US Presidential Straw Poll

Puppycow · 25th April 2007, 01:45 AM

Who do JREFers want to see in the Oval Office in 2009?
You don't even have to be a US ctizen to vote!
20 is the limit for poll choices, so sorry if your favorite candidate is not given.

Here is a more exhaustive list of potential candidates with links to their respective sites

Whoracle · 25th April 2007, 01:56 AM

I'm leaning Obama in the early going.

Puppycow · 25th April 2007, 02:15 AM

Originally Posted by Whoracle

I'm leaning Obama in the early going.

Me too. BTW, I read on some blog that Obama is supposed to be more popular with the so-called "wine and cheese" liberals (those with more education and income), as well as younger people and men. Would any or all of those descriptions fit you? It sort of fits me except the income part, which is about average middle-class.

Upchurch · 25th April 2007, 02:28 AM

My wife and I were talking about this just the other day. She contends that you vote for the person that you want to win in the primaries and against the person you don't want to win in the general election.

At this point in time and space, I'm rooting for the local boy made good: Obama. It's a shame we don't have the ability to change our votes as time goes on to keep the poll current.

Puppycow · 25th April 2007, 02:39 AM

Originally Posted by Upchurch

My wife and I were talking about this just the other day. She contends that you vote for the person that you want to win in the primaries and against the person you don't want to win in the general election.

At this point in time and space, I'm rooting for the local boy made good: Obama. It's a shame we don't have the ability to change our votes as time goes on to keep the poll current.

We can do the poll again!

andyandy · 25th April 2007, 02:42 AM

barack has a catchy name - i'd vote for him

richardm · 25th April 2007, 02:50 AM

I'd like Hillary to win it, at least in part because I think the rage from the right-wingers would be hilarious to watch. Failing that, I've read some interviews with Obama Barack and he seems to be a genuinely capable person.

Whoracle · 25th April 2007, 03:05 AM

Originally Posted by Puppycow

Me too. BTW, I read on some blog that Obama is supposed to be more popular with the so-called "wine and cheese" liberals (those with more education and income), as well as younger people and men. Would any or all of those descriptions fit you? It sort of fits me except the income part, which is about average middle-class.

I'm a young male who should be finishing college in December. As for income I'm dirt poor since I'm currently unemployed.

Upchurch · 25th April 2007, 04:23 AM

Originally Posted by richardm

I'd like Hillary to win it

I'm opposed to Hillary as president on the principle that it is not a good thing for a democracy to have the executive position passed back and forth between two families over a period of 24 to 28 years. I do not want to see us go from a narrow two party system to a suffocatingly constricted two family system.

Katana · 25th April 2007, 04:27 AM

I was surprised to see the Tom Tancredo & Newt votes.

If one of you would be willing, could you elaborate on why you support them? Just curious.

BPSCG · 25th April 2007, 04:59 AM

Originally Posted by Puppycow

You don't even have to be a US ctizen to vote!

How is that different from real life?

Texastwister · 25th April 2007, 05:06 AM

I voted for Newt....I personally am not very excited about the Rep. field, but have always thought Newt to have great ideas, and good leadership abilities. Also if you hear him speak, he does have the charisma, which is a pre-req. to be elected nowadays.

I would never vote the other side of the ticket.

Katana · 25th April 2007, 05:11 AM

Originally Posted by Texastwister

I would never vote the other side of the ticket.

Why?

Beerina · 25th April 2007, 05:38 AM

Originally Posted by andyandy

barack has a catchy name - i'd vote for him

Oh, like "Hillary" isn't good enuf for u?

Beerina · 25th April 2007, 05:41 AM

Originally Posted by Whoracle

I'm a young male who should be finishing college in December. As for income I'm dirt poor since I'm currently unemployed.

Given you may have college loans, your income has been damned negative for several years...

As for me...rudy...rudy...Rudy...Rudy...RUDY...RUDY!!!

BPSCG · 25th April 2007, 06:32 AM

Originally Posted by andyandy

barack has a catchy name - i'd vote for him

Don't make your mind up too soon, andyandy - I hear Rutt Gonad is getting ready to declare.

Katana · 25th April 2007, 06:34 AM

On the subject of names, what is with Newt?

HarryKeogh · 25th April 2007, 06:40 AM

Originally Posted by Katana

On the subject of names, what is with Newt?

He was born 10 weeks premature and the nurses in the ward affectionately began calling him "Minute" due to his small size. His parents took a liking to it and formally named him that. When he was older his friends called him "Newt" for short and eventually everyone called him that.

Come to think of it it might just be short for Newton.

Darth Rotor · 25th April 2007, 07:05 AM

Originally Posted by Puppycow

Who do JREFers want to see in the Oval Office in 2009?

Why do you hate Ron Paul?

He has declared, yet you put others who are not yet declared on your list.

How about a little love for a small government man . . .

DR

ImaginalDisc · 25th April 2007, 07:12 AM

Can I just ask why folks seem to be so enamored of Obama? He's had a two year career as a federal legislator, and a career as a state legislator of only seven years.

Is it silly of me to prefer someone with a track record?

Mind you, I selected "Gore" on the dying hope he might run and win. Hillary Clinton gives me the heebie-jeebies.

shemp · 25th April 2007, 07:13 AM

Originally Posted by Darth Rotor

Why do you hate Ron Paul?

He has declared, yet you put others who are not yet declared on your list.

How about a little love for a small government man . . .

DR

Are you saying he's a midget?

Katana · 25th April 2007, 07:14 AM

Originally Posted by ImaginalDisc

Can I just ask why folks seem to be so enamored of Obama? He's had a two year career as a federal legislator, and a career as a state legislator of only seven years.

Is it silly of me to prefer someone with a track record?

Depends on the track record. Sometimes little to none is preferable.

I would add that I haven't made up my mind entirely on who will get my vote.

Puppycow · 25th April 2007, 07:14 AM

Originally Posted by Katana

I was surprised to see the Tom Tancredo & Newt votes.

If one of you would be willing, could you elaborate on why you support them? Just curious.

I wasn't the one who voted for Tancredo, but my understanding is that his main issue is stopping illegal immigration. A lot of people say this is xenophobia, but I think there are also legitimate arguments to be made for this position. It depresses wages in unskilled industries, for one thing, which increases inequality. I don't have a problem with legal immigration, I just think people should follow the rules. We can accomodate a certain number each year, but there are limits. It takes time to absorb new immigrants. And there is the simple matter of ettiquette. If a person came into your house uninvited you would feel differently about them than if they came in with your permission. Any mixed signals like amnesty tend to encourage more illegal immigration. So I am not without some degree of sympathy for that position.

BTW, I happen to be an American living in Japan, and I follow all their rules and jump through the appropriate hoops. I also learned the language and do not expect Japanese to speak English to me at all. If you choose to live in a country, you need to learn the language. When I visited my parents in California last year, I happened to go to a Jack in the Box, and the employees didn't seem to be able to speak English, or even to have much of an idea about what to do in general. It's hard not to notice the difference with Japan. Japan does not allow unskilled immigrants into the country (they exist, but in smaller numbers, and they have been cracking down). Of course being an island country makes it somewhat easier. The level of politeness of service employees in Japan is worlds better that I remember from the US. There are some immigrants, but they are pretty well integrated and service employees tend to make better wages than their US counterparts.

Last year's riots in France also should make us wary about letting the illegal immigration problem fester. I don't claim to know the right solution, but I do worry that something like that could develop some day.

shemp · 25th April 2007, 07:15 AM

PUNY HUMANS!!! YOU WILL ALL VOTE FOR ZOD!!!

ImaginalDisc · 25th April 2007, 07:29 AM

Originally Posted by Katana

Depends on the track record. Sometimes little to none is preferable.

I would add that I haven't made up my mind entirely on who will get my vote.

If it comes to a choice between Clinton and Obama, I know I'll vote against Ms. Video Game Censorship, Banning Flag Burning (obscene, certainly, but why make it illegal?), Pro Invade Iraq For No Reason and Not Even Regret It Later, Anti-Gay Rights, Pro-Death Penalty. She's just not liberal enough for me.

ImaginalDisc · 25th April 2007, 07:32 AM

Originally Posted by shemp

PUNY HUMANS!!! YOU WILL ALL VOTE FOR ZOD!!!

Christopher Walken seems to poll better among the movie fan demographic. Maybe they should become running mates.

Puppycow · 25th April 2007, 07:32 AM

Originally Posted by ImaginalDisc

Can I just ask why folks seem to be so enamored of Obama? He's had a two year career as a federal legislator, and a career as a state legislator of only seven years.

Is it silly of me to prefer someone with a track record?

Mind you, I selected "Gore" on the dying hope he might run and win. Hillary Clinton gives me the heebie-jeebies.

Dick Cheney had a track record.

Obama's a great writer and speaker, he made a very good decision in opposing the Iraq invasion from the beginning. His sense of foreign policy seems to be better than the others. And I also think its time for someone other than another white male to get a turn. And he just seems more charismatic to me on many levels. I suggest reading his book!

I also think Gore deserves credit too for being right about Iraq from the beginning. If he had been elected in 2000, just think about how different things might be now.

Darth Rotor · 25th April 2007, 07:33 AM

Originally Posted by shemp

PUNY HUMANS!!! YOU WILL ALL VOTE FOR ZOD!!!

Nope, he was not born in the US, so he can't run. Just like Ahnold.

As to Ron Paul's midgetry, that is metaphorical, rather than material, in nature but in the "political coalition behind him sense" he is a bit of a midget, being pretty much a libertarian.

DR

Darth Rotor · 25th April 2007, 07:34 AM

Originally Posted by Puppycow

And I also think its time for someone other than another white male to get a turn. And he just seems more charismatic to me on many levels. I suggest reading his book!

*Puts on hat of a devil's advocate:*

What does race and gender have to do with this?

More to the point, how is Obama not a While Male, or at least a "half" white male? His mom was of Caucasian extraction. His dad was from Kenya. Is this an appeal to the old racialist, and racist, theme of tainted blood? (Rhetorical question, at root.)

Who are you to classify him? (How he considers and identifies himself is another matter, of course, and far more important to what you or I would consider him.

)

See also Tiger Woods, on the matter of people of genetic / racial / ethnic stew. Cablanasian is the phrase he coined.

*Removes Devil's Advocate hat*

DR

BPSCG · 25th April 2007, 07:51 AM

Originally Posted by Darth Rotor

Nope, he was not born in the US, so he can't run. Just like Ahnold.

Pah! You think a little thing like the Constitution of the United States of America will stop Our Lord Zod?

I, for one, look forward to laying down all my money, my earthly goods, even my very life, before our new ruler.

Upchurch · 25th April 2007, 07:54 AM

Originally Posted by BPSCG

I, for one, look forward to laying down all my money, my earthly goods, even my very life, before our new ruler.

don't forget your knees. Kneel before Zod.

Upchurch · 25th April 2007, 08:02 AM

Originally Posted by ImaginalDisc

Can I just ask why folks seem to be so enamored of Obama? He's had a two year career as a federal legislator, and a career as a state legislator of only seven years.

Is it silly of me to prefer someone with a track record?

Well, Bush only had 5 years of government experience when he.....

oh. Good point.

Joe Random · 25th April 2007, 08:13 AM

Pardon the derail, but it appears Zod is expanding his horizons :

http://youtube.com/watch?v=5FTsCMwX5xE

Fnord · 25th April 2007, 10:32 AM

Voting for the "Lesser of Two Evils" not only maintains a steady stream of evil elected officials, but ensures that they will be progressively less effective ("lamer") than the previous ones.

Would somebody please provide a GOOD candidate?

Thank you.

ImaginalDisc · 25th April 2007, 10:40 AM

Originally Posted by Upchurch

Well, Bush only had 5 years of government experience when he.....

oh. Good point.

Yeah, and the Bush/Obama comparison is apt because, like Bush in 1999, the major newspapers and news commentators all really like him. Remember when Bush was "folksy" and "the kind of guy you want to have a beer with?" People chatted up how great and personable Bush was as a "normal guy" because there wasn't very much of a record to examine.

Mind you, Obama's obviously better than Bush. He can speak English and he's much more consistent in his stated views. The comparison would be incredibly unfair if I didn't mean it exclusively in regards to their preliminary media coverage. I'm just saying that voting for a rookie candidates makes me feel like I'm voting for a pig in a poke.

Katana · 25th April 2007, 01:38 PM

Is the fact that Kucinich is a vegan common knowledge?

I only just found that out.

Interesting.

Upchurch · 25th April 2007, 02:02 PM

Originally Posted by Katana

Is the fact that Kucinich is a vegan common knowledge?

I knew. and I think his wife, though hot, is a total woo.

Katana · 25th April 2007, 02:07 PM

Originally Posted by Upchurch

I knew. and I think his wife, though hot, is a total woo.

How so?

Just curious.

The Atheist · 25th April 2007, 02:33 PM

57 votes, Obama with exactly a third of them from a long list of candidates, Giuliani second with seven...

Can it be that USA is about to have its first black presidential candidate on the polling options?

I must find a bookie offering odds on his assassination. Be a good one for a psychic: "Barack Obama will be assassinated in ......... (whichever month is a month after the candidate selection is finalised)"

I might start a thread at Stormfront to see what people there think and compare the two.

The Central Scrutinizer · 25th April 2007, 02:36 PM

Originally Posted by Upchurch

At this point in time and space, I'm rooting for the local boy made good: Obama.

You're use of the term "boy" to describe Obama is offensive.

Hillary Clinton	9	7.63%
Barack Obama	34	28.81%
John Edwards	6	5.08%
Dennis Kucinich	3	2.54%
Al Gore	10	8.47%
Bill Richardson	3	2.54%
Wesley Clark	1	0.85%
Other Democrat	0	0%
Rudy Giuliani	12	10.17%
John McCain	2	1.69%
Mitt Romney	1	0.85%
Fred Thompson	2	1.69%
Tommy Thompson	0	0%
Tom Tancredo	1	0.85%
Newt Gingrich	2	1.69%
Chuck Hagel	1	0.85%
Other Republican	0	0%
Ralph Nader	5	4.24%
Kinky Friedman	6	5.08%
Other Third Party/Independent/Planet X	20	16.95%
Voters: 118. You may not vote on this poll

25th April 2007, 01:45 AM	#1
Puppycow Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Japan Posts: 15,784	US Presidential Straw Poll Who do JREFers want to see in the Oval Office in 2009? You don't even have to be a US ctizen to vote! 20 is the limit for poll choices, so sorry if your favorite candidate is not given. Here is a more exhaustive list of potential candidates with links to their respective sites

25th April 2007, 02:42 AM	#6
andyandy anthropomorphic ape Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: up a tree Posts: 8,192	barack has a catchy name - i'd vote for him
	__________________ "Contentment is found in the music of Bach, the books of Tolstoy and the equations of Dirac, not at the wheel of a BMW or the aisles of Harvey Nicks."

25th April 2007, 02:50 AM	#7
richardm Philosopher Join Date: Aug 2001 Posts: 9,270	I'd like Hillary to win it, at least in part because I think the rage from the right-wingers would be hilarious to watch. Failing that, I've read some interviews with Obama Barack and he seems to be a genuinely capable person.
richardm Philosopher Join Date: Aug 2001 Posts: 9,270	__________________ Rimmer: Look at her! Magnificent woman! Very prim, very proper, almost austere. Some people took her for cold, thought she was aloof. Not a bit of it. She just despised fools. Quite tragic, really, because otherwise I think we'd have got on famously.

25th April 2007, 04:27 AM	#10
Katana Illuminator Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 4,894	I was surprised to see the Tom Tancredo & Newt votes. If one of you would be willing, could you elaborate on why you support them? Just curious.
Katana Illuminator Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 4,894	__________________ "I think Katana is as big of a perv as the rest of us." - Dragonrock "The rationality was there, and clear and concise. The condescention was hinted at and was like french onion dip on the perfect potato chip. Tasted like woo smackdown." - Fowlsound (aka Ducky, darnit) "Katana is one quick shut-yo-mouth!" - JonnyFive StopSylviaBrowne Last edited by Katana; 25th April 2007 at 05:02 AM. Reason: Mistake

25th April 2007, 01:56 AM	#2
Whoracle Suspended Join Date: May 2003 Location: South of Heaven Posts: 343	I'm leaning Obama in the early going.

25th April 2007, 02:15 AM	#3
Puppycow Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Japan Posts: 15,784	Originally Posted by Whoracle I'm leaning Obama in the early going. Me too. BTW, I read on some blog that Obama is supposed to be more popular with the so-called "wine and cheese" liberals (those with more education and income), as well as younger people and men. Would any or all of those descriptions fit you? It sort of fits me except the income part, which is about average middle-class.

25th April 2007, 02:28 AM	#4
Upchurch Papa Funkosophy Join Date: May 2002 Location: Funky Town (STL, MO) Posts: 23,426	My wife and I were talking about this just the other day. She contends that you vote for the person that you want to win in the primaries and against the person you don't want to win in the general election. At this point in time and space, I'm rooting for the local boy made good: Obama. It's a shame we don't have the ability to change our votes as time goes on to keep the poll current.

25th April 2007, 02:39 AM	#5
Puppycow Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Japan Posts: 15,784	Originally Posted by Upchurch My wife and I were talking about this just the other day. She contends that you vote for the person that you want to win in the primaries and against the person you don't want to win in the general election. At this point in time and space, I'm rooting for the local boy made good: Obama. It's a shame we don't have the ability to change our votes as time goes on to keep the poll current. We can do the poll again!

25th April 2007, 03:05 AM	#8
Whoracle Suspended Join Date: May 2003 Location: South of Heaven Posts: 343	Originally Posted by Puppycow Me too. BTW, I read on some blog that Obama is supposed to be more popular with the so-called "wine and cheese" liberals (those with more education and income), as well as younger people and men. Would any or all of those descriptions fit you? It sort of fits me except the income part, which is about average middle-class. I'm a young male who should be finishing college in December. As for income I'm dirt poor since I'm currently unemployed.

25th April 2007, 04:23 AM	#9
Upchurch Papa Funkosophy Join Date: May 2002 Location: Funky Town (STL, MO) Posts: 23,426	Originally Posted by richardm I'd like Hillary to win it I'm opposed to Hillary as president on the principle that it is not a good thing for a democracy to have the executive position passed back and forth between two families over a period of 24 to 28 years. I do not want to see us go from a narrow two party system to a suffocatingly constricted two family system.

25th April 2007, 04:59 AM	#11
BPSCG Cannibal Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Looting Fafner's Cave Posts: 17,556	Originally Posted by Puppycow You don't even have to be a US ctizen to vote! How is that different from real life?
	__________________ Philanthropist (n.) - Someone who spends his own money to advance his version of Utopia. Socialist (n.) - Someone who spends your money to advance his version of Utopia.

25th April 2007, 05:06 AM	#12
Texastwister Scholar Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 92	I voted for Newt....I personally am not very excited about the Rep. field, but have always thought Newt to have great ideas, and good leadership abilities. Also if you hear him speak, he does have the charisma, which is a pre-req. to be elected nowadays. I would never vote the other side of the ticket.
Texastwister Scholar Join Date: Aug 2006 Posts: 92

25th April 2007, 05:11 AM	#13
Katana Illuminator Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 4,894	Originally Posted by Texastwister I would never vote the other side of the ticket. Why?
Katana Illuminator Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 4,894	__________________ "I think Katana is as big of a perv as the rest of us." - Dragonrock "The rationality was there, and clear and concise. The condescention was hinted at and was like french onion dip on the perfect potato chip. Tasted like woo smackdown." - Fowlsound (aka Ducky, darnit) "Katana is one quick shut-yo-mouth!" - JonnyFive StopSylviaBrowne

25th April 2007, 05:38 AM	#14
Beerina Sarcastic Conqueror of Notions Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: A floating island above the clouds Posts: 23,835	Originally Posted by andyandy barack has a catchy name - i'd vote for him Oh, like "Hillary" isn't good enuf for u?
	__________________ "Great innovations should not be forced [by way of] slender majorities." - Thomas Jefferson The government should nationalize it! Socialized, single-payer video game development and sales *now!* More, cheaper, better games, right? Right?

25th April 2007, 05:41 AM	#15
Beerina Sarcastic Conqueror of Notions Join Date: Mar 2004 Location: A floating island above the clouds Posts: 23,835	Originally Posted by Whoracle I'm a young male who should be finishing college in December. As for income I'm dirt poor since I'm currently unemployed. Given you may have college loans, your income has been damned negative for several years... As for me...rudy...rudy...Rudy...Rudy...RUDY...RUDY!!!
	__________________ "Great innovations should not be forced [by way of] slender majorities." - Thomas Jefferson The government should nationalize it! Socialized, single-payer video game development and sales *now!* More, cheaper, better games, right? Right?

25th April 2007, 06:32 AM	#16
BPSCG Cannibal Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Looting Fafner's Cave Posts: 17,556	Originally Posted by andyandy barack has a catchy name - i'd vote for him Don't make your mind up too soon, andyandy - I hear Rutt Gonad is getting ready to declare.
	__________________ Philanthropist (n.) - Someone who spends his own money to advance his version of Utopia. Socialist (n.) - Someone who spends your money to advance his version of Utopia.

25th April 2007, 06:34 AM	#17
Katana Illuminator Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 4,894	On the subject of names, what is with Newt?
Katana Illuminator Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 4,894	__________________ "I think Katana is as big of a perv as the rest of us." - Dragonrock "The rationality was there, and clear and concise. The condescention was hinted at and was like french onion dip on the perfect potato chip. Tasted like woo smackdown." - Fowlsound (aka Ducky, darnit) "Katana is one quick shut-yo-mouth!" - JonnyFive StopSylviaBrowne

25th April 2007, 06:40 AM	#18
HarryKeogh Catholic School Survivor Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: New York, NY Posts: 11,342	Originally Posted by Katana On the subject of names, what is with Newt? He was born 10 weeks premature and the nurses in the ward affectionately began calling him "Minute" due to his small size. His parents took a liking to it and formally named him that. When he was older his friends called him "Newt" for short and eventually everyone called him that. Come to think of it it might just be short for Newton.

25th April 2007, 07:05 AM	#19
Darth Rotor Salted Sith Cynic Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Rat cheer Posts: 34,265	Originally Posted by Puppycow Who do JREFers want to see in the Oval Office in 2009? Why do you hate Ron Paul? He has declared, yet you put others who are not yet declared on your list. How about a little love for a small government man . . . DR
	__________________ Helicopters don't so much fly as beat the air into submission. "Jesus wept, but did He laugh?"--F.H. Buckley____"There is one thing that was too great for God to show us when He walked upon our earth ... His mirth." --Chesterton__"If the barbarian in us is excised, so is our humanity."--D'rok__ "I only use my gun whenever kindness fails."-- Robert Earl Keen__"Sturgeon spares none.". -- The Marquis

25th April 2007, 07:12 AM	#20
ImaginalDisc Proactive Untwister of Octagonal Hippopotamus Pants Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Miami, Fl Posts: 10,225	Can I just ask why folks seem to be so enamored of Obama? He's had a two year career as a federal legislator, and a career as a state legislator of only seven years. Is it silly of me to prefer someone with a track record? Mind you, I selected "Gore" on the dying hope he might run and win. Hillary Clinton gives me the heebie-jeebies.
	__________________ Definition: 'Love' is making a shot to the knees of a target 120 kilometers away using an Aratech sniper rifle with a tri-light scope. Statement: This definition, I am told, is subject to interpretation. Obviously, love is a matter of odds. Not many meatbags could make such a shot, and fewer would derive love from it. Yet for me, love is knowing your target, putting them in your targeting reticle, and together, achieving a singular purpose, against statistically long odds. *-HK-47*

25th April 2007, 07:13 AM	#21
shemp Timothy, Timothy, where on earth did you go? Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: trapped in a cave-in with Joe Posts: 12,892	Originally Posted by Darth Rotor Why do you hate Ron Paul? He has declared, yet you put others who are not yet declared on your list. How about a little love for a small government man . . . DR Are you saying he's a midget?
	__________________ Church on Sunday, sleep and nod Tryin' to duck the wrath of God Preacher's fillin' us with fright Tryin' to tell us what he thinks is right He really got to be some kind of nut (I can't use it!) Tryin' to make it real - compared to what?

25th April 2007, 07:14 AM	#22
Katana Illuminator Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 4,894	Originally Posted by ImaginalDisc Can I just ask why folks seem to be so enamored of Obama? He's had a two year career as a federal legislator, and a career as a state legislator of only seven years. Is it silly of me to prefer someone with a track record? Depends on the track record. Sometimes little to none is preferable. I would add that I haven't made up my mind entirely on who will get my vote.
Katana Illuminator Join Date: May 2006 Posts: 4,894	__________________ "I think Katana is as big of a perv as the rest of us." - Dragonrock "The rationality was there, and clear and concise. The condescention was hinted at and was like french onion dip on the perfect potato chip. Tasted like woo smackdown." - Fowlsound (aka Ducky, darnit) "Katana is one quick shut-yo-mouth!" - JonnyFive StopSylviaBrowne

25th April 2007, 07:14 AM	#23
Puppycow Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Japan Posts: 15,784	Originally Posted by Katana I was surprised to see the Tom Tancredo & Newt votes. If one of you would be willing, could you elaborate on why you support them? Just curious. I wasn't the one who voted for Tancredo, but my understanding is that his main issue is stopping illegal immigration. A lot of people say this is xenophobia, but I think there are also legitimate arguments to be made for this position. It depresses wages in unskilled industries, for one thing, which increases inequality. I don't have a problem with legal immigration, I just think people should follow the rules. We can accomodate a certain number each year, but there are limits. It takes time to absorb new immigrants. And there is the simple matter of ettiquette. If a person came into your house uninvited you would feel differently about them than if they came in with your permission. Any mixed signals like amnesty tend to encourage more illegal immigration. So I am not without some degree of sympathy for that position. BTW, I happen to be an American living in Japan, and I follow all their rules and jump through the appropriate hoops. I also learned the language and do not expect Japanese to speak English to me at all. If you choose to live in a country, you need to learn the language. When I visited my parents in California last year, I happened to go to a Jack in the Box, and the employees didn't seem to be able to speak English, or even to have much of an idea about what to do in general. It's hard not to notice the difference with Japan. Japan does not allow unskilled immigrants into the country (they exist, but in smaller numbers, and they have been cracking down). Of course being an island country makes it somewhat easier. The level of politeness of service employees in Japan is worlds better that I remember from the US. There are some immigrants, but they are pretty well integrated and service employees tend to make better wages than their US counterparts. Last year's riots in France also should make us wary about letting the illegal immigration problem fester. I don't claim to know the right solution, but I do worry that something like that could develop some day.
	Last edited by Puppycow; 25th April 2007 at 07:24 AM.

25th April 2007, 07:15 AM	#24
shemp Timothy, Timothy, where on earth did you go? Join Date: Nov 2002 Location: trapped in a cave-in with Joe Posts: 12,892	PUNY HUMANS!!! YOU WILL ALL VOTE FOR ZOD!!!
	__________________ Church on Sunday, sleep and nod Tryin' to duck the wrath of God Preacher's fillin' us with fright Tryin' to tell us what he thinks is right He really got to be some kind of nut (I can't use it!) Tryin' to make it real - compared to what?

25th April 2007, 07:29 AM	#25
ImaginalDisc Proactive Untwister of Octagonal Hippopotamus Pants Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Miami, Fl Posts: 10,225	Originally Posted by Katana Depends on the track record. Sometimes little to none is preferable. I would add that I haven't made up my mind entirely on who will get my vote. If it comes to a choice between Clinton and Obama, I know I'll vote against Ms. Video Game Censorship, Banning Flag Burning (obscene, certainly, but why make it illegal?), Pro Invade Iraq For No Reason and Not Even Regret It Later, Anti-Gay Rights, Pro-Death Penalty. She's just not liberal enough for me.
	__________________ Definition: 'Love' is making a shot to the knees of a target 120 kilometers away using an Aratech sniper rifle with a tri-light scope. Statement: This definition, I am told, is subject to interpretation. Obviously, love is a matter of odds. Not many meatbags could make such a shot, and fewer would derive love from it. Yet for me, love is knowing your target, putting them in your targeting reticle, and together, achieving a singular purpose, against statistically long odds. *-HK-47*

25th April 2007, 07:32 AM	#26
ImaginalDisc Proactive Untwister of Octagonal Hippopotamus Pants Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Miami, Fl Posts: 10,225	Originally Posted by shemp PUNY HUMANS!!! YOU WILL ALL VOTE FOR ZOD!!! Christopher Walken seems to poll better among the movie fan demographic. Maybe they should become running mates.
	__________________ Definition: 'Love' is making a shot to the knees of a target 120 kilometers away using an Aratech sniper rifle with a tri-light scope. Statement: This definition, I am told, is subject to interpretation. Obviously, love is a matter of odds. Not many meatbags could make such a shot, and fewer would derive love from it. Yet for me, love is knowing your target, putting them in your targeting reticle, and together, achieving a singular purpose, against statistically long odds. *-HK-47*

25th April 2007, 07:33 AM	#28
Darth Rotor Salted Sith Cynic Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Rat cheer Posts: 34,265	Originally Posted by shemp PUNY HUMANS!!! YOU WILL ALL VOTE FOR ZOD!!! Nope, he was not born in the US, so he can't run. Just like Ahnold. As to Ron Paul's midgetry, that is metaphorical, rather than material, in nature but in the "political coalition behind him sense" he is a bit of a midget, being pretty much a libertarian. DR
	__________________ Helicopters don't so much fly as beat the air into submission. "Jesus wept, but did He laugh?"--F.H. Buckley____"There is one thing that was too great for God to show us when He walked upon our earth ... His mirth." --Chesterton__"If the barbarian in us is excised, so is our humanity."--D'rok__ "I only use my gun whenever kindness fails."-- Robert Earl Keen__"Sturgeon spares none.". -- The Marquis

25th April 2007, 07:34 AM	#29
Darth Rotor Salted Sith Cynic Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Rat cheer Posts: 34,265	Originally Posted by Puppycow And I also think its time for someone other than another white male to get a turn. And he just seems more charismatic to me on many levels. I suggest reading his book! Puts on hat of a devil's advocate: What does race and gender have to do with this? More to the point, how is Obama not a While Male, or at least a "half" white male? His mom was of Caucasian extraction. His dad was from Kenya. Is this an appeal to the old racialist, and racist, theme of tainted blood? (Rhetorical question, at root.) Who are you to classify him? (How he considers and identifies himself is another matter, of course, and far more important to what you or I would consider him. ) See also Tiger Woods, on the matter of people of genetic / racial / ethnic stew. Cablanasian is the phrase he coined. Removes Devil's Advocate hat DR
	__________________ Helicopters don't so much fly as beat the air into submission. "Jesus wept, but did He laugh?"--F.H. Buckley____"There is one thing that was too great for God to show us when He walked upon our earth ... His mirth." --Chesterton__"If the barbarian in us is excised, so is our humanity."--D'rok__ "I only use my gun whenever kindness fails."-- Robert Earl Keen__"Sturgeon spares none.". -- The Marquis Last edited by Darth Rotor; 25th April 2007 at 07:40 AM.

25th April 2007, 07:51 AM	#30
BPSCG Cannibal Join Date: Mar 2002 Location: Looting Fafner's Cave Posts: 17,556	Originally Posted by Darth Rotor Nope, he was not born in the US, so he can't run. Just like Ahnold. Pah! You think a little thing like the Constitution of the United States of America will stop Our Lord Zod? I, for one, look forward to laying down all my money, my earthly goods, even my very life, before our new ruler.
	__________________ Philanthropist (n.) - Someone who spends his own money to advance his version of Utopia. Socialist (n.) - Someone who spends your money to advance his version of Utopia.

25th April 2007, 07:54 AM	#31
Upchurch Papa Funkosophy Join Date: May 2002 Location: Funky Town (STL, MO) Posts: 23,426	Originally Posted by BPSCG I, for one, look forward to laying down all my money, my earthly goods, even my very life, before our new ruler. don't forget your knees. Kneel before Zod.

25th April 2007, 08:02 AM	#32
Upchurch Papa Funkosophy Join Date: May 2002 Location: Funky Town (STL, MO) Posts: 23,426	Originally Posted by ImaginalDisc Can I just ask why folks seem to be so enamored of Obama? He's had a two year career as a federal legislator, and a career as a state legislator of only seven years. Is it silly of me to prefer someone with a track record? Well, Bush only had 5 years of government experience when he..... oh. Good point.

25th April 2007, 08:13 AM	#33
Joe Random Muse Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 698	Pardon the derail, but it appears Zod is expanding his horizons : http://youtube.com/watch?v=5FTsCMwX5xE
Joe Random Muse Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 698

25th April 2007, 10:32 AM	#34
Fnord Metasyntactic Variable Join Date: Oct 2006 Posts: 6,633	Voting for the "Lesser of Two Evils" not only maintains a steady stream of evil elected officials, but ensures that they will be progressively less effective ("lamer") than the previous ones. Would somebody please provide a GOOD candidate? Thank you.
	__________________ Belief is the subjective acceptance of a (valid or invalid) concept, opinion, or theory; Faith is the unreasoned belief in improvable things; *and Knowledge* is the reasoned belief in provable things. Belief itself proves nothing.**

25th April 2007, 10:40 AM	#35
ImaginalDisc Proactive Untwister of Octagonal Hippopotamus Pants Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Miami, Fl Posts: 10,225	Originally Posted by Upchurch Well, Bush only had 5 years of government experience when he..... oh. Good point. Yeah, and the Bush/Obama comparison is apt because, like Bush in 1999, the major newspapers and news commentators all really like him. Remember when Bush was "folksy" and "the kind of guy you want to have a beer with?" People chatted up how great and personable Bush was as a "normal guy" because there wasn't very much of a record to examine. Mind you, Obama's obviously better than Bush. He can speak English and he's much more consistent in his stated views. The comparison would be incredibly unfair if I didn't mean it exclusively in regards to their preliminary media coverage. I'm just saying that voting for a rookie candidates makes me feel like I'm voting for a pig in a poke.
	__________________ Definition: 'Love' is making a shot to the knees of a target 120 kilometers away using an Aratech sniper rifle with a tri-light scope. Statement: This definition, I am told, is subject to interpretation. Obviously, love is a matter of odds. Not many meatbags could make such a shot, and fewer would derive love from it. Yet for me, love is knowing your target, putting them in your targeting reticle, and together, achieving a singular purpose, against statistically long odds. *-HK-47*