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Old 8th October 2007, 09:40 PM   #1
pipelineaudio
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Can we have a top ten canards list?

because hucksters usually say the same thing when chickening out of the challenge could we have a list somewhere of what those normal responses are, so when someone starts backing up we already have answers for their bull?

for instance:

1. Randi doesnt have the million

2. JREF is a cult

3. The tests are rigged

4. Im not in it for the money

etc...and good answers to them
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Old 9th October 2007, 01:36 AM   #2
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A1. yes he does, you can ask for evidence, for which randi will provide you with a note from the bank with all the necessary information to validate that he has the account, it is his account, it has more than one million usd on it, and it is his to give away. if you dont' trust said evidence then not only don't you trust randi, you don't trust the bank, and by extension the entire american bank system, and the entire economic system of the US at large.

A2. no it isn't, many people who are a part of JREF disagree with some of what randi says, and some of his atitude(if you do yourself, do state what you disagree with, to make a point)

A3. The tests are created by claimant and randi together, so both parties will create the test, and agree it is a fair test before it starts. If the parties can't agree to a fair test, then no test will be performed.

A4. Wouldn't you spend 1 hour of your life to donate one million dollars to starving children? what kind of person are you?

Feel free to rephrase
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Old 9th October 2007, 01:39 AM   #3
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5. If it was real someone would have won it by now

A5, look at answer 1&3, and realize that if you pass the test, you can sue Randi for the million. And just passing the test alone is probably worth more than that million.

6. I'm a real scientist, i'm not doing this to win a Prize, that is childish and stupid.

A6. Like the NOBEL prize?
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Old 9th October 2007, 03:45 AM   #4
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Originally Posted by TobiasTheCommie View Post
6. I'm a real scientist, i'm not doing this to win a Prize, that is childish and stupid.

A6. Like the NOBEL prize?
I'm not sure this is a great answer. No-one does work to win a Nobel, it is an extra reward for work they would have done anyway. I would say something more like:

A6. Winning Randi's prize would bring fame and recognition to your work, as well as providing significant funding. If this isn't worth a few hours of your time, what is?
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Old 9th October 2007, 03:50 AM   #5
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7. I donīt have to prove anything to Randi or other skeptics, I know my powers are real.

A7/1: Since you make a living with________ (insert woo of your choice) anyway, wouldnīt it be cool to earn a million in a day compared to the couple of bucks you earn with it now? Wouldnīt winning the million be a perfect advertisement for your business?

A7/2: If you canīt make a living with your powers now, wouldnīt it be cool if you win the million and can quit your burger flipping job and tell your boss what you always wanted to tell him?

8. My powers donīt work in the presence of skeptics.

A8: If you are able to tell if skeptics are there as observers while you canīt see them, that alone would earn you the million.


Disclaimer: Iīm totally tired, so Iīm not sure if any of the above makes sense, but I like the idea of this thread and therefore wanted to contribute.
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Old 9th October 2007, 06:18 AM   #6
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9. This weekend is a no go.

(Well, maybe you don't need to add that one.)
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Old 9th October 2007, 05:47 PM   #7
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10. Randi's not a scientist, he's a magician; so what right does he have to offer free money for an impressive demonstration?
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Old 9th October 2007, 06:23 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by Tim Harrod View Post
10. Randi's not a scientist, he's a magician; so what right does he have to offer free money for an impressive demonstration?
Ahhh good one, I see that sometimes
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Old 9th October 2007, 09:56 PM   #9
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You all forgot to list the "Randi is godless/not spiritual, so he's an idiot and not worth consideration" line of argument. That's the one that makes me laugh the hardest.
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Old 9th October 2007, 10:07 PM   #10
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I wish I could think of one but I can’t, it’s too early. Think I’ll come back later though. Looks like it could be fun.

Just thought of one, bit silly but it might fit in.

11. What would I do with a million pound?!!
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Old 10th October 2007, 02:32 AM   #11
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12. I am psychic. But if I tell you what I can do someone else will get in first and win the prize with my idea.

13 I do not want any publicity.
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Old 10th October 2007, 02:36 AM   #12
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Originally Posted by Cuddles View Post
I'm not sure this is a great answer. No-one does work to win a Nobel, it is an extra reward for work they would have done anyway. I would say something more like:

A6. Winning Randi's prize would bring fame and recognition to your work, as well as providing significant funding. If this isn't worth a few hours of your time, what is?

That brings us to:

14. I can't use my powers for personal gain.
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Old 10th October 2007, 11:21 PM   #13
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Originally Posted by Mojo View Post
That brings us to:

14. I can't use my powers for personal gain.
That should be amended:

14. I can't use my powers for personal gain [, even though I could give the million bucks to a charity. Anonymously.]
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Old 11th October 2007, 04:52 AM   #14
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After 13 posts, I thought it would be nice to have all suggestions so far in a single post. I started copy/paste work and tried to correct typos and get an homogeneous format. I also added my own comments. Now I feel I've just changed too much to say this is a quote, so I'll say it is a rewriting of previous posts in this same thread. Feel free to criticize my rewriting style.
If you are the original author of something I have rewritten and you feel I've changed your point, please do say so.

1. Randi doesn't have the million.
A1. Yes, he does. You can ask for evidence, for which Randi will provide you with a note from the bank with all the necessary information to validate that he has the account, it is his account, it has more than one million USD on it, and it is his to give away. If you don't trust said evidence then not only don't you trust Randi, you don't trust the bank, and by extension the entire American bank system, and the entire economic system of the US at large.
2. JREF is a cult.
A2. No, it isn't. Many people who are a part of JREF disagree with some of what Randi says, and some of his attitude (if you do yourself, do state what you disagree with, to make a point).
3. The tests are rigged.
A3. The tests are created by claimant and Randi together, so both parties will create the test, and agree it is a fair test before it starts. If the parties can't agree to a fair test, then no test will be performed.
4. I'm not in it for the money.
A4.1. Wouldn't you spend 1 hour of your life to donate one million dollars to starving children? What kind of person are you?
Jononete remarks: I don't like this kind of answer. It almost makes me call in Godwin's Law. Surely it doesn't mention Hitler or nazis, but... well, to me it sounds much like "you're like Hitler, what kind of person are you?". My alternative:

A4.2.Then, what are you in it for?
5. If it was real someone would have won it by now.
A5.1. Look at answer 1&3, and realize that if you pass the test, you can sue Randi for the million. And just passing the test alone is probably worth more than that million.
Jojonete adds: A5.2. If superpowers were real, they would have won it by now.
6. I'm a real scientist, I'm not doing this to win a Prize, that is childish and stupid.
A6.1. Like the NOBEL prize?
Cuddles remarked: I'm not sure this is a great answer. No-one does work to win a Nobel, it is an extra reward for work they would have done anyway. I would say something more like:

A6.2. Winning Randi's prize would bring fame and recognition to your work, as well as providing significant funding. If this isn't worth a few hours of your time, what is?
7. I don't have to prove anything to Randi or other skeptics, I know my powers are real.
A7.1. Since you make a living with ________ (insert woo of your choice) anyway, wouldn't it be cool to earn a million in a day compared to the couple of bucks you earn with it now? Wouldn't winning the million be a perfect advertisement for your business?

A7.2. If you can't make a living with your powers now, wouldn't it be cool if you win the million and can quit your burger flipping job and tell your boss what you always wanted to tell him?
8. My powers don't work in the presence of skeptics.
A8: If you are able to tell if skeptics are there as observers while you can't see them, that alone would earn you the million.
9. This weekend is a no go.
Jojonete remarks: I should probably have thrown this one out, but kept it for completeness. If anyone makes any further compilation, I suggest assigning number 9. to the the "<Unnumbered>" canard below (as of now, it is between 10. and 11.). That way, all other numbers remain unchanged so that people don't get confused about renumberings.
10. Randi's not a scientist, he's a magician; so what right does he have to offer free money for an impressive demonstration?
Jojonete suggests A10. What right do you have to forbid anyone to offer whatever he/she pleases for whatever demonstration he/she pleases?
<Unnumbered>. Randi is godless/not spiritual, so he's an idiot and not worth consideration.

11. What would I do with a million pound?!!

12. I am psychic. But if I tell you what I can do someone else will get in first and win the prize with my idea.
Jojonete suggests A12.1. So, instead of telling JREF, you are publicly advertising your services as a superpowered-person. That way no one can win the prize with your idea.
A12.2. If you never had any intention of telling us what your superpowers consist of, why did you tell you have superpowers in the first place?
13. I do not want any publicity.
Jojonete suggests 13.1. and 13.2. to be the same as 12.1. and 12.2.
14. I can't use my powers for personal gain.
Doc Daneeka suggests changing the canard text to:
I can't use my powers for personal gain, even though I could give the million bucks to a charity. Anonymously.

Jojonete remarks: Doc Daneeka's text sounds to me more like an answer, i.e:
A14. ...even though you could give the million bucks to a charity. Anonymously.
Furthermore, I'm not sure about the "anonymously" part. The challenge rules state explicitly that the JREF has the right to publish everything, including the applicant's name. Or, at least, the pre-April-1st FAQ did state that, and I don't remember any comment about that part changing.
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Old 11th October 2007, 05:18 AM   #15
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11 and 14 are really just the same as 4.
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Old 11th October 2007, 06:04 AM   #16
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Cuddles,

Stop nit-picking. 11 was mine. lol
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Old 11th October 2007, 07:45 AM   #17
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A variation of 13

13

One addition to this is the claim that by demonstrating they can (insert woo) they would be subject to being kidnapped and made to use (insert woo) for bad things or creating wealth for the people controling them. I've seen this used to explain not "proving RV"

The other darker side of this is that Randi and the money is a "honey pot" used to attract real (insert woo), ID them and then 'THEY' will have them killed or put into a concentration camp. This is the evil government idea while the one above is an evil group/people.
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Old 11th October 2007, 09:32 AM   #18
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#9 was intended as a joke, but maybe it could be revised to the catch-all of "My powers aren't working today" or some such.

Or we could start a new list...


1. Daffy
2. Donald
3. Howard
4. Daisy
5. Bedard
...

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Old 11th October 2007, 12:07 PM   #19
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#00: "I don't feel strong." (FF to 01:46)
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Old 11th October 2007, 01:52 PM   #20
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My favorite canards.
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Old 11th October 2007, 03:55 PM   #21
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Originally Posted by Doc Daneeka View Post
That should be amended:

14. I can't use my powers for personal gain [, even though I could give the million bucks to a charity. Anonymously.]

Or maybe:

Apart from on phonelines...
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Old 11th October 2007, 06:20 PM   #22
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Missed some recent classics:
15. Randi is not a magician. He has paranormal powers and knows it. He uses them to stop anyone from winning.

16. The tests are rigged (again). Randi has a tremendous media and church backing and can cover up any legitimate challenges. (Yes this was used)
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Old 11th October 2007, 11:17 PM   #23
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Most of these points amount to:
17) I can't hear you. Nyah Nyah Nyah.
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Old 12th October 2007, 05:22 PM   #24
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Variation of #1: The prize isn't in cash, it's in bonds! You don't get cash, you get bonds! What if the companies go bankrupt, huh? You'll win worthless paper bonds!
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Old 12th October 2007, 11:49 PM   #25
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Originally Posted by Jackalgirl View Post
Variation of #1: The prize isn't in cash, it's in bonds! You don't get cash, you get bonds! What if the companies go bankrupt, huh? You'll win worthless paper bonds!
Yes, bonds are quite worthless. That's why on Wall Street, the bond market involves only a few dollars per day
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Old 19th December 2007, 10:44 PM   #26
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Well, I think that the funniest one is this one someone told me on a forum from another website

It went something like this:

"I think that Randi has psychic powers and it is very clear that he's using them to make everyone else loose"


Well get a load of that one, huh?
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Old 22nd December 2007, 01:19 PM   #27
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Calling every decline of a challenge a 'chickening out' has gotta be some new fallacy.
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Old 24th December 2007, 11:36 AM   #28
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18) I am psychic enough to see I can't win.

19) Randi is an Anti-psychic, and when a psychic and an anti-psychic come in contact with each other it is the woohoo equivalent to matter and antimatter coming in contact with each other, and I don't wanna clean up the mess.
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Old 24th December 2007, 02:28 PM   #29
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#-666: Randi is the AntiChrist.





(You know what song I'm thinking of, hellaeon?)
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Old 24th December 2007, 02:32 PM   #30
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13. I cannot count. I cannot even reason properly. I can only troll. But I still have powers.
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Old 24th December 2007, 02:41 PM   #31
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Fixed it for you.

13. I CANOT CO
UNT... I CANOT EVEN RAISIN PROPRELY... ORS PEL... I CAN ONLY TROo3LL!!!!!!!!!!!!
BUT I STILL HAVE PWOERS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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Old 24th December 2007, 03:53 PM   #32
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Originally Posted by GzuzKryzt View Post
Fixed it for you.

13. I CANOT CO
UNT... I CANOT EVEN RAISIN PROPRELY... ORS PEL... I CAN ONLY TROo3LL!!!!!!!!!!!!
BUT I STILL HAVE PWOERS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Thanks. Good one. Mind you, reality is even better. See below
Originally Posted by pavel_do View Post
well i undarstood you, and that is a good idea with sealed envelope, than it should be 25 envelopes or 50 (25 -50cards).. but would be better if envelope would be opne after my gues, or my gues would be writen on top of the envelope and remaine in same room and then opened infront of all of us...

regarding my friend to be involved as i explaned it is more as a person that i feel comfortable with and trust and as a support as well.. still its my claim and my abiliti to be tested...
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Old 16th January 2008, 10:11 AM   #33
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Originally Posted by Georg View Post
8. My powers donīt work in the presence of skeptics.

A8: If you are able to tell if skeptics are there as observers while you canīt see them, that alone would earn you the million.
How would you then demonstrate this ability in the presence of sceptics?
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Old 16th January 2008, 10:42 AM   #34
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Say your ability is guessing Zener cards. Here is the protocol:

For each trial:

You sit at a table with a tester who is an avowed believer in ESP. He shuffles the deck and deals the cards face down, one at a time and you guess each card, then he turns it over. Meanwhile, there is a skeptic or non-skeptic (randomly chosen) watching the test from a position where you cannot see them.

Based on your good or bad results you determine whether the skeptic or the non-skeptic was watching.

Pass 10 out of 10 trials and you have passed the preliminary test.

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Old 16th January 2008, 11:12 AM   #35
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New canard: "I was scheduled to take the challenge, but they were afraid that I would win, so they canceled the whole offer."
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Old 18th January 2008, 07:38 AM   #36
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20) My claim is a paranormal claim, and by definition is outside the realm of science. Your materailstic logic and science is not up to the task of testing my spiritual powers. Likewise, Randi and other scientists are too spiritually bankrupt to understand, let alone verify my abilities.
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Old 19th January 2008, 07:19 AM   #37
Temporal Renegade
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You'd think that, even if there really wasn't any money in the 'jackpot', TRUE paranormal people would still try for it, if for no other reason, than bragging rights that they beat Randi.

That in itself, would be 'money in the bank', you'd think.
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Old 19th January 2008, 07:25 AM   #38
Temporal Renegade
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Just had a thought...

Wonder how many people are going to come out of the woodwork, immediately after the Challenge is officially over with, and claim "I was *just* going to apply! See? They're AFRAID of my powers! HA!"

Or, if someone's going to claim that they predicted the Challenge would be canceled, and therefor they're entitled to the Prize...
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Old 19th January 2008, 09:22 AM   #39
GzuzKryzt
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Originally Posted by Temporal Renegade View Post
Wonder how many people are going to come out of the woodwork, immediately after the Challenge is officially over with, and claim "I was *just* going to apply! See? They're AFRAID of my powers! HA!"
...
I nominate edge for the front line of El Coro di Burro:

(...)They are running scared.

(...)Some one is lying.
If it’s a time issue LMAO, then the Old man and Spectator have figured a way around that issue, so I feel that it’s JREF that’s running scared now…(...)
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Old 20th January 2008, 10:16 AM   #40
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Originally Posted by Temporal Renegade View Post
Wonder how many people are going to come out of the woodwork, immediately after the Challenge is officially over with, and claim "I was *just* going to apply! See? They're AFRAID of my powers! HA!"
We point them at one of the many other skeptical challenges available for them to take. Sure, none of them are $1,000,000, but still...
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