical Thinker Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts: 306	__________________ Have you ever considered the cesspool of your minds? The best thing is not to be born. But who is as lucky as that? To whom does it happen??!! An evil mind is my only consolation! - Theodore When you're out of slits, you're out of pier. - Crow

16th February 2007, 12:04 PM	#11
Azrael 5 Illuminator Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Yorkshire,Uk Posts: 4,220	Don't worry about DL's do a side steal into Tenkai or lateral palm instead! DL's are easy if you don't think about what you are doing too much.
	__________________ "I achieve these results through a mixture of magic,misdirection,suggestion and showmanship"-Derren Brown Photography here

16th February 2007, 12:27 PM	#12
firecoins Illuminator Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Nyack, NY Posts: 3,065	Originally Posted by aofl I agree, a strike DL is the best looking, IMHO. I practice it a lot and only rarely have to double dip. However, in the rare times I perform I usually do a Snap DL. 100% absolute guaranteed DL or TL. A my hand is too small I think. I end up having to move my hand up to pull that off and than looks horrible for me. Other people do it flawless. The strike works for me.
	__________________ NY Paramedic, skeptic, 9/11/01 Reality-ist. I am both right wing nut and left wing lunatic. Deal with it.

16th February 2007, 12:28 PM	#13
firecoins Illuminator Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Nyack, NY Posts: 3,065	Originally Posted by Azrael 5 Don't worry about DL's do a side steal into Tenkai or lateral palm instead! Great, encourage the even harder technique. I love the side steal. I use it now along with a top change. I am thinking dropping the DL completely.
	__________________ NY Paramedic, skeptic, 9/11/01 Reality-ist. I am both right wing nut and left wing lunatic. Deal with it.

16th February 2007, 12:40 PM	#14
Dinsdale Piranha A cruel man, but fair. Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: In the conversation pit. Posts: 842	Originally Posted by firecoins Great, encourage the even harder technique. I love the side steal. I use it now along with a top change. I am thinking dropping the DL completely. In some instances, a second deal can also be used instead of a DL.
	__________________ "Don't hit me with them negative waves this early in the morning." Oddball from Kelly's Heroes. "I almost had a psychic girlfriend, but she left me before we met." Steven Wright

16th February 2007, 12:44 PM	#15
KingMerv00 Philosopher Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Philadelphia, PA...USA Posts: 8,802	Wow. Umm...Are we still taking about card tricks? Looks for the novice exit.
	__________________ TEEK on Merv: He really is cute. Not in a tickle-me-Elmo way, either. Cicero: [Ann Coulter] doesn't require defending. Her education, college appearances, and book sales speak for themselves

16th February 2007, 12:51 PM	#16
Dinsdale Piranha A cruel man, but fair. Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: In the conversation pit. Posts: 842	Originally Posted by KingMerv00 Wow. Umm...Are we still taking about card tricks? Looks for the novice exit. Don't run away. We strayed off topic a bit. Those are just some advanced moves you can use after you gain some experience. Meanwhile, practice your DL and also learn a control and a palm and you can do some miracles.
	__________________ "Don't hit me with them negative waves this early in the morning." Oddball from Kelly's Heroes. "I almost had a psychic girlfriend, but she left me before we met." Steven Wright

16th February 2007, 12:54 PM	#17
KingMerv00 Philosopher Join Date: Nov 2004 Location: Philadelphia, PA...USA Posts: 8,802	Originally Posted by Dinsdale Piranha Meanwhile, practice your DL and also learn a control and a palm and you can do some miracles. I know alot of people blame small hands for not being able to palm cards. I'd hate to break with tradition.
	__________________ TEEK on Merv: He really is cute. Not in a tickle-me-Elmo way, either. Cicero: [Ann Coulter] doesn't require defending. Her education, college appearances, and book sales speak for themselves

16th February 2007, 01:03 PM	#18
Garrette Philosopher Join Date: Aug 2001 Posts: 7,964	Definitely don't run away. You need the DL, but you don't need it now. Last week I wowed some guys at a luncheon with just a few card tricks and none of them required a DL (none required any sleights at all, in fact). You want to learn that all these different sleights exist, but you only need three or four. The DL is a must, even if you replace it with something else later. A basic palm is a must, and you can learn different ways to get in to that as you progress. The Elmsley Count was an excellent suggestion; it will get you through many tricks. Just one control is plenty to start. If you do only those three, you can put on a regular show. In a couple of years you'll know enough to know what else you want to add to it.
Garrette Philosopher Join Date: Aug 2001 Posts: 7,964	__________________ My kids still love me.

16th February 2007, 01:04 PM	#19
Azrael 5 Illuminator Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Yorkshire,Uk Posts: 4,220	Well at least I was joking!
	__________________ "I achieve these results through a mixture of magic,misdirection,suggestion and showmanship"-Derren Brown Photography here

16th February 2007, 01:05 PM	#20
Garrette Philosopher Join Date: Aug 2001 Posts: 7,964	Originally Posted by KingMerv00 At TAM5 a was privy to a Jamy demonstration up close and I have been obsessed with magic tricks since then. 3 and a half weeks. I guess I am an ultra novice but it seems to me that the DL is THE card technique to know. So many tricks depend on it that I feel pressured to get it right right now. To sort of contradict my previous post: If I had to give up all my knowledge of card sleights save one, I would save a control and not the DL.
Garrette Philosopher Join Date: Aug 2001 Posts: 7,964	__________________ My kids still love me.

16th February 2007, 01:06 PM	#21
Garrette Philosopher Join Date: Aug 2001 Posts: 7,964	Originally Posted by Azrael 5 Well at least I was joking! Nobody with that avatar can ever be joking.
Garrette Philosopher Join Date: Aug 2001 Posts: 7,964	__________________ My kids still love me.

16th February 2007, 03:38 PM	#22
Azrael 5 Illuminator Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Yorkshire,Uk Posts: 4,220	Originally Posted by Garrette Nobody with that avatar can ever be joking. Blame Darat.Some Dr Who thread....
	__________________ "I achieve these results through a mixture of magic,misdirection,suggestion and showmanship"-Derren Brown Photography here

21st February 2007, 12:44 PM	#23
Peter S. Magician Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Arlington, MA Posts: 847	Originally Posted by Dinsdale Piranha ...There are too many magicians out there who still can't perform it properly... David Blain for one! Even worse, Mark Wilson.
	__________________ Wil In Space Wil in the Haunted forest Please vote for Wil In Space HERE

21st February 2007, 01:09 PM	#24
rebecca Banned Join Date: Apr 2004 Location: some other spring Posts: 6,852	Originally Posted by Peter S. David Blain for one! He said magicians, not hack performance artists. Ooh, take that David Blaine.

21st February 2007, 01:21 PM	#25
firecoins Illuminator Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Nyack, NY Posts: 3,065	how many magicians can properly sit in a box above the River Thames and crap in garbage bag? How many magicians can be properly forzen in a block of ice in Times Square? Of couse I don't know anyone who want to.
	__________________ NY Paramedic, skeptic, 9/11/01 Reality-ist. I am both right wing nut and left wing lunatic. Deal with it.

21st February 2007, 01:30 PM	#26
Peter S. Magician Join Date: Dec 2001 Location: Arlington, MA Posts: 847	At the risk of embarrassing myself, here are a couple of the DLs I use most often. Note the big "get ready" on the second one! The third one, the aerial DL, is just silly. I only do it for magicians. The one thing I like to do when doing the DL is to make the card snap. I think the sound enhances the move to make it more deceptive. Unfortunately, my little web cam mic doesn't capture the sound accurately, so on the video it sounds a bit strange. I discovered something about that sound many years ago when I was working close up in very loud rock and roll bars: Even with music playing so loudly my patter couldn't be heard if I screamed it at the top of my lungs, that snap sound could still be heard clearly. http://www.petersosna.com/dl.mpg
	__________________ Wil In Space Wil in the Haunted forest Please vote for Wil In Space HERE

21st February 2007, 01:52 PM	#27
firecoins Illuminator Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Nyack, NY Posts: 3,065	learn a strike DL
	__________________ NY Paramedic, skeptic, 9/11/01 Reality-ist. I am both right wing nut and left wing lunatic. Deal with it.