magic tricks revealed

T'ai Chi · 5th May 2007, 01:15 PM

If we post a revealing of a magic trick here, or on this board, that is skeptically taboo.

But how about posting links to videos of the tricks being revealed?

DJM · 5th May 2007, 02:00 PM

And why would you want to do that?

wahrheit · 5th May 2007, 02:07 PM

Originally Posted by T'ai Chi

If we post a revealing of a magic trick here, or on this board, that is skeptically taboo.

What does revealing a magic trick have to do with skepticism?

ChristineR · 5th May 2007, 02:08 PM

You aren't trying to come up with an excuse to report the Wiseman video are you?

Use your discretion. If there's a gray area, then the mods will quash the link and give you a warning. If there's a really gray area, ask about it.

The Wiseman video is not in a gray area. Just in case you are referring to it.

Chupacabras · 5th May 2007, 03:06 PM

Probably talking about japanese magicians complaining of a TV show giving away their secrets and the magicians suing. Now, where did I just read that?

ETA: I saw a full series on TV (translated to Spanish) that showed a lot, I mean a lot of tricks, some very elaborated. It was something like "the masked magician". My first impression was of astonishment that they ran the show, because I felt someone would complain. That was a couple of years ago and I have heard nothing about this particular show. Heck.

ChristineR · 5th May 2007, 03:20 PM

Fox TV had a series of five shows called "Breaking the Magicians' Code: Magic's Biggest Secrets Finally Revealed" that starred someone they referred to as "The Masked Magician." I guess they actually had two Masked Magicians in all. Could it be the same show?

There was a very large stink about it.

tkingdoll · 5th May 2007, 03:22 PM

Originally Posted by ChristineR

You aren't trying to come up with an excuse to report the Wiseman video are you?

Use your discretion. If there's a gray area, then the mods will quash the link and give you a warning. If there's a really gray area, ask about it.

The Wiseman video is not in a gray area. Just in case you are referring to it.

Nah, it can't be that, for two simple reasons. 1) magicians are allowed to reveal their own methods, and 2) as the 'method' for swapping the deck is done in full view of the audience, there's actually no method to reveal. If you were going to perform a deck swap, you wouldn't do it out in the open like that. It's not actually a magic trick, it's just someone pretending to do a magic trick but in plain sight of the audience. I doubt Tai thinks that the Wiseman video is 'method revealing', it's a Psychology experiment. There's no magic in it at all.

T'ai Chi · 5th May 2007, 04:45 PM

Weird, some people can't let the Wiseman video go.

No, this is an 'in general' question. I was specifcally thinking about some real stinker 'tricks' that Criss Angel has done that have 'revealed!' videos on the internet.

T'ai Chi · 5th May 2007, 04:46 PM

Originally Posted by wahrheit

What does revealing a magic trick have to do with skepticism?

Gee I dunno, Randi seems to think there is some connection.

thaiboxerken · 5th May 2007, 04:49 PM

In the forum index, under Conjurer's Corner it says "For a discussion of magic and magicians, NOT TO INCLUDE THE DISCLOSING OF SECRETS"

Does that clarify it for you, Whodini?

wahrheit · 5th May 2007, 04:56 PM

Originally Posted by T'ai Chi

Gee I dunno, Randi seems to think there is some connection.

I was quoting you in my previous post, not James Randi.

It was not about what you think that other people think, it was about your assertion.

Jeff Wagg · 8th May 2007, 06:17 AM

The official word..

You may not reveal tricks here. Also, you may not embed video or images that reveal tricks. However, you can post links to revealed tricks.

The latter is simply a matter of practicality. We do strongly discourage revealing tricks, though at times there is a reason for it. Specifically we do NOT want this type of exchange:

"Hey, I saw The Great Gonzo saw a lady in half! How did he do that?"

"Oh, you get a special box that's filled with blood and a woman who can bend a whole lot to get out of the way of the saw.."

Something like this would be OK:

"Sylvia Browne knew her daughters name!! How could she know that?"

"She didn't know it. She used cold reading to get that information out of the Mom."

There is a clear difference between the two. There is a link between skepticism and conjuring, but as conjuring is a "secret" art, and one that many people depend on for their livelihood, this board shall not serve as a clearing house for how tricks are done.

T'ai Chi · 8th May 2007, 03:30 PM

Don't many people depend on cold reading for their livelihood? hehe, we better not reveal how that is done.

Thank ya

Mercutio · 8th May 2007, 03:47 PM

I did see your smiley, but for others reading... of course, Wagg's example did not tell how cold reading is done. If someone asks, we could (for example) direct them to Ian Rowland's excellent book on the subject. You are quite right, a good many people depend on cold reading for [at least part of] their livelihood. Some honestly, others dishonestly. Anyone with sufficient interest to buy Rowland's book will be helping someone who uses it honestly to earn his livelihood.

Thanks for this thread, TC--I must admit, I have been curious about the Japanese lawsuit, and had wondered whether the videos in that case would be fair game to link to here (if they exist).

thaiboxerken · 8th May 2007, 04:25 PM

Originally Posted by T'ai Chi

Don't many people depend on cold reading for their livelihood?

Some depend on cold-reading techniques to make an honest living, like mentalist/magicians who don't claim to have superpowers. Others depend on cold-reading techniques to make a dishonest living, like Sylvia Browne and anyone else who makes money playing psychic or medium.

5th May 2007, 01:15 PM	#1
T'ai Chi Penultimate Amazing Join Date: May 2003 Posts: 11,233	magic tricks revealed If we post a revealing of a magic trick here, or on this board, that is skeptically taboo. But how about posting links to videos of the tricks being revealed?
	__________________ http://www.statisticool.com

5th May 2007, 02:00 PM	#2
DJM Muse Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 783	And why would you want to do that?
DJM Muse Join Date: Nov 2006 Posts: 783

5th May 2007, 02:07 PM	#3
wahrheit Pac-Man Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 5,589	Originally Posted by T'ai Chi If we post a revealing of a magic trick here, or on this board, that is skeptically taboo. What does revealing a magic trick have to do with skepticism?
wahrheit Pac-Man Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 5,589	__________________ For a moment, nothing happened. Then, after a second or so, nothing continued to happen. D. Adams -- THHGTTG You're a sick man. The Atheist

5th May 2007, 02:08 PM	#4
ChristineR Illuminator Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 3,071	You aren't trying to come up with an excuse to report the Wiseman video are you? Use your discretion. If there's a gray area, then the mods will quash the link and give you a warning. If there's a really gray area, ask about it. The Wiseman video is not in a gray area. Just in case you are referring to it.
ChristineR Illuminator Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 3,071	__________________ Avatar (c) Neopets.com

5th May 2007, 03:06 PM	#5
Chupacabras Illuminator Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Guaymas Posts: 3,045	Probably talking about japanese magicians complaining of a TV show giving away their secrets and the magicians suing. Now, where did I just read that? ETA: I saw a full series on TV (translated to Spanish) that showed a lot, I mean a lot of tricks, some very elaborated. It was something like "the masked magician". My first impression was of astonishment that they ran the show, because I felt someone would complain. That was a couple of years ago and I have heard nothing about this particular show. Heck.
	__________________ Oh Maggie, I wish I'd never seen your face. Last edited by Chupacabras; 5th May 2007 at 03:08 PM.

5th May 2007, 03:20 PM	#6
ChristineR Illuminator Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 3,071	Fox TV had a series of five shows called "Breaking the Magicians' Code: Magic's Biggest Secrets Finally Revealed" that starred someone they referred to as "The Masked Magician." I guess they actually had two Masked Magicians in all. Could it be the same show? There was a very large stink about it.
ChristineR Illuminator Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 3,071	__________________ Avatar (c) Neopets.com

5th May 2007, 03:22 PM	#7
tkingdoll AKA TEEK Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: Up Myself Posts: 12,468	Originally Posted by ChristineR You aren't trying to come up with an excuse to report the Wiseman video are you? Use your discretion. If there's a gray area, then the mods will quash the link and give you a warning. If there's a really gray area, ask about it. The Wiseman video is not in a gray area. Just in case you are referring to it. Nah, it can't be that, for two simple reasons. 1) magicians are allowed to reveal their own methods, and 2) as the 'method' for swapping the deck is done in full view of the audience, there's actually no method to reveal. If you were going to perform a deck swap, you wouldn't do it out in the open like that. It's not actually a magic trick, it's just someone pretending to do a magic trick but in plain sight of the audience. I doubt Tai thinks that the Wiseman video is 'method revealing', it's a Psychology experiment. There's no magic in it at all.
	__________________ www.stormmovie.net Official website of Tim Minchin's Storm Movie

5th May 2007, 04:45 PM	#8
T'ai Chi Penultimate Amazing Join Date: May 2003 Posts: 11,233	Weird, some people can't let the Wiseman video go. No, this is an 'in general' question. I was specifcally thinking about some real stinker 'tricks' that Criss Angel has done that have 'revealed!' videos on the internet.
	__________________ http://www.statisticool.com

5th May 2007, 04:46 PM	#9
T'ai Chi Penultimate Amazing Join Date: May 2003 Posts: 11,233	Originally Posted by wahrheit What does revealing a magic trick have to do with skepticism? Gee I dunno, Randi seems to think there is some connection.
	__________________ http://www.statisticool.com

5th May 2007, 04:49 PM	#10
thaiboxerken Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Portland, Oregon Posts: 13,315	In the forum index, under Conjurer's Corner it says "For a discussion of magic and magicians, NOT TO INCLUDE THE DISCLOSING OF SECRETS" Does that clarify it for you, Whodini?
	__________________ All national institutions of churches, whether Jewish, Christian or Turkish, appear to me no other than human inventions, set up to terrify and enslave mankind, and monopolize power & profit - Thomas Paine

5th May 2007, 04:56 PM	#11
wahrheit Pac-Man Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 5,589	Originally Posted by T'ai Chi Gee I dunno, Randi seems to think there is some connection. I was quoting you in my previous post, not James Randi. It was not about what you think that other people think, it was about your assertion.
wahrheit Pac-Man Join Date: Mar 2005 Posts: 5,589	__________________ For a moment, nothing happened. Then, after a second or so, nothing continued to happen. D. Adams -- THHGTTG You're a sick man. The Atheist

8th May 2007, 06:17 AM	#12
Jeff Wagg Communication and Outreach Manager JREF Staff Join Date: Sep 2003 Location: Vermont Posts: 2,753	The official word.. You may not reveal tricks here. Also, you may not embed video or images that reveal tricks. However, you can post links to revealed tricks. The latter is simply a matter of practicality. We do strongly discourage revealing tricks, though at times there is a reason for it. Specifically we do NOT want this type of exchange: "Hey, I saw The Great Gonzo saw a lady in half! How did he do that?" "Oh, you get a special box that's filled with blood and a woman who can bend a whole lot to get out of the way of the saw.." Something like this would be OK: "Sylvia Browne knew her daughters name!! How could she know that?" "She didn't know it. She used cold reading to get that information out of the Mom." There is a clear difference between the two. There is a link between skepticism and conjuring, but as conjuring is a "secret" art, and one that many people depend on for their livelihood, this board shall not serve as a clearing house for how tricks are done.

8th May 2007, 03:30 PM	#13
T'ai Chi Penultimate Amazing Join Date: May 2003 Posts: 11,233	Don't many people depend on cold reading for their livelihood? hehe, we better not reveal how that is done. Thank ya
	__________________ http://www.statisticool.com

8th May 2007, 03:47 PM	#14
Mercutio Shakespeare's Sock Puppet Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Live Free Or Die Posts: 16,329	I did see your smiley, but for others reading... of course, Wagg's example did not tell how cold reading is done. If someone asks, we could (for example) direct them to Ian Rowland's excellent book on the subject. You are quite right, a good many people depend on cold reading for [at least part of] their livelihood. Some honestly, others dishonestly. Anyone with sufficient interest to buy Rowland's book will be helping someone who uses it honestly to earn his livelihood. Thanks for this thread, TC--I must admit, I have been curious about the Japanese lawsuit, and had wondered whether the videos in that case would be fair game to link to here (if they exist).
	__________________ "But to see her was to love her Love but her, and love forever."

8th May 2007, 04:25 PM	#15
thaiboxerken Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Portland, Oregon Posts: 13,315	Originally Posted by T'ai Chi Don't many people depend on cold reading for their livelihood? Some depend on cold-reading techniques to make an honest living, like mentalist/magicians who don't claim to have superpowers. Others depend on cold-reading techniques to make a dishonest living, like Sylvia Browne and anyone else who makes money playing psychic or medium.
	__________________ All national institutions of churches, whether Jewish, Christian or Turkish, appear to me no other than human inventions, set up to terrify and enslave mankind, and monopolize power & profit - Thomas Paine