Mineta testimony

Non Believer · 19th June 2007, 08:44 AM

I assume I don't have to explain the testimony to you. I am curious is he lying, or is one of Cheney's several stories in error. Do you agree it didn't belong in the 9-11 commision final report. I mean in the name of consistency it certainly didn't belong in the commision report since nothing else that did'nt fit the official explanation did not make it either

T.A.M. · 19th June 2007, 08:46 AM

What do you think about his testomony?

TAM

Dave Rogers · 19th June 2007, 08:47 AM

Before we answer, could you give us a list of the parts of Mineta's testimony you want us to ignore?

Dave

lapman · 19th June 2007, 08:48 AM

Originally Posted by Non Believer

I assume I don't have to explain the testimony to you. I am curious is he lying, or is one of Cheney's several stories in error. Do you agree it didn't belong in the 9-11 commision final report. I mean in the name of consistency it certainly didn't belong in the commision report since nothing else that did'nt fit the official explanation did not make it either

I do question Mineta's time line. He claims that at 9:20AM, Bush was already in Air Force One heading to Louisiana. However, Bush didn't leave until 9:55. Could Mineta be off by an hour?

Non Believer · 19th June 2007, 08:56 AM

You know the part where he is in the bunker with Shooter at 9.25 and a kid is coming in with reports that the plane is 50 miles out, 40 miles out, etc, and asks your hero do the orders still stand.

gumboot · 19th June 2007, 08:58 AM

The only thing that can be said with any certainty about Norman Mineta's testimony is that his times are wrong, and the flight in question isn't AA77.

-Gumboot

Non Believer · 19th June 2007, 09:03 AM

That's profound Gumshoe

T.A.M. · 19th June 2007, 09:07 AM

name calling will only get you suspended from this forum, and you wouldnt want that now would you?

TAM

Non Believer · 19th June 2007, 09:10 AM

I am sorry, I didn't know gumshoe is considered profane

lapman · 19th June 2007, 09:13 AM

Originally Posted by gumboot

The only thing that can be said with any certainty about Norman Mineta's testimony is that his times are wrong, and the flight in question isn't AA77.

-Gumboot

Most likely it was Flight 93.

Quote:

(Between 10:10-10:15 a.m.): Cheney, Told That Flight 93 Is Still Heading to Washington, Orders It Shot Down The Secret Service, viewing projected path information about Flight 93, rather than actual radar returns, does not realize that Flight 93 has already crashed. Based on this erroneous information, a military aide tells Vice President Cheney and others in the White House bunker that the plane is 80 miles away from Washington. Cheney is asked for authority to engage the plane, and he quickly provides authorization. The aide returns a few minutes later and says the plane is 60 miles out. Cheney again gives authorization to engage.

So, non believer, how do you account for the Mineta's time line discrepancy?

Mashuna · 19th June 2007, 09:16 AM

Originally Posted by Non Believer

nothing else that did'nt fit the official explanation did not make it either

You are hereby awarded the coveted Triple Negative award.

Congratulations, and use your powers wisely.

Note, in the event of no triple negatives being awarded, the prize will go to the best double negative that also begins with the word 'nothing'.

DavidJames · 19th June 2007, 09:16 AM

Originally Posted by Non Believer

I assume I don't have to explain the testimony to you. I am curious is he lying, or is one of Cheney's several stories in error. Do you agree it didn't belong in the 9-11 commision final report. I mean in the name of consistency it certainly didn't belong in the commision report since nothing else that did'nt fit the official explanation did not make it either

Originally Posted by Non Believer

Jocce I am not going to answer the same question 20 times

but you expect others to answer your's

Serious questions.
Do you care about the truth?
If so, why do you get all of your information from CT sites?
Why haven't you spent time researching non CT sites?
Why haven't you searched this site for answers to your questions?

T.A.M. · 19th June 2007, 09:16 AM

Originally Posted by Non Believer

I am sorry, I didn't know gumshoe is considered profane

where did I say you were profane?

TAM

rwguinn · 19th June 2007, 09:18 AM

Originally Posted by Non Believer

I assume I don't have to explain the testimony to you. I am curious is he lying, or is one of Cheney's several stories in error. Do you agree it didn't belong in the 9-11 commision final report. I mean in the name of consistency it certainly didn't belong in the commision report since nothing else that did'nt fit the official explanation did not make it either

False dichotomy.
There is also the potential (and likelihood) that Mr. Mineta was simply mistaken about his time call-outs. You've never made a mistake about the time, never been late (or early) to an appointment?

Dave Rogers · 19th June 2007, 09:19 AM

Originally Posted by Non Believer

You know the part where he is in the bunker with Shooter at 9.25 and a kid is coming in with reports that the plane is 50 miles out, 40 miles out, etc, and asks your hero do the orders still stand.

Sorry, was that the bit you did want us to ignore, or the bit you didn't want us to ignore?

Dave

bje · 19th June 2007, 09:20 AM

Originally Posted by Non Believer

You know the part where he is in the bunker with Shooter at 9.25 and a kid is coming in with reports that the plane is 50 miles out, 40 miles out, etc, and asks your hero do the orders still stand.

NB, how does "the plane is 50 miles out, 40 miles out, etc," square with your belief that the flights were not tracked because the transponders were off?

gumboot · 19th June 2007, 09:28 AM

Originally Posted by Non Believer

That's profound Gumshoe

It's Gumboot. I take it reading is also something you're not especially gifted in?

-Gumboot

Metullus · 19th June 2007, 09:29 AM

Originally Posted by Non Believer

I assume I don't have to explain the testimony to you. I am curious is he lying, or is one of Cheney's several stories in error. Do you agree it didn't belong in the 9-11 commision final report. I mean in the name of consistency it certainly didn't belong in the commision report since nothing else that did'nt fit the official explanation did not make it either

Or, gee whiz, maybe Mineta is, well, merely mistaken in his time line? Discussed in detail here, and here and Ed only knows how many other times.

Undesired Walrus · 19th June 2007, 09:57 AM

Originally Posted by Non Believer

I assume I don't have to explain the testimony to you. I am curious is he lying, or is one of Cheney's several stories in error. Do you agree it didn't belong in the 9-11 commision final report. I mean in the name of consistency it certainly didn't belong in the commision report since nothing else that did'nt fit the official explanation did not make it either

Let me ask you a question. Is that ok. Why do you not use question marks. It is really annoying and asinine isn't it. Look, it's getting even more annoying isn't it. Why do you keep doing it. I sound like a headcase dont I. Will you use question marks in future.

Non Believer · 19th June 2007, 10:05 AM

Hey, undesired/walrus9 if por 'puncuation-bothers-yop. I'll make more just for you

Non Believer · 19th June 2007, 10:08 AM

Metullus -It is so simple anybody, or anything that doesn't follow your story is simply mistaken. At least Mineta did not contradict himself as Cheney did, Also his timeline is supported by Clarke's testimony as well.

Arkan_Wolfshade · 19th June 2007, 10:11 AM

Originally Posted by Non Believer

Metullus -It is so simple anybody, or anything that doesn't follow your story is simply mistaken. At least Mineta did not contradict himself as Cheney did, Also his timeline is supported by Clarke's testimony as well.

Please provide a specific example of VP Cheney contradicting himself.

Please provide a specific example of Clarke's testimony corroborating Mineta's testimony.

CurtC · 19th June 2007, 10:12 AM

Originally Posted by Non Believer

Hey, undesired/walrus9 if por 'puncuation-bothers-yop. I'll make more just for you

Well, it makes your posts harder to read. It sends a message that you don't care enough about your own writing to clean it up, so why should anyone else bother reading it?

stateofgrace · 19th June 2007, 10:17 AM

Originally Posted by Non Believer

Metullus -It is so simple anybody, or anything that doesn't follow your story is simply mistaken. At least Mineta did not contradict himself as Cheney did, Also his timeline is supported by Clarke's testimony as well.

NB what were you doing 3 months ago at six o’clock on the 21st March? Can you tell me exactly what you did between six and seven o clock in the evening?

If there was a cover up do you not think that all those involved in it would make sure they got their stories exactly right and their times exactly perfect, espically when they presented their testimony? Or is it all possible that the reason they don't quite agree with each other is because they have told their story as best they could remember without consulting with each other?

Is it vaguely possible that unlike yourself who can recount every second of every day, that people simply make mistakes when asked to recall exactly what they were doing and when,on probably the most confusing day of their lifes?

Redtail · 19th June 2007, 10:32 AM

When did Cheney contradict himself?

ETA: Serious question BTW, I haven't seen where he has. (At least not about his actions 9/11)

gumboot · 19th June 2007, 10:33 AM

Originally Posted by Arkan_Wolfshade

Please provide a specific example of VP Cheney contradicting himself.

Please provide a specific example of Clarke's testimony corroborating Mineta's testimony.

Clarke's another person on 9/11 who has a really terrible timeline of events. He claims to have been talking to Richard Meyers on a video conference when Meyers was at Capitol Hill meeting with Senators.

-Gumboot

Metullus · 19th June 2007, 10:37 AM

Originally Posted by Non Believer

Metullus -It is so simple anybody, or anything that doesn't follow your story is simply mistaken. At least Mineta did not contradict himself as Cheney did, Also his timeline is supported by Clarke's testimony as well.

My story? What, pray tell, is "my story"? I have no story - I just follow the evidence. And you have provided none.

Why don't you read this thread wherein this has all been discussed ad nauseum. Then we can talk about whether or not Mineta's testimony was consistent with known facts.

Triterope · 19th June 2007, 10:43 AM

Originally Posted by Mashuna

You are hereby awarded the coveted Triple Negative award.

Congratulations, and use your powers wisely.

Don't you mean, "don't not use your powers unwisely"?

rwguinn · 19th June 2007, 11:13 AM

Originally Posted by stateofgrace

NB what were you doing 3 months ago at six o’clock on the 21st March? Can you tell me exactly what you did between six and seven o clock in the evening?

Insufficient. We need a minut3e-by-minute breakdown of all events occurring during that time period. Any uncertainty means he is lying.

Originally Posted by stateofgrace

If there was a cover up do you not think that all those involved in it would make sure they got their stories exactly right and their times exactly perfect, espically when they presented their testimony? Or is it all possible that the reason they don't quite agree with each other is because they have told their story as best they could remember without consulting with each other?

Is it vaguely possible that unlike yourself who can recount every second of every day, that people simply make mistakes when asked to recall exactly what they were doing and when,on probably the most confusing day of their lifes?

Non Believer · 20th June 2007, 06:51 AM

Yes, Cheney has said to the press on at least two occasions that he he got the bunker shortly before a plane hit the pentagon. Rice also stated that she was told to go to the bunker by Secret Service shortly after the second plane hit the towers, and that Cheney was already there. Mineta and Clarke stories match that they met at Clarke's video conference at around 9.15, and that Mineta went to the bunker after that.

As for the idea it was 93, you can't be serious.

CurtC · 20th June 2007, 08:04 AM

Originally Posted by Non Believer

Yes, Cheney has said to the press on at least two occasions that he he got the bunker shortly before a plane hit the pentagon.

I'm not saying Cheney is always right, but I don't believe you either. Can you provide cites of him saying this?

The reason I ask is that you've been giving malcolm kirkman a race to see who can be wrong the most. Since he's now on vacation, you might just catch up.

Non Believer · 20th June 2007, 08:45 AM

Cheney's statements were made on meet the press, Sept 16 2001, and then on CNN ayear later. Thats nice you think I am wrong, how about proving something?

twinstead · 20th June 2007, 09:02 AM

Originally Posted by Non Believer

Cheney's statements were made on meet the press, Sept 16 2001, and then on CNN ayear later. Thats nice you think I am wrong, how about proving something?

that's nice. I happen to think Cheney's a moron.

Anyhoo, perhaps you could read the threads on this forum considering Mineta's testimony. That subject was done to death, and it may prevent you from being one in a huge line of so-called truth seekers coming on the board with his latest smoking gun without realizing that not only have many folks here studied his testimony extensively, but have talked about it a lot on this very forum.

Otherwise our exasperation at yet ANOTHER person who hasn't done his homework and arrogantly implies we're all mindless drones who only believe what the government tells us will be interpreted as impoliteness.

Non Believer · 20th June 2007, 09:06 AM

Well if you say previous threads have taken care of this, you must be able to summarize it. So far your evidence is Mineta must be wrong. Very convincing

Non Believer · 20th June 2007, 12:12 PM

I got to say after watching the response from you guys on this, I have to say this is one of 9-11 truths strongest issues. Lets face it you hav had NOTHING, Either Norman Mineta is an absolute liar, or this account is correct. You have made no rationale to suggest how he could have been slightly confused. Not to mention the statements that contradict Cheney's supposed arrival at the bunker. As to somebody's comment that how could they be tracking the plane if they had lost it on primary radr, I never said I believe the official story. I simply try to show how it does not make sense

Pardalis · 20th June 2007, 12:30 PM

Originally Posted by Non Believer

Either Norman Mineta is an absolute liar, or this account is correct.

False dilemma fallacy.

Beat you to it Arkan.

Non Believer · 20th June 2007, 12:57 PM

No I gave you a third option. That he could be slightly mistaken, and offered you all a chance to give an explanation of how that work. None of you did. So quit taking s--- out of context, so you can play your little false fallacy games. To claim a false dichotomy, you need another option that makes sense. Please present one

Pardalis · 20th June 2007, 01:03 PM

Originally Posted by Non Believer

Please present one

Read the links that have been provided for you. This has already been discussed to exhaustion.

Arkan_Wolfshade · 20th June 2007, 01:04 PM

Originally Posted by Non Believer

No I gave you a third option. That he could be slightly mistaken, and offered you all a chance to give an explanation of how that work.

Bollocks. You explicitly stated, " Either Norman Mineta is an absolute liar, or this account is correct"

Originally Posted by Non Believer

None of you did. So quit taking s--- out of context, so you can play your little false fallacy games. To claim a false dichotomy, you need another option that makes sense. Please present one

Why, if his account is incorrect, must he be lying? That is to say, why can his account not be wrong through human error?

CurtC · 20th June 2007, 01:10 PM

Originally Posted by Pardalis

False dilemma fallacy.

Beat you to it Arkan.

When I read NB's post, I quickly scanned to the bottom of the page to see if Arkan had posted yet. I thought yea, he hadn't, so I'd get to point out the particular logical fallacy involved. But it was not to be.

By the way, I think the forum mods should change Arkan's forum title from "Philosopher" to "Fallacy Police."

19th June 2007, 08:44 AM	#1
Non Believer Critical Thinker Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 257	Mineta testimony I assume I don't have to explain the testimony to you. I am curious is he lying, or is one of Cheney's several stories in error. Do you agree it didn't belong in the 9-11 commision final report. I mean in the name of consistency it certainly didn't belong in the commision report since nothing else that did'nt fit the official explanation did not make it either

19th June 2007, 08:47 AM	#3
Dave Rogers Bandaged ice that stampedes inexpensively through a scribbled morning waving necessary ankles Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: In a world lit only by fire. Posts: 17,894	Before we answer, could you give us a list of the parts of Mineta's testimony you want us to ignore? Dave
	__________________ "We will punish the murderer together. Our punishment will be more generosity, more tolerance and more democracy." - Fabian Stang, Mayor of Oslo SSKCAS, covert member

19th June 2007, 08:48 AM	#4
lapman Graduate Poster Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 1,715	Originally Posted by Non Believer I assume I don't have to explain the testimony to you. I am curious is he lying, or is one of Cheney's several stories in error. Do you agree it didn't belong in the 9-11 commision final report. I mean in the name of consistency it certainly didn't belong in the commision report since nothing else that did'nt fit the official explanation did not make it either I do question Mineta's time line. He claims that at 9:20AM, Bush was already in Air Force One heading to Louisiana. However, Bush didn't leave until 9:55. Could Mineta be off by an hour?
lapman Graduate Poster Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 1,715

19th June 2007, 08:58 AM	#6
gumboot lorcutus.tolere Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: New Zealand Posts: 23,103	The only thing that can be said with any certainty about Norman Mineta's testimony is that his times are wrong, and the flight in question isn't AA77. -Gumboot
	__________________ O xein', angellein Lakedaimoniois hoti têde keimetha tois keinon rhémasi peithomenoi. A fan of fantasy? Check out Project Dreamforge.

19th June 2007, 09:13 AM	#10
lapman Graduate Poster Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 1,715	Originally Posted by gumboot The only thing that can be said with any certainty about Norman Mineta's testimony is that his times are wrong, and the flight in question isn't AA77. -Gumboot Most likely it was Flight 93. Quote: (Between 10:10-10:15 a.m.): Cheney, Told That Flight 93 Is Still Heading to Washington, Orders It Shot Down The Secret Service, viewing projected path information about Flight 93, rather than actual radar returns, does not realize that Flight 93 has already crashed. Based on this erroneous information, a military aide tells Vice President Cheney and others in the White House bunker that the plane is 80 miles away from Washington. Cheney is asked for authority to engage the plane, and he quickly provides authorization. The aide returns a few minutes later and says the plane is 60 miles out. Cheney again gives authorization to engage. So, non believer, how do you account for the Mineta's time line discrepancy?
lapman Graduate Poster Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 1,715

19th June 2007, 08:46 AM	#2
T.A.M. Keeper of the Kool-Vax Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: The Far East...of Canada Posts: 20,816	What do you think about his testomony? TAM

19th June 2007, 08:56 AM	#5
Non Believer Critical Thinker Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 257	You know the part where he is in the bunker with Shooter at 9.25 and a kid is coming in with reports that the plane is 50 miles out, 40 miles out, etc, and asks your hero do the orders still stand.

19th June 2007, 09:03 AM	#7
Non Believer Critical Thinker Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 257	That's profound Gumshoe

19th June 2007, 09:07 AM	#8
T.A.M. Keeper of the Kool-Vax Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: The Far East...of Canada Posts: 20,816	name calling will only get you suspended from this forum, and you wouldnt want that now would you? TAM

19th June 2007, 09:10 AM	#9
Non Believer Critical Thinker Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 257	I am sorry, I didn't know gumshoe is considered profane

19th June 2007, 09:16 AM	#11
Mashuna Ovis ex Machina Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Welsh Wales Posts: 6,578	Originally Posted by Non Believer nothing else that did'nt fit the official explanation did not make it either You are hereby awarded the coveted Triple Negative award. Congratulations, and use your powers wisely. Note, in the event of no triple negatives being awarded, the prize will go to the best double negative that also begins with the word 'nothing'.

19th June 2007, 09:16 AM	#12
DavidJames Philosopher Join Date: Sep 2001 Location: Front Range, CO Posts: 7,083	Originally Posted by Non Believer I assume I don't have to explain the testimony to you. I am curious is he lying, or is one of Cheney's several stories in error. Do you agree it didn't belong in the 9-11 commision final report. I mean in the name of consistency it certainly didn't belong in the commision report since nothing else that did'nt fit the official explanation did not make it either Originally Posted by Non Believer Jocce I am not going to answer the same question 20 times but you expect others to answer your's Serious questions. Do you care about the truth? If so, why do you get all of your information from CT sites? Why haven't you spent time researching non CT sites? Why haven't you searched this site for answers to your questions?
	__________________ I will no longer respond to those who choose to have tools of murder as their avatars. Everyone is a skeptic except, of course, for the stuff that they believe Beaver Hateman: Is your argument that human life loses value proportionate to the number of humans available? Malcolm Kirkpatrick: That's part of the argument. Value is determined by supply and demand.

19th June 2007, 09:18 AM	#14
rwguinn Philosopher Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: 16 miles from 7 lakes Posts: 8,416	Originally Posted by Non Believer I assume I don't have to explain the testimony to you. I am curious is he lying, or is one of Cheney's several stories in error. Do you agree it didn't belong in the 9-11 commision final report. I mean in the name of consistency it certainly didn't belong in the commision report since nothing else that did'nt fit the official explanation did not make it either False dichotomy. There is also the potential (and likelihood) that Mr. Mineta was simply mistaken about his time call-outs. You've never made a mistake about the time, never been late (or early) to an appointment?
	__________________ "Political correctness is a doctrine,...,which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end." "I pointed out that his argument was wrong in every particular, but he rightfully took me to task for attacking only the weak points." Myriad http://forums.randi.org/showthread.php?postid=6853275#post6853275

19th June 2007, 09:19 AM	#15
Dave Rogers Bandaged ice that stampedes inexpensively through a scribbled morning waving necessary ankles Join Date: Jan 2007 Location: In a world lit only by fire. Posts: 17,894	Originally Posted by Non Believer You know the part where he is in the bunker with Shooter at 9.25 and a kid is coming in with reports that the plane is 50 miles out, 40 miles out, etc, and asks your hero do the orders still stand. Sorry, was that the bit you did want us to ignore, or the bit you didn't want us to ignore? Dave
	__________________ "We will punish the murderer together. Our punishment will be more generosity, more tolerance and more democracy." - Fabian Stang, Mayor of Oslo SSKCAS, covert member

19th June 2007, 09:20 AM	#16
bje Graduate Poster Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: On Solid Ground Posts: 1,280	Originally Posted by Non Believer You know the part where he is in the bunker with Shooter at 9.25 and a kid is coming in with reports that the plane is 50 miles out, 40 miles out, etc, and asks your hero do the orders still stand. NB, how does "the plane is 50 miles out, 40 miles out, etc," square with your belief that the flights were not tracked because the transponders were off?
	__________________ - There is only one way to be right, but an infinite number of ways to be wrong.

19th June 2007, 09:28 AM	#17
gumboot lorcutus.tolere Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: New Zealand Posts: 23,103	Originally Posted by Non Believer That's profound Gumshoe It's Gumboot. I take it reading is also something you're not especially gifted in? -Gumboot
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19th June 2007, 09:29 AM	#18
Metullus Forum ¾-Wit Pro Tem Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Waldo's Pond Posts: 3,959	Originally Posted by Non Believer I assume I don't have to explain the testimony to you. I am curious is he lying, or is one of Cheney's several stories in error. Do you agree it didn't belong in the 9-11 commision final report. I mean in the name of consistency it certainly didn't belong in the commision report since nothing else that did'nt fit the official explanation did not make it either Or, gee whiz, maybe Mineta is, well, merely mistaken in his time line? Discussed in detail here, and here and Ed only knows how many other times.
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19th June 2007, 09:57 AM	#19
Undesired Walrus Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: London Posts: 10,882	Originally Posted by Non Believer I assume I don't have to explain the testimony to you. I am curious is he lying, or is one of Cheney's several stories in error. Do you agree it didn't belong in the 9-11 commision final report. I mean in the name of consistency it certainly didn't belong in the commision report since nothing else that did'nt fit the official explanation did not make it either Let me ask you a question. Is that ok. Why do you not use question marks. It is really annoying and asinine isn't it. Look, it's getting even more annoying isn't it. Why do you keep doing it. I sound like a headcase dont I. Will you use question marks in future.

19th June 2007, 10:05 AM	#20
Non Believer Critical Thinker Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 257	Hey, undesired/walrus9 if por 'puncuation-bothers-yop. I'll make more just for you

19th June 2007, 10:08 AM	#21
Non Believer Critical Thinker Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 257	Metullus -It is so simple anybody, or anything that doesn't follow your story is simply mistaken. At least Mineta did not contradict himself as Cheney did, Also his timeline is supported by Clarke's testimony as well.

19th June 2007, 10:11 AM	#22
Arkan_Wolfshade Philosopher Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Making Mytheon come to life Posts: 7,158	Originally Posted by Non Believer Metullus -It is so simple anybody, or anything that doesn't follow your story is simply mistaken. At least Mineta did not contradict himself as Cheney did, Also his timeline is supported by Clarke's testimony as well. Please provide a specific example of VP Cheney contradicting himself. Please provide a specific example of Clarke's testimony corroborating Mineta's testimony.
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19th June 2007, 10:12 AM	#23
CurtC Illuminator Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Dallas, TX Posts: 4,758	Originally Posted by Non Believer Hey, undesired/walrus9 if por 'puncuation-bothers-yop. I'll make more just for you Well, it makes your posts harder to read. It sends a message that you don't care enough about your own writing to clean it up, so why should anyone else bother reading it?
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19th June 2007, 10:17 AM	#24
stateofgrace Guest Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: Scotland Posts: 3,847	Originally Posted by Non Believer Metullus -It is so simple anybody, or anything that doesn't follow your story is simply mistaken. At least Mineta did not contradict himself as Cheney did, Also his timeline is supported by Clarke's testimony as well. NB what were you doing 3 months ago at six o’clock on the 21st March? Can you tell me exactly what you did between six and seven o clock in the evening? If there was a cover up do you not think that all those involved in it would make sure they got their stories exactly right and their times exactly perfect, espically when they presented their testimony? Or is it all possible that the reason they don't quite agree with each other is because they have told their story as best they could remember without consulting with each other? Is it vaguely possible that unlike yourself who can recount every second of every day, that people simply make mistakes when asked to recall exactly what they were doing and when,on probably the most confusing day of their lifes?
	Last edited by stateofgrace; 19th June 2007 at 10:23 AM. Reason: typo

19th June 2007, 10:32 AM	#25
Redtail Philosopher Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 9,303	When did Cheney contradict himself? ETA: Serious question BTW, I haven't seen where he has. (At least not about his actions 9/11)
Redtail Philosopher Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 9,303	__________________ AVENGERS!!!.. Turn off the dark! Last edited by Redtail; 19th June 2007 at 10:41 AM.

19th June 2007, 10:33 AM	#26
gumboot lorcutus.tolere Join Date: Jun 2006 Location: New Zealand Posts: 23,103	Originally Posted by Arkan_Wolfshade Please provide a specific example of VP Cheney contradicting himself. Please provide a specific example of Clarke's testimony corroborating Mineta's testimony. Clarke's another person on 9/11 who has a really terrible timeline of events. He claims to have been talking to Richard Meyers on a video conference when Meyers was at Capitol Hill meeting with Senators. -Gumboot
	__________________ O xein', angellein Lakedaimoniois hoti têde keimetha tois keinon rhémasi peithomenoi. A fan of fantasy? Check out Project Dreamforge.

19th June 2007, 10:37 AM	#27
Metullus Forum ¾-Wit Pro Tem Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Waldo's Pond Posts: 3,959	Originally Posted by Non Believer Metullus -It is so simple anybody, or anything that doesn't follow your story is simply mistaken. At least Mineta did not contradict himself as Cheney did, Also his timeline is supported by Clarke's testimony as well. My story? What, pray tell, is "my story"? I have no story - I just follow the evidence. And you have provided none. Why don't you read this thread wherein this has all been discussed ad nauseum. Then we can talk about whether or not Mineta's testimony was consistent with known facts.
	__________________ I have met Tim at TAM. He is of sufficient height to piss on your leg. - Doubt 10/7/2005 Aristotle taught that the brain exists merely to cool the blood and is not involved in the process of thinking. This is true only of certain persons. - Will Cuppy

19th June 2007, 10:43 AM	#28
Triterope Muse Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Walking the fine line between stupid and clever Posts: 915	Originally Posted by Mashuna You are hereby awarded the coveted Triple Negative award. Congratulations, and use your powers wisely. Don't you mean, "don't not use your powers unwisely"?

19th June 2007, 11:13 AM	#29
rwguinn Philosopher Join Date: Apr 2003 Location: 16 miles from 7 lakes Posts: 8,416	Originally Posted by stateofgrace NB what were you doing 3 months ago at six o’clock on the 21st March? Can you tell me exactly what you did between six and seven o clock in the evening? Insufficient. We need a minut3e-by-minute breakdown of all events occurring during that time period. Any uncertainty means he is lying. Originally Posted by stateofgrace If there was a cover up do you not think that all those involved in it would make sure they got their stories exactly right and their times exactly perfect, espically when they presented their testimony? Or is it all possible that the reason they don't quite agree with each other is because they have told their story as best they could remember without consulting with each other? Is it vaguely possible that unlike yourself who can recount every second of every day, that people simply make mistakes when asked to recall exactly what they were doing and when,on probably the most confusing day of their lifes?
	__________________ "Political correctness is a doctrine,...,which holds forth the proposition that it is entirely possible to pick up a turd by the clean end." "I pointed out that his argument was wrong in every particular, but he rightfully took me to task for attacking only the weak points." Myriad http://forums.randi.org/showthread.php?postid=6853275#post6853275

20th June 2007, 06:51 AM	#30
Non Believer Critical Thinker Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 257	Yes, Cheney has said to the press on at least two occasions that he he got the bunker shortly before a plane hit the pentagon. Rice also stated that she was told to go to the bunker by Secret Service shortly after the second plane hit the towers, and that Cheney was already there. Mineta and Clarke stories match that they met at Clarke's video conference at around 9.15, and that Mineta went to the bunker after that. As for the idea it was 93, you can't be serious.

20th June 2007, 08:04 AM	#31
CurtC Illuminator Join Date: Aug 2001 Location: Dallas, TX Posts: 4,758	Originally Posted by Non Believer Yes, Cheney has said to the press on at least two occasions that he he got the bunker shortly before a plane hit the pentagon. I'm not saying Cheney is always right, but I don't believe you either. Can you provide cites of him saying this? The reason I ask is that you've been giving malcolm kirkman a race to see who can be wrong the most. Since he's now on vacation, you might just catch up.
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20th June 2007, 08:45 AM	#32
Non Believer Critical Thinker Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 257	Cheney's statements were made on meet the press, Sept 16 2001, and then on CNN ayear later. Thats nice you think I am wrong, how about proving something?

20th June 2007, 09:02 AM	#33
twinstead Penultimate Amazing Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Big corner office in NWO Towers Posts: 11,572	Originally Posted by Non Believer Cheney's statements were made on meet the press, Sept 16 2001, and then on CNN ayear later. Thats nice you think I am wrong, how about proving something? that's nice. I happen to think Cheney's a moron. Anyhoo, perhaps you could read the threads on this forum considering Mineta's testimony. That subject was done to death, and it may prevent you from being one in a huge line of so-called truth seekers coming on the board with his latest smoking gun without realizing that not only have many folks here studied his testimony extensively, but have talked about it a lot on this very forum. Otherwise our exasperation at yet ANOTHER person who hasn't done his homework and arrogantly implies we're all mindless drones who only believe what the government tells us will be interpreted as impoliteness.

20th June 2007, 09:06 AM	#34
Non Believer Critical Thinker Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 257	Well if you say previous threads have taken care of this, you must be able to summarize it. So far your evidence is Mineta must be wrong. Very convincing

20th June 2007, 12:12 PM	#35
Non Believer Critical Thinker Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 257	I got to say after watching the response from you guys on this, I have to say this is one of 9-11 truths strongest issues. Lets face it you hav had NOTHING, Either Norman Mineta is an absolute liar, or this account is correct. You have made no rationale to suggest how he could have been slightly confused. Not to mention the statements that contradict Cheney's supposed arrival at the bunker. As to somebody's comment that how could they be tracking the plane if they had lost it on primary radr, I never said I believe the official story. I simply try to show how it does not make sense

20th June 2007, 12:30 PM	#36
Pardalis Banned Join Date: Mar 2006 Location: Montréal Posts: 25,831	Originally Posted by Non Believer Either Norman Mineta is an absolute liar, or this account is correct. False dilemma fallacy. Beat you to it Arkan.