How to persuade an atheist to become a christian

saizai · 18th November 2007, 12:37 PM

http://www.wikihow.com/Persuade-an-A...come-Christian

Summary: Osmosis.

qayak · 18th November 2007, 12:42 PM

I would have been a christian but I couldn't afford the lobotomy.

Apology · 18th November 2007, 12:43 PM

LOL!

"As strange as it may sound, Christian music is actually a very powerful weapon when dealing with atheists."

Are they trying to convert us or torture us? Christian music is a very powerful weapon---for driving people away!

Biscuit · 18th November 2007, 12:43 PM

Seems more like a guide on how to bash your head into a brick wall repeatedly.

I love the bit about christian music, that could not possibly help recruit.

Alice Shortcake · 18th November 2007, 12:45 PM

Christian music...(shudders). Frankly I'd prefer crucifixion.

Apology · 18th November 2007, 12:48 PM

Don't miss the other wikihow's on similar subjects, linked at the bottom of the article:

-How to Believe In God
-How to Become an Atheist

The Man · 18th November 2007, 01:35 PM

“One of the biggest reasons that atheists don't convert even with a desire to do so is because they are afraid people will treat them differently.”

Right, I am sure that’s what’s keeping a lot of atheists away.

“Emphasize verifiable truth over unverifiable dogma, and work together with them to discover what is actually true, with honesty and integrity.”

Shouldn’t this be in the how to become an atheist link?

Originally Posted by saizai

http://www.wikihow.com/Persuade-an-A...come-Christian

Summary: Osmosis.

Spot on saizai

“You will be assimilated, resistance is futile”

joobz · 18th November 2007, 02:33 PM

I thought it gave 3 good points

Quote:

Don't equate proving the existence of God with proving the Bible is from God or proving Christianity is God's religion. If the Bible and Christianity are not from God, that does not impact whether or not God exists. In fact, some atheists say that it was reading the Bible that convinced them that God doesn't exist. There are many non-Christians who still believe a god or gods exist.

An atheist may not be swayed by arguments from books that are said to be divinely inspired, as he or she does not believe deities exist. Quoting a Bible verse might be sufficient if arguing a fellow Christian, but a verse will likely not be convincing for an atheist (i.e., the Bible doesn't receive special status like it does among Christians). Also, don't assume that an atheist hasn't read the Bible: Many atheists were raised as Christians and grew up reading the Bible.

Avoid common stereotypes about atheists, such as that "Atheists really believe in God but are just in denial," and, "Without God, atheists can't be moral people." These stereotypes are generally untrue, and it's considered inappropriate to prejudge somebody (whether that person is an atheist or anybody else).

JoeEllison · 18th November 2007, 02:40 PM

That's... dumb. Really, really dumb.

the PC apeman · 18th November 2007, 02:58 PM

Originally Posted by wikihow article

... If they do not ask any further about church after a few months, mention that some of the people they'd met had been asking about them.

This, of course, assumes that people did actually ask about the prospect. Surely the author of this article doesn't condone lying. That would never happen in the service of God. Right?

-Fran- · 18th November 2007, 03:29 PM

Quote:

One way to encourage someone to believe in God is to spend a lot of time in nature and appreciate the beauty of it. For example, go outside in night and see the stars and moon. It's hard to see such a majestic sight and not think who/what made it all.

Funny. That's one of the things that keeps me an atheist!

Madalch · 18th November 2007, 03:37 PM

Someone should add "Don't!"

It's insulting to a person to try to convince them that their beliefs (or lack thereof) are wrong. If you respect the person enough to be their friend, then you shold respect them enough to leave their religion (or lack thereof) alone.

If you're uncomfortable being friends with someone who is not your religion, stick to your own kind like all the other bigots.

Robin · 18th November 2007, 03:52 PM

Originally Posted by -Fran-

Funny. That's one of the things that keeps me an atheist!

Ditto

TuftedPuffin · 18th November 2007, 07:53 PM

I must admit, I kinda wish a Christian was trying to convert me...it'd be fun...

firecoins · 18th November 2007, 07:55 PM

Originally Posted by Alice Shortcake

Christian music...(shudders). Frankly I'd prefer crucifixion.

Your Strange!!!

firecoins · 18th November 2007, 07:56 PM

Originally Posted by TuftedPuffin

I must admit, I kinda wish a Christian was trying to convert me...it'd be fun...

I can send over some Jehovah's witnesses.

godless dave · 18th November 2007, 08:16 PM

Originally Posted by Apology

LOL!

"As strange as it may sound, Christian music is actually a very powerful weapon when dealing with atheists."

Are they trying to convert us or torture us? Christian music is a very powerful weapon---for driving people away!

Depends on the music. Play some Bach and I'll sit and listen, though it won't convert me to Christianity.

Play some inane Christian rock or modern "Praise music" and I'll run screaming to the closest heavy metal station.

quixotecoyote · 18th November 2007, 08:28 PM

Originally Posted by TuftedPuffin

I must admit, I kinda wish a Christian was trying to convert me...it'd be fun...

Depends on the Christian. My best friend is very very Baptist and we lived together for 2 years. We had our own little culture war going but it was great fun for both of us.

-Fran- · 18th November 2007, 08:48 PM

Originally Posted by godless dave

Depends on the music. Play some Bach and I'll sit and listen, though it won't convert me to Christianity.

Play some inane Christian rock or modern "Praise music" and I'll run screaming to the closest heavy metal station.

I agree!

After that bus-trip I went on with a Christian school, and hearing them sing those modern praise songs you mention, constantly all the way from Sweden to Poland, I can assure you all that it didn't make me a Christian, however... it nearly made me a mass-murderer

ImaginalDisc · 18th November 2007, 09:19 PM

Originally Posted by Madalch

Someone should add "Don't!"

I tried. It's logged to prevent any edits.

What Nimrods.

saizai · 18th November 2007, 11:17 PM

Originally Posted by The Man

Spot on saizai

“You will be assimilated, resistance is futile”

That's not quite what I meant by osmosis.

More, all of the stuff they list in that wikihow is basically cultural; get them to be around you enough, show them how it's been good to you, get them involved in Christian cultural stuff like church and music and whatnot, and the Christianity will just sorta seep into their brain.

Which is a strange thing... although that is the attitude many Christians seem to have about how atheism works (counter-culture and all that jazz).

One of those interesting little axiom differences between the atheists/agnostics and theists - the former want evidence & argument, the latter want emotional appeal.

my_wan · 18th November 2007, 11:43 PM

Originally Posted by TuftedPuffin

I must admit, I kinda wish a Christian was trying to convert me...it'd be fun...

I like it when that happens too. The most stumped I ever seen a Jehovah's witness was my brother, not me.

Script (more or less).
Witness: We once thought the Earth was flat, but the Bible knew it was round (passage quoted).
Brother: Pizza.
Witness: Huh.
Brother: A pizza is round (holding his hands up in a round shape).
(Silence)

Yes my brother knows as much as anybody about the flat earth BS.

Other links on that wiki;
How to Become an Atheist (Notice they didn't say persuade)
How to Be a Skeptic
How to Believe in God
How to Become an Atheist
How to Deal With Religious People if You Are an Atheist
How to Ask Yourself What You Truly Believe
How to Make a Christian Not Try to Convert an Atheist
How to Become a Philosopher
How to Avoid Uncomfortable Conversations About Religion
How to Become a Taoist
How to Make a Decision Using a Quantitative Scoring System

MINISTERofTRUTH · 19th November 2007, 12:23 AM

I don't think that it is possible.

An atheist is focused open the self and not anything outside of the self, hence the description of them being " A - THEE - IST ".

six7s · 19th November 2007, 12:53 AM

Originally Posted by MINISTERofTRUTH

I don't think

Just fixed that for you

slingblade · 19th November 2007, 03:51 AM

Originally Posted by MINISTERofTRUTH

I don't think that it is possible.

An atheist is focused open the self and not anything outside of the self, hence the description of them being " A - THEE - IST ".

What is it you think (and taking my cue from six7s, I use the term loosely) "thee" means?

I once knew a girl who thought "thee" meant the same as "the," only emphatically and uniquely so. If someone was known as "the king," it was properly spelled Thee King.

e-sabbath · 19th November 2007, 04:37 AM

My favorite bit of Christian Music is After Forever. Sadly, most people don't really find Black Sabbath appropriate conversion music.

I do like to break the minds of evangelicals with that.

petra10 · 19th November 2007, 04:56 AM

Why do religious people always try to convert others to their way of thinking? Through out history religion has been forced on people, believe our way or you die.
Even nowadays, if you dont believe in a god you are threatened with eternal hell. I know a guy who is truely worried about my soul and prays constantly for me.
So my point is, if my soul,brain,body or whatever is doomed in the afterlife, then thats my problem no-one else's.

kellyb · 19th November 2007, 05:19 AM

"How to totally creep out your atheist friend".

Magyar · 19th November 2007, 05:36 AM

well to answer the OPs question.
All it would take is 36 vestal virgins promised. I am not greedy I can live with 50% down. Oh wait - that's the wrong religion.

The Man · 19th November 2007, 06:22 AM

Originally Posted by saizai

That's not quite what I meant by osmosis.

Yeah I know, but I just took it a little further for the sake of humor.

Originally Posted by saizai

More, all of the stuff they list in that wikihow is basically cultural; get them to be around you enough, show them how it's been good to you, get them involved in Christian cultural stuff like church and music and whatnot, and the Christianity will just sorta seep into their brain.

Which is a strange thing... although that is the attitude many Christians seem to have about how atheism works (counter-culture and all that jazz).

One of those interesting little axiom differences between the atheists/agnostics and theists - the former want evidence & argument, the latter want emotional appeal.

It is interesting the similarities I find with this approach and those used most other cults to indoctrinate followers.

“Show the practicality of Christianity through your own sucesses and friendships with Christians. If your friend truly sees that being a part of a church is like gaining dozens of new family members who each truly loves and admires them, then they will know where to turn in hard times.”

This quote for example is just a soft sell version of the “Love Bombing” used by most cults. I for one have always considered religion to be just another cult but with a more underhanded approch to recruitment. It is posible that this was writen by a non Christian to exemplify the similarites between religions and cults. If not then this is the first time I have seen something written by a Chsistain that so clearly emulates typical cult recrutment tecniques. Keep exposing them slowly and consitianly so they don’t even relize there being recruted. Always remind them that “everyone at church loves me and they will love you too” and before they know it they are hooked like some crack addict.

sophia8 · 19th November 2007, 07:15 AM

Quote:

“Show the practicality of Christianity through your own sucesses and friendships with Christians. If your friend truly sees that being a part of a church is like gaining dozens of new family members who each truly loves and admires them, then they will know where to turn in hard times.”

That doesn't sound like any family I know (including mine). One of my kids hates all the others and won't speak to me, another doesn't speak to one of the others. I'm barely on speaking terms with my own siblings. Real families are often like that - sharing the same DNA doesn't automatically make you life long friends.

These peoples' idea of family is pure Disneyland. And that's the big attraction for a certain type of potential convert, I suppose - that going to church and saying the magic words will magically bring them the fairytale family that they've always wanted.

six7s · 19th November 2007, 07:39 AM

Originally Posted by sophia8

... going to church and saying the magic words will magically bring them the fairytale family that they've always wanted.

The point that simutaneously amuses and annoys me is the presumption that atheists, for want of the warm fuzzies of mythology, are not only incapable of playing an active role in a vibrant, supportive community, but also devoid of happiness, friendship and love

grayman · 19th November 2007, 08:02 AM

Originally Posted by e-sabbath

My favorite bit of Christian Music is After Forever. Sadly, most people don't really find Black Sabbath appropriate conversion music.

I do like to break the minds of evangelicals with that.

I like to play Black Sabbath in my church building. It irritates my religious friends and I find it oddly comforting.

Cello Man · 19th November 2007, 09:28 AM

Quote:

"As strange as it may sound, Christian music is actually a very powerful weapon when dealing with atheists."

An ICBM is also a very powerful weapon, but you won't see me tossing those around in polite company.

I also find it very telling that they choose the word "weapon" when elaborating on the process of conversion. The author might be a very tolerant and moderate believer, but on some level there is still a strong association between their worldview and a need to inflict violence (whether physical or psychological) upon others for that worldview to survive.

MINISTERofTRUTH · 19th November 2007, 09:34 AM

Originally Posted by petra10

Why do religious people always try to convert others to their way of thinking? Through out history religion has been forced on people, believe our way or you die.
Even nowadays, if you dont believe in a god you are threatened with eternal hell. I know a guy who is truely worried about my soul and prays constantly for me.
So my point is, if my soul,brain,body or whatever is doomed in the afterlife, then thats my problem no-one else's.

See

Originally Posted by MINISTERofTRUTH

Who supports Satan ?

for some guidance on that one.

It is most unfortunate, but some people get caught up in beliefs rather than the truth of a situation, and so the true word of God / Christ becomes lost in the shadows.

Fnord · 19th November 2007, 09:37 AM

Originally Posted by TuftedPuffin

I must admit, I kinda wish a Christian was trying to convert me...it'd be fun...

Okay!

Do you want to be a Christian?

Fnord · 19th November 2007, 09:46 AM

http://www.wikihow.com/Persuade-an-A...come-Christian

As naively-written an article as any from the 1950's on "The Red Menace," "Surviving a Nuclear Attack," and "Reefer Madness."

Trust me, it is safe to assume that the original writers of this article may have had only a limited number of partial and/or temporary conversions, if any at all.

Conversion is a personal choice that can only be enabled. It can't be forced, coerced, or otherwise encouraged (otherwise, it is "brainwashing," and not a choice). It's up to the individual, not the evangelist.

You simply can not be converted unless you already had some inclination to do so. And, barring redaction and brainwashing, if you had no previous inclination, you can not be converted.

Ocelot · 19th November 2007, 09:55 AM

Easy,

Burning bush making accurate prophsies, that'd convince me. Raise me up to heaven let me take a look about and return me with verifiable infomration I couldn't have gleaned from anywhere else, that'd convince me.

What I dn't get is God's willingness to prove himself through miracles for 4000 years with floods, plagues, people living inside fish, wlkng the earth curing the sick, raising the dead, feeding the multitude turning water into wine, giving people the ability to speak and understand any language all of that but then for the last 2000 years nada, nothing zilch.

Jimbo07 · 19th November 2007, 10:13 AM

I can't believe they recommended the Kalam cosmological argument (I didn't know: first cause) and provided a wiki link. The wiki link contains its own refutations!

Are they incompetent, or too lazy to read?

ImaginalDisc · 19th November 2007, 10:14 AM

Originally Posted by Jimbo07

I can't believe they recommended the Kalam cosmological argument (I didn't know: first cause) and provided a wiki link. The wiki link contains its own refutations!

Are they incompetent, or too lazy to read?

Is that an inclusive "or?"

18th November 2007, 12:37 PM	#1
saizai Graduate Poster Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 1,374	How to persuade an atheist to become a christian http://www.wikihow.com/Persuade-an-A...come-Christian Summary: Osmosis.
saizai Graduate Poster Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 1,374	__________________ Friendly advice: if in an argument with me, don't make tons of fallacies or you'll just embarass yourself when I call you on 'em. Kthx! See my Youtube videos for more good argument, as well as bits about my various other interests, like ASL, cogsci, neurosci, meditation, cooking, etc.

18th November 2007, 12:42 PM	#2
qayak Philosopher Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 8,772	I would have been a christian but I couldn't afford the lobotomy.
qayak Philosopher Join Date: Jul 2006 Posts: 8,772	__________________ "The man who does not read good books has no advantage over the man who can't read them." (Mark Twain)

18th November 2007, 12:43 PM	#4
Biscuit Illuminator Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 4,907	Seems more like a guide on how to bash your head into a brick wall repeatedly. I love the bit about christian music, that could not possibly help recruit.
Biscuit Illuminator Join Date: Aug 2007 Posts: 4,907	__________________ “... there is no shame in not knowing. The problem arises when irrational thought and attendant behavior fill the vacuum left by ignorance.” ― Neil deGrasse Tyson

18th November 2007, 01:35 PM	#7
The Man Scourge, of the supernatural Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Poughkeepsie, NY Posts: 7,575	“One of the biggest reasons that atheists don't convert even with a desire to do so is because they are afraid people will treat them differently.” Right, I am sure that’s what’s keeping a lot of atheists away. “Emphasize verifiable truth over unverifiable dogma, and work together with them to discover what is actually true, with honesty and integrity.” Shouldn’t this be in the how to become an atheist link? Originally Posted by saizai http://www.wikihow.com/Persuade-an-A...come-Christian Summary: Osmosis. Spot on saizai “You will be assimilated, resistance is futile”
	__________________ "Not a seat but a springboard” (1942 Winston Churchill) "As he who, seeking asses, found a kingdom" (1671 Milton "Paradise Regained") "for it seem'd A void was made in nature, all her bonds Crack'd; and I saw the flaring atom-streams And torrents of her myriad universe, Ruining along the illimitable inane, Fly on to clash together again, and make Another and another frame of things For ever." (1868 Tennyson "Lucretius")

18th November 2007, 02:33 PM	#8
joobz Tergiversator Join Date: Aug 2006 Location: That's how you get ants Posts: 17,584	I thought it gave 3 good points Quote: Don't equate proving the existence of God with proving the Bible is from God or proving Christianity is God's religion. If the Bible and Christianity are not from God, that does not impact whether or not God exists. In fact, some atheists say that it was reading the Bible that convinced them that God doesn't exist. There are many non-Christians who still believe a god or gods exist. An atheist may not be swayed by arguments from books that are said to be divinely inspired, as he or she does not believe deities exist. Quoting a Bible verse might be sufficient if arguing a fellow Christian, but a verse will likely not be convincing for an atheist (i.e., the Bible doesn't receive special status like it does among Christians). Also, don't assume that an atheist hasn't read the Bible: Many atheists were raised as Christians and grew up reading the Bible. Avoid common stereotypes about atheists, such as that "Atheists really believe in God but are just in denial," and, "Without God, atheists can't be moral people." These stereotypes are generally untrue, and it's considered inappropriate to prejudge somebody (whether that person is an atheist or anybody else).
	__________________ What's the best argument for UHC? This argument against UHC. "Perhaps one reason per capita GDP is lower in UHC countries is because they've tried to prevent this important function [bankrupting the sick] and thus carry forward considerable economic dead wood?"-BeAChooser

18th November 2007, 12:43 PM	#3
Apology Reader's of the Boden Codex Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 1,664	LOL! "As strange as it may sound, Christian music is actually a very powerful weapon when dealing with atheists." Are they trying to convert us or torture us? Christian music is a very powerful weapon---for driving people away!

18th November 2007, 12:45 PM	#5
Alice Shortcake Muse Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: York, England Posts: 750	Christian music...(shudders). Frankly I'd prefer crucifixion.

18th November 2007, 12:48 PM	#6
Apology Reader's of the Boden Codex Join Date: Jul 2007 Posts: 1,664	Don't miss the other wikihow's on similar subjects, linked at the bottom of the article: -How to Believe In God -How to Become an Atheist

18th November 2007, 02:40 PM	#9
JoeEllison Cuddly Like a Koala Bear Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Florida Posts: 7,276	That's... dumb. Really, really dumb.

18th November 2007, 02:58 PM	#10
the PC apeman Muse Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 649	Originally Posted by wikihow article ... If they do not ask any further about church after a few months, mention that some of the people they'd met had been asking about them. This, of course, assumes that people did actually ask about the prospect. Surely the author of this article doesn't condone lying. That would never happen in the service of God. Right?
the PC apeman Muse Join Date: Jun 2007 Posts: 649

18th November 2007, 03:29 PM	#11
-Fran- Master Poster Join Date: May 2007 Location: Sweden Posts: 2,581	Quote: One way to encourage someone to believe in God is to spend a lot of time in nature and appreciate the beauty of it. For example, go outside in night and see the stars and moon. It's hard to see such a majestic sight and not think who/what made it all. Funny. That's one of the things that keeps me an atheist!
	__________________ Thank goodness there are such things as lies. Imagine if everything you heard was true! (Albert Engström) Last edited by -Fran-; 18th November 2007 at 03:43 PM.

18th November 2007, 03:37 PM	#12
Madalch The Jester Join Date: Nov 2006 Location: The wet coast. Posts: 8,743	Someone should add "Don't!" It's insulting to a person to try to convince them that their beliefs (or lack thereof) are wrong. If you respect the person enough to be their friend, then you shold respect them enough to leave their religion (or lack thereof) alone. If you're uncomfortable being friends with someone who is not your religion, stick to your own kind like all the other bigots.
	__________________ As the size of an explosion increases, the number of social situations it is incapable of resolving approaches zero. -Vaarsuvius It's a rum state of affairs when you feel like punching a jar of mayonnaise in the face. -Charlie Brooker

18th November 2007, 03:52 PM	#13
Robin Philosopher Join Date: Apr 2004 Posts: 8,541	Originally Posted by -Fran- Funny. That's one of the things that keeps me an atheist! Ditto
Robin Philosopher Join Date: Apr 2004 Posts: 8,541	__________________ The non-theoretical character of metaphysics would not be in itself a defect; all arts have this non-theoretical character without thereby losing their high value for personal as well as for social life. The danger lies in the deceptive character of metaphysics; it gives the illusion of knowledge without actually giving any knowledge. This is the reason why we reject it. - Rudolf Carnap "Philosophy and Logical Syntax"

18th November 2007, 07:53 PM	#14
TuftedPuffin Thinker Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 202	I must admit, I kinda wish a Christian was trying to convert me...it'd be fun...
TuftedPuffin Thinker Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts: 202

18th November 2007, 07:55 PM	#15
firecoins Illuminator Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Nyack, NY Posts: 3,191	Originally Posted by Alice Shortcake Christian music...(shudders). Frankly I'd prefer crucifixion. Your Strange!!!
	__________________ NY Paramedic, skeptic, 9/11/01 Reality-ist. I am both right wing nut and left wing lunatic. Deal with it.

18th November 2007, 07:56 PM	#16
firecoins Illuminator Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Nyack, NY Posts: 3,191	Originally Posted by TuftedPuffin I must admit, I kinda wish a Christian was trying to convert me...it'd be fun... I can send over some Jehovah's witnesses.
	__________________ NY Paramedic, skeptic, 9/11/01 Reality-ist. I am both right wing nut and left wing lunatic. Deal with it.

18th November 2007, 08:16 PM	#17
godless dave Great Dalmuti Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: St. Paul, Minnesota Posts: 6,137	Originally Posted by Apology LOL! "As strange as it may sound, Christian music is actually a very powerful weapon when dealing with atheists." Are they trying to convert us or torture us? Christian music is a very powerful weapon---for driving people away! Depends on the music. Play some Bach and I'll sit and listen, though it won't convert me to Christianity. Play some inane Christian rock or modern "Praise music" and I'll run screaming to the closest heavy metal station.

18th November 2007, 08:28 PM	#18
quixotecoyote Howling to glory I go Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 9,621	Originally Posted by TuftedPuffin I must admit, I kinda wish a Christian was trying to convert me...it'd be fun... Depends on the Christian. My best friend is very very Baptist and we lived together for 2 years. We had our own little culture war going but it was great fun for both of us.
	__________________ If people needed video games to live, a national single payer plan to fund those purchases would be a great idea.

18th November 2007, 08:48 PM	#19
-Fran- Master Poster Join Date: May 2007 Location: Sweden Posts: 2,581	Originally Posted by godless dave Depends on the music. Play some Bach and I'll sit and listen, though it won't convert me to Christianity. Play some inane Christian rock or modern "Praise music" and I'll run screaming to the closest heavy metal station. I agree! After that bus-trip I went on with a Christian school, and hearing them sing those modern praise songs you mention, constantly all the way from Sweden to Poland, I can assure you all that it didn't make me a Christian, however... it nearly made me a mass-murderer
	__________________ Thank goodness there are such things as lies. Imagine if everything you heard was true! (Albert Engström)

18th November 2007, 09:19 PM	#20
ImaginalDisc Proactive Untwister of Octagonal Hippopotamus Pants Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Miami, Fl Posts: 10,225	Originally Posted by Madalch Someone should add "Don't!" I tried. It's logged to prevent any edits. What Nimrods.
	__________________ Definition: 'Love' is making a shot to the knees of a target 120 kilometers away using an Aratech sniper rifle with a tri-light scope. Statement: This definition, I am told, is subject to interpretation. Obviously, love is a matter of odds. Not many meatbags could make such a shot, and fewer would derive love from it. Yet for me, love is knowing your target, putting them in your targeting reticle, and together, achieving a singular purpose, against statistically long odds. *-HK-47*

18th November 2007, 11:17 PM	#21
saizai Graduate Poster Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 1,374	Originally Posted by The Man Spot on saizai “You will be assimilated, resistance is futile” That's not quite what I meant by osmosis. More, all of the stuff they list in that wikihow is basically cultural; get them to be around you enough, show them how it's been good to you, get them involved in Christian cultural stuff like church and music and whatnot, and the Christianity will just sorta seep into their brain. Which is a strange thing... although that is the attitude many Christians seem to have about how atheism works (counter-culture and all that jazz). One of those interesting little axiom differences between the atheists/agnostics and theists - the former want evidence & argument, the latter want emotional appeal.
saizai Graduate Poster Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 1,374	__________________ Friendly advice: if in an argument with me, don't make tons of fallacies or you'll just embarass yourself when I call you on 'em. Kthx! See my Youtube videos for more good argument, as well as bits about my various other interests, like ASL, cogsci, neurosci, meditation, cooking, etc.

18th November 2007, 11:43 PM	#22
my_wan Graduate Poster Join Date: Feb 2007 Posts: 1,077	Originally Posted by TuftedPuffin I must admit, I kinda wish a Christian was trying to convert me...it'd be fun... I like it when that happens too. The most stumped I ever seen a Jehovah's witness was my brother, not me. Script (more or less). Witness: We once thought the Earth was flat, but the Bible knew it was round (passage quoted). Brother: Pizza. Witness: Huh. Brother: A pizza is round (holding his hands up in a round shape). (Silence) Yes my brother knows as much as anybody about the flat earth BS. Other links on that wiki; How to Become an Atheist (Notice they didn't say persuade) How to Be a Skeptic How to Believe in God How to Become an Atheist How to Deal With Religious People if You Are an Atheist How to Ask Yourself What You Truly Believe How to Make a Christian Not Try to Convert an Atheist How to Become a Philosopher How to Avoid Uncomfortable Conversations About Religion How to Become a Taoist How to Make a Decision Using a Quantitative Scoring System
my_wan Graduate Poster Join Date: Feb 2007 Posts: 1,077	__________________ Peace to all people of the world. The evidence indicates that this is best accomplished through a skeptical approach.

19th November 2007, 12:23 AM	#23
MINISTERofTRUTH Thinker Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 224	I don't think that it is possible. An atheist is focused open the self and not anything outside of the self, hence the description of them being " A - THEE - IST ".
MINISTERofTRUTH Thinker Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 224	__________________ Plato - Strange times are these in which we live, when old and young are taught in falsehoods schools. And the one man that dares to tell the truth is called at once a lunatic and fool. Proudler - I respond not to those who cannot see truths.

19th November 2007, 12:53 AM	#24
six7s veretic Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Aotearoa Posts: 8,710	Originally Posted by MINISTERofTRUTH I don't think Just fixed that for you
	__________________ Evolution and the rest of reality fascinates the be-jeebus out of me!

19th November 2007, 03:51 AM	#25
slingblade Guest Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 23,642	Originally Posted by MINISTERofTRUTH I don't think that it is possible. An atheist is focused open the self and not anything outside of the self, hence the description of them being " A - THEE - IST ". What is it you think (and taking my cue from six7s, I use the term loosely) "thee" means? I once knew a girl who thought "thee" meant the same as "the," only emphatically and uniquely so. If someone was known as "the king," it was properly spelled Thee King.
slingblade Guest Join Date: Jul 2005 Posts: 23,642	Last edited by slingblade; 19th November 2007 at 03:52 AM.

19th November 2007, 04:37 AM	#26
e-sabbath Critical Thinker Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts: 321	My favorite bit of Christian Music is After Forever. Sadly, most people don't really find Black Sabbath appropriate conversion music. I do like to break the minds of evangelicals with that.

19th November 2007, 04:56 AM	#27
petra10 Graduate Poster Join Date: May 2007 Location: scotland uk Posts: 1,796	Why do religious people always try to convert others to their way of thinking? Through out history religion has been forced on people, believe our way or you die. Even nowadays, if you dont believe in a god you are threatened with eternal hell. I know a guy who is truely worried about my soul and prays constantly for me. So my point is, if my soul,brain,body or whatever is doomed in the afterlife, then thats my problem no-one else's.
	__________________ "Imagine theres no heaven,its easy if you try. no hell below us,above us only sky." John Lennon

19th November 2007, 05:19 AM	#28
kellyb Illuminator Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Tennessee. Ain't you jealous? Posts: 4,462	"How to totally creep out your atheist friend".

19th November 2007, 05:36 AM	#29
Magyar Graduate Poster Join Date: Oct 2004 Location: the edge of reason Posts: 1,564	well to answer the OPs question. All it would take is 36 vestal virgins promised. I am not greedy I can live with 50% down. Oh wait - that's the wrong religion.
	__________________ "There is no heresy or no philosophy which is so abhorrent to the church as a human being." James Joyce Due to recent cutbacks the light at the end of the tunnel has been turned off.

19th November 2007, 06:22 AM	#30
The Man Scourge, of the supernatural Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Poughkeepsie, NY Posts: 7,575	Originally Posted by saizai That's not quite what I meant by osmosis. Yeah I know, but I just took it a little further for the sake of humor. Originally Posted by saizai More, all of the stuff they list in that wikihow is basically cultural; get them to be around you enough, show them how it's been good to you, get them involved in Christian cultural stuff like church and music and whatnot, and the Christianity will just sorta seep into their brain. Which is a strange thing... although that is the attitude many Christians seem to have about how atheism works (counter-culture and all that jazz). One of those interesting little axiom differences between the atheists/agnostics and theists - the former want evidence & argument, the latter want emotional appeal. It is interesting the similarities I find with this approach and those used most other cults to indoctrinate followers. “Show the practicality of Christianity through your own sucesses and friendships with Christians. If your friend truly sees that being a part of a church is like gaining dozens of new family members who each truly loves and admires them, then they will know where to turn in hard times.” This quote for example is just a soft sell version of the “Love Bombing” used by most cults. I for one have always considered religion to be just another cult but with a more underhanded approch to recruitment. It is posible that this was writen by a non Christian to exemplify the similarites between religions and cults. If not then this is the first time I have seen something written by a Chsistain that so clearly emulates typical cult recrutment tecniques. Keep exposing them slowly and consitianly so they don’t even relize there being recruted. Always remind them that “everyone at church loves me and they will love you too” and before they know it they are hooked like some crack addict.
	__________________ "Not a seat but a springboard” (1942 Winston Churchill) "As he who, seeking asses, found a kingdom" (1671 Milton "Paradise Regained") "for it seem'd A void was made in nature, all her bonds Crack'd; and I saw the flaring atom-streams And torrents of her myriad universe, Ruining along the illimitable inane, Fly on to clash together again, and make Another and another frame of things For ever." (1868 Tennyson "Lucretius") Last edited by The Man; 19th November 2007 at 06:24 AM.

19th November 2007, 07:15 AM	#31
sophia8 Master Poster Join Date: Oct 2003 Location: In the dark, dark forest.... Posts: 2,289	Quote: “Show the practicality of Christianity through your own sucesses and friendships with Christians. If your friend truly sees that being a part of a church is like gaining dozens of new family members who each truly loves and admires them, then they will know where to turn in hard times.” That doesn't sound like any family I know (including mine). One of my kids hates all the others and won't speak to me, another doesn't speak to one of the others. I'm barely on speaking terms with my own siblings. Real families are often like that - sharing the same DNA doesn't automatically make you life long friends. These peoples' idea of family is pure Disneyland. And that's the big attraction for a certain type of potential convert, I suppose - that going to church and saying the magic words will magically bring them the fairytale family that they've always wanted.
	__________________ "Nature is floods and famines and earthquakes and viruses and little blue-footed booby babies getting their brains pecked out by their stronger siblings! ....Nature doesn't care about me, or about anybody in particular - nature can be terrifying! Why do they even put words like 'natural' on products like shampoo, like it's automatically a good thing? I mean, sulfuric acid is natural!" -Julia Sweeney Last edited by sophia8; 19th November 2007 at 07:16 AM. Reason: fix quotes

19th November 2007, 07:39 AM	#32
six7s veretic Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Aotearoa Posts: 8,710	Originally Posted by sophia8 ... going to church and saying the magic words will magically bring them the fairytale family that they've always wanted. The point that simutaneously amuses and annoys me is the presumption that atheists, for want of the warm fuzzies of mythology, are not only incapable of playing an active role in a vibrant, supportive community, but also devoid of happiness, friendship and love
	__________________ Evolution and the rest of reality fascinates the be-jeebus out of me!

19th November 2007, 08:02 AM	#33
grayman Happy-go-lucky Heretic Join Date: Apr 2006 Location: Casa del Whacko Posts: 6,142	Originally Posted by e-sabbath My favorite bit of Christian Music is After Forever. Sadly, most people don't really find Black Sabbath appropriate conversion music. I do like to break the minds of evangelicals with that. I like to play Black Sabbath in my church building. It irritates my religious friends and I find it oddly comforting.
	__________________ Stupidity is a condition. Ignorance is a choice. - Wiley All great truths begin as blasphemies. - George Bernard Shaw God is evil. As soon as you accept that, it all makes sense. - Sledge

19th November 2007, 09:28 AM	#34
Cello Man Graduate Poster Join Date: Sep 2006 Posts: 1,035	Quote: "As strange as it may sound, Christian music is actually a very powerful weapon when dealing with atheists." An ICBM is also a very powerful weapon, but you won't see me tossing those around in polite company. I also find it very telling that they choose the word "weapon" when elaborating on the process of conversion. The author might be a very tolerant and moderate believer, but on some level there is still a strong association between their worldview and a need to inflict violence (whether physical or psychological) upon others for that worldview to survive.
	__________________ This is my Timey-Wimey Detector. It goes "DING!" when there's stuff. - The Doctor

19th November 2007, 09:34 AM	#35
MINISTERofTRUTH Thinker Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 224	Originally Posted by petra10 Why do religious people always try to convert others to their way of thinking? Through out history religion has been forced on people, believe our way or you die. Even nowadays, if you dont believe in a god you are threatened with eternal hell. I know a guy who is truely worried about my soul and prays constantly for me. So my point is, if my soul,brain,body or whatever is doomed in the afterlife, then thats my problem no-one else's. See Originally Posted by MINISTERofTRUTH Who supports Satan ? for some guidance on that one. It is most unfortunate, but some people get caught up in beliefs rather than the truth of a situation, and so the true word of God / Christ becomes lost in the shadows.
MINISTERofTRUTH Thinker Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 224	__________________ Plato - Strange times are these in which we live, when old and young are taught in falsehoods schools. And the one man that dares to tell the truth is called at once a lunatic and fool. Proudler - I respond not to those who cannot see truths.