Jordan count

thaiboxerken · 25th March 2007, 12:31 AM

Anyone have information on how I can learn this techinique? I know the elmsly count and I suspect the Jordan is similar but I want to be sure. I have acquired instruction on a Twisted Aces variation that uses a Jordan count to introduce an unexpected card into the effect but it's useless because I don't know what a jordan count is.

Mick Houlahan · 25th March 2007, 01:55 AM

Card College Volume Two by Roberto Giobbi. What the Elmsley Count does for the third card in the packet, the Jordan Count does for the bottom card.

thaiboxerken · 25th March 2007, 09:44 AM

Can I stick my tongue out while doing it, like the Jordan dunk?

Dinsdale Piranha · 26th March 2007, 06:18 AM

Originally Posted by thaiboxerken

Can I stick my tongue out while doing it, like the Jordan dunk?

You're thinking of the Michael Jordan count which only applies to millions of dollars in U.S. currency, not cards.

Dinsdale Piranha · 28th March 2007, 11:05 AM

Here's an online resource with descriptions of several card moves including the Jordan Count.

http://www.practicenotincluded.com/

It's password protected so you'll need to know a little about card sleights to enter.

Brown · 28th March 2007, 12:13 PM

Originally Posted by Dinsdale Piranha

It's password protected so you'll need to know a little about card sleights to enter.

Well, I was able to enter, but the questions threw me off. I'd never heard of two of the guys, and as for one of the moves, I'd always heard it attributed to ... someone else. Nevertheless, I applied a little logic and was able to pass the test on the first try.

Almost immediately, I found an alternate subtlety to use in performing one of my tricks. In this trick, as performed conventionally, there is a risk of flashing at a bad time, and I am not confident that I can consistently misdirect my spectators' attention away from the cards momentarily so that they won't notice the flash if it occurs.

With this subtlety, not only is the flashing eliminated, I can even specifically direct the spectator's attention to the cards while I'm doing the dirty work! I can't wait to try it out!

Dinsdale Piranha · 28th March 2007, 12:22 PM

Originally Posted by Brown

Almost immediately, I found an alternate subtlety to use in performing one of my tricks. In this trick, as performed conventionally, there is a risk of flashing at a bad time, and I am not confident that I can consistently misdirect my spectators' attention away from the cards momentarily so that they won't notice the flash if it occurs.

With this subtlety, not only is the flashing eliminated, I can even specifically direct the spectator's attention to the cards while I'm doing the dirty work! I can't wait to try it out!

Verrrry interesting. Any hint as to which trick you are referring? Twisting the Aces, perhaps?

Brown · 28th March 2007, 12:50 PM

Originally Posted by Dinsdale Piranha

Verrrry interesting. Any hint as to which trick you are referring? Twisting the Aces, perhaps?

Mmmmm, could be! Without going into details, I would neither use the classic patter, nor would I use the patter recommended at the website; rather, I would use my own flavor of patter (my patter avoids suggesting that I am a magician or a card sharp, as I wish to be more humble and suggest that weird things simply happen, not that I'm actually making them happen) and combine it with the technique of using a card as a "pointer." By using a card as a pointer, I can direct the attention to the cards themselves in a natural and innocent manner, while at the same time doing the dirty work.

All of which might make complete sense, or no sense whatsoever. But there you are.

thaiboxerken · 28th March 2007, 03:07 PM

I find it easier to do the effects for people who are tipsy. But then, they are more belligerent about asking me how I did it.

My most enjoyable experience came from Roadtoad as he thoroughly enjoyed my ambitious card routine and was very entertaining himself. But he wasn't tipsy and didn't ask how I did it either.

NeilC · 29th March 2007, 06:44 AM

I learned the elmsley and jordan counts ages ago but none of the effects I do use them. I spent ages learning them and, as far as I can see, they look identical to straight counting.

So I'd like to learn a few good effects where I can utilise them. Any suggestions of some really good false-count based effects?

Garrette · 29th March 2007, 06:48 AM

Originally Posted by Splossy

I learned the elmsley and jordan counts ages ago but none of the effects I do use them. I spent ages learning them and, as far as I can see, they look identical to straight counting.

So I'd like to learn a few good effects where I can utilise them. Any suggestions of some really good false-count based effects?

For packet tricks and a good shocker ending, go with The Web. Some people will assault you afterwards, though.

Dinsdale Piranha · 29th March 2007, 07:25 AM

You can start with the original version of Dai Vernon's Twisting the Aces. I'd also suggest Alex Elmsley's Four Card Trick.

These are two effects that popularized packet tricks using Elmsley and Jordan counts.

thaiboxerken · 29th March 2007, 10:47 AM

I do twisting aces. I never heard of the web.

Dinsdale Piranha · 29th March 2007, 11:27 AM

Originally Posted by thaiboxerken

I do twisting aces. I never heard of the web.

It's a packaged card trick. I never cared for it - not my style.
Here's a description.

http://themagicwarehouse.com/cgi-bin...&x_item=LP1872

thaiboxerken · 29th March 2007, 11:29 AM

my wife says that I better not do that trick on her.

Dinsdale Piranha · 29th March 2007, 11:42 AM

Originally Posted by thaiboxerken

my wife says that I better not do that trick on her.

Ahh, there's nothing like getting caught in a Kimura over a lousy card trick.

firecoins · 31st March 2007, 09:20 PM

twisting the aces was a Dai Vernon effect. You don't need to buy anything for it.

25th March 2007, 12:31 AM	#1
thaiboxerken Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Portland, Oregon Posts: 13,315	Jordan count Anyone have information on how I can learn this techinique? I know the elmsly count and I suspect the Jordan is similar but I want to be sure. I have acquired instruction on a Twisted Aces variation that uses a Jordan count to introduce an unexpected card into the effect but it's useless because I don't know what a jordan count is.
	__________________ All national institutions of churches, whether Jewish, Christian or Turkish, appear to me no other than human inventions, set up to terrify and enslave mankind, and monopolize power & profit - Thomas Paine

25th March 2007, 09:44 AM	#3
thaiboxerken Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Portland, Oregon Posts: 13,315	Can I stick my tongue out while doing it, like the Jordan dunk?
	__________________ All national institutions of churches, whether Jewish, Christian or Turkish, appear to me no other than human inventions, set up to terrify and enslave mankind, and monopolize power & profit - Thomas Paine

26th March 2007, 06:18 AM	#4
Dinsdale Piranha A cruel man, but fair. Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: In the conversation pit. Posts: 842	Originally Posted by thaiboxerken Can I stick my tongue out while doing it, like the Jordan dunk? You're thinking of the Michael Jordan count which only applies to millions of dollars in U.S. currency, not cards.
	__________________ "Don't hit me with them negative waves this early in the morning." Oddball from Kelly's Heroes. "I almost had a psychic girlfriend, but she left me before we met." Steven Wright

28th March 2007, 11:05 AM	#5
Dinsdale Piranha A cruel man, but fair. Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: In the conversation pit. Posts: 842	Here's an online resource with descriptions of several card moves including the Jordan Count. http://www.practicenotincluded.com/ It's password protected so you'll need to know a little about card sleights to enter.
	__________________ "Don't hit me with them negative waves this early in the morning." Oddball from Kelly's Heroes. "I almost had a psychic girlfriend, but she left me before we met." Steven Wright

28th March 2007, 12:13 PM	#6
Brown Philosopher Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Twin Cities, Canada Posts: 9,117	Originally Posted by Dinsdale Piranha It's password protected so you'll need to know a little about card sleights to enter. Well, I was able to enter, but the questions threw me off. I'd never heard of two of the guys, and as for one of the moves, I'd always heard it attributed to ... someone else. Nevertheless, I applied a little logic and was able to pass the test on the first try. Almost immediately, I found an alternate subtlety to use in performing one of my tricks. In this trick, as performed conventionally, there is a risk of flashing at a bad time, and I am not confident that I can consistently misdirect my spectators' attention away from the cards momentarily so that they won't notice the flash if it occurs. With this subtlety, not only is the flashing eliminated, I can even specifically direct the spectator's attention to the cards while I'm doing the dirty work! I can't wait to try it out!
	__________________ Klaatu: I'm impatient with stupidity. My people have learned to live without it. Mr. Harley: I'm afraid my people haven't. I am very sorry. I wish it were otherwise. -- The Day The Earth Stood Still, screenplay by Edmund H. North "Don't you get me wrong. I only want to know." -- Judas in Jesus Christ Superstar, lyrics by Tim Rice

25th March 2007, 01:55 AM	#2
Mick Houlahan Scholar Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Chicago 'burbs Posts: 112	Card College Volume Two by Roberto Giobbi. What the Elmsley Count does for the third card in the packet, the Jordan Count does for the bottom card.

28th March 2007, 12:22 PM	#7
Dinsdale Piranha A cruel man, but fair. Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: In the conversation pit. Posts: 842	Originally Posted by Brown Almost immediately, I found an alternate subtlety to use in performing one of my tricks. In this trick, as performed conventionally, there is a risk of flashing at a bad time, and I am not confident that I can consistently misdirect my spectators' attention away from the cards momentarily so that they won't notice the flash if it occurs. With this subtlety, not only is the flashing eliminated, I can even specifically direct the spectator's attention to the cards while I'm doing the dirty work! I can't wait to try it out! Verrrry interesting. Any hint as to which trick you are referring? Twisting the Aces, perhaps?
	__________________ "Don't hit me with them negative waves this early in the morning." Oddball from Kelly's Heroes. "I almost had a psychic girlfriend, but she left me before we met." Steven Wright

28th March 2007, 12:50 PM	#8
Brown Philosopher Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Twin Cities, Canada Posts: 9,117	Originally Posted by Dinsdale Piranha Verrrry interesting. Any hint as to which trick you are referring? Twisting the Aces, perhaps? Mmmmm, could be! Without going into details, I would neither use the classic patter, nor would I use the patter recommended at the website; rather, I would use my own flavor of patter (my patter avoids suggesting that I am a magician or a card sharp, as I wish to be more humble and suggest that weird things simply happen, not that I'm actually making them happen) and combine it with the technique of using a card as a "pointer." By using a card as a pointer, I can direct the attention to the cards themselves in a natural and innocent manner, while at the same time doing the dirty work. All of which might make complete sense, or no sense whatsoever. But there you are.
	__________________ Klaatu: I'm impatient with stupidity. My people have learned to live without it. Mr. Harley: I'm afraid my people haven't. I am very sorry. I wish it were otherwise. -- The Day The Earth Stood Still, screenplay by Edmund H. North "Don't you get me wrong. I only want to know." -- Judas in Jesus Christ Superstar, lyrics by Tim Rice

28th March 2007, 03:07 PM	#9
thaiboxerken Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Portland, Oregon Posts: 13,315	I find it easier to do the effects for people who are tipsy. But then, they are more belligerent about asking me how I did it. My most enjoyable experience came from Roadtoad as he thoroughly enjoyed my ambitious card routine and was very entertaining himself. But he wasn't tipsy and didn't ask how I did it either.
	__________________ All national institutions of churches, whether Jewish, Christian or Turkish, appear to me no other than human inventions, set up to terrify and enslave mankind, and monopolize power & profit - Thomas Paine

29th March 2007, 06:44 AM	#10
NeilC Graduate Poster Join Date: Sep 2005 Location: London, UK Posts: 1,085	I learned the elmsley and jordan counts ages ago but none of the effects I do use them. I spent ages learning them and, as far as I can see, they look identical to straight counting. So I'd like to learn a few good effects where I can utilise them. Any suggestions of some really good false-count based effects?

29th March 2007, 06:48 AM	#11
Garrette Philosopher Join Date: Aug 2001 Posts: 7,964	Originally Posted by Splossy I learned the elmsley and jordan counts ages ago but none of the effects I do use them. I spent ages learning them and, as far as I can see, they look identical to straight counting. So I'd like to learn a few good effects where I can utilise them. Any suggestions of some really good false-count based effects? For packet tricks and a good shocker ending, go with The Web. Some people will assault you afterwards, though.
Garrette Philosopher Join Date: Aug 2001 Posts: 7,964	__________________ My kids still love me.

29th March 2007, 07:25 AM	#12
Dinsdale Piranha A cruel man, but fair. Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: In the conversation pit. Posts: 842	You can start with the original version of Dai Vernon's Twisting the Aces. I'd also suggest Alex Elmsley's Four Card Trick. These are two effects that popularized packet tricks using Elmsley and Jordan counts.
	__________________ "Don't hit me with them negative waves this early in the morning." Oddball from Kelly's Heroes. "I almost had a psychic girlfriend, but she left me before we met." Steven Wright

29th March 2007, 10:47 AM	#13
thaiboxerken Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Portland, Oregon Posts: 13,315	I do twisting aces. I never heard of the web.
	__________________ All national institutions of churches, whether Jewish, Christian or Turkish, appear to me no other than human inventions, set up to terrify and enslave mankind, and monopolize power & profit - Thomas Paine

29th March 2007, 11:27 AM	#14
Dinsdale Piranha A cruel man, but fair. Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: In the conversation pit. Posts: 842	Originally Posted by thaiboxerken I do twisting aces. I never heard of the web. It's a packaged card trick. I never cared for it - not my style. Here's a description. http://themagicwarehouse.com/cgi-bin...&x_item=LP1872
	__________________ "Don't hit me with them negative waves this early in the morning." Oddball from Kelly's Heroes. "I almost had a psychic girlfriend, but she left me before we met." Steven Wright

29th March 2007, 11:29 AM	#15
thaiboxerken Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Portland, Oregon Posts: 13,315	my wife says that I better not do that trick on her.
	__________________ All national institutions of churches, whether Jewish, Christian or Turkish, appear to me no other than human inventions, set up to terrify and enslave mankind, and monopolize power & profit - Thomas Paine

29th March 2007, 11:42 AM	#16
Dinsdale Piranha A cruel man, but fair. Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: In the conversation pit. Posts: 842	Originally Posted by thaiboxerken my wife says that I better not do that trick on her. Ahh, there's nothing like getting caught in a Kimura over a lousy card trick.
	__________________ "Don't hit me with them negative waves this early in the morning." Oddball from Kelly's Heroes. "I almost had a psychic girlfriend, but she left me before we met." Steven Wright

31st March 2007, 09:20 PM	#17
firecoins Illuminator Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Nyack, NY Posts: 3,065	twisting the aces was a Dai Vernon effect. You don't need to buy anything for it.
	__________________ NY Paramedic, skeptic, 9/11/01 Reality-ist. I am both right wing nut and left wing lunatic. Deal with it.